[SPEAKER_00]: Welcome back to another episode of Friends From Work, a podcast about all things in the Marvel Cinematic Universe hosted by Robbie Earl, my friend, and myself, Kyle Sconewell.
[SPEAKER_00]: We are on the doorstep.
[SPEAKER_00]: of Spider-Man brand new day.
[SPEAKER_00]: Help everyone's enjoying their summer.
[SPEAKER_00]: And so today we finally reached.
[SPEAKER_00]: We've reached that pinnacle, which is the Saga Sophia episode.
[SPEAKER_00]: Some of our favorite episodes to do.
[SPEAKER_00]: Robbie, how are you?
[SPEAKER_00]: Are you excited for today?
[SPEAKER_01]: I am excited for today.
[SPEAKER_01]: I feel like this year of movies, like we've talked about how it's turning into a huge thing, but I feel like specifically July, like brand new day and not up in Hymer and the Odyssey.
[SPEAKER_01]: I have been on the horizon, like the distant horizon for so long, that it's, I mean, it's not quite,
[SPEAKER_01]: Doomsday, you know, which has been pushed back in name changed and everything, but these have been things that felt like they were so far out, and so it's just kind of crazy that we're a few weeks away from, uh, as we were recording this, like, yeah, one week away, really from the Odyssey and a few from, uh, Spider-Man.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I'm, I'm really excited.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think it's, uh,
[SPEAKER_01]: It's going to be a fun month for us, and potentially a very fun month for Tom Holland.
[SPEAKER_00]: And for the world.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so doomsday and just to urge that.
[SPEAKER_00]: So the Odyssey in just a few days.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm missing my screener which is such a huge bomber so we won't have an episode out the night of I'm going to try to go see it in Michigan Like everyone else, okay?
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm gonna go try to see it in Michigan.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't think I a pity for getting to go to a screener either so
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: So we hope to have a screen saver episode on the Odyssey.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, we will have a screen server episode on the Odyssey.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a Christopher Nolan movie, but it might not be till next week when you and I see it.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then yes, Comic Con is next weekend and not this one of the next one.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, crazy news.
[SPEAKER_00]: Again, as I said here today, I still hope to be there and I hope you can be there.
[SPEAKER_00]: We still are waiting on a few details to confirm that, but I have stuff booked to go.
[SPEAKER_00]: If we're there, obviously I'll blow everyone up on social media with news and stuff.
[SPEAKER_00]: And on top of that, whether we are there or not, I guess we'll have to record an episode just with the fallout.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I'm sure there'll be a doomsday trailer.
[SPEAKER_00]: We're going to want to talk about.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, or something.
[SPEAKER_00]: an announcement or whatever, and then the following week is Spider-Man, which you and I might be seeing at the same time of recording the reaction of the fallout, you know, if we get to see it early.
[SPEAKER_00]: So it is crazy that it's finally here huge month for Tom Holland and his bank account, huge month for Zindaya.
[SPEAKER_00]: You keep forgetting she's in both too, you know, which is crazy.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: And they're married, so it's a joint bank account.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: really, really exciting.
[SPEAKER_00]: To help our bank account, check out the FFW podcast and go to the ffw podcast.com slash shop and check out our merchandise and go visit panelbound comics.
[SPEAKER_00]: This episode is brought to you by panelbound comics.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, Robbie.
[SPEAKER_00]: I like to kick us off with these because I'm always in the mindset of having just made the video version of this.
[SPEAKER_00]: So he says every time, if you're listening to this episode and you want to see a seven minute version, not a 70 minute version, then go to our YouTube channel and check out our friendly reminder, our screen recap of all the movies from a very, very high level.
[SPEAKER_00]: But what I want to highlight on this Robbie is what struck me when I was making that from each project.
[SPEAKER_00]: The first thing I want to talk about is, I just am not sure the entrance to Spider-Man in the MCU could have been any better than it was in Civil War.
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's not forget that Civil War, this absolute masterpiece of a film also gave us black Panther and Spider-Man in such an elite way.
[SPEAKER_00]: Ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma
[SPEAKER_00]: Toby McGuire, Andrew Garfield.
[SPEAKER_00]: We know the story.
[SPEAKER_00]: We know the bit by spider.
[SPEAKER_00]: We know what happens with Uncle Ben.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now it's interesting to talk about that now because if you fast forward, I think I'm actually wanting some of those elements now.
[SPEAKER_00]: But at the time,
[SPEAKER_00]: It didn't even make sense to go back and rehash it because they had done it already a full blown rehash and then cancel that so the fact that he's introduced and Tony Stark is the mentor and in this original introduction in civil war and then you'll see more of that in homecoming.
[SPEAKER_00]: just spectacular.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then what's kind of interesting is the way he's written by I think Marcus and McPhilia at that point, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: The way he's written at that point, too, is so much my scene from the get go.
[SPEAKER_00]: He has the quips.
[SPEAKER_00]: Tony Stark with the your unusually attractive
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, but then right the quips on the fight is is this stuff coming out of you is the conversation.
[SPEAKER_00]: Hey, Captain America, big fan You know, he said you'd say that.
[SPEAKER_00]: He said go for the legs the spider or the Star Wars references.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean all of the dialogue feels so spider-man to me So it's a great entry in civil war.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and I mean the the conversation that he has with Tony Is such a smart way of
[SPEAKER_01]: giving us the, the origin without giving it to us, which is, yes, not something you can do if you hadn't had those other franchises or at least, you know, if you hadn't had the
[SPEAKER_01]: you know, what we still don't know exactly what happened with Uncle Ben.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: And the in this version of of Spider-Man's history, we know that there was an Uncle Ben because, you know, we see like the suitcase reference.
[SPEAKER_00]: Wonderful.
[SPEAKER_00]: Get more info on that now, maybe.
[SPEAKER_00]: Potentially.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it's, you know, I think it's, we'll talk about that.
[SPEAKER_01]: in the no way.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm context in a second.
[SPEAKER_01]: But they've they've done a good job of creating a situation where they could continue to build on that or not.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like I think they could give a little bit more insight here and there.
[SPEAKER_01]: We could get flashbacks.
[SPEAKER_01]: But I think I like the way they handled it there, you're exactly right.
[SPEAKER_01]: For the moment was was great because we see that
[SPEAKER_01]: It's like that moment.
[SPEAKER_01]: What does it look out for the little guy?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: And he says, like, when you do the things I can do and the bad things still happen, then that's on you, like that's my fault now.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, I think it's when we're introduced to him.
[SPEAKER_01]: He is a dumpster diving kid who does not have, like, he clearly doesn't have much money.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's smart, but he's not like re-re Williams, at least, Tony is impressed with the webbing he's developed.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's still kind of inherently,
[SPEAKER_01]: relatable in a way that I think is important.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's not like, oh, Peter is this crazy genius that's like five steps ahead of everybody else who's ever talking to the way that like reader, re-re-re-or-tony are, but it's like he wants more than anything and I think that comes through in that first conversation and the battle.
[SPEAKER_01]: He is feeling like he owes something to
[SPEAKER_01]: the world to the people in his life, and there's this urgency to get out and like do something about it, to like do something with the power that he's been given, which is very much like at the core of the of the Spider-Man ethos.
[SPEAKER_01]: But I think it's really interesting that they don't, it's the only time we've seen a character, a Spider-Man character introduced on the big screen
[SPEAKER_01]: And we don't see him go through that initial tragedy.
[SPEAKER_01]: We just see him taking the first steps after it.
[SPEAKER_01]: So in an interesting way, even Civil War, picks up more where other franchises would pick up in the second installment, even though it's his first appearance and it's not even a full spider-man.
[SPEAKER_00]: He gets an upgraded suit.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's already got the quips and the confidence
[SPEAKER_00]: I really do think the Uncle Ben thing isn't going to be any more, because I think you have to view the effectiveness of the Aunt May stuff by no way home as the complete stand-in.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think by the time that happens in no way home, you do feel the same amount of weight.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think by them like saying the great, you know, great responsibility by them saying,
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, you know, you didn't do anything wrong trying to save these people, like, you know, him doing the right thing, cost them.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think that's the stand.
[SPEAKER_00]: And so I'm not trying to fast forward.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm just saying, I don't think they're going to lean a ton more into it.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think that they're going to lean into Aunt May was the pivotal figure in his life.
