[SPEAKER_03]: Welcome to the lower hounds where your guides to the dance of dragons.
[SPEAKER_03]: This is our feedback episode for house of the dragon season three episode four tumble town tumbleton tumble to town tumble tumble tumble tumble tumble tumble tumble tumble tumble tumble tumble
[SPEAKER_03]: John, tell the folks how they can get in touch to correct our pronunciation.
[SPEAKER_05]: They can hit us on our discord as always is a very lively community and also you can send us an email at hackd at themoahounds.com leave us a voice message and attach it to the email.
[SPEAKER_05]: That's great anytime we can hear voices is awesome thing because you hear hours all the time and we'd love to hear yours but send an email send a voice message hit us
[SPEAKER_03]: love that as well.
[SPEAKER_03]: I like that framing zone that yeah, you hear us like let's hear you a little bit from time to time and you can also support us by subscribing go to the show notes.
[SPEAKER_03]: There's a link to a link tree has all of our subscription options.
[SPEAKER_03]: I was listening today
[SPEAKER_03]: To some other bigger pilots into a few podcasts I guess you could say and a few of them They're like hey, we've got a club.
[SPEAKER_03]: We've got a sub thing and there's some.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm just not going to subscribe to and there's others.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I was thinking about it today.
[SPEAKER_03]: We say this all the time podcasts are say this all the time, but what is it that actually?
[SPEAKER_03]: get somebody to commit some of their hard earned dollars to throw them our way so that we can share the love between us and our co-hosts and pay for all our subscriptions.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I don't know what the magic words are like I don't know that, like.
[SPEAKER_03]: Hmm, you know, entice people or whatever.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm not a snake oil salesman.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm just a lowly average podcaster.
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, it was not a profession that I realized could be a thing when I was a child.
[SPEAKER_03]: But if you want to support us, and it is something that you would drive some personal satisfaction from, hit us up, we'd love to have your support.
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, and stick around for as long as you want and leave when you want.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's no big deal.
[SPEAKER_03]: People roll in and roll out all the time.
[SPEAKER_03]: The point is, is that you get that warm fuzzy feeling for helping some of your favorite podcasters who are independently doing this, like this is not our main gig, you know, like, so there's a lot going on for it.
[SPEAKER_03]: Anyway, enough of that, enough of that, some affiliate news, real quick, John, you, what did you think about going on the Dungeons & Door Eggs podcast?
[SPEAKER_05]: Like, I think I said, like, I knew what was going to be but I didn't know what it was.
[SPEAKER_05]: I'm sorry, not to be.
[SPEAKER_03]: But he was looking at the roller coaster ride and go, okay, look, there's a loop to loop there and then they go around and pass the corner.
[SPEAKER_03]: But until you ride it,
[SPEAKER_05]: I can't really get a sense of, yeah, it's a different experience.
[SPEAKER_05]: It's also, it's also, we had loads of fun on that though, and hopefully we could do it again.
[SPEAKER_03]: Check out Dungeons & Do Rags, our newest affiliate in the Lorhound's Extended Universe, that's Ron Dawson and some of his friends, JD, I do and Jivon, and yeah, it's like going down
[SPEAKER_03]: and talking about pop culture and what's on TV and all that kind of stuff and it gets some takes and got some spicy takes.
[SPEAKER_03]: They're on YouTube as well as a podcast.
[SPEAKER_03]: and they're going to be covering this show weekly as well from their perspective.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think Jean, we might try to do a season wrap like when what we'll do do will still act.
[SPEAKER_03]: Can I speak English?
[SPEAKER_03]: We will still do our Lorehounds wrap up, and maybe we'll talk to Alicia, maybe Jean, John,
[SPEAKER_03]: would be interested in coming on to because I don't know where he is at.
[SPEAKER_03]: I did get one message from him that he'd started it, but then he got busy, blah, blah.
[SPEAKER_03]: So anyway, we'll see what's up for a season rep for us.
[SPEAKER_03]: But I think that we should go on over there again for us.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, that would be cool.
[SPEAKER_05]: That would be cool with the fellas.
[SPEAKER_05]: Hopefully one of this cool would be.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: And hopefully like those like I think
[SPEAKER_03]: Is into comic books at like the same level you are so like that would be awesome if you guys can Yeah, yeah, we'll talk about it and see if we can do something then yeah, that'd be awesome
[SPEAKER_03]: Uh, over with, never mind the music that's Nicole and Mark, our musician and psychiatrist, call it no, wait, psychology professors, they're both professors anyway.
[SPEAKER_03]: I just recorded a anniversary podcast with them that was a lot of fun.
[SPEAKER_03]: It was just a conversation that three of us, but it was really lovely and gosh, I, I just so admire and esteem those guys.
[SPEAKER_03]: So I'm so glad that they,
[SPEAKER_03]: decided to pitch us when they were shopping their podcast idea around and they have just added so much short community and I'm just so grateful.
[SPEAKER_03]: So that will be out in a couple of weeks but check out there.
[SPEAKER_03]: Make sure you're subscribed to their feed to get that conversation.
[SPEAKER_03]: We continue with our list dot vampire list dot coverage.
[SPEAKER_03]: John is running that and Alicia is deep in the levels of silo and her and Luke are winding their way through the stairways and by ways of season three.
[SPEAKER_03]: So go check out.
[SPEAKER_03]: We'll check it out dust.
[SPEAKER_03]: She got the pot.
[SPEAKER_03]: I just got caught up.
[SPEAKER_05]: So yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: Is it good?
[SPEAKER_03]: Is it fire?
[SPEAKER_03]: It's good.
[SPEAKER_05]: It's good.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's good.
[SPEAKER_03]: Great.
[SPEAKER_03]: So again, link in the show notes.
[SPEAKER_03]: There's a link tree and it actually has links to all of the affiliates and all the things.
[SPEAKER_03]: Right.
[SPEAKER_03]: So today we've got some feedback.
[SPEAKER_03]: Nancy, thank you so much.
[SPEAKER_03]: You make our lives so much easier.
[SPEAKER_03]: She's put together this beautiful outline document for us.
[SPEAKER_03]: She's even transcribed the voice mails and put in the places where I'm supposed to press the button for the voice mail and all of that.
[SPEAKER_03]: So like, oh, thank you so much.
[SPEAKER_03]: After we get through the main feedback and voicemails, we'll have military corner, the eyes to promised military assessment of what's happening in West Rose.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I'll explain more of that once we get to that section.
[SPEAKER_03]: Then we'll take our final commercial break.
[SPEAKER_03]: and then we'll get into some book pitch in.
[SPEAKER_03]: We got some pitch in to do about the books.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then that will be at the end because it's got spoilery stuff in it.
[SPEAKER_03]: So if you want to bounce, make sure, you know, we'll give you a warning at that break and then you can check out.
[SPEAKER_03]: John, before we get into the feedback, though.
[SPEAKER_05]: the blue jjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjjj
[SPEAKER_03]: Spain was on fire though like credit to the Spanish.
[SPEAKER_05]: They definitely can great they played well But France was just oh, I don't know where they're they didn't want it.
[SPEAKER_05]: They didn't feel like them No, it seemed like they were totally off their game.
[SPEAKER_03]: But yeah, I was shocked.
[SPEAKER_03]: It was a shocking
[SPEAKER_03]: And then I watched the England Argentina, dad, I did not watch it, I did not watch it.
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, you just don't let Argentina camp outside your goal and not expect stuff to happen.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, I'm sorry, England tactically screwed that up badly.
[SPEAKER_03]: They should have stayed on the attack.
[SPEAKER_03]: You don't let Argentina's going to like best you up.
[SPEAKER_03]: And?
[SPEAKER_03]: I know you don't love him, but like they do it, man.
[SPEAKER_05]: Every time they do a lot of things.
[SPEAKER_05]: They do a lot of things.
[SPEAKER_05]: A lot of this doesn't get called.
[SPEAKER_05]: So true.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's true, but I think we're in for a good game between Argentine and Spain.
[SPEAKER_03]: So I am excited to be in the match.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think the England France game is going to be fun too.
[SPEAKER_03]: It depends on how much teams, how the teams show up, that they feel, if they feel good players, it could be a good game because that's an ancient rivalry, right?
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I know, but I think it'll be a let down because both of them won totally expected to meet in the, in the, in the championship.
[SPEAKER_05]: And the way that they both went out was so kind of like punks.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_05]: So I think this, this matchup is going to be a snooze.
[SPEAKER_05]: Like I don't even think I'm turning in for it.
[SPEAKER_03]: Interesting, okay.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I think it was sub zero on the discord was saying something like yeah They may also be under pressure by the pro teams to say like don't put my star player on the field That they get injured and that too that's so that could really water down the game Anyway, we're not here to talk about World Cup.
[SPEAKER_03]: We're here to talk about dragons
[SPEAKER_03]: We're here to get some feedback from the people, and first up, we've got a voicemail from Karen.
[SPEAKER_03]: Thank you, Karen, for heating the call to send in your voice raven.
[SPEAKER_04]: John, you were actually killing me with the pronunciation of these names.
[SPEAKER_04]: It made me think of the Key and Peel substitute teacher sketch.
[SPEAKER_04]: We got Damian.
[SPEAKER_04]: We got Rinaura.
[SPEAKER_04]: Rinaura has been, she's been plugging away so far this season.
[SPEAKER_04]: We got Tumble Town.
[SPEAKER_03]: That was me.
[SPEAKER_04]: that was from this week.
[SPEAKER_04]: There's been some other ones too.
[SPEAKER_04]: So anyway, love you guys, love the pod.
[SPEAKER_04]: Get this guy a phonetic spelling sheet.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's awesome.
[SPEAKER_03]: Thanks, Karen.
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, people will write in to correct our pronunciations, but they will not write in their deep and thoughtful takes about the strategic position of the forces, a raid in Western Rose, the father and son drama and dynamics that deep social impacts of storytelling of this scale.
[SPEAKER_03]: But, you know, you say Reneera,
[SPEAKER_03]: And care, we love you.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm not making front of you care because we got some comments on Spotify as well, or somebody else was dropping to some comments.
[SPEAKER_05]: And let me just say, I, it's from Game of Thrones onward.
[SPEAKER_05]: I have purposely.
[SPEAKER_05]: said these names the way that I saved them in my head.
[SPEAKER_05]: I know how supposed to be pronounced.
[SPEAKER_05]: But it's so much more fun.
[SPEAKER_05]: I think it's just more fun.
[SPEAKER_05]: I'm just just more fun.
[SPEAKER_05]: So yeah, I appreciate that you call it.
[SPEAKER_05]: So there's also.
[SPEAKER_05]: And it's pronounced, John, not John, John.
[SPEAKER_03]: John, definitely not John, not John.
[SPEAKER_03]: No, no, John, John, John.
[SPEAKER_03]: We've already got a John, John, isn't it?
[SPEAKER_03]: That's right.
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, John, John is not his name.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm not going to talk about that.
[SPEAKER_03]: We're not going to talk about that.
[SPEAKER_03]: I also want to share, Julie, you see on Patreon, because she caught my typo, it was when I published the episodes the other night, I wrote
[SPEAKER_03]: title of the podcast episode.
[SPEAKER_03]: And that was because we had just done two hours you and on a short break.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then we did, I mean, we were on with Ron and company with the Dungeon Genewed Rad Guys for about two hours.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's not all, you know, the recorded conversations an hour something, but we were talking before and after and all that kind of stuff.
[SPEAKER_03]: And so by the time I actually hit publish on the, you know, the episodes to save him in, my brain was fried.
[SPEAKER_03]: So that was a straight up.
[SPEAKER_03]: But Julia, see how to very fun.
[SPEAKER_03]: We had a very fun interaction.
[SPEAKER_03]: She used to see she said it was actually gave her a little joy in her week.
[SPEAKER_03]: So there you go.
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, if we, if we managed to pronounce that, if we got whatever, like, it's just fun.
[SPEAKER_03]: Have fun with it.
