[SPEAKER_00]: Hello, everybody.
[SPEAKER_00]: JJ Cooper, Ben Badler here.
[SPEAKER_00]: Baseball America, draft podcast.
[SPEAKER_00]: And today, we're got a treat for you guys, because we're going to talk all about the 27 and 28 high school classes.
[SPEAKER_00]: Ben, the 27 class for Ben is kind of like, it's not old news, but it's like, it's like something that he's been seeing for quite a while now.
[SPEAKER_00]: 28, as well, we can look ahead, but I think that you're really going to enjoy kind of getting kind of a big picture look at kind of how this,
[SPEAKER_00]: We'll talk again about how both classes shape up.
[SPEAKER_00]: Ben, great to see you.
[SPEAKER_00]: Welcome back from, you know, that this is kind of what you do during the summer is.
[SPEAKER_00]: It feels like I'm always trying to keep track of where you are, but how was underclass, Ericot?
[SPEAKER_01]: Sometimes I wake up and I'm trying to remember where I am too, so, but yeah, area code underclass, it's, it's my favorite event of the year.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's, there's a lot of good events throughout the summer and throughout the fall, but the area code games, they have it, they have an underclass and an upper class event going on, we've got a couple guys out there right now for the upper class, but you're bringing it in a lot of the top players from
[SPEAKER_01]: all over the country and Canada, Puerto Rico as well to play for, you know, workouts and then games are again a lot of at bats from all these guys facing good competition and it's it's all on one field to so you're now bouncing around and trying to keep track of three or four games or eight games at once or something like that to which is always always a plus.
[SPEAKER_00]: The ADHD part of my brain when that's happening is like I always have this fear like I realized that I just got to do a better job of just staying put one place because I always have the fear that I'm missing something more important at a different field and I just have to block that out with that app because you can't see everything that you just can't.
[SPEAKER_01]: But yeah, yeah, that's definitely you get that phomo sometimes when when that's going on to make sure you're want to make sure you're at the right place, but when there's, you know, one of those quiet games going on and there's three really good arms thrown at once on different fields makes a little more challenging.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I wanted to start before we kind of dive into the the classes kind of like the challenge of what you do and kind of the fun part in some ways of what you do as well, which is I do think that you're kind of in a
[SPEAKER_00]: you're uniquely qualified to do this from a standpoint of like you do, you kind of drive our international, you know, signing day coverage and you're doing the underclass, you know, kind of list for us on the domestic side.
[SPEAKER_00]: And to me, the fascinating and challenging part of that is is that when you're talking about a college drafty, you are talking about something we've got a long
[SPEAKER_00]: They're still development to go there, but they're not going to change dramatically generally from one year to the next.
[SPEAKER_00]: I kind of want to just ask you like, when you're seeing these guys, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, could you may see some guy, you know, one summer and then you turn around to the next summer and you're seeing them again?
[SPEAKER_00]: I have to imagine that sometimes it's almost like, wait, is that the same guy that I saw last year?
[SPEAKER_00]: How do you kind of try to blend what you're seeing now versus kind of what you're kind of projecting ahead and as you talk to people kind of looking ahead far, far, far in the future in a lot of ways?
[SPEAKER_01]: There are literally, there are times where I'm literally saying that I don't think that's the same guy.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I was in the Dominican Republic one time, and I think that the Metz and then upside in this guy William Lugo, and I was at a showcase, I remember, I'd seen him, and there was another event, maybe a year later, where I saw, was at a showcase, and I looked at the roster, and it said, William Lugo, and
[SPEAKER_01]: it was listed as some guy who's up there is like six foot four or something like that big tall strong kid and went to the guy run in the showcase and I said, I think there's a mistake on the rights now William Wugo I've seen him he's like, no, that's him.
[SPEAKER_01]: I said, no William Wugo, I saw William Wugo like a year ago he's like this
[SPEAKER_01]: Squatty like six foot compact body guys like no, that's him.
[SPEAKER_01]: He just like grew four inches.
[SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, we don't talk about that with college players growing like three or four inches You know over the course of a year, but you do see that that's an extreme case obviously you're like with him.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'll eat a lot of
[SPEAKER_01]: O'Neill crews to probably the Dodgers agreed to sign them.
[SPEAKER_01]: He was 6-1 by Tommy Sign, he's 6-foot-4, and then now he's 6-foot-7, or 6-foot-8, or whatever.
[SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, guys, just physically can change a lot, including height-wise, which doesn't really happen.
[SPEAKER_01]: We're talking about pro guys, or college guys, and that's...
