[SPEAKER_00]: The Survivor Specialist Phil will ambleake our back and today part three of our winner rankings.
[SPEAKER_00]: We are into the middle 10.
[SPEAKER_00]: We don't feel that these people are bad.
[SPEAKER_00]: We don't feel that these people are great.
[SPEAKER_00]: They fall smack in the middle.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's not how we feel that the bottom 10 were necessarily bad.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I know that's got to be something we really drive home for people, huh, guys.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is we know this is our.
[SPEAKER_03]: Guys, we are so excited if you weren't survivor, you've got a million dollars and that's way more money than this is worth.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, we, we are being your money and have fun.
[SPEAKER_00]: We are doing this strictly because we have been pressured for decades.
[SPEAKER_00]: And by decades, I mean, one decade.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, tonight, this is one of the first videos decades that have gone.
[SPEAKER_00]: And we were like, man, we got to do one of these and I'll tell you what, man, the Tommy and Savannah rankings were very controversial last week.
[SPEAKER_00]: I was surprised.
[SPEAKER_00]: I wasn't surprised that Savannah is controversial ranking.
[SPEAKER_00]: I called that one moment.
[SPEAKER_02]: I was surprised that she was that low.
[SPEAKER_02]: I said that live.
[SPEAKER_02]: So I kind of defended it, but I don't know how I ranked her also.
[SPEAKER_00]: He was so poor part of the reason she was that low.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, no, I said her game was going to age like, why, I was surprised at how much people were defending Tommy.
[SPEAKER_00]: I was really, really, really surprised at that because I love Tommy's game.
[SPEAKER_00]: I obviously have not watched, I don't know, the idol since it aired.
[SPEAKER_00]: I did watch it twice when it was airing.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like I used to watch the East Coast streaming the watch of West Coast.
[SPEAKER_00]: So like I do know it a little.
[SPEAKER_00]: I love Tommy's game, and I really liked Tommy, and obviously Tommy was a fan of the podcast before he went out there.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I was like, I don't want to be overly biased on him, and pretty much us right here at 32.
[SPEAKER_00]: Everybody's like, we mean, he's a top 20 top 10 game, and I was like, I thought everybody hated Tommy and hated down to the idols.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I was surprised at that one, but look, we are just, we are just cruising through and I'll tell you what, dealing with four different rankings plus Will's freaking will-geriddom,
[SPEAKER_00]: higher.
[SPEAKER_00]: No everyone runs the algorithm.
[SPEAKER_02]: The algorithm is actually probably defending the people of the internet loves.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like the algorithm is higher on your Natalie whites, your Erica's, your kind of lower key, you know, your ambers, your gentleman, look the, a lot of the under-edited women.
[SPEAKER_02]: the algorithm favors more because it doesn't take in the edit or confessionals or how well like the show has a motion.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's right, it literally doesn't.
[SPEAKER_00]: That is not a metric point for it being a man who won, then a woman would?
[SPEAKER_02]: No, that's not how the algorithm works, but that maybe is how Phil's brain works, you know?
[SPEAKER_00]: It's just Jack Conroy, the algorithm is flawed, but that's why I love it.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean,
[SPEAKER_00]: Here we go.
[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, any ranking is going to be flawed.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like any ranking where we're doing this is going to be flawed.
[SPEAKER_00]: With every I have really gotten a lot of joy like we'll go and we'll post post a little video and I have gotten a little a lot of joy and people being like this is ridiculous all the people I'm unfollowing you like look you don't have to announce you're leaving I don't care that you're leaving if you unfollow us because of our winner ranking like at that point you're so soft like I don't want you to be a follower of us anyway um it's a winner ranking like give me a break but I do love how many comments we've gotten of that or like this is an egregious list and then you just respond and say
[SPEAKER_00]: Who would you rank here?
[SPEAKER_00]: Just no answer.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like, okay, now we did get one.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I don't remember what the person's name is.
[SPEAKER_00]: I should actually look it up because it was so absurd where they essentially said that our list wasn't in depth and that it was kind of shallow.
[SPEAKER_00]: When I went back at them, it was like, okay, and then they explained how they were ranking theirs.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I was like, all right, I actually have to give respect to this person because that's absurd.
[SPEAKER_00]: And they had like transcribed every confessional and like had done all this crazy stuff.
[SPEAKER_00]: we're going to be shallow compared to that.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like there's really a lot of transcribing every confessional again like that's what the show is choosing to show you.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's not indicative of like the amount of confessional you have really doesn't have an influence on how well or how good you are at Survivor.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's more about like
[SPEAKER_02]: How are you as a TV character?
[SPEAKER_02]: How are you as an narrator?
[SPEAKER_02]: Can you explain your game?
[SPEAKER_02]: Does the show want you to be six like this?
[SPEAKER_02]: Does the show want to put you up as someone who played a successful game even if you win?
[SPEAKER_02]: And so that's a very subjective thing to base it on, confessional.
[SPEAKER_02]: So that's why the algorithm was probably doing a better job than most people.
[SPEAKER_00]: It was Minge, SJ Barber.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's who it was.
[SPEAKER_00]: And they were doing
[SPEAKER_00]: photos and all these different grades.
[SPEAKER_00]: Tatyana, Ariana, Ariana, Edith says, yes, the algorithm works because it probably has Michelle ranked really high, so we like it.
[SPEAKER_00]: No, wills the reason Michelle's in this damn episode.
[SPEAKER_00]: So here we go.
[SPEAKER_03]: My favorite thing I saw was, all right, Blake, do you have Tina?
[SPEAKER_03]: Ranked number one because she did 42 days.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I looked at my list and I was like, I looks like I forgot, I move her up, move her up right now.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I do appreciate that you're getting that type of crap.
[SPEAKER_00]: I did have to explain just so everybody knows Blake ranked every single new era winner between 37 and 46 I mean, that's that's what he did.
[SPEAKER_00]: That was his move.
[SPEAKER_00]: So
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, make them do the work to bury me.
[SPEAKER_03]: Don't do it for them.
[SPEAKER_00]: No, you're doing it for yourself.
[SPEAKER_00]: Come on, man.
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, anyway, so we are going to be ripping through today's winner rankings.
[SPEAKER_00]: I am really pumped about this one.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is what's really funny is I feel like we all have like the people we really care deeply about that we want to get further into the list.
[SPEAKER_00]: We have the people that maybe we're not fans of their game.
[SPEAKER_00]: So we want to get them lower.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is the first episode.
[SPEAKER_00]: where we really do have like some people where it starts to feel like we're getting up towards the top.
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's it's interesting how many people in this podcast are going to have somebody who ranked them in like the top 15 and then somebody else who also ranked them like 38 or lower.
[SPEAKER_00]: And that happens quite a bit throughout this podcast.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I think that that's going to be a lot of fun and that's going to be an interesting little thing to look at as we move through.
[SPEAKER_00]: We got will.
[SPEAKER_02]: I mean that kind of happened last week a little bit and that's that's like a it's evidence of how hard it is to rank winners like you're gonna like I had my 11th best winner in the 40 to 30 episode that in Jan Pamp you know so I would say after this episode
[SPEAKER_00]: Everybody's top 10 is still intact.
[SPEAKER_00]: Blake is the only one with his 11 and 12 also still alive.
[SPEAKER_00]: Everybody else loses their 11 and 12 by the end of tonight.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, so your jam jam at 11 ends up being the case for John and McKenna and myself also in this episode.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, but a week later, 10 spot.
[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, that's that matters.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it does.
