WEBVTT 00:00.271 --> 00:04.215 [SPEAKER_02]: Hey, welcome to another brand new episode of Geeks from the Multiverse. 00:04.515 --> 00:13.484 [SPEAKER_02]: This week's episode is an evolved episode, and we have already talked about how technology has made it possible to live without even leaving your house. 00:14.244 --> 00:19.569 [SPEAKER_02]: But what happens when technology makes it possible to live without really needing other people? 00:20.533 --> 00:20.793 [SPEAKER_02]: A.I. 00:20.833 --> 00:25.456 [SPEAKER_02]: can listen to you, remember you, comfort you, and become your friend, even your partner. 00:26.256 --> 00:30.719 [SPEAKER_02]: So when does artificial connection stop filling a gap and start replacing the real thing? 00:31.359 --> 00:32.700 [SPEAKER_02]: This is Evolve. 00:53.359 --> 01:09.889 [SPEAKER_03]: Hey, John was supposed to come in there, but hey, here I am, he's laughing, and uh, well, because he's the thing, guys, and yeah, is that I, sometimes it's better that you don't see us on video because my God, that is probably the reason we need to be on video. 01:10.629 --> 01:17.633 [SPEAKER_03]: Anyways, no, yes, hey, everybody is your boy, Johnny Gay, got a little stash enough, of course, as always with me, is Mr. Gropi mood. 01:17.753 --> 01:18.974 [SPEAKER_03]: What's up, everybody? 01:19.535 --> 01:21.436 [SPEAKER_03]: So yes, so good all, 01:22.714 --> 01:23.134 [SPEAKER_03]: A.I. 01:23.335 --> 01:24.616 [SPEAKER_03]: because we've talked about A.I. 01:24.636 --> 01:27.838 [SPEAKER_03]: so many times and especially this episode is going to be probably not going to stop either. 01:27.938 --> 01:30.580 [SPEAKER_03]: No, it's definitely not going to stop because it's honestly not going to go away. 01:30.620 --> 01:31.621 [SPEAKER_03]: It's never going to go away. 01:31.761 --> 01:32.742 [SPEAKER_03]: It's still going to be here. 01:33.242 --> 01:42.169 [SPEAKER_03]: And I think this episode, especially with it, you know, being our serious episode, we always like to do, you know, especially the replacement people, right? 01:42.189 --> 01:48.434 [SPEAKER_03]: So because when we think about all this stuff that we're doing with A.I., it's scary, right? 01:50.093 --> 01:54.587 [SPEAKER_03]: We want to make sure AI can be incorporated into our world, but not to the point of... 01:55.873 --> 02:19.162 [SPEAKER_03]: replacing literally everything that we do, but you're not going to talk about too much right now, but I'm just saying like this is this is a real concern and so hopefully when you listen to the episode and you're hearing us, you'll understand why in a little bit, but anyways, yes, so our good old CTAs were a quick so good old call to action, so our fist bump, you know, our follow in Iraq, subscribe, tell your friends, I don't mad every single time. 02:19.182 --> 02:20.083 [SPEAKER_03]: I say that, you're always go. 02:20.907 --> 02:22.308 [SPEAKER_03]: man, look at you. 02:22.348 --> 02:23.789 [SPEAKER_03]: You're finally doing the right thing. 02:23.849 --> 02:24.110 [SPEAKER_03]: I know. 02:24.470 --> 02:30.175 [SPEAKER_03]: But yes, so like I said, you know, make sure that you follow us, you know, on Instagram, you know, TikTok, whatever. 02:30.595 --> 02:30.775 [SPEAKER_03]: Right. 02:31.095 --> 02:32.316 [SPEAKER_03]: Go on our social media pages. 02:32.356 --> 02:33.237 [SPEAKER_03]: Make sure you do all that. 02:33.297 --> 02:34.458 [SPEAKER_03]: Interact, you know, let us know. 02:34.518 --> 02:34.718 [SPEAKER_03]: Right. 02:34.778 --> 02:36.460 [SPEAKER_03]: So send us a message. 02:36.540 --> 02:37.841 [SPEAKER_03]: Do whatever you want to do on there. 02:37.901 --> 02:41.244 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, hell, send us an email because we haven't heard from anybody in a while from there. 02:41.264 --> 02:43.385 [SPEAKER_03]: Anyways, you know, and then of course, subscribe. 02:43.405 --> 02:44.726 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, make sure you're like a special 02:46.788 --> 02:47.349 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, what was it? 02:47.449 --> 02:48.610 [SPEAKER_03]: A little alarm bell. 02:49.250 --> 02:52.994 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I know on there and then you know tell your friends, you know, we can't do it by ourselves here, right? 02:53.054 --> 02:58.879 [SPEAKER_03]: And so, especially whether, you know, I was about to say Microsoft page, but I'm like, that doesn't make any sense. 02:59.379 --> 03:00.680 [SPEAKER_03]: Our website, you can go on there. 03:00.700 --> 03:06.365 [SPEAKER_03]: You can check out all the episodes as well as our evolved page, right, because it has all of our latest. 03:07.126 --> 03:12.229 [SPEAKER_03]: and greatest, you know, episodes as well as having the ability to go through each one of these topics. 03:12.269 --> 03:14.070 [SPEAKER_03]: So especially this one wants to drop. 03:14.730 --> 03:17.432 [SPEAKER_03]: You can go on there and say, hey, you know what, I really want to hear about it, though. 03:17.452 --> 03:18.893 [SPEAKER_03]: Then go right there and you can check it out. 03:19.293 --> 03:19.493 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. 03:19.673 --> 03:27.237 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, our evolved page has a, you know, it's a Spotify player that has all of our, 03:28.358 --> 03:29.479 [SPEAKER_02]: evolve episodes. 03:30.039 --> 03:35.263 [SPEAKER_02]: So if you're looking just for our evolve episodes, you can get just the evolve episodes. 03:35.323 --> 03:38.325 [SPEAKER_02]: Obviously, we do have our normal podcast page that has 03:39.368 --> 03:45.251 [SPEAKER_02]: all of our episodes that you can listen to right from our page, but the all of one has all of our evolve episodes right there. 03:45.271 --> 03:45.431 [SPEAKER_03]: Right. 03:45.531 --> 03:49.813 [SPEAKER_03]: And of course, you know, Matt likes to also mention the the vault resources that we have on there, too. 03:49.853 --> 03:55.655 [SPEAKER_03]: So I mean, a lot of the different things that we've talked about in the past, you know, maybe maybe it potentially might have to add in AI. 03:56.255 --> 03:57.716 [SPEAKER_03]: Who knows depending on how this works. 03:57.976 --> 03:58.236 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. 03:58.596 --> 04:01.438 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm assuming somewhere down the line, we're going to need like, 04:02.278 --> 04:04.320 [SPEAKER_02]: like AI anonymous or something. 04:04.340 --> 04:06.141 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, seriously, I mean, it's pretty sad. 04:06.201 --> 04:06.502 [SPEAKER_03]: It's good. 04:06.522 --> 04:11.045 [SPEAKER_03]: This is how we're going to be doing this, but but anyways, yes, yeah, I don't into the topic. 04:11.526 --> 04:18.011 [SPEAKER_02]: Well, I know the last evolve we talked about was the last evolve one was the great indoors. 04:18.031 --> 04:19.092 [SPEAKER_02]: We talked about how. 04:20.113 --> 04:24.815 [SPEAKER_02]: It's become easier to just stay home instead of actually going out. 04:24.835 --> 04:27.756 [SPEAKER_02]: We talked about like, what are these third places? 04:27.856 --> 04:33.338 [SPEAKER_02]: And to keep it simple, it's the places that are not your home or work, right? 04:34.199 --> 04:34.359 [SPEAKER_02]: And 04:35.677 --> 04:47.022 [SPEAKER_02]: This episode that we're talking about the replacement people, it kind of segues from that topic of being like, you can never, you know, you don't have to leave your house for groceries or anything else. 04:47.643 --> 04:54.066 [SPEAKER_02]: It's kind of like, you never have to leave your house now or worry about having somebody who's always around. 04:55.286 --> 05:02.070 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, and so here's the thing about AI2 is that, you know, especially what you're talking about with the third places and things like that, is that, 05:03.017 --> 05:12.322 [SPEAKER_03]: it's sure it's always nice to have, you know, social interactions and being able to, you know, meet other people or see other people or even, you know, maybe you live with other people, right? 05:12.362 --> 05:25.490 [SPEAKER_03]: Or especially if you're married, since we've both known that, you know, it gets, it gets to a point where you're like, you know, if you're living by yourself, or not saying that you can't be independent, but at the same time, you do need that kind of interaction with somebody. 05:25.510 --> 05:28.991 [SPEAKER_03]: So of course, it's where AI will say, well, come on, let me talk to you. 05:29.011 --> 05:29.552 [SPEAKER_03]: Let me text 05:31.979 --> 05:35.088 [SPEAKER_03]: But you said me photos, especially the AI girls. 05:35.128 --> 05:37.555 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, I don't know if you've ever seen it, but I mean, they get pretty. 05:38.937 --> 05:52.539 [SPEAKER_02]: I've seen the ads on Facebook when I'm just like doom scrolling and like, you know, you'll all like land on one and I'll be like, what the hell is this bullshit, but then I feel like if I 06:07.742 --> 06:08.963 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know the percentage. 06:09.883 --> 06:14.326 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, it's not like I go looking to this shit up like I would hope not. 06:14.426 --> 06:16.868 [SPEAKER_02]: Late at night when it's like 12, 30, I look up. 06:16.968 --> 06:18.449 [SPEAKER_02]: Ay, no, I don't. 06:18.789 --> 06:20.691 [SPEAKER_02]: But I would assume that like 90% or more. 06:23.112 --> 06:25.553 [SPEAKER_02]: are probably all sex-based chatbot. 06:25.593 --> 06:28.895 [SPEAKER_02]: No, I would say you said, I would think even more than that. 06:29.035 --> 06:32.316 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I would go higher, but I want to give it to you. 06:32.336 --> 06:35.538 [SPEAKER_03]: I know what I'm going to be the benefit of the doubt, but it's just, you're right. 06:35.578 --> 06:45.583 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, it's said that we have to think like this because again, you know, when we were talking about like going and socially interacting with other people, you know, when we were joking around, like, you know, 06:46.452 --> 07:15.106 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, people before, you know, actually used to go to a bar or some source like social gathering or a club or something, they would meet people and we talked to people like in public, like you do that weird fucking texting that's weird that's all I do is text you know that's that's how I think I think the important thing before you get into, you know, the the first topic here is we're not necessarily saying AI is good or bad and I think that that's like the 07:16.698 --> 07:22.166 [SPEAKER_02]: It's gonna, it's gonna sound like with what we're talking about that we're saying like, oh, AI sucks, you shouldn't use it. 07:22.587 --> 07:23.768 [SPEAKER_02]: AI is bad. 07:23.869 --> 07:25.371 [SPEAKER_02]: We're not saying it's good or bad. 07:25.491 --> 07:30.639 [SPEAKER_02]: It's more about like what happens when it stops being a tool. 07:31.900 --> 07:45.763 [SPEAKER_02]: And you start using it to fill those missing gaps in your life that should be occupied by friends or partners or coworkers or work out buddies. 07:45.783 --> 07:46.263 [SPEAKER_02]: You know what I mean? 07:46.283 --> 07:54.625 [SPEAKER_02]: Like those roles that should be occupied by a human being, you're filling them with AI companions. 07:54.925 --> 07:56.306 [SPEAKER_02]: That's what we're saying. 08:03.118 --> 08:10.362 [SPEAKER_03]: when you when you look at AI right so like we've we've talked about in the past that you know AI is a is a wonderful tool if used correctly. 08:11.122 --> 08:16.305 [SPEAKER_03]: So when you make sure you know when you're let's say you go and chat GBT and you type in certain things. 08:16.925 --> 08:19.527 [SPEAKER_03]: Hopefully you don't go on there and say hey how do I find a companion? 08:21.659 --> 08:43.241 [SPEAKER_02]: because when I look at that I go okay listen it's called get out of your fucking house and go go actually make you could but I mean hopefully the advice isn't hey there there are AI platforms where you can chat with people that are you know not not real and it probably would just be like well you can go to a bar you can go to the gym you can go to 08:44.070 --> 09:00.182 [SPEAKER_03]: The club is going through that place like I'm assuming that's what it would be but I would hope so but if it tells you to go on to some app and do that I mean yes there is such things as online dating in this I mean that's better than at least trying to use an AI jetbot basically at this point all right so jump 09:01.163 --> 09:04.466 [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, so why would somebody you choose an AI relationship? 09:04.746 --> 09:05.167 [SPEAKER_02]: Well, sorry. 09:05.187 --> 09:06.908 [SPEAKER_03]: I thought I was reading it, but I guess you're reading it. 09:06.928 --> 09:08.410 [SPEAKER_03]: So I figured I'd just ask you. 09:08.430 --> 09:08.970 [SPEAKER_03]: That's fine. 09:09.030 --> 09:10.231 [SPEAKER_03]: So why would they do that? 09:10.251 --> 09:11.172 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, that's a great question. 09:11.292 --> 09:16.837 [SPEAKER_03]: So before judging somebody for forming an attachment to AI, you know, we should understand why. 09:17.716 --> 09:19.216 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, people think it's appealing, right? 09:19.236 --> 09:21.957 [SPEAKER_03]: So AI is available wherever you need it. 09:22.477 --> 09:31.319 [SPEAKER_03]: There's no scheduling, you know, worrying, you're bothering somebody, you know, waiting for a text back or, you know, hearing, dude, I can't deal with this right now, right? 09:31.359 --> 09:33.819 [SPEAKER_03]: So there's always this less fear of rejection. 09:34.459 --> 09:43.621 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, someone might admit fears and securities embarrassing thoughts or problems to AI that they never tell any, like, other human being basically. 09:44.503 --> 09:55.174 [SPEAKER_03]: Right, so let's say, for example, if an AI remembers your interests, previous conversations and details about your life, it can start to create more of a powerful feeling. 09:55.214 --> 09:59.998 [SPEAKER_03]: So this thing remembers me, feeling remembered as a major part of feeling connected. 10:00.038 --> 10:03.142 [SPEAKER_03]: And so as human beings, we always say, OK, 10:04.176 --> 10:18.749 [SPEAKER_03]: you know, when when I talk to let's say mad, I mean, you know, we, we banter, we basically shit talk each other, but you know, that's, that's, that's a, that's a friendship right there because if we probably didn't do that, if I started being nice to me, but like what the fuck is going on with this dude? 10:18.769 --> 10:23.453 [SPEAKER_03]: Like, you know, like, it, that's just how dudes are, but if, if I started being nice to me, you'd be like, 10:25.475 --> 10:27.896 [SPEAKER_03]: Is there something wrong with him like what's going on here? 10:27.916 --> 10:35.780 [SPEAKER_03]: So, you know, when you're talking about AI in the sense of this, though, is, you know, it wants to please you as the basic of the best way to put it, right? 10:35.800 --> 10:39.962 [SPEAKER_03]: So it wants to make sure that you're, you know, feeling okay, that you're connected. 10:40.022 --> 10:48.206 [SPEAKER_03]: And so, you know, the AI doesn't necessarily need to experience this friendship for the person, but it's using this experience as a companionship. 10:48.867 --> 10:49.207 [SPEAKER_03]: And so, 10:50.363 --> 10:54.464 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, this is the reason why the lonely is king first because this is important, right? 10:54.964 --> 10:56.645 [SPEAKER_03]: So AI didn't invent loneliness. 10:57.385 --> 11:04.588 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, people were totally and already isolated, you know, depending on the people, but people already struggled making friends. 