[SPEAKER_01]: that size difference or just strength difference in a lot of cases can make a significant impact on on players' tools, on players' skill sets, you get more bat speed, you get more arm strength guys get stronger, they start running faster too from one summer to the next or even from from this summer for the 27th, some guys are going to come out.
[SPEAKER_01]: Next spring and be showing different different tools that their tools are going to have taken a jump forward, especially the power, I think that's that's the big one, we'll receive you guys take a jump forward start driving the ball with more impact but.
[SPEAKER_01]: Uh, but yeah, I like having that, uh, it's, you know, just pass something on my 19th anniversary work in a baseball America.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I do like having that global perspective of, you know, what the top 15, 16, 17, 18-year-old players all around the world look like not just in the States, but in Latin America too.
[SPEAKER_01]: And obviously just having so many years of, uh, been able to pick brains of so many scouts who've been doing this longer, one way than I have over the years.
[SPEAKER_00]: So but with that does that mean that when you're watching you know kind of asking for the for the audience like are there certain attributes are there certain things you're looking for kind of more than others because you kind of know like again when we're lot come talk about college player right and you see someone who you know has good bat ball skills a decent swing but they really just don't have the ability to drive about even for metal bat.
[SPEAKER_00]: You're generally going to be like, okay, if you can't do that 21, the chances are that at 24, you're going to have playable powers probably pretty slim when you're looking at a 14 15 even 16 year old.
[SPEAKER_00]: I have to imagine that becomes much less of the attribute.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's like an attribute that sometimes stands out.
[SPEAKER_00]: But it just made me that that player got to it earlier I would imagine then some others who have other better skills, you know, better bat the ball skills all that.
[SPEAKER_00]: And they're just waiting for that maturity to kick in to get the power to get the bat speed that
[SPEAKER_00]: they're going to eventually need.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, how do you kind of drill down on what's basically what's important when you're talking about a high school, you know, sophomore, high school age, sophomore junior versus when you're talking about again, older players?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, a lot of times the players at a really young age who will jump out or who will get a lot of attention early on are the early physical mature players right and they're just bigger stronger they're often older for the class to so they're able to beat up on you know their peers and in the competition that they're facing at that level.
[SPEAKER_01]: But if they don't have a swing or they just don't have other traits that are going to continue to translate well, they're just beating up another players their age or maybe even younger than their age if they're old for the class, but don't have skill sets and mechanics that are going to translate at higher levels.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's always a red flag for me, whereas guys who maybe just, you know, they have good instincts for the game.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, you do still like to see, you know, especially by the time you get to be like 15, 16 years old, especially 16.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's when you start to start to see like real, like real major league tool sets at that level.
[SPEAKER_01]: But, you know, not necessarily power, but speed, arm strength, that kind of stuff.
[SPEAKER_01]: But you see guys who do things mechanically the way that they should look, the instincts are there, the bats of ball skills, are there, they recognize pitches, they have good plan at the plate.
[SPEAKER_01]: Once they start to layer on more strength, get bigger and stronger,
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, then the power is going to come, especially if they have more physical projection in their frame right if a guy's already you know six foot 200 pounds already real strong will okay now is much physical upside as a guy who's you know six foot to 175 pounds okay we'll once he fills out.
[SPEAKER_01]: And gets into his physical prime or even just a few years later, like, okay, you know, there's, you know, whether it's a picture or more velocities going to be coming or there's going to be more bats beat, more power, more arm strength better tools are are coming.
[SPEAKER_01]: So it doesn't even need to be a tall guy like not that I've ever saw this coming from.
[SPEAKER_01]: Ozzy Alby's, but I saw Ozzy Alby's when he was probably 15, 16 years old at an MLB showcase, and he was, I mean, no taller than he is right now, we're not very big.
[SPEAKER_01]: And he probably weighed about 127 pounds, but he was really athletic, quick twitch guy, could put the bat to the ball, and now he's putting up a, you know, 30 plus home run season under
[SPEAKER_01]: his belt.
[SPEAKER_01]: So those those are the guys who have you know do things mechanically the way you want them to look and have those contact skills having to have a feel for the game.
[SPEAKER_01]: Those are the kind of guys that I'm I'm looking to bet on.
[SPEAKER_00]: So along those lines when you look at this 2027 high school class next year's high school class you've seen a lot of these classes now how do you think that this one stacks up you know big picture first does seem like a lot of
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and I think there's one great shortstop at the top in Dylan seward, switching shortstop from Southern California, who's we have them right now as a number one overall prospect on our draft rankings college or high school and I think the last.
[SPEAKER_01]: who was not the first high school player drafted was Ethan Holiday.