[SPEAKER_03]: Alright, we got some love for the show, Zach, to each end of the discord says I enjoyed the first two seasons but feel like the season they're really bringing it and opening up the wallet to make things extra good.
[SPEAKER_03]: The attention to detail has gone up a notch or maybe I'm just paying more attention because these four episodes have been so good, question mark.
[SPEAKER_03]: And jam packed E-Lon says, what are the other podcast and crews I listened to?
[SPEAKER_03]: Thought the episode three was too slow for their taste, but I thought it was very much needed to bring viewers like me back around on Reneera, Reneera, after her seemingly falling completely apart in the first two episodes.
[SPEAKER_03]: Also, it was such
[SPEAKER_03]: a great episode of dread and psychological stress in dosing psychological, psychological stress in dosing horror that I think it is elevating the season to my favorite so far from what I know what's left I expect at it even gets better.
[SPEAKER_03]: What do you think so far there?
[SPEAKER_03]: Or do you want to read Shane's message really quick?
[SPEAKER_05]: And then we can find the disk topic.
[SPEAKER_05]: It's so interesting how people want to bring this show down.
[SPEAKER_05]: I think the three episode, this three episode run is pretty on pause with peak thrones.
[SPEAKER_05]: It's such a tough job to make their own dialogue and they seem to have it down.
[SPEAKER_05]: Also, it's the best-looking show on TV.
[SPEAKER_05]: We are so used to the CGI in the VFX now, but it's groundbreaking.
[SPEAKER_05]: It's like we don't appreciate it anymore.
[SPEAKER_05]: It's stunning stuff they are doing.
[SPEAKER_05]: I want to shout out the VX, the VFX team.
[SPEAKER_05]: I agree.
[SPEAKER_05]: I think the show is gorgeous and I don't see the misgivings that people may have with the show as far as plot or acting or anything else story I don't get it
[SPEAKER_03]: We were on with D&D and it do was like, yeah, it was more episode three is boring.
[SPEAKER_03]: I was just like, what are you talking about?
[SPEAKER_03]: That was the one of the most riveting episodes of television.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like it's going in my nominations for best episode of the year.
[SPEAKER_03]: We started keeping a list of those that we think might work.
[SPEAKER_03]: And this one is right in there for me, no question.
[SPEAKER_03]: Episode three.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think like I said in the main pod, I think that they're going to take there's a bunch of elements in three that I think are going to continue to play out for the rest of the season, so I think that's a really smart pacing.
[SPEAKER_03]: And you know in a show like this eight episodes, we know that there's some big battles and stuff coming up.
[SPEAKER_03]: Pacing is one of those places where people throw a lot of rotten tomatoes at, like, oh, the pacing was off on this episode on the season.
[SPEAKER_03]: Whenever it's a really hard thing to do to get pacing right, and it's a really easy critique to make about pacing.
[SPEAKER_03]: And for me, this is the right amount of fast, slow, wide, narrow.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like I feel like we've got space, like we're moving around Westuros, but I also feel like we're close in and intimate with the important characters, so as they go through their trials and tribulations, we feel the gravity of their situation.
[SPEAKER_03]: It means something to us.
[SPEAKER_03]: They're steaks to it.
[SPEAKER_03]: So I think they're hitting some good strides.
[SPEAKER_03]: There's one area that we are going to talk about in a little bit here.
[SPEAKER_03]: In fact, the next up topic.
[SPEAKER_03]: And that is sort of a, well here, let me, let me, yeah, this is going to, yeah, let's, let's, let's have, I Sadi, frame the issue for it because I think she put some good, she puts it very clearly in succinctly.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm extra mad because I think this episode was solid.
[SPEAKER_03]: They just wanted to remind me of their single and biggest failing as a writer's team.
[SPEAKER_03]: You, oh, this is about sexual assault, using sexual assault as a plot device.
[SPEAKER_03]: You can have it as a plot point.
[SPEAKER_03]: You can have it as a character point.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's a real thing in people's lives and affects victims deeply, much to explore because of that.
[SPEAKER_03]: However,
[SPEAKER_03]: Please, let's stop having it as a throwaway situation to drive plot and character for other people, especially if they are men who are not the victim, especially if you are not going to explore it further.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's insulting and tiring.
[SPEAKER_03]: And it's not like writers don't know how to handle this stuff.
[SPEAKER_03]: This and Allison's iron rod scenes are very different for instance from Aegon's raping of the servant girl in season one, or was that season two?
[SPEAKER_03]: I think that was season two.
[SPEAKER_03]: That served to show Aegon's awfulness, boring, but also showed how Allison dealt with it.
[SPEAKER_03]: One of the best Allison scenes of the show, she sees herself in Diana as a pawn, Diana was the serving girl.
[SPEAKER_03]: As upon abused by men, she sees herself as a mother needing to care for a child in need.
[SPEAKER_03]: She sees herself as a queen needing to protect the air as a monarch needing to make sure that the downtrodden are taken care of as a woman who knows this servant girl as a woman who knows this servant girl nor her family would want or knowing that this servant girl
[SPEAKER_03]: That's an exploration of the cause and effects of sexual assault, even though it wasn't about Diana, but about another character, not this throwaway nonsense.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I'll add that we didn't need to see it to have it very present and clear to us.
[SPEAKER_03]: They did not need to construct a scene for that.
[SPEAKER_03]: It was all through dialogue.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I know that Alicia has made some comments and I think dopamine he had some things to say and maybe TCS I can't remember there's a number of people in the discord and past episodes have been talking around this and I just felt for me the way that ISSI
[SPEAKER_03]: bracketed this, using the contrasting of the Allison's scene really brought sharp relief for me to how lazy using these constructed scenarios is.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes, we know that the soldier is going to be gross and potentially violent.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then now Hugh the Hammer gets to have his man pain because he's got to come in and save his wife.
[SPEAKER_03]: You know that kind of stuff.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's like,
[SPEAKER_03]: or cat's brother needs to, you know, have this terrible consequences and I love, so I really appreciate what I said I had to say here.
[SPEAKER_05]: Now as well put it as well put in, you know, these are things that, you know, need to be pointed out a lot more often than then they are pointed out because that's how, you know, we get some real change in the way stories are told.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, and I realized too, through all this conversations, like, oh, yeah, how kind of desensitized I am to it, too.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm like, oh, of course this is gonna happen.
[SPEAKER_03]: And like, oh, but I do I need to see it in the tilt when she pointed out that Allison scene with Diana was like, oh, we never actually saw any on-screen violence.
[SPEAKER_03]: It was all dialogue.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then the deeper explorations of the impact of that nonsene incident really showed me, like, oh my god, I guess I am, I'm just sort of, yeah, they've numbed me to it because we see it all the time, especially in thrones.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, it's not a potential lived experience, right?
[SPEAKER_05]: Right.
[SPEAKER_05]: And I think that as a guy, that's something that needs to be pointed out, you know,
[SPEAKER_05]: I can't potentially see those things, because it's not good storytelling, you know what I mean?
[SPEAKER_05]: It's another, and there's a reason that it's not good storytelling.
[SPEAKER_05]: And yeah, we need to point these things out a lot more.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, and Alicia had a comment too about the fact that it's popping up almost every week in the show.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's like one of the most, you know, it's arguably one of the most popular shows on TV in the world right now, and as she expressed in a concur, it's getting tiring, it's lazy, and it deflates what is otherwise an excellent show.
[SPEAKER_03]: All right, thank you, I said, yes, it's a really great and to all the rest of the community for having robust conversation about this and being able for us as a community be able to get into these issues in a really constructive and illuminating way.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think that's the value of having a community like this.
[SPEAKER_03]: That said, ISSI does have a voicemail that is about parallel characters.
[SPEAKER_03]: This one came in just under the wire.
[SPEAKER_03]: So just before we start recording, so we have not pre-screened it.
[SPEAKER_03]: So let's listen to what ISSI says.
[SPEAKER_01]: Hello, Laura Hounds.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is ISSI die, long time fan, first time color.
[SPEAKER_01]: Amazing.
[SPEAKER_01]: Three episode of television.
[SPEAKER_01]: A lot of folks have covered what
[SPEAKER_01]: Lots of great points made in the chat.
[SPEAKER_01]: I love how this episode was very humorous, had a lot of action, lots of gross stuff.
[SPEAKER_01]: Scary men being scary, conniving men being conniving, despairing soldiers, et cetera.
[SPEAKER_01]: I felt like I really saw that episode.
[SPEAKER_01]: I wanted to bring up a little bit about the parallels that I saw between characters as well as with previous episodes because they made an impression on me and were just well used to tell the story of characters.
[SPEAKER_01]: The first of course is Ormond and
[SPEAKER_01]: If you recall in season one, there was an episode where Eman was curled up the Sylvie in the brothel and then when Egan shows up to make fun of him, he gets up in all of his nakedness to intimidate a catch.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is the same thing that Orman is doing.
[SPEAKER_01]: This scenes are both of them.
[SPEAKER_01]: Honestly, I'm actually trying their body to interlopers to intimidate them into
[SPEAKER_01]: That's one.
[SPEAKER_01]: Another big one for me was the conversation between Allen and Coralist, as Coralist is leaving to fight the triarchy.
[SPEAKER_01]: The conversation happens at the same arch, if you recall, where Otto tells a young Allison, what she has to do now that he has to do now, but he has a nice ending.
[SPEAKER_01]: The arch of parents and impossible charges, or perhaps the arch of a child's duty, even if you're unprepared to take it on.
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's really what's happening.
[SPEAKER_01]: He is asking Alan to take his place, something he has not prepared his son for at all.
[SPEAKER_01]: to both comply and perform in this role that his dad has unfairly thrust upon him, and that episode in the first season, Otto is doing the same thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: He says, the time is coming out of sin and whether you prepare egg onto rule or you sleep through a new rat and pray for her mercy.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's a very, very hard thing for a young child to hear, and she similarly feels unprepared to do that.
[SPEAKER_01]: Third parallel is about absent-dads.
[SPEAKER_01]: two children who were not prepared by their fathers for their lives to come.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is about Reneera and the Sarah's and Alan and Corlis.
[SPEAKER_01]: In the scene with the model of old Valeria, both Reneera and Alan are dealing with the fallout of the absence of their fathers.
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, that's so good.
[SPEAKER_01]: Four failures in that role.
[SPEAKER_01]: Both of them also make excuses Reneera says that the Sarah's wasn't weak,
[SPEAKER_01]: Allen says his dad just needs to cool off even though in the scene previous he sent to Cornless anger is not something that can be ended with the blade period.
[SPEAKER_01]: They both have criticisms with their fathers but they're both trying to honor them and do the best they can with the loft that they've been given period.
[SPEAKER_01]: In the very last scene, Ormond strongly reminds
[SPEAKER_01]: He says about the Targaryens and their dragons and ruling by dragon, where is reason where is the pride?
[SPEAKER_01]: You have to be reminded of Allison's comments to Reneera in season 1 when her son
[SPEAKER_01]: Both, orment, and allicents are really against the unfairness of a Targaryen, flaunting their power and impunity.
[SPEAKER_01]: Even though one was the morning her life, which is extremely personal, and the other, orment, having, is just have absolute belief in the righteousness of his religion.
[SPEAKER_01]: Lastly, of course, Ned would be disappointed, Orman passes the sentence, but does not swing the sword.
[SPEAKER_01]: Orman, reminded of Reneera, and Otto, when she kills him, but Daran here is under significant duress.
[SPEAKER_01]: Another example in miniature of parents, not truly preparing their children or charges for what they want them to do, where Reneera is under emotional duress, because she wants things to be different and is not prepared for what taking the throne really entails.
[SPEAKER_01]: Last comment to Serian.
[SPEAKER_01]: You're wonderful and I love you.
[SPEAKER_01]: Please burn a date or event.
[SPEAKER_01]: Keep thanks.
[SPEAKER_01]: Bye.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think we should just stop the pod here.
[SPEAKER_03]: That was a, that's a mic, that was a mic drop voicemail.
