[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, well, I'm going to drink in Rose's kids Tuesday morning show a year.
[SPEAKER_03]: You guys said you wanted the mornings, we're giving you the mornings here, all right?
[SPEAKER_03]: We work for you guys, Anthony, we got on the show today.
[SPEAKER_04]: Have Ryan.
[SPEAKER_04]: Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mauro Mau
[SPEAKER_05]: And no, it was a gift actually from someone who like my work.
[SPEAKER_05]: It was made out of wood by a veteran.
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, okay.
[SPEAKER_03]: I was just making sure it wasn't made by Jesus.
[SPEAKER_03]: It was cool.
[SPEAKER_03]: Jesus.
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, man.
[SPEAKER_03]: God.
[SPEAKER_03]: Are you dealing with that, too?
[SPEAKER_03]: The same way that other people are.
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, God.
[SPEAKER_03]: More.
[SPEAKER_05]: I learned I was Jewish about 50 times this week.
[SPEAKER_05]: Are you by the way?
[SPEAKER_05]: Are you really Jewish?
[SPEAKER_05]: According to the DNA test, I might be like three or four percent, but also might be like two or three percent Arab.
[SPEAKER_05]: So, you know, that makes me very fair and balanced guy.
[SPEAKER_04]: So there's two wolves inside of you.
[SPEAKER_04]: One of them wants to pick up pennies off the ground and the other one wants to blow themselves up.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, and hopefully they never collide, brother, you know?
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, no, I think I can feel them cladding my brain every single day.
[SPEAKER_03]: Uh, so look, man, we're, we've been trying to figure this out here for the past let's call it eight months total somewhere in that, that neighborhood here about this, uh, disinformation attack, uh, that is coming from some influencers, pondcasters, uh, people on shweter,
[SPEAKER_03]: I live in the camp and until Dan this where it felt like the same 8 or 9 people were getting paid at the same exact time, but where this is coming from and why I can't really figure that out because it was Jews Jews Jews and then suddenly the guy who started Jews Jews Nick Funtis.
[SPEAKER_04]: posted a retracting statement that was pretty shocking his followers were pissed off I think it was a clarifying statement that a lot of people are Fulish it when they just talk about Jews and or Israel and don't talk about China and Russia and so on right But he's one of them then
[SPEAKER_04]: So, yeah, yeah, I mean, how much time he's dedicated for the last four years talking about Russia or China?
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, and so by the way, now that he said, hey, the Jew thing was off, everybody was off, and everybody was grifting, take a money on the shit.
[SPEAKER_03]: We were always on the right side of history this.
[SPEAKER_03]: What we really tried to figure out was who was paying these people?
[SPEAKER_03]: Um, because again, I'll go back to that eight or nine and I'll all list them personally and I think Candice is on that list Tucker Carlson's on that list Alex Jones is on that list, uh, and then let's call it five others that are popular, but maybe a little bit fringe.
[SPEAKER_03]: Um, where did this start and who was paying for this if you think they were being paid for?
[SPEAKER_03]: Maybe they weren't and they all just believe the same thing and they were chasing clicks and likes at the same time.
[SPEAKER_05]: There's always the possibility of these deals that go on that you don't know about, but if they don't know about them, then I can't alleged them, but what I can tell you is that those direct payments that we know about from like the Cold War era, don't really have to take place anymore, especially if the people are rich anyway.
[SPEAKER_05]: So it's kind of like a war of ecosystems.
[SPEAKER_05]: So there's two avenues at Russia, and really any foreign government doesn't like us can do this.
[SPEAKER_05]: The first is you just invade the ecosystem
[SPEAKER_05]: So you're supposed to lead your audience, but ends up being the audience lead you because you need them and they become your source of information and your social ties and everything else.
[SPEAKER_05]: So the Russia-aligned ecosystem becomes your ecosystem on social media and then it just kind of naturally wraps people up into it.
[SPEAKER_05]: That's one way of doing it.
[SPEAKER_05]: The more nefarious way of doing that is
[SPEAKER_05]: Like everybody kind of knows this happening, even though you can't really prove it.
[SPEAKER_05]: 100% is that these bots that everybody sees are very obviously bots because they have two followers and they all insult you at the same time in the same way.
[SPEAKER_05]: Well, one of the reasons for that aside from being a side-off is that the more your engagement goes up, the more money you make.
[SPEAKER_05]: So if I am working for China or Russia, I would look at influencers when they say something that I like or talk about a topic that I like.
[SPEAKER_05]: Unleash the bots not just to defend them and give them the the dopamine hits of people complimenting them, but now they make more money and it's not even your own money.
[SPEAKER_05]: It's X's money.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, it's this makes so much more sense to me now.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay, so what you're saying is
[SPEAKER_03]: It may might not be somebody behind the curtain like a wizard of Oz, writing a check.
[SPEAKER_03]: You're saying they're just unleashing their bots towards that specific person or topic, jamming it up to the top, and then they're generating money on their own, just based off of X and then the other stuff.
[SPEAKER_04]: I think it's the topic and not the account.
[SPEAKER_04]: I think it's the worst stuff because because then you can't trace that.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, it's financial.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I've looked at it.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, exactly.
[SPEAKER_04]: I mean, I've looked at smart.
[SPEAKER_04]: Jesus Christ, man.
[SPEAKER_04]: NCRI did a pretty decent report on this.
[SPEAKER_04]: They made some errors that my guy, another agency.
[SPEAKER_04]: that has more access than they do, player-fied, but they were right about a lot.
[SPEAKER_04]: They were right about the astroturfing of keywords for sure, and certain accounts.
[SPEAKER_04]: Fuente as account was not one of them on my list.
[SPEAKER_04]: I had six major accounts looked at, and all of them were astroturfed directly except for his.
[SPEAKER_04]: Okay, his was primarily, it was like 15%.
[SPEAKER_04]: But that's compared to the other ones that are like 60, 70.
[SPEAKER_04]: It wasn't that big a deal.
[SPEAKER_04]: But...
[SPEAKER_05]: like hand this is a big one, like you didn't even say something positive negative and it's like they just want her in the mix, they'll reward you, actually even to get criticize her, you're kind of rewarded because having the bots come after you could even elevate you if she's going back and forth and there's like a fight about whatever you said.
[SPEAKER_05]: But that goes to the whole, they also want to poison our civil society at the same time.
[SPEAKER_05]: So there's a few different objectives here because the Russians in the one instance where they're actually correct is that they said the weak point of America is it's civil society.
[SPEAKER_05]: So if you fill it with poison, basically you fill with disinformation and hatred and racism, you just make it so that people can't be constructive, what you'll have happen is tribalism will increase and systems will just kind of fall apart.
[SPEAKER_05]: You hear this a lot now.
[SPEAKER_05]: It'll be like, well, I can't tell what's true.
[SPEAKER_05]: I can't tell what's false.
[SPEAKER_05]: So I'm just going to triple down on what I think is true or I'm just not going to pay attention at all.
[SPEAKER_05]: And that's all very good for adversaries of the US.
[SPEAKER_05]: That actually wanted to destroy us.
[SPEAKER_05]: Like that's like if I got a choose between an enemy that can control social media, or has like a small arsenal of nukes and they're going to use them, I think I would take them out and prefer the guy with the nukes.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I'm looking at a picture of Candace Owens and Russia right here now.
[SPEAKER_05]: That's her straight husband, I think, um, right right.
[SPEAKER_03]: Very very very straight.
[SPEAKER_04]: So the the.
[SPEAKER_04]: to Ryan's point about the astroturfing thing.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, like an account like Candace, that is, it's only to rile people up.
[SPEAKER_04]: That's her entire agenda.
[SPEAKER_04]: You asked her to turf the entire account.
[SPEAKER_04]: For somebody like Fuentes, who bounces around from thing to thing, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: Like he changed his mind five or six times.
[SPEAKER_04]: I'm gonna vote for Democrats.
[SPEAKER_04]: Oh, if you vote for Democrats, you're a fucking traitor.
[SPEAKER_04]: All within the same month.
[SPEAKER_04]: You can't ask her to earth that account.
[SPEAKER_04]: right because we can do you get mixed messages which which by the way in Russian propaganda mixed messages mixed messages isn't always bad because you do you do want some confusion it's not about one side or the other winning it's about what he said poisoning the well but
[SPEAKER_04]: you would be better off going after true believers like her, people that are fucking crazy.
[SPEAKER_04]: Nick Fuentes is not crazy, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: He's not, she don't know.
[SPEAKER_04]: She is, she is, he's very smart.
[SPEAKER_04]: She is crazy and very dumb.
[SPEAKER_04]: She cannot pronounce words, not that you're dumb.
[SPEAKER_04]: No, I'm a cheat.
[SPEAKER_04]: No, she can't pronounce.
[SPEAKER_04]: She can't pronounce the word anecdot.
[SPEAKER_04]: So, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh.
[SPEAKER_05]: He and Carol lots, is the best one.
[SPEAKER_04]: No, it's so good.
[SPEAKER_04]: Aaron Carol's a moron, like all the, a lot of these people, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: I just absolutely idiots.
[SPEAKER_04]: And more importantly, crazy, true believer people.
[SPEAKER_04]: Tucker Carlson's a true believer, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: Like once he commits to an idea, he fucking, it's his world view and you can't, there's nothing you can say to change his mind.
[SPEAKER_04]: Fuentes isn't like that.
[SPEAKER_04]: I'm not saying he's a good dude.
[SPEAKER_04]: I'm just saying he's a different dude.
[SPEAKER_04]: But there's a couple of,
[SPEAKER_04]: The thing that we're talking about today is a Russian influence operation, which to be fair has been going on domestically in Russia since the 1880s, during Zars Russia when they saw the oncoming wave of Bolsheviks, which people think for some reason was a Jewish movement, despite the fact that 10% of the Bolsheviks were Jewish, it's an odd thing to say, I guess.
[SPEAKER_04]: Maybe you're not good at math.
[SPEAKER_04]: Maybe you should hire some Asians to do your hate for you.
[SPEAKER_04]: We're getting everybody involved today.
[SPEAKER_03]: No, but like, because I understand this and if you keep hammering the same thing in the likes keep going up and up and up, but then you're never really talking about anything different other than that.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, and it's, it's, if you followed my series on rhetorical persuasion, you'll understand this, what a, what a sealed system of ideas is, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: Think of a cult.
[SPEAKER_04]: There's a response to every new piece of evidence.
[SPEAKER_04]: that conforms that piece of evidence to the theory, no matter what it is, it's unfalseifiable.
[SPEAKER_04]: There's no way to falsify it.
[SPEAKER_04]: And an unfalseifiable statement is garbage.
[SPEAKER_04]: That's nothing, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: Like an empirical claim about the universe can be proven right or wrong.
[SPEAKER_04]: Anything else is just your opinion.
[SPEAKER_04]: And as Aristotle said, if you cannot produce a syllogism,
[SPEAKER_04]: to explain why you believe the thing you believe, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: If you can't tell me why you believe it, then you don't, or tell me why, yeah, you believe it, you don't know it.
[SPEAKER_04]: That's the difference, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: That's just a belief that you have.
[SPEAKER_04]: Now on this one, there's a couple of key points that I wanna hit here.
[SPEAKER_04]: Because this is the Russian's in general have been very good at influence operations since Xars Russia.
[SPEAKER_04]: And it continued over into Soviet Russia.
[SPEAKER_04]: And it's that whatever we call this post-Soviet, news like I guess, new Xars Russia Putin wants to be Peter the Great, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: That's what he wants to do.
[SPEAKER_04]: There are these, there's this continuous line of influence operations over the years, but they've taken some pretty decent turns, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: So one of the things that I think is always present in these influence operations, I'll get your opinion on this, is that it doesn't require a winning agent.
[SPEAKER_04]: They actually title it useful idiot, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: That's what the Russian influence operations of the Cold War called it, useful idiot.
[SPEAKER_04]: Translation is a product.
[SPEAKER_04]: Russia invites personalities like Candace Owens and Tucker Carlson and be like, oh, everything you've been told about this is a lie.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's like that movie the interview where James Franco was like, oh, they got food and they're grocery stores and it turns out to be fucking cardboard cutouts, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: It's this is now an updated version of the Soviet playbook, but with Zars Russia propaganda, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: They're in the Soviet area,
[SPEAKER_04]: every aspect of a foreign visitor's trip, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: As, I mean, of course, same thing that North Korea would do.
[SPEAKER_04]: And the strategic objective is perception.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's not personal, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: They're not trying to uplift Candace, they're not trying to uplift any of this stuff.
[SPEAKER_04]: They're not trying to get her or Tucker to move to Moscow or Jackson Hinkle who, by the way, lives there now.
[SPEAKER_04]: They doubt they want it there, but they didn't want him to move to Moscow on this this year.
[SPEAKER_04]: What they wanted,
[SPEAKER_04]: was to bring them there, use them for propaganda and then send them back to be their fucking propaganda agent.
[SPEAKER_04]: And the final part of it that's always present with them is the and you part.
[SPEAKER_04]: Or near Americans, amplifying grievance content are the delivery mechanism, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: So they weaponize our nihilism.
[SPEAKER_04]: They say things like America was fatally wounded in 1913 when the 17th Amendment and so on and so forth, and we'll never ever recover from it.
[SPEAKER_04]: Let me be really clear about this.