[SPEAKER_01]: And he, I think, was the second high school player drafted and got the biggest bonus.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, you know, Max Kaur, Connor Griffin, then it was Ethan Holiday, a great Emerson last year, Dylan Seward, I think is a pretty good company there.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think if you put them in the draft, even this year, I probably still take great Emerson ahead, but I'd have to thank hard.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's a good argument.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, beyond him, yeah, you're right.
[SPEAKER_01]: There are a lot of good short stops in this class.
[SPEAKER_01]: You got guys like Lupin, Rinkone, really smooth, smooth.
[SPEAKER_01]: Everything he does left hand to hitting short stop from Texas.
[SPEAKER_01]: Guys like Leonocli, Carter, had not.
[SPEAKER_01]: Malachi Butler, Max Hemingway, Graham Houston.
[SPEAKER_01]: There's a lot of good short stops, but I also think overall.
[SPEAKER_01]: There's like good players who are in that top 25, 30, 40, maybe 50.
[SPEAKER_01]: group but overall I think the class is a little bit down from what we would normally see at this point like probably like a 4045 on the 2080 scale if you're creating just just from the high school side of the draft at this point right now.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, I want to get into Dylan Seward and more and that the emotional fortune that's one of the guys that I've really got a chance to bear down as well and we'll do that right after this quick break.
[SPEAKER_00]: And we're back.
[SPEAKER_00]: So Ben, we talked about sewer to a little bit, but let's kind of drill down on him a little bit.
[SPEAKER_00]: Watching him, like one thing that stands out first off is not that he's lacks physicality, but this is not, you know, we've had some of these kind of like top to the corner griffins of the world, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: We've had these, these short stops who,
[SPEAKER_00]: Bobby Whit Jr. kind of fits in this category going further back, but these sorts of short stops who kind of are these physical, just the physicality of those kind of like stands out and like leaps out to you when you're watching them.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's not Dylan Seward, like Dylan Seward's athleticism to me, you know, and you see them a lot more than I have.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like it really jumps out more for kind of like what you see the burst, the quick twitch, but also kind of like the overall game to me is kind of what makes him really jump out in comparison with peers.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like what is it about him to you that kind of makes him like you said the clear number one of this group?
[SPEAKER_01]: He has a lot of strengths and if you're trying to nitpick holes in his game, it's hard to find many of them.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's just a great combination of tools, the explosiveness that you're talking about, and then all the actions move the right way.
[SPEAKER_01]: the instincts are all there.
[SPEAKER_01]: You watch them at the plate, switch hitter, really high contact guy has a very mature approach at the plate.
[SPEAKER_01]: The swing works really well from both sides.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's compact.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's smooth.
[SPEAKER_01]: The barrel stays through the zone for a long time.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then, like you said, he's not, yeah, like he's not like Connor Griffin, you're like, oh, this is like a freak show physical specimen, but he's, you know, about six foot lean kid, but has a lot of bat speed and the ball just flies off his bat, like I don't.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not like, oh, see this going to be like a 10 to 15 home run guy and, you know, occasionally just, you know, a ball out to the pole side something like that, like, no, he definitely has power in there because there is a lot of bad speed just because of the, or there is a lot of there is power in there because of the bad speed.
[SPEAKER_01]: That he's able to generate and then just how frequently he is on the barrel that helps to play up and then oh, yeah, like we haven't even got his best tool.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, which is that he's an 80 runner.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's got great range, great instincts defensively at shortstop the hands, the feet work well.
[SPEAKER_01]: He has a strong arm like I don't know.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know what I'm not supposed to like about.
[SPEAKER_00]: The guy that I've been kind of sitting there and again, you know, everyone always asks what you're confident.
[SPEAKER_00]: And we try to stay away from it.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I do try to figure out like, okay, because one of the things you are looking at when you see a guy like this, you're trying, okay, so who is the player who's looked like this?
[SPEAKER_00]: who's ended up being like an impactful big liquor, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: Because there are guys where you're like, you realize, like, okay, this is really a unicorn.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, Ellie Dayla Cruz, we're talking about, you know, like, that's a unicorn because there just hasn't been someone who, that size at shortstop really kind of in, you're like,
[SPEAKER_00]: big league history, so where the one I kind of came to I first started with thinking like he gave me a little bit of of memory of a young trait turner because again, you're talking about that 80 run, you know, that speed being so the athleticism, but that's not perfect, you know, he's a switch hitter, you know,
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I'm going to run this one by you, like I think cold.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't think I've run this by you before, but I kind of like a Jose Reyes type in some ways.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, and again, I know that's going really far back for some people, but like when Jose Reyes was coming up, this like six foot, 170, 180, 180, five pound, switch hitting 80 runner, like impactful on the base pass guide, but also had the ability to hit for, you know, it wasn't just like a slap at or anything as well.