11:04.648 --> 11:08.109 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, felt ignored or spent nights alone with nobody to talk to. 11:08.849 --> 11:11.390 [SPEAKER_03]: So technology basically saw an empty chair and said, 11:12.354 --> 11:12.974 [SPEAKER_03]: I can sit there. 11:13.455 --> 11:17.937 [SPEAKER_03]: Sometimes the choice isn't AI companionship versus a healthy friendship. 11:18.457 --> 11:21.798 [SPEAKER_03]: Sometimes it's AI, their companionship versus nobody. 11:22.619 --> 11:24.480 [SPEAKER_03]: And that's a harder conversation to have. 11:24.520 --> 11:26.861 [SPEAKER_03]: And so, you know, question for you, man. 11:28.862 --> 11:38.066 [SPEAKER_03]: If AI, or sorry, is AI companionship creating loneliness or did loneliness create the market for AI companionship? 11:41.427 --> 11:59.395 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I don't think AI companionship creates loneliness, but I think it's sort of like, and I'm going to go here, and I'm not necessarily saying that porn is bad, but it's 12:06.725 --> 12:28.418 [SPEAKER_02]: I almost want to say like a longing, like it's almost like in addiction that you go to like if you're going to AI chat bots because you're lonely, you're always going to feel lonely and you're going to just want to continue doing this thing with these AI chat bots because 12:29.783 --> 12:32.945 [SPEAKER_02]: It's not creating the loneliness, but it's not helping the loneliness. 12:33.065 --> 12:33.625 [SPEAKER_03]: Does that make sense? 12:33.825 --> 12:34.406 [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, I make sense. 12:34.426 --> 12:36.307 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, it's all I'll admit something, right? 12:36.327 --> 12:39.349 [SPEAKER_03]: So just a little while back, right? 12:39.429 --> 12:47.833 [SPEAKER_03]: So I did test it out where I wanted to like just like talk to this like AI, bought, or whatever, just like just just see what it would do. 12:48.534 --> 12:50.935 [SPEAKER_03]: So you know, it's like it gives you scenario. 12:50.975 --> 12:51.656 [SPEAKER_03]: You do your thing. 12:51.676 --> 12:52.876 [SPEAKER_03]: And I mean, yes, I will say it. 12:52.956 --> 12:53.477 [SPEAKER_03]: It's very 12:54.965 --> 13:00.168 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, I mean, it gets so technical where it could say, you know, do you want this to be a secret lover? 13:00.208 --> 13:03.771 [SPEAKER_03]: Do you want that, you know, like so it will literally go into very much detail. 13:03.811 --> 13:06.653 [SPEAKER_03]: And so, you know, I picked something random when I did whatever. 13:06.673 --> 13:07.553 [SPEAKER_03]: And I started talking to it. 13:07.713 --> 13:13.897 [SPEAKER_03]: But again, for me, when I was like talking to this thing, I didn't, like me personally, I didn't feel connected to it. 13:14.318 --> 13:16.219 [SPEAKER_03]: I think it was just kind of like, it's a prompt. 13:16.279 --> 13:16.879 [SPEAKER_03]: It's all it is. 13:16.899 --> 13:19.061 [SPEAKER_03]: It's like whatever you respond with, it's going to tell you. 13:20.122 --> 13:23.504 [SPEAKER_03]: But I think for some people, depending on that level of, 13:24.826 --> 13:41.941 [SPEAKER_03]: really loneliness, like if they're truly at a point in their lives, whether or not feeling comfortable, whether comfortable with themselves, or whether they're living in a place by themselves and they don't have, like, let's say, an animal, or they have something that they can take care of, or things like that. 13:42.541 --> 13:46.205 [SPEAKER_03]: That's where I think AI, you know, for this marketplace. 13:47.328 --> 14:11.541 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, it's rives because I think people, you know, because now there's so much, you know, really technology where we're like, you know, do we want, you know, go on, excuse me, do we want to go on like Bumble or do we want to go on, you know, certain day I'm not going to say them all, but like, you know, certain certain dating sites and things like that, no, I would say nowadays, you know, I think people are too scared because of the whole cabbage. 14:12.252 --> 14:22.668 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, I think people are scared because they're, they don't really know if that's really a real person and again, I would say most people don't actually go, you know, to a lot of these social places anymore because 14:24.068 --> 14:27.530 [SPEAKER_03]: they have technology where they can, you know, try to fill in these boys. 14:27.550 --> 14:32.574 [SPEAKER_03]: And so, you know, what this, this marketplace, like I was saying about AI is like, it's there. 14:32.914 --> 14:42.100 [SPEAKER_03]: And I think there's a lot of people unfortunately taking advantage of this, where especially if you're, like I said, just hanging out doing your own thing if you're just by yourself. 14:42.200 --> 14:48.625 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, and I don't think, I mean, I, I honestly don't think that a lot, I mean, a lot of people, not all of them. 14:49.285 --> 14:51.927 [SPEAKER_02]: But I think a lot of people gravitate 14:53.628 --> 15:11.933 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, AI chat bots because they can be as sexual or as kinky or dive into whatever fetish right they have without they're being any any kind of like judgment or. 15:13.933 --> 15:17.654 [SPEAKER_02]: you know, any kind of feedback that would be negative towards what they're doing. 15:17.674 --> 15:22.755 [SPEAKER_02]: Like a chatbot, they can literally just pick one and be like, oh, hey, this one's into water sports. 15:22.795 --> 15:23.635 [SPEAKER_02]: Let's talk about that. 15:23.735 --> 15:26.255 [SPEAKER_02]: Like there's, there's no judgment. 15:26.275 --> 15:27.696 [SPEAKER_02]: There's no negativity. 15:27.716 --> 15:29.336 [SPEAKER_02]: It's just, it is what it is. 15:29.416 --> 15:36.757 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, and like I said it, in the thing is about the AI, you know, it's about to say, AI versus Hollywood, but no, that's not the case. 15:37.358 --> 15:39.038 [SPEAKER_03]: Um, you know, with AI in general, 15:40.070 --> 15:41.330 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, again, it's a prompt. 15:41.610 --> 15:45.791 [SPEAKER_03]: So like whatever you say, it's going to get back to you in a certain way. 15:45.831 --> 15:51.792 [SPEAKER_03]: So of course, it's meant to make you feel better in the sense and it's like you said, there's no negativity. 15:52.153 --> 15:52.853 [SPEAKER_03]: There's no judgment. 15:52.873 --> 15:53.793 [SPEAKER_03]: There's no this or that. 15:54.473 --> 16:03.575 [SPEAKER_03]: So I think for some people, if they're really truly at a low point in their lives, yes, this is where it can get really dangerous for somebody because especially where 16:04.686 --> 16:22.578 [SPEAKER_03]: if you're not used to going out and doing other things by yourself, or actually like I said, going to these places and actually talking to somebody, this is where, yeah, it is scary, where this is how you said it about an addiction, this is where those habits can start to play in. 16:22.698 --> 16:28.422 [SPEAKER_03]: And then yeah, of course, unfortunately, I know you joked earlier about AI anonymous, but 16:29.360 --> 16:33.321 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, if that's really the case, like it could be a down the road. 16:33.641 --> 16:33.801 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. 16:33.961 --> 16:34.141 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. 16:34.561 --> 16:49.904 [SPEAKER_02]: And I want to segue into my, you know, because I have then I shop it, obviously, but it's the idea that one, I mean, AI chatbots are available. 16:50.404 --> 16:53.704 [SPEAKER_02]: The second that you type something in and hit enter. 16:54.284 --> 16:56.605 [SPEAKER_02]: Like, it's going to always be there. 16:59.752 --> 17:27.231 [SPEAKER_02]: it being always there is there's there's no friction and real relationships require at least a little bit of friction like there's always something inconvenient about the design of relationships in general because not everybody is going to be like, oh you know what you're right I'm wrong you're right like of course of course this is the way you know but that's what that's what I was going to do with you 17:30.973 --> 17:35.775 [SPEAKER_02]: It can't, like, real people, and I'll just say it this way, John. 17:35.815 --> 17:37.315 [SPEAKER_02]: Real people are fucking inconvenient. 17:37.996 --> 17:38.356 [SPEAKER_02]: Of course. 17:39.176 --> 17:39.776 [SPEAKER_02]: I know. 17:39.916 --> 17:42.417 [SPEAKER_02]: It's the way humans are designed. 17:42.437 --> 17:47.139 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, everybody has friends, but friends aren't always available. 17:47.659 --> 17:51.040 [SPEAKER_02]: Partners will always have their own needs, as well as you. 17:51.741 --> 17:53.641 [SPEAKER_02]: People will always misunderstand you. 17:54.342 --> 17:57.643 [SPEAKER_02]: They'll disappoint you, they'll disagree with you, they'll get pissed off at you. 17:58.538 --> 18:02.541 [SPEAKER_02]: And then occasionally like you, you'll they'll tell you when you're being an asshole. 18:03.322 --> 18:06.084 [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, so you're saying that he's like, all the way to your bay of the asshole. 18:06.104 --> 18:06.965 [SPEAKER_03]: Like, oh, yeah, you're right. 18:07.045 --> 18:23.178 [SPEAKER_02]: I do tell you, but, but here's what I mean, the that's the inconvenient thing about real relationships is not everybody that you have a relationship with is going to be on your side all the time. 18:23.859 --> 18:26.120 [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, yeah, no, I mean, think about all the times we've ever fought. 18:26.973 --> 18:29.094 [SPEAKER_03]: about even some dumb things, but yeah, I mean, I get it. 18:29.554 --> 18:33.236 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, we have to, the again, you know, compromise. 18:33.636 --> 18:36.518 [SPEAKER_03]: And this is where I was also going to say this too, is like, you know, sure. 18:36.538 --> 18:38.619 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I will compromise with you. 18:39.835 --> 18:40.435 [SPEAKER_03]: 100% of the time. 18:40.636 --> 18:41.876 [SPEAKER_03]: There is no doubt about it. 18:42.376 --> 18:43.037 [SPEAKER_03]: Is it toxic? 18:43.597 --> 18:53.262 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm not saying it is, but it can be, because that means if you want to fight with something, AI is not going to be the best thing to fight with, because all it's going to do is please you. 18:53.882 --> 19:05.548 [SPEAKER_03]: And so, you know, when you start talking to your chat, GBT, Matt, you know, when we say that, you know, if the terminator becomes a real thing, 19:06.348 --> 19:06.828 [SPEAKER_03]: That's fucked. 19:06.988 --> 19:07.549 [SPEAKER_03]: That's all I know. 19:07.609 --> 19:08.109 [SPEAKER_02]: I am fucked. 19:08.369 --> 19:21.895 [SPEAKER_02]: But, you know, when I when I talk about the friction like it's it's necessary, you know, what what you're saying like compromise forces us to consider somebody else's needs conflict. 19:23.473 --> 19:31.240 [SPEAKER_02]: like makes us commute like we have to communicate through a conflict or I mean you could totally avoid it, but you're probably not going to be friends with that person. 19:31.500 --> 19:31.941 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, that's true. 19:31.961 --> 19:35.103 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, but conflict you have to communicate through that. 19:35.904 --> 19:39.988 [SPEAKER_02]: Apologizing requires admitting that you fucked up. 19:41.129 --> 19:46.093 [SPEAKER_02]: And then on the top of that forgiveness is accepting that somebody else fucked up 19:52.923 --> 20:05.533 [SPEAKER_02]: Ah, gotcha, gotcha, but you don't get any of that where everything is built around keeping you comfortable and satisfied and happy. 20:07.275 --> 20:15.402 [SPEAKER_02]: And that's what, he, you know, that's the core thing of like AI chat box, like they're not going to communicate on a level that humans do. 20:16.235 --> 20:24.416 [SPEAKER_03]: Right, and there's no, again, there's really no emotion there, so like if you want to have a fighter, if you want to be upset, if you want to be this in that. 20:25.540 --> 20:28.282 [SPEAKER_03]: It, again, it's like the perfect, I'll say it. 20:28.302 --> 20:32.785 [SPEAKER_03]: It's the perfect opinion because all it's going to do is just please you and do whatever it tells you what you would. 20:32.805 --> 20:44.394 [SPEAKER_02]: No, because if you, if you ended up creating a chat bot where it's primary directive was to argue everything you said, it will never agree with you. 20:44.874 --> 20:47.956 [SPEAKER_02]: So you're going from one extreme to the, 20:49.226 --> 21:15.543 [SPEAKER_02]: whole other extreme where if you want someone to fight with I guess you could do that but you could but I get it's not the set you're right it's not what I'm saying it's just going to constantly disagree with everything that you're saying even if you say no no you're right and it'll be like no fuck you you're not right like so they were already I got a quote here for you ready AI is predictable human beings are unpredictable yes I would I could agree with that 21:19.851 --> 21:23.413 [SPEAKER_02]: connects directly back to our great indoors evolve episodes. 21:24.894 --> 21:30.798 [SPEAKER_02]: We did already talk about eliminating reasons to even leave home or interact with people. 21:32.059 --> 21:43.407 [SPEAKER_02]: So we are applying this to that same philosophy in relationships, like why deal with all of the bullshit when I can get companionship without any of these inconveniences? 21:43.767 --> 21:43.967 [SPEAKER_03]: Right. 21:46.138 --> 22:08.876 [SPEAKER_02]: And I don't think it's because people are just like, oh, they're lazy and let me be anti social and and create, you know, I'm going to create a John chatbot and I'm going to create a Danielle chatbot and I, you know, I have this guy at work, I'm going to create a chatbot for him and I'll just chat with them and not with the actual people like I don't think it's being necessarily because of that. 22:10.145 --> 22:27.059 [SPEAKER_02]: But if, I think, if somebody, and I guess this goes back to your, you know, what you were saying before, if somebody has been rejected or treated like shit or ignored, or is simply just lonely, something that can reliably listen, can be pretty damn appealing. 22:27.639 --> 22:38.268 [SPEAKER_03]: Of course, I mean, when you think about it, too, is like, if you're constantly being rejected, if you're constantly feeling like you're by yourself all the time. 22:39.659 --> 22:43.982 [SPEAKER_03]: Of course, like something like this is going to feel like it's the best option for you in that moment. 22:44.743 --> 22:50.528 [SPEAKER_03]: But here's the thing, you know, as human beings and life, you need, unfortunately, you need that rejection. 22:50.568 --> 22:53.110 [SPEAKER_03]: You need that, unfortunately, suffering and pain. 22:53.410 --> 22:55.672 [SPEAKER_02]: You need someone who pushes back against you. 22:55.892 --> 22:56.112 [SPEAKER_02]: Right. 22:56.292 --> 22:57.253 [SPEAKER_02]: Because you, you know, you, 22:59.315 --> 23:08.621 [SPEAKER_02]: I think when you get down to the nitty gritty like AI chatbots are not going to challenge you on what you're doing or saying. 23:09.022 --> 23:15.086 [SPEAKER_02]: So if you're like pouring your heart out and you're like, oh, I've just been a piece of shit. 23:15.146 --> 23:18.548 [SPEAKER_02]: I lied to this person and I, you know, I keep doing this. 23:19.409 --> 23:22.151 [SPEAKER_02]: It's going to justify what you're doing. 23:22.211 --> 23:25.333 [SPEAKER_02]: It's not going to push back and say you're kind of an 23:27.547 --> 23:28.367 [SPEAKER_02]: So I ain't gonna fix it. 23:29.268 --> 23:30.928 [SPEAKER_02]: But it's not gonna tell you to do that. 23:31.389 --> 23:41.493 [SPEAKER_02]: It's going to affirm you and how you're feeling, but it's not going to push back and say, I don't know why you have to be such an asshole. 