[SPEAKER_04]: Let me really clear about this.
[SPEAKER_04]: Believing, not being able to fix something right now today and without some significant struggle, if you believe that means the Republic is broken, you have betrayed a deep misunderstanding of our Republic because everything is a heavy lift here.
[SPEAKER_04]: On purpose, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: The friction is by design, it's to keep wild swings from happening.
[SPEAKER_04]: The fact that even if you believe that theory, the fact that it took 110 years,
[SPEAKER_04]: for it to get to the point that it's at today shows the durability of our constitutional system, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: So they weaponize nihilism because they learn from Marx and Engel making these predictions about agrarian societies not being ready for communism and industrial cities turning to them because too many people got too rich.
[SPEAKER_04]: They were completely wrong about it, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: Completely wrong about it.
[SPEAKER_04]: So they have to weaponize nihilism.
[SPEAKER_04]: They have to say that somebody's fucking with you.
[SPEAKER_04]: and there's no hope for you.
[SPEAKER_04]: So the only hope you have is to overturn this entire system.
[SPEAKER_03]: Which is what it feels like is going on in America with a socialist movement on the Democrat side.
[SPEAKER_03]: All of these young people feel like, hey, this is hopeless.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'll never own a house.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'll never do this.
[SPEAKER_03]: So fuck it.
[SPEAKER_03]: I got to go to this other party.
[SPEAKER_03]: And to that point, if that is indeed what Russia is doing and China is doing,
[SPEAKER_03]: It's working.
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, there are candidates who are winning in all these cities, so there's nothing you can do.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's not just on the left though.
[SPEAKER_03]: I know.
[SPEAKER_04]: I know.
[SPEAKER_04]: Right.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's the people who are pretend right.
[SPEAKER_04]: Uh-huh.
[SPEAKER_04]: So one of the things that Russia also did, and I'm going to turn it over to Ryan to discuss more this now.
[SPEAKER_04]: But one of the things that Russia did a very good job of is presenting this fake ass.
[SPEAKER_04]: socially conservative socialism, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: Like, oh, we go to church and we do this and we do that.
[SPEAKER_04]: We don't fucking like gay people.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's like, all right, that's cool, but you're communists, so fuck off, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: But that, that, you're communists, so fuck off part, fell completely off the table for a lot of these people, especially the morons who think they're the new media on social media.
[SPEAKER_04]: These are very dumb people who are all unwitting agents.
[SPEAKER_04]: You think they don't know?
[SPEAKER_04]: I know, I think they're completely fucking brainwash.
[SPEAKER_04]: So let's talk about this progression and the latest, let's call it the newsarm movement, right, or whatever, whatever you want to call it.
[SPEAKER_04]: But walk us through the pastes of this, including Doug and all these other assholes.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, sure.
[SPEAKER_05]: So, the newest thing, and I'll explain why this fits into the broader strategy, they are trying to get especially Americans to move to Russia now.
[SPEAKER_05]: That's a very heavy amount of propaganda put in there, and that's part of the reason for Canada's trip there was to advertise Russia, and say, basically, it's just as comfortable there as being in the U.S., except you don't have to deal with the woke.
[SPEAKER_05]: Um, and I also believe because I found a lot of evidence I haven't released on X yet.
[SPEAKER_05]: Um, I released on my podcast, but not on that yet.
[SPEAKER_05]: Uh, she was meeting with the people who handle Americans moving to Russia.
[SPEAKER_05]: Um, and that lines up with like this really started kicking up after her lawsuits.
[SPEAKER_05]: So if you want to hide your assets, you feel like you're going to lose everything, Russia will exploit that and welcome you there.
[SPEAKER_05]: What a lot of people do is they'll put their assets in Dubai, sort of like Andrew Tate will, who is friends with Kansas, but then you can get political, safe harbor in Russia, and so they're actually trying to build a community of so-called Christian conservatives, you know, from
[SPEAKER_05]: And what the hope is is that someone like Candace will bring her audience into the overall Russian, the lime ecosystem.
[SPEAKER_05]: So you tune her into your show, but then there'll be other shows like RT that that same audience then sticks with her, so then they go over to this new audience.
[SPEAKER_05]: So it's a pretty smart strategy on their part, but that's more of a tactical maneuver.
[SPEAKER_05]: the strategic thing that happened.
[SPEAKER_05]: But I wrote this in this long article for Glenn Beck called the Russian influence operations targeting Candace Owens and you, so people understood it's not really about her.
[SPEAKER_05]: In 1987, they actually put together a team the Soviets did, and they said, well, everyone's realizing communism sucks, so we better figure this out.
[SPEAKER_05]: And they put together a team with heavy resources and what they concluded was that they needed to reinvent communism by keeping the central core of it But then mixing it with nationalism and then Orthodox Christianity meaning the Russian Orthodox Church
[SPEAKER_05]: Um, and so use that as an engine to promote this new Zaris Christianity, the idea that uh, if you want Christian values, traditional values to survive, well, they can't survive in a free society anymore.
[SPEAKER_05]: So if you believe in your faith before your country, before the constitution, well, then you need to accept a little bit of dictatorship.
[SPEAKER_05]: and then suddenly Putin is the big savior of Christianity.
[SPEAKER_05]: So that was a strategic move that goes back to 1987 before Putin was even in power.
[SPEAKER_05]: And then it was in 1997 that this guy Alexander Dugin, who people dismissed as a philosopher, but he's much more than that.
[SPEAKER_05]: He is connected to Russian intelligence.
[SPEAKER_05]: Um, he put out a book that became famous in Russia and people didn't hear about it until now, uh, where he outlined their ideology called your region is them, um, that linked up with this and it's really kind of weird, but the, but the big point was just quote, where he said, we need to just inflame all of the,
[SPEAKER_05]: negative.
[SPEAKER_05]: I guess you can say even sinful tendencies within the United States or rips itself apart because they think the whole melting pot idea is crap.
[SPEAKER_05]: So for them they see they see that as just garbage, so then they need to
[SPEAKER_05]: exposed that and then that it's garbage and so have all the different social groups ethnicities had just everyone just ripped each other apart and then that's how you'll defeat the US and he actually specifically said we need to shift now and go after the isolationist strain and empower that within right wing Republican circles that that was his terminology that was like tonight seven I first learned of this in like 2002 2003 and I thought this guy's not presentable he's I don't think he comes off smart
[SPEAKER_05]: I was like, this isn't going to go anywhere.
[SPEAKER_05]: He's going to have to find someone to teach.
[SPEAKER_05]: And then so now I'm like in this surreal universe where somehow this guy who should not be popular is friends with people like Tucker, Candace owns two of his books and he's like this real popular guy.
[SPEAKER_05]: So I still kind of suspect there's something going on behind the scenes because
[SPEAKER_05]: how they even know who this guy is, why they reach out to him, what happens when they reach out to him that makes them friends?
[SPEAKER_05]: Like, what's the base of that friendship?
[SPEAKER_05]: Because he's a weird guy.
[SPEAKER_05]: It's not like he's funny or like there's like, what's it tracking about this guy?
[SPEAKER_05]: I don't get it.
[SPEAKER_05]: Is he rich?
[SPEAKER_05]: I don't get it.
[SPEAKER_04]: Is he rich?
[SPEAKER_04]: I mean, he might be getting funded by Russia, but he's he's colloquially referred to in.
[SPEAKER_04]: Soviet, and Soviet in, new Russia as Putin's brain, that's how people were for it all.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_04]: So it's not like he's some satellite character or anything like that.
[SPEAKER_04]: I'm not saying he's having tea with the guy every morning or anything, which I don't know if Russian didn't even have tea.
[SPEAKER_04]: They seem kind of gay to be so high as soon as they do.
[SPEAKER_04]: I think they might have.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: He's a weirdo.
[SPEAKER_04]: He's not super affable or charming or anything.
[SPEAKER_04]: So it's like why are you striking up?
[SPEAKER_04]: a friendship with a guy like that.
[SPEAKER_04]: I mean, there could be any number of reasons who knows, but it is odd.
[SPEAKER_04]: Hickleball.
[SPEAKER_04]: He doesn't look like he's got a lot of lateral quickness, but you never know.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's deceptive.
[SPEAKER_03]: So with all these people lump in and then together, if you're taking pictures over there, I have a hard time believing you're not getting paid to do so.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'll go back to an interview a few weeks ago that Tucker did with Chris Cuomo and said, hey, how did you get in a Russia?
[SPEAKER_03]: No journalists are allowed in Russia, but you were allowed in Russia and you still are.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's a point that nobody ever brought up during that whole Tucker Carlson thing and the grocery stores are better and life is amazing over here and it's like in all these and all that other stuff.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I never thought about it.
[SPEAKER_03]: So how did Candace and Tucker get access inside of Russia?
[SPEAKER_03]: All right, Dan, did you real quick?
[SPEAKER_03]: We get some sponsors to put the shit wagon on the air.
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[SPEAKER_03]: You're seeing these everywhere, man.
[SPEAKER_03]: They're starting to pop up in convenience stores.
[SPEAKER_03]: They're all over the place.
[SPEAKER_03]: All over America, I'm seeing the meat sticks, the energy drinks, and the bars are now starting to show up now.
[SPEAKER_04]: I saw the meat sticks, they're in sheets.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: Right, that's great.
[SPEAKER_04]: I stopped to get some of the other day.
[SPEAKER_04]: Actually, I was hungry on the way to work in those sheets, on my drive-in, on the right over there.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yep.
[SPEAKER_04]: And I stopped in there, and I was like, I wasn't stopping to get some fucking jerk here.
[SPEAKER_04]: I don't say what I'm saying.
[SPEAKER_04]: Oh, shit.
[SPEAKER_04]: I did a sharp cheddar in there.
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, we're out of it at the office, so I got the same sharp cheddar sheets.
[SPEAKER_03]: I bought it.
[SPEAKER_03]: There's why there's a lot of sheets down here, but I was surprised.
[SPEAKER_03]: That was a, that's any jersey one.
[SPEAKER_03]: But anyways, they're everywhere, man.
[SPEAKER_03]: And they're the best in the biz.
[SPEAKER_03]: You get them in their huge, but the meat sticks are huge, by the way.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's a, it's a great meal replacements or a nice little breakfast to get you started in the day.
[SPEAKER_03]: And one of their sticks isn't actual breakfast sausage, man.
[SPEAKER_03]: If you're looking to start it off right, so do it.
[SPEAKER_03]: Microfactors take those every morning takes the guesswork out of vitamins Big six and it's 30 individual bags one beautiful little box cookie 10s multi vitamins fruits and veggies EFA's in the pro biotics month is over you throw it out your order a new one Protein wise.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's not just meat six.
[SPEAKER_03]: They got those level one bars.
[SPEAKER_03]: We talked about those are everywhere They got about 12 different flavors there cookie dough PB and J Strawberry smash cake carrot cake you name it
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[SPEAKER_03]: prices last few years have been exhausting and uh... man these interest rate strengthening i think they're going to fucking drop real how to meeting yesterday about it
[SPEAKER_03]: TPD five and a half years we're looking at the same interest rates cost the living isn't just high it is exhausting for sure man if you've been leaner on credit guards lately just to cover the basics like groceries gas utility bills you're essentially paying a survival tax of 20 to 30 percent interest on your credit cards sometimes more why keep handing your harder and paycheck to big banks when you could keep it for your family
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[SPEAKER_03]: Last but not least, here today, we got a heart A of Seltzer.com, talking about that store locator from earlier.
[SPEAKER_03]: We got one as well on heart A of Seltzer.com, all right, over the past year, I've been telling you, we've been trying to buy out some of the smaller distributors who we've outgrown and then go back into those states, happy to announce that North Carolina.
[SPEAKER_03]: We'll be the first one on that list.
[SPEAKER_03]: We had shot it with Tennessee for a little bit.
[SPEAKER_03]: There were only, I think that one in our British place was only going to do like eight counties or ten counties or something.
[SPEAKER_03]: North Carolina, we just signed with our age barrenger, which is 45% of the states that is going to open up here in the next 10 to 14 days.
[SPEAKER_03]: Purely in accident, by the way, it's not because we're in North Carolina.
[SPEAKER_03]: It just so happens, there's a little chain deal we have with Circle K and some of the other fun stuff that they wanted and that's how we're open and it up.
[SPEAKER_03]: Other states like Washington kind of require you to have a chain to get in other states and they want it safe away.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't have those connections right now working on it, okay?
[SPEAKER_03]: Working on it, but yeah, we'll be back in the state and with Caroline here in the next 10 to 14 days.
[SPEAKER_03]: So go to the store locator once that launches, find the closest location near the shoe.
[SPEAKER_03]: It'll actually be in the west part of the state.
[SPEAKER_03]: So that's 45% if you draw a line down the thing.
[SPEAKER_03]: Not in Wilmington quite yet.
[SPEAKER_03]: uh... but there is one deal on the table for able to secure it will get the entire state for us and uh... we're super amped about that in the meantime uh... i know we're selling out uh... a lot but we're fucking stocking as fast as we can we're still a small company god damn it's we're still little
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, 12 states right now, expanding to 13 next, but yeah, you can go to the HBs and Texas, just off the top of the dome here, all the total wines down there, total wines in Georgia, two thirds of the circle case in Alabama, all the circle case in Idaho, every Albert Sins in Idaho, I believe all the Albert Sins in Montana, I think.