[SPEAKER_00]: That was kind of something that Seward evoked a little bit to me, but the other thing with Seward that really stood out is patient too, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, really knows the zone.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, I feel like I watched three at bats of his or three plate appearances, I should say, where it was like, it's three one, and he hasn't dropped, you know, pulled the bat off his shoulder yet because he hasn't seen a pitch worse to win that yet.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's the thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's he's a tool shed, but then he's also just one of the more advanced instincts smartest players out there the internal clock in the field the approach at the plate.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I could see Jose Reyes, the guy right now who's coming up as a prospect.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, the probably the same age, but like the guy who reminds me of him, someone is Joss Warren's always with the giants.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, just really quick Twitch athletic, explosive, switch hitting shortstop, who's ranked extremely high right now on our top 100 prospects, I think, I mean, and Joss Warren as an amateur, and obviously when he was an amateur, he was 16 years old,
[SPEAKER_01]: Right now, but I think there were more questions about, okay, how is this all going to translate in the game?
[SPEAKER_01]: Now, he's, I think, clearly answered that, yeah, extremely extremely well.
[SPEAKER_01]: And as another really high, especially high in zone contact guy with batsby to probably a similar,
[SPEAKER_01]: build.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think those two guys are pretty similar players.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I probably, even though the, you know, we have more professional data right now on just Oregon's all is I probably take Dillon sewer to take ahead of him right now.
[SPEAKER_00]: I can see it again, this is a guy we are kind of flagging as.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is not, oh, there, someone has to be number one in the class.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is a guy who's number one in the class.
[SPEAKER_00]: And you're like, and in many years, he would be number one in the high school class.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, if you just kind of look at it year after year, the other part of this is is that you've kind of, again, you've seen him for a while now.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is not something we're often, we get, I feel like there's the tools and you're like, but I wish I saw them translate a little bit more often.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's the guy who's kind of doing it also, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: Like it's something where you see this 80, you know, this 80 grade speed.
[SPEAKER_00]: You see this which, you see the bad speed, but you also don't see him.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's not really a much of ups and downs and kind of a steadiness to what you kind of get out of him week after week, month after month, isn't there?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I would say like if you think about maybe like gradie Emerson last year or this past draft, I should say, I think gradie Emerson is a better pure, hitter than Dylan seward is.
[SPEAKER_01]: I probably say that about anybody compared to gradie Emerson.
[SPEAKER_01]: So just trying to like compare and create the tool.
[SPEAKER_01]: Right, the two of them, but otherwise, yeah, I mean Dylan Seward is just got a great offensive track record and then you combine that with where he plays in the field, how he plays, so well defensively at shortstop and all the tools, all the explosiveness like I just can't imagine.
[SPEAKER_01]: I can't imagine him not doing and just being being concerned of the top 10 overall picks next year and I just I can't see how I can't like there's you know there's always different kinds of scouts right in terms of how much they weigh just like the raw tools versus you know the more gamer type guys who may be able with a bit more polish but are lighter on on tools I don't know like the type of scout that is not going to be really enamored with on steward.
[SPEAKER_00]: So the thing that this class doesn't seem to have, the next class coming up is when you get to the arms, how worrisome is this high school pitching group?
[SPEAKER_00]: It just doesn't feel like it has a whole, there are some guys, but it doesn't have kind of that depth of, especially top-end guys at this point.
[SPEAKER_00]: Does it, or am I,
[SPEAKER_00]: miss evaluating it.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think there are so there are good arms.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think we're probably
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, certainly I am more conservative with high school pitching, especially this far out from the draft, maybe relative to other people, would be, well, how many first round arms did we have this year, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: We had geo-relus, we had Coleman-Borthwick, which is like the Padres, I don't know, okay, fine.
[SPEAKER_01]: They're just like operating differently than,
[SPEAKER_01]: most other clubs I would say.
[SPEAKER_01]: And we have other guys who got paid comparably right like Jensen Hirschgorn this year with the braves and there's some other guys who still got good money.
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, yeah, there are other guys who paid but Brody Bammilla even with two UCL surgeries so credit to him, but
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I think the teams in general are saying we're more conservative these guys than certainly they used to be and there's just so much, so much risk I think was 16, 17 year old pitching.