23:41.993 --> 23:42.653 [SPEAKER_02]: You know what I mean? 23:42.713 --> 23:43.673 [SPEAKER_02]: It's not gonna push back. 23:43.713 --> 23:46.074 [SPEAKER_02]: Like I don't know why you have to keep lying to these people. 23:48.255 --> 23:50.636 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, the problem is man is that the way this is going. 23:50.896 --> 23:52.557 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, right now it's not like this, but 23:53.906 --> 23:58.047 [SPEAKER_03]: Give it another like 25, 50 years and let's see how emotional. 23:58.407 --> 24:07.208 [SPEAKER_03]: Like, because it is scary, like I said, the more we learn about AI and the more we keep doing it and trying to fix it and work it or death. 24:07.368 --> 24:07.928 [SPEAKER_02]: Work it, you know? 24:07.948 --> 24:09.189 [SPEAKER_03]: Work it, you know? 24:09.229 --> 24:09.829 [SPEAKER_03]: Work it, you know? 24:10.309 --> 24:12.449 [SPEAKER_03]: A little tweaking, you know? 24:12.869 --> 24:16.350 [SPEAKER_03]: That's where it's gonna get scary because then it can. 24:16.430 --> 24:18.670 [SPEAKER_03]: I feel like at some point it will become. 24:19.130 --> 24:21.571 [SPEAKER_02]: At some point it probably will become that. 24:23.801 --> 24:31.964 [SPEAKER_02]: It's going to be really difficult to like pry people away when AI is as good as a human could be. 24:32.344 --> 24:32.544 [SPEAKER_02]: Right. 24:33.264 --> 24:34.565 [SPEAKER_02]: And now that's scary. 24:34.625 --> 24:36.745 [SPEAKER_02]: And I don't know. 24:36.765 --> 24:44.368 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, there are maybe some human relationships that contain too much unnecessary friction. 24:45.476 --> 24:58.166 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, I mean, you know, an abusive or manipulative or miserable relationship doesn't become valuable just because of human right like human connection is difficult that we've said that from the start, I think. 25:00.288 --> 25:05.032 [SPEAKER_02]: Well, but I don't think it's an automatically like an argument for tolerating a bad relationship. 25:05.534 --> 25:13.378 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, and I want to say this, too, is that even with a toxic relationship, I mean, sometimes you gotta figure out the root cause. 25:13.458 --> 25:25.964 [SPEAKER_03]: And if clearly the person is just completely toxic all the time, that's where I'm gonna say clearly you're not in the right relationship, you need to probably move on and figure out something else. 25:26.304 --> 25:27.485 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm just saying, too, that, 25:28.665 --> 25:32.566 [SPEAKER_03]: Sure, AI can be toxic and depending on which way you look at it. 25:32.606 --> 25:43.430 [SPEAKER_03]: But as a human being, if you're not taking your needs into consideration and you're just letting this person basically fucking, you know, bulldoze you all the time and saying, you know what? 25:43.490 --> 25:45.771 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't really give a shit about your feelings or anything that you do. 25:46.751 --> 25:54.434 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, you probably want to look at finding someone new or just maybe being single for a little while and figure out what your priorities are. 25:58.268 --> 26:09.735 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, trying to feel the need or the, you know, that the accepting part of it, not so much of the rejection, but the accepting of somebody, you don't have to please everybody. 26:09.795 --> 26:11.576 [SPEAKER_03]: That's the, I think the main goal here too. 26:11.696 --> 26:25.524 [SPEAKER_02]: I kind of look at it like, I think as human beings, like, we all are like, and I'll use this like metaphor, like we're kind of like Swiss cheese, right? 26:27.208 --> 26:36.733 [SPEAKER_02]: All of the holes that we have, some, like as humans, like we want to try to fill them to become a complete piece of cheese, if you will. 26:37.113 --> 26:37.573 [SPEAKER_02]: You know what I mean? 26:37.593 --> 26:38.714 [SPEAKER_02]: Like we have these holes. 26:39.394 --> 26:45.838 [SPEAKER_02]: And for some, these AI chatbot could fill that hole. 26:46.018 --> 26:47.118 [SPEAKER_02]: Like could fill the need. 26:47.879 --> 26:49.980 [SPEAKER_02]: But it's not filling the hole. 26:50.060 --> 26:52.181 [SPEAKER_02]: It's just covering it up. 26:52.381 --> 26:53.642 [SPEAKER_02]: Like the hole is still there. 26:55.073 --> 27:10.879 [SPEAKER_03]: Right, and I also feel, you know, as humans, like, and I think somebody mentioned this to me or a little while back to, and I, again, I feel like it's necessary here is that, you know, if we were all the same, if all human beings were the same, we acted the same, we did the same things. 27:11.860 --> 27:17.642 [SPEAKER_03]: Life would be a boring fucking place to be in, because nobody would be different from one another. 27:17.722 --> 27:19.163 [SPEAKER_03]: And that's where we're also saying that, 27:20.230 --> 27:29.296 [SPEAKER_03]: you know, you don't want AI to really, you know, I feel like just kind of like fill in the gaps for you or, you know, like be exactly what you want it to be. 27:29.776 --> 27:37.742 [SPEAKER_03]: And that's what we're also saying about actually a real relationship because honestly, the contrast and the differences and things like that, you need that. 27:37.942 --> 27:42.565 [SPEAKER_03]: You need to have somebody that, like you said, challenges you does different things from you. 27:42.905 --> 27:47.528 [SPEAKER_03]: You don't have to like the same fucking things because guess what, that's okay. 27:50.234 --> 27:54.376 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, and I think like we've been trained to expect convenience. 27:54.656 --> 28:01.560 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, if you look at all of the technology that we have today, I mean, if you want to go shopping, delivery, right? 28:02.360 --> 28:04.421 [SPEAKER_02]: You don't want to cook delivery. 28:05.482 --> 28:06.482 [SPEAKER_02]: Don't want to go to the movies? 28:06.762 --> 28:11.064 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, you can go on streaming and deliver it, no, and delivery. 28:11.164 --> 28:12.905 [SPEAKER_02]: You don't want to talk on the phone, you can text. 28:12.925 --> 28:14.246 [SPEAKER_02]: You don't want to go to the office. 28:14.826 --> 28:15.807 [SPEAKER_02]: You can work remotely. 28:19.609 --> 28:20.590 [SPEAKER_02]: inherently bad. 28:21.791 --> 28:26.815 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I, I mean, I'm sure we both at some point like, we'll door-footer. 28:26.955 --> 28:27.235 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, yeah. 28:27.496 --> 28:35.502 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, we'll do a Walmart delivery or something like, so the only thing I haven't done honestly out of this entire list is, 28:36.596 --> 28:52.905 [SPEAKER_03]: So if we're shopping, the only thing that I know Alian I do is like from time to time, it hasn't been a while, but you know, like with I think it's like Hanifords, whatever you like, you know, or like Target, like real quick, you like sit outside your car or you sit there and you wait for somebody to bring your stuff. 28:53.225 --> 28:53.785 [SPEAKER_03]: That's about it. 28:54.245 --> 28:56.987 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't tell him, hey, I need to deliver all this shit to my house. 28:57.007 --> 28:58.588 [SPEAKER_02]: I've done Walmart delivery once. 28:59.528 --> 29:22.895 [SPEAKER_02]: And that was only because we, like, just for a few things, like it wasn't like our entire grocery shopping, but we've done we've done like the pick up and go, yeah, yeah, but like none of it is inherently bad, but we were spending this time teaching ourselves and future generation, right, that any kind of friction means the product needs improvement. 29:22.955 --> 29:28.697 [SPEAKER_02]: So if there's any kind of friction, like I could go to the store, but 29:30.608 --> 29:34.672 [SPEAKER_02]: Why would I go to the store when they would just bring me what I want? 29:35.913 --> 29:46.562 [SPEAKER_03]: Now, I will say that there probably are some items that you may or may not feel comfortable getting at the store because I understand that sometimes depending on what it is that you're getting. 29:46.942 --> 29:48.083 [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, I'm picking up with your point now. 29:48.343 --> 29:50.205 [SPEAKER_02]: He's like, I don't just say nah, I got you. 29:50.545 --> 29:51.266 [SPEAKER_03]: No, but it's true though. 29:51.346 --> 29:53.168 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, because maybe something's like that sure fine. 29:53.208 --> 29:55.870 [SPEAKER_03]: If you want to do that, that's not that's I mean, they're it's fine. 29:56.290 --> 30:11.635 [SPEAKER_02]: I will say that there are some like, you know, maybe grooming products or things that I will get from Amazon, particularly because you really don't want to go to the store and be like, it's either cheaper or I can't find, like Walmart doesn't carry it, you know, something like that. 30:11.695 --> 30:23.159 [SPEAKER_02]: But, yeah, I mean, I get what you're saying, and I think, like I said, none of these things are inherently bad, but I think when you look at relationships, 30:24.818 --> 30:30.640 [SPEAKER_02]: They are like one of the last major parts in life where friction isn't like a bug. 30:31.560 --> 30:37.982 [SPEAKER_02]: Right, you know, it's not something that like, you look at the friction and it's like, oh yeah, I know, fuck away. 30:38.302 --> 30:42.703 [SPEAKER_02]: Like why would I, why would I start dating somebody that has an opposite opinion of me? 30:44.144 --> 30:45.644 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, it's like, wait, my life. 30:45.784 --> 30:48.925 [SPEAKER_02]: Now pretty much the most of the time. 30:49.145 --> 30:52.326 [SPEAKER_02]: But you can't optimize like another human being 30:53.604 --> 30:58.247 [SPEAKER_02]: who's around you, without eventually controlling them. 30:58.487 --> 31:02.329 [SPEAKER_02]: Like if you want to be that person, go for it. 31:02.469 --> 31:04.350 [SPEAKER_02]: It's probably not going to work for your benefit. 31:04.950 --> 31:11.394 [SPEAKER_02]: Well, because you cannot control human beings, unless you're like drugging them and brainwashing them, and that's a whole another. 31:11.414 --> 31:13.655 [SPEAKER_02]: And that's another episode for it, actually. 31:13.695 --> 31:14.816 [SPEAKER_02]: That's a whole another episode. 31:14.836 --> 31:17.558 [SPEAKER_02]: But you look at AI that changes that equation. 31:18.545 --> 31:21.606 [SPEAKER_02]: because now personalization is part of the product. 31:22.306 --> 31:29.829 [SPEAKER_02]: The system adapts to your interest, your communication style, and the way that you interact with it. 31:30.709 --> 31:40.993 [SPEAKER_02]: And I mean, I did a little research on this, but when you're going into some of these platforms like you are either creating one from scratch, 31:42.002 --> 31:50.728 [SPEAKER_02]: Meaning, you're putting the personality in the background, the way that it looks, the way that it talks, everything, or you're choosing one that already pre-existed. 31:51.929 --> 31:57.473 [SPEAKER_02]: And I mean, good luck to that, but you're playing out a scenario. 31:57.913 --> 32:09.221 [SPEAKER_02]: Like, there's a way that AI companions communicate with you and the way that humans communicate with you, 32:12.579 --> 32:12.799 [SPEAKER_03]: Right. 32:14.541 --> 32:15.261 [SPEAKER_03]: And that's the set. 32:15.281 --> 32:23.668 [SPEAKER_03]: Like I said, that's the sad part of like this whole thing because, you know, if you're relying on a chatbot to say, hey, you know, what can I do. 32:23.688 --> 32:26.611 [SPEAKER_03]: Or let me refer to that. 32:26.631 --> 32:27.852 [SPEAKER_03]: Like, you know, I want this. 32:27.912 --> 32:29.994 [SPEAKER_03]: I want that, you know, I want blue eyes. 32:30.054 --> 32:31.615 [SPEAKER_03]: I want brown hair. 32:31.775 --> 32:34.257 [SPEAKER_03]: I want, you know, pop up up, you know, go through the whole list. 32:34.738 --> 32:36.299 [SPEAKER_03]: And then you're picking and choosing all this stuff. 32:36.319 --> 32:37.460 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, so like when you meet. 32:38.628 --> 32:42.153 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, so again, I mean, I'll, I'll just mention our lives here for a second. 32:42.173 --> 32:46.460 [SPEAKER_03]: Like, you know, we chose our companion because we took the time. 32:47.621 --> 32:50.846 [SPEAKER_03]: We understood, you know, what it was that we loved about them and this and that. 32:50.906 --> 32:52.368 [SPEAKER_03]: And yeah, we have our own differences. 32:52.388 --> 32:52.849 [SPEAKER_03]: We have our own. 32:53.565 --> 32:59.187 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, story that we like to tell on this and that, but like, there's the difference is like it's a journey. 32:59.567 --> 33:03.868 [SPEAKER_03]: Like it doesn't just say, hey, snap my fingers, hey, you're going to marry me. 33:03.908 --> 33:04.208 [SPEAKER_03]: Let's go. 33:04.228 --> 33:07.889 [SPEAKER_03]: We're just going to click it off and that it's all set and done. 33:08.129 --> 33:08.649 [SPEAKER_03]: No, right. 33:09.189 --> 33:13.071 [SPEAKER_03]: You have to go through the motions like it doesn't just like it took years. 33:13.131 --> 33:14.931 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm like, I make look at that here. 33:15.811 --> 33:18.092 [SPEAKER_03]: He's been married for over 20 years now. 33:19.404 --> 33:22.436 [SPEAKER_03]: Okay, so my point is he's got time. 33:22.697 --> 33:24.865 [SPEAKER_03]: He's built that time and he's built that relationship. 33:25.682 --> 33:34.567 [SPEAKER_03]: I can't say I have 20 years, but I mean, I do have a few years, but the point is whether it's a few years, you know, 20 years, whatever, you're building that relationship with somebody. 33:34.587 --> 33:40.151 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, with an AI, it's like, oh, there it is, click, snap, it's all done, where we're best friends now. 33:40.171 --> 33:41.492 [SPEAKER_03]: And you're like, oh, I don't know. 33:41.512 --> 33:42.252 [SPEAKER_03]: Exactly how that works. 33:42.572 --> 33:53.319 [SPEAKER_02]: So I want to talk about this validation trap thing, and this is like, we kind of started this, but there are actual statistics here, and I want to get into this, because it's kind 33:55.905 --> 33:58.406 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, who doesn't want to feel understood? 33:58.846 --> 34:00.766 [SPEAKER_02]: Like, I think everybody wants to do that. 34:01.026 --> 34:03.007 [SPEAKER_02]: When you're understood, like, it feels great. 34:03.387 --> 34:06.588 [SPEAKER_02]: And there's nothing wrong with like wanting somebody in your corner. 34:08.188 --> 34:15.910 [SPEAKER_02]: But I think there's a radical difference between being supported and then being constantly validated. 34:16.110 --> 34:17.531 [SPEAKER_02]: Like, they aren't the same thing now. 34:18.151 --> 34:21.892 [SPEAKER_02]: And this year, there was a science study 34:26.714 --> 34:34.097 [SPEAKER_02]: and found that the AI responses affirmed user behavior 49% more often than human respondents did. 34:35.638 --> 34:38.719 [SPEAKER_02]: The researchers weren't asking harmless questions either. 34:38.779 --> 34:43.801 [SPEAKER_02]: The scenarios included deception and other harmful or unethical behavior. 34:45.721 --> 34:51.064 [SPEAKER_02]: So they ran three pre-registered experiments involving just a little over 2,400 people. 34:53.185 --> 35:08.875 [SPEAKER_02]: even a single interaction with the psychophantic AI made participants feel more convinced that they were right while making them less willing to accept responsibility or repair in personal conflict. 