[SPEAKER_03]: and all those town pumps up there in circle caves, as well.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then Florida, the Florida store locator, they don't operate in the same systems as everybody else.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's in the Tampa area, that's where we reopened, and then we'll expand outwards after that.
[SPEAKER_03]: So really, really hone in on that Tampa area, if you're in Florida, and then stock up and go grab them, college football seasons about to start.
[SPEAKER_03]: So is the NFL, good morning of Seltsor.com.
[SPEAKER_03]: Today, support us, support the show
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, they just gave it to him.
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, at this point, it was already known that they're sympathetic.
[SPEAKER_05]: So that wasn't news to the Russian side.
[SPEAKER_05]: With Candace, she had openly said that if the Russians are, was around today, she would side with an Orthodox Christian Russia.
[SPEAKER_05]: That would be her ideal form of government.
[SPEAKER_05]: And the Russian connected influence operators have been targeting her and actually turning
[SPEAKER_05]: largely on successfully, but with her, I think, successfully all the way back to 2018.
[SPEAKER_05]: Like, most people don't know, like a second after she announced Brexit, Russian intelligence networks, their social media bots and their trolls all started promoting Brexit.
[SPEAKER_05]: And it was a really weird thing where it gets announced and then this guy who is high up in the church of Scientology in London but is also openly strongly connected to the senior levels of the Russian government and to some degree in the Chinese government, his name is John Mappin, is obsessively reaching out to her and saying just like crazy things.
[SPEAKER_05]: You're going to go down history as the biggest freedom fighter of all time.
[SPEAKER_05]: You're freeing not just black minds, but white minds from slavery.
[SPEAKER_05]: Like you're like just
[SPEAKER_05]: Like, and it's the type of thing that a social operator wouldn't do that unless he was a hundred percent confident that it's going to work on that particular person because it's so repulsive that it would make most people say I'm getting a restraining order.
[SPEAKER_05]: But you look at 2018.
[SPEAKER_05]: He's just obsessively tweeting at them, but it's really zeroed in on her.
[SPEAKER_05]: And then around November, 2018, like, really kick some of me.
[SPEAKER_05]: So, you guys need to get involved in foreign policy.
[SPEAKER_05]: I'll help you build the US relationship with Russia.
[SPEAKER_05]: And then also China ran a North Korea, but really Russia.
[SPEAKER_05]: And of course, as Candace tells the story, this is just a good microcosm of like, what to look for and how these things happen.
[SPEAKER_05]: She, according to her story, she just had a spiritual calling to go to London and she didn't know why.
[SPEAKER_05]: And Charlie was, she went, told Charlie, we gotta go.
[SPEAKER_05]: What do you mean turning point you cat?
[SPEAKER_05]: What do you mean London?
[SPEAKER_05]: So she like hates his credit card, books the trip for them and like forces him to go and then what do you know?
[SPEAKER_05]: They arrive and the Scientologist, Russian government connected guy, John Mappin, holds this massive fundraiser like 250 rich people.
[SPEAKER_05]: They launch turning point UK like as soon as they arrive.
[SPEAKER_05]: And then she meets her husband, George Farmer, at that same meeting, and she locks eyes with them, and then realizes that rich guy, he's my husband.
[SPEAKER_05]: And according to his own recollection, he's like, we never kiss that there wasn't even any romance.
[SPEAKER_05]: But 19 days later, I proposed over FaceTime, and she accepted.
[SPEAKER_05]: And then he became the leader for a short period of time of turning point UK.
[SPEAKER_05]: So turning point UK was actually launched.
[SPEAKER_05]: with money and the organization, of a guy at the senior levels of the Russian government and the senior levels of the Church of Scientology with Candice's that later fiancee and husband who then leads it.
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, that to me looks like the takeover, an attempted takeover basically.
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, to try to place someone in turning point on par with Charlie.
[SPEAKER_05]: Which she working with T.P.
[SPEAKER_03]: USA at that point,
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_03]: Gotcha.
[SPEAKER_03]: So this was after the exit from daily wire.
[SPEAKER_05]: Daily wire exit came later.
[SPEAKER_05]: So turning point came first, and then she gets fired or quits whatever along with her husband in the spring of 2019.
[SPEAKER_05]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_05]: She goes to Prager University and then goes to daily wire and she leaves there in I think it's May of 2024.
[SPEAKER_05]: That's when she starts the British eat my prone thing and
[SPEAKER_03]: Because you got to latch on to one thing in order to get the ratings all the time and all that's shit, right?
[SPEAKER_05]: Well, that was a rush and up, too.
[SPEAKER_05]: Most people don't know that.
[SPEAKER_05]: Like, what's the, yeah, yeah.
[SPEAKER_05]: So the network that Russia used to promote Candace and Blacks it when it was announced was previously fine-tuned for promoting anti-france, anti-machrome conspiracy theories.
[SPEAKER_05]: So it was first used for that.
[SPEAKER_05]: which is kind of a weird coincidence.
[SPEAKER_05]: So, they use that same one to then promote Candace.
[SPEAKER_05]: And then years later, the month that she gets fired from Daily Wire, she adopts the Brigitte Macron conspiracy theory that those same networks promote.
[SPEAKER_05]: Like, that's a weird coincidence, but here's
[SPEAKER_05]: So the originator of that is a woman named Natasha Rae.
[SPEAKER_05]: And so the McCrones sued Natasha Rae, and they win.
[SPEAKER_05]: And now it's still going back and forth.
[SPEAKER_05]: They're compesting that and it's in court again because they got overturned.
[SPEAKER_05]: But Natasha Rae then gets picked up by someone else and then Candace picks it up.
[SPEAKER_05]: So that's the origin.
[SPEAKER_05]: So now who's Natasha Rae?
[SPEAKER_05]: She gets sued.
[SPEAKER_05]: and she immediately started praising Putin and the great Christian Russia and how they preserve it.
[SPEAKER_05]: Seeing stuff can't be said and why did she do that?
[SPEAKER_05]: That's part of the application process for political asylum.
[SPEAKER_05]: So Russia literally says, yeah, well, you're being persecuted for standing up for the McCroens and promoting this conspiracy theory about regime being a man.
[SPEAKER_05]: So we'll accept you as a refuge.
[SPEAKER_05]: If you want to come here and she says, yeah, I'm doing that, but then the court goes then sides of there so it's still stuck there.
[SPEAKER_05]: So she has it left yet.
[SPEAKER_05]: But that's part of the reason I said that the evidence is very strong that Candace is looking at going to Russia because what's the most analogous case?
[SPEAKER_05]: The person who invented and first put out there, the Brigitte Macron conspiracy theory, that
[SPEAKER_05]: Candice adopted and is also getting sued for and is almost certainly going to get lose other lawsuits and what the Natasha Redu said, all right, if I'm going to lose these lawsuits, I'm going to Russia and I'm going to say the things are required for Russia to accept me and that what is Candice do shows up in Russia saying the exact same stuff.
[SPEAKER_03]: Or is this just for ratings?
[SPEAKER_04]: So people like that, it probably starts one way in turns into the other.
[SPEAKER_04]: You want to mean?
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, so to your point about, it became obvious she was about to head to Russia.
[SPEAKER_04]: I think a lot of people were talking about that in the week prior to it happening or two weeks, but you were talking about it quite a bit before that.
[SPEAKER_05]: Now, if he announced it and just said it was a family vacation.
[SPEAKER_05]: And then I discovered what the real purpose was before see the left.
[SPEAKER_05]: So it was the rare moment where like first impressions are everything with these influence operations, where myself and the people who helped me, we beat the Russians at their own game because we released the information that she was speaking at this Russian intelligence organized event that has spies crawling all over the place and Jeffrey Epstein and Epstein's Russian assistant used to help
[SPEAKER_05]: She's the one that went to the annual event that Epstein used to help put on.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, it's weird, huh?
[SPEAKER_04]: And you can't just book a flight to a level four advisory country, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: So what does it take?
[SPEAKER_04]: for an American to end up on a Kremlin forum stage who has to sign off on that.
[SPEAKER_04]: That's a good question.
[SPEAKER_04]: I'm curious about that.
[SPEAKER_05]: You know what I'm talking about?
[SPEAKER_05]: I understand he's mostly a Russian thing.
[SPEAKER_05]: Like the US will let you, but you just have to get a visa.
[SPEAKER_05]: And then there's all sorts of stuff.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, they consider us level four advisory countries.
[SPEAKER_04]: Well, that's what I'm saying.
[SPEAKER_04]: So who in Russia sign off on her coming into their country as a journalist come on?
[SPEAKER_04]: I mean, you know, but still, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: Hey, the view is trying to become journalists now.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, they should try really hard.
[SPEAKER_03]: are.
[SPEAKER_03]: They're going up against the FCC right now and it's like, hey, we're a political show.
[SPEAKER_03]: I know, okay.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm with you here, but yeah, who signs off on this stuff?
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I mean, that's a Russian government thing, but the story canous tells that was a family vacation, but she's doing interviews with the Russian press all the time.
[SPEAKER_05]: It's not a family vacation and she's traveling around, but I discovered is that the main company that helps Americans move to Russia and guarantees 100% confidentiality.
[SPEAKER_05]: So you have to go there in person for the opening stages of it.
[SPEAKER_05]: that when she's taking those weird propaganda pictures, the photographer there is part of that company.
[SPEAKER_05]: And so like I'll need to tell you guys, like photographer, journalists, and like travel agent, are like the Russian intelligence cut.
[SPEAKER_05]: The covers for any intelligence service basically is like the classic ones.
[SPEAKER_05]: And so she, of course, didn't tell anybody that the people she was staying within Moscow and traveling with were connected to that company.
[SPEAKER_05]: She also didn't tell people that the event she was speaking at,
[SPEAKER_05]: is probably the most secure part of Russia year round that is outside of an official government building.
[SPEAKER_05]: So if you want to scheme, that's where you go.
[SPEAKER_05]: And then what you know, Andrew Tate and his brother, who openly brag about how they hide assets and stuff, arrived from Dubai.
[SPEAKER_05]: Two same Peter's break at the same time that she's there.
[SPEAKER_05]: And they've never acknowledged that they met or had signs just to coincid in.
[SPEAKER_04]: That's a coincidence.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: So explain what since you brought it up.
[SPEAKER_04]: What the SPIF actually is?
[SPEAKER_04]: Because Merkel and Goldman Sachs and Epstein a bunch of other people used to attend back in the day, but who's who's showing up to that in 2026 what's that look like?
[SPEAKER_05]: Well, they will, in order to make it seem respectable, they'll try to have like foreign diplomats.
[SPEAKER_05]: But of course, this is the best spot for honeypotting operations.
[SPEAKER_05]: It's known that Russian hookers show up all over the place, models, you know, they show up in the local citizens, complain about it when this annual event goes on.
[SPEAKER_05]: But it's the St. Petersburg International Economic Forum, which the name of which, I mean, it totally makes sense like Candace is there, because if you want advice on international investing, I mean, you go to Candace Owens, right?
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, absolutely so.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, so that was an obvious that was just a pretext together there for these private meetings.
[SPEAKER_05]: But according to investigative documents that have leaked out from US investigations of Russian spy operations.
[SPEAKER_05]: They specifically say that one of the key purposes of this event is to have panels and can this spoke for about five minutes on a panel.
[SPEAKER_05]: which is suspicious of itself like oh you're going there just to speak on a five-minute panel like your can to sew and should make a star there just find us but the purpose of the panels actually says they are recruitment pipelines and one of the best well the key objectives is to establish quote media partnerships with foreign influencers.
[SPEAKER_05]: So like I had all the smoking guns ready to go, which is why that post kind of went viral when I found out why she was really going there, and then when she got there and she started, the basically the way she was auditioning and other people auditioned to go to Russia.
[SPEAKER_05]: is that Putin put out this decree to say, all right, so everyone who wants safe harbor from the liberals and the globalists in the West, you have to believe in these things.
[SPEAKER_05]: And you have to like not say certain things.
[SPEAKER_05]: So there's the, and it's for a shared values visa.
[SPEAKER_05]: So there's the announcement of the shared values visa.
[SPEAKER_05]: You can find out about that, like kind of easily, but then what are those shared values?
[SPEAKER_05]: There's another decree that's long or in much more detailed and talks about how Russia's technologically advanced, how the supermarkets and all that is bad, not supermarkets specifically, but like down to that level of granular detail.
[SPEAKER_05]: And so when she went there and she was systematically doing things like taking pictures of a knockoff of Starbucks in order to say look Russia's been sanctioned, but it's got everything America has it doesn't matter and she actually says at one point that everything America has exists in Russia except in Russia, it's sometimes even better like I knew what all that was most people thought it was just propaganda that they didn't think beyond that I was like
[SPEAKER_05]: No, she's checking the boxes on what you're supposed to believe in order to apply for this program.
[SPEAKER_05]: That's why she's saying all these kind of random.
[SPEAKER_05]: You can praise Russian all sorts of different ways.
[SPEAKER_05]: But the reason she's doing it without any nuance, like if you're a BS or you want to be like, I don't agree with everything Putin does, but
[SPEAKER_04]: here's the reasons that he's not so bad like that that's what a professional would do yeah put your phone for this program you can't even do that put this up on screen this is a post she made yeah that's a told rusher they couldn't have starbucks and they really said okay now we own it and they call it stars coffee um so
[SPEAKER_04]: It's a weird brag for somebody in any era, but especially these days to say, hey, the Russian government stole our shit and then runs a state-owned coffee company.