[SPEAKER_00]: All right.
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's get this.
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's get this going.
[SPEAKER_03]: Let's get this room scene on the smartest rancor here.
[SPEAKER_00]: You also are going to have somebody at 30 seven who's still alive.
[SPEAKER_00]: So no.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: We can't wait for that.
[SPEAKER_00]: All right.
[SPEAKER_00]: So here we go.
[SPEAKER_00]: Part three.
[SPEAKER_00]: Everybody.
[SPEAKER_00]: So we're going to do a quick thing ranking so far.
[SPEAKER_00]: We showed 50 to 41 last time.
[SPEAKER_00]: Makes sense.
[SPEAKER_00]: Again, the rage bait here it is.
[SPEAKER_00]: Underwood Bob.
[SPEAKER_00]: Panicator, Ben Fabio, Natalie White, Kenzie Amber, Eric.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you want to hear our reasons for that, go check out part one link is in the description here.
[SPEAKER_00]: Part two, a little bit more controversial.
[SPEAKER_00]: And Aubrey at 40 will some people were stoked you ranked her at 48.
[SPEAKER_00]: Other people thought you were dumb.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, that was, that was a big one too.
[SPEAKER_00]: People were really like.
[SPEAKER_02]: I was saying, I guess, but like again, like again, not Aubrey's fault.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's just that was a show heavily influenced by production.
[SPEAKER_02]: Not player.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm curious how everybody will feel after watching game changers.
[SPEAKER_00]: I just finished my rewatch for the Patreon yesterday.
[SPEAKER_00]: She's in a lot more of that season when you're watching it on a binge, then you remember when you're watching it week to week.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's for sure.
[SPEAKER_00]: Then we have Ethan, Ari, Savannah, Danny, Jam Jam, Nick, Rachel.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then as I said last week, big gap between Rachel and Tommy and then Marianne and I just want to highlight this so that it's known how close this is.
[SPEAKER_00]: Even though this is, obviously we're going to do this in groups of 10 because that's what makes sense.
[SPEAKER_00]: So this is 30 to 21.
[SPEAKER_00]: 32 to 26 are separated by 13 points when we did the scoring of this.
[SPEAKER_00]: 26 to 25 is separated by 10.
[SPEAKER_00]: So really 32 to 26 is kind of its own tier.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then there's a big gap after 26 when we get into the top half here.
[SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, we're going to be starting off with number 30 in this podcast, who barely finished ahead of Marianne and Tommy to land at this spot any guesses who wants to wants to start off the guessing the guessing's my favorite part because I have all the power and I know.
[SPEAKER_03]: Hmm.
[SPEAKER_03]: Is it John Cochrane.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's a good guess.
[SPEAKER_02]: Cochrane is not around.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think I'm trying to think of who we haven't seen yet.
[SPEAKER_02]: I've got my list pulled up.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, here's, here's while we wait for this.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm gonna ask, I'm gonna ask you guys this question because I thought it was pretty funny.
[SPEAKER_00]: We put a, we can't have put a post out an Instagram, a story out an Instagram, where she asked people who was gonna be ranked at 25 in our ranking.
[SPEAKER_00]: It was amazing that people were pretty much split between Denise and Sophie.
[SPEAKER_00]: And like we got like over a dozen answers and like almost every answer was Denise or Sophie.
[SPEAKER_02]: Wow.
[SPEAKER_02]: Which is bizarre.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: So anyway.
[SPEAKER_00]: Come on guys.
[SPEAKER_00]: Give me a guess.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to be like Denise or something.
[SPEAKER_02]: Denise or Sofia.
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, I guess those two.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's got to be Sophie.
[SPEAKER_00]: Look at this, huh?
[SPEAKER_00]: Look at this.
[SPEAKER_00]: Darryl Seymour.
[SPEAKER_00]: I would you will get Darryl Seymour.
[SPEAKER_02]: With the feeling you were going to be in here.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think you'll just got to be in here.
[SPEAKER_00]: Michael.
[SPEAKER_00]: coming in at 30.
[SPEAKER_00]: What in the world I can't wait.
[SPEAKER_00]: So anyway, my colleague, world's apart, four votes against them all negated, obviously somebody who wins a lot of immunities down the stretch.
[SPEAKER_00]: Jonathan McKenner rang him at 42.
[SPEAKER_00]: Will ranking him at 13.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, okay.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think the algorithm has to be impacting that one a lot.
[SPEAKER_02]: But yes, the algorithm loved my call away.
[SPEAKER_02]: And you always kept saying, well, it punishes you for winning challenges.
[SPEAKER_02]: It punishes you for winning challenges.
[SPEAKER_02]: No, it rewards you for winning challenges.
[SPEAKER_02]: Also, I think we forget about my call ways when
[SPEAKER_02]: Yes, uh, the final what was it four meanings in a row?
[SPEAKER_02]: Was it five in a row?
[SPEAKER_02]: It was live for five.
[SPEAKER_02]: I mean up until that point though like he he made the play where we have the idol and he did the bluff on He was going to play it on Sharine and then the at that alliance had to turn on each other in Dan and end up getting vote so he was like
[SPEAKER_02]: Making even when he would play idols or win challenges, he was still trying to get under the main alliance of skin and find a way to break them up.
[SPEAKER_02]: Now, I don't know if he ever would have been successful because he won a challenge every single time and had an idol every single time, but he was very much actively playing.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I think why they all heard them also really like to miss his win equity was very high.
[SPEAKER_02]: He was beating everybody from like final seven.
[SPEAKER_02]: Maybe final eight on.
[SPEAKER_02]: Maybe which is a big thing to like being the most likable guy and getting all I mean The get it and then he also has a good drew vote Percentage you get six of eight drew votes.
[SPEAKER_02]: So the algorithm I've actually believed had him at number two So you say I got to fix this like that is the moment you tell yourself I got to do something different
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, at that point I had been like, okay, so this is so this is because it said this is my biggest biggest discrepancies here there were there were five players on my discrepancies where I had Mike as 28 in my personal rankings, but the algorithm had Mike at number two and lands at 13 night.
[SPEAKER_02]: That was my biggest discrepancy out of all.
[SPEAKER_02]: There's a couple other players on there.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's that's crazy though.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, like I said, if you if you're out of the mouth of my Callaway at two, you're the guy who's doing the polling and says, yeah, no, we're talking about three points.
[SPEAKER_02]: It goes to a lot of a lot of tribals, but he wins a lot of challenges.
[SPEAKER_02]: He gets a lot of jury votes.
[SPEAKER_02]: He's going to be everybody.
[SPEAKER_02]: He won on his first try.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like I said, like the final six one equity is perfect.
[SPEAKER_02]: He gets a full 10 point.
[SPEAKER_02]: So it's like
[SPEAKER_02]: Everybody, if we get to the end of you wins, that's pretty damn good.
[SPEAKER_02]: Two is a little high, but yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, here's the thing though, like I have Mike at 30, Blake has him at 31.
[SPEAKER_00]: So we end up right here again.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm just hitting somebody right on the nose because I didn't do it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean, and if you would have had him at 28, he probably ends up, I mean, you're talking 15 more points or whatever.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, Mike is ending up around 34 or 33.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, he's he's not that much different here.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think what's funny is I really like Mike's game and I think a lot of people crap on Mike just because they needed to win the amenities down the stretch, but like I don't really ever take that out like I don't take that too much in the consideration because I do feel like I did hear 30 or no, but here's my point.