[SPEAKER_00]: And she is right away here in Civil War.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, the connection is right away with Aunt May and Tony Stark.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, after the battle of Germany,
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a little bit hard for Peter to go back to school, which when I was making the clips.
[SPEAKER_00]: I kind of resonated with.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm like, I get that part of it a little more like it's a little bit weird to have Tony Stark show up your house, give you a multimillion dollar suit and go fight Captain America stand alongside the Avengers and then just go back to class and wait for them to call you.
[SPEAKER_01]: I also think because of how of how great home coming is.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think it's pretty universally.
[SPEAKER_01]: loved by even the the hardest to please among the the Spider-Man fans.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think so.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think because of that, it's worth noting how tricky that was because of the timing like we've talked about how
[SPEAKER_01]: Really, that space between Civil War and Infinity War for the amount that they were trying to do, it was fairly compressed.
[SPEAKER_01]: And you look at, I mean, you look at how long for better worse we've set in the post-end game status quo without a ton changing in the MCU since then.
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's been, um, what since endgame it's been seven years.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, like that compared to the two between the Avengers breaking up and then Thanos coming.
[SPEAKER_01]: And when it comes to Spider-Man specifically, they were in a tough spot because they introduced him in Civil War.
[SPEAKER_01]: They know they want to bring him back in Infinity War.
[SPEAKER_01]: and in between that, they need to have a standalone Spider-Man movie that feels like it's not retreading things or just treading water.
[SPEAKER_01]: but you don't want to send him on some totally diversion path that then gets ignored when you bring him back and infinity war.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I think it's kind of challenging and they pulled it off so well by following up right on civil war and he does want to be involved.
[SPEAKER_01]: He wants all this stuff.
[SPEAKER_01]: But then he kind of threw that movie
[SPEAKER_01]: learns not just that it's not about kind of rushing to the end, but it's like doubling down on what it actually looks like to be grown up and kind of, and then turning down toning at the very end where now toning is willing to give them that thing, but you see Peter
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not just like rushing to have the most power so that you can then like wield the responsibility most effectively, but more like recognizing
[SPEAKER_01]: what the responsibility actually is and making sure that you're tuning yourself to it and recognizing that it's not about going as big as you possibly can, that maybe sometimes to belstang friendly neighbor at Spider-Man because if he goes and he does that stuff, then if he just goes and becomes another Avenger, then there isn't anybody that's
[SPEAKER_01]: that's there, that's keeping an eye on like, local level of dealers.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that level of thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: And that stuff matters to him.
[SPEAKER_01]: And those people matter to him.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so you start to kind of see the building blocks where Peter's so he's so relational.
[SPEAKER_01]: And you understand that for him, the kind of immediate, and the like the local, not just in his neighborhood,
[SPEAKER_01]: are really impactful to him specifically in a way that you don't see with a lot of the core Avengers.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like you see it with like Scott Lang, and that's maybe the only other example I can think of where someone has these personal relationships that really motivate them.
[SPEAKER_01]: Everybody else is just like kind of unattached.
[SPEAKER_01]: As a quick side note, that's important.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah, it is.
[SPEAKER_00]: As a quick side note, because we're talking about
[SPEAKER_00]: I, for some reason, do think it's kind of fun to...
[SPEAKER_00]: envision these geographical boundaries.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like once everything's fully developed, there is something fun to me about being like, okay, if it's small time, and it's in house kitchen, Daredevil's got it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like that's his thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, miles is from Harlem.
[SPEAKER_00]: So it's like eventually if that happens, it's kind of like, well, that's gonna hit, you know, something in Harlem is gonna be more sensitive to for miles than it's gonna be for Peter.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, although it's Brooklyn and the,
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, is he in the game he's in comics in the spiderverse, but in the game he's in the game.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's from Harlem.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_00]: What I either, you know, Brooklyn, whatever one you want to.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, but then Peter and Queens and like the Avengers being in midtown like they run Manhattan if it's big enough.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's kind of fun to be actually for some reason.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's on the upper west side.
[SPEAKER_00]: That will be, you know, so and so's jobs to get there.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: New York is massive so you can spread out.
[SPEAKER_00]: Anyways, yes, totally agree with all that.
[SPEAKER_00]: The other thing that homecoming does so well is we're introduced to Ned, MJ and Liz and just how and flash and just how unbelievably well they document what it truly feels like to be in high school.
[SPEAKER_00]: That was my high school experience.
[SPEAKER_00]: Those are my high school interactions, not Tobin McGuire's high school.
[SPEAKER_00]: that kind of ribbing from flash is more accurate to like a like a flash is on the decathlon team.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's got a little bit of nerdness about him too that that makes more sense than like buff up all guy who beats Peter up.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I wouldn't want to fight me neither.
[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.
[SPEAKER_00]: But that part is so spectacular.
[SPEAKER_00]: The other thing I really want to shout out from this journey is Michael Keaton might be one of the greatest additions to the MCU.
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's a case where the actor and the writing in the movie for that character is so good that I want him back just because there's so much charisma.
[SPEAKER_00]: I just rewatched it.
[SPEAKER_00]: the reveal obviously of Peter going on the homecoming date and he's Liz's father is a top five twist ever.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah in the MCU and that car ride sequence I could I could break it down forever where he's putting it together Peter is aware of what's happening Liz has no idea so she keeps hinting at things that are ruining Peter's cover
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then the visual aspect, it looks so cool.
[SPEAKER_00]: And Michael Keaton's face in the rear Vermeer.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then the light turns green, but he has a green face that looks like vulture, great foreshadowing.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then the conversation where he just pulls the gun.
[SPEAKER_00]: The second hard gum drop, we'll see you later.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to do the dad thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: And as soon as she gets out, does she know?
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I'll kill everyone you know Peter.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's what I'll do for my family.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then the fact that he makes him thank him.
[SPEAKER_00]: Peter, I just saved your life.
[SPEAKER_00]: what do you say back to me?
[SPEAKER_00]: One of my favorite scenes ever, ever, ever, ever in any movie.
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's so good that I just, I could use more of it, even though it was already perfect.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, this is one of the rare cases are like, yeah, like, he's so cool.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, to me.
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's such a great, it's such a great villain for that first movie because you compare him to
[SPEAKER_01]: the green goblin or even the studio and far from home, it's in a criminal school level villain, you know?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, well, they're so callously the green goblin, especially, but even the studio, willing to let a lot of people die and not really care about it.
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's not
[SPEAKER_01]: like he only, you know, like you see him kill the shocker, but it's kind of by accident.
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, he's not really doing anything sadistically.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's doing things out of a sense of desperation and trying to provide for his family and
[SPEAKER_00]: And obviously he's taken it a little too far because like he has an incredible house.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like in a lot of ways it looks like he's already set.
[SPEAKER_00]: You could just do this last job.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you really like your family, that's the twist of it.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, it's like, well, you're still doing bad stuff.
[SPEAKER_00]: And you could still.
[SPEAKER_01]: But you see the, I think the mirror image of Tony though, and I mean, that's really the more I look at it.
[SPEAKER_01]: And again, I still think that that was,
[SPEAKER_01]: part of Jekino's intention with that theme because it really does seem to be the mere image of the Avengers theme, but I think you see the Antitone Stark, where it's like you've got the guy that was born with everything, and he's super smart and the world has just kind of been his playground, his entire life.
[SPEAKER_01]: and then you have tombs who has he feels like those are the people that have been stepping on him.
[SPEAKER_01]: And whenever Tony kind of keeps reaching and reaching and reaching, he just keeps getting more and more and more and goes from being the super famous billionaire to now being like a super famous superhero billionaire that everybody loves and adores.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then
[SPEAKER_01]: for him, you know, you kind of see him wanting the same thing, but it looks darker and he has to kind of fight for every piece.
[SPEAKER_01]: So whenever he hits that point where, yeah, like Tinker is trying to get him to just like call it, he can't just, he can't just like walk away because now he feels like he's getting a chance to finally get what he's
[SPEAKER_01]: Odin and what he's actually worked for and that's where I think he's such a great person to expose Peter to now because Peter starting this movie thinks Tony is perfect it's so perfect because we talk about villains you know getting a little bit tired of the villain being the anti the hero
[SPEAKER_00]: What a genius call for that.