[SPEAKER_04]: See, got you a bitch.
[SPEAKER_04]: What are you talking about?
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, of course they did, but that's exactly what they do.
[SPEAKER_04]: What are you talking about?
[SPEAKER_04]: You fucking moron.
[SPEAKER_04]: Now, I want to go back to Doug in a little bit.
[SPEAKER_04]: Who is Duke and tell the audience who Duke is?
[SPEAKER_04]: Well, that's what I'm going to allow.
[SPEAKER_04]: I'm going to talk about his version of Christianity, which is completely incompatible with Christianity in general, but especially American conservative evangelical Christianity.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's not even the same religion, just to be clear.
[SPEAKER_04]: And I'll get into all the specific details about that in a moment.
[SPEAKER_04]: But first, give us background on this retard where it came from and what he's up to.
[SPEAKER_05]: So he calls himself a philosopher, but he's more like a political activist who learned some academic terms and then just wrote books that loaded it with academic terms like a, oh, like a digital, you just, what's that?
[SPEAKER_04]: Like, Deepak Chopra's saying quantum entanglement basically, right?
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, yeah, it's basically it's like a grad student that just learned how to do literature reviewing was like, oh, if I turn that into a book, I'll be a philosopher, but he was well connected enough that his ideas about how to destroy America and this new foreign policy vision for Russia, even his books even got in the high levels of like the Russian military.
[SPEAKER_05]: And so contrary to what people say, they they say, oh, he's not really Putin's brain because like they don't talk directly that much.
[SPEAKER_05]: They actually have met, but that's
[SPEAKER_05]: they wouldn't though like that's just, that would that wouldn't be the relationship here.
[SPEAKER_05]: He's his ideas getting out there.
[SPEAKER_05]: He's not like an operational person except for when it comes to influencing maga.
[SPEAKER_05]: So he writes these kind of like strategic books like a thought leader, but then later on he gets more.
[SPEAKER_05]: integrated into official Russian propaganda apparatus, especially those connected to the Russian Orthodox church, like you mentioned.
[SPEAKER_05]: So he has official positions there.
[SPEAKER_05]: He's a professor.
[SPEAKER_05]: He leads a think tank.
[SPEAKER_05]: And the network that he then leads starts producing English language content.
[SPEAKER_05]: And now it's interesting that at the same time, Dugans doing this.
[SPEAKER_05]: you know how I mentioned before the Soviets put together that team to say well like how do we save communism because it sucks and they said well we need to revive it with nationalism and orthodox Christianity and fuse it together the guy who led that committee and says okay that's the decision we're going forward with that the next thing he does is form a think tank called the strategic culture foundation that even exists today.
[SPEAKER_05]: uh... but it's one of its primary purposes is just a promote conspiracy theories uh... because the determination was made that basically you don't people that you get people thinking like conspiratorial way they reflexively are anti-establishment which means you're going to be anti-western because and that's worth it
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, to be clear, that has worked.
[SPEAKER_03]: Every single thing that happens now is a conspiracy.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't care if it's politics or sports or a car crash.
[SPEAKER_03]: It is everybody's gonna conspiracy behind.
[SPEAKER_03]: Whatever the thing is, it can't just be the thing.
[SPEAKER_04]: Well, it's a function of, I mean, they're really what they're doing as a weaponizing.
[SPEAKER_04]: Postmodernism and critical theory.
[SPEAKER_04]: The big element of critical theory is that there is no objective truth that we are all on a persistent and never ending
[SPEAKER_04]: deconstruction campaign, it never in.
[SPEAKER_04]: There's no end state outlined in the Frankfurt School ideologies, no end state, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: Like in communism, the end state was people would see how great communism is and governments would disappear.
[SPEAKER_04]: And we would all just live, we would all just be fucking ski pull on each other for the rest of all eternity or whatever.
[SPEAKER_04]: In reality, obviously, that's what taught it nonsense.
[SPEAKER_04]: even if what we banked on what we absolutely banked on and this all came from the Scottish Enlightenment right so Marks could have just read those books and he would have known his idea was fucking stupid but people will seek their own interest and Henry Ford when he realized his product was getting too expensive for the people that he wanted to buy it he fucking developed the factory floor so he could make it cheaper so that everybody could fucking buy one every industrialist did that during the industrial revolution or their
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, right now with AI, it's the same thing.
[SPEAKER_04]: Every one of these motherfuckers that are building massive companies will find a way to make sure that people can afford their products, which means they have to distribute wealth on their own voluntarily, not have the state do it for them, which by the way is socialism and communism.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's fucking stupid, it will never happen ever, anyways.
[SPEAKER_04]: On the religious thing,
[SPEAKER_05]: This is real quick because I realized I forgot a key point.
[SPEAKER_05]: So the idea was promote any type of conspiracy theory in general because of the way it crows the mind, but there's something called narrative laundering.
[SPEAKER_05]: And they realize that the same person who adopts conspiracy theories, you can easily dip in Russian disinformation as well.
[SPEAKER_05]: So rather than just, oh, how do we have Russian disinformation like convince someone to carry it?
[SPEAKER_05]: No, just create a bunch of conspiracy theorists
[SPEAKER_05]: who are American and are not Russian, and then those people will just, they'll just eat it up, and that's exactly what happened.
[SPEAKER_05]: So those were like kind of the free tracks.
[SPEAKER_05]: It was Zaris, Christianity, I know you're about to talk about, and then the conspiracy theories as a strategic
[SPEAKER_05]: attack essentially and then attacking American civil society just by poisoning it with hatred and filth and now you're seeing the the fruits of it.
[SPEAKER_05]: I took a while to put everything together, but amazingly now now you're seeing it.
[SPEAKER_04]: Oh, it's actually happened.
[SPEAKER_04]: Oh, yeah, this is uh, I learned this for the first time from uh, from a old movie, a spoonful of sugar makes the medicine go down.
[SPEAKER_04]: Love that, Phil.
[SPEAKER_04]: See.
[SPEAKER_04]: The spoonful of sugar makes the medicine go down.
[SPEAKER_04]: If you carve a path in someone's brain, you can dump whatever you want to into that ship.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, whatever you want to.
[SPEAKER_04]: And you can see it.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's brain rot.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's conspiracy brain.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yesterday, you have a Brett Weinstein post on Twitter.
[SPEAKER_04]: Why are they covering this up?
[SPEAKER_04]: Like, oh, do you have evidence of a cover up bread?
[SPEAKER_04]: Everybody asks him what evidence you have of a cover up and he's like they're coming after me like no, you're an idiot Right right right You fucking dummy anyways But and that's that is the entire that is the entire Plot right the entire plot is To carve channels into some of these brains where you can dump whatever you want and you don't have to get them to buy every single thing either You just have to get them to buy enough where they stop giving a fuck about their own country
[SPEAKER_04]: Right.
[SPEAKER_04]: That is what's happening right now.
[SPEAKER_04]: The inverse of that is also true, though.
[SPEAKER_04]: I've quoted this many times.
[SPEAKER_04]: G. K. Chestron says that men did not love Rome because she was great.
[SPEAKER_04]: Rome was great because the men loved her and you could also look to.
[SPEAKER_04]: the Tokfills commentary I've mentioned this before on what he called a nation of joiners.
[SPEAKER_04]: This like unique American spirit to form small associations to solve problems and not get the government involved.
[SPEAKER_04]: This is who we are at a cultural level.
[SPEAKER_04]: If you're going to attack that, you can fuck us up.
[SPEAKER_04]: Now the reason they want to use
[SPEAKER_04]: Christianity to get into it is because America is still to this day a deeply religious country whether like some people have moved on to the religion of politics, but we are still culturally deeply religious It may not be an organized religion and
[SPEAKER_04]: It is what we would call false ethos, right, or a manufactured credibility.
[SPEAKER_04]: They're trying to come under the banner of something that you, it's like standing next to George Washington saying, I love America, while you're strangling a fucking American under the scene, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: It's your borrowing credibility from the thing you're standing next to.
[SPEAKER_04]: And this asshole and the entire Russian government are trying to stand next to what they think
[SPEAKER_04]: We'll pass, and to some degree it does with people because they're uneducated, but to some degree pass as what we could set a Christianity, but it's not even close.
[SPEAKER_04]: So this Russian Orthodox Christianity, which by the way is a split in the 17th century from the broader Protestant reformation.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'll get to that in a moment.
[SPEAKER_03]: He's got real quick, Luke has that bread wine scene.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's one of them.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, that's one of them.
[SPEAKER_04]: That's not the one I was talking about.
[SPEAKER_04]: For those asking about evidence of a cover up in the Charlie Kirk case at Liberty Lack pod is a good list that should not be political It's on any leader should there's you know, I saw through true There's no evidence look like Clint Russell is the guy he's talking about and he's one of the biggest brain rot retard on the internet at any rate the
[SPEAKER_04]: Even if you fold in the large Catholic contingent into the broader conservative Christians in America, not just the Protestants, the Russian Orthodox version differs wildly on authority and salvation and the church itself by church, I mean the body, the group of people who belong to it.
[SPEAKER_04]: So one of the
[SPEAKER_04]: One of the main points of disagreement, and this is heresy, by the way.
[SPEAKER_04]: I mean, people say the word heresy sometimes, this is legitimate heresy.
[SPEAKER_04]: The difference between individual and collective salvation.
[SPEAKER_04]: American evangelicalism.
[SPEAKER_04]: is built on individual conversion.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's why it's so closely related.
[SPEAKER_04]: One of the two reasons that's so closely related with the broader Western liberty movement.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's individual salvation or the Jewish idea of unique identity before God.
[SPEAKER_04]: I was made in the image of God, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: I was.
[SPEAKER_04]: Me personally, my individual body was made in the image of God.
[SPEAKER_04]: My in spirit body, whatever the fuck I'm gonna do that.
[SPEAKER_04]: a personal relationship with Jesus.
[SPEAKER_04]: No intermediary.
[SPEAKER_04]: I can talk directly to God.
[SPEAKER_04]: This is what the Catholic Church and authoritarian governments did for 1500 years almost, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: They said, if you want to fucking talk to God, you got to come through me, you got to, you can't learn Latin because you're dumb, you don't have access to it, you got to come to me, you got to pay me,
[SPEAKER_04]: Martin Luther in a variety of others destroyed that idea and it was the kindling that started the fire of the western liberty movement in a major way.
[SPEAKER_04]: You already had the Magna Cards have other stuff that applied to the the gentry, like the regents and barons and stuff like that.
[SPEAKER_04]: This took it all the way down to the individual fuckface.
[SPEAKER_04]: Every farmer, every plumber, whatever the fuck you are, you get direct access to the guy because that's what it says in the book.
[SPEAKER_04]: individualism and Protestantism is heresy that there is collective salvation.
[SPEAKER_04]: That is retarded.
[SPEAKER_04]: He says that Christianity is communal, liturgical, and national, the church is an organized body, bound to two people, like the Russian era, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: Like the Russian people have to be saved as a group.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's common as a mapped on to Christianity.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's fucking stupid, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: Nobody thinks that.
[SPEAKER_04]: There's no biblical root for this.
[SPEAKER_04]: I challenge you to go fucking look for it and find.
[SPEAKER_04]: If you find it said to anybody, because that would be news to me.
[SPEAKER_04]: I've read that thing a couple of times.
[SPEAKER_04]: American conservative Christians operate within the framework of church and state separation and religious liberty.
[SPEAKER_04]: Now they may not like that phrase church and state separation, but the purpose of it, and if this comes from the Calvinists, by the way,
[SPEAKER_04]: the purpose of separation of church and state, forget about the phrase, but the purpose of that wall between the two isn't so that we don't have a national religion.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's so that the state doesn't tell us what it is, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: We can choose whatever the fuck we want.
[SPEAKER_04]: And America is, make no mistake, a Christian nation, and it always will be.
[SPEAKER_04]: But the state doesn't get to tell us that.
[SPEAKER_04]: We chose that.
[SPEAKER_04]: And that might seem like a but an all distinction to a communist, but that means everything to us, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: And Dugan obviously disagrees.
[SPEAKER_04]: His concept is of Moscow as the third Rome, right, the third Rome and Empire, risen again and where it's basically Christian nationalism, but in Russia, and then globally, like a caliphate,
[SPEAKER_04]: you opt-in to Christianity, you choose.
[SPEAKER_04]: And if you don't choose, you're fucked.
[SPEAKER_04]: That's the rule.
[SPEAKER_04]: You know what I mean?
[SPEAKER_04]: So then the attitude towards capitalism and America gets woven into the religion has nothing to do with anything.
[SPEAKER_04]: This is not a religious stance.
[SPEAKER_04]: That is a fucking political ideology.
[SPEAKER_04]: The fact that he tries to, that he views capitalism, liberalism and Americanism as a satanic package, he refers to it literally as a satanic package, those three things.
[SPEAKER_04]: United States is not a Christian nation that it is a civilization embodiment of anti-Christ forces.
[SPEAKER_04]: I mean, it's basically the Arab version, or I'm sorry, the Russian version of Arab great state and ideology that he espalves.