[SPEAKER_03]: That was awesome.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like I'm trying to keep up on the notes and I'm like it.
[SPEAKER_03]: What about Amand and Ormond and that comparison, that parallel, what do you think about that as well?
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I could see it.
[SPEAKER_05]: And I didn't see it until she pointed it out.
[SPEAKER_05]: To the, to the, to the, to the, to the, to the, to the, I, I really, yeah, it's so interesting that Amand is so, you know,
[SPEAKER_05]: intermingled with these other characters, with Gorman, with Damon, and just really who is he?
[SPEAKER_05]: as a person, besides the psychopath that we all, that I believe that he is, who is he, who they are.
[SPEAKER_05]: And I think it's going to be interesting to see if we get to see a little bit more of his character as he recuperates with Alice.
[SPEAKER_05]: like, yes, yes, like we have children who are grossly mistreated and really not prepared for the world that they will inherit by their parents.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's a major, major theme.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_05]: to the point that I said I just said it's just like you see it with Alan, you see it with Renara, you see it with Deiron, you know what I'm saying?
[SPEAKER_05]: This is a complete everything that we that we see, perhaps maybe the only one in this
[SPEAKER_05]: because her father was so conniving.
[SPEAKER_05]: And so, what's the word I'm looking for?
[SPEAKER_05]: He was so...
[SPEAKER_03]: that was a pushy, but he was just, he was singular, purposeous.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yes, yes, there's always angling to get to some place that I think he trained her for that, to be the one in the room that is making the decisions, how to use what you have in order to get your way.
[SPEAKER_05]: I think he really
[SPEAKER_05]: much to my chagrin and it's disgusting to say.
[SPEAKER_03]: Right, what lessons were the lessons?
[SPEAKER_03]: Right, he was giving lessons.
[SPEAKER_05]: He was giving our lessons.
[SPEAKER_05]: No one else was.
[SPEAKER_03]: Hmm.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's so interesting.
[SPEAKER_03]: And it's like you say, it's the most distasteful of all of the relations.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes, yes.
[SPEAKER_03]: Because he's grooming her and putting her in a position.
[SPEAKER_03]: Hey, put on this dress.
[SPEAKER_03]: Go grab this favorite book of the kings and come for him.
[SPEAKER_05]: Oh, that's so creepy.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes, exactly.
[SPEAKER_03]: Dude.
[SPEAKER_03]: And he lost his head for it.
[SPEAKER_05]: As he should have.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I love those parallels, it's so good, I bet such.
[SPEAKER_03]: And the archway, like, totally missed that.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's an amazing pull.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then having, like, Reneera and Alan down there at the Lego set, you know, in her father's old sort of thing.
[SPEAKER_03]: And he's coming to say, hey, my dad's not coming to a small council, but he said, well, he's nice.
[SPEAKER_03]: And she does have that line about how fathers are both,
[SPEAKER_03]: What was it?
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, shoot.
[SPEAKER_03]: Something about like inspiring, but infuriating simultaneously to have a singular talent for that.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I thought that was a really nice line, a nice way to put a bow on it.
[SPEAKER_03]: But I didn't see the connection of these are two fatherless children.
[SPEAKER_03]: One physically's, no, you know, the father's not there.
[SPEAKER_03]: And the other one is like, I'm here, but I can't give you nothing so by.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm going to punch some pirates in the face.
[SPEAKER_03]: So interesting.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay, awesome.
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, that was an amazing voicemail.
[SPEAKER_03]: Thank you.
[SPEAKER_03]: I guess today, for taking a little time out of your day because I know you were juggling some things there.
[SPEAKER_05]: So, that was great.
[SPEAKER_05]: Thank you for that.
[SPEAKER_03]: Let's talk about Oremond a little bit.
[SPEAKER_03]: Julia F. wrote in using the website contact forum.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'll just get right to it because I've got too many other showsh thoughts that would clog up any attempt at a prelude.
[SPEAKER_03]: Ormond to day-run is mogreen to fray-dow.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's a godfather reference.
[SPEAKER_05]: If you don't know that.
[SPEAKER_05]: Man, that's mogreen in fray-dow.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I see it.
[SPEAKER_03]: Do you like it?
[SPEAKER_03]: Does it work?
[SPEAKER_03]: It took me a minute to work through that.
[SPEAKER_03]: I was like, wait, who's, who what?
[SPEAKER_03]: And yeah.
[SPEAKER_05]: Nah, I can see it.
[SPEAKER_05]: So the 500's heart is Michael.
[SPEAKER_05]: That's that's my point.
[SPEAKER_05]: Okay, that's where that's what I like Drugly that's what that's what I'm like.
[SPEAKER_05]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_05]: The link like who's the Michael you know Can I spoil God for
[SPEAKER_03]: Godfather, too, how old is it?
[SPEAKER_03]: Godfather, how old is it?
[SPEAKER_03]: God
[SPEAKER_03]: And so I think what Julia saying here is that day-run is probably a very sweet and fine individual, but yet is in the context of a thing that is just corruption abounds around them and is easily manipulatable.
[SPEAKER_03]: Character-wise is day-run manipulatable.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know because he's been groomed from the beginning.
[SPEAKER_03]: And he thinks that's the way on text.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, he knows nothing else.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I think that's where Julia F may be leaning towards, because Mo Green was very much abusive to Frado.
[SPEAKER_05]: Okay, you know.
[SPEAKER_05]: But it's been so long since I've seen him.
[SPEAKER_05]: But he's hard to slap them around.
[SPEAKER_05]: You know?
[SPEAKER_05]: And boss them around and made him do the things that he wanted him to do, not necessarily what the family wanted Frado to do.
[SPEAKER_05]: So I think that's where the comparison really
[SPEAKER_05]: It's clear to me in the ways that Armond and Frado treat their charge, because Frado was in Vegas and, you know, for business, but Mo Green was also to look off for him.
[SPEAKER_03]: So, right, right, right, he was in charge of his well-being, but manipulated the individual,
[SPEAKER_03]: It's almost like a vampire thrall.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, yeah, yeah, something like that.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know, maybe there is, or the vampire list dot in the house and the dragon chosen number station here.
[SPEAKER_05]: I'll just ask those guys.
[SPEAKER_05]: No, but I see that I see the comparison though.
[SPEAKER_05]: I do.
[SPEAKER_03]: Good poll, Julia F, I had a comment myself, actually.
[SPEAKER_03]: myself, to the, into the outline.
[SPEAKER_03]: I was listening to House of R. And I think it was the original podcast from their quick reaction thing.
[SPEAKER_03]: And they questioned whether Ormond actually had what's his name from white claw or whatever, a garric, actually gilded.
[SPEAKER_03]: And there was some doubt about whether the sentence was carried out.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I actually disagree in the sense that I think it was carried out.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think he would have carried out that sentence.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I was curious to,
[SPEAKER_03]: hear what you thought, if Oremond actually punished that soldier, because I think there's an issue at the root of that there, not just a hypocrisy of power, but actually Oremond holding on to his power and exercising his power effectively.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, when we, when I watched that episode and after we spoke about the episode, I really thought he did it, he did not know that he did, he did, yes, yes, that the punishment was was given right now having a few days of warm on on my mind, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can, I can
[SPEAKER_05]: where that would be questioned.
[SPEAKER_05]: Because he's a motherfucker.
[SPEAKER_05]: Like, would he punish his soldier for this transgression to these people?
[SPEAKER_05]: So it's a question that I have about
[SPEAKER_05]: what he was willing to do and to who he's willing to do it for, so I can definitely see a world where he did not in the punish.
[SPEAKER_05]: Gerek, but again, as I viewed the episode and as we spoke about the episode, I really felt that he did it.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I come down on the side that he did carry out the punishment because he did give his word to the foot job.
[SPEAKER_03]: What are the calls for?
[SPEAKER_03]: That was a bad thing to say.
[SPEAKER_03]: The Lord foot sees, I don't know.
[SPEAKER_03]: Sorry, you can at me.
[SPEAKER_03]: This one's a freebie at me.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's okay.
[SPEAKER_03]: John's, do we have to pause the podcast?
[SPEAKER_05]: No, no, it's okay, it's okay.
[SPEAKER_03]: The dean, he guys got to me, like, I'm, I don't know, I'm channeling something I didn't get.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think it's a little good.
[SPEAKER_03]: That he gave his word that his surgery would behave themselves.
[SPEAKER_03]: and this soldier violated that.
[SPEAKER_03]: It also is ill, bad discipline.
[SPEAKER_03]: That is bad, that's a bad discipline to true.
[SPEAKER_03]: So if that, if his troops think that they can get away,
[SPEAKER_03]: with behavior that is underhanded and out to oh well you know like by next superior officer or non-commissioned officer or my non-com is nearby and oh I'm going to steal this thing or I'm going to do something that I know I'm not supposed to do that is bad discipline
[SPEAKER_03]: And if anything, I would say that Oremond would want to field a well-disappearment than troops, so that when he says, you know, break right, you know, break right, or charge, or whatever, that without hesitation, those who are carried out, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: And so if he were then to seemingly give this public pronouncement because there were other soldiers around and other public people around and they heard him say one thing, but then later on, they see old Gareth walking down the street like, hey, without a broken arm or anything else in the other bandages on his body, they're like, oh, broken is not.
[SPEAKER_03]: truthful to what he's saying.
[SPEAKER_03]: So I don't know now where the boundaries lie.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know what I can get away with.
[SPEAKER_03]: Maybe I'm a kind of person who would try to push those boundaries and get away with something.
[SPEAKER_03]: So to me, it weakens his mystique of power and his actual power by not following through with that publicly pronounced sentence.
[SPEAKER_05]: That makes sense.
[SPEAKER_05]: That makes all the sense in the world.
[SPEAKER_05]: I just, you know, he's a low-daunt dirty snake ass and not just so you know.
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, Alicia had some thoughts about Ormond, Lord Ormond, the well-based is a snub through and through, so I think you and her are an agreement.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I look forward to his death, almost as much as John looks forward to Kristen Cole's death.
[SPEAKER_05]: This is amazing.
[SPEAKER_05]: This is good stuff right here.
[SPEAKER_03]: How dare sir smells a lot.
[SPEAKER_03]: Come on.
[SPEAKER_03]: Now when it was just that, that was like right there.
[SPEAKER_03]: How could you not take that one?
[SPEAKER_03]: uh... tell their unnotto show his poor chained up dragon affection i know that's not how he spoke he's supposed to go out but to sarion burn this man
[SPEAKER_03]: The fact that he killed Hughes' brother-in-law in secret means that he's not doing it to deter others from defying him, it's pure sadism, and I have a hard time seeing in a good parenting intentions and bringing his nephew down to this level, the Mustache has officially been twirled.
[SPEAKER_03]: Uh, and I think she's putting some internet points down on this next production.
[SPEAKER_03]: I swear I'm not a violent person, but it's going to be funny when like this is the prediction.
[SPEAKER_03]: When Agon kills her douche of rook's rest of ruins.
[SPEAKER_03]: The whole boy.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_03]: So.
[SPEAKER_03]: I guess that's a prediction there of how things are going to go down.
[SPEAKER_03]: So reduce of rook's rest ruin.
[SPEAKER_03]: So she's talking, so we're shifting locations here to rook's rest.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes, yes.
[SPEAKER_03]: From tumble town, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tumble, tum
[SPEAKER_05]: No, no, I wouldn't enjoy saying, hey, gone, have any, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry.
[SPEAKER_05]: No, absolutely bad.
[SPEAKER_05]: No redemption.
[SPEAKER_05]: No, no, sir, do you know, yes, okay, but no, I won't be happy to see it.
[SPEAKER_05]: And I won't be glad that they got gifts someone else come up and it's like, no, get out of here.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, so Aegon being gentle with Sunfire just doesn't move your spirits.
[SPEAKER_05]: Absolutely not, not one eye out of my big of my being felt any sorrow, any solace in that moment.
[SPEAKER_05]: No, enough.
[SPEAKER_05]: Fair enough.