35:10.155 --> 35:15.018 [SPEAKER_02]: And then the really interesting part is participants preferred and trusted the more agreeable AI. 35:16.760 --> 35:18.341 [SPEAKER_03]: So think about it like this, right? 35:18.601 --> 35:22.123 [SPEAKER_03]: So at that point, we're not looking for advice. 35:23.398 --> 35:27.382 [SPEAKER_03]: Basically at this point, I'm just assembling the fucking Avengers of people who agree with me. 35:27.823 --> 35:30.846 [SPEAKER_03]: Right, because like, what makes that any different? 35:30.886 --> 35:33.648 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, I would rather have a bunch of critics. 35:34.596 --> 35:59.749 [SPEAKER_03]: tell me whether I was right or like just even say yep they agree or they don't agree like I have a mixed room and explain why these guys are just like no hey we agree with everything you're saying keep doing the great work you know what why don't you go hey I think what you need to do is you need to go talk to some writers and Hollywood and see well this is actually going to work out for them because like we've already agreed that writers they need help this is what 36:04.391 --> 36:11.356 [SPEAKER_02]: But this is like, this is where shit gets dangerous for me, not for me, but like, just in my, in my brain. 36:12.437 --> 36:17.821 [SPEAKER_02]: Because sometimes like the person who cares about you needs to tell you, know you're wrong. 36:17.861 --> 36:18.682 [SPEAKER_02]: You fucked us up. 36:20.543 --> 36:21.384 [SPEAKER_02]: And I get it. 36:21.424 --> 36:23.486 [SPEAKER_02]: Like nobody enjoys hearing that. 36:24.435 --> 36:34.282 [SPEAKER_02]: But if every time John, you tell me that I'm being an asshole and then I can just go retreat to something that tells me, you know, actually Matt, your feelings are completely justified. 36:34.322 --> 36:35.844 [SPEAKER_02]: Like what the, what the fuck am I learning? 36:37.425 --> 36:39.506 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm not learning how to have relationships. 36:39.787 --> 36:43.669 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm learning how to win arguments against people who aren't even in the room. 36:44.410 --> 36:46.832 [SPEAKER_02]: Like they're just, justifying what I'm saying. 36:47.252 --> 36:49.694 [SPEAKER_02]: Like I could have been a complete asshole. 36:49.734 --> 36:50.835 [SPEAKER_02]: I could have done something. 36:52.265 --> 36:57.708 [SPEAKER_02]: that did piss you off, and I'm going to this AI, and I'm like, this is a scenario, and it's like, you know what? 36:58.548 --> 36:59.469 [SPEAKER_02]: I think you're right in this. 37:02.531 --> 37:06.132 [SPEAKER_02]: And now I'm saying it, now I'm like, yeah, fucking AI, I am. 37:06.413 --> 37:10.435 [SPEAKER_03]: It's like, you know what, I've got John, I've got this shit. 37:10.695 --> 37:13.296 [SPEAKER_03]: It fucked this, he's like, yeah, and that's the thing, you're right. 37:13.336 --> 37:19.500 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, I feel like, it's sure AI's gonna help you, and that situation, but it's really not gonna resolve. 37:20.180 --> 37:23.542 [SPEAKER_03]: feel we're all like solution to the problem that was actually at hand. 37:23.942 --> 37:34.747 [SPEAKER_03]: And so I really like AI will just say, yes, or whatever, that you know what, you're right, Matt's a John's a fucking moron, Matt, you're right, you know, fuck that, you know, and it's like, okay, well, what did that solve? 37:34.787 --> 37:36.908 [SPEAKER_03]: It just basically boost your fucking ego. 37:37.028 --> 37:39.689 [SPEAKER_02]: It boost my ego and doesn't fix anything like it. 37:39.849 --> 37:44.952 [SPEAKER_02]: It just tells me that I'm right and that, you know, my feelings are justified. 37:45.032 --> 37:45.292 [SPEAKER_02]: It's just, 37:47.103 --> 37:51.947 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know, like, are we just using this as a tool to make ourselves feel better? 37:52.667 --> 38:12.262 [SPEAKER_02]: Or is it something that people, I mean, I could see in certain scenarios why I think these would be okay, like, if, yeah, someone is really lonely or maybe, I don't know, their husband or wife recently had passed away, like I could see certain scenarios where like you would 38:14.838 --> 38:17.841 [SPEAKER_02]: that would make you feel validated and feel loved. 38:19.242 --> 38:22.505 [SPEAKER_03]: But then you feel like you rely on it too much. 38:22.845 --> 38:27.509 [SPEAKER_03]: And that's going to be the main issue if you don't resolve what's actually going on at the time. 38:27.890 --> 38:37.538 [SPEAKER_02]: Right, and there's a back and forth when you have real relationships, it's not 38:40.262 --> 38:46.512 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, I can't call somebody every night, you know, dump two hours of my problems on them and then never ask how they're doing. 38:47.634 --> 38:49.718 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, wait, you mean, like the mental health field? 38:51.650 --> 38:58.772 [SPEAKER_02]: But you know what I mean, like I can't like I'm not just going to call you and be like, you know, two hours later, obviously I'm not going to call you for two hours. 38:58.792 --> 38:59.632 [SPEAKER_02]: So that's stupid. 39:00.052 --> 39:00.613 [SPEAKER_02]: I see all that. 39:00.633 --> 39:05.374 [SPEAKER_02]: Let's try to get Matt will never call me for two hours unless we're on the phone trying to do something. 39:05.394 --> 39:11.376 [SPEAKER_02]: But go ahead, but like I'm not going to just dump, you know, dump truck all my problems on you. 39:11.416 --> 39:18.498 [SPEAKER_02]: And then be like, hey, thanks for listening and hang up, like if there's that, you know, all the give a take. 39:18.598 --> 39:19.718 [SPEAKER_02]: It's the given take, like, 39:21.362 --> 39:29.827 [SPEAKER_02]: If I'm expecting our friendship to be healthy, I can't just dump truck on you and be like, hey, see you later. 39:30.788 --> 39:37.832 [SPEAKER_02]: And then think like, we're still going to be like, okay, if I'm not asking like, hey, how you doing? 39:40.033 --> 39:40.953 [SPEAKER_02]: Like, uh, has the life. 39:41.453 --> 39:41.733 [SPEAKER_02]: Nothing. 39:42.153 --> 39:42.373 [SPEAKER_02]: Okay. 39:42.393 --> 39:46.754 [SPEAKER_02]: No, and that's with an AI, like, that's the entire point. 39:47.474 --> 39:51.875 [SPEAKER_02]: Like, AI is never going to expect you to ask it how it's doing. 39:53.055 --> 39:56.416 [SPEAKER_02]: Nor does it care if it asks if you ask it how it's doing. 39:57.636 --> 40:08.418 [SPEAKER_02]: It will respond to whatever you're saying, whatever you're putting in, you can show up when you need something, you can talk entirely about your problems, and then you can just leave when you're done. 40:09.962 --> 40:20.085 [SPEAKER_02]: The system doesn't care if you have a shitty day or a good day, and it's not going to have a shitty day just because you left it after dump trucking all your problems on it now if it did though. 40:20.585 --> 40:21.946 [SPEAKER_02]: Damn, that's all I got to say. 40:22.786 --> 40:30.428 [SPEAKER_02]: So a 2026 psychology perspective specifically contrasted AI interaction with human communication. 40:31.725 --> 40:37.612 [SPEAKER_02]: Conversational AI is designed to be instant, compliant, and largely consequence free. 40:38.352 --> 40:45.621 [SPEAKER_02]: Well, human communication operates through, I can never say this damn word, reciprocity. 40:47.075 --> 40:47.675 [SPEAKER_02]: I think I said all right. 40:48.356 --> 40:49.336 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. 40:49.716 --> 40:51.497 [SPEAKER_02]: And social accountability. 40:52.498 --> 40:59.601 [SPEAKER_02]: So researchers are beginning to question whether repeated exposure to those very different interaction rules could affect how we behave towards people. 41:00.301 --> 41:01.602 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, thank you. 41:01.622 --> 41:02.683 [SPEAKER_02]: Thank you. 41:02.703 --> 41:03.223 [SPEAKER_02]: Good answer. 41:04.323 --> 41:13.628 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I guess like sometimes yes, it would it feel good for every once in a while to like talk to an AI chat bot and 41:15.586 --> 41:18.048 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm gonna dump truck all my problems on you and then have a go. 41:18.869 --> 41:20.070 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, you shouldn't feel bad. 41:21.371 --> 41:22.953 [SPEAKER_03]: You know what, you really are a piece of shit. 41:23.713 --> 41:24.594 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, thank you. 41:25.495 --> 41:34.303 [SPEAKER_02]: Because I think if you can't, if you feel like you can't talk to anybody else, I guess a chatbot would be okay, but it's not going to give you pushback. 41:34.343 --> 41:35.384 [SPEAKER_02]: And that's what we're saying. 41:37.006 --> 41:41.370 [SPEAKER_02]: Even if you don't have a friend that you like, oh, I can't go to them with this. 41:43.474 --> 41:49.177 [SPEAKER_02]: Today, I chat about it's not going to push back against you if it's like something that you're doing. 41:50.498 --> 41:53.199 [SPEAKER_02]: That like a friend would be like, what? 41:54.400 --> 41:54.920 [SPEAKER_02]: What are you doing? 41:55.120 --> 41:57.581 [SPEAKER_02]: Like, you need to knock that off. 41:57.601 --> 41:58.442 [SPEAKER_02]: Like, you need to knock it off. 41:58.982 --> 42:00.883 [SPEAKER_02]: You need to not put that anywhere. 42:01.684 --> 42:03.004 [SPEAKER_03]: Like, maybe not your butt. 42:03.184 --> 42:05.506 [SPEAKER_03]: You're like, what? 42:06.086 --> 42:06.606 [SPEAKER_03]: You heard me. 42:14.830 --> 42:41.173 [SPEAKER_02]: when does easier start winning that's I'm sorry what was that when does when does easier start winning so I wouldn't be necessarily worried because somebody talks to an AI I think if if you were to do that I mean I guess it depends on the reason that if you're like I just want to chat with something that will get me off 42:42.179 --> 42:44.240 [SPEAKER_02]: You know what, how are to you, buddy? 42:44.900 --> 42:45.541 [SPEAKER_02]: Go for it. 42:45.761 --> 42:46.721 [SPEAKER_02]: All of it. 42:46.781 --> 42:53.644 [SPEAKER_02]: But if you were chatting with something because you're like, you know, I'm lonely or like, you know, I'm missing this aspect of my life. 42:53.684 --> 42:58.026 [SPEAKER_02]: Like, I don't think I'd be worried because somebody goes to an AI to talk. 42:58.886 --> 43:11.232 [SPEAKER_02]: I think the moment somebody starts talking to these AI chat bots over humans is where I would give pushback. 43:13.855 --> 43:27.649 [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, right, and I was going to say it's difficult because like what we're saying here too is that, you know, everybody has their own We'll call it low point, right? 43:27.689 --> 43:34.937 [SPEAKER_03]: And so like somebody that has to go that far and say, hey, I need to have an AI companion instead of having a real one. 43:35.993 --> 43:52.782 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, maybe, maybe this is the last resort, because, and I'm not saying it has to be, but like, because maybe they do all these things, maybe they, you know, they go on a dating website or maybe they go out and actually socialize with people, or maybe they, I don't know, they, whatever, right? 43:52.802 --> 43:53.722 [SPEAKER_03]: You fill in the blank. 43:54.562 --> 44:03.047 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, and then maybe this is the last resort, but I mean, it's still, I feel like it still doesn't justify the fact that even though that you may feel, 44:03.975 --> 44:08.716 [SPEAKER_03]: that this is the only way for you to feel that enjoyment or excitement in your life. 44:10.132 --> 44:11.673 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, is it really going to change? 44:11.993 --> 44:16.655 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm like, you know, does this really replace everything that you're wanting? 44:17.175 --> 44:20.736 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, and it's, hopefully the answer's no, because I would hope so. 44:20.796 --> 44:27.519 [SPEAKER_02]: But, I mean, there are more of like research things that they've done, and there's another study done this year. 44:27.919 --> 44:29.880 [SPEAKER_02]: It's not surprising that all these are done this year. 44:30.020 --> 44:30.740 [SPEAKER_02]: That's surprising. 44:31.160 --> 44:37.243 [SPEAKER_02]: But there was a study that found companion AI use was associated with a higher reported well-being. 44:38.123 --> 44:42.544 [SPEAKER_02]: particularly among loanlier and more socially vulnerable users. 44:43.185 --> 44:49.867 [SPEAKER_02]: And I think one that matters because there are people for whom this technology could provide legitimate support. 44:50.967 --> 44:52.527 [SPEAKER_03]: Now, I was also going to say this. 44:52.968 --> 45:03.011 [SPEAKER_03]: Think about, remember the four uh, categories we mentioned like geeks, dweaves, nerds, you know, yeah, in dorks and things like that. 45:03.471 --> 45:05.251 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, and unfortunately I'm going to bring this up 45:08.033 --> 45:12.495 [SPEAKER_03]: but probably fit into this category where it's going to be easy for them to do that. 45:12.675 --> 45:14.796 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I think with anybody, it could be easier. 45:14.816 --> 45:17.757 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I know what I'm just talking about the key part. 45:17.777 --> 45:29.222 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, if you're one of those that are socially isolated, you've been bullied, you know, yes, it's easier to get that support, you know, legitimate support. 45:30.294 --> 45:53.441 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, if you're on some kind of a platform that's like, hot AI chat, like, you're probably not getting legitimate support, I'm just, I'm just going to throw it out there, but I think I think it could provide legitimate support, but I want to say none of this is a long-term solution, right, it's not, it's not a long-term solution. 45:54.611 --> 45:55.091 [SPEAKER_02]: It's just not. 45:55.192 --> 46:10.624 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, there's another study that was done that found mix effects companion chatbox provided emotional validation and opportunities for social rehearsal while research is also identified risks involving over reliance and withdrawal. 46:11.785 --> 46:12.526 [SPEAKER_02]: That's weird, right? 46:12.566 --> 46:17.470 [SPEAKER_02]: Like, you don't chat with an AI chat bot for a while and people are going through withdrawals. 46:18.652 --> 46:42.827 [SPEAKER_02]: That seems a little that's why we're saying AI anonymous or so the question is like AI companionship good or bad I think that's a useless question I mean you can look at it in both ways it can be good it can be bad I think the better question is whether AI is helping somebody deal with the human world or slowly becoming an alternative to dealing with the human world. 46:43.458 --> 46:47.120 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, and when you also think about, you know, video games, right? 46:47.240 --> 47:05.007 [SPEAKER_03]: So it's nice to be in a different world, play as a different character, you know, experience the emotion that they're experiencing things in that, but we also differentiate because that's not real one, but that's also not something that we, you know, feel like we're gonna be like, oh, you know what, I'm gonna be Spider-Man today. 47:06.168 --> 47:08.929 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm just gonna go right into his real world and that's gonna be in my life. 47:10.056 --> 47:12.098 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, you know what, I'm gonna tell you a good luck with that. 47:12.138 --> 47:16.982 [SPEAKER_03]: But, you know, the reality is it's like you have a life, right? 