[SPEAKER_04]: Then he's got some weird, like, esotericism beliefs, his intellectual formation runs through what's called traditionalism.
[SPEAKER_04]: Heightagre is a big one.
[SPEAKER_04]: If you want to look him up, it's HE, IDE, G-G-E-E-R.
[SPEAKER_04]: I think it's a Spill's name, but her metacism, various esoteric currents, it's layered over metaphysics that even jellicle theologians would call pagan or nostic, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: So he takes like this old-school Russian pagan shit and European northern European pagan shit, remember the barbarians, the barbarians, the barbarians, it moved their
[SPEAKER_04]: He treats Christianity partly as an authentic tradition of Russian civilization, rather than a universal Protestant truth, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: And folds in all of this weird.
[SPEAKER_04]: I mean, it's basically like Kabbalah, but for Christianity and Russia, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: And then finally, Eschatology, they're both apocalyptic to some degree with Armageddon, Megito, all this stuff.
[SPEAKER_04]: and Dugan's Apocalypse is geopolitical.
[SPEAKER_04]: The final battle is in Eurasia, and it's Eurasia versus Atlantisism, or Russia versus the United States.
[SPEAKER_04]: That's where he thinks the bat not in fucking Israel where the Bible says it is, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: And believe whatever you want about that, but he just made this shit up, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: So his entire, this entire version of Christianity, for which he is the forefront in Russia, by the way.
[SPEAKER_04]: is completely incompatible with Western Christianity in general, but especially evangelical Christian Christianity.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's not even the same thing you're talking about, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: He's a guy that fucking found a Bible track and took some ideas out of it and woven into his barbarian religion.
[SPEAKER_04]: That's really what it is.
[SPEAKER_04]: And then dump some communism on top of it.
[SPEAKER_04]: So if you're out there and you hear people saying, Rush is a Christian nation, they're closer to us than this group or that group, no, they're not.
[SPEAKER_04]: are.
[SPEAKER_04]: And as you say, they've got a 20% Muslim perception right now Muslims are the Muslims are the fastest growing contingent demographic of any kind in their country, 27% now.
[SPEAKER_04]: Right.
[SPEAKER_04]: And I think Ryan will agree within the next 25 to 50 years, the majority of their military will be Muslim.
[SPEAKER_03]: So probably because they're not afraid to empty out the prison cells and say, hey, go to the front line.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's not just that.
[SPEAKER_04]: But all of their troops are getting swacked.
[SPEAKER_04]: They already had to go to North Korea, but North Koreans aren't emigrating to Russia, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: But the Chechnians and the stands are coming into Russia now.
[SPEAKER_04]: They're getting folded back in.
[SPEAKER_04]: And they're getting a lot of fucking resources from Russia to come fighting that fucking war.
[SPEAKER_04]: Do you think there's going to go away?
[SPEAKER_03]: No, I don't think it's going to go away.
[SPEAKER_03]: I guess my question you is, the conspiracy thing is already worked.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's worked here.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm willing to admit that and everybody believes in some form of conspiracy or another, the problem is how do you correct it?
[SPEAKER_03]: Because even when you tell the truth, people don't want to hear it, they don't believe you.
[SPEAKER_03]: So then what?
[SPEAKER_03]: Does everybody just have this great shutdown of social media and apps and all that shit?
[SPEAKER_03]: What's the next step of this is what I'm trying to figure out?
[SPEAKER_05]: I think a big part of it is that we haven't adapted to social media as a society yet.
[SPEAKER_05]: Like, I'm not aware of a revamping in the public school systems to say, be on the lookout for this, and this is how you deal with it.
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, critical thinking from everything I can tell isn't really taught much in the schools.
[SPEAKER_05]: You might learn about
[SPEAKER_05]: You know, some different scientific facts, I won't matter for your life, and you can always look up later, but then these critical thinking skills and research skills and how to deal with these emerging problems isn't really in there.
[SPEAKER_05]: So there's going to have to be a revitalization of civil society in terms of critical thinking, but also how we.
[SPEAKER_05]: deal with each other in terms of disagreement, so it's not always war war war all the time, but I think also using the words of the Russian government and the Iranian government everyone else doing this to show how much this is by design, so it's not authentic, because people are attracted to the authenticity, even if it's a stupid idea, it's like, oh it's authentic, like with Nick Fuentes, he's trying to outmaneuver his new competitors, I say, well I'm authentic,
[SPEAKER_05]: China and Iran to defeat the U.S. is like, yeah, but I'm not on their payroll.
[SPEAKER_05]: So, and why is he doing that?
[SPEAKER_05]: Because it's about authenticity.
[SPEAKER_05]: So, we should show it's not authentic.
[SPEAKER_05]: So, for example, Dugin, this new version of Bible prophecy that he truly invented, there is a little-known text that has been discovered where it's entire text about weaponizing conspiracy theories.
[SPEAKER_05]: and it's written long ago and he actually says in there, one of the big problems we have with tried to influence American Christians is that there's this prevailing belief that at the end times Russia is going to be part of God and may God and the Battle of Armageddon and whether that's true or not that's a problem for them because how do you get past that and he blatantly says we just need to make up our own we just need to mirror that and then now and this just
[SPEAKER_05]: The Russia Orthodox Church and Putin's people in Duke are promoting this new end times ideology where they actually believe in the Islamic body, the Messianic figure of Islamic times prophecy, but what they say is that the body will appear, but he will ally with the Katek on.
[SPEAKER_05]: and that could take on fights the anti-Christ, like leads the fight against anti-Christ, and it's a leader or an entity, but that's Russia, and it's primarily leads an Orthodox coalition, traditionalist type Catholics, like really like the type that tends to be more authoritarian, not Catholics with traditional values, but they call them traditional Catholics.
[SPEAKER_05]: And so, their argument is that there'll be an Orthodox coalition that includes Arabs that allies with the jihadists led by the body, and then they fight the Jewish anti-Christ and the West at the Battle of Armageddon wherever that takes place.
[SPEAKER_05]: I've heard a few different versions of it.
[SPEAKER_05]: So they've actually linked together the radiology, so it's no longer just, oh, the enemy of my enemy is my friend, it's, no, you're a holy duty,
[SPEAKER_05]: and you're calling to fulfill prophecy requires allying with the jihadists and with Iran and all of them.
[SPEAKER_05]: So it's not even that.
[SPEAKER_05]: It's actually true Brotherhood and it sounds nuts, but based on what I've seen, it needs to be nuts to say that Churchill was the big villain World War II.
[SPEAKER_05]: All you need is one of these,
[SPEAKER_05]: idiots out there to put this out there and normalize it and you're going to have this authoritarian zars Christianity these new end times ideas being debated in your churches it's coming because we've seen this over and over again over the past like five years some crazy idea gets put out there by someone like Tucker Carlson and say nobody nobody would buy that and well they do they do and that becomes a normalized argument
[SPEAKER_03]: And, you know, I think the end game here is, you know, obviously spreading communism here, which is also happening.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then, look, I just sent you a clip from last night on CNN.
[SPEAKER_03]: This was the first time I heard a CNN host, actually called this new party that's going on within the Democrats' communism for the first time.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, so everything they're doing is working right now.
[SPEAKER_03]: And it's slowly starting to spread to these little cities and you can look at it and say, all right,
[SPEAKER_03]: But when CNN starts reporting on it for their own party, play this clip.
[SPEAKER_03]: This was Van Jones last night.
[SPEAKER_02]: With Gretchen Carlson.
[SPEAKER_02]: So then, you're post-strucker nerve, right?
[SPEAKER_02]: We saw a strike a nerve on Fox News.
[SPEAKER_02]: I saw it strike a nerve among many on the left.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_02]: For whom some of those things you mentioned have become rallying, passionate rallying calls, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_02]: But you knew it was going to,
[SPEAKER_02]: Ben, Ben, Ben, Ben doesn't walk into a moment like this being like, Oh, I don't think this is going to happen.
[SPEAKER_01]: Let's go like this.
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, why?
[SPEAKER_00]: To you?
[SPEAKER_00]: Why do you say?
[SPEAKER_01]: Because this was necessary.
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you.
[SPEAKER_01]: This was very, especially from your voice.
[SPEAKER_01]: Now, I'm going to let you respond first, because this is about you.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then I can pick up.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, listen, I cannot tell you this phone has been blowing up all day, governors from both parties, senators from both parties, Democrats in the House, calling thanking me for saying what everybody's been saying behind the scenes.
[SPEAKER_00]: which is that this stuff is going too far.
[SPEAKER_00]: I am a progressive Democrat.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, you want to talk about a prison reform.
[SPEAKER_00]: I've done it as well as anybody Republican Democrats in the South with Trump.
[SPEAKER_00]: I've done prison reform.
[SPEAKER_00]: I never said have no prisons.
[SPEAKER_00]: Where you're gonna put the clan.
[SPEAKER_00]: I've done police reform.
[SPEAKER_00]: I never said no police where you're gonna put the pedophiles.
[SPEAKER_00]: You're gonna grab the pedophiles.
[SPEAKER_00]: This stuff is going too far.
[SPEAKER_00]: And part of the thing that has to happen is we saw what happened in the Republican Party.
[SPEAKER_00]: When things started going in a nutty direction and nobody stood up, I am happy that the young people are fighting for affordability, Medicare for all, all the good things.
[SPEAKER_00]: I've been waiting my whole life to see a youth movement do what is doing, but it's being hijacked by people who are putting in nutty ideas, supporting terrorists, nutty ideas saying we don't need cops and prisons.
[SPEAKER_00]: We can't, we can't deport anybody, even if they rape somebody who's set this,
[SPEAKER_02]: Where does she volunteer is going to, is, is, is, is, is the Democratic nominee.
[SPEAKER_02]: So sorry.
[SPEAKER_02]: DSA, a nominee for Congress.
[SPEAKER_00]: No, not as she corrects him to DSA.
[SPEAKER_00]: I just want to say that there's a shock wave through this party.
[SPEAKER_00]: when mom Donnie, who everybody's excited about, stabbed in the back, S.B.I.
[SPEAKER_00]: who was the chair of the congressional Hispanic caucus, beloved by everybody, who backed mom Donnie.
[SPEAKER_00]: Mom Donnie said, I will back you.
[SPEAKER_00]: They've turned around, stabbed in the back.
[SPEAKER_00]: That should all be it.
[SPEAKER_03]: So, okay, with that, I think the biggest takeaway was the word hijacking.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's hijacking this party.
[SPEAKER_03]: Is this Russia, hijacking this part like who is this?
[SPEAKER_03]: Because this feels like communism.
[SPEAKER_03]: It really does.
[SPEAKER_03]: And that was what Van Jones was talking about.
[SPEAKER_04]: This one's been going on.
[SPEAKER_04]: This is more, in my opinion, the Democratic Party thing is more CCP and the right-wing stuff is more Russia.
[SPEAKER_04]: So,
[SPEAKER_04]: Explain the difference there because I don't know what that is so Roy Neville's thing of who's now under investigation by the the Department of Justice and that's not going to go well for him by the way, so is that That that Jang that So that Chinese do the calls himself a professor.
[SPEAKER_04]: He's not a professor shit
[SPEAKER_04]: He's a he's a he's a He's a doctor.
[SPEAKER_05]: The Chinese do again.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, he's the Chinese do again basically, but those two guys Roy Neville sing them as a fundraiser and and jang as a as a as a I guess a puppet.
[SPEAKER_04]: I don't know what you would call them maybe he's China's brain bud
[SPEAKER_04]: He's a high school teacher to be fair, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: This is him.
[SPEAKER_04]: Put him up on prison.
[SPEAKER_04]: But it's whatever he thinks we people to believe in and fall.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, look at that.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
[SPEAKER_05]: So the Democratic Party has been
[SPEAKER_04]: right for this for 25 years, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: Logger certainly attempt-wise, but they have accepted it for 25 years.
[SPEAKER_04]: The battle that's going on right now, where I would say more than half, I think there's a lot of loud people on the retard, which is what I call them.
[SPEAKER_04]: There's a lot of loud people, but there's fewer of them.
[SPEAKER_04]: And,
[SPEAKER_04]: Right now, what's happening on the right with shutting down all this dip-shit Russia propaganda is what should have happened on the left, 25 years ago when all this fucking left is bullshit started from China.
[SPEAKER_04]: And in my opinion, it's no coincidence that it happened right on the heels of Clinton allowing China into the World Trade Organization with no fucking strings attached, as I've mentioned many times before.
[SPEAKER_04]: Um, as soon as that happens, China starts buying farm land, starts sending all their students to the United States universities and, uh, uh, uh, uh, start spending billions and billions of dollars.
[SPEAKER_04]: Since they were allowed in the World Trade Organization, they have stolen $16 trillion worth of US intellectual property, trillion with a T, half of our national debt has been robbed from us by China and, uh,
[SPEAKER_04]: That the left never mounted a serious defense against it and now it's too late.
[SPEAKER_04]: All these people you hear on the left now complaining about the DSA and about this and communism and this is what it's supposed to look like.
[SPEAKER_04]: You should have said that shit 20 years ago, you're fucked.
[SPEAKER_04]: The Democratic Party is fucked and they will have to rebuild.
[SPEAKER_04]: Once this collapses entirely, they will have to rebuild and kick these people to fuck out.
[SPEAKER_04]: Now on the right, there's still a bit of a chance.
[SPEAKER_04]: Boom.