[SPEAKER_05]: At least not for Aegon, you know, it was hard looking at Sunfire that way, but.
[SPEAKER_05]: Right.
[SPEAKER_05]: That burnt king out of here, boy.
[SPEAKER_03]: Let's do this, let's take a quick break.
[SPEAKER_03]: And when we come back, let's spend a little more time with our find, smelling friend, hormone.
[SPEAKER_03]: And we're back.
[SPEAKER_03]: And Nate had a comment or two about Ormond.
[SPEAKER_03]: So I guess Ormond's plan was that Amen and Vigar would come and save their situation.
[SPEAKER_03]: And since that's not happening, he's got a he has a little hissy fit without Vigar.
[SPEAKER_03]: He's just stuck in Tumbleton.
[SPEAKER_03]: If Reneer decides to burn the whole place down, which is a logical choice, except the narrative has decreed that no, in fact, the small folk are an amorphous, all-powerful mob that Reneer is petrified of.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know if I think they should petrified of them.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think she actually has sympathy and empathy for them.
[SPEAKER_05]: I just don't think she wants to kill everybody.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: And as you native pointed out earlier, killing all your small folk, I mean, like Templeton is an important trading town as I understand it.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's a crossroads, a lot of sort of goods and materials come in there and then get redistributed and redirected, it's just outside of Kings Landing, it's near enough, oh, where's my map go?
[SPEAKER_03]: It's at the headwaters of the mander and so you've got some river traffic there and you've got all of sort of the high garden, you've got the kingswood to one side.
[SPEAKER_03]: So you get a lot of things.
[SPEAKER_03]: Templeton's kind of a lens focal point for kingslanding, both for goods coming and going.
[SPEAKER_03]: So burning Templeton and burning the small folk there would
[SPEAKER_03]: Nate continues actually more military thoughts.
[SPEAKER_03]: I guess I can accept that the human shield angle has some basis when we learn that the foots who ruled Templeton were on team black.
[SPEAKER_03]: The foots somebody we can't remember their actual last name.
[SPEAKER_03]: Because now it's not about generic, don't burn the small folk.
[SPEAKER_03]: We've added a political element whereby Reneer comes if Reneer comes in blasts, Tumbleton, to root out the high tower.
[SPEAKER_03]: She's only not only killing cities, but they're also the cities who serve a house, who stayed loyal to her.
[SPEAKER_03]: So since they declared for a house black, then what are you communicating to your other supporters?
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, I'm just going to burn you and it's and when it's politically expedient for me to do so.
[SPEAKER_03]: Nate continues.
[SPEAKER_03]: Anyway, the correct answer is to fly to Old Town and burn the shit out of the street.
[SPEAKER_03]: I agree to a lot of Lee.
[SPEAKER_03]: He has no, no, no, no, no.
[SPEAKER_03]: Nate continues any assessment of hormones planning has to take into account that we, or at least eyes, a non-book reader,
[SPEAKER_03]: When Paul, I listened to last night, posited that he hold up in Tommelton to wait for Amenvegar to cover his movements because without that, he'd be vulnerable to dragon air strikes, which, okay, yes, but to what end?
[SPEAKER_03]: Because if it was to go home, he already had secured that.
[SPEAKER_03]: Obviously, that was not his purpose.
[SPEAKER_03]: So, he was trying to set a trap for Reneera and the Black Dragons to draw them to him and have Vigar ambush him, perhaps, but that seems silly.
[SPEAKER_03]: Vigar is one dragon, despite being the biggest dragon, and given what we see in this episode, it doesn't seem like he'd risk Daryon and to Serian to help him.
[SPEAKER_03]: But if we look at it as his plan is to put Darren on the throne, maybe the idea was to hold up in Tumbleton, have all the dragons of both sides converge, and they take out each other.
[SPEAKER_03]: There's a part of me that thinks he's upset, Amen isn't coming, because he wants Amen to be in danger, and die.
[SPEAKER_03]: I agree.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, he was actually trying to get Amen ambushed.
[SPEAKER_03]: Question Mark?
[SPEAKER_03]: I can see Matt, yes.
[SPEAKER_03]: Mm-hmm.
[SPEAKER_03]: He clearly doesn't like dragons or Targaryens, and has faith, militant energy.
[SPEAKER_03]: It sounds like his ultimate goal is to see as many of the Targaryens and dragons die.
[SPEAKER_03]: I like this actually, I think, because what do we have in this time period?
[SPEAKER_03]: This is the official thing, is it the death of dragons?
[SPEAKER_03]: This is like the period.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes, what do you wish?
[SPEAKER_03]: There are no more dragons, yes, yes, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: And Targaryen rule is shrinking at this point as well, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: We lose House Valerian and do we have any Targaryens by the time?
[SPEAKER_03]: No, we only have secret Targaryens by the time Game of Thrones come around, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: We have a Targaryen in the night's watch.
[SPEAKER_03]: We have two Targaryens in the night's watch, sorry.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then we have the brother and sister, obviously Danny.
[SPEAKER_03]: So that's interesting, so the high towers are going to spend a whole bunch of their blood and treasure on basically tearing the hard out of Targaryen rule, which is what they want, but they want to put one of theirs on, but we don't see that in Game of Thrones, so that's interesting, that's interesting to me.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like we know an end result, but like how do we get there?
[SPEAKER_03]: They continue to go into Templeton, keeps the war open, but beyond that, I'm not sure what it does.
[SPEAKER_03]: There's got to be more to drop, which we will likely see next week, episode 5 seems battle heavy, so before warned, for those of you who don't like that, go in for that kind of stuff.
[SPEAKER_03]: If I were a reneera, I'd recognize that I shouldn't burn cities owned by no, nominal allies like Templeton is.
[SPEAKER_03]: But as far as we know, Old Town isn't open target.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'd have Missaria prove her usefulness and reach by finding out what old town's air defense is looked like.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm not a really good point.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know if she has the reach.
[SPEAKER_03]: She would have to build that network.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know if she's got people and getting somebody all the way down to old town.
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, the triarchy smashed, so maybe you could get somebody around by boat, but getting them overland would be a very difficult thing.
[SPEAKER_03]: And getting that real time intelligence back and forth would be tough, but it is a good
[SPEAKER_03]: Uh, Nate concludes if there are no or few scorpions, then send the three knuckle hands along one culpit right at a burp down the old down docks, street of steel, forges and smithies and high tower castle.
[SPEAKER_03]: Conspicuously leave the seped alone, this time, along with the citadel.
[SPEAKER_03]: little strategic air bombing campaign there, Allah World War II.
[SPEAKER_03]: Take out manufacturing base, but leave some other things alone.
[SPEAKER_03]: Thoughts.
[SPEAKER_05]: Now I agree with burning old town.
[SPEAKER_03]: You don't like what my assessment from the last episode?
[SPEAKER_03]: Just in circlet and leave him there, let him starve out.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I'm, I'm full burnin' shit.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm, I'm, I'm starting with the high dollars.
[SPEAKER_05]: Starting, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, I'm full burnin' shit.
[SPEAKER_05]: I see burnin' shit down.
[SPEAKER_03]: So I'll have some more military thoughts when we get to military corner a little bit later.
[SPEAKER_03]: But I like Nate working through the things here and figuring out.
[SPEAKER_03]: In the military corner, I think too, I'll just note that I don't really have commentary or editorial, but I have more tactical situation than we can talk commentary maybe after we see next episode.
[SPEAKER_03]: Because I agree, there's not enough information for us, but if we remember,
[SPEAKER_03]: that the Lannister Force was taken out by the graveyards and the riverlands folks.
[SPEAKER_03]: So Lannister was supposed to come through.
[SPEAKER_03]: We were supposed to have a force coming out of King's Landing led by Kristen Cole with the,
[SPEAKER_03]: high tower army coming up from the south.
[SPEAKER_03]: So those three elements were supposed to converge.
[SPEAKER_03]: But one's been taken out.
[SPEAKER_03]: One is small and ineffective and we'll talk about them later.
[SPEAKER_03]: And their air power is non-existent or is unnon-non-non-non-state.
[SPEAKER_03]: So.
[SPEAKER_03]: So but we just have to remember why did he take to old town?
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, he could have gone back or he instead decided to continue forward.
[SPEAKER_03]: Did he know about the Lannister force being taken out?
[SPEAKER_03]: We don't know we have not been told.
[SPEAKER_03]: So, and we don't know where the brassians are.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's another open question.
[SPEAKER_03]: So, we'll leave all of that all there and we'll talk about more a little bit later.
[SPEAKER_03]: You want to jump down to day-run the non-blonde.
[SPEAKER_05]: This is also from Nate on our discord.
[SPEAKER_05]: Does they run favorite elicent?
[SPEAKER_05]: That's wrong, we are, they dying, his talk area in here to be read.
[SPEAKER_05]: They run might be a wild card.
[SPEAKER_05]: He seems very, yes, sir, to Orma.
[SPEAKER_05]: But his comment about soon being able to fly with the sir who, if to sorry on, maybe means he's just playing the roles Orma and we'll get out when he can.
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, I want him to get out when he can.
[SPEAKER_05]: I would like that, but I don't think he will.
[SPEAKER_05]: Unfortunately, I don't think he will.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think Oman has him firmly in his grasp to the point that he is the legit air, but he calls Oman's side.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_03]: a bunch of other podcasts have been talking about this whole conditioning that Darren has been put through and what hormone has how he has created this psychological old hold over this seemingly young sweet kid yeah I don't think and he does play by the sense strongly yes
[SPEAKER_03]: Do you think the hair job, do you think the hair is a die job or is it naturally red?
[SPEAKER_03]: I think it's naturally red.
[SPEAKER_03]: No, it's not because that was the reason that she sent them.
[SPEAKER_03]: Right, that's what I thought too.
[SPEAKER_03]: To be with, um, go south to high towers.
[SPEAKER_03]: Right, because he didn't have white hair.
[SPEAKER_05]: Because he didn't look like a talker.
[SPEAKER_05]: Right.
[SPEAKER_05]: She wanted their on to be one of them.
[SPEAKER_05]: What a head trip for Allison.
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, it's going to be going to fuck up.
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, like all over his, all of our, like how much can we, as parents, take responsibility for the development of our children and how much is it just them, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, there's a lot of tension around those questions about what do, how much effect do you really have on your child and how much does the environment and make your versus nurture.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, that whole thing, right.
[SPEAKER_03]: There's a big dynamic there backwards and forwards.
[SPEAKER_03]: Man, I don't know backwards as far.
[SPEAKER_03]: There's a dynamic, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: There's a really big context and poor for Alison
[SPEAKER_03]: Doesn't have a lot to show for her mother.
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, Helena's sweet and alive.
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, the other ones, it's a rough, I was saying I got a rough go of things.
[SPEAKER_05]: I know she's a horrible parent.
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, I want to say it.
[SPEAKER_05]: I didn't want to say it.
[SPEAKER_05]: I want to call her aable parent.
[SPEAKER_05]: She's a whole goler out.
[SPEAKER_05]: There are no good parents on this show.
[SPEAKER_05]: Right.
[SPEAKER_05]: Exactly, right?
[SPEAKER_05]: None.
[SPEAKER_05]: No one has excused from this.
[SPEAKER_05]: None of them are.
[SPEAKER_05]: how not I'm here and none of them are right and at the first, you know, inkling someone can get sent to live elsewhere.
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, in their children become political ponds, right, because you're either hooked up and married for political expediency, or your scent as ward to another family, again, for political, I mean, it's just like not it's the same purpose without being married.
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, you're mixing bloodlines if you're actually sending a daughter or receiving a daughter so that they can marry and you can actually literally join your two households.
[SPEAKER_05]: So, though, I don't, no one is spared none of them are spared from the criticism of them being parents, of how they parent their children.
[SPEAKER_05]: No one on this show.
[SPEAKER_03]: Let's talk about sheep's dealer and caraxies and their little meet cute.
[SPEAKER_03]: Satuichi said, do we know if a sheep's dealer, and do we know what the gender of sheep's dealer and cracks these are?