[SPEAKER_00]: Peter's basically, he's fighting a dark or opposite version of his mentor, you know?
[SPEAKER_00]: The case Uncle Ben stand in.
[SPEAKER_00]: Here's kind of the alternate route it could go.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then it just gets great.
[SPEAKER_00]: Cause then the power levels are also like mismatched, which is fun.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a different world you're fighting in.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and it, like that conversation that he has right before the rebel scene.
[SPEAKER_01]: where he, like, tunes is basically saying, like, you're one of, you should be on my side, you're one of me, basically.
[SPEAKER_01]: Cause he's like, you can't, you start to go and sell weapons, like this is wrong.
[SPEAKER_01]: And he's like, how do you think Tony Stark made all this money?
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's true, you know, it's like that's the thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's Tony wound up not, he walked away from that and that comes up a lot in the MCU, but it doesn't change the fact that,
[SPEAKER_01]: He wouldn't have access to the things that he did if his family hadn't done that for years and years and years and then one day he decided to not do it and now he's also going to police it so that nobody else can do it and make the same amount of money and so it you do see it from tunes perspective
[SPEAKER_00]: it's also a perfect example or a perfect balance I guess of he really doesn't want to kill Peter.
[SPEAKER_00]: In the scene with the car race says go inside, show my daughter a good time, not too good, but sure a good time.
[SPEAKER_00]: I truly believe that if Peter had done that, he would have left him alone.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think he is not sadistic enough to now seek Peter out.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think he will be okay, you know what?
[SPEAKER_00]: I will keep this quiet, you keep it quiet, and we're good.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like outside of that, I'm going to go back to operating like normal.
[SPEAKER_00]: You can hang out with my dog.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's what's kind of unique.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like even when he shows up in that rebel sequence, there's still apartments like Peter.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, I don't want to have to do this to you.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, you should be like, me, we don't have anything.
[SPEAKER_00]: Those guys up there, you think they care about us?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then after all that, he finally takes him down, but it's a perfect balance of, I don't think he feels a ton of regret walking out of that building, thinking he just killed Spider-Man.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's like, okay, well, that's what I had to do.
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's what I like about it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's still a bad dude, you know, at the end of it.
[SPEAKER_01]: But even in the final, in the final scene, his primary concern is just getting away with his loot.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's not, like, I'm gonna have to make sure that I kill this guy.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, and the post-cred scene to Gargan.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, he has the chance.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's not like Matt either.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think.
[SPEAKER_01]: But I think all of that is telling because you have Peter kind of have his own realization when things go badly on the ferry and he has to have Iron Man come and say the day that he kind of has to reevaluate who he is and what his role is and what he's doing it for.
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's a huge maybe the huge part of his growth.
[SPEAKER_01]: But I do think that
[SPEAKER_01]: that conversation with tombs and the impact of the impact of Avengers activities that maybe like an impact that Tony doesn't ever even think about.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that that stuff does I think that changes the way that Peter used himself as well because I think that he has
[SPEAKER_01]: empathy than Tony and I think it's easier for him to relate to people like that than it ever would be for Tony.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I think in every way the relationship with Tony, the relationship with
[SPEAKER_01]: Adrian, the way all of that, like interacts with Peter's first couple of months being Spider-Man in a real way, I think that all serves as like the first
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, again, like the first big portion of his like three movie origin story, where we we see him recognize, okay, no, it's okay to be a small time guy and maybe there's actually some honor in that and maybe if I do this the right way, then you don't have to have what happens to Liz and her family happened, like maybe this doesn't have to get to that point.
[SPEAKER_01]: and maybe like there's a world where like we'll see a no way home, I could have done more or could do more to prevent tombs from ever even getting that far down the line and getting in that situation, which I think is kind of where we meet him in infinity war after he's now made the decision to not.
[SPEAKER_01]: except the suit.
[SPEAKER_00]: Perfect transition that I'm going to mess up real quick.
[SPEAKER_00]: Because my last note is just, it is really moving to me.
[SPEAKER_00]: The conversation he does have a Tony Stark win.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's all falling apart.
[SPEAKER_00]: There are some incredible Uncle Ben style lines.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, we made the joke about the zip and the sort of the adults are talking now, but you know, what if someone had died, that's on you.
[SPEAKER_00]: And if you had died, that's on me.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then, well, you can't take the suit away from me.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm nothing without the suit.
[SPEAKER_00]: Obviously, this being like the great power and the responsibility.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you're nothing without the suit, then you shouldn't have it.
[SPEAKER_00]: All right, give it back to me.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's not working out.
[SPEAKER_00]: Guys, I'm like my dad.
[SPEAKER_00]: Uh-huh.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, I want to be as good as you.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I wanted you to be better.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that line.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's so like, and then it really does take the suit and I don't know, that just I rewatch it recently, it's such a good movie that was so moving to me.
[SPEAKER_00]: So anyway, and Peter goes through that, you know, and I think that's that's the realization of the rubble sequences.
[SPEAKER_00]: He is by himself.
[SPEAKER_00]: He doesn't have Tony coming.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's not wearing his high-tech suit anymore.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like this is it.
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's why I think the Iron Man Jr. critique has always fallen flat to me because I don't think that if you stand back like, oh yeah, he has this relationship with Tony Stark and he gets the advanced tech stuff.
[SPEAKER_01]: But I think that that whole that sequence is not like,
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I think some Spider-Man is not having that advanced suit.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's who he is and it's what he does to a whole last battle without it, you know, still.
[SPEAKER_00]: So yes, so then we finally made a video or an incredible entrance.
[SPEAKER_00]: My favorite movie in the MCU, one of my favorite movies ever in all of them.
[SPEAKER_00]: But one incredible entrance this whole thing was a tax been built up this dread and then all of a sudden it cuts to a bus and there's Peter, his arm tingles It gets goose bumps his hairs raised up and he looks out the window even Ned's funny.
[SPEAKER_00]: I need a distraction.
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, it's really special for all good to die and then he jumps out the window that swinging is so cool looking as he heads over there.
[SPEAKER_01]: That whole that whole scene
[SPEAKER_01]: which is not, I mean, that's the crazy thing about Infinity War.
[SPEAKER_01]: They're balancing so many things.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like 30 seconds.
[SPEAKER_01]: Look at actual character run times, you know?
[SPEAKER_00]: 30 seconds long.
[SPEAKER_01]: But that whole little portion of the movie from the moment that Peter's like spider sense goes off until he and Tony wind up on the ship heading the Titan is maybe like beat for beat.
[SPEAKER_01]: my favorite, just like a fun MCU, like, and again, I, like, I can't leave her doing this.
[SPEAKER_00]: We got this far too soon.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, like something about just the way that they jump in and everything is, is like working.
[SPEAKER_01]: And again, a lot of my favorite characters are not even in that sequence, but there's just something about the way that it's done and the way that Spider-Man, I just,
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, his introduction there picks up so well and and the like who is this guy Mr. Stark?
[SPEAKER_01]: Like I got the wizard.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's just the whole thing is is like it feels perfectly in line both with the groundwork that's been laid across civil war and homecoming
[SPEAKER_00]: but also it it like has that just kind of quintessential spider man flip and see to it that you don't always get well and that I love watching the transition of Peter not really taking the whole thing seriously enough to
[SPEAKER_00]: Realizing it's a big deal once it's too late and Tony a fray that this might be a really big deal And I don't want you to be stuck here.
[SPEAKER_00]: So by the time he gets to the the conversation on the actual alien spaceship I think you do see the legitimate disappointment in Tony's eyes where he's like oh no Now you're here, but now what there's no I can do now so then he's like well here we go What's the plan?
[SPEAKER_00]: You know you're an adventure boom boom like there's nothing else we can do
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, you know, he's he's that generally torn up about him being there and I don't think it really.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't think it really hits Peter until the dusting, honestly, and then that's where I think the sorry comes from, you know, when he's being dusted away, it's like you battles Thanos and they've always fun interactions on the ship and on the thing, but then all of a sudden it's realizing, oh no, this is like a really big deal.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know he says the line of,
[SPEAKER_00]: You can't be a friendly neighborhood Spider-Man if there's not a neighborhood to protect or to be friendly around or whatever.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm sorry, it's confusing, but you know what I'm saying?