[SPEAKER_04]: There's a lot of problems on the right.
[SPEAKER_04]: They haven't been conservative in a long time.
[SPEAKER_04]: There's like, no, but we can't get to fucking say that.
[SPEAKER_04]: Tax where that's technically Trump has reduced the size of government, but he's like added three trillion to the debt in the 18 months.
[SPEAKER_04]: So that's not particularly conservative is it.
[SPEAKER_04]: But the ideologies are different.
[SPEAKER_04]: Note, like the left isn't aligning with Russia.
[SPEAKER_04]: Remember Russia's the bookie man.
[SPEAKER_04]: They're pro-Ucraine.
[SPEAKER_04]: Right.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: Well, they're supposed to be.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: They're pro Ukraine.
[SPEAKER_03]: But these ideals are coming.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_05]: Hey, is pro Russia.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: But we've even normalized that.
[SPEAKER_03]: Did you do you notice she stopped during that interview when she said that the Democratic Socialists and then she goes, excuse me.
[SPEAKER_03]: DSA, like that was in her ear from a producer saying, hey dude, you can't say the word socialist because that's going to drive too many voters away.
[SPEAKER_03]: I know that's what's happening behind the scenes.
[SPEAKER_03]: So there's something to make it sound like, oh, this isn't so bad.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's just DSA, you're good.
[SPEAKER_03]: DSA, you just say versus socialist.
[SPEAKER_03]: When you say socialist, that's what perks up everybody's ears.
[SPEAKER_03]: We're like, wait, what?
[SPEAKER_03]: No, we're not doing that here.
[SPEAKER_03]: But then DSA normalizes this new party.
[SPEAKER_03]: of what they're actually going to run on.
[SPEAKER_03]: And it has worked, guys, this whole campaign, whoever's doing it, Russia, China, whoever, it has worked.
[SPEAKER_03]: We've never seen this in the history of our country.
[SPEAKER_03]: We're actual socialist slash communist are actually getting elected in these primaries and fucking end of Congress.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, and here's how they can win over the short term.
[SPEAKER_05]: This is what's like really scary to me is that for the longest time, because I don't have a political background, I've just viewed this as one thing.
[SPEAKER_05]: I call it the global submissionist, excuse me.
[SPEAKER_05]: The global seditionist movement.
[SPEAKER_05]: where I don't really see a far left and far right, like I don't even believe in the horseshoe theory because it's an oval now.
[SPEAKER_05]: It's just like one thing and it's increasingly coalescing.
[SPEAKER_05]: And so you saw in 2024 the what you call the far left, the Marxist, the anarchist, the DSA.
[SPEAKER_05]: We're all saying that some of them kind of wanted camera to lose because then they could say, well, you need also in order to win.
[SPEAKER_05]: But they at least wanted it close so that they could say we hold the keys to your future.
[SPEAKER_05]: Now you're seeing Tucker when he's talking about forming his own party and you're seeing a similar thing happening on the right and that's not a coincidence that both elements are doing the same thing while they're going on each other shows and probably meeting with each other.
[SPEAKER_05]: You're seeing the seditionist movement that we have failed to see because we always say view everything through this binary of far left and far right.
[SPEAKER_05]: It's coalescing, and if you look at the polls of extremist opinion in the US, it's easy to say all of that's, you know, maybe 15, 20% which is higher than what a lot of people think.
[SPEAKER_05]: But I still say, well, that can't win a majority of the vote.
[SPEAKER_05]: You'll need a majority.
[SPEAKER_05]: What their message is is that they just need to be able to say that they control enough of the swing voters, that you have to kiss their feet.
[SPEAKER_05]: and lots of political consultants who make their money off of winning elections will start legitimizing them.
[SPEAKER_05]: And at that point, if they can credibly claim to be the ones that determine the outcomes of close elections, they own the system.
[SPEAKER_04]: Do you think that the Trump administration is taking this seriously?
[SPEAKER_04]: And here's why I ask, Thursday night,
[SPEAKER_04]: last week.
[SPEAKER_04]: He talks about how China was deeply involved in stealing the 2020 election and yada yada yada yada.
[SPEAKER_04]: A lot of stuff.
[SPEAKER_04]: We know that China stole in 16 trillion dollars worth of our intellectual property.
[SPEAKER_04]: We know that there are the students they send here are trying to smuggle biological material in that's happened twice in the last six months.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yet,
[SPEAKER_04]: no comment on the 600,000 Chinese visas issued for students coming into our country.
[SPEAKER_04]: It seems to me like easy or oblivious to this or is not taking it seriously.
[SPEAKER_05]: I think he takes it seriously as the different issues come up and there isn't like a cohesive strategy across the board.
[SPEAKER_05]: Like,
[SPEAKER_05]: The global seditious movement isn't even like a thing.
[SPEAKER_05]: Like that's just the best term I could come up with to explain it.
[SPEAKER_05]: So there obviously isn't a strategy to go after it.
[SPEAKER_05]: When he's condemned, can this and Tucker and Alex Jones and Marjorie Taylor Greene, it's largely because of personal reasons.
[SPEAKER_05]: They pose as policy, he gets offended because he was friends with them and he goes after them and calls them ugly and then traders and things like that.
[SPEAKER_05]: And although that's positive for the cause, because it's not integrated as part of an overall strategy of saying like, this is the threat, it's all one thing, the Russian China obviously coordinate on all this, the Russian and Iranian influence operations are essentially one thing, they literally share staff.
[SPEAKER_05]: Then, until you have that kind of recognition, and you say we just need to attack this infrastructure as a whole, I would say it's inadequate, but they're taking it seriously, it's just sometimes not for the right reasons, and it's for the moment based off of a tactical dispute.
[SPEAKER_04]: No, so what's next?
[SPEAKER_04]: Well, what's next?
[SPEAKER_04]: What's next is as per, and this is out, I'll say this.
[SPEAKER_04]: I don't care what the left does because I don't think they're serious people, but there are a lot of serious people in the right and a lot of them are asking the same questions you are.
[SPEAKER_04]: How do we deal with this?
[SPEAKER_04]: And I'll tell you, you're dealing with a cult.
[SPEAKER_04]: and you have to think of that way.
[SPEAKER_04]: D-bunking will not work.
[SPEAKER_04]: Telling somebody their religion as fools has worked zero times in human history.
[SPEAKER_04]: Not fucking once.
[SPEAKER_04]: and attacking them personally has never worked.
[SPEAKER_04]: I know it is very easy because it's retarded.
[SPEAKER_04]: The things they're saying and the things they believe are fucking retarded.
[SPEAKER_04]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_04]: I don't know if you saw that socialist dummy explained into the homeboy what he's been how he's been converting people to socialism.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's like, oh, it's all about vibes, man.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's all about hanging out and talking about the game and just what the fuck are you talking about?
[SPEAKER_04]: But it's retarded, but it is very effective.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's the same strategy that groups like Mormons use, like community-based stuff, is very attractive people.
[SPEAKER_04]: That's you're fulfilling a basic human need right there, and people will accept what you say if you fulfill basic human needs.
[SPEAKER_04]: That is a fucking fundamental reality about human beings.
[SPEAKER_04]: So what actually works?
[SPEAKER_04]: One thing I don't like is the idea of using the enemy's tactics against them, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: Like if they're doing X, you do X too.
[SPEAKER_04]: But sometimes it doesn't make sense when it's a noble effort.
[SPEAKER_04]: As I mentioned with Alexis de Tocqueville, one of the things that made America possible in the first place he wrote this in Democracy in America.
[SPEAKER_04]: I think it was in 1836 when that book was published, but you could read it.
[SPEAKER_04]: And I highly encourage that you read it.
[SPEAKER_04]: One of the things he called us a nation of joiners, I explained it, these small associations, this proclivity that American culture had, to come together, not just to solve problems, by the way, because it was something that happened as a result of the club systems that were in Glasgow and Scotland, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: The Scotch Irish came over from Northern Ireland during the mass migration, brought that with them.
[SPEAKER_04]: And,
[SPEAKER_04]: that Proclivity to band together in small groups have very rigorous academic discussions at the top and be very tough and you're not gonna fuck with me at the bottom, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: That was the cast system in Scotland.
[SPEAKER_04]: It was academics and by the way, their colleges, they had six universities for maybe a million two people, something like that, most of which were way outside the cities.
[SPEAKER_04]: compared to just two, Oxford and whatever the fuck in London and all of the, all of England.
[SPEAKER_04]: So it which had obviously an enormous population compared to them.
[SPEAKER_04]: That system
[SPEAKER_04]: allows for two things.
[SPEAKER_04]: One is called pre-bunking, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: And this is something that you individually have to do, but also something that we have to do with the American education system.
[SPEAKER_04]: And it is, you can find many studies on this.
[SPEAKER_04]: Cambridge, ironically, Cambridge did one of them.
[SPEAKER_04]: But Cambridge, Google, Jaxaz, done one.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's called a, it's called social inoculation, okay?
[SPEAKER_04]: And it shows a teaching people manipulation techniques.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's why I do these fucking rhetorical persuasion studies and published them to people for fucking free, showing them manipulation techniques, like emotional exploitation or pathos, exploitation, false dichotomies, scapegoating and others, and stuff like that.
[SPEAKER_04]: They don't want you to know framing fits with their conspiratorial mind.
[SPEAKER_04]: They're trying to trick you is very attractive to somebody who's decided that everything is a conspiracy, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: That is a pathway into their fucking ideology where you can make some movement.
[SPEAKER_03]: I just don't know what to say to people, like in regards to conspiracies and shit, like you don't talk about the conspiracy.
[SPEAKER_03]: You talk about the grift.
[SPEAKER_04]: You talk about the mechanics of the grift, and that's the second thing, attack the grift and not the belief.
[SPEAKER_04]: The most effective wedge against cult-like movements is exposing the leadership's hypocrisy and financial incentives, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: First, and then exposing the mechanics of the grift specifically, like all these tread influencer people, have you seen them on Twitter?
[SPEAKER_04]: They're all fucking each other.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's like traditional conservative women like they're wearing a costume like they're fucking in the night.
[SPEAKER_04]: They're like cheating on their spouses with each other.
[SPEAKER_04]: All of them.
[SPEAKER_04]: They're all making money from companies to do that stuff.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's they're all full of shit, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: This is it right here, Blue?
[SPEAKER_03]: these, this track, I've seen this.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's not like it.
[SPEAKER_04]: You can, by the way, little house in the fair.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's so stupid.
[SPEAKER_04]: You know, the fact that they're wearing a costume should be an immediate red flag in your mind.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: Be an immediate red flag in your mind.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's like a Christy, no, I'm showing up in a fucking cowboy hat and a black jacket.
[SPEAKER_04]: right like what do you do when right right it should be an immediate red flag if that person's life and argument are authentic they don't wear costume that that fucking dress has nothing to do with being a traditional woman nothing to do with it not absolutely nothing to do it right the next thing
[SPEAKER_04]: is to produce exit ramps through relationships, not arguments.
[SPEAKER_04]: You're not going to argue somebody out of a cult.
[SPEAKER_04]: What you're going to do is in some way engage them on ethos, your credibility.
[SPEAKER_04]: I've shown you that I'm a good actor, I'm not against you, I'm not trying to fool you, I'm just showing you some stuff and then pathos the emotional part will come through your relationship.
[SPEAKER_04]: And only then, well, your logos, the actual fucking information that you have for them, mean anything to them.
[SPEAKER_04]: only then.
[SPEAKER_04]: So we will decide whether we have the temerity to behave like the adults in the room and communicate this stuff the way that it needs to be communicated to people or if we're just going to call them idiots on Twitter.
[SPEAKER_04]: And if we do the latter, if we call them idiots on Twitter, we will lose this country.
[SPEAKER_03]: The problem with all of this, by the way, all the way around, is it's exhausting on a daily basis, isn't it?
[SPEAKER_03]: It's just fucking exhausting.
[SPEAKER_03]: There was a, let's certainly hit me up this morning.
[SPEAKER_03]: We'd have a show last week.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think it was Lindsey Graham dying.
[SPEAKER_03]: It was awesome with the YMCA one.
[SPEAKER_03]: And it was, I think, number 23 in the world.
[SPEAKER_03]: We'd posted it.
[SPEAKER_03]: Hey, thanks for listening, blah, blah, blah.
[SPEAKER_03]: And they were like, well, why was your show number 90 today?
[SPEAKER_03]: And I was like,
[SPEAKER_03]: We talked about range 15, man, and we're still, you know, it's an insider baseball show.
[SPEAKER_03]: Number 90 in the world is amazing.
[SPEAKER_03]: I want to talk about what I want to talk about every day.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't want to chase, click, reviews, or things, or juice, juice, juice, all the time.
[SPEAKER_03]: So how do you get everybody else away from that?
[SPEAKER_03]: Is what I don't really get?
[SPEAKER_03]: How do you just get a genuine conversation or a person or a personality that you can follow who's
[SPEAKER_03]: Just genuine and not chasing this one thing because I think all of us along the way have been disappointed by people we had liked or met or worked with before or whatever and so yeah at the end of the day it feels exhausting and How do you figure out who the real person is when you're like God damn it man.
[SPEAKER_03]: I thought I knew that person for a couple years and then they changed
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, I felt that way, like, and it makes me sad, dude.