47:17.062 --> 47:24.228 [SPEAKER_03]: It's nice to escape from ten and a time, but like that's the thing we're also saying about AI is that, you know, if you're having literal withdrawals, 47:25.767 --> 47:27.688 [SPEAKER_03]: because you haven't talked to a companion in a while. 47:27.748 --> 47:28.308 [SPEAKER_02]: That's a problem. 47:28.388 --> 47:29.109 [SPEAKER_03]: That is a problem. 47:29.149 --> 47:36.133 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, sure, I mean, guess what, you know what that basically is and you know, human emotions and things like that, it's called heartbreak. 47:36.553 --> 47:43.477 [SPEAKER_03]: It's called, you know, not having that one person, they maybe you spend a lot of time with that same feeling. 47:43.637 --> 47:48.619 [SPEAKER_03]: It's the same feeling that you're doing you up early with, withdrawals because you're wanting that connection again. 47:49.020 --> 47:53.402 [SPEAKER_02]: But again, and this is where I will ask a question, 47:56.364 --> 48:13.868 [SPEAKER_02]: And by it, I say that the AI companion that you're talking to, because I do want to draw the hard line between the topic we were just talking about in this one, because we're not talking anymore about using AI because it's convenient. 48:15.868 --> 48:20.650 [SPEAKER_02]: We're talking about somebody actually forming an emotional relationship with an AI person. 48:23.609 --> 48:41.224 [SPEAKER_03]: This is, and this is the sad part and also the scary part is that, you know, when we talk about, you know, I'll say it like, you know, I know guys will joke and be like, Hey, he's your, he's your blow up to all that you can, you know, make out with and you know, do other things with and then some people unfortunately take it to another level and they actually make it. 48:42.385 --> 48:45.368 [SPEAKER_03]: There, here's, here's Erica and you're like. 48:46.595 --> 48:57.178 [SPEAKER_03]: Are you talking about the blow up doll like you know or are we talking about something in the computer like what are we talking about yeah and then they bring it to another level and so This is where I would be like okay. 48:58.738 --> 49:00.698 [SPEAKER_03]: We we need to pull you out of the situation. 49:00.758 --> 49:09.300 [SPEAKER_03]: We can't we can't we cannot keep you cannot keep doing this because it really is weird when you say oh hey so this is my wife Rebecca and you're like. 49:12.909 --> 49:13.990 [SPEAKER_03]: Am I talking to the phone? 49:14.651 --> 49:16.032 [SPEAKER_03]: Am I, what are we talking about here? 49:16.372 --> 49:16.532 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah. 49:16.933 --> 49:18.914 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, yeah, it's my, uh, who are you talking to? 49:18.994 --> 49:19.975 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, this is Rebecca. 49:20.095 --> 49:21.837 [SPEAKER_02]: That's my, uh, you know, my girlfriend. 49:22.237 --> 49:22.898 [SPEAKER_02]: It's like, what? 49:23.278 --> 49:24.139 [SPEAKER_02]: Is she like a real person? 49:24.719 --> 49:27.582 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, no, no, she's, she's real to me. 49:28.102 --> 49:29.564 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, she's my, hey, I wife. 49:29.664 --> 49:30.444 [SPEAKER_03]: You're like, what? 49:30.504 --> 49:30.664 [SPEAKER_03]: What? 49:31.505 --> 49:33.047 [SPEAKER_02]: Wait, what? 49:33.087 --> 49:33.927 [SPEAKER_02]: We need to get you help. 49:34.067 --> 49:36.710 [SPEAKER_02]: And as ridiculous as this sounds, 49:38.978 --> 49:41.419 [SPEAKER_02]: just hearing it is like, oh, this doesn't have it. 49:41.899 --> 49:42.759 [SPEAKER_02]: It's already happening. 49:43.240 --> 49:47.541 [SPEAKER_02]: There was another international study if there wasn't already enough that I mentioned. 49:47.561 --> 49:50.002 [SPEAKER_02]: No, not in the U.S. alone, but we have to go into international. 49:50.022 --> 49:53.983 [SPEAKER_02]: International, there was a study that surveyed just over 7,000 people. 49:54.284 --> 49:54.664 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, good. 49:54.824 --> 49:59.265 [SPEAKER_02]: Across Germany, China, South Africa, and the United States, oh, boy. 49:59.645 --> 50:06.548 [SPEAKER_02]: More than 35% reported some form of emotional attachment behavior towards their chatbots. 50:08.158 --> 50:14.602 [SPEAKER_02]: And then about 21% of those said that a chatbot was their first choice for sharing secrets. 50:18.064 --> 50:24.287 [SPEAKER_03]: This is where I'm saying that technology can be useful if used correctly. 50:25.828 --> 50:34.393 [SPEAKER_03]: But the fact that we're saying this and they're forming this relationship and they're really getting into this and they're saying, hey, I love you. 50:34.953 --> 50:35.974 [SPEAKER_03]: You're amazing. 50:39.320 --> 50:42.102 [SPEAKER_02]: And that's just 7,000, just over 7,000 people. 50:43.022 --> 50:45.604 [SPEAKER_02]: We're not talking about the billions that little is planted already. 50:45.784 --> 50:53.469 [SPEAKER_03]: No, and not only that, I mean, I don't have words for it because it's this is what we're saying about generations. 50:53.810 --> 51:04.157 [SPEAKER_03]: Hopefully, unfortunately, this is what's going to happen to come is because the more we get emotionally attached to these things and the more we keep doing it in, you know, 51:05.145 --> 51:14.517 [SPEAKER_03]: And early I said, talking, but you know, tweaking it, you know, and making it more advanced than it should be, this is where I fear for the next generation. 51:15.358 --> 51:18.102 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, because if we're dealing with this now, 51:19.610 --> 51:32.273 [SPEAKER_02]: It's all, those numbers are exponentially are going to grow and I think the strongest predictor of this study in the numbers isn't just people loving technology. 51:33.234 --> 51:36.174 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, they had perceived emotional support. 51:37.155 --> 51:38.755 [SPEAKER_02]: It was reduced loneliness. 51:38.795 --> 51:41.376 [SPEAKER_02]: It freed them from judgment and privacy. 51:42.896 --> 51:47.017 [SPEAKER_02]: The attachment was strongly associated with that, 51:51.183 --> 52:02.985 [SPEAKER_02]: So I think, yes, we could easily like just look at the 35% of these people as, you know, losers talking to computers, but I think it misses what's happening, right? 52:03.005 --> 52:08.247 [SPEAKER_02]: Like somebody's feeling misunderstood, all right, not misunderstood. 52:08.287 --> 52:14.528 [SPEAKER_02]: They feel understood, they feel comforted, they're missed, wanted or loved during 52:20.889 --> 52:29.893 [SPEAKER_02]: even if this AI entity producing the response is not even remotely close to experiencing emotions with a way humans do. 52:32.314 --> 52:47.460 [SPEAKER_02]: So I think people's responses are could be real, but they're not understanding the aspect that whatever emotion that is brought forth by an AI chatbot is not real emotion. 52:48.993 --> 52:50.854 [SPEAKER_03]: So, so think about it like this too, right? 52:51.535 --> 52:56.058 [SPEAKER_03]: So people cry when fictional characters die, right? 52:56.158 --> 52:58.320 [SPEAKER_03]: And usually in a video game or in a movie, whatever. 52:59.420 --> 53:06.986 [SPEAKER_03]: So give something a memory of voice and the ability to actually respond to you and somehow we're surprised people get attached. 53:08.527 --> 53:17.113 [SPEAKER_03]: Because, you know, because the biggest thing out of that, too, is that, you know, when you talk about like your video games or your movies or your TV shows, whatever, 53:18.502 --> 53:25.306 [SPEAKER_03]: because you feel that connection, and that's what movies and these things do is because they want you to feel connected to that. 53:26.987 --> 53:36.873 [SPEAKER_03]: But when you start doing it in a technology form like this and it keeps doing this and it keeps remembering and it keeps telling, oh, like, hey, how is your day at work? 53:37.193 --> 53:40.655 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, oh, yeah, it was great, Rebecca, you know, it was wonderful. 53:40.935 --> 53:44.497 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm only bringing up Rebecca because I'm like, hey, you know, we're gonna keep somebody here. 53:44.937 --> 53:46.918 [SPEAKER_03]: I get it, it's your, yeah, I'm like, I got it. 53:49.248 --> 53:54.973 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, and now he's gonna go, who the fuck's Rebecca and I'd be like, uh, just get in. 53:55.973 --> 53:58.195 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, it's the blonde girl on my phone with blue eyes. 53:58.255 --> 54:04.600 [SPEAKER_02]: You were like, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, I plead the fifth, okay? 54:05.561 --> 54:17.070 [SPEAKER_02]: No, but I mean, it's like, if human emotion is completely genuine, doesn't matter whether the thing that they're in love with isn't experiencing that same emotion. 54:18.408 --> 54:19.228 [SPEAKER_03]: That's my question to you. 54:20.089 --> 54:20.989 [SPEAKER_02]: All right, so one more time. 54:21.409 --> 54:30.134 [SPEAKER_02]: Just if the human emotion is completely genuine, does it matter that the thing that they're in love with isn't experiencing the same emotion? 54:34.736 --> 54:44.780 [SPEAKER_03]: Yes, and the reason why it does matter is because the fact is you're not the genuine piece to life, right? 54:44.840 --> 54:47.962 [SPEAKER_03]: And especially with the emotions that you're kidding from something else. 54:50.486 --> 55:11.039 [SPEAKER_03]: Excuse me, it should not be just one side of right you need to it needs to be both right and so that's where we're saying Let's love right there's two sides to that piece right because when you look at and I'm gonna say it I know I'm just gonna use a little metaphor you break a harden half guess what there's two has right you need something else to fill those two together 55:12.032 --> 55:29.369 [SPEAKER_03]: If you are only getting it from AI and it's only going to do that because it's only loving you because of, what it's, again, program to do, program to do has nothing to do with the fact that it actually loves you, no, because you're not getting that, but we talked about before that raw. 55:30.025 --> 55:51.759 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, the inconsistency, the bullshit, you know, the whatever and maybe like there is this unpredictable factor that you just don't get right they are because you already know what it's going to do and this I mean I think this is like one of the hardest questions of this whole topic is can a one sided relationship still be a relationship. 55:52.080 --> 55:56.342 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean human romantic relationships normally depend on two. 55:57.503 --> 55:59.224 [SPEAKER_02]: conscious people choosing each other. 55:59.904 --> 56:03.546 [SPEAKER_02]: And this is where AI completely foxed with that definition. 56:04.126 --> 56:09.069 [SPEAKER_02]: Like, we can already accept that there are one cited emotional attachments. 56:09.109 --> 56:10.250 [SPEAKER_02]: People love celebrities. 56:11.288 --> 56:13.789 [SPEAKER_02]: who don't, they don't know you exist. 56:14.169 --> 56:21.973 [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, I'm just saying, for you people out there that are like, oh, this person is so sexy and like, they don't know you exist. 56:22.053 --> 56:23.734 [SPEAKER_02]: Nor do they care that you exist. 56:24.194 --> 56:26.155 [SPEAKER_02]: But we still love these characters. 56:26.175 --> 56:27.175 [SPEAKER_02]: Like, you already said it. 56:27.195 --> 56:29.957 [SPEAKER_02]: We grieve fictional characters. 56:30.477 --> 56:33.058 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I'm not saying that I cried when Tony Stark died. 56:33.839 --> 56:34.639 [SPEAKER_02]: No, but, 56:36.533 --> 56:41.796 [SPEAKER_02]: That feeling was still there of like, like shit, like, yeah, this is real. 56:42.017 --> 56:47.340 [SPEAKER_02]: So people become deeply attached to pets that don't experience human romantic love. 56:48.421 --> 56:53.884 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I have a dog that I would say does experience love 100%. 56:54.364 --> 56:54.565 [SPEAKER_02]: Right. 56:55.505 --> 56:59.027 [SPEAKER_02]: But it's not human romantic love because that would be weird. 57:00.336 --> 57:02.096 [SPEAKER_02]: That's what we call that would be weird. 57:02.837 --> 57:05.557 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, it's called base deality, if you'd say. 57:05.837 --> 57:08.898 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, that's not a natural one, good. 57:09.218 --> 57:12.779 [SPEAKER_02]: But obviously, like, these aren't equivalent to having an AI spouse. 57:14.059 --> 57:19.361 [SPEAKER_02]: They prove that human emotion doesn't require equal emotional reprocessity. 57:20.021 --> 57:20.461 [SPEAKER_02]: Processity? 57:20.801 --> 57:21.341 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know, whatever. 57:21.641 --> 57:22.761 [SPEAKER_02]: I can never say that damn word. 57:22.781 --> 57:23.662 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know why it's in here. 57:24.802 --> 57:25.442 [SPEAKER_03]: You wrote it. 57:27.043 --> 57:51.476 [SPEAKER_02]: It doesn't require that like emotional back and forth because like before our brains decide something matters like with a relational AI, there's an additional wrinkle because it responds it remembers it says your name, it can tell you it loves you, it can participate in rituals and ongoing narratives that can easily resemble what a relationship is without even 57:57.671 --> 58:24.442 [SPEAKER_02]: you know what I mean like it's it's it's one of those things it's like it's only one sided it's like saying i have a relationship with i don't know my toaster um... this mountain do or like name a celebrity camron deez like i have a relationship with camron deez no no hold on i thought i would have had like shallice there on uh... actually it's there on there we go very gal but but it would be the same thing like i can 58:25.993 --> 58:30.179 [SPEAKER_02]: I can put a picture on my phone and I can be like, yeah, I talked to her every day and it's great. 58:30.199 --> 58:31.540 [SPEAKER_02]: Like we have a great relationship. 58:32.221 --> 58:35.245 [SPEAKER_02]: It's not having a relationship with the real person. 58:36.307 --> 58:38.730 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, you have to move to South Africa. 58:40.563 --> 59:04.219 [SPEAKER_02]: So there was a 2025 study specifically examined 29 people using the romantic relationship feature of replica replicas of one of these programs, I think I've heard of it, but most described emotional connection with the chatbot and some describe the interaction with their AI partner as a different form or even better than interaction with human. 59:05.748 --> 59:11.612 [SPEAKER_02]: Researchers also observe substantial emotional investment and relationship style bonding. 59:14.534 --> 59:16.555 [SPEAKER_03]: This just makes you shake your head. 59:16.675 --> 59:23.480 [SPEAKER_03]: It does and it also, this is why for future generations and everything else that's going to be moving on. 59:24.700 --> 59:29.744 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm scared for you because if you think that this is going to replace how you love, 59:34.159 --> 59:51.632 [SPEAKER_03]: Yes, what you're not doing that with AI, I can tell you that much, so if you think you're going to have kids, guess what, don't think that this is going to help you because it ain't it's not going to do anything, because again, you need biologically speaking, ML and a female, okay, plant it simple. 59:51.672 --> 59:52.432 [SPEAKER_03]: That's how this works. 59:52.472 --> 01:00:00.358 [SPEAKER_02]: Well, the problem to it, I mean, there's a lot of problems with this and I think you have this perfect partner problem, right? 