[SPEAKER_03]: Man, is that to which it was just wondering is there is one of them in rot or in heat?
[SPEAKER_03]: Is there any, do we know and then Marilyn jumped in to say that?
[SPEAKER_03]: We know very little about the sex life, subtractions.
[SPEAKER_05]: Would I, I almost certain that they are both male.
[SPEAKER_05]: I'm like, yeah, they're male dragons.
[SPEAKER_03]: Doesn't, that's somebody clarified on something.
[SPEAKER_03]: But then when we're talking about dragons,
[SPEAKER_03]: at that level.
[SPEAKER_03]: And are we anthropomorphizing gender or biological sex onto them?
[SPEAKER_03]: Because, you know, how do they reproduce?
[SPEAKER_03]: Is it a normal, these are dragons?
[SPEAKER_03]: It's not normal mammalian biology.
[SPEAKER_05]: Wait a minute.
[SPEAKER_05]: Oh, are we saying it's magical?
[SPEAKER_05]: Maybe.
[SPEAKER_05]: Oh, maybe.
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, I mean, I'm here for the magic.
[SPEAKER_05]: I'm here for the magic.
[SPEAKER_03]: They got dragon wifi.
[SPEAKER_05]: I don't need chromosomes.
[SPEAKER_05]: I don't need to write you exactly.
[SPEAKER_05]: I don't need we're I don't need none of that if we talk about is magic Let's make it magic baby.
[SPEAKER_05]: Let's do it.
[SPEAKER_05]: Go science be damned magic.
[SPEAKER_05]: It's simple.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like if we're going to go there.
[SPEAKER_03]: Let's go there.
[SPEAKER_05]: Right.
[SPEAKER_05]: Let's do it.
[SPEAKER_05]: Cool.
[SPEAKER_03]: I like it.
[SPEAKER_03]: Rocky's in me when I read Rocky's image comment there.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, why don't you do Rakezim and Alicia's formal feedback as well?
[SPEAKER_05]: I'll let's do that.
[SPEAKER_05]: So Rakezim on the discord, I think Rakezim smells sheepy, sheep rough.
[SPEAKER_05]: I just wanted to hear you say sheepy.
[SPEAKER_05]: Oh, Rakezim was not happy to see sheepy.
[SPEAKER_05]: I like how Rakezim's gives off a snake vibe or serpent with the high pitch sounds in the long slender body.
[SPEAKER_05]: Just like how Damon is a snake.
[SPEAKER_05]: It can't be trusted.
[SPEAKER_04]: Oh, 100% of Rakezim's characters.
[SPEAKER_05]: I looked up information about sheep's dealer and found that he had a rivalry with another dragon.
[SPEAKER_05]: This may have caused the damage to his mouth.
[SPEAKER_05]: Is it dangerous?
[SPEAKER_05]: That's just sheepy.
[SPEAKER_05]: I don't know, but who's this other dragon that's running up on my boy Sheepie?
[SPEAKER_05]: I think I know who is it, is it cannibal, who is it?
[SPEAKER_05]: Because I'm ready to ride.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm ready to ride.
[SPEAKER_03]: Let's get John a backseat on a dragon mount and let him go.
[SPEAKER_05]: I'm ready to ride out with Sheepie, but come on.
[SPEAKER_05]: And this is from Alicia Norhound.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, she said it in a long email this time and then Nancy broke up the pieces and fit them through so is because the last time it was like, wow, the voicemail was so awesome and then it was like, oh, I have what so this time we altered things a little bit so that we could actually discuss what Holy Shes to say a bit nice.
[SPEAKER_05]: So she writes, and I know we all love shipping, but my first dragon love remained caraxous.
[SPEAKER_05]: So many glorious new looks and sounds from the bloodworm with a deviated septum this week.
[SPEAKER_05]: I am not going to do this, yeah, we're not pronouncing those things.
[SPEAKER_03]: All right, no, and I should note, I should note that this is me.
[SPEAKER_03]: I went and looked at this.
[SPEAKER_05]: Okay, okay, thank you.
[SPEAKER_03]: But then this is her comment after words, but I just had to, I just had to throw this in because to me it just seemed like, you know, you know how we have Valar?
[SPEAKER_03]: Valar has that, that is, that is all dragons must I.
[SPEAKER_03]: I know this error.
[SPEAKER_05]: I know this error is the great dying of the dragons, but I dread it happening to corrects the most, yeah, I feel you.
[SPEAKER_05]: So yeah, it is sad, this is a sad time, and I don't know how we're all going to deal with it, but deal with it, we're going to have to.
[SPEAKER_03]: And it's interesting, because in this episode, we can front the mortality of dragons.
[SPEAKER_03]: And we've been confronting the mortality of dragons since Malice.
[SPEAKER_03]: Really, these things, these big mythological power in the minds of people,
[SPEAKER_03]: Whoa, and then one can die, and I think they address that in season two a little a little bit they talked about it.
[SPEAKER_03]: They're like, you have pierced the veil of their all powerfulness.
[SPEAKER_03]: And now we're seeing how mortal they they really are the the citizenry is and that's going to change the balance of power.
[SPEAKER_03]: In terms of.
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, these things can be defeated.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, and we lost Jayce and Vermax, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: So, and Sunfire, well, yeah, what?
[SPEAKER_03]: And air acts, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: So we've lost three dragons in the time frame of what?
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, that news is gonna spread amongst people and that's, there people are gonna have a reaction to that.
[SPEAKER_03]: Because that was the power that was keeping everything in check.
[SPEAKER_03]: And now suddenly that power is gone.
[SPEAKER_03]: or is going a bull, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: It is, it is not like we thought it was.
[SPEAKER_05]: And the bodies are there to be seen.
[SPEAKER_05]: There's proof evidence.
[SPEAKER_05]: Right.
[SPEAKER_05]: It takes the awe out of it when you can see the bodies there.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's almost like realizing that there's a body, a narrow body of water that you can control.
[SPEAKER_03]: And you've actually demonstrated that control.
[SPEAKER_03]: Sorry, that's a little bit more logical.
[SPEAKER_03]: But it's like that.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's like, oh, there's this thing that we thought was the thing is not a thing.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's actually this other thing.
[SPEAKER_03]: And that changes how we are all organized.
[SPEAKER_03]: And what we need to do and how we need to manage situations and we need to figure out different ways of doing things because dragons are not all powerful.
[SPEAKER_02]: good.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_02]: Uh.
[SPEAKER_02]: Improper.
[SPEAKER_03]: When you jump.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_05]: At least show a name.
[SPEAKER_03]: Um.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, do do Nate and then roll into Alicia.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like you actually join them like in your own reading of the two.
[SPEAKER_05]: So let's go to Aegon Benz-The-Ne.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, you like saying that, don't you?
[SPEAKER_03]: I do.
[SPEAKER_05]: I don't.
[SPEAKER_05]: It's so very, yeah, it's just easy to say.
[SPEAKER_05]: This is from Nate on the Discord.
[SPEAKER_05]: I can't have been the only person who was really worried about what was going to happen when the punk in charge of Rick's rest told Aegon to get on his knees.
[SPEAKER_03]: That one has a name, I think Alicia, what did she call him?
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm trying to find it now, carry on and I'll try to find it.
[SPEAKER_05]: Okay, and this comes in from Alicia, how dare they make me root for Aegon the second LOL, but it's good to see him being forced to experience that peasant life.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I'm cool with having to see him in this way, it actually makes me happy.
[SPEAKER_05]: He's been looking to learn the lessons.
[SPEAKER_05]: No, he's not.
[SPEAKER_05]: But it makes me happy that he has to suffer.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_05]: I'm cool with all of it.
[SPEAKER_05]: I am very, very happy in this moment.
[SPEAKER_05]: I am sure you're going to have a rook's rest ruins.
[SPEAKER_05]: That's what you call them.
[SPEAKER_05]: Sir, that's what you call them earlier.
[SPEAKER_05]: Sir, do you have rook's rest ruins?
[SPEAKER_05]: And that's not to say that, you know, I fuck with Sir Duce.
[SPEAKER_05]: Like, I'm not Team Sir Duce.
[SPEAKER_02]: No, no, no.
[SPEAKER_05]: I am not.
[SPEAKER_05]: There's just be clear on that, everyone.
[SPEAKER_05]: But yeah, like the Burnt King, man, fucking.
[SPEAKER_03]: word.
[SPEAKER_03]: All right.
[SPEAKER_03]: Let's see.
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, wow.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think you need to read this next one.
[SPEAKER_03]: Where are we going?
[SPEAKER_05]: Oh, the cease-naked slivers away.
[SPEAKER_05]: That's it.
[SPEAKER_05]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_05]: Not to join John.
[SPEAKER_05]: This is from Alicia again.
[SPEAKER_05]: This is why excuse me, this from Alicia.
[SPEAKER_05]: Not to join John.
[SPEAKER_05]: I'm the
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean really, really, this is really, but seems dumb to me that he was squandered his chance to have an influence on the direction of the war by fulfilling his role as the hand.
[SPEAKER_05]: His home has burned, his succession remains insecure, screaming at Raynara.
[SPEAKER_05]: No, your children are bastards in running away seems like the best way to undermine getting any of those personal goals back on track.
[SPEAKER_05]: What is his plan now?
[SPEAKER_05]: But do you think?
[SPEAKER_05]: I agree.
[SPEAKER_05]: He's hunting the triarchy raiders, so he's basically, so basically he's putting his old grievances
[SPEAKER_05]: Also, I'm her hand, not her mouth, leaving the talk, leave the talking to those who relish it.
[SPEAKER_05]: The hand has one job, and it is to be the voice in the monarch's ear, why wait a waste one of the most powerful opportunities in Westerners and undermine all of your goals at once.
[SPEAKER_05]: And finally, at least he's putting Allen in front of her more so she can learn a greater appreciation of him.
[SPEAKER_05]: I guess we'll see how that pans out.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_05]: I got to agree with everything but the last one.
[SPEAKER_05]: Uh-huh.
[SPEAKER_05]: Like I don't like that sheep that he's putting Allen in this position at all for the reasons that I stated earlier on our pod.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, it's entirely inappropriate.
[SPEAKER_03]: He's entirely not prepared to handle that.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, again, bad parenting's who are not preparing to children, who are the world that they will inherit.
[SPEAKER_05]: We're not saying that Allen is not capable.
[SPEAKER_03]: No, no, no, no.
[SPEAKER_03]: We're saying that he doesn't have a proper orientation to the work that he is being put in front of him.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's exactly it.
[SPEAKER_03]: But everything else I agree with.
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, he's running the ship and there's some of those politics involved there right in terms supplies and different divisions of labor and personnel and that kind of stuff, but we're talking on a scale that just dwarfs anything that Allen has ever experienced.
[SPEAKER_03]: and the lessons that you learn at that small scale don't necessarily apply to this scale.
[SPEAKER_03]: And there's a political dimension to the hands job as well.
[SPEAKER_03]: The appearance of power, the way that people respond to the decisions.
[SPEAKER_03]: When you're in a ship, the discipline is firm and ordered and there is no questioning of it.
[SPEAKER_03]: When you're dealing with,
[SPEAKER_03]: nobility major and minor when you're dealing with trade and merchant.
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, it's an inordinately complex thing dealing with your diplomatic core or getting rid of them all so that you're making decision.
[SPEAKER_03]: It doesn't work very well.
[SPEAKER_03]: You've got to have a call and the hand is the full drum of all of that and you're the gatekeeper for all of the information and you have to
[SPEAKER_03]: and then help with the frequency of the decisions that they have to make so that they're making the most important decisions and not wasting their effort on frivolous things.
[SPEAKER_05]: And the thing that gets me, like I know he's hurt and I understand that and I know he's pissed and I understand that but what he's doing is actually not helping.
[SPEAKER_05]: the people that he is saying that he wants to help, which is why I call bullshit on it all, because it's not about his Adam and it's not about our Adam.