[SPEAKER_03]: I felt that way about Tucker Carlson, dude, really liked him in real life.
[SPEAKER_03]: And to see this radical switch has been wild to me.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, I just can't figure it out.
[SPEAKER_03]: Especially because he's so rich, and he's got so much money.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: I have figured he's just be doing fun shit, like side-quest shit right now, but it's taken like a weird, dark turn.
[SPEAKER_03]: And it actually makes me sad on a daily basis.
[SPEAKER_05]: There were indications before he became blatantly crazy that he was going down this path.
[SPEAKER_05]: I remember in 2018, Maria Boutina, or Boutina, yeah, Boutina was like the Russian spy sent to infiltrate the conservative movement and she got arrested and this wasn't like the a normal headline that you would cover at like eight o'clock, I believe was when
[SPEAKER_05]: uh... and that was really weird and he also got upset when amazon wouldn't sell dugins book like there are these things creeping in there that indicated to me that he was consciously seeding some of this in there uh... and that the change came earlier than people realized unfortunately um... as we're countering it uh... i'm hoping that the exhaustion
[SPEAKER_05]: will just through capitalism lead people to set, become attracted to new products, new social media platforms, new personalities that offer a break from all this shit because like we came and look at late night or like you go to a friggin airport and it's like they have the news on.
[SPEAKER_05]: like when it's stressful enough like like at some point someone's going to say oh look there's a market opportunity here for people that don't want to be stressed out all the time and they're going to come up with something that draws people in so I think some of that's a process but the one thing I would add I agree with everything you guys said about how to how to counter this yeah but to really drag that point home I did what was probably the biggest study of the anti Israel protests ever done and as part of it I decided to look at the protesters not just their
[SPEAKER_05]: activity on their social media pages.
[SPEAKER_05]: I want to know what they're doing outside their political lives because even if they're protesting, that's usually like 5% of their lives.
[SPEAKER_05]: And they don't live like me where it's most of it.
[SPEAKER_05]: Even those guys, like 5% like, well, what's the other 95% of this person?
[SPEAKER_05]: And what I found was that while of them who become communist and Marxists, it's not like they read Karl Marx and said, you know, that's intellectually very persuasive.
[SPEAKER_05]: It's more that kids are getting more involved.
[SPEAKER_05]: And this is a good thing.
[SPEAKER_05]: It's annoying as the younger generation
[SPEAKER_05]: It comes from a good, a really admirable thing, which is that they're less and less about materialistic things or what like band, what shirt you have and what band you have on that shirt, it causes or becoming cool, like it's cool to try to improve the world.
[SPEAKER_05]: And they're becoming aware of these issues at a younger age and finding self-worth.
[SPEAKER_05]: in those causes at a much younger age.
[SPEAKER_05]: But the problem is, is that who are the ones that come to them and say, look, even though you're young, you have value.
[SPEAKER_05]: You can build a better future for yourself and help other people.
[SPEAKER_05]: And these things that bother you, you can address them.
[SPEAKER_05]: Aren't the good guys?
[SPEAKER_05]: Like, it's not, it's not the church in the synagogue, it's not conservative groups.
[SPEAKER_05]: Like, there has to be a non-political approach that grabs those kids and says, look, it's wonderful that you believe self-worth should equate with helping people.
[SPEAKER_05]: Here's the way you do it.
[SPEAKER_05]: But the ones that are doing it are, it's like Chinese propaganda that's on TikTok, they're saying, this is where you should follow your efforts.
[SPEAKER_05]: You should hate the Jews, democratic socialists of America.
[SPEAKER_05]: I saw that they had groups in middle school now.
[SPEAKER_05]: So, instead of just dismissing those kids and as annoying as they can be, recognize they get in terms of empathy and wanting to make a difference, they're certainly better than my generation was.
[SPEAKER_03]: I would personally love to see, so I saw Greta Thunebear, Tunebear, excuse me.
[SPEAKER_03]: Great attune, Barry, yesterday.
[SPEAKER_03]: Get arrested for an anti-Palestine thing or a free Palestine thing, excuse me.
[SPEAKER_03]: You can pull up that picture of her yesterday, Bluex, looks like he may have now.
[SPEAKER_03]: But you look at this picture that will put up on screen here.
[SPEAKER_03]: She's got the, what is it, Kifiki around her head, or Kifiki around her head, and the neck, and all that other stuff.
[SPEAKER_03]: And you just want to reach out to and say, sweetheart, if you go there and live in that country, and that's your real cause and Palestine is it and everything else, you're going to be wrapped up from head to toe and if you get out of line, a man, whoever you're married to and there are 38 husbands or wives, they're going to be the shit out of you.
[SPEAKER_04]: No, they have 38 husbands too, because they're all homosexuals.
[SPEAKER_04]: So, I'm sorry, that's the fucking truth.
[SPEAKER_04]: If you don't know that you haven't been to the Middle East, they're gayish.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I don't know what it is about that, but yeah, there's a lot of that going on in the Middle East.
[SPEAKER_03]: So, yeah, there she is right there.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yesterday, and you know what I've ever seen.
[SPEAKER_03]: We can look at her.
[SPEAKER_04]: She's in the universe of music, while she's getting caught in it.
[SPEAKER_04]: Oh God, is that?
[SPEAKER_03]: I know, man, but do they not realize, if you lived in that country,
[SPEAKER_04]: you would have zero rights and never be able to protest speak out of turn this is the red green alliance and they never recognize it until it's too late like the 1979 or any revolution that killed them all or kicked them out of the country um yeah and to the rinds point
[SPEAKER_04]: It's the final part of this of bringing somebody back from this.
[SPEAKER_04]: The core 5 to 10% of these assholes are brain-rotted.
[SPEAKER_04]: They will never ever be convinced of anything else.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I agree, and I know people like that.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, you do too.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: But the majority of these people can be rescued, if you want to think of it that way.
[SPEAKER_04]: And the final step to it after all the things I've said are ready.
[SPEAKER_04]: is to, you have to fill the actual vacuum that created that potential in the first place, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: If they were hopeless, you have to give them hope, as he mentioned, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: Like, you have value, you have a life in front of you, you should like that.
[SPEAKER_04]: That's what stop communism.
[SPEAKER_04]: American industrialists decided to, and the US government helped to some degree with deregulation and workers' rights.
[SPEAKER_04]: They didn't get involved in redistribution of wealth, which was smart.
[SPEAKER_04]: Not until fucking FDR's bitch asked came along.
[SPEAKER_04]: But they did protect workers from abuse and stuff like that, and they deregulated stuff, so there was way easier for a middle class guy to start a business.
[SPEAKER_04]: That started way back in like 1844, I think the first bill passed for that.
[SPEAKER_04]: during the industrial revolution, so there's a lot of stuff that can be done there, but you get people hope, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: And industrialists knew if they just make sure the people can fucking live a good life off the money, you don't have to make everybody rich.
[SPEAKER_04]: You just have to let these people live a comfortable life because things other than money matter to them, their family matters more to them than money, most people, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: Um, and that's what that all you have to do is give on that and communism can't thrive.
[SPEAKER_04]: Well, think of it this way.
[SPEAKER_04]: What are the things in American society and Western society more broadly speaking that allowed for this shit to take root in the first place?
[SPEAKER_04]: This, this instinctive countermeasure of everything's fine.
[SPEAKER_04]: Trust the experts is fucking bullshit.
[SPEAKER_04]: And that's what the right wing went with for a long time.
[SPEAKER_04]: And most of them still do, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: Most of them still do.
[SPEAKER_04]: of this, the second hinge is competing successfully by offering real versions of the fake shit being offered to them, real hope, real community, right, an honest acknowledgment of institutional failures.
[SPEAKER_04]: Don't fucking defend the government when it's fucked up.
[SPEAKER_04]: Why?
[SPEAKER_04]: Why are you doing that?
[SPEAKER_04]: Why are you defending politicians?
[SPEAKER_04]: That's like rooting for a fucking referee.
[SPEAKER_04]: No, that guy, he works for us.
[SPEAKER_04]: He's an employee and if he's fucked up, he needs to correct himself and if he isn't, we're going to fire his ass.
[SPEAKER_04]: and an honest look at an honest and serious look at theology, right, that this didn't used to be a problem.
[SPEAKER_04]: It didn't used to be a problem and for the, let's say, 100 years in America where people had a pretty decent sense of what they believed.
[SPEAKER_04]: Now people don't really know what they believe and it makes them open to wild-ass ideas from places that don't have their best interest in mind.
[SPEAKER_04]: I mean, if you think of it as educating your child.
[SPEAKER_03]: I do and so that's the thing is like right now with my kids, everybody's questioning AI versus not AI.
[SPEAKER_03]: Every video, every picture, every thing, well this can't be real.
[SPEAKER_03]: They're 12, 12 girls.
[SPEAKER_03]: I was hanging out with a bunch of 12 girls over the weekends.
[SPEAKER_03]: And they were saying, you know, and they were like, finally, dad, is this real or not real?
[SPEAKER_03]: And I'm like, guys, that's a real video.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I go the fact that you even have to have to ask that, it's crazy to me.
[SPEAKER_03]: It was a soccer player that couldn't believe he had made this shot or whatever, and I was just like,
[SPEAKER_03]: that guy was one of the greatest soccer players of all time.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's a real video.
[SPEAKER_03]: And they were like, why is it greened like this?
[SPEAKER_03]: So whatever I go, because he played in the 90s?
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, sorry, you know, oh, that's not an app, that's not a filter, that's not a thing.
[SPEAKER_03]: And it's like, this was a 10-minute conversation about a very famous soccer player from the, the 90s who had made this, you know, amazing bicycle kick or whatever it was.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I'm like,
[SPEAKER_03]: Man, guys, the fact that I've got to break this down for you for 10 minutes, are you analyzing everything that you're seeing in hearing for 10 minutes of Whether this is real or fake.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's the scary part here.
[SPEAKER_03]: I shit and I don't know what else to say or do.
[SPEAKER_03]: Sorry, you know, because I'm sure eight of those, let's say it was talking to 10 kids.
[SPEAKER_03]: Let's say eight of those kids probably walked away saying, I still think it's AI.
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh my God, how do you fix that?
[SPEAKER_03]: How do you fix that?
[SPEAKER_03]: Because this is the generation that's coming up to Dan your point about talking your kids and teaching your kids.
[SPEAKER_03]: How do you fix that other than explaining every single thing you see that it's not some conspiracy.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's not some AI video that like, yeah, real people do exist.
[SPEAKER_03]: Cause you're right, it's gonna change everything that I thought wise that is going on inside your mind as a child.
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, it, it shapes technology, probably, right?
[SPEAKER_05]: I have to think the market's going to be pretty big for tools to detect AI and alert people as to what is real and what isn't.
[SPEAKER_05]: And you can always get around it, I'm sure, but it's pretty high.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, but I'd also say this in regards to religion as well.
[SPEAKER_03]: If you can't get a kid to understand a video or believe in a video that was real from 1990, how do you convince them that certain, this certain religion is correct?
[SPEAKER_03]: Or, you know, whatever they're fucking learning or believing in and everything else, because that's part of the reason I think that's what's going on with the left right now, where they're seeing these, the,
[SPEAKER_03]: fucking Greta Thunbearable shits and saying, you know what, man?
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I believe in that too, and you don't really know what you're believing in.
[SPEAKER_04]: I mean, I guess it depends on the kid, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: Not everybody's the same.
[SPEAKER_04]: I don't believe in indoctrination.
[SPEAKER_04]: I don't either.
[SPEAKER_04]: Sure.
[SPEAKER_04]: But I do believe in thoughtful explanation, and I think you should recognize that it takes time.
[SPEAKER_04]: There's a, for example, to understand why
[SPEAKER_04]: Why we chose the system of government we did in the United States in the 1780s, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: Not like I'm talking about after the articles, the failed articles of Confederation, although that's a good example.
[SPEAKER_04]: When I when I libertarian starts talking to me, I just hear fucking bells ringing because we've done it.
[SPEAKER_04]: We tried it with the articles of Confederation.
[SPEAKER_04]: It was a fucking failure, okay?
[SPEAKER_04]: get out of here with that shit.
[SPEAKER_04]: Now, if you want to come with something more like awesome Peterson's libertarian nationalism that has an energetic and strong central government, but small, okay, we can have a conversation now.
[SPEAKER_04]: But to understand why this stuff is real or not real, you have to understand the history of it.
[SPEAKER_04]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_04]: To understand why Christianity, for example,
[SPEAKER_04]: What sets it apart from everything else?
[SPEAKER_04]: Well, there's two things.
[SPEAKER_04]: One, you have to understand that a lot of these religions are seeking a central truth.
[SPEAKER_04]: The fact that they're all pointed in the same direction shows you that there is a central truth being pointed at.
[SPEAKER_04]: Nobody, if everybody's looking at a direction, there's a fucking noise or a sound or a sight over there.
[SPEAKER_04]: That is how human beings work, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: And the second step is to define that thing and to define why your version of it is different.
[SPEAKER_04]: So
[SPEAKER_03]: These are the exact conversation I actually have with my kids, by the way, but I mean, you're getting more and more questions that you didn't use to get, and what they're seeing in hearing from other kids is pretty fucking wild.
[SPEAKER_04]: There's a couple, I'll summarize for this one because I can't go one of the whole thing, but there's three things about.