[SPEAKER_00]: It comes down to is that all you could do and then what else were you doing?
[SPEAKER_00]: We just recently watched Rolls Apart again.
[SPEAKER_00]: Mike makes every good point.
[SPEAKER_00]: But when you are making a good point to terrible survivor players, it doesn't matter how smart and intelligent your decisions are.
[SPEAKER_00]: Everything Mike says on that season after he screws up at the auction makes total sense and ends up predicting what's going to happen on the episode and how people are going to go home almost every single time with the people are too stubborn to listen to him.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm not going to fault Mike for being in kind of a Terry position of this alliance is just really stubborn.
[SPEAKER_00]: They don't care.
[SPEAKER_00]: They're not thinking at all.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, Dan fully is presented with the easiest.
[SPEAKER_00]: extra vote play in the history of survivor and he screws it up and goes home at that travel council.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like because he's so stubborn and won't think about it.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I like Mike's win.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's why I put him at 30.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, putting at 30, I'm ringing him over 20 other winners, which I do feel like is probably pretty unpopular in this community.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know most people probably rank him closer where John and McKenna had him, but I think there's a lot more to Mike's game than just winning the
[SPEAKER_00]: He was making the right decisions and ultimately like another thing that ostracized him from the group was standing up for Shireen when Will was essentially like burrating her and calling her scum of the earth.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, is that really the worst flaw to have?
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't think so.
[SPEAKER_00]: The Will on the show.
[SPEAKER_00]: the will on the show.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, I mean, this will was probably saying the same thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, we're not like really a brochuring podcast.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not going to lie.
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, a couple of things.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think Mike is amazing of like he is the underdog that you're like, how did he get in this position?
[SPEAKER_03]: It was just like a lot of these other people are not likeable.
[SPEAKER_03]: And they realize that he's a threat from like final 10.
[SPEAKER_03]: And there is a, I stick up for the people that are ostracized.
[SPEAKER_03]: And it's like,
[SPEAKER_03]: Whenever we're all hungry or whatever it's like a people some people on the island may roll their eyes with that But the people at home are like yeah, let's do this.
[SPEAKER_03]: So I think it is something where Why is he 30 instead of 48 when it's like you needed a mutaties to win and bin bombs and it's like Well, there is a difference in my mind between something you had to do and then saved by the bell
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, but he doesn't remember, and then he figures it out.
[SPEAKER_03]: So I think he's also pretty cool post survivor, which does coming to play some in this when you're like, oh, I like this guy.
[SPEAKER_00]: Only for Blake.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then I think for our content.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think part of our thing when we go from person to person and do our two to five minutes on them, we can't be like, if we ranked them differently, they would have come in a different spot.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think we got to go just how did we rank them?
[SPEAKER_03]: What are they in our thing?
[SPEAKER_03]: If we took the robot out, if we took good.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think my point with picking out the road is that it barely changes his spot.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's why I brought it up like Mike was ending up between 30 and 34.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think it's gonna have a lot moving forward I'm not I'm not saying it's bad content.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm saying, but we did rank him this way.
[SPEAKER_03]: This is where you got I think Mike all the way getting 30.
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, look at this season.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's his goal.
[SPEAKER_03]: It 30 is a big number for him
[SPEAKER_03]: I love Mike.
[SPEAKER_03]: Why didn't you play again for winners at war?
[SPEAKER_03]: I think that would have been great.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't think there is something Mike could have done better to get first place like based on how a season went.
[SPEAKER_03]: This is about as high as he can go.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean, and Blake wants to shoot down, you know, all of our stuff here, Blue Box Kirby from last week.
[SPEAKER_00]: Blake talking about Ethan's game is literally making shit up.
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, my God, he's pulling up receipts that aren't even from here.
[SPEAKER_00]: I just wanted to pull that one out because it's like, you know, whatever Blake you were talking about made up shit.
[SPEAKER_00]: So when we talk about Mike's ranking potentially changing, what's also crazy though is if will add.
[SPEAKER_03]: We know how much it was to digitize footage.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's 2001.
[SPEAKER_03]: We had no idea what was left on the cutter and floor.
[SPEAKER_00]: If Will had put Mike at spot two, Mike would have finished at 26.
[SPEAKER_00]: So like that's what he's in this range no matter where he is.
[SPEAKER_01]: But if we're really going to go people out on their bullshit, it's going to be 150,000% Phil, he doesn't bel you.
[SPEAKER_01]: He doesn't knock people out for their challenge victories, but then decides what might get 30.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'll 200% disagree with that.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not doing a happy dance because I'm
[SPEAKER_00]: Vlad the impeller.
[SPEAKER_00]: We'll do your mic impression.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, that is on par with Rodney's, but Rodney gets the facial expression and the body language going to, but that's pretty damn good.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not gonna lie.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, yeah.
[SPEAKER_02]: This is a podcast.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's, you know, I don't understand.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like there's something about watching Rodney's whole appearance change that he almost becomes Mike.
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, all right.
[SPEAKER_00]: Dude, worth playing for a hit us with a second week in a row.
[SPEAKER_00]: Double you in press.
[SPEAKER_00]: There you go.
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, wow.
[SPEAKER_00]: Wow.
[SPEAKER_00]: There you go.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, you earned us that.
[SPEAKER_00]: You're talking about it.
[SPEAKER_00]: All right.
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you.
[SPEAKER_01]: I got my million.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't care how you break me.
[SPEAKER_00]: Blake is back to Blake's feeling it there.
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, thank you worth playing for a week.
[SPEAKER_00]: Wow.
[SPEAKER_00]: Greatly appreciate that.
[SPEAKER_00]: A very, very, very, very fine.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's very common.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now we're getting cheesesteaks again.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, no, Blake, you're not getting a cheesesteak.
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, all right, we're moving on to number 29.
[SPEAKER_00]: We're into the 20s, uh, Darrell Seymour, you're one for one.
[SPEAKER_00]: You want to take another stab here.
[SPEAKER_00]: Who you guys, uh, who you guys feeling here?
[SPEAKER_00]: John Cochrane.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think you'll is coming up at some point.
[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe not this low, but I think we're going to love about this right now is you guys are just going to guess the person that you criminally rated way too low for the remainder of this podcast.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, you already did him like, like I'm telling you right now, John Cochrane is not in this podcast.
[SPEAKER_00]: No matter how much you hit John Cochrane, he's so happy.
[SPEAKER_02]: Sophie, let's go Sophie then.
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, Sophie's a good pick.
[SPEAKER_00]: Darryl Seymour saying Michelle, Brad and Hiroble saying Visapia.
[SPEAKER_00]: Sandra Diaz, who I'm from Curl Islands.
[SPEAKER_03]: So we are very soon.
[SPEAKER_00]: Typically calling out the Perl Islands game here, this is probably gonna be a controversial one because people don't know which game of Sandra's they're supposed to like more.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I have found that the community is so split on which one that they actually favor.
[SPEAKER_00]: Some people love what she did in Perl Islands, they love what she was able to do at the beginning of the game, how she navigated after losing root hurt.
[SPEAKER_00]: Other people like us,
[SPEAKER_00]: really appreciate her hero's first villains game in the fact that she came back as a winner in only the second all returning player season and was able as a winner to get all the way to the end and win.
[SPEAKER_00]: So we have her hero's villains game ranked much much much higher than this.
[SPEAKER_00]: I also think the caliber of player on that season was just out of control and you already kind of knew what Sandra was about and you knew that she was a winner.