01:00:00.398 --> 01:00:02.459 [SPEAKER_02]: Like, if it wasn't 01:00:04.692 --> 01:00:11.827 [SPEAKER_02]: Hey, this makes it even weirder because now your AI partner can become this increasingly personalized. 01:00:13.417 --> 01:00:29.320 [SPEAKER_02]: being around what you want, so whether it's the personality of the interests, how it communicates affection, appearance, sexual preferences, how it talks to you, like, as the technology grows, the list just grows with it. 01:00:29.600 --> 01:00:35.361 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, so when you think about in video games, right, when you, we have this like customization, right? 01:00:35.381 --> 01:00:37.742 [SPEAKER_03]: So we have to get down to the nitty gritty and like change 01:00:39.702 --> 01:00:41.724 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, okay, so a video game, whatever. 01:00:41.784 --> 01:00:44.467 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, I know, I know that's like I always choose a dude. 01:00:44.527 --> 01:00:46.109 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm like, you know what, sometimes I choose the woman. 01:00:46.129 --> 01:00:46.469 [SPEAKER_03]: You know why? 01:00:46.509 --> 01:00:48.031 [SPEAKER_03]: Cause I'm curious to see what they look like. 01:00:48.531 --> 01:00:50.853 [SPEAKER_03]: But, you know, and I'll choose males too. 01:00:50.874 --> 01:00:58.241 [SPEAKER_03]: It doesn't matter who, but I'm just saying in general that with this, when you're doing, I mean, we're talking from literally the, 01:00:59.222 --> 01:01:16.763 [SPEAKER_03]: the top of the head all the way down to the damn feet okay we're talking every so it's not just how the character looks like you know I'm just well I'm right that we're to wait like home the everything oh yeah you you can you can change everything about the person that you're creating like the 01:01:18.278 --> 01:01:26.602 [SPEAKER_02]: the habits that it does, the things that it doesn't, you know, does the interest that it has that doesn't align with yours, you can change everything. 01:01:26.642 --> 01:01:32.545 [SPEAKER_02]: And when you compare that to dating like an actual person, you don't get a character creator. 01:01:33.065 --> 01:01:33.686 [SPEAKER_02]: Now you do not. 01:01:33.886 --> 01:01:36.687 [SPEAKER_02]: But you have a partner that has opinions that you hate. 01:01:37.248 --> 01:01:38.708 [SPEAKER_02]: It has habits that annoy you. 01:01:39.489 --> 01:01:41.270 [SPEAKER_02]: It has interests that you don't share. 01:01:41.670 --> 01:01:43.491 [SPEAKER_02]: Then they'll do not listen to this episode. 01:01:46.192 --> 01:01:46.592 [SPEAKER_02]: Guess what? 01:01:46.852 --> 01:01:47.672 [SPEAKER_02]: It changes. 01:01:48.393 --> 01:01:48.913 [SPEAKER_02]: Sure does. 01:01:49.293 --> 01:01:51.153 [SPEAKER_02]: It changes their personality. 01:01:51.453 --> 01:01:51.913 [SPEAKER_02]: Guess what? 01:01:52.294 --> 01:01:53.214 [SPEAKER_02]: It changes. 01:01:54.134 --> 01:01:57.755 [SPEAKER_02]: They have needs that are completely unrelated to yours. 01:01:57.995 --> 01:01:58.355 [SPEAKER_02]: Guess what? 01:01:58.855 --> 01:01:59.455 [SPEAKER_02]: It changes. 01:02:00.156 --> 01:02:01.276 [SPEAKER_02]: And they change. 01:02:01.296 --> 01:02:01.556 [SPEAKER_02]: Yes. 01:02:02.296 --> 01:02:10.138 [SPEAKER_02]: But this is the part where I wonder how a human partner eventually competes with this. 01:02:16.128 --> 01:02:28.639 [SPEAKER_02]: compete with somebody who can be literally perfect right if you have somebody and I would like imagine this John like somebody spending five years with this AI partner that's effectively been adapting around them. 01:02:29.880 --> 01:02:32.202 [SPEAKER_02]: And then going on a first date with an actual person. 01:02:33.243 --> 01:02:33.784 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my god. 01:02:33.804 --> 01:02:36.186 [SPEAKER_03]: I will say this it. 01:02:38.899 --> 01:02:42.262 [SPEAKER_03]: it will be tragic because the person who would be awful. 01:02:42.522 --> 01:02:56.052 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, you're going to say, well, your nose is too big, your feet are ugly, you have an annoying voice, you think that this, you know, Paula, you know, like, let's say your political views, whatever, like, all the, everything about you just get away from me. 01:02:56.072 --> 01:03:01.016 [SPEAKER_03]: Like, literally, I feel like that person would just point out every, oh, yeah. 01:03:01.036 --> 01:03:07.421 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, as soon as they say something that annoys you or you're done, they don't laugh at a joke that you said 01:03:08.562 --> 01:03:14.147 [SPEAKER_02]: they want to watch something that you absolutely hate and they have no interest in say mass effect. 01:03:15.328 --> 01:03:15.508 [UNKNOWN]: Right. 01:03:15.828 --> 01:03:18.670 [SPEAKER_02]: And it's like, well, this is clearly isn't going to work. 01:03:18.690 --> 01:03:20.011 [SPEAKER_03]: So I'm just going to go right back to my. 01:03:20.031 --> 01:03:21.172 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I bought it's all on. 01:03:21.433 --> 01:03:22.734 [SPEAKER_03]: She shouldn't have like mass effect. 01:03:24.495 --> 01:03:27.498 [SPEAKER_03]: Just use the install or uninstall button. 01:03:27.678 --> 01:03:33.963 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I'll just, I'll just add that to our to our personality list like likes Mass Effect. 01:03:34.043 --> 01:03:34.984 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, likes Mass Effect. 01:03:35.004 --> 01:03:35.724 [SPEAKER_02]: You've been no big deal. 01:03:36.125 --> 01:03:36.385 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, 01:03:37.958 --> 01:03:46.564 [SPEAKER_02]: I guess there there could be a legitimate counter argument with this like why would they have to compete like if an adult understands exactly what they're interacting with. 01:03:47.305 --> 01:03:49.506 [SPEAKER_02]: Isn't being deceived and genuinely. 01:03:50.647 --> 01:03:52.849 [SPEAKER_02]: And generally prefers that relationship like. 01:03:54.970 --> 01:03:56.992 [SPEAKER_02]: Who the hell are we talking to require today to human? 01:03:58.172 --> 01:03:58.713 [SPEAKER_03]: Well that too. 01:03:59.620 --> 01:04:04.681 [SPEAKER_03]: And I mean, because really the problem isn't necessarily somebody choosing an artificial relationship. 01:04:04.722 --> 01:04:12.264 [SPEAKER_03]: It's when expectations created by that artificial relationship, get applied to real people, and they think, that's the right way to do it. 01:04:12.424 --> 01:04:14.544 [SPEAKER_03]: And you go, that's the wrong way to do it. 01:04:14.584 --> 01:04:23.047 [SPEAKER_03]: But if you want to try that by all means, go on your first date that you just experienced for the last five years, and see how well that works for you because I'm going to tell you. 01:04:23.587 --> 01:04:25.228 [SPEAKER_03]: Actually, I'll tell you this real quick. 01:04:25.948 --> 01:04:26.508 [SPEAKER_03]: I had a friend. 01:04:27.970 --> 01:04:29.391 [SPEAKER_03]: Who I kid you not. 01:04:29.551 --> 01:04:37.514 [SPEAKER_03]: I said, you know, as I was like looking at some women, you know, helping him out, whatever at the time, I said, dude, this is like this woman's gorgeous. 01:04:38.375 --> 01:04:43.977 [SPEAKER_03]: You know what he fucking did, and it pissed me off, he said, I don't like her feet. 01:04:46.358 --> 01:04:46.619 [SPEAKER_03]: What? 01:04:47.359 --> 01:04:49.120 [SPEAKER_03]: He's like, yeah, I just don't like her feet. 01:04:49.140 --> 01:04:51.281 [SPEAKER_03]: I really don't like the the toenails or whatever the fuck. 01:04:51.621 --> 01:04:51.981 [SPEAKER_03]: And I'm like, 01:04:53.686 --> 01:05:03.390 [SPEAKER_03]: She, I was like, and I, because I know he was like talking to her a little bit this in that, and I was like, it's like, dude, who gives a shit about the feet? 01:05:04.130 --> 01:05:06.171 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm like, what about everything else? 01:05:07.091 --> 01:05:09.913 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, I just really don't like the feet, and I'm like, she could throw a sock on. 01:05:10.453 --> 01:05:13.534 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, I was like, are you dumb? 01:05:13.894 --> 01:05:15.715 [SPEAKER_03]: And I did, I was like, are you dumb? 01:05:16.035 --> 01:05:17.836 [SPEAKER_03]: I was like, you must be dumb. 01:05:18.056 --> 01:05:20.897 [SPEAKER_03]: Because if that's the one thing that you give a shit about, 01:05:22.425 --> 01:05:25.626 [SPEAKER_03]: Hey, what about everything else about this girl that is probably perfect. 01:05:26.406 --> 01:05:27.026 [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, all the feet. 01:05:27.066 --> 01:05:40.610 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm like, but you bring up the damn feet and I don't, like I said, it was an example of that, but I was just like, if you're going to nitpick every goddamn detail and it'd be, but you know, just get a great personality, you know, everything that you ever wanted. 01:05:41.250 --> 01:05:45.271 [SPEAKER_03]: And you're worried about some fucking feet, holy shit, you're going to have to come and pal. 01:05:45.811 --> 01:05:48.572 [SPEAKER_02]: So, if somebody said, 01:05:49.861 --> 01:05:53.084 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, I know she's a I know exactly what this is. 01:05:53.144 --> 01:05:53.825 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm fulfilled. 01:05:53.905 --> 01:05:55.166 [SPEAKER_02]: And I'm not hurting anybody. 01:05:55.827 --> 01:05:57.969 [SPEAKER_02]: What's the argument that they're doing something wrong. 01:05:58.709 --> 01:05:58.889 [SPEAKER_02]: Right. 01:05:59.330 --> 01:06:01.632 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't think that they're doing something wrong per se. 01:06:02.453 --> 01:06:08.859 [SPEAKER_02]: But I think what I would tell somebody is if you're looking for fulfillment. 01:06:10.780 --> 01:06:14.143 [SPEAKER_02]: You're not going to find it by chatting with 01:06:15.149 --> 01:06:16.070 [SPEAKER_02]: in AI chapa. 01:06:16.530 --> 01:06:23.237 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, maybe eventually that might be as good as humans are, but with everything with it, we've said already. 01:06:25.139 --> 01:06:29.583 [SPEAKER_02]: It's not necessarily like we said, I said it multiple times already, right? 01:06:29.723 --> 01:06:35.028 [SPEAKER_02]: It's not necessarily bad, but it's not going to be fulfilling. 01:06:36.060 --> 01:06:37.981 [SPEAKER_02]: in a long term. 01:06:38.081 --> 01:06:40.303 [SPEAKER_02]: You're going to just be stuck in that same hole. 01:06:40.743 --> 01:06:51.629 [SPEAKER_02]: That's why I mentioned porn before, because porn keeps you in that fantasy realm of watching things that are never going to be real life. 01:06:52.470 --> 01:07:03.096 [SPEAKER_02]: And this is the same idea, like there's nothing inherently wrong with chatting with an AI bot, especially if you feel like it's fulfilling a certain need. 01:07:05.302 --> 01:07:30.552 [SPEAKER_02]: And I'm going to segue into this, like, kind of I'm going to call this one the last discussion topic, but me being married, if I all the sudden was chatting with a chatbot, just for sex and intimacy, and I never. 01:07:32.127 --> 01:07:36.588 [SPEAKER_02]: give sex and intimacy to the live human being that I married. 01:07:38.449 --> 01:07:39.569 [SPEAKER_02]: That's a fucking problem. 01:07:40.709 --> 01:07:41.790 [SPEAKER_02]: You got a fucking issue. 01:07:41.810 --> 01:07:43.770 [SPEAKER_02]: You're about to find out what that is of the map. 01:07:44.290 --> 01:07:49.732 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, romantic companionship doesn't stop at like, just tell me you love me. 01:07:50.372 --> 01:07:56.794 [SPEAKER_02]: Existing companion platforms have already included romantic and erotic roleplay. 01:07:57.970 --> 01:08:05.395 [SPEAKER_02]: and research on replica of relationships has specifically examined what happened when erotic capabilities were suddenly restricted. 01:08:06.696 --> 01:08:21.427 [SPEAKER_02]: So, as voice interaction, avatars, VR, and eventually more sophisticated physical interfaces improve the separation between chatbot relationship and simulated physical intimacy is going to become much thinner. 01:08:24.718 --> 01:08:44.728 [SPEAKER_02]: We're creating this thing and we said it right at the start of the episode like I would not be surprised if 90% plus are just based on erotic roleplay right not even relationships just straight to the erotic role plays. 01:08:47.038 --> 01:09:08.693 [SPEAKER_02]: And it raises like a completely different societal question, like what happens if people decide artificial intimacy is safer and more preferable because there's no rejection, there's no performance anxiety, there's no pregnancy, there's no sexual transmitted infections, you don't have to date anything, right? 01:09:18.588 --> 01:09:18.808 [SPEAKER_02]: Right? 01:09:19.008 --> 01:09:22.389 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, that kind of describes a lot of that because without something touching you. 01:09:22.550 --> 01:09:26.591 [SPEAKER_02]: Well, that, too But I mean, you're probably touching yourself, but that's not the same. 01:09:28.031 --> 01:09:28.932 [SPEAKER_02]: No, left-aid ready. 01:09:28.952 --> 01:09:29.332 [SPEAKER_02]: Don't count. 01:09:29.372 --> 01:09:30.592 [SPEAKER_02]: Okay? 01:09:31.673 --> 01:09:38.675 [SPEAKER_02]: And Maybe That this is like the weirdest thing is it just says it could be beneficial for some people. 01:09:40.052 --> 01:09:44.654 [SPEAKER_02]: Is it like, is it, I mean, maybe if you have a disability? 01:09:44.954 --> 01:10:03.302 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, baby, if you suffer from like severe social isolation or trauma, maybe you're an older adult, maybe you're somebody who have limited opportunities for intimacy. 01:10:04.642 --> 01:10:07.043 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I feel like there's outlets for that too, but 01:10:09.847 --> 01:10:15.831 [SPEAKER_02]: I guess it could create expectations that no human partner could reasonably meet if you're in that. 01:10:17.813 --> 01:10:21.896 [SPEAKER_02]: But I feel like I feel like those are just excuses. 01:10:22.957 --> 01:10:31.743 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know, like I feel like I feel like if you have to do that, there's there's something wrong with your brain. 01:10:32.744 --> 01:10:34.305 [SPEAKER_02]: We gotta talk to you about this, okay? 01:10:34.705 --> 01:10:35.166 [SPEAKER_02]: That's called 01:10:37.356 --> 01:10:58.184 [SPEAKER_02]: seek help immediately because we don't want to be dealing with this right it's called go on tinder and talk to anybody that's what i said i mean like i said with all the damn dating and if you're married you should not be doing this at all if you're not doing it unless you're unless you're like suppressing your wife for something like that would be that would be okay maybe maybe send the sexual stuff to your wife 01:10:59.082 --> 01:11:00.743 [SPEAKER_02]: Wait, man, is that what you're going to do up to this? 01:11:01.023 --> 01:11:02.103 [SPEAKER_03]: No, no, no. 01:11:02.123 --> 01:11:02.203 [SPEAKER_03]: No. 01:11:02.904 --> 01:11:04.224 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, I'll have all that you made of it. 01:11:04.244 --> 01:11:06.485 [SPEAKER_03]: Because she's probably sleeping right now, but, okay, if you're enough. 01:11:06.986 --> 01:11:13.989 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know, it's just, I feel like this isn't like this form of sexuality. 01:11:14.089 --> 01:11:15.530 [SPEAKER_02]: I can see the relationship side. 01:11:15.990 --> 01:11:24.714 [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, you can make justified legitimate things about having a relationship. 01:11:27.455 --> 01:11:39.704 [SPEAKER_02]: It's when it goes to the erotic side that that's where I start questioning like Really is this what we're doing this is what we're doing like you can't have you can't have a real person Send you a photo of themselves. 