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, that doesn't even really make sense, but.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, okay, yeah, sorry, that's what I'm saying.
[SPEAKER_00]: But the dusting, then, if him looking, I'm going saying, I'm sorry, I think that's him realizing, oh, man, like a lot of poor decisions kind of led to this moment.
[SPEAKER_01]: from, you know, just from the development of Peter and Spider-Man, I think you just watch homecoming so correct me from wrong.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that's the first time we really see him have Spider Sense.
[SPEAKER_01]: Both on the
[SPEAKER_01]: Like maybe he references it when he's talking to Ned, but like we see it on the bus, but then we also see like when they land on Titan and he's like, when I'm trying to say something is coming, you start to see this different like that side of his power set and that comes into play, I think it's sort of in the same way we'll see it show up in no way home and maybe the way we're seeing it in brand new day,
[SPEAKER_01]: when like his process of getting dusted is much longer than everybody else's.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like he has time to feel it coming and to talk to Tony through it.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so I think there's this idea that he can sense it happening earlier than everybody else can.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think the way they do that subtly without ever saying that that's what they're doing is is another very sleek, Marcus McFelizm.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, but I think like the other two things for Infinity War I, I think you're right when he gets kind of knighted as an Avenger after they save strange.
[SPEAKER_01]: I do think that you see him get it's like a moment of excitement
[SPEAKER_01]: because he feels legitimized in then a moment of sort of salinity where he's understanding that this is not a fun thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like this is not whatever he thought it was going to be when he was fantasizing about being an Avenger, you know, in the first part of homecoming.
[SPEAKER_01]: so well done and so unique is we talk about how Tony in some ways becomes a stand-in for Uncle Ben.
[SPEAKER_01]: But then what's crazy is Peter's loss becomes a huge motivating factor for Tony in just as much, if not more of a way than Tony's loss will for sure.
[SPEAKER_00]: puts them over the top for doing the actual time travel.
[SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, I mean, because they make a point to show the picture.
[SPEAKER_01]: He, yeah, he wipes off the picture.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so I think that is, it enhances that relationship.
[SPEAKER_01]: But it also kind of, it, it shows how much it cuts.
[SPEAKER_01]: both ways and then happy has that line and far from home, you know, where he's like, I don't think Tony would have done what he did if he didn't know that you would be here.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: and so it's like it even carries forward more where it's like you, the lessons that Tony has helped teach Peter, you then kind of see, go back the other direction, which I think is cool and also sets up this idea that Spider-Man, he starts as a peripheral character in what's essentially
[SPEAKER_01]: And by the end of this run is poised to become the kind of centerpiece of the, the MCU.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's a slightly interesting interaction or a difference in interaction at the end of endgame once Tony snaps.
[SPEAKER_00]: And you know, because in endgame, we don't get a ton of Peter, obviously, until the very end, you get the one where you're in in the hug, which is really sweet.
[SPEAKER_01]: I do love the.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh my god.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: But Tony dies.
[SPEAKER_00]: I was just thinking you're Tony
[SPEAKER_00]: already hasn't had Spider-Man for five years, six years, and that last interaction when he actually shows up.
[SPEAKER_00]: So he just got that one right.
[SPEAKER_00]: But the Spider-Man, it's been like no time, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: He just disappeared and kind of came back all the sudden and now his mentor has gone.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I think that sets up pretty well.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like Tony's going to be more moved by Pepper, that conversation with Pepper at the end than he has with Peter, but Peter is wrecked by it.
[SPEAKER_00]: I, uh, I just recorded that clip and he's, he's crying.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, we kind of taken off him from roadie and pepper.
[SPEAKER_00]: And that would make more sense to me because the last thing he knew he was with them on, on Titan, and that was it, you know, and then he, you know, he didn't have that gap of having to get over it already.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, and it's it's I think the bigger moment for Tony is yeah, the reunion when he sees Peter and again, it's another great little mini callback to homecoming because there's the moment when he like leans over.
[SPEAKER_01]: to open and Peter like give us him for the hug and he's like, no, no, I'm just just open the door for you.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's right.
[SPEAKER_01]: We're not at hugging.
[SPEAKER_00]: But then, then Peter, oh, this is really exactly.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah, he does hug him and it's like, so you, I mean, the man, or I think, and I'm biased, obviously, but I don't know if you can get much better,
[SPEAKER_01]: the like nuanced face acting, then like Ardy Jay and Vigo Mortensen.
[SPEAKER_01]: And Ardy Jay, that's just one of the best like when he does that kind of watery eye thing, you know, where he when he sees Peter for the first time, and like Peter's just kind of doing the babbling thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: And like that, that I think is the most important moment for Tony, but yeah, Peter doesn't
[SPEAKER_01]: loss where he's just like devastated.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think kind of, it's like roadie and pepper under they're able to come to terms of what's happening to Tony in a way that Peter is obviously not equipped to.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, we'll continue this saga after a quick word from these sponsors.
[SPEAKER_00]: So then we pick up a far from home.
[SPEAKER_00]: Spider-Man is back, Peter is back, but he's lost his mentor, and he is feeling the pressure of who is going to be the next Iron Man, which I, again, despite some of the hate from the Spider-Bros online, do think is a genius call as a way to reflect on what happened in endgame.
[SPEAKER_00]: Obviously Tony has been a huge part of his journey.
[SPEAKER_00]: So we've already committed to that.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's a big part of his journey.
[SPEAKER_00]: and it is a good exploration of what is Spider-Man then.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like without Tony, what is Spider-Man and who is going to be the next Iron Man?
[SPEAKER_00]: And what's funny is ultimately the answer is it's not him.
[SPEAKER_00]: But for a movie, it's kind of a, we're going to try it as if it is him.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm okay with all that, but that's kind of the central core of it.
[SPEAKER_00]: I, right now, I'm picturing that shot of him on top of the water tower, seeing the, uh, mural of Tony and kind of putting his head down of like, all those feelings coming back.
[SPEAKER_00]: When he, and the escape to Europe is almost kind of an escape from the pressure of Avengers level questions, you know?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and yeah, and I think that I, the more I sit with it, I, it always struck me as an odd choice, and I've talked about that before, but I think that it does, especially makes sense now that we have brand new day being what it is, where I, I think that it was the, the right move.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, at the time, I think you and I were saying, like, we really just want, we want to see Peter come into his own as the guy that's swinging around me and hadn't, like, Spider-Man, like we know him.
[SPEAKER_01]: And...
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that they were right to not fully give us that until now, because they did it correctly.
[SPEAKER_01]: There's a world where we would say that that was not the case because it crashed and burned.
[SPEAKER_01]: But I think that getting him away and again, doing something that we had never seen any other, I mean, no other live action spider-man movie has ever even gotten him out of New York.
[SPEAKER_01]: at all.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so the fact that homecoming civil war starts taking him to Germany and then homecoming takes him to DC and then all of far from home is basically gone.
[SPEAKER_00]: You're right.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's almost no New York time.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so, you know, they're kind of continuing to show you all these different things.
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's why I'm so, but again, if you view it as the origin of how Spider-Man becomes the protector of New York, then it makes sense to me.
[SPEAKER_01]: And you sort of see him like in homecoming, he's chasing something and then realizes that
[SPEAKER_01]: he actually wants to be where he is.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then in far from home, it's kind of running for something.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, he's no longer allowed to have that.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's like he spends this time with Tony telling him, look, you don't need to rush into all this stuff, like be this and that's fine.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then now all of a sudden Tony's gone and caps gone and Thor's gone and everyone's looking to him as though
[SPEAKER_01]: he now has to know all of these things that previously the whole point whisper him to be okay not knowing and not doing.
[SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, I think it's like his home is now no longer even accessible to him because you see those kind of panic attack moments when he can't even show up at feast without everybody gathering around.
[SPEAKER_01]: not to mention the fact that yeah, he was blipped, so it's not even something where he had the five years to acclimate during the post-blipped Thanos time.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's like he's just right.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's gone from
[SPEAKER_01]: a world where he was just in high school and Tony was there and things were kind of operating as usual to coming back and now like everything is totally changed and there are all these new issues and yeah his mentor and all of the people that he would have traditionally looked to are gone which goes back to the like where is Dr.