[SPEAKER_00]: Here she is though for Perl Island's no votes
[SPEAKER_00]: What do you guys think about this ranking here?
[SPEAKER_00]: Will had the lowest of 35.
[SPEAKER_00]: John and McKenna with the highest only at 20s.
[SPEAKER_00]: We were all very compact on Sandra as compared to a lot of other people who are going to show up in this ring.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I think it's a, the outcast twist of it all.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think helps her, I, you know, sitting next to Lill is something usually wouldn't be able to do in any given season.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I'm not really sure who else she beats, although I gave her pretty good score.
[SPEAKER_02]: No, I actually didn't give her.
[SPEAKER_02]: I got her a medium score on one equity.
[SPEAKER_02]: The algorithm had her at 25, so algorithm was higher than me on Sandra's game.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's probably due to the 61 jury vote.
[SPEAKER_02]: But,
[SPEAKER_02]: I feel like a season where, yes, I can appreciate Sandra's game and how she plays rivalry where anybody but me and I just got to make it through one more vote, but like when we're ranking winners, how great is that relative to people who are saying, okay, I'm going to drive the decisions, I'm going to form a strategy and execute it and have more agency.
[SPEAKER_02]: Which is not saying that's correct or a better way to play or even a more entertaining way to play there are different ways to play But how do we value that as a podcast?
[SPEAKER_02]: I think it's clear like we value the big decision making and having more control over what happens Higher than being like I'm gonna hang out in the back.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm gonna be likable I'm not gonna piss too many people off.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm gonna tell you how it is though I'm gonna be real so when I get to the end again to get someone you don't like you're gonna vote for me Matterspect that style again.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's just not something we're valuing as high here
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and the reason why I end up valuing the heroes for his villains game over this one is she played the exact same game a second time, and I know this one from Brad Skolnick, Pearl Island she cooks heroes for his villain.
[SPEAKER_00]: She just tries to get Russell out and can't do it like the thing was she was willing to just keep voicing how much she hated Russell and how much she wanted Russell out so that when she started the end it was like guys, remember this whole time I told you that everybody should hate this guy and everybody's like, yeah, we do hate that guy, Sandra.
[SPEAKER_00]: And now we're going to vote for you to win because we like you so much more than him.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like she really did a great job of making us first them thing and poverty gets lumped in with Russell while Sandra gets to be on the other side, whether you like it or not, that's how Sandra ultimately gets the win.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I do feel like when it becomes intentional people will say, well, she got kind of lucky early on and she just went along with the flow.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, Sandra's biggest mistake would have been if if Cand is actually was willing to flip.
[SPEAKER_00]: And if she was willing to vote with the heroes because then Sandra would have voted with the heroes and then she probably loses that season, but the thing is she didn't need control in that game, she plays the exact same game and wins it against maybe the best cast ever assembled to me, it's like that's just more impressive, especially because how does the Drake tribe get control post merge.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's because will hate savage.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like that's crazy that we don't just get an authentic five to five fight it out and then let's see what's going to happen.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think without the outcast twist, Sandra probably doesn't win that season.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, Grant, that I'm not going to go like too hard in on that.
[SPEAKER_00]: That is what the season was.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I do just think that that is a big, big, big thing that ultimately led to me ranking her.
[SPEAKER_00]: at number 31.
[SPEAKER_00]: So one spot behind Mike.
[SPEAKER_00]: I like her game.
[SPEAKER_00]: I just think that ultimately this isn't this isn't the same tier as Heroes of Versailles.
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, we ranked her all this way, but I'm not saying you guys are haters.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm going to speak more positive, more about the pro islands actual season.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's like she was on the Drake tribe and that is something where I think that was an insane tribe before Kassaya and insane tribe before Fong and insane tribe before Failong of like Failong's like the most not version of it but kind of
[SPEAKER_03]: So I think being on Drake and having it and implode and like we go up three O and then we start throwing it.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think she was against it.
[SPEAKER_03]: She balances the Rupert relationship better than everyone else of like if it does go sideways or if you go after Rupert I'm gonna be fine either way I think there's another thing where it's like
[SPEAKER_03]: is she fun to talk to?
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, she's more fun to talk to than little.
[SPEAKER_03]: She's more fun to talk to than fair play and sometimes in this early game that's as bad as good as it can be.
[SPEAKER_03]: The only person that she gets a vote not from is Tijuana and that is something where you're watching that thing like if Tijuana doesn't like you, you're doing something right?
[SPEAKER_03]: Um, shout out to Tijuana.
[SPEAKER_03]: Thank you for watching the podcast.
[SPEAKER_02]: What's a good line.
[SPEAKER_03]: But it is something where I think she shows what social game can do in this part of the era of like, she should have been gone if they lost when the first three.
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, she's on a powerful tribe.
[SPEAKER_03]: And she's not.
[SPEAKER_03]: At the bottom of that, she would just be gone physically.
[SPEAKER_03]: So after she leverages those first three wins, she's never going even if they they lose or throw.
[SPEAKER_03]: And it is something where, yes, let's get out the big guys.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like maybe we've seen that in more cases a bit, but it is like Burton needs to go.
[SPEAKER_03]: He's too big for his bridges, then who follows, then who follows are that part.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then when Burton comes back, he's not out for blood on Sandra, and it is something where we've seen so many other times not a returny thing, but like, even if you vote against me, somebody's out for blood, they're never out for blood on Sandra, even when she's screaming at people and getting, I can get allowed to with John, and I think that's something where that balance of, because I'm so real and telling it the way it is, there's no way I'm lying, but she is lying constantly.
[SPEAKER_03]: And it is something whether you value that or not, I think in that year when it was coming out, that's way most people can't play and it is impressive.
[SPEAKER_00]: So now with all that positivity, where do you rank her?
[SPEAKER_00]: I had her at 27 because I liked the other one better.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, exactly.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not really giving you a hard time for that.
[SPEAKER_00]: But even after Blake says all that positive, he still ranks her in the bottom half from this game.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think what's also interesting, and I'm not telling people that they're wrong, but all three of us were there for when this happened.
[SPEAKER_00]: Right, Sandra was such an afterthought when all was said and done after Pearl Islands.
[SPEAKER_00]: Rupert, fair play, even Burton was a big deal after that, like Sandra won, but Sandra was not revered in the way that she is now.
[SPEAKER_00]: It wasn't until after Heroes vs. Villains that she hit that level and you see it in her edit in-game changes, she's finally edited the way Sandra D. S. Twine is supposed to be edited when she hits game changers.
[SPEAKER_00]: They didn't feel that people really care about Sandra's story coming into Heroes vs. Villains, which I think is why so much of it is disregarded early on in that season for the other more popular players.
[SPEAKER_00]: Sandra Hermple Island's game is one of those things where
[SPEAKER_00]: most people were ranking this her and Jenna were the two worst winners of the first seven seasons like that's how a lot of people felt people weren't really looking at survivor the way we look at it now and so I do think that that plays a little bit into my mind as well.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't get caught up in the oh because Sandra is a better two-time winner.
[SPEAKER_00]: or because now she's a two-time winner, that means that one of her games has to be amazing.
[SPEAKER_00]: And so I will say that, you know, to me, they're both kind of, her other ones are a tier above, but either one of them makes top 15 for me.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, jackcon, right, Amber better than Sanjo 1.0, according to Blake, Amber's better than a lot of people, according to Blake.
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't understand how you have Amber.
[SPEAKER_02]: Let's talk about... Or Jenna Marasca, I didn't have Jenna Marasca, how do you?