[SPEAKER_01]: There are, there are good arms in this class, but there are certainly a lot of, like, there's just so much that can go sideways with them, you know, some of the top guys this year,
[SPEAKER_01]: When he was 16 years old, George Ferguson has been into the upper 90s right hander from Texas six foot four, kind of an unorthodox delivery, but also throws a ton of strikes, so those guys definitely jump out.
[SPEAKER_01]: There's some other arms this year, and there's going to be,
[SPEAKER_01]: There's going to be guys who are we're not going to even have ranked in our top 200 draft prospects come the time of the draft.
[SPEAKER_01]: We're going to be throwing like 98 99 miles an hour.
[SPEAKER_01]: So there's no shortage of velocity throughout the high school circuit.
[SPEAKER_00]: So that's a kind of a you know again 50,000 foot view, but of this 27 class, but bins already also been hard at work on the 28s as well.
[SPEAKER_00]: We'll get into that right up this quick break.
[SPEAKER_00]: So Ben, so that's the 27th kind of an idea of it.
[SPEAKER_00]: And again, we have this guy at the top who we're like, okay, that is the clear number one in that group.
[SPEAKER_00]: What about the 28th?
[SPEAKER_00]: Is there someone or further away, we're not holding you to like, that's gonna be the number one guy come draft day to plus years for now.
[SPEAKER_00]: But is there someone who's kind of standing out at the top of the group?
[SPEAKER_00]: Or is it more kind of a group of guys at the top?
[SPEAKER_01]: That's one of the big differences from 28 versus 27, or even really other most other years that we've had recently is there is not that one clear cut number one guy where we put them at the top the way we have with Dylan Seward in 27 or the way we did with Brady Emerson from the time he was
[SPEAKER_01]: probably 15 year old in 2026 or Connor Griffin when I don't that's going to see reclass to 24 or he was our number one high school player the whole way through for the 2024 class.
[SPEAKER_01]: We don't have that.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, we might end up having seven or eight different high school players at the top of our high school rankings for 2028 by the time the 28 draft rolls around.
[SPEAKER_01]: There is just not that one.
[SPEAKER_01]: marquee guy where it's like, oh, okay, this is like the obvious smack you in the face guy who's just like a head of everybody else in this class.
[SPEAKER_01]: I do think overall it's stronger than 2027 was at this time last year and the way that the 27 classes developed.
[SPEAKER_01]: we do have flip waters and outfield there from Michigan number one and he moved up number one in this last update because he does check a lot of the boxes that you're looking for for you know for a potential first round pick when you're seeing a guy obviously he's still two years out from the draft but at 16 years old it's
[SPEAKER_01]: It's physicality, athleticism, really good left-handed swing.
[SPEAKER_01]: I like that.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, he's the younger brother of being a waterist to just had a couple really good years at Notre Dame transferring to LSU, probably on a being a top two, three round pick in the draft next year.
[SPEAKER_01]: probably LSU and Jay Johnson, not too disappointed to have a built-in relationship there, but we'll see if you can see your brother play.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, we'll see if he ends up getting to college, because there's a lot of tools that teams are going to be drawn to.
[SPEAKER_01]: He runs extremely well to especially for a guy who's as big as he is, like it's legit plus plus speed right now,
[SPEAKER_01]: a corner outfielder kind of like a walker Jenkins that kind of like physicality, but they had even like runs better than walker and he's he had a great summer really good summer hitting ability power strike zone judgment.
[SPEAKER_01]: So a lot of things be really excited about with Fliplers.
[SPEAKER_00]: So the other thing that does stand out, like you said, there's more kind of guys in there.
[SPEAKER_00]: And there's some, like, you got direct baskets and that makes too.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's some present physicality.
[SPEAKER_00]: I say that, especially when you're talking about how young these guys are, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: Like you said, like, we're talking about water's flip waters is 6 2 1 90 right now.
[SPEAKER_00]: And he's still got two, two years of high school to go.
[SPEAKER_00]: Best guess is 6 2 1 85 right now.
[SPEAKER_00]: And he's got two years of high school to go.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's physicality in this group and it does seem like that again makes sense that the top is going to be a lot of guys who are up the middle profiles.
[SPEAKER_00]: But it does seem like a nice mix of up the middle profiles.
[SPEAKER_00]: You've got some, you've got you got a Utah bat, you know, near the top of the class in in Jacob Welch, which is not a normal thing we get to say.
[SPEAKER_00]: But but when you look at this
[SPEAKER_00]: As you said, there probably may be some jogging back and forth.
[SPEAKER_00]: What is the difference again, just like for a big picture for people trying to understand this?
[SPEAKER_00]: You just laid out, like we just hit the point now, like the, hey, something, again, we talk about all the things have gone crazy with the NCAA and college baseball and all that.