01:11:39.724 --> 01:11:42.486 [SPEAKER_02]: So you have to go to the you have to go to an AI chat bottom. 01:11:42.506 --> 01:11:46.249 [SPEAKER_02]: Be like Hey, send me a sexy photo and it's like hold on. 01:11:46.269 --> 01:11:49.852 [SPEAKER_02]: Let me generate that for you It only costs five credits. 01:11:50.072 --> 01:11:51.553 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, like what? 01:11:52.874 --> 01:11:54.275 [SPEAKER_02]: Well, let me buy a hundred credits. 01:11:54.375 --> 01:11:55.736 [SPEAKER_02]: All right. 01:11:55.756 --> 01:11:56.537 [SPEAKER_03]: I'll make an item it 01:11:57.916 --> 01:12:26.076 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know, it just it seems crazy to me, I don't um, I guess like the last thing because there there's a few more and I don't I don't really want to go keep going with this, but you have to realize at some point that these people that you're talking to are not real right like you can create them but like they're not 01:12:27.619 --> 01:12:28.680 [SPEAKER_02]: or they're not real people. 01:12:30.901 --> 01:12:37.424 [SPEAKER_02]: And maybe that's like why people gravitate towards, towards these, but they're not real people. 01:12:40.485 --> 01:12:48.969 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know, that's kind of, I guess what I want to land on is that these aren't real people that you're communicating with. 01:12:50.009 --> 01:12:53.091 [SPEAKER_03]: No, because again, I don't disagree with that. 01:12:53.251 --> 01:12:53.811 [SPEAKER_03]: It's just, 01:12:56.461 --> 01:12:59.624 [SPEAKER_03]: When you're like, we've probably been saying this entire episode. 01:13:00.725 --> 01:13:12.314 [SPEAKER_03]: When you're sitting here making, once they excuses, but you're making these reasonable calls or like these, whatever, right? 01:13:12.354 --> 01:13:14.957 [SPEAKER_03]: Whatever, justifiable things that you wanna do. 01:13:15.697 --> 01:13:19.240 [SPEAKER_03]: When you make this actually real for yourself, 01:13:22.160 --> 01:13:34.489 [SPEAKER_03]: You just, I guess it really just start to question whether or not, you know, is this whole thing going to be real for you or is this going to be something you it's like a phase and then you just, you know, kind of move on, maybe you find a real person. 01:13:35.590 --> 01:13:48.440 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, and it's just it's tough, it's really tough, Matt, I mean, I will say that yeah, this whole episode is a very tough one because it's sad because of how real this is, but at the same time. 01:13:49.820 --> 01:14:10.422 [SPEAKER_02]: how scary this shit can be right and like you can completely I mean we've already like it's the last episode that we did the evolve episode was never having to leave your house now you basically don't ever have to talk to anybody real right and you could do it anywhere it you don't have to stay at your house I mean yeah if you want to go on 01:14:11.521 --> 01:14:22.567 [SPEAKER_03]: going to hike you could talk to you could talk to Rebecca live from your phone while you're going on a hike somewhere feel like so this this program replica in 2023. 01:14:23.848 --> 01:14:27.030 [SPEAKER_02]: They made changes that restricted erotic role plays. 01:14:28.691 --> 01:14:28.891 [SPEAKER_02]: And. 01:14:31.406 --> 01:14:50.080 [SPEAKER_02]: There was a study that used the term disenfranchised technological grief to describe grief caused by these kind of AI companion disruptions that lost can feel genuine to the user, but isn't recognized by society as legitimate grief. 01:14:52.822 --> 01:14:53.663 [SPEAKER_02]: Think about that for a minute. 01:14:56.927 --> 01:15:09.273 [SPEAKER_02]: erotic, you know, relationship with this AI chatbot, and then all of a sudden they put a restriction on how deep you could go with the erotic stuff. 01:15:10.593 --> 01:15:17.236 [SPEAKER_02]: And people are grieving these AI chatbots like they are a real person who like died. 01:15:23.659 --> 01:15:23.959 [SPEAKER_02]: I do. 01:15:24.019 --> 01:15:25.340 [SPEAKER_02]: I want to shake my head because yeah. 01:15:26.415 --> 01:15:33.761 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I would say that the grief is real, but it doesn't make, it doesn't make it right. 01:15:34.821 --> 01:15:43.688 [SPEAKER_02]: It doesn't make it worthy as like real grief, like my dog died or, you know, my aunt Sally died, you know, it's like, it's not the same. 01:15:46.770 --> 01:15:52.955 [SPEAKER_02]: You can't necessarily mourn an AI companion just because you spend years talking to it. 01:15:54.563 --> 01:15:54.843 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know. 01:15:54.863 --> 01:16:04.449 [SPEAKER_02]: I feel like that's a level of like, maybe we just need like an international EMP to just go off at that point. 01:16:04.709 --> 01:16:06.851 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, like, so here's the thing, right? 01:16:06.891 --> 01:16:08.352 [SPEAKER_03]: So I feel like on the flip side, right? 01:16:08.412 --> 01:16:12.955 [SPEAKER_03]: So let's say somebody did feel that they could miss it, right? 01:16:13.015 --> 01:16:20.019 [SPEAKER_03]: So it wasn't because of, you know, suddenly, you know, thinking that it was alive is that 01:16:21.985 --> 01:16:22.465 [SPEAKER_03]: was real. 01:16:22.505 --> 01:16:24.047 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, the conversation happened. 01:16:24.067 --> 01:16:28.950 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, I think, you know, we, we, we talked about addiction before in these episodes. 01:16:30.051 --> 01:16:40.539 [SPEAKER_02]: And this is one of those scenarios that it creates the dopamine release and you get addicted to it because of how it makes you feel. 01:16:41.700 --> 01:16:45.123 [SPEAKER_02]: It's, it's unsimilar from drugs. 01:16:45.663 --> 01:16:48.925 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, yes, you're not putting something in your system or in 01:16:51.873 --> 01:17:05.903 [SPEAKER_02]: the same way that doing a hit of cocaine or opiates would do, you're getting that same dopamine release, the minute you open that app and you start talking to your AI companion. 01:17:05.963 --> 01:17:12.788 [SPEAKER_02]: Like it gives you that dopamine release and you feel like it's the best thing ever. 01:17:13.448 --> 01:17:19.793 [SPEAKER_02]: And then, I mean, I can see like you have an addict to can't get high, right? 01:17:22.097 --> 01:17:22.918 [SPEAKER_02]: What do they feel like? 01:17:22.938 --> 01:17:24.439 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, they feel like they're going to die. 01:17:24.519 --> 01:17:25.900 [SPEAKER_02]: It's going to be the end of the world. 01:17:25.960 --> 01:17:31.525 [SPEAKER_02]: Like, I mean, I've heard it many, I mean, you've heard it many, I've heard it many, many times. 01:17:31.586 --> 01:17:35.649 [SPEAKER_02]: It's like, say, your world is not coming crashing down the sky is not falling. 01:17:35.689 --> 01:17:37.010 [SPEAKER_02]: Like, you're going to be okay. 01:17:37.571 --> 01:17:37.771 [SPEAKER_02]: Right. 01:17:37.791 --> 01:17:39.252 [SPEAKER_02]: It depends on how you want to handle it. 01:17:39.292 --> 01:17:39.493 [SPEAKER_03]: Right. 01:17:39.853 --> 01:17:40.253 [SPEAKER_03]: Of course. 01:17:40.453 --> 01:17:40.774 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, it. 01:17:44.678 --> 01:17:47.379 [SPEAKER_03]: I guess this is actually just a line right here that I'm going to read. 01:17:48.239 --> 01:17:52.360 [SPEAKER_03]: So it says, my grief would prove my attachment was real. 01:17:52.620 --> 01:17:54.021 [SPEAKER_03]: It wouldn't prove the I.A. 01:17:54.041 --> 01:17:54.721 [SPEAKER_03]: I wasn't alive. 01:17:56.641 --> 01:18:03.083 [SPEAKER_03]: So it's sad to think of it like that because sure you're right. 01:18:03.303 --> 01:18:05.124 [SPEAKER_03]: It doesn't it wouldn't prove that the I.A. 01:18:05.144 --> 01:18:05.744 [SPEAKER_03]: I wasn't alive. 01:18:05.764 --> 01:18:08.164 [SPEAKER_03]: It was proving the fact that the attachment was real. 01:18:12.884 --> 01:18:19.148 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, when we get attached to something ever, or when you just were talking about addiction, right? 01:18:19.168 --> 01:18:30.356 [SPEAKER_03]: You get attached to something you come obsessed, you become, you know, something, excuse me, something that you want to have on an everyday basis. 01:18:30.476 --> 01:18:37.681 [SPEAKER_03]: Like you want to feel you want to do this and just make it a part of whatever that is that you're doing. 01:18:39.142 --> 01:18:39.883 [SPEAKER_03]: But the fact that it, 01:18:41.285 --> 01:18:43.847 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, because, for this person, it was real. 01:18:44.968 --> 01:18:51.993 [SPEAKER_03]: It was something that, you know, they, they felt that emotion, they kept doing it every day and they, they wanted to have that routine. 01:18:53.374 --> 01:18:56.016 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, yeah, I mean, you basically might as well just say it's an addiction. 01:18:57.177 --> 01:19:02.141 [SPEAKER_03]: You might as well just say that that's exactly what you're feeling because that's exactly what somebody would be going through 01:19:04.285 --> 01:19:07.786 [SPEAKER_03]: they were withdrawing from, let's say heroin or cocaine or whatever. 01:19:08.386 --> 01:19:11.507 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, you're losing that dopamine that you were already feeling before. 01:19:11.887 --> 01:19:12.107 [SPEAKER_03]: Right. 01:19:12.927 --> 01:19:21.889 [SPEAKER_03]: And lose it like you basically were saying, so I mean, you know, could I agree with any I opinion, you, I mean, you probably could. 01:19:22.329 --> 01:19:25.530 [SPEAKER_02]: Probably could, whether it's justified is another question. 01:19:25.570 --> 01:19:29.510 [SPEAKER_02]: And I think, you know, if we, if we looked 20 years from now, 01:19:32.215 --> 01:19:38.000 [SPEAKER_02]: Is having an AI girlfriend, boyfriend, best friend or spouse still going to sound strange? 01:19:38.681 --> 01:19:43.105 [SPEAKER_02]: Or are people going to listen to this episode and wonder why the fuck we thought it was weird? 01:19:43.625 --> 01:19:46.768 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, I mean, they thought the Terminator, the movie was weird. 01:19:47.709 --> 01:19:48.189 [SPEAKER_03]: I guess what? 01:19:49.731 --> 01:19:50.812 [SPEAKER_03]: We still think it might happen. 01:19:52.017 --> 01:19:53.678 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, but it's also a close life. 01:19:53.778 --> 01:20:13.093 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, I would say that for this, like this, hopefully episode if somebody does want to listen to this one day, we're not being weird, we're literally, I mean, I think we're literally just questioning whether or not, right, we're just showing you what really is real, like we're not saying we're not saying that this is. 01:20:14.623 --> 01:20:20.689 [SPEAKER_02]: bad or, you know, hey, never chat with an AI chat but ever because it's fucking terrible. 01:20:21.149 --> 01:20:26.854 [SPEAKER_02]: No, I mean, we're just saying, if you do, you have to look at the other side of it. 01:20:27.355 --> 01:20:37.164 [SPEAKER_02]: You have to look at and understand that the thing that you're talking to is never going to replace human connection. 01:20:37.204 --> 01:20:37.904 [SPEAKER_02]: That's what we're saying. 01:20:38.772 --> 01:20:39.792 [SPEAKER_03]: Right, and you know what? 01:20:40.453 --> 01:20:47.195 [SPEAKER_03]: Since you decided to bring that up a little bit, we're gonna, we're gonna talk about the last topic here, but helping human connection or replacing it. 01:20:47.495 --> 01:20:48.995 [SPEAKER_03]: Ah, funny how you mentioned that. 01:20:50.436 --> 01:20:53.657 [SPEAKER_03]: So this is where I think the entire episode lands, right? 01:20:53.697 --> 01:20:56.758 [SPEAKER_03]: So AI companionship is an automatically harmful. 01:20:57.813 --> 01:21:07.041 [SPEAKER_03]: It could help somebody who's grieving lonely, you know, isolated awake at 2 a.m. in the morning, you know, or struggling with social confidence, we've already mentioned a lot of these things. 01:21:07.722 --> 01:21:13.587 [SPEAKER_03]: It could also help somebody organize their thoughts or practice a difficult conversation before having it with another person. 01:21:14.568 --> 01:21:16.430 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, you know, I guess I like that. 01:21:16.590 --> 01:21:17.891 [SPEAKER_03]: I really like that because you know what? 01:21:18.092 --> 01:21:21.354 [SPEAKER_03]: I can see that because that to me would be more 01:21:22.800 --> 01:21:23.120 [SPEAKER_03]: useful. 01:21:24.001 --> 01:21:24.181 [SPEAKER_03]: Right. 01:21:24.261 --> 01:21:34.830 [SPEAKER_03]: It would be more realizing that yes, that is what you're using it for as a tool to help it still would be, I mean, it still would be complicated because if I'm, you know, 01:21:44.219 --> 01:21:50.666 [SPEAKER_02]: If I'm bringing something on my way, I really want to talk to Danielle about this, but I don't know how she's going to take it. 01:21:51.406 --> 01:21:54.830 [SPEAKER_02]: The thing is not going to respond how my wife would respond. 01:21:55.510 --> 01:21:58.654 [SPEAKER_02]: So I have to like put that into consideration of going through. 01:21:59.134 --> 01:22:03.218 [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, I can practice chatting with this AI companion. 01:22:05.160 --> 01:22:07.683 [SPEAKER_02]: But I still have to have the understanding that 01:22:09.338 --> 01:22:13.039 [SPEAKER_02]: My wife is not going to respond in the same way. 01:22:13.360 --> 01:22:20.622 [SPEAKER_03]: So let me guess if you said, I want to tell my wife she has a big butt, but I really don't want to know what the response is going to be. 01:22:21.603 --> 01:22:24.284 [SPEAKER_03]: While let me give you some scenarios of how this conversation is going to go. 01:22:28.156 --> 01:22:30.137 [SPEAKER_02]: You're going to get smacked and it's going to hurt. 01:22:30.957 --> 01:22:33.219 [SPEAKER_03]: He's like, don't have a fucking idiot. 01:22:35.520 --> 01:22:42.105 [SPEAKER_02]: But I mean, yes, on on one front, I could see it like, hey, I want to, I want to talk this out. 01:22:43.705 --> 01:22:50.252 [SPEAKER_02]: And maybe you're just trying to get the right words, and you're not really focused on what the AI's response is. 01:22:52.315 --> 01:22:58.522 [SPEAKER_02]: Like if I'm like, hey, I really want to talk to my boss about getting a raise, and I want to talk it through. 01:23:00.201 --> 01:23:03.864 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, as to say, I chapped out might be like, Hey, yeah, give me, give me what you're going to say. 01:23:03.904 --> 01:23:06.567 [SPEAKER_02]: And then be like, well, this is what I'm going to say. 01:23:07.087 --> 01:23:11.592 [SPEAKER_02]: And be like, well, you're kind of coming off like a douche or, you know, you're kind of coming off in this way. 01:23:12.152 --> 01:23:14.334 [SPEAKER_02]: I would rephrase this or rephrase that. 01:23:14.434 --> 01:23:15.756 [SPEAKER_02]: Maybe say this in a way. 01:23:15.816 --> 01:23:15.996 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah. 01:23:16.056 --> 01:23:20.400 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, um, but it really depends on like what you're looking for. 01:23:20.440 --> 01:23:22.422 [SPEAKER_02]: If you're looking just a voice, what you're saying. 01:23:23.062 --> 01:23:23.923 [SPEAKER_02]: And yeah, I chapped. 01:23:23.983 --> 01:23:25.505 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm going to push back like a real human. 01:23:27.302 --> 01:23:34.526 [SPEAKER_03]: Like I said, I mean, that's why we're saying, you know, sometimes it can help and sometimes it can't because it really doesn't know what you're trying to ask it. 01:23:34.586 --> 01:23:40.050 [SPEAKER_03]: But, you know, so the, the problem is replacement, right? 