[SPEAKER_03]: Do you not, I feel he had a pretty much $20 dollar.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_03]: I got to pull it up.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm ready.
[SPEAKER_03]: You let me know what you mean across.
[SPEAKER_02]: So having to tell him we're asking you in that even sniffing.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_02]: Even still insane.
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, a lot of people only play 26 days.
[SPEAKER_03]: And so that.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: Don't forget that.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know that's, I had to, I had to do that explaining.
[SPEAKER_00]: I was talking to.
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's start going to people and I'm like, no, Savannah was Blake's second highest ranked new era winner.
[SPEAKER_00]: He just ranked them all 37.
[SPEAKER_00]: We got a focus.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's 28.
[SPEAKER_00]: No, no, no, no, no.
[SPEAKER_00]: I like stuff.
[SPEAKER_00]: We're running out of time already, real.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, what do you think?
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, well, if you're making that list, let's for three seconds, just be in Blake's mind.
[SPEAKER_00]: What's your reason, will, for ranking Sandra, two spots below Amber?
[SPEAKER_02]: I had to do that.
[SPEAKER_00]: I wouldn't do that like you can't even think of like a reason.
[SPEAKER_00]: What is it?
[SPEAKER_00]: Her name came first in the alphabet?
[SPEAKER_02]: I can't really find literally any reason.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like not even in this first time players like Nicole Delma, but the first boot in her season was Tina Weston.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay, so we'll remember.
[SPEAKER_01]: Amber.
[SPEAKER_02]: Amber played against like an all-star cast.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's it.
[SPEAKER_03]: And it was 18 people that's two more than Sandra had to be.
[SPEAKER_02]: Okay, those are reasons.
[SPEAKER_00]: Those are, they're not like, I mean technically Sandra had to beat 18 as well, because two people came back into the game after we're splitting hairs here, we're splitting hairs, we're back.
[SPEAKER_00]: Facts.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm here for facts.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know.
[SPEAKER_00]: All right.
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's move on to number 28.
[SPEAKER_00]: Will you said the name earlier?
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm going to start this by being like, this is where the arbitrary factor starts coming a little bit.
[SPEAKER_00]: Guys and I apologize.
[SPEAKER_00]: No.
[SPEAKER_00]: Number 28 Sophie Clark will with the highest ranked 12 me with the lowest ranked ranked 3rd game.
[SPEAKER_00]: What's really funny about this is I absolutely love Sophie's game.
[SPEAKER_00]: I just like other games more.
[SPEAKER_00]: I really do praise Sophie's game in South Pacific.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think she lays the blueprint for how you're supposed to beat the returning players.
[SPEAKER_00]: She does a great job of just
[SPEAKER_00]: feeding these egos feeding these egos feeding these egos ultimately I ranked her lower than other people just because like other people to me have flashier moves and flashier things going the fact that this was a pugonging doesn't really help either and the fact that they were like not willing to go against the pugonging because they were worried people might come back from redemption island hurts but I think Sophie does a great job of what she's supposed to do on this season.
[SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, I have her at 38 but like
[SPEAKER_00]: This is again, we're like every winner one, and this is actually, I think I said it on the one podcast or on the hot takes thing I said that Sophie's win is like one of the most important in the history of the show and everybody's like, get out of here with that and I was like, no, like people did not want to just watch Jeff's favorites win like
[SPEAKER_00]: That's not what Survivor was supposed to be in the fact that we get Boston Robb.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you get Coach or Ozzy here, and then you get Cochrane and Tyson in two of the next four seasons, it's like, oh my god, so Sophie's win is actually unbelievably important in my eyes.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I have her at 38, but I really respect her.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm kind of, I think she kind of comes in at the right spot here at 28.
[SPEAKER_02]: The algorithm had her at eight.
[SPEAKER_02]: Wow.
[SPEAKER_02]: Very high.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, really, I have my color way at two.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't understand this.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't see.
[SPEAKER_02]: She, you know, winning on her first try, her final six equity, weirdly high.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, she's beating basically everybody except one person is how I have it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: What's that?
[SPEAKER_00]: Everybody been Aussie.
[SPEAKER_02]: Right.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's how I had it.
[SPEAKER_02]: So that's pretty high.
[SPEAKER_02]: She turned it 13 tribal councils.
[SPEAKER_02]: She did get some challenge wins.
[SPEAKER_02]: So a pretty well rounded game jury votes at, you know, getting six of nine.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's pretty good, especially against the returning player.
[SPEAKER_02]: So The knock on her, I guess, is that it was a big gonging so she didn't have to do much.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's like, oh, find the people that are unlikeable become allies with them.
[SPEAKER_02]: be in that getting the good side and then just get to the end, you know, that's all she had to do and that maybe isn't as impressive.
[SPEAKER_02]: My personal rankings, I don't where I have her personally.
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't really, let's see, I don't really know, um, 20.
[SPEAKER_02]: So I still was pretty high, still higher on her than where she lands.
[SPEAKER_02]: So yeah, that's about right.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, why are you guys like you?
[SPEAKER_00]: I just don't know why Blake is laughing.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, maybe because you're personal or maybe.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, it's already here.
[SPEAKER_03]: This, we have it on tape.
[SPEAKER_03]: I believe this could be the last time in the, the history of my life.
[SPEAKER_03]: I have to talk about Survivor Self-Pacific.
[SPEAKER_03]: Hopefully we don't do 50 rankings or whatever.
[SPEAKER_03]: But thank God, Sophie is the light of the season.
[SPEAKER_03]: She is the reason why it's worth watching or in hindsight, like if Sophie didn't win, this is the worst season of survivor.
[SPEAKER_03]: The fact that she can, like, it's like the, in the walking dead where they put zombie guts on all of them and walk with the zombies the whole time,
[SPEAKER_03]: i'm actually a real person that has hopes and dreams don't don't see that i'm here coach because i'm the only one that can beat you and it's like that was very fun to watch it is something where you you want coach to win when you first watching and then he isn't the the best
[SPEAKER_03]: It's not despicable, but there's some stuff that you maybe you don't agree with and how he treats a Hans person and you're like, okay I it is something I want him to lose.
[SPEAKER_03]: What am I talking about Sophie's gameplay though?
[SPEAKER_03]: The gameplay is I have a really strong alliance And I'm going to maybe soup into that Relit like yes, I'll bow my head when we pray and I won't say a word and that's something that maybe she doesn't do in real life
[SPEAKER_03]: But on the island when we're playing for a million dollars.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I say some hillmarries at home.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's not something I do, but I feel more to God than ever on this on.
[SPEAKER_03]: She didn't say that.
[SPEAKER_03]: But I'm assuming that could be something that was going on because everybody else that didn't do that.
[SPEAKER_03]: Everyone that else disagreed was God and it is something where
[SPEAKER_03]: they did not give Savai a single chance to come back.
[SPEAKER_03]: They literally think, thanks, cocking for the boat.
[SPEAKER_03]: You're dead, too.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think that was part of her.
[SPEAKER_03]: If I remember back when we watched how do we year go.
[SPEAKER_03]: It is something where I think she made sure that the five was iron clad.
[SPEAKER_03]: You're going to go with Rick over me.