[SPEAKER_00]: One thing that has become more rational, I would say in the last few years, if you go check out our 20, 28 high school rankings, what you'll notice there is committed, colon, uncommitted, and most all instances,
[SPEAKER_00]: where the official recruiting period for these players has just begun, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: Like if that was August 1st, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: Like you can't contact these players officially.
[SPEAKER_00]: You could, you know, I'm not saying you can't nod your head as you walk by them or something, but you can't, you know, formally, you know, like recruit players until they hit their junior year now.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, it used to be that college coaches were recruiting and offering players when they were like 13 years old in some cases, which is like
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, you know, you're a college coach and a talk into a 13 year old and a 13 year old is going to know what he wants out of college in five years when he's 18 or like really six to nine years down to like no is ridiculous.
[SPEAKER_01]: So it's it's a much better system now, I think that everything is just slowed down.
[SPEAKER_00]: So no one disagrees like the funny thing about this is it's sad it was the other way because you don't find a college coaches like you know, you know, I really miss when I was a recruiting coordinator spending a whole lot of time at like 13 you type events because I didn't want to be late on a guy like that's not a good system now it's it's much more.
[SPEAKER_00]: It makes a whole lot more sense to say, yes, you're going into your junior year, start thinking about college, that makes sense.
[SPEAKER_00]: By the way, the coaches there, there's also a better chance that the coaches will still be at the institution as opposed to a normal rising ninth grader.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm committing to a school for, you know, that could be two coaches later at that point.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's I think it's much better for for pretty much everybody involved, especially the players just be able to slow everything down.
[SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, now is like when the recruiting period really heats up right this, especially over these next.
[SPEAKER_01]: let's say like six months for the very very top high school players.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then I think people get there's this like miss misunderstanding or or this belief that like oh, why are we even bothering you know like why is my team you know my college team bothering to recruit this guy who's ranked in the top 20 or 50 like he's not going to get to school
[SPEAKER_01]: I know, like, okay, like, there's certain guys where it's like, okay, Dylan's soared where you see a guy who's that good or a greedy Emerson, okay, fine, like, that's those guys are the exceptions.
[SPEAKER_01]: There's a lot that can change in the two years leading up to the draft, like, we've looked at the data on this even.
[SPEAKER_01]: Even guys were ranked in the top 50 still have a pretty good chance of getting to college because there's still a lot that can change guys signability is is you don't know what it's going to be when they're 16 years old some guys.
[SPEAKER_01]: There's a lot of guys who are going to play college baseball next year who easily could have gotten drafted and got offers for a million dollars, one point five million dollars more who just said, no, I want more money than that.
[SPEAKER_01]: Otherwise, I'm going to play college baseball and then you do still get guys like
[SPEAKER_01]: Darryl Coriel or now Logan Schmidt or Tyler Bell or Chris Levonis, who still go to college, so there's a lot that can change until we get to like the actual draft.
[SPEAKER_01]: date or like very close to approaching the draft date and then you see okay well these guys are ranked top 40 50 in a class like okay then you have pretty little chance of of getting those guys But at this point it makes all the sense in the world if you're one of the top programs with the country to be going after these top top high school players
[SPEAKER_00]: especially when you throw in the fact that again, when you now, the equations also very much change what it used to be because it used to be in the old, back in the old days that we both were therefore, that you were talking about, okay, that break even point could be $750,000,000,
[SPEAKER_00]: for many players, like that's a hard, hard number to look away from, even if you wanna go to school.
[SPEAKER_00]: But if that number is 750,000 or a million versus, okay, I'm gonna make less at college.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I'm gonna make real potentially game-changing money while I play college baseball.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then have the opportunity also to turn $750,000 into $3 million or more in the draft a couple years down the road.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's a very different equation to me than it used to be where it was like, you never know, especially if you're a pitcher, get hurt whatever this could be your one shot at life-changing money.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, that equation feels like it's a lot different than it used to be.
[SPEAKER_00]: Again, you do the recruiting stuff first.
[SPEAKER_00]: Also, how much do you feel like that's changed kind of the the dynamic of this.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think it has some impact, like the NIL that a, especially incoming college freshman is gonna get it not like substantial.