[SPEAKER_01]: Strange, where is Captain Marvel and
[SPEAKER_01]: and he's a teenager and he's like not gonna like the other thing that I think that the far from home movie does so well is like he he makes a mistake with with back and he's not even it's not like he's trying to do the wrong like he's trying to do what he thinks is right like he's he's I kind of I like not like my video all the movies I think
[SPEAKER_00]: come back to a core theme of Spider-Man gets bitten by trying to do the right thing and it goes a lie.
[SPEAKER_00]: Right?
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, yeah, just by his best efforts, bad stuff still happens to him, even when he's trying to do the right thing at certain times.
[SPEAKER_00]: Because obviously, that's the moral of no way home too, obviously, you know what I mean?
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's the lesson that, like,
[SPEAKER_01]: I think with far from home, it's a similar, it's kind of building on the homecoming thing, but again, from the opposite angle where in homecoming, he has that moment of realizing, like, I have to do this on my own and lifting the rubble.
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's sort of the same thing here where he wants so desperately for there to be a Tony, a new Tony Stark.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so whenever Quentin Beck presents himself that way intentionally, Peter so primed to see it and to want to believe it.
[SPEAKER_01]: So he's just like, yeah, please take this.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then I can actually go and take a girl in a date and not feel sure like, you know, about
[SPEAKER_01]: And back, like, takes advantage of that and plays into it, um, and then, you know, uh,
[SPEAKER_00]: That, and that's a mention, Jake Chill and all just absolutely crushes it and they absolutely crush it with the visuals around Mysterio.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like how Mysterio could be a thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: You have to stretch your imagination a little bit that the drones can do that much, but it still is so cool, looking and he is so cool.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's not going to land gladly.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I just I love it.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like linked back directly into the Civil War stuff and pulling the guy back from the first Iron Man, like that's
[SPEAKER_01]: what we talked about last week like Spider-Man's done such a good job in those movies despite despite the fact that those are the only like not fully Marvel Studios in CU movies they do a better job than most at referencing the rest of them CU and kind of integrating.
[SPEAKER_00]: And for everyone who knows Mysterio is already a villain, I get that, but they do such a good job of letting it go on a little too long.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like he's good in the conversation in the cave or whatever and then they're friendly and then they have that conversation on the roof You're like man, this guy actually might like maybe what they're doing the captain marvelness with the scrolls Maybe what they're doing is right.
[SPEAKER_00]: It was actually a hero
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's the different story of that they're twisting.
[SPEAKER_00]: And they let it keep going.
[SPEAKER_00]: Then they fight the fire elemental together and win and you're like, okay, they still haven't revealed that he's bad.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then they go sit down at the bar and you're like, man, he's still being really sweet.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, what do you want?
[SPEAKER_00]: Peter, what do you want it?
[SPEAKER_00]: No, don't give me the glasses.
[SPEAKER_00]: Don't give him to me.
[SPEAKER_00]: No, no, okay, I'll try him on whatever, don't give him to me.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, and you're like, wow, so that to the point where I've famously said this, my mother went like,
[SPEAKER_00]: What, because the amount doesn't know anything about this, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: But she was just liking Jake Gillen Hall.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then when he does like get this stupid outfit off, she was like legitimately confused.
[SPEAKER_00]: Wait, he what?
[SPEAKER_00]: She was so mad.
[SPEAKER_01]: Or just like, I mean, like, I knew going into it that Mysterio is obviously it's a he's a villain.
[SPEAKER_01]: But even if even if you knew that he was going to go that route
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that in on my first watch, I probably thought, okay, he is a good guy that's going to get like kind of corrupted or burned or something, but I think the full on, like even if you knew that there was going to be some kind of turn, I think the fact that it was all orchestrated on the level that it was and the drones and everything, I was not
[SPEAKER_01]: I was not predicting that, and I say that just to say like I like anybody else and very familiar with Mysterio and the comics, so you know it fits, but it was a masterful reveal, and again, just kind of shows like another thing that Homecoming did well, the contrast between the young
[SPEAKER_01]: kind of naïve hero and the the older cynical vulture and here it's it's that same like he wants to trust in this guy he assumes that like so many of the heroes that Peter's just met and are great people that oh yeah this guy like Nick Fury trusts him he's a hero he's helped me do all this stuff surely he's a better candidate for these right
[SPEAKER_01]: it's totally justifiable.
[SPEAKER_00]: The only other angle I need to approach us from is it is interesting to look at happy.
[SPEAKER_00]: In the first movie, happy doesn't even really want anything to do with Peter.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's annoyed.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's a kid.
[SPEAKER_00]: Happy's funny.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's more, he's closer to Tony.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like he's almost like jealous that Tony's spending time with him.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then in the second movie, he really is the
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, what if I'm now your assistant, Tony's gone, how can I help you?
[SPEAKER_00]: And so it is an exploration of what does it look like if Spider-Man is, Tony Stark Jr.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's kind of like what this movie to me feels like in a lot of ways.
[SPEAKER_00]: He does the tech stuff at the end, the ACDC joke, happy, helping, actually with the jet, et cetera.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I think it works perfectly as a chapter because as we transition to no way home,
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, if they were, you know, happy was here, kind of, and Peter was here, and then they're kind of here for this movie.
[SPEAKER_00]: By no way, home time, Peter is more in charge is more confident of what's going on and happy's kind of taking it backseat.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like, Peter's saying, I'm gonna use your apartment.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm just gonna do this.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm gonna do this and happy being like, okay, and I do think it's another, it's a different angle to look at this transition of Peter Parker becoming Spider-Man and not Tony's from Junior.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know what I'm saying?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, well, and in that scene, the moment he designs his own suit using the fabricator, where I think that I like that too, because that was always a question I had with the Ramey film, like how does he have the skillset to create
[SPEAKER_01]: whatever these suits like Spandex suit this is there's like very intricate thing that is normally it's easier to explain to the comics but here you know I kind of like that jackups and look jackups and yeah by the time you get to the version we see at the end of no way home
[SPEAKER_01]: you understand that he at least has, he's made one of these obviously with the benefit of one of these fabricators, but he at least kind of understands what's going into it.
[SPEAKER_01]: And yeah, he's like creating his own stuff now, like he's not relying on.
[SPEAKER_01]: either of these suits that Tony's made for him.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's now knowing like what he wants, what he needs to have, how to use his expider sense against Mysterio, not the suit.
[SPEAKER_01]: And again, it's that kind of a lie.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's true.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's a good idea.
[SPEAKER_00]: The final fight is his spider sense, not any type.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: In fact, I think he doesn't even have webs, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: His cartridges are gone.
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, right.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: It, like, if anything, he can't trust the tech, you know?
[SPEAKER_01]: So it's like, again, it's not reinforcing the Iron Man juniors.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's showing that, like, I mean, and I think a happy even has the line.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, no one could live up to Tony, like not even Tony.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so it's like you have to do something different.
[SPEAKER_01]: The other piece of that,
[SPEAKER_01]: maybe the big piece of that movie beyond that is the developing relationship with MJ who is not a huge part of homecoming.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, we don't even really, we don't even get the MJ right name drop until the last very last scene.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, right at there now.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, Liz is his crush on the first movie.
[SPEAKER_00]: She is now his full crush here.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, they're in a relationship by the end of this.
[SPEAKER_00]: For sure.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think it's the case on the bridge is so significant by the end, you know?
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's when you start to get him being torn more because in homecoming, you see the consequences of him having to always leave and fight between the to-cathalon and being spider-man and stuff.
[SPEAKER_01]: But here, it's like he really just wants to focus on this time with MJ and he sees like Brad hoeing in and he keeps getting you on me to execute, Brad.
[SPEAKER_00]: I By the way, it's so funny when Ned is insecure that now MJ knows when he every little subtle comment after she says, he's like, oh, I knew first I knew longer.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, he'll say things like that or And when he first walks in and he's trying to make up that he doesn't know she knows yet Peter, what a costume for the Is it ball or something?
[SPEAKER_00]: He said he's like, yes, he's like she knows what
[SPEAKER_01]: I, uh, I also just, man, J.B.
[SPEAKER_01]: Smooth in, yes, that movie is, oh, funny to me.