[SPEAKER_03]: Rick doesn't even talk and like Albert that's straddy like if if he was gonna go against somebody it wasn't gonna be Sophie They were gonna go after coach maybe, but then it is Ozzy is just a pain in the ass that we have to kill at the end and now we we don't get to make a decision It just we have to kill Ozzy at all costs and that's that's all the strategy they have
[SPEAKER_00]: What's funny is towards the end everybody thinks that they can beat Sophie and that's why they all kind of want to keep her around but then they start voting for her anyway like on Brandon's vote Albert and Brandon both vote for Sophie on the Rick vote Aussie and Rick both vote for Sophie like Sophie is the person whose name comes up but this is when they're playing the version of survivor where it's I feel like I can beat Sophie but I also feel like I can beat everybody else
[SPEAKER_00]: that this might be the most delusional final six in the history of the show.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think they all thought that they could win against every other person there.
[SPEAKER_00]: And as we kind of know, like I know Jim Rice said that Brandon Hans would have won not really giving much credence to Jim Rice saying that however many years after playing he said that like,
[SPEAKER_00]: It's easy to say that after the fact, but I do think at the end of the day, for as much of a cult as survived was, I don't think they're necessarily voting for Brandon to win that season because I don't think Brandon by the end of it was like somebody you wanted to be associated with.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, but they all thought that they had a chance to win.
[SPEAKER_00]: The one knock I have, I know somebody in here had said like getting a dominant line to doing a pegoning is how you play a dominant game.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think for me, the one knock I have against Sophie is she's not the leader of that alliance.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like that's why I think Kim's game is so highly revered because Kim is the leader of the dominal alliance that leads the pagami.
[SPEAKER_00]: Sophie is like she's like a mid tier person in that.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like coach is so blatantly leading it and everybody else has to fall in line behind coach.
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's ultimately why I don't rank Sophie maybe as high as I would somebody else who has
[SPEAKER_02]: I do, and that is interesting, will it 12 though, like, tell me more, like, yeah, I mean, again, I think the algorithm is higher on the games where they don't come through the TV screen as much.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's what we're learning.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's what the objective good players, that's what we're seeing.
[SPEAKER_03]: We need to get this algorithm to the survivor editors for 51 and 52.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's probably too late for 51, but for 52.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's true.
[SPEAKER_02]: They should have, like, okay, let's just look and see, like, how, like, I guess there's only one winner though.
[SPEAKER_02]: You can't rank.
[SPEAKER_02]: I guess you could rank the entire player's based on based on these metrics, like, yeah, these players deserve to screen time.
[SPEAKER_00]: West from once upon an island we were doing the winning survivor podcast last week we were talking about all the winners and you're saying that from season 33 through 44 the winner of every season got to talk on the mat to open the season so essentially like if they were one of the like you could eliminate every single person on the on the mat who didn't speak at the opening challenge from season 33 through 44
[SPEAKER_00]: which is insane.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like every single winner had content there.
[SPEAKER_00]: So they were essentially split in their season there.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's kind of like, well, how I talk about nowadays, if you get zero confessionals in an episode, you literally cannot win the season.
[SPEAKER_00]: It hasn't happened since Erica.
[SPEAKER_00]: They start to show their hand in those ways rather than showing their hand in like a way to tell them more more compelling narrative for the actual win.
[SPEAKER_03]: Why did they not have Michelle and Dee talk on the mat to start the season?
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know.
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, there's some dumb girl.
[SPEAKER_03]: We don't need to get anything for us.
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, I had to edit that season.
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, we don't.
[SPEAKER_00]: All right, number 27.
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's do a little guessing game again.
[SPEAKER_00]: I like playing the guessing.
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, and Wendell Holland.
[SPEAKER_00]: Who you got?
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, let me look at someone in my,
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't know, all these people are content.
[SPEAKER_02]: This can't be content.
[SPEAKER_02]: Richard, that's good.
[SPEAKER_00]: Richard, that's crazy.
[SPEAKER_00]: Blake, you nailed it.
[SPEAKER_00]: I just didn't want to give you credit.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's Wendell.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that sounds better.
[SPEAKER_00]: I put a menu here as a six-five winner over Dom, because the fact that Laurel ultimately ends up casting a crew, I mean, makes sense.
[SPEAKER_00]: Will with Wendell at 14.
[SPEAKER_00]: So now we have done in this podcast, just so everybody's keeping track.
[SPEAKER_00]: We have done Will's 11, 13, and 14.
[SPEAKER_02]: No, 11 was last podcast.
[SPEAKER_02]: Come on.
[SPEAKER_02]: So it's a total 13 and 14.
[SPEAKER_00]: Three of the first four people on this podcast are your 12 13 and 14.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, John, I'm kind of coming in here with a ranking of 33.
[SPEAKER_00]: Ultimately, I'd went to like 26 and Blake.
[SPEAKER_00]: You had Wendell at 32.
[SPEAKER_00]: So he comes in here at 27, helped along by Will.
[SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_02]: If Wendell, like if this wasn't a bad season, like I think Wendell would be way more revered.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like it's a pretty obviously is an epic ending, but I think the season is boring in part to him and Dom just demolishing that entire season.
[SPEAKER_02]: like they just run the show and I think Wendell is also like he's very social very like well he wants me he's a very well-rounded player um... and I think he's beating I mean we saw him beat down how many people is he beating uh... he beat up Wendell Wendell Wendell Wendell was like why are you going back home ever in contingent he beat everybody from thirty five to if you want to go get a good job
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean, he eats everyone.
[SPEAKER_00]: Dom plays such a great game.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like if Wendell can beat Dom, he can beat anybody.
[SPEAKER_02]: Right.
[SPEAKER_02]: So that's impressive to me and the algorithm.
[SPEAKER_00]: But no, it's not because you tell me this all the time that that's not impressive, because you say that you want to get the majority of votes.
[SPEAKER_00]: He only got five.
[SPEAKER_00]: What are you talking about?
[SPEAKER_00]: Sheesh, she's got rid of Dom earlier.
[SPEAKER_00]: You don't want to get a heater.
[SPEAKER_00]: He got sticks.
[SPEAKER_00]: He got sticks all the time.
[SPEAKER_02]: you got six of the love and votes.
[SPEAKER_00]: What are you talking about worth playing for I want to public apology regarding your Wendell and Tommy rankings when you get to them in every season matters and realize how good their games were.
[SPEAKER_00]: Clip this and see me.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean that could very well happen.
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like you know again when I'm ranking Wendell and Tommy these are two of my favorite people in the community and I'm trying not to be overly biased on that front.
[SPEAKER_00]: And so then all of a sudden I do this and everybody's like, no, when does much better?
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm like, I love that that's where the conversation's going.
[SPEAKER_00]: I really do.
[SPEAKER_00]: I like that you're not sitting here coming to our podcast and when does the overrated?
[SPEAKER_00]: I like that you're coming out of our podcast and when does underrated?
[SPEAKER_03]: Because I did it on purpose.
[SPEAKER_00]: I want it.
[SPEAKER_00]: I do though.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, that makes me happier than then like, oh, I can't believe you guys did that.
[SPEAKER_00]: You guys are just playing favorites.
[SPEAKER_00]: Cough, cough, where's Adam right now will?
[SPEAKER_00]: Just just wondering where Adam might be in this ranking.
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't want 10.
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, with fairly good win equity.
[SPEAKER_02]: So I feel like the algorithm probably had Adam very hard.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think the reason why I ultimately went with Wendell at 26, he can't do this without Dom, and it's kind of like a knock that I have on some other winners too that were a little bit lower.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's fine to be in that type of alliance, but Dom is very much in control of a lot of the decisions
[SPEAKER_00]: it's it's almost like you want to you want to rank them together as a player.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I put Wendell just outside of the top half, but you know maybe when I rewatch Ghost Island I'll feel differently because I was very much and and Wendell will tell you this.