[SPEAKER_05]: Never was.
[SPEAKER_05]: Right, agreed.
[SPEAKER_03]: Before we get into the military corner stuff and then do our final break before we get into the book,
[SPEAKER_03]: Alicia's got a couple more comments.
[SPEAKER_03]: You went around up on both of those.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, Chris Be cool.
[SPEAKER_05]: As a Christian, as a Christian, should be charged.
[SPEAKER_03]: Can you answer it?
[SPEAKER_03]: That's fine.
[SPEAKER_05]: That's so crystal.
[SPEAKER_05]: Should be charged like a coal.
[SPEAKER_03]: She's that right early pen is coming out.
[SPEAKER_05]: And she's doing a obligatory, the Vampirely Side reference of the week incoming.
[SPEAKER_05]: People say, Amah is a petty violent ex.
[SPEAKER_05]: Chris, dude, Raynard didn't want to marry you a decade or more ago.
[SPEAKER_05]: Get over it.
[SPEAKER_05]: truth.
[SPEAKER_05]: All you're doing is providing exact is proving exactly why you would never have been a suitable key to consort.
[SPEAKER_02]: Uh-huh.
[SPEAKER_05]: Facts.
[SPEAKER_05]: All facts.
[SPEAKER_05]: Uh-huh.
[SPEAKER_05]: So Christian should be charred like and then finally this is from Elisa, how to hide a dragon.
[SPEAKER_05]: That's what I'm on.
[SPEAKER_05]: I'm a, I assume he's an Alice's bedroom healing.
[SPEAKER_05]: But where is Vega?
[SPEAKER_05]: That's a big dragon to hide.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, that's the question of the day.
[SPEAKER_03]: But I think that it is a big thing to hide.
[SPEAKER_03]: But remember.
[SPEAKER_03]: when both on the sand on the beach would aim and went out there, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: Or outside of storms end when we see, you know, big R rise up in the in the stormy background, but there was another scene where is it?
[SPEAKER_03]: It was the battle of rook's rest.
[SPEAKER_03]: Now there's another one where aiming went out to find him and we didn't see him and then suddenly he rises up out of the forest.
[SPEAKER_03]: So there's been a couple of scenes where we've seen big are all in the ground and just sort of blending into the forest.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_05]: Fair enough.
[SPEAKER_03]: I have some past experience with working in and around large wildlife in East Africa.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I can tell you that you could have an elephant in a bunch of, a bunch of elephants in a bunch of, you know, shrubbery off to the side.
[SPEAKER_03]: And you could not know that they're there.
[SPEAKER_03]: And when they come through or, you know, when they're walking, they're very quiet when they walk.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then suddenly there's an elephant there.
[SPEAKER_03]: And he didn't know it was there.
[SPEAKER_03]: Or a buffalo.
[SPEAKER_03]: I get buffaloes under the shade trees, especially male buffaloes that are off the side, whatever.
[SPEAKER_03]: Lepards, you can almost never see them if they don't want to be seen.
[SPEAKER_03]: So those are much smaller.
[SPEAKER_03]: I granted.
[SPEAKER_03]: But large, large animals tend to blend into the terrain.
[SPEAKER_03]: I know it's a weird thing to contemplate.
[SPEAKER_03]: But when you see veg are curled out, like if, you know, he's curled up, knows the tail, like a kitty cat.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's just like a big mound of dirt.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's just a big,
[SPEAKER_03]: So it's possible.
[SPEAKER_03]: I was trying to think there was one other part I was listening to today, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: In the houses are deep dive and they had at somebody right in to say that that person thought that big arm might be on what's the island, the Isle of Faces in the God's High Lake next to Heron Hall.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like that would be a good place for a big arm to hold up, take a little nap, hang out with
[SPEAKER_03]: That makes sense to me, because he's near enough to his writer, who's at hair and all.
[SPEAKER_03]: But far enough away that maybe we can't see him and he's just curled up in some hollow or something like that.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's my thought anyway.
[SPEAKER_05]: We shall see.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay, so let's talk some military stuff here.
[SPEAKER_03]: So what I wanted to do was to make sure that each week we had sort of a clear assessment and understanding of where the different forces are arrayed throughout Westeros.
[SPEAKER_03]: And so I pulled together all the information that I could.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then I was thinking, there's a senior military commander, battlefield commanders.
[SPEAKER_03]: Get these type of
[SPEAKER_03]: get these type of reports that give them a situational overview and they're structured in a particular way.
[SPEAKER_03]: There's a situational assessment, like a paragraph or two, then there's a disposition of the forces, your forces, enemy forces, any other combatant or non-combatant forces, key terrain, and then an overall assessment again.
[SPEAKER_03]: So I sort of structured all of this information in this way
[SPEAKER_03]: And then I've got a couple of notes on maybe defining or explaining a little bit more, some military theory and practice that would be helpful for folks to understand.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then that, yeah, we'll get to that section after I do the sort of report.
[SPEAKER_03]: And again, this is not editorial and this is not commentary.
[SPEAKER_03]: This is best as I can, a clean, dry tactical assessment.
[SPEAKER_03]: so you can sort of draw your own conclusions and keep things in mind like who's coming from where and where are different people in different stages.
[SPEAKER_03]: So at the end of episode four, we have three active military fronts.
[SPEAKER_03]: This is after episode four, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: This is where we are now at this episode.
[SPEAKER_03]: The blacks are holding King's Landing as essentially as a central and fortified position.
[SPEAKER_03]: The greens are holding Tumbleton with the largest field army that we're aware of on the battlefield at this moment.
[SPEAKER_03]: And Coralis is conducting a separate coastal security operation against the triarchy raiders in the Gallet and around Driftmark.
[SPEAKER_03]: And there's a fourth major factor, which is the Stormlands.
[SPEAKER_03]: House Baratheon has not yet field an army on screen, but they remain a significant uncommitted force, who's...
[SPEAKER_03]: entry could shift the balance of things to one side or the other, depending on what the breathians choose.
[SPEAKER_03]: So the black, so a little assessment here, the black's forces, King's Landing, Reneer controls the capital, it's Garrison, the gold cloaks, and the nearby dragon assets, giving them the strongest fortified position on in-westor host that has access to
[SPEAKER_03]: in the riverlands and the north we've got a large field army including the riverlanders and the winter wolves moving now towards Tumbleton rather than moving towards King's Landing it's just a few degrees off.
[SPEAKER_03]: Tumbleton is
[SPEAKER_03]: West by Southwest of Kings Landing by about I think I heard somebody else say it was around 16 leagues or something like that so well within the days right it's very close.
[SPEAKER_03]: Days ride, maybe a days ride.
[SPEAKER_03]: We're going to say that.
[SPEAKER_03]: So rather than going towards King's Landing, they're going to start moving down towards Tumbleton.
[SPEAKER_03]: Delarian has his small mobile detachment heading out towards the gullets to that sort of a little bit of a rear guard action.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's keeping a bunch of harassing forces away from King's Landing.
[SPEAKER_03]: and to try to handle some of the piracy and weaving that's happening on the coastal elements, so that has some political implications, but it's also drawing some forces away from the mean strength of King's Landing, and I think functionally we have no naval assets left at all.
[SPEAKER_03]: And with the dragon posture, the blacks have a larger presence in and around King's Landing,
[SPEAKER_03]: with the three Dragon Seeds, Reneer's Dragon, and Bayless Dragon, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: I think that's right.
[SPEAKER_03]: Moon answer?
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_03]: Right.
[SPEAKER_03]: So on the green forces, and I'm sorry if I'm stemming, this is the first time I'm actually trying this out, so I'm like trying to figure out in my head what works to how to explain all this.
[SPEAKER_03]: There's a lot of information.
[SPEAKER_03]: The greens have tumbleton, a high tower is holding that with about 15,000 troops.
[SPEAKER_03]: The largest concentrated conventional force that we've got currently in the field.
[SPEAKER_03]: The hair and haul force is Kristen Cole with a smaller mobile force operating out of hair and haul, and they're going to use it in a screening capacity but also to hairy and harass the enemy
[SPEAKER_03]: And then we've only got to Serian who is a young dragon and integrated with the tumble town forces, but combat effective not so much.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't we don't know how much to Serian can actually do.
[SPEAKER_03]: Did did, um, do you want to even say that he could fly on to Serian?
[SPEAKER_03]: Can to Serian fly?
[SPEAKER_03]: Maybe, well, to Serian can fly, but can to Serian carry a writer?
[SPEAKER_03]: I think that's a question none of us have been asking.
[SPEAKER_05]: He said he's ready to fly off with him.
[SPEAKER_05]: So maybe they've done some.
[SPEAKER_03]: Maybe to Serian is right around the age of being able to carry a writer, being able strong enough to take wing with a writer.
[SPEAKER_03]: Maybe that's why Derr, why Damon didn't have him fly back with them.
[SPEAKER_03]: Because to Serian's carrying a writer might be too slow to keep up with multiple adult dragons.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's a thought.
[SPEAKER_03]: And, of course, sunfires out of action in Vigar is active from all fronts, so we don't know where that is.
[SPEAKER_03]: Again, we have an uncommitted force house brassian in the stormlands.
[SPEAKER_03]: We have not seen anything on screen, but there is a latent force pool in the stormlands.
[SPEAKER_03]: And don't know how many men he could rally, but earlier diplomacy put them in the greens orbit, but then Baratheon is delaying, why are they delaying?
[SPEAKER_03]: Don't know political open political question there.
[SPEAKER_03]: but we activated that Baratheon army could create a new operational access against either the Crownlands or the Reach making the Stormlands army a potential thorn in the side of whichever faction it ends up opposing.
[SPEAKER_03]: We did get that message last episode where Baratheon was saying they were delaying their deployment.
[SPEAKER_03]: We don't know why, and we don't know how many forces perathion holds.
[SPEAKER_03]: Keterane, King's Landing, it's the Black Center of Gravity.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's the capital, it's a fortress, and it's the communications hubs, sort of all roads lead there, both sea lanes and overland lanes.
[SPEAKER_03]: Tumbleton, the Greens center of field operations, and that's anchoring hormones large southern army.
[SPEAKER_03]: Haren Hall at this point is not decisive by itself, but it's a maneuver base for Greens to carry on an interdiction campaign against the black army that is marching south.
[SPEAKER_03]: The Riverlands and Winter Wolves.
[SPEAKER_03]: In the gullet and the driftmark coast, we've got that security zone that's happening with the triarchy survivors, and that's a complex environment where they're not doing naval operations but they're doing land operations.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then we have the stormlands which are interesting because they're right below the King's woods, but they're also just adjacent to the riverlands, but I gotta look at the map
[SPEAKER_03]: right so if we look at storms and there's some mountains there and some some woods there and a force coming out of storms and all of those bantermen around there they could easily break Norse or break south depending on on which side they want to go.
[SPEAKER_03]: So our assessment overall is the blacks have the stronger central position, fortified capital, interior lines, and more usable dragons near the seat of power.
[SPEAKER_03]: The greens have the stronger field army, uh, mast at Tumbleton, uh, being supported by Kristen's screening force at Heron Hall.
[SPEAKER_03]: We don't know how big the riverlands army is and we don't know how big the winter wolves are.
[SPEAKER_03]: uh... coreless is anti pirate mission is a detached force and again it's weakens the the king's landing force by that much uh... and we don't have uh... any idea of what's happening with the berathy and mobilization is that clear yes that's pretty good okay by first time giving a high-level briefing that that's not a little there's pretty good
[SPEAKER_03]: Get it, yeah, exactly, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: Let me get some screens up here.
[SPEAKER_03]: We need some maps.
[SPEAKER_03]: So I want to talk a couple of some military terminology.
[SPEAKER_03]: What is the screening force?
[SPEAKER_03]: I mentioned that a couple of times.
[SPEAKER_03]: A screening force is usually a smaller, more mobile detachment or unit of troops that serves as a early warning and concealment is sort of does a couple of things.