[SPEAKER_00]: And the teacher, the teacher is also funny to, like, red scientist.
[SPEAKER_00]: which is yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: I love his teacher saying uh, I can't lose another child.
[SPEAKER_00]: Not again.
[SPEAKER_00]: When he goes not again.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, I know.
[SPEAKER_01]: I know.
[SPEAKER_01]: I love his uh, I think my like the funniest line to me in far from home is the like, listen.
[SPEAKER_01]: You gotta stop taking pictures of people in the bath.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah, that's so weird.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not your animals or stoles.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: Dude, I mean, the movie's funny.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's all my list of funniest movies in the MCU, but actually both of them.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: Even the first one, a couple of lines from Flash, like when Flash,
[SPEAKER_00]: is like it cuts to him in his dad's car and he's like I'm sorry, but I've had was it I've had chicken parmesan before that's that's just not know whatever it is like it's like super president that's just not it okay you like in the girlfriend's so basic made them leave the rush
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, that's a good call out.
[SPEAKER_00]: They're in a relationship, which, you know, Peter's identities revealed at the end.
[SPEAKER_00]: And so we were kind of wondering how long would they hold on to that MJ finds out who he is in the middle of far from home.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then the end, everyone in the world finds out who he is.
[SPEAKER_00]: And no way home picks up literally one second later.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's, it could be cut, cut exactly together together.
[SPEAKER_00]: I said that horribly.
[SPEAKER_00]: Three, two, one.
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's try again.
[SPEAKER_00]: They're stitched together, basically.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: Seeing goes right into each other.
[SPEAKER_01]: One, there's the, it's like in, at the end of homecoming may find sell.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yep.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then, in the words, the Ned finds out early in homecoming.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yep.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then, and yeah, and far from home, MJ finds out like halfway through.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so there's this, and he talks about this in no way home.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like there's this kind of sweet spot moment there where,
[SPEAKER_01]: like happy and everyone that's within the kind of stark family knows who he is and then the three people that he's closest to know who he is and like yeah it's like you get want like 30 minutes or something of that where it's really at least like that tension is gone for a moment and then yeah like in the
[SPEAKER_00]: everyone finds out, and also we get the J.K. Simmons, J. Jonah Jameson, but it's also another couple of examples again, where Peter trying to do the right thing, like he feels like MJ and Ned are unfairly being punished for knowing he's Spider-Man, they can't get in the college, they can't get the jobs, they may be one, et cetera, it's not their lives are not in the right track.
[SPEAKER_00]: Because he feels bad about that when they did nothing, he's the one that goes to Dr.
[SPEAKER_00]: Strange and gets the spell tampered with.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's the same thing then later once the villains get pulled into the multiverse, it's coming from a good place.
[SPEAKER_00]: He does it with them to all go back to parish, which is what is about to happen.
[SPEAKER_00]: And so because of that, he goes to the whole regular moral, which ultimately leads to Aunt May's death.
[SPEAKER_00]: So again, trying to do the right thing, cost him dearly.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: And it is so different, even just thematically.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I love that they did that because,
[SPEAKER_01]: If we talk about this as the origin trilogy versus the origin movie, you know, like there's that moment anytime you're watching a Spider-Man origin story or reading one where you're just waiting for the other shoot to drop, like waiting for him to make the mistake and to get arrogant and to do the thing that leads to this tragedy and it was bold of them.
[SPEAKER_01]: to have it flip that like if he had done the selfish thing and just sent them back and they would still be alive and everybody would still know who he is, you know, like, or the people around him that he wanted to know who he is would know.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's right.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so it's a,
[SPEAKER_01]: It shows, yeah, it's that like trying to do the right thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: Isn't that the tragedy of the story of Spider-Man though, like going back to comics?
[SPEAKER_00]: Is that if there's like he's always kind of going through something even in an effort, and then that's also the beauty of it.
[SPEAKER_00]: No matter what he goes through, he doesn't become jaded.
[SPEAKER_00]: Typically, he is such a moral compass that he powers through that stuff.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, and that's what makes Spider-Man 2 so great is that it's him choosing the hard thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
[SPEAKER_01]: Rather than, you know, having it kind of thrust upon him, which is the origin.
[SPEAKER_00]: But it's also the message that Toby and Andrew pass along to him in no way home when they show up.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's kind of his lifeline because they can share their experience and prevent him from going down that path.
[SPEAKER_00]: And it kind of gets this Peter Parker back on track of no matter all this awful stuff that happens to you like we need you here, you know, you got to be this.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: All the way down to not to fast forward too far, but all the way down to Toby literally catching the glider.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, and there's the same thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's such a beautiful moment by the way.
[SPEAKER_00]: He hasn't seen any just stairs out of Molly's until he gets down.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, because he, you know, he has that line earlier where he's like, when when my uncle Ben died, like I wanted the person that killed him dead and I got what I wanted.
[SPEAKER_01]: It didn't help.
[SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, you watch the rainy movie, he doesn't, it's not like he throws the guy out the window.
[SPEAKER_01]: No.
[SPEAKER_01]: But it's intentional.
[SPEAKER_00]: Stumbles back and he's not obsessed with the guys like getting in trouble exactly.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: And, but then, you know, like, and they, and that's a little bit of, like, it all goes through Spiderman 3, you know, with the,
[SPEAKER_01]: like battling decision to make sand and like the actual killer of Uncle Ben or whatever, but it, you know, like that's a thing that he wrestles with there.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so I like that, that's an explicit thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: But then yeah, you see like, I think that we maybe, we talked about this not that long ago and I came over with the context was, but
[SPEAKER_01]: I am so grateful for what they did with Willandefoe in no way home because I still think his green goblin was really fun in the first Spider-Man.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's so like can't be and kind of like Jack Nichols and Joker ask.
[SPEAKER_01]: The, like you don't get the, it's personal, you know, because he attacks Aunt Ma and puts her in the hospital.
[SPEAKER_01]: He tries to kill Mary Jane.
[SPEAKER_00]: But you get, like, he is actually frightening and no way home, because you see, Spider-Man as a trilogy has the best villains by a long shot, by a long shot when you talk about the, like, you think about, like, the other really good trilogies, like Tony's got, you know,
[SPEAKER_00]: extremists like that, you know, okay, you know, like Captain America, like yeah, Reds calls fine, but I never feel like I do like I do a vulture.
[SPEAKER_00]: And so like the icing on the cake here is that will him default, default turns into this kind of performance.
[SPEAKER_00]: And yeah, like you said, we kind of realize on this last watch through both of us, he's like the main villain of this, like he's the one that sets this on motion.
[SPEAKER_01]: And he should be, you know, it's like it's the Green Goblin, that's the Nemesis, and it's the Nemesis because of the, like, I don't know that people viewed Green Goblin that way until one the issue when he, like unmasked Peter and in captures him.
[SPEAKER_01]: And too, when he obviously kills Gwen Stacy, it's a very personal thing, you know, it's not like a, it's not an intuitive match the same way that like very dark grim Batman and the kind of clownish Cartoonie Joker are a good match like the opposites, but it's because of what Norman has done to Peter personally, and I think that.
[SPEAKER_01]: Here, man, it's like, by the end, the way he kills May, the way he kills May despite the fact that like he is the one that May was trying to help the most and he's so cruel about it and then the ending when like you get why he would want to just take him out in that moment and I love that Toby is like his
[SPEAKER_01]: conscience.
[SPEAKER_01]: There.
[SPEAKER_01]: No, not to mention my favorite.
[SPEAKER_00]: Norman's not home, honey.
[SPEAKER_00]: No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no,
[SPEAKER_00]: the hell.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's my favorite part.
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, but also that's body sensing is as good as it is.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's the best spotty sensing we've ever had in any Spider-Man film.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm saying all of them, that's the coolest spotty sense.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like the guy that camera like locks onto him, but everything else is kind of moving and then his face and then just like something's not right.
[SPEAKER_00]: And you're as the viewer like looking around like what's wrong.
[SPEAKER_00]: And other people are like, yeah, you're okay, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, he's like just looking and looking and the Norman's on sabbatical, honey.
[SPEAKER_00]: What the hell?