[SPEAKER_00]: I was so in on the fact that Dom was winning that season that I was just like what do you mean Wendell won?
[SPEAKER_00]: So I think maybe I do need to rewatch a Ghost Island where I see it, but yeah I have my 26, so he comes in at
[SPEAKER_03]: we're all your friends.
[SPEAKER_03]: So, Wendell, what's crazy about him?
[SPEAKER_03]: Thank you, no, believe me.
[SPEAKER_03]: It is Ghost Island younger than Millennials versus Gen X, because it's literally insane.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, the Millennials, I'm looking back at this cast, 18, 21, 21, whatever.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, I think that's where I go against Wendell here of like,
[SPEAKER_03]: Whenever you see a duo that is on the same tribe from the beginning, they work together, it does not seem like it's obvious to us because they're talking about our professionals, but how is there nobody there breaking this up at any point in time?
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh well they're together and working together with all the smart people and you're like,
[SPEAKER_03]: The masterminds of Donithin and Laurel didn't get it done.
[SPEAKER_03]: Sebastian didn't figure it out either.
[SPEAKER_03]: And you're like, I'm not going to go one by one to pick them apart, but it is something where it's like, what were y'all doing?
[SPEAKER_03]: Who did you think was going to win?
[SPEAKER_03]: If it wasn't these guys, how did you think you were going to make it to the end?
[SPEAKER_03]: And I know that we're talking about Robin Amber and being like,
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, did you put Amber higher than the one that we're not here to discuss that?
[SPEAKER_03]: But it is something where it's like, how did you not break up this duo that's so super strong?
[SPEAKER_03]: And we're almost excited to make survivor history making them the 55.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's like, there's not many people with a killer instinct on the season, or they were dealt with long before we got to final nine to final eight.
[SPEAKER_03]: And it is purple Chelsea.
[SPEAKER_03]: Is she the one who's going to guess up?
[SPEAKER_03]: We don't know because she's not saying anything in her confessionals.
[SPEAKER_03]: And it almost feels like, I can't say all this stuff I want to say, but like, I know some of these like, oh, this was their opposition.
[SPEAKER_03]: Some of the worst opposition of all time.
[SPEAKER_03]: And like, I'm glad they dominated because their opposition is so bad, but I can't rank them higher when it is kind of like, oh, who do you play?
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm not saying that they're minor league of survival, that would be so rude, but it's not a banner year of survivor.
[SPEAKER_02]: I considered adding a part to the algorithm like how good was your cast, but it's so that's still so hard because again we don't get to see everything it's a very it's going to it's going to make the winning story shine you know more often than not then also it's like where these players.
[SPEAKER_02]: just bad at survivor or do they look bad because Dom and Wendell were so good.
[SPEAKER_02]: So it's like I don't know like what comes first, the chicken or the egg, are you bad because the people you're playing with are so good or you just naturally bad at survivor.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's hard to measure that.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so I didn't include any of that, but I think it is fair to say.
[SPEAKER_02]: And maybe I would have Wendell higher if there was something like, you know what?
[SPEAKER_02]: The ghost island cast probably was negative, it's a river.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, they probably weren't, but I don't know.
[SPEAKER_02]: Maybe they were, and they just got steam rolled by two of the best players to ever do it.
[SPEAKER_02]: I can't really tell you which one's true.
[SPEAKER_00]: And the problem is it's because the only guy playing a plus survivor went out in the pre-barge, which is a rather bad example.
[SPEAKER_00]: Great, bad example.
[SPEAKER_00]: Great, great, great, great, great, great.
[SPEAKER_00]: A plus survivor.
[SPEAKER_00]: Freak him back.
[SPEAKER_00]: Here's the thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: What round in March Madden is will, comes after sweet 16.
[SPEAKER_02]: The lead aid.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's also how many spots higher, Blake has amber than when it's the key to track it home.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm just saying, look, I think that Wendell's game is one of those.
[SPEAKER_00]: It also hurts.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's kind of similar to Sophie, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: It can hurt you when you're not as loud as the person who is being shoved down our throw, it's by the editors.
[SPEAKER_00]: And Wendell could make better moves than Dom, the entire game, but at the end of the day, we're hearing Dom's stories so much more than we're hearing Wendell's.
[SPEAKER_00]: Same thing with Coach Oversofi.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think that is something that ultimately just gets Wendell here at 27.
[SPEAKER_03]: If I go on survivor, and Jacob Durwin is on the other tribe I have to be, and they save him after that first disaster, and we get a two-o lead in tribal immunities,
[SPEAKER_03]: I that would be a dream.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's like what went wrong for Wendell from like what what plan went right for somebody to go after Wendell and Dom it just never happened and it's like it just seems like oh I don't know it's even board games when someone gets so far ahead you don't go I don't know how we're gonna catch them it's like throw the freaking blue shell right now or
[SPEAKER_00]: My favorite board game is Mario Kart.
[SPEAKER_00]: All right.
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's move on to number 26.
[SPEAKER_00]: So the last person in our bottom half of the winner.
[SPEAKER_00]: So the person before 25, which everybody is making their guesses at 26.
[SPEAKER_00]: And this is all wills fall.
[SPEAKER_00]: Again, help it sterile.
[SPEAKER_00]: 26, come on.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I just don't want to hear it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Anybody Blake has Michelle ranked.
[SPEAKER_00]: how many spots I had to rank 10 spots higher than I do do this to me.
[SPEAKER_00]: So don't you dare you said me.
[SPEAKER_00]: I said you know what's really funny is people were in the comments being like Michelle's only still here because of Phil if it wasn't here.
[SPEAKER_00]: And here's Blake ranked Michelle at 14.
[SPEAKER_00]: Look, I tried to take my personal bias out of this stuff as much.
[SPEAKER_00]: Not hard enough.
[SPEAKER_00]: We do so much.
[SPEAKER_03]: I ranked there at 24 and she comes in at 26 because Will's over here being a cry baby and Blake's over here trying to what do you think like you're going to get like a raise for this like I'm confused I have the text and I will say him out loud that Phil said I put Michelle at 13 can you put it at 14 so we can get her as high as possible and he dumped his rank nine or six down or whatever it was whatever the numbers
[SPEAKER_03]: So I don't know, we just recently watched Michelle Fitzgerald Suffolk again, and I think it is something where when I watched it again, it's like, yeah, it's kind of cool that she didn't go to immunity, but then I'm also going to say Denise went to every immunity, so it is different for every single thing and that's what I'm trying to say go into tribal council.
[SPEAKER_03]: I literally have a head high of me being the person who's going to take the fall for the Michelle 10 spots high, but you know Michelle's going to watch this because she's your sheet this is your her favorite podcaster and then that'll probably be like actually like play better.
[SPEAKER_03]: He's making a lot of good points.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think it's something where this is a social game winning over a strategic game and it is something where you're not going to understand it because it's not going to make sense, but sometimes you just like people better and it is something where we're going to re-hash it and that's going to be an Aubrey's entire storyline for 50.
[SPEAKER_03]: Because that's how the whole community feels about it.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's how you feel about it.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's how Michelle feels about it.
[SPEAKER_03]: And Aubrey's felt about it this whole time.
[SPEAKER_03]: Michelle's just the one that runs out.
[SPEAKER_03]: And it is something which one would you have rather have a beer with?
[SPEAKER_03]: The person who's literally the bartender behind that thing.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's pretty attractive.