[SPEAKER_03]: It can, um, a screen can spot the enemy first, report movements and strength and you can also use it to hide the force that's behind you because you're making a lot of noise or attacking stuff in the front and that focuses the attention onto that from what's actually further behind the screening force.
[SPEAKER_03]: You can also set up a screening force with a wide frontage with very light contact.
[SPEAKER_03]: So if they come in contact, you just sort of skirmish and get away.
[SPEAKER_03]: You spread out over wide area using patrols and smaller detachments.
[SPEAKER_03]: You engage just to test and slow the other army and you avoid getting sucked into any big set piece battles.
[SPEAKER_03]: and you can do counter reconnaissance.
[SPEAKER_03]: So you can hunt down the enemy scouts and small units and forcing blinding the enemy, causing them to fight blindly to waste time chasing you down and to sort of screw up your deployment lines.
[SPEAKER_03]: So you can, with a screening force, you can see first, you can hit first, and you can reach the black army from reaching Tumbleton on its own terms.
[SPEAKER_03]: Now, there's another concept.
[SPEAKER_03]: Is that clear?
[SPEAKER_03]: Any questions?
[SPEAKER_03]: No, that's clear.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_03]: When we talk about hairy and harass the enemy using gorilla tactics, so using a smaller force that's usually fast and mobile on the edges of in opposition to an enemy force, but on the edges or the rear areas of that enemy force repeatedly coming in contact with out committing to a full battle.
[SPEAKER_03]: you strike the scouts or the baggage train and supply lines, you inflict casualties, destroy supplies, and then withdraw before the main body or other larger units can be detached to confront you.
[SPEAKER_03]: So hit and run.
[SPEAKER_03]: And you hit and run soft things, scouts, support units that are coming up from behind.
[SPEAKER_03]: you can do night raids and ambushes, short, sharp attacks on camps, bridges, choke points, that force larger armies to lose slow, slow their march and divert guards and resources.
[SPEAKER_03]: So you've got to put more energy and resources into force protection, which then
[SPEAKER_03]: causes more logistical problems and slows you down and then also has a morale effect like oh man we have all these scouts or a picket lines out and these guys are getting killed at night and nobody knows you know they come in with a hit and run night raid like that's as for morale as a soldier that's not like I don't want to die like that.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't wanna die anyway, but I don't wanna die like that.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then you can do indirect fire and sniping.
[SPEAKER_03]: Obviously, we don't have artillery because we're not in a modern doctrine, but you could come in and shoot off a whole bunch of arrows and cause a bunch of panic and then run away.
[SPEAKER_03]: So again, using it in night, rate, or hit and run tactic, but you can use indirect fire.
[SPEAKER_03]: So maybe you bring up, get some scouts and you sort of,
[SPEAKER_03]: that you're attacking and you sort of push them one way with some ground forces and then you've got some archers in the trees over here and then you you know rain down a bunch of fire on them, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: So you can combine these tactics together.
[SPEAKER_03]: So Kristen doesn't have a large enough force to go toe to toe with the riverlands and northern army, but Kristen's
[SPEAKER_03]: that when that army arrives at Templeton, they're going to be late, they're going to be tired, they're going to be understrength, potentially badly informed because all of their scouts have been killed, so they don't really know what they're marching into.
[SPEAKER_03]: So you can just cause all kinds of chaos and sap the strength
[SPEAKER_03]: of the units that you're attacking using these hit and run fast ambushes and night raids and indirect fire to really sap the strength of a much larger force.
[SPEAKER_03]: Make sense?
[SPEAKER_05]: Make sense?
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_03]: Then lastly, a little bit on air power, so obviously in the setting there, we talk about this all the time, there are fighter planes, but there are also bombers sort of at the same time, and flying assets, but these assets can scout, they could potentially move commanders around if they needed to, and then of course they can deliver really devastating firepower at chosen targets.
[SPEAKER_03]: So Reneera has long-range reconnaissance from the capital, the ability to rapidly reinforce or strike nearby forces, and has a powerful deterrent threat against any direct assault on the city, as well as being able to devastate any
[SPEAKER_03]: force, any forces that are out in the open in the field, they can just rain down Hellfire on them quite easily.
[SPEAKER_03]: The greens don't have a lot.
[SPEAKER_03]: They've got to saryan, it's stuck in Tumbleton and
[SPEAKER_03]: They were there.
[SPEAKER_03]: They've only got one.
[SPEAKER_03]: Kristen screening force and hair and haul doesn't have any air cover, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: So we've got two forces.
[SPEAKER_03]: We've got the greens at Tumbleton and coal at hair and haul.
[SPEAKER_03]: There is no unifying air cover covering either of them.
[SPEAKER_03]: So they're both vulnerable.
[SPEAKER_03]: And they just don't have any ability.
[SPEAKER_03]: They don't have the dragons to be able to force together any sort of coherent.
[SPEAKER_03]: return force against the air power that they're facing.
[SPEAKER_03]: So, Reneera is deliberately choosing not to use her air power to burn tumbleton, but instead going to send a ground army in.
[SPEAKER_03]: And that,
[SPEAKER_03]: While seemingly insane, it also turns the dragons into a flexible reserve force as well as a reconnaissance tool rather than the main effort.
[SPEAKER_03]: Now granted, David would be like to learn them all, but that doesn't necessarily make tactical sense in some regards political sense as well as tactical sense.
[SPEAKER_03]: So if she holds her dragons in reserve, she can reinforce, but she can also continue to scout and provide air cover for all of her forces, no matter where they are.
[SPEAKER_03]: So the blacks are in a really awkward position because they have less forces and they're more scattered, but the greens have more forces but they're pinned down into this one location.
[SPEAKER_03]: So it's a really complex scene.
[SPEAKER_03]: thoughts questions, do I make more of a mess of it?
[SPEAKER_05]: Or no.
[SPEAKER_05]: I just, I think the political, political calculation is what's driving her and not the military one.
[SPEAKER_05]: Right.
[SPEAKER_05]: Because military one is the most prudent one that that I think.
[SPEAKER_05]: could end this all right now, but she's choosing not to do it because of the public.
[SPEAKER_05]: Because of political question, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, exactly.
[SPEAKER_03]: And what is what it was it, classmates who said that military force is just politics by another name.
[SPEAKER_03]: Ultimately, you want a political outcome.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I, you can at me, if I was wrong on the quote, please, please, let me, let me know.
[SPEAKER_03]: But the idea is is that you're trying to come to a political outcome
[SPEAKER_03]: take that into account right now in this day and age because you want you want a political outcome because use of force is not going to get you anywhere ultimately.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yes, so I think it's totally a political calculation that she's making.
[SPEAKER_05]: It's not a military one because it would be more important to just use the dragons burned the town.
[SPEAKER_05]: You get rid of the army.
[SPEAKER_05]: And now you're done, everybody goes home.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, but she won't do it and I can understand why she won't do it.
[SPEAKER_03]: Right.
[SPEAKER_03]: And that's this choice that the show writers want us to be in the position with her going, oh, what are you going to do?
[SPEAKER_03]: Burn the smoke.
[SPEAKER_03]: I do her.
[SPEAKER_03]: Right.
[SPEAKER_05]: I do it, I burn it.
[SPEAKER_03]: And there are modern political, there are modern historical examples that we can go to.
[SPEAKER_03]: World of War II.
[SPEAKER_03]: Absolutely.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: Peace.
[SPEAKER_03]: This is very same decision.
[SPEAKER_05]: Absolutely.
[SPEAKER_05]: I'd burn to shit.
[UNKNOWN]: There.
[UNKNOWN]: No.
[SPEAKER_03]: All right.
[SPEAKER_03]: At John, if you, if you disagree, we love your, we love, we seriously, we do what your feedback.
[SPEAKER_03]: So.
[SPEAKER_03]: uh... and if this was useful let me know i'll keep doing it uh... as we can uh... whether we do it on the main pod or the reaction pod there the feedback pod will see but anyway let us take our final break and after that full book spoilers a comment so if you don't want to get spoiled by any of that stuff or hear the bitch in about the books
[SPEAKER_03]: and what is and isn't in the books, et cetera.
[SPEAKER_03]: This is your time to check out.
[SPEAKER_03]: Thanks for stopping by.
[SPEAKER_03]: We appreciate you.
[SPEAKER_03]: If you feel like you can support us, we would love to have your support.
[SPEAKER_03]: But the fact that you're just listening is great.
[SPEAKER_03]: And if you would have jumped in on the conversation, hit us up on the discord.
[SPEAKER_03]: If you want to add John for his pronunciations or me for my...
[SPEAKER_03]: Listen.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm from New York.
[SPEAKER_05]: grew up in Brooklyn.
[SPEAKER_05]: You know, there's a lot of, there's a lot of, Jamaican patchwired that I live next to Caribbean accents and I live next to my own Haitian upbringing.
[SPEAKER_05]: So yeah, you're gonna have to deal with it.
[SPEAKER_03]: There you go.
[SPEAKER_05]: There you go.
[SPEAKER_05]: It's always gonna be day-run.
[SPEAKER_05]: That's it.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's it.
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, let's take our break on that note and then when we come back, we'll get into the spoil.
[SPEAKER_02]: Thank you.
[SPEAKER_03]: and we are back.
[SPEAKER_03]: Again, final spoiler warning if you do not want to be spoiled by any of the book knowledge.
[SPEAKER_03]: This is your opportunity to check out.
[SPEAKER_03]: We're going to get right to it.
[SPEAKER_03]: Karen aka zero ducks has a voicemail for us.
[SPEAKER_03]: So let's check that out.
[SPEAKER_04]: Hey guys, this is Karen aka zero ducks.
[SPEAKER_04]: This may be too late for feedback this week, so if it sits later great.
[SPEAKER_04]: So I feel like there's been some interesting dynamics with Hugh and all that they're setting up behind the scenes and for book readers.
[SPEAKER_04]: this is interesting.
[SPEAKER_04]: I thought that maybe he's wife being in tumble tin would be a reason for he to turn coat because possibly if they find out that that is his wife they could use her as some kind of blackmail to get he to turn with Vermithor and turn against Reneera.
[SPEAKER_04]: But then I also
[SPEAKER_04]: think that that storyline is moving the long faster than I anticipated that it would.
[SPEAKER_04]: I do think Tumble 10 is going to be like multiple episodes if it plays out anything like the book, but I'm not sure that that's what they're going to do, especially because he is already there with Vermithor.
[SPEAKER_04]: We've also seen off being one that's more vocally dissatisfied and outwardly a bit treasonous in the things that he says.
[SPEAKER_04]: And Reneer is giving him some grace mainly because she doesn't have that much of a choice.
[SPEAKER_04]: But I'm really interested to see what they do with this.
[SPEAKER_04]: And I'm wondering if there's a major departure from the book that
[SPEAKER_04]: is possibly part of what's behind G. R. R. M. Deciding that he didn't want to be involved anymore.
[SPEAKER_04]: So, curious to see what happened in this video.
[SPEAKER_03]: Hmm.
[SPEAKER_03]: Thanks, Karen.
[SPEAKER_03]: That is some interesting speculation there.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, what were the decisions behind the scenes that caused, uh, old George T.
[SPEAKER_03]: opt out and uh... head for the exit because we know that in this series there but deviating from the books it's not a but it's an encyclopedia right these are these are fake histories right you know are fake in the sense of the fictionalized histories of the so it's not story line it's so it's interesting i wonder i'm curious that's any thoughts on often uh... and you
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I think that, you know, setting up the betrayal, they're setting it up in a much more interesting way, right?
[SPEAKER_05]: I think it was, it might have been Alicia who said, um, prior that, you know, the betrayal is,
[SPEAKER_05]: not being driven so much by greed in the show.
[SPEAKER_05]: We can see some other things that play here instead of just wanting more, with both of them.
[SPEAKER_03]: Right, with pride, with family.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_05]: And so it's a very interesting, um,
[SPEAKER_05]: how they're setting the table to have them turn potentially and that's going to be interesting if that isn't the such dramatic, you know, departure from the book.