[SPEAKER_01]: And they might say like, oh, like, you know, we have an X amount of money for you now and then we'll do Y and you'll see it like, that's if you can't count on any future promises of what money the school says, they're gonna give you because if you come in and you, you know, you stink as a freshman, they're gonna be like,
[SPEAKER_01]: actually like we don't have that money, but I do think it would happen.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah MLB, look, MLB stacks the deck against the high school player in the draft.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like if you look at the top 50 bonuses, there's like a little bit more than half went to high school players, the top 100 bonuses, there's a little less than half like 47 something like that went to high school players,
[SPEAKER_01]: And then like, they're just aren't that many high school players have been who end up signing.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's about like 100 or so high school players every year who sign and it is not the top 100 high school players in the country who are signing.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's like the top.
[SPEAKER_01]: a lot of the top 60 or so players will sign.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then it's a lot of guys who say, yeah, I'll take 200,000.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'll take $350,000 to sign later on in the draft.
[SPEAKER_01]: Sure.
[SPEAKER_01]: I just want to start in play professional baseball.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I have no interest in continuing to school and
[SPEAKER_01]: So, which, you know, which is fine, but there's just, there are a lot of really good high school players who are still going to college, and especially this point in the process.
[SPEAKER_01]: We're talking about 27's who are, you know, at this point are mostly all committed at this point, or 28's who are, like you said, almost 99% still uncommitted except for the guys who jumped on those August first offers and said, yes, so I'll go there, but there's there's so much that can change with those guys.
[SPEAKER_00]: By the way, that scenario, the $152,350, $350,000 guy.
[SPEAKER_00]: Ben's written a lot about that, like, and pointing out, like, okay, so mom, dad, the brewers are on the phone.
[SPEAKER_00]: They, yeah, there seems to be a call coming.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like the brewers are a couple of other teams to do this, but there are teams to do this very well now.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, at that kind of that 11th round on high school player who a lot of times is not as well noticed, but again, we've seen number of those guys kind of awesome.
[SPEAKER_01]: Turns into Josh Adam Chesky.
[SPEAKER_00]: Mm-hmm.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm just kidding.
[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.
[SPEAKER_00]: But, okay.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, when it comes to, as you said, understandably, very conservative about pictures, especially at this, like, there's more position players at the top of that 28 class.
[SPEAKER_00]: Kind of a big picture question on that.
[SPEAKER_00]: Could we just saw you were just an event?
[SPEAKER_00]: We saw another, you know, 16-year-old throw 100.
[SPEAKER_00]: Annual tradition now.
[SPEAKER_00]: Annual tradition.
[SPEAKER_00]: Is that something, again, I'm not saying like we're not having a philosophical debate about velocity.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm just asking from a value weight of standpoint, I know that that catches a lot of attention.
[SPEAKER_00]: Is that a marker to you of future success or is that something where it's like,
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, yes, you threw it, you know, someone through a hundred at 16, that doesn't necessarily mean I think that there's kind of this expectation out there now that well that means that guy's to top pitching prospect of the class right it's like no, not necessarily we seeing guys who throw a hundred you know.
[SPEAKER_00]: most every year now coming out of high school it's got to be more than that it's not that's where I think that the I think that's where the industry's gotten smarter in the last decade like it used to be that if you through a hundred and it could be like what other attributes to this player have he through a hundred you know like in that could get you to the very top of a class it doesn't feel like that's the case anymore is it.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I think it's a little bit of both, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: So, I mean, yeah, that in the high school pitch, you're who's throwing 100, I mean, Colin Scott, who's who also is a third basement with like huge raw power, probably power over hit type guy.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, maybe it's neither, because maybe he just is a pitcher.
[SPEAKER_01]: But he's also, like he's also just turned 16, I think a few months ago,
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, so it's pretty impressive just to watch him throw like he did at the area code games.
[SPEAKER_01]: If you throw him like an 88 to 90 mile an hour slider to, um, which I guess you can do when you throw 100 miles an hour.
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, and there's, I mean, it's like he's a big strong kid, but it also looks like there's still some more physical.
[SPEAKER_01]: upside, we'll have just like a really explosive, powerful, rotational force with him.
[SPEAKER_01]: But overall, yeah, you're right.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it's great to throw 100 miles an hour at a young age or at any age.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think it's, it is indicative of players.
[SPEAKER_01]: promise, but also, yeah, like you need to see more than that, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: Like if you want to see a guy who has the stuff to start, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: You want to see strikes.
[SPEAKER_01]: You want to see feel for secondary stuff.
[SPEAKER_01]: You want to see a delivery and, you know, that can be some subjectivity to evaluating a delivery.
[SPEAKER_01]: But you want to see something that's going to be conducive, especially to
[SPEAKER_01]: To being able to repeat it, to being able to throw strikes with it, not just like herky jerky all over the place, okay, like that's going to be difficult for a guy to have the body control to throw strikes.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I think you look at some of the other pictures who are at the top of the class.