[SPEAKER_01]: And the the very that very final fight when he's like, but yeah, like he's just he's doing such a crazy, but just like, he's,
[SPEAKER_01]: It is the most like kind of arch form of a villain like that, but I think the faux pulls it off so well and it so earned both by what we get in the first rainy film, but also just what we get in no way home and it really captures something else that we didn't get a lot of time within the rainy film that we see in the comics, which is that
[SPEAKER_01]: that tension where Peter knows that Norman Osborne, the person, is distinct from the like goblin persona and that the one doesn't really understand what the other's doing and so when he gets cured at the end, he actually has no idea what's been going on and so then you're like,
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, it would have been unfair on some level to kill him because he didn't know that he was like the way that they handled that I think is it's so good that I really don't know if they can do anything with the Osborns.
[SPEAKER_00]: See, that's fascinating because I while you're talking was thinking, I don't want this to be a hot take,
[SPEAKER_00]: Just screen time-wise, he's not a massive villain.
[SPEAKER_00]: Meaning like, he doesn't show up until a good, what, probably 30 minutes in the movie.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then he's kind of good and you don't real like, he's not the main villain in that like, I don't think they can bring Mysterio back.
[SPEAKER_00]: Because Mysterio, we saw the whole thing, he's there, the whole movie, he dies.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think at that point, that's just cheap.
[SPEAKER_00]: Vulture has the same kind of gravitas, but you can explain it because he's just been in jail like he gets broken out and maybe wants to fight with Peter or something you could do or he's I mean he's forgotten that he knows his identity so you you could have him just acting as a villain that's true have to but I do wonder with the foe specifically if the green goblin it's a perfect balance to me because it is the villain and he does such an amazing such an amazing job
[SPEAKER_00]: But it's in the movies like a small enough amount of time that I wonder if you could do the opposite way to said, like could you now introduce the 616 version of Norman slowly and have Peter B maybe a little bit anxious about that relationship from the gecko?
[SPEAKER_00]: But, you know, he's actually really nice and really helps me for a long time for two movies worth until the end of it or whatever.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I'm not saying the reason I said it's not a hot take is because I'm also with you.
[SPEAKER_00]: Defoe is so much that character now that it could be kind of strange to have a different green goblin.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not sure anyone would play it as well.
[SPEAKER_00]: But it also would be strange to have him do green goblin again with Tom Holland, you know.
[SPEAKER_01]: So yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: I the way they could do it if they if they want that and again, I just don't know that they there are so many different corners of the spider-man stuff to explore like we've said.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: But, you know, they do have the hop gobblin' available as something that has not been adapted on the on the big screen and I don't think that should be Ned, but I think that you could say that, you know, the tech from Norman, from whenever he came over is still
[SPEAKER_01]: they're somewhere like people see the like there's footage, you know, from the, uh, like from happy's apartment when James is there.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like you could imagine somebody stumbling upon that or trying to recreate that and them doing it that way and just taking a different approach.
[SPEAKER_01]: But then yeah, you don't get the Osborne family dynamics.
[SPEAKER_00]: So on that note, perfect closing thought.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, we're left with Peter.
[SPEAKER_00]: He loses Aunt May.
[SPEAKER_00]: Obviously, I have one knows this.
[SPEAKER_00]: His identity is now gone.
[SPEAKER_00]: Dr.
[SPEAKER_00]: Strange cast the spell that even Dr.
[SPEAKER_00]: Strange doesn't remember who he is.
[SPEAKER_00]: Peter decides not to reveal himself to MJ and Ned.
[SPEAKER_00]: Aunt May is gone.
[SPEAKER_00]: even though he promised that he would even though he promised he would and there's an interesting thing from the press circuit that he's on right now is that Tom Holland and I don't know if this was a mistake but he said that nobody remembers who he is except for one person
[SPEAKER_00]: That's what he said in the press circuit.
[SPEAKER_00]: And so I've been thinking about what does that mean who could that be?
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, who would know why would they know?
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, would, you know?
[SPEAKER_00]: So that's interesting thing to think about.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm also thinking about, you know, we talk with the Avengers, like how Thanos was a big bad that we built to.
[SPEAKER_00]: But that probably in comics, one of the biggest big bads is
[SPEAKER_00]: like the incursions and that kind of stuff that Dr. Doom being mixed in that.
[SPEAKER_00]: And we've had the discussion once the war is done, where can they go from there?
[SPEAKER_00]: What's another comic that they can pull from?
[SPEAKER_00]: It's even bigger to top that or whatever.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think about that, and I pose this question to you from a Spider-Man perspective.
[SPEAKER_00]: So within the Spider-Man realm, what is the big bad that we can go to?
[SPEAKER_00]: Because it looks like in brand new day, we're gonna do scorpion, maybe even tombstone, and a few of these others almost as like a montagey thing, like I don't think the whole movie is gonna be him versus scorpion.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's not like he's trying to stop scorpion.
[SPEAKER_00]: is the big bad, just we're working towards a sinister six, a true like Spider-Man video game, you know, like Doc Ock, a lead doesn't to be Doc Ock in this, but a sinister six, that's actually really tough for Peter, who have we not done, you know, in the second game, they do crave and really well, and that's not a character I would have thought,
[SPEAKER_00]: Could carry the gravitas that it does in the game.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, I know the movie is really mixed results there at best, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: But that's an example of like, okay, that's maybe a character that you wouldn't think of as like a big bad or like an ultimate finishing place for him.
[SPEAKER_00]: But it did work really, really well in the game, but also it works in the game is, you know what I'm saying?
[SPEAKER_00]: Is like, I do wonder for ultimately heading toward if it has to be something like Green Goblin or Vennum.
[SPEAKER_00]: Black suit venom.
[SPEAKER_00]: Not for this movie, but I'm saying like what else does a comic fan is out there that you go while we haven't seen that yet I mean, I think when you look at it by You know by decade
[SPEAKER_01]: So much of the DNA of Spider-Man comes from that Stanley Steve Dicco era, like the first 38 issues.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I always thought it was interesting that if you look at no way home, which is collecting all the villains from all the live action movies.
[SPEAKER_01]: uh, except for Venom.
[SPEAKER_01]: You are essentially every one of those is from the Ditto era.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think that that that that seems by design because that is so much the vibe like that just take the high school version.
[SPEAKER_00]: Goblin Electro Sandman Lizard.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, uh, we've done culture,
[SPEAKER_00]: Mysterio.
[SPEAKER_01]: Those are, yeah, all of those are early, you know, in the first, I think 10, 12 issues of amazing Spider-Man.
[SPEAKER_01]: The only, where Chris would drive and be early, comic.
[SPEAKER_01]: Graven would be early.
[SPEAKER_01]: The only one that is not Dick Cohen, it's still from early in the Ramita around the followed.
[SPEAKER_01]: But shock or incoming is the only villain that is not specifically confined to the
[SPEAKER_01]: And so you kind of see like that's the most of the villains, like the famous villains are from that initial period.
[SPEAKER_00]: Mm-hmm.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then the meat are run.
[SPEAKER_00]: What a job they did, by the way.
[SPEAKER_00]: Come on.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know what all that junk in 1962.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's insane.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's really well done.
[SPEAKER_00]: Bravo.
[SPEAKER_01]: And a lot of that, I think Steve Dicco has to get credit for it, because the care is not answered.
[SPEAKER_00]: I said that.
[SPEAKER_01]: No, no, no, no, but I'm saying like the fact that he was like turning out like the green goblin and Mysterio and just these like wacky looking people, but I think Ramita, you have people like the Kingpin introduced the take center stage and that's something we've talked about like that's a character that we haven't seen in the Spider-Man in the live action
[SPEAKER_01]: Beyond that, there aren't a ton of like you have shocker.
[SPEAKER_01]: You have, I think Tombstone is the Romita era.
[SPEAKER_01]: But it's mostly like, you see a little bit more realistic, less like super colorful, like, Mysterio Green Goblin, Doc Ock type folks.
[SPEAKER_01]: Although those characters are obviously used again in the Romita era, which culminates with,
[SPEAKER_01]: the death of Gwen Stacy, but I would say like, yes, what is in them.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's the big one.
[SPEAKER_01]: So the like 80s leading into the 90s is the the next big development for the the Spider-Man mythos and I think that you're right, but I think that it needs to be handled
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's that's obvious.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not saying that, I'm not saying they should rush and do the anything, I just, no, I don't think you might.