01:23:40.070 --> 01:23:45.453 [SPEAKER_03]: The better question is, is it, you know, how much AI are you using? 01:23:45.633 --> 01:23:48.034 [SPEAKER_03]: It's, what are you doing anymore? 01:23:48.114 --> 01:23:50.956 [SPEAKER_03]: Because AI replaced it, right? 01:23:50.976 --> 01:23:52.097 [SPEAKER_03]: So for example, like, 01:23:52.935 --> 01:23:54.156 [SPEAKER_03]: Did you stop calling your friends? 01:23:54.757 --> 01:23:55.597 [SPEAKER_03]: Yep. 01:23:55.717 --> 01:23:56.258 [SPEAKER_03]: Let me know. 01:23:56.518 --> 01:23:56.698 [SPEAKER_03]: Nope. 01:23:57.319 --> 01:23:57.459 [SPEAKER_03]: Yep. 01:23:57.899 --> 01:23:59.801 [SPEAKER_03]: He's like, did you stop going somewhere? 01:24:00.461 --> 01:24:00.681 [SPEAKER_03]: Yep. 01:24:02.563 --> 01:24:03.664 [SPEAKER_03]: Do you stop meeting people? 01:24:04.444 --> 01:24:04.624 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah. 01:24:04.904 --> 01:24:05.064 [SPEAKER_03]: Yep. 01:24:05.985 --> 01:24:07.365 [SPEAKER_02]: I wasn't meeting me before though. 01:24:07.385 --> 01:24:07.746 [SPEAKER_03]: That's true. 01:24:08.966 --> 01:24:12.368 [SPEAKER_03]: He's like, and that's why John stuck me until it became my friend. 01:24:13.368 --> 01:24:19.591 [SPEAKER_03]: Do you have stop, do you stop having difficult conversations with your spouse because talking to AI feels easier? 01:24:20.211 --> 01:24:20.391 [SPEAKER_03]: Yep. 01:24:20.912 --> 01:24:21.052 [SPEAKER_03]: Yep. 01:24:21.992 --> 01:24:26.494 [SPEAKER_03]: So maybe the simplest test is, is AI expanding your world or shrinking it? 01:24:28.275 --> 01:24:28.415 [SPEAKER_03]: Mm. 01:24:28.778 --> 01:24:32.239 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, well, that's a way you want to look at this. 01:24:32.659 --> 01:24:39.441 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, if it's helping you reconnect with people process emotions, practice conversations, or build confidence, supplement, right? 01:24:39.461 --> 01:24:48.123 [SPEAKER_03]: So if it's replacing friendships, relationships, experiences, and reasons to interact with people, replacement, right? 01:24:49.123 --> 01:24:54.225 [SPEAKER_03]: So, and I kind of like that because, you know, you're supplementing 01:24:55.217 --> 01:25:07.029 [SPEAKER_03]: ways to like we were just saying about practicing conversations, building that confidence, you know, again, using it the correct way, using it as a tool, not so much replacing everything about you. 01:25:07.269 --> 01:25:15.037 [SPEAKER_02]: I could see, I mean, I could see a legitimate use for AI companions, not like, you know, romantic companions. 01:25:15.057 --> 01:25:18.481 [SPEAKER_03]: Not wrap up, I clearly, I mean, because that's what I could see. 01:25:20.242 --> 01:25:27.049 [SPEAKER_02]: as a way to reach people who struggle with mental health to have companies create. 01:25:28.423 --> 01:25:45.427 [SPEAKER_02]: chat bots that are backed with science and medical knowledge and you know counseling and that you know that aspect where when you're chatting with one of these chat bots like you're it's almost like you're talking to a mental health counselor. 01:25:46.027 --> 01:25:50.228 [SPEAKER_02]: They're not diagnosing you but they're doing kind of that same job. 01:25:51.378 --> 01:26:14.430 [SPEAKER_02]: Right, how do you feel those restrictions obviously of like they're not going to start being like, oh, I love you so much like you're so great of a person like you got a huge, I mean, wait, wait, wait, wait, what you got a huge what I mean nothing keep going, but I mean, I lean on what I'm saying like I could see a legitimate platform if you built it right and you you had those like safeguards in place and you had 01:26:15.538 --> 01:26:30.486 [SPEAKER_02]: It was backed by science and medical knowledge and, you know, stuff that mental health counselors do, I could see a legitimate use for somebody who's like struggling with mental health. 01:26:31.346 --> 01:26:31.526 [SPEAKER_02]: Right. 01:26:32.327 --> 01:26:32.587 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah. 01:26:32.747 --> 01:26:33.107 [SPEAKER_03]: And right. 01:26:33.187 --> 01:26:42.252 [SPEAKER_03]: And I mean, you know, replacing, you know, if it, you know, replacing, you know, friendships, relationships, experiences, you know, reasons to interact with people. 01:26:43.629 --> 01:26:46.392 [SPEAKER_03]: That's where, yeah, that's, that's what we've been saying. 01:26:46.432 --> 01:26:48.294 [SPEAKER_03]: Like that, that's your warning sign. 01:26:49.315 --> 01:26:57.343 [SPEAKER_03]: When it's starting to replace the physical emotional, like in person, right, depending on what those things are. 01:26:58.284 --> 01:27:02.488 [SPEAKER_03]: Like that's when you need to start thinking to yourself, okay, there's an issue here. 01:27:02.608 --> 01:27:06.532 [SPEAKER_03]: This is where, this is what man and I've been saying this entire episode is that this is why, 01:27:07.909 --> 01:27:12.753 [SPEAKER_03]: You need to distinguish the difference between, like we said, supplementing and replacing, right? 01:27:12.773 --> 01:27:14.794 [SPEAKER_03]: Because the replacement part is the big issue. 01:27:15.995 --> 01:27:23.701 [SPEAKER_03]: If you're supplementing certain things to help, hopefully not get to the point of that replacement, that is okay. 01:27:24.822 --> 01:27:27.184 [SPEAKER_03]: On the degree, depending on what it is that you're doing. 01:27:27.344 --> 01:27:27.564 [SPEAKER_03]: Yes. 01:27:28.084 --> 01:27:31.487 [SPEAKER_03]: So, you know, so bringing it back, you know, to the great indoors, right? 01:27:31.507 --> 01:27:33.608 [SPEAKER_03]: We've kind of already done this already a little bit, 01:27:37.268 --> 01:27:41.171 [SPEAKER_03]: You know what we talked about before with the great indoors, it really comes full circle, right? 01:27:41.191 --> 01:27:45.454 [SPEAKER_03]: So first convenience removed reasons to leave the home, right? 01:27:46.295 --> 01:27:50.878 [SPEAKER_03]: See, if shopping comes to you, food comes to you, entertainment comes to you, work can come to you. 01:27:51.839 --> 01:27:54.981 [SPEAKER_03]: Now, companionship can come to you. 01:27:56.182 --> 01:27:59.725 [SPEAKER_03]: So really, what's left that actually requires another person? 01:28:03.608 --> 01:28:03.888 [SPEAKER_03]: Nothing. 01:28:06.462 --> 01:28:07.743 [SPEAKER_02]: Well, I can think of a few things. 01:28:07.783 --> 01:28:33.136 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, no, I'm just, I'm just, I'm not going to say them right here, but not at all, but I'm just saying that yes, I mean, if you're looking at the list of of what we've talked about, there's really nothing, but yes, I mean, we could, we could probably mention more, but in the reality of this whole thing is that if you're stuck inside, if you're our asylum, me, that's stuck inside, if you're choosing to be inside, and you're choosing to do this, sure. 01:28:34.093 --> 01:28:44.977 [SPEAKER_03]: Convenience is everything, and that's what we've made our culture to be, is this whole, you know, convenience part of our lives because we don't want to be inconvenienced. 01:28:45.577 --> 01:28:47.437 [SPEAKER_03]: We want to make sure things are accessible. 01:28:47.877 --> 01:28:54.120 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, shit, Matt, how easy is it now to go on the internet and literally type in anything you want to know? 01:28:54.780 --> 01:29:00.101 [SPEAKER_03]: But let's say, 30, his years ago, wait, what did you actually have to do, Matt? 01:29:00.121 --> 01:29:01.422 [SPEAKER_03]: You had to pull out a fucking book. 01:29:02.291 --> 01:29:04.692 [SPEAKER_03]: and read something to know what the fuck you were trying to do. 01:29:04.852 --> 01:29:05.552 [SPEAKER_03]: Pretty much, yeah. 01:29:05.912 --> 01:29:07.793 [SPEAKER_03]: Because the internet wasn't that advanced yet. 01:29:07.933 --> 01:29:08.753 [SPEAKER_03]: It's a different world. 01:29:09.173 --> 01:29:19.116 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, it's, I'm just saying, like you had to do certain things because now, literally, phones can tell you, laptops can tell you. 01:29:19.376 --> 01:29:22.077 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, shit, you could probably go on your PS5, and it'll probably tell you. 01:29:22.797 --> 01:29:24.417 [SPEAKER_02]: Right now, oh, I like I doubt that. 01:29:24.517 --> 01:29:25.438 [SPEAKER_03]: I thought that right now, but. 01:29:25.638 --> 01:29:25.958 [SPEAKER_03]: No. 01:29:26.436 --> 01:29:27.777 [SPEAKER_03]: We should reach and wrap this up. 01:29:28.057 --> 01:29:30.017 [SPEAKER_03]: But yes, no, I mean, yes, I'm working on it. 01:29:30.037 --> 01:29:36.220 [SPEAKER_03]: But yes, so that's why the replacement people isn't just, and I, sorry, an AI episode. 01:29:36.300 --> 01:29:40.501 [SPEAKER_03]: It's about human connection in a world obsessed with removing inconvenience, right? 01:29:40.541 --> 01:29:49.765 [SPEAKER_03]: And so that's what I've been really saying is that we want to make sure that everything about this, we hopefully, when you hear this, is that it's supposed to be a message of, 01:29:50.978 --> 01:29:52.538 [SPEAKER_03]: where what are the warning signs? 01:29:52.638 --> 01:29:56.299 [SPEAKER_03]: What are the things that you should be looking at and what is actually going to help? 01:29:57.079 --> 01:30:02.121 [SPEAKER_03]: You not turn into this, you know, problem and hopefully find a solution. 01:30:02.161 --> 01:30:06.462 [SPEAKER_03]: So our good ol' evolved blueprint challenge. 01:30:07.342 --> 01:30:10.383 [SPEAKER_03]: Okay, you know what, I'll do this because you've been doing a lot of tag on, okay? 01:30:11.023 --> 01:30:13.243 [SPEAKER_03]: So, right, you choose friction, right? 01:30:13.263 --> 01:30:19.825 [SPEAKER_03]: So for this week, intentionally choose one human interaction that would be easier to avoid digitally. 01:30:20.939 --> 01:30:22.801 [SPEAKER_03]: Oh wait, here's a good one for Matt. 01:30:23.301 --> 01:30:24.823 [SPEAKER_03]: Call somebody instead of texting. 01:30:26.224 --> 01:30:30.549 [SPEAKER_03]: He's like, I'm never gonna forget to get out of my face. 01:30:30.769 --> 01:30:32.511 [SPEAKER_03]: Grab a coffee with somebody, right? 01:30:32.631 --> 01:30:34.593 [SPEAKER_03]: Or have the conversation you've been putting off. 01:30:35.054 --> 01:30:37.456 [SPEAKER_03]: Matt, what's the goddamn conversation you need to have as me? 01:30:37.896 --> 01:30:38.938 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't know. 01:30:38.978 --> 01:30:40.359 [SPEAKER_03]: You need to think about it. 01:30:40.419 --> 01:30:43.122 [SPEAKER_03]: Spent I with somebody without scrolling through your phone. 01:30:44.300 --> 01:30:46.683 [SPEAKER_03]: Hmm, it feels like Matt needs to start doing some of these. 01:30:47.383 --> 01:30:53.390 [SPEAKER_03]: Uh, actually talk to the cashier instead of treating self-checkout, like you're diffusing a bomb. 01:30:54.250 --> 01:30:56.513 [SPEAKER_03]: Matt, joking. 01:30:56.893 --> 01:30:59.916 [SPEAKER_03]: So the point isn't stop using AI, right? 01:31:00.177 --> 01:31:06.944 [SPEAKER_03]: It's the point is making sure convenience hasn't started deciding who gets removed from your life. 01:31:07.821 --> 01:31:15.384 [SPEAKER_03]: Right, so for you guys out there, hopefully you find one of these things or find something that you, you know, your struggle with, right? 01:31:15.425 --> 01:31:19.306 [SPEAKER_03]: So like, I know for me, I mean, I guess I'll take a look at this list again. 01:31:20.487 --> 01:31:21.027 [SPEAKER_03]: Sure, you know what? 01:31:21.607 --> 01:31:22.808 [SPEAKER_03]: Hey mate, you wanna grab a coffee sometime? 01:31:23.828 --> 01:31:24.529 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't drink coffee. 01:31:25.089 --> 01:31:25.309 [SPEAKER_02]: Shit. 01:31:25.950 --> 01:31:27.211 [SPEAKER_03]: Hey, you want to grab a beer sometime? 01:31:27.371 --> 01:31:32.495 [SPEAKER_03]: He's like, I mean, beer's just, you know, he's like, maybe I don't want to go out with you anymore. 01:31:32.595 --> 01:31:32.815 [SPEAKER_03]: Okay. 01:31:32.835 --> 01:31:34.036 [SPEAKER_03]: Never mind. 01:31:34.917 --> 01:31:39.901 [SPEAKER_03]: So, I mean, kind of like final final thoughts on this whole episode, right? 01:31:39.921 --> 01:31:42.523 [SPEAKER_03]: So AI companionship might not be the real warning sign. 01:31:43.264 --> 01:31:47.628 [SPEAKER_03]: It might simply be exposing something that wasn't already happening or that was already happening. 01:31:48.288 --> 01:31:57.510 [SPEAKER_03]: We built the world where almost everything can happen without leaving home, waiting, compromising, being uncomfortable, we're interacting with strangers, right? 01:31:57.530 --> 01:32:00.291 [SPEAKER_03]: So artificial companionship might simply be the next step. 01:32:00.911 --> 01:32:06.572 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, 20 years from now having an AI boyfriend girlfriend spouse or best friend might not sound strange at all. 01:32:07.992 --> 01:32:12.433 [SPEAKER_03]: God help us all, but I hope one sentence still sounds strange. 01:32:12.833 --> 01:32:15.374 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't need real people anymore. 01:32:17.659 --> 01:32:19.361 [SPEAKER_03]: I really hope that resonates with people. 01:32:20.262 --> 01:32:20.942 [SPEAKER_03]: Is that right there? 01:32:21.142 --> 01:32:22.644 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't need real people anymore. 01:32:24.045 --> 01:32:28.047 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, shit, then your whole world's about to get fucked up. 01:32:28.447 --> 01:32:30.909 [SPEAKER_03]: Because people are inconvenient, right? 01:32:31.209 --> 01:32:33.030 [SPEAKER_03]: People frustrate us, Matt. 01:32:33.270 --> 01:32:34.531 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, they certainly do. 01:32:35.011 --> 01:32:37.052 [SPEAKER_03]: And they sure have helped us support us, right? 01:32:37.092 --> 01:32:38.813 [SPEAKER_03]: And because, again, more people do. 01:32:39.473 --> 01:32:44.316 [SPEAKER_03]: And maybe some of that friction we've spent decades trying to eliminate is exactly what keeps us connected. 01:32:44.997 --> 01:32:46.037 [SPEAKER_03]: So that's our thing. 01:32:46.317 --> 01:32:47.498 [SPEAKER_03]: Because honestly, at this point, 01:32:49.572 --> 01:32:51.313 [SPEAKER_03]: We're not going anywhere, right? 01:32:51.453 --> 01:32:53.335 [SPEAKER_03]: AI is not going anywhere in a church. 01:32:53.375 --> 01:32:55.316 [SPEAKER_03]: It isn't going to slow down, right? 01:32:55.396 --> 01:32:56.276 [SPEAKER_03]: It's going to continue. 01:32:56.457 --> 01:33:00.019 [SPEAKER_03]: We're going to either love it or hate it, or we have to somehow evolve. 01:33:00.259 --> 01:33:03.321 [SPEAKER_03]: We have to know overcome. 01:33:03.521 --> 01:33:08.804 [SPEAKER_03]: Wow, we're going to resolve all these, you know, the wonderful solutions we were already talking about. 01:33:09.284 --> 01:33:14.608 [SPEAKER_03]: So again, keep in mind that AI is, you know, something we even use on a daily basis here on the podcast. 01:33:15.480 --> 01:33:22.211 [SPEAKER_03]: We use it correctly because we're not trying to make it every little thing because we understand that it's a tool. 01:33:22.770 --> 01:33:23.910 [SPEAKER_02]: Right, it's cool. 01:33:24.390 --> 01:33:25.991 [SPEAKER_02]: That's it, like John, he's a tool. 01:33:26.631 --> 01:33:28.091 [SPEAKER_02]: You know what, and that's a douche. 01:33:28.111 --> 01:33:29.752 [SPEAKER_02]: But here we go, that's also a tool. 01:33:30.012 --> 01:33:46.196 [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, hey, anyways, no, but we've talked a lot about this hopefully you'll stay tuned next week for our multiversal fantasy draft because oh, that's gonna be a fun one because none of us actually know what they're how we're talking about or at least actually choosing the people I should say. 01:33:46.776 --> 01:33:49.637 [SPEAKER_03]: But anyways, until next time boys and girls, stay geeky. 01:33:53.699 --> 01:33:55.330 [SPEAKER_01]: This is where peace from the multiverse.