[SPEAKER_05]: maybe he texts what cause it could hold George to say no thank you come out because they change metals you don't I mean so what else has what else did they do then perhaps he was looking at the the board and saying now this is not the vision that I had.
[SPEAKER_03]: Well I think that's a perfect segue
[SPEAKER_03]: feedback this week on a bookstuff.
[SPEAKER_03]: Do you want to start off her?
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, the silhouette of Reina in the cave.
[SPEAKER_05]: Speaking of pedals, her character is definitely getting Nettles firewitch of the veil ending.
[SPEAKER_05]: But good news.
[SPEAKER_05]: She be guests to live past the end of the show.
[SPEAKER_05]: I almost wish that G Wayne would take Kristen Cole out, although G Wayne is already dead by this point in the book.
[SPEAKER_05]: Kristen talking about their purified, more like purely stupid.
[SPEAKER_05]: It's going to be fun to watch his plan fall apart spectacularly, one visitor at a time.
[SPEAKER_05]: Some men are worse, more wantingly destructive than dragons.
[SPEAKER_05]: That's a fucking good point.
[SPEAKER_03]: So this is interesting because I don't know this aspect of the books on paper and what I saw in the last episode, his plan seems reasonable to me from a military strategy standpoint, but it sounds like it's not going to go according to plan if they stick with the book plan.
[SPEAKER_05]: What we see is coal being coal, he is single-minded and really, really focused on what you said last week, this thing about purity, right, because he's living in the machine.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, he's not even reading
[SPEAKER_05]: Right.
[SPEAKER_03]: Right.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's a good point.
[SPEAKER_03]: Right.
[SPEAKER_03]: He's not thinking clearly.
[SPEAKER_05]: He's not.
[SPEAKER_05]: So you can, he's bent.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yes, absolutely.
[SPEAKER_05]: And you can see that G Wayne is looking at him like you're not reading the board.
[SPEAKER_05]: Mm-hmm.
[SPEAKER_05]: You got a death.
[SPEAKER_05]: There's already dissenting.
[SPEAKER_05]: He's already dissenting.
[SPEAKER_05]: Like in the scene with the two of them, if you look at his face, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,
[SPEAKER_05]: Wayne was like, no, no, I'm not dying for your bullshit.
[SPEAKER_03]: Not for this.
[SPEAKER_03]: And he presulably some of the forces that Cole is commanding RG Wayne's forces.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes, high tower men.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_03]: And the high tower men are like, he doesn't have men.
[SPEAKER_03]: So does he, he must have some of the cares and of Kings or is it all high tower and
[SPEAKER_03]: And Rosbee, yeah, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what
[SPEAKER_03]: Gwain's guys are gonna look at them when they get an order from coal and they're gonna be like You thought what?
[SPEAKER_03]: G Wayne what we do in world All right, this is a really interesting point.
[SPEAKER_03]: I like this.
[SPEAKER_03]: I hadn't I yeah, this was a dimension of the book that I don't Obviously, I've not read and I I like that we're getting insight into it.
[SPEAKER_05]: Sorry So this is the one and this is some actual book bitchin
[SPEAKER_05]: I'm beginning to think that they're going to stretch out this season more than I should have said that they're going to stretch out this season more than I expected and that they won't go all the way to the aftermath of this war.
[SPEAKER_05]: No.
[SPEAKER_05]: Well, guys, are you injecting?
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I gotta see mine.
[SPEAKER_05]: We gotta see that.
[SPEAKER_03]: Um, and everything, okay, all right, yeah, yeah, I didn't know if you were reacting to this boiler or to what you was saying about this boiler.
[SPEAKER_03]: So the hour of the wolf is something, obviously, that you just had a big reaction to.
[SPEAKER_03]: Who's the breeders know?
[SPEAKER_05]: and everything I find so interesting about the messy process of cleaning up after a civil war.
[SPEAKER_05]: That would import explain why important characters like Thailand, Lannister'd have seemingly been killed or screen, which is really a shame.
[SPEAKER_05]: I'm increasingly worried that the ending will feel even emptier than the ending of Game of Thrones did.
[SPEAKER_05]: We'll see.
[SPEAKER_05]: Oh my.
[SPEAKER_05]: I'm not there yet.
[SPEAKER_05]: No.
[SPEAKER_05]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_03]: No, I'm not there yet.
[SPEAKER_03]: All right.
[SPEAKER_03]: No.
[SPEAKER_03]: I can't be there because I'm I don't have anything to compare to.
[SPEAKER_05]: So yeah, I don't.
[SPEAKER_05]: Game of Thrones and then with such a shithole.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I.
[SPEAKER_05]: And conceivably they've learned from that.
[SPEAKER_05]: We will.
[SPEAKER_05]: That's that's my hope.
[SPEAKER_05]: That's our hope.
[SPEAKER_05]: That's that that's my hope.
[SPEAKER_03]: And we don't have a, like, we didn't have a, you know, the pen trailing off from, you know, George to, you know, blank pages.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then those two guys filling up those blank pages with what they thought was right.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, just think it's um, yeah, I'm not, that's a totally different situation than what we're dealing with here.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm trying to source material
[SPEAKER_03]: I get the fear though, like I don't want to dismiss, uh, at least I don't want to dismiss your concerns because I think a lot of people have those concerns.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_05]: I. Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: So we'll see.
[SPEAKER_05]: We'll see.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_05]: In any case, maybe they will indeed save the first battle of Tumbledon.
[SPEAKER_05]: until the end of the season.
[SPEAKER_05]: And perhaps combine the two tomaton battles into one giant dragon brawl.
[SPEAKER_05]: I don't think they're gonna combine the two.
[SPEAKER_05]: I would hope they don't combine the two.
[SPEAKER_05]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_03]: Because I've been more than one battle in Dumbledore.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, and yeah, there's somebody that I wanna see shine, so yeah, I don't, I hope they don't combine the two.
[SPEAKER_05]: make an almond, high-towers, troops, and tomatons, so lonesome.
[SPEAKER_05]: Does seem to muddle Hugh Hammer seeming motive for his impending switch of sides?
[SPEAKER_05]: Especially if his wife is the new target for this show's go-to-rapey behavior.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, yeah, done.
[SPEAKER_05]: Unfortunately, yeah.
[SPEAKER_05]: She continues, so garrick the newly gilded would be rapists from white girls at this point in the timeline This is before white cloth Carrying this way.
[SPEAKER_03]: Did you say white cloth?
[SPEAKER_03]: I think it's a white cloth.
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh my god.
[SPEAKER_03]: I didn't pick that up
[SPEAKER_03]: How many are you wrote in the email?
[SPEAKER_05]: Oh, gosh, at this point in the timeline, this house belongs to House Peak, one of their three castles, and they are staunch green supporters.
[SPEAKER_05]: But the only garrick I can find reference to in the book is a garrick haul who went off to the first battle of Tumbledon for Team Black and was never mentioned again.
[SPEAKER_05]: Perhaps this garrick will be the same and I wasted entire minutes trying to figure out if he will be employed.
[SPEAKER_05]: At least does the work, does the work.
[SPEAKER_05]: And finally, as far as certain offs, impending turn-coldery, the lack of a castle and demon poking him in the face seemed bad enough.
[SPEAKER_05]: But not she's taking his tavern time away from me.
[SPEAKER_05]: I'm surprised he'll even wait until the battle's a turn now, but he actually handled the Nara, clap back this episode surprisingly gracefully for Ulf in the way that he called her out for her unkindness and reminded her that her subjects are watching her.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, that's actually a really good point because he was like, you could see he kind of visibly was taking a back and he was going to go to leave and he was like, nah, I'm going to drop this one on you, a queen.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: They're calling you a bastard.
[SPEAKER_03]: No, I'm not saying, I am not saying that.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm just doing, I'm being your loyal servant and saying that people are calling you.
[SPEAKER_03]: I cleared the board, so I don't have the... Oh, man, it's all right, bro.
[SPEAKER_03]: But it was, it was a beautiful little turn on of, it was so, and it was delivered so awfully off-like, you know.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then he does the little sort of bow thing as he comes out.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's really good.
[SPEAKER_03]: He's a really turned.
[SPEAKER_03]: You think.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: In his heart.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_05]: He's already he's already.
[SPEAKER_03]: We back to Dragonstone when they told me to get his goddamn feet off the table.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: He's already.
[SPEAKER_03]: He's ready to go.
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, I think we're ready to go.
[SPEAKER_03]: That is the end of the feedback.
[SPEAKER_05]: Thank you, everyone, for giving us all of this wonderful information to talk about and to you on.
[SPEAKER_05]: This is awesome.
[SPEAKER_05]: And also special thanks to Nancy.
[SPEAKER_05]: Or without whom we don't know what we would do.
[SPEAKER_05]: So thank you, Nancy.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, big time.
[SPEAKER_03]: And yeah, like we covered before, we've got a lot of coverage happening.
[SPEAKER_03]: Let there's this coming up on August 15th, coverage for that, because I think we don't overlap.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes, that's no, I think, sign over that.
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, right.
[SPEAKER_03]: Sorry.
[SPEAKER_03]: You're right.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: Sorry.
[SPEAKER_03]: Let's start.
[SPEAKER_03]: Should be finished by then.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_05]: We'll be doing Xman 97 on one shot on the season.
[SPEAKER_05]: We're going to be doing with going to be doing Supergirl, please everybody know that we're doing Supergirl.
[SPEAKER_05]: Next week, we're going to be doing Spider-Man brand new day.
[SPEAKER_05]: So the next few weeks are not going to be a little busy.
[SPEAKER_03]: We're going to check to see, I haven't heard from John, John.
[SPEAKER_03]: If he's doing, I didn't mean to make that in a mean sounding way, I was just trying to
[SPEAKER_03]: What is going to do some Odyssey coverage?
[SPEAKER_03]: I have not heard from him.
[SPEAKER_03]: So we need to find that out.
[SPEAKER_03]: But that is also up on deck this weekend.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I can't tell whether reviewers are saying it.
[SPEAKER_03]: But yeah, I haven't looked at any of the reviews.
[SPEAKER_03]: No.
[SPEAKER_03]: I just know I'm going to go see it.
[SPEAKER_03]: Fair enough, I will wait to hear from y'all, whether I should, whether I'll be able to handle that.
[SPEAKER_03]: Let's go home, boys.
[SPEAKER_03]: Sorry, I can't do it.
[SPEAKER_03]: All right, anyway, but what I can do is thank you all so very much for your support.
[SPEAKER_03]: And your good humor and your lovely voicemails and to our
[SPEAKER_03]: community volunteers to our discord server boosters and to our loremasters.
[SPEAKER_03]: Thank you all so very much for all that you do for us in the community.
[SPEAKER_03]: Joan always a pleasure.
[SPEAKER_03]: Always.
[SPEAKER_03]: To to talk.
[SPEAKER_03]: Dungeons and do rags with you the other day.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, that was great.
[SPEAKER_05]: And this is great.
[SPEAKER_05]: So.
[SPEAKER_05]: Are you supporting Spain?
[SPEAKER_05]: I'm supporting no one.
[SPEAKER_05]: I would hate to see Argentina win, but I'm not rooting for Spain.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay, got it.
[SPEAKER_03]: You're hoping for a good game.
[SPEAKER_05]: I would think you're a scene.
[SPEAKER_05]: I would love to see Argentina get blown out by anyone.
[SPEAKER_05]: Okay, you know, but so the enemy of my enemy kind of situation.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, kind of, kind of.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I'm a, I'm a, I'm a, you know, fan.
[SPEAKER_05]: So, um, I hope he does well and plays well and scores a few goals.
[SPEAKER_05]: Um, but yeah, I, I don't root for Spain and I'd be test Argentina.
[SPEAKER_05]: I'm not a messy guy.
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, not known.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think we'll step out and yeah, good luck to everyone.
[SPEAKER_03]: You can talk to me about it.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm not a messy guy.
[SPEAKER_03]: We need a sports podcast, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: All right, everybody out.