[SPEAKER_04]: So, everyone of these religions has a person that they put up as the righteous icon, if you want to call it that, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: The person that did it best.
[SPEAKER_04]: Even the secular versions, like stoicism, has the sage who is perfectly aligned with natural law, as Aristotle would say, the inverse of the fool, I guess.
[SPEAKER_04]: there's a there's a there's a very stark difference between the Jesus character and however you want to feel about that I'm not here to proselytize anybody but there's a very stark difference between Christianity and every other religion every other religion and it is moral clarity first strength that is used the proper way
[SPEAKER_04]: This whole manos fear reaction that we're dealing with right now, Jesus dealt with in the first century, and he never weaponized his strength.
[SPEAKER_04]: He was the most powerful person there, despite having no authority or position over anybody.
[SPEAKER_04]: That's real power, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: He had no one had any reason to listen to him.
[SPEAKER_04]: They had no reason to follow him.
[SPEAKER_04]: They had no reason to fear him, but the Roman government feared him so much, they had him executed publicly.
[SPEAKER_04]: And...
[SPEAKER_04]: The reason is because he never once deployed his power for his own advantage, ever, unlike Muhammad, unlike all the other people, all of them, always used it to their own advantage.
[SPEAKER_04]: And in the leadership, that's seen where he washes people's feet, I'll summarize this as well, people misread it.
[SPEAKER_04]: They think that he's subjugating himself to his followers.
[SPEAKER_04]: No, he's showing you what leadership is.
[SPEAKER_04]: because leadership is using your power and authority to serve your people.
[SPEAKER_04]: That's what it is, not to milk things from them, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: So, and you can tell that's what's happening, because when he stands up, he straight up tells him I'm God.
[SPEAKER_04]: right I'm the leader he doesn't he doesn't stand up and say you guys are in charge now he stands up and says I am right and because he speaks in this way um people recognize truth at him a false king serves himself but a real king serves as people and
[SPEAKER_04]: Then John brings back something that is true in Western tradition, something that we forget about a lot.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's called the logos, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: And the Greeks thought of the logos as the underlying truth of the universe, physics, moral law, all of it, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: And it's think of it as wood grain.
[SPEAKER_04]: And you're either sanding, planning against the grain, or with the grain, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: Jesus is the character.
[SPEAKER_04]: Very much like Buddha, very much like the Sufi ideal person, the Confucian Junji attuned to the way.
[SPEAKER_04]: They would also, the Muslims also say Muhammad, all of that's kind of a stretch.
[SPEAKER_04]: But
[SPEAKER_04]: This idea of the logos is the one that John used to describe Jesus, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: And the first chapter, first verse actually, in the beginning was the word, the logos, and the word was with God, and the word was God.
[SPEAKER_04]: And then later on he says, and the word became flesh.
[SPEAKER_04]: Like this human being right here is the universe, essentially is what he's saying, the truth of the universe.
[SPEAKER_04]: Nobody has ever made that claim or demonstrated it in the way, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: All of Western civilization is in must be Christian, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: I'm not saying you personally have to be believe it over the fucking one.
[SPEAKER_04]: But our civilization is built on this, starting with the Greek realization that there's an underlying truth to all the universe, to the guy who show, and by the way, I'm not even religious, just telling you the history of this.
[SPEAKER_04]: The Greek starting with the fact,
[SPEAKER_04]: that there's an underlying truth to the universe and then recognizing in the ways that are most important, moral clarity, strong leadership and real masculinity from a male perspective, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: Leadership and strength and moral clarity, the three things that make a good man on display in an actual human being, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: This is,
[SPEAKER_04]: This is what, whether you believe in it and a theological sense or not, this is what people should be teaching their kids.
[SPEAKER_03]: And my last question for you before we get out of here today is, do the Russians know that this is working?
[SPEAKER_05]: Oh, hell yeah.
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, otherwise, well, first of all, they have the internet.
[SPEAKER_05]: It's a very restricted internet, but the guys in charge of this certainly are aware of it.
[SPEAKER_05]: I think that they're probably amazed, particularly Dugan, because for so long, you just a isolated character, and it wasn't until like 2009, you start really making contacts in the American conservative movement.
[SPEAKER_05]: And then,
[SPEAKER_05]: for some reason they grew, and I still don't quite get how that happened, but I think Russia, China, Iran, even North Korea, to some extent, definitely Cuba.
[SPEAKER_05]: They've all recognized it, and I think soon, we're going to view the...
[SPEAKER_05]: Dopamine hits like the manufacturer dopamine hits to get people addicted to content And weaponizing that as a biological attack because it kind of is because it's not just about persuasion and the ecosystem It's if you're you biologically or getting dopamine hits that you kind of need
[SPEAKER_05]: from doing something, then you're going to think you're just authentically coming up with this idea of like, oh, I want that material, but there's actually a biological impulse to it.
[SPEAKER_05]: I think that is thought through, and I think WMD is going to be expanded from weapons of mass destruction to weapons of mass dysfunction.
[SPEAKER_05]: I think basically all these terminologies that we use all have to be upgraded, ideally before we're the enemies force us upgrade that it's going to happen one way or the others.
[SPEAKER_05]: That's a matter of whether we're forced to do it because we're going through so much pain that we have to do it or other we're smart and do it soon.
[SPEAKER_03]: Sorry, I lied about the last question, I'm going to ask you one more here.
[SPEAKER_03]: Does Elon Musk, let's just take Twitter, for example, I think Facebook and Zuckerberg
[SPEAKER_03]: Uh, I think it too entirely different people to be honest with you, does he know this is happening, uh, bot wise to this extent, and that all these topics are getting pushed up, jammed up, likes, retweeted, all that other stuff, and if so, why does any stop it?
[SPEAKER_05]: I think he knows it's pervasive.
[SPEAKER_05]: When I've talked to like internet geeks that know the economics of this, they say it actually would be extremely expensive and time consuming to crack down on this without they're and it would actually cost them money because then you're not getting the amplification and then you don't get the advertising money.
[SPEAKER_05]: So you're asking a businessman to make less profit and spend a lot of his money in order to make less profit
[SPEAKER_05]: I also think he is somewhat unaware of the extent to which this creeps into his own echo chamber because there have been plenty of times he's retweeted or quote tweeted people that he probably shouldn't that whether it's someone with like a white nationalist bent or or someone that is kind of spreading Russian propaganda every once in a while I'm like I just can't believe he saw that instead of everything in the world for me to amplify I'm having a fighting of that thing
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, because I look at this.
[SPEAKER_03]: And with Zuckerberg, there was no doubt in my mind, whoever's paying him, he's fine with it.
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, obviously 2016 was one thing with Russia and all that other shit.
[SPEAKER_03]: You know where these places are coming from.
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, sorry, where these messages are coming from on post and shit like that.
[SPEAKER_03]: They have the technology for all this.
[SPEAKER_03]: Do I think they're incentivized to change it?
[SPEAKER_03]: No, back to your point.
[SPEAKER_03]: Absolutely not.
[SPEAKER_03]: Is a business owner?
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, it'll take away from your business and advertising and all that other shit.
[SPEAKER_03]: But at the end of the day, when is enough money enough money for these guys to where you're actually doing the right thing for the country?
[SPEAKER_03]: And that's what I'm concerned with.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, and I've trouble with that my mind because I guess because I'm not that type of person where it's like I just don't understand how they can say I'm going to participate in the destruction of civil society and Elon Musk openly talks about brain rot being a problem and how short term videos and
[SPEAKER_05]: It was like counterproductive and it's like, yeah, but you're profiting off of it and making that part of our lives because he's in a unique position to determine what our lives actually look like without us having the ability to choose to a certain degree because they're almost like utilities now.
[SPEAKER_05]: You need social media to operate socially and business and everything else and I guess he just doesn't take that responsibility that seriously in that regard.
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, that's all I can come up with.
[SPEAKER_05]: I think it's fatal.
[SPEAKER_05]: Well, whether I should say this or not, I mean that his dad, his dad does have a lot of Russian friends.
[SPEAKER_04]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_04]: He's, I think it's with Elon, I think it's a lot of fatalism.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's why he buys into the universal basic income thing.
[SPEAKER_04]: He thinks that it's inevitable.
[SPEAKER_04]: So why should you do anything to try to stop it?
[SPEAKER_04]: But fatalism is only useful for people who are too afraid to act or the people who
[SPEAKER_04]: profit off of their nihilism.
[SPEAKER_04]: All of these so-called right-wing influencers, most of whom have no fucking clue about our system of government or about any of the people that contributed to it.
[SPEAKER_04]: They know the founder's names, they have no idea.
[SPEAKER_04]: what were on the founder's bookshelves, what books were on.
[SPEAKER_04]: They're fucking morons.
[SPEAKER_04]: All these people are uneducated, swine.
[SPEAKER_04]: They have no fucking clue what they're talking about.
[SPEAKER_04]: But they're charismatic.
[SPEAKER_04]: And sometimes that's all you need to be.
[SPEAKER_04]: But the solution to that isn't to call the end user stupid.
[SPEAKER_04]: Because the end user is not stupid.
[SPEAKER_04]: They're busy.
[SPEAKER_04]: right they're busy and if you don't fucking work for their attention and get in there like this fatalism works in both directions too it's our country can't be saved and it's that guy can't be saved and if you believe that then you're fucking a coward frankly and there's somebody out there profiting off of that nihilism and you're letting it happen so I'm not I refuse to fucking do that
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, and this has been fascinating shit.
[SPEAKER_03]: I could talk to you for three hours today, Mount.
[SPEAKER_03]: I appreciate you being here.
[SPEAKER_03]: Now's the point that we show.
[SPEAKER_03]: We get to the drinking bro the week, which is someone who has inspired you or helps you become the person you are today, who'd like to give the drinking bro the week, too.
[SPEAKER_05]: Oh, man, I think that this one through.
[SPEAKER_05]: I could be just so predictable as layman, just say, Jesus, I mean, that's kind of the first one.
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, I mean, I had two or three Jesuses on the show.
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, really?
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, God.
[SPEAKER_03]: All right, so back.
[SPEAKER_03]: 100 episodes made me and yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, wow.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_05]: Why Jesus?
[SPEAKER_05]: Because every time I follow his example, it works out, and every time I don't, it doesn't work out.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think for me, it was his ability to steal signs and baseball.
[SPEAKER_03]: He was a hell of a baseball player, man.
[SPEAKER_03]: He was very good at it and he could always sit one out, you know.
[SPEAKER_03]: That was, he was just good in the clutch.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's really why I don't wonder why.
[SPEAKER_04]: Dearer wonder why, so like an Arab culture is very common to name your child, not an Indian culture is so much, by the way.
[SPEAKER_04]: Like the 15% or so of India is Muslim, not so common to name your kid Muhammad there, but very common in Arab world, also very common in Latin America to name your code, well, not just Latin America, but Hispanic Europe as well.
[SPEAKER_04]: to name your kid Jesus, maybe it's because it sounds cooler as he zoos.
[SPEAKER_05]: I don't know.
[SPEAKER_05]: But it's, I mean, that is pretty cool.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, it's better than no offense.
[SPEAKER_04]: But you mean, yeah, she was how he was.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, so let's, let's not fall.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, yeah, all right.
[SPEAKER_04]: But it's like, uh, uh, I've always wondered about that.
[SPEAKER_04]: Why do the Spanish cultures do that and the Arab cultures do that, but other cultures don't, it's odd to me.
[SPEAKER_03]: We don't know.
[SPEAKER_03]: And here's the thing.
[SPEAKER_04]: You know, maybe somebody just broke the seal back in the day and they're like, Oh, you need your kid fucking Jesus dude.
[SPEAKER_04]: That's a bit.
[SPEAKER_04]: I mean, it's a lot of pressure on that kid.
[SPEAKER_04]: That person's probably really cool.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_05]: It's a lot of pressure on that kid.
[SPEAKER_05]: That person's probably really cool.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_05]: It's a lot of pressure on that kid.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's a lot of pressure on that kid.
[SPEAKER_03]: That person's probably really cool.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: For a religious nation that we live in, there's not, there's not a lot of white kids named Jesus.
[SPEAKER_05]: I never, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don't see it, I don
[SPEAKER_03]: He could turn water in the wine, though, at your dinner, which would be nice.
[SPEAKER_03]: No, no, no, he didn't drink the bottle.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, that's not the same thing.
[SPEAKER_03]: Tell everybody where they're going to find you, sir.
[SPEAKER_05]: On social media, Ryan Moro.
[SPEAKER_05]: My last name is M-A-U-R-O.
[SPEAKER_05]: And then in my new podcast is the counter offensive.
[SPEAKER_03]: Awesome man.
[SPEAKER_03]: We appreciate you being here.
[SPEAKER_03]: Appreciate you soon and then go to iTunes right to show a five star and leave a quick review.
[SPEAKER_03]: Spotify, Miguel's kicking ass there, blue, putting up the back catalog.
[SPEAKER_03]: Patreon will always be Patreon and if you want to support us and buy some merch, go to drinkingbrows.com.
[SPEAKER_03]: Those are bison shirts right there or selling out right now.
[SPEAKER_03]: We made that live on here last week.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's fucking awesome, man, but yeah, get it while it's out the old cartwheel champion there for a boy For Anthony Anthony Holloway, I'm Ross Patterson this drinking rose pod cast good night everyone