[SPEAKER_00]: There aren't that many others out there.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, well, and now they, it wouldn't have, it works better now because he's in a position where he,
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, he's, I think this whole next trilogy, I want it to be about him really, really closely guarding his identity because of how badly things turned out last time.
[SPEAKER_00]: You'll be pretty disappointed if it's revealed early on.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, at least if it gets out to more people than just, like, I mean, if he tells
[SPEAKER_01]: has this level of like his spider sense doesn't work on Venom, like Venom knows everything about Peter because the he was wearing the alien suit.
[SPEAKER_01]: So he knows his identity, he knows like how to get to like all of the people that he cares about.
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's just this heightened level of like, oh man, like this guy is he has all of Spiderman's powers basically, but stronger.
[SPEAKER_01]: and Spider-Man can't even like, since him coming or the danger the way he would, everybody else.
[SPEAKER_01]: So you really, like they create this heightened feeling of like anxiety.
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's not something that I think came through in the Ramey version and I would like to see them like really build that and the ground works there.
[SPEAKER_01]: Beyond that, you have like the 90s famous clone saga stuff, which we haven't talked that much about, but I already know that is.
[SPEAKER_01]: you have a clone of Spider-Man show up and it is this whole messy thing that at some point they may try to play with but would probably be advised and then there's some of the spider verse type stuff that is not necessarily multiverse oriented but there are some like more
[SPEAKER_01]: This is an interesting one because there's a villain called Moreland who is probably one of the bigger inclusions, uh, like in the spider and mythos of the last couple decades.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's sort of a weird villain that's kind of more mystically oriented and I would say.
[SPEAKER_01]: the introduction of that of that villain is when my favorite Spider-Man comics ever it's so well done okay everything since then when they've included them why not like but that doesn't mean you know like sure that's just I think that when other writers have dealt with that they've taken it in down the kind of multiversal path in a way that I don't love and I don't think they'll do that because of how much we've done with that in the spider verse.
[SPEAKER_01]: And the reason why that could come into play, weirdly is because it is directly linked to that, the other, the storyline that brand new days seems to be adapting in part.
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_01]: But the idea there is he basically, he's sort of like a vampiric type guy that's like,
[SPEAKER_01]: sort of impossible to beat and wants to drain the, he would like drain the life force out of Spider-Man, and there's this, uh, some really great, like Spider-Man on the ropes, seems there.
[SPEAKER_01]: But I think venom is the big, venom is the big one.
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, if we don't do the green goblin or, you know, you've got like some of the stuff you're familiar with from the games, like if you want to go the, the Mr.
[SPEAKER_01]: Negative route.
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yeah, I didn't even bring Martin Leap.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, they really tie Martin lead to miles in the second game.
[SPEAKER_00]: So that'll be interesting if they were to change that.
[SPEAKER_01]: And again, Hop Goblin is a fairly big Spider-Man villain that has been touched.
[SPEAKER_01]: And it does feel like that's a way to to deal with that.
[SPEAKER_00]: So as we as in Craven, as we usher in brand new day, hopefully this has helped set your mind because
[SPEAKER_00]: We on this podcast believe that the homecoming trilogy was a perfect look at Spider-Man becoming Spider-Man and not becoming Tony Stark and hopefully we made an argument for that.
[SPEAKER_00]: But now we have said so many times on this podcast.
[SPEAKER_00]: you can go find this in other episodes.
[SPEAKER_00]: I probably other 30 other episodes.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now we are really putting a lot of hopes in this movie to take the next step.
[SPEAKER_00]: So this is where I think both of us want a darker and older, more mature, Peter, Peter who's wrestling with less of the high school things, we now have a chance to go back to Peter,
[SPEAKER_00]: has his identity hidden.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a secret.
[SPEAKER_00]: He doesn't have a lot of money.
[SPEAKER_00]: He doesn't have Tony Stark to fall back on.
[SPEAKER_00]: He doesn't even have it made of fall back on and his friends aren't there either.
[SPEAKER_00]: So what is he going to do?
[SPEAKER_00]: How is he going to respond?
[SPEAKER_00]: That is where I'm so excited for this film and I really hope that it doesn't just turn into he responds by telling net an MJ and it's like the high school crew is back together and they're hanging out.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's like
[SPEAKER_00]: That's the wrong step.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not saying they can't be in the movie, but I'm ready to see the next level of what Peter looks like.
[SPEAKER_00]: And what does that mean for Peter now with the Punisher and Bruce?
[SPEAKER_00]: Like you said, does Bruce, no Peter is Spider-Man?
[SPEAKER_00]: Does Frank, and if not, who does Frank think this interaction is with?
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, his Frank trying to figure out who this kid is, then.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's behind this mask.
[SPEAKER_00]: And what does that look like?
[SPEAKER_00]: And then how does,
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, some of these other reported castings, how does that look?
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, what is Yelena's role in this if she shows up or when she shows up?
[SPEAKER_00]: What is, say, the sink roll?
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, is that gonna be the beginning of the mutations and the X-Men?
[SPEAKER_00]: Although we've gotten a few shoutouts before, like Miss Marvel and things like that?
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: So there's still a lot of question marks.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then on top of all that, is Daredevil involved at all?
[SPEAKER_00]: Why is the hand around?
[SPEAKER_00]: All things that I feel like the table is now set for, because of this original trilogy, plus the two, Marcus and McPhilly addition.
[SPEAKER_00]: So really exciting times.
[SPEAKER_00]: Thanks for going through this with me, Rob.
[SPEAKER_01]: man, it does, uh, these always get me so pumped.
[SPEAKER_01]: I, you know, it's, it's just, uh, I love reading the stuff about how it's broken on these records with trailer stuff and with, with, with early ticket sales.
[SPEAKER_01]: No way home was such a moment.
[SPEAKER_01]: And,
[SPEAKER_01]: people were so happy about the ending of it.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I love that it looks like everything I've read, they seem to really understand how much people were happy about the ending of it and they have wanted to make sure to honor that.
[SPEAKER_01]: So it feels like, man, I mean,
[SPEAKER_01]: It is the first time we've ever gotten a fourth installment in any live-action Spider-Man series, but also as I was thinking about this the other day, this is the longest I think we've ever gone between Spider-Man movies.
[SPEAKER_00]: Right, it's both hand.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's been doing it for a long time.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's now only the second MCU character get four, right, with Thor being the other.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, true.
[SPEAKER_00]: But unlike Thor, although that's not been a few years, it's been a while for Spider-Man, you know.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah, I'd be maybe it's worth noting that there were a couple tiny, tiny references in the Daredevil series, you know, a guy who swings around with webs, so like yeah he has been doing some stuff according to Daredevil.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's gonna be really fun to see.
[SPEAKER_00]: I hope that everyone has the best next 15 to 20 days.
[SPEAKER_00]: With all of the stuff we're gonna be doing here, please follow us on social media, please subscribe to this podcast, share it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, let's be doing this together.
[SPEAKER_00]: We have a Discord channel.
[SPEAKER_00]: There are so many ways to involve friends from work plus outlets to contact us, et cetera.
[SPEAKER_00]: You've heard all of those things before, but more than anything,
[SPEAKER_00]: I always say it's we only get this one time you're only gonna get a brand new day doing one time So enjoy Comic Con and all the news that comes out of it last year Marvel Studios didn't have a big plan and now they do So enjoy this era we're in like the excitement for this movie I just rewatched a couple scenes from fantastic for like we're in a good era right now
[SPEAKER_00]: Enjoy this, enjoy Comic Con, and then really please just try to have a great time during brand new day.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's going to be so much fun to talk about for the next three weeks still, four weeks or whatever.
[SPEAKER_00]: And as we break it down after we've seen it, too.
[SPEAKER_00]: So thanks for joining us.
[SPEAKER_00]: Go ahead.
[SPEAKER_01]: Don't forget to wear your shirt, your your your special brand new day, friends from Workshire when you go.
[SPEAKER_01]: Those are my favorite photos when we, uh, when get those in everyone's decked out.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't even know if we still are going to have pre-orders
[SPEAKER_00]: Love you guys.
[SPEAKER_00]: Listen to what Robbie says he's smart.
[SPEAKER_00]: We'll see you next time here.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'll see you next time.