[SPEAKER_01]: This year for, for 2028, guys, like a left hand or a grace and bell out of Pennsylvania, right hand or a colon poplin from Florida, another right hand or a Gavin Chaker from Connecticut, like these guys all for the most part of like really good deliveries, feel for spinning, and in some cases multiple breaking balls, change ups, and in some of those cases.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, that's usually pitch it's a little bit further.
[SPEAKER_01]: behind at this age, because, I mean, especially if you throw 100 miles an hour like, well, you don't really need much of a change up, but so that pitch often develops later for pictures.
[SPEAKER_01]: But yeah, I mean, you're you're looking for a guy who are generally at the top of the class.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's it's not just raw velocity that you're looking at.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's all the other checkpoints that you're looking for in evaluating a picture and what it's going to look like.
[SPEAKER_01]: down the road because, yeah, I mean, look where it's 100 miles an hour, 97 and 98 like there's so many guys out there who throw upper 90s and then like there's just a limit to how much harder you're ultimately going to throw so it's nice to know that you have that big fastball.
[SPEAKER_01]: In your pocket to be able to rely on, but the scouts are when they're projecting guys out and seeing who's going to be the most successful major league starters years down the road, they're looking for a whole bunch of other checkpoints for for guys worth a very, very top of the list at this point.
[SPEAKER_00]: So that is a overview look at the 2027 and 2028 high school classes been before we wrap this up anything we didn't cover that really stands out that either of these classes that we should absolutely touch on.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, like you said, I mean, there's so a lot of good good short stops to in this this upcoming or this I should say this 2028 class that we were just talking about.
[SPEAKER_00]: You seem like not clean is having a a very good couple of weeks, you know, yeah, yeah, 27.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, Leo, not clearly who's five, but not a lot, but man.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, I don't care how big he is because he's the ball surprisingly hard like the shockingly hard for his side and it's a size and it's a really good left hand swing to really good instincts for the game good actions at shortstop internal clock really good hands quick release like.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's probably just as big as maybe like jet Williams or Slate Caldwell.
[SPEAKER_01]: Or, and I think, I think Leo knockles a better guy than, or a better player at the time, than either of those guys.
[SPEAKER_01]: And those guys are both first round picks.
[SPEAKER_01]: I would not be surprised to see Leo knockly ultimately end up going in the first round, which is where we have him.
[SPEAKER_01]: Right now, and then 2028, and you mentioned guys like Derek Vasquez, I mean Jake Welch, the Oswaffer, just really good, all these guys like, you know, we're looking to get ideally those premium position guys toward the top of the list and those guys certainly.
[SPEAKER_01]: check that box and they all all those guys just have really good instincts for the game really good basketball skills, good swings, always putting together quality fast to saw.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, that wasn't at East Coast Pro Carlos was there, but, you know, Derek Vasquez Homer there, and he's a 28 going up against a bunch of 27s who's one of Carlos's big.
[SPEAKER_01]: standouts there and then Jake Welch and Theoswalford both looked great at area codes and they both looked great all summer two guys were you know maybe like five eleven six foot not the most physical guys but really advanced both defensively offensively they have the basketball skills that especially teams have just shown that they're looking for.
[SPEAKER_01]: right now and well-ish in particular for for a guy who's not all that physical either hits the bowl it extremely hard for a guy his size he's a guy he's not just like a scrappy gamer type like there's he is but there's also some tools there you can you can run you can
[SPEAKER_01]: throw up to the mid 90s on the amount of not that I think is future is going to ever be on the mound beyond high school, but Those are all those are all guys.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think of a chance to be early early round picks come out high school in a couple years It's gonna be fun to watch it and again, you know, when you say like when wouldn't been highlights say a hitter who's not particularly tall.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm always flashback to you know
[SPEAKER_00]: When it was in high school Kevin McGonagall, there was always questions, you know, hey, stop that big.
[SPEAKER_00]: Ben was very much like, no Kevin McGonagall, just trust it, trust the bat and we see what it's turned into.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, but well, that is our look at the 2728 prep classes and kind of where they are right now with Ben Badler.
[SPEAKER_00]: And so, obviously, check out we have rankings for
[SPEAKER_00]: basically for all of this over at baseballamerica.com, we also have kind of coverage of the recruiting aspects of it that been touched about as well.
[SPEAKER_00]: You can see where these guys are committed.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, we also have kind of rankings as far as our 20 wrapping up the 26 recruiting classes.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, if you're interested in that.
[SPEAKER_00]: For Ben, I'm JJ.
[SPEAKER_00]: So long, everybody.