[SPEAKER_03]: Or the Aubrey, the person that you're doing your homework with in the back.
[SPEAKER_03]: And it's like, a lot of people pick Michelle.
[SPEAKER_03]: Does she have some strong things?
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, she doesn't go home.
[SPEAKER_03]: She would have gone home there if she had immunity.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then she does the whole thing.
[SPEAKER_03]: Just like we're saying, Sandra did her second thing.
[SPEAKER_03]: Michelle is kind of not a winner.
[SPEAKER_03]: I would never say she wanted second time but she made the final tribal without getting voted out.
[SPEAKER_03]: Only two people did that Tony and Michelle and I think Michelle's game is shown and rehashed again with that higher echelon of people and she doesn't lose a step.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think that comes in a play when I'm thinking about her OG game, some of winners at war and maybe winners at war winners that is breaking ties and doing stuff for me in this because I didn't make an algorithm.
[SPEAKER_03]: My bad, but this is something where I like Michelle's game whenever I watch it again and it's something I could never do.
[SPEAKER_03]: I would be the strategist that loses a three to a very charismatic person.
[SPEAKER_00]: There are three winners in Survivor History who have played more than once and never been voted out.
[SPEAKER_00]: Jennifer Asuka, Kyle Fraser, and Michelle Fitzgerald.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I'm just saying, like, Michelle's the only one who actually went through an entire season.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know she was on winners at war, but you know, you could say what you want about her game.
[SPEAKER_00]: It doesn't matter.
[SPEAKER_02]: Here's, we're not taking into account other seasons for these rankings.
[SPEAKER_02]: Do we need to say that all right?
[SPEAKER_02]: So do we need to remind you of that?
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, I don't know.
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't know what you're doing.
[SPEAKER_02]: What?
[SPEAKER_00]: Everybody, if I put eras really high, everybody also took into account for these rankings like the fans and the fact that the fans want to hear our opinions
[SPEAKER_00]: So we're not really doing algorithms for the ranking either, but sometimes it pops up.
[SPEAKER_00]: So Blake, I get what you're saying here when you bring it up.
[SPEAKER_00]: I didn't take Michelle's second game into consideration.
[SPEAKER_00]: All the Michelle's second game is much better than a zero-of-a-finalist performance.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I look, we just watch Cauron.
[SPEAKER_00]: Michelle's social game is impeccable.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I don't care that she doesn't go to a travel council in the pre-merge.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's the point of survivor.
[SPEAKER_00]: Don't go to travel councils.
[SPEAKER_00]: Good.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you can go through the pre-merge without going to a travel council, good.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, I don't rank her as high as Tom Westman, because Tom Westman's the reason his tribe's not going to travel council.
[SPEAKER_00]: Michelle's not the reason her tribe's not going to travel council.
[SPEAKER_00]: But she gets through without going to travel council.
[SPEAKER_00]: She hits the merge.
[SPEAKER_00]: She's not really on the right side of things.
[SPEAKER_00]: And she knows when to pivot when she needs to.
[SPEAKER_00]: And she knows how to get where she's going.
[SPEAKER_00]: So Michelle gets all the way to the end and people consider and be like, well, Aubrey should have won Aubrey should have won.
[SPEAKER_00]: The jury's just bitter.
[SPEAKER_00]: Michelle treated everybody was voted out of that game like her friend.
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's why she gets votes.
[SPEAKER_00]: Scott and Jason and Julia are begging for Michelle to win this season when they get the final travel count.
[SPEAKER_00]: So they want everybody else to vote that way because
[SPEAKER_00]: They liked Michelle a lot and you can see him and you're watching her.
[SPEAKER_00]: Michelle talks to everybody.
[SPEAKER_00]: Aubrey talks to her alliance, at least that's what the edit is showing us.
[SPEAKER_00]: But Aubrey's not going out of her way to make the people are about to be voted out.
[SPEAKER_00]: Feel better and Michelle does.
[SPEAKER_00]: So Michelle gets the win.
[SPEAKER_00]: Five, two over Aubrey and Ty.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's pretty damn impressive.
[SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, I have her at 24.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm happy to see her at 26, you know, maybe if I could have brainwash one or two more people, we could have gotten her even higher, but 26 feels appropriate.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I had her at 27 in my personal, and then the algorithm was very, very, very low on Michelle's game.
[SPEAKER_02]: But, um, or immunity wins when you're on a tribe, tribal immunities aren't weighted as high as individual wins.
[SPEAKER_02]: So it's like she had a really bad combination of challenge points and tribal councils attended because she doesn't get as much credit for those.
[SPEAKER_02]: Tribal wins.
[SPEAKER_02]: There's also a lot of meta-vax to season and meta-vax also take away tribal council appearances so it's like the total times that Michelle went to a tribal where she could have gotten wrote it off.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think it was four And that's not that's like one of the lowest out of anyone you ever win this game and then I also I remember bringing this up on
[SPEAKER_02]: I believe the last episode, like to me, her game is so similar to Danny Boatred.
[SPEAKER_02]: So, I just very curious, now that we're at Michelle, where did you have Danny Boatred and Rankings and where did you have Michelle?
[SPEAKER_00]: I have Michelle at 24 and Danny at 41.
[SPEAKER_02]: Okay, see I I would love to hear the disparity between those games because to me those two games are almost I don't think they're similar really at all.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think Danny has no I don't Danny has to play coming back from a six one deficit with an alliance that's starting to eat itself.
[SPEAKER_00]: Michelle's on a season where the alliances are swapping all the time.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean her and Nick are supposed to be the ones who take over there's put Nick's
[SPEAKER_02]: But Michelle falls out of the main alliance and then kind of hangs around.
[SPEAKER_02]: I can't talk that we're having in podcast.
[SPEAKER_00]: No, I'm just saying you asked me.
[SPEAKER_00]: You have your answer was to it was going on a lot a lot a while more than so when it grew yeah I mean Michelle Michelle's game is also like purely social like Danny's game You can say is purely social, but at the end of the day, they're at final seven and then the other alliance just doesn't like each other and starts to pick each other off that's not Michelle's game at all
[SPEAKER_00]: Michelle's game is very much a going back and forth between different players.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's times where she's working with Julia and she's working with Sydney and she's working with Aubrey.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's other times that she's working with Kyle and working with Scott.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think her game is totally different.
[SPEAKER_00]: She's just playing a fully social game.
[SPEAKER_00]: I actually think Danny probably plays a more strategic game than Michelle.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I think that Michelle's strategy was to be social and I think that Michelle
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, but here's, here's the deal, let's, let's do this now then, you rank Danny higher than Tom Westman and they both are six one votes at the end and Tom plays the most dominate from a physical and he dominates the challenges.
[SPEAKER_00]: He wins five league does all this stuff.
[SPEAKER_00]: We're going to get the Tom later, but it's like that is probably a much bigger contradiction of a rank.
[SPEAKER_03]: This is her Turner Park has a part of my show here, not much part.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm just saying like she'll told Aubrey to tell tie to not give the idols so they just never put in the edit that that's what happened I mean mod is saying there I think there's a lot of creative liberties being taken here feel like I really don't think there are if you watch the season Michelle's game is there the entire time
[SPEAKER_02]: No, I know.
[SPEAKER_02]: We see her game and I feel like, you know, Michelle even got a better edit in the Danny in a lot of ways.
[SPEAKER_02]: And as we mentioned when talking about Danny, you know, she was hiding her game intentionally, so that producers wouldn't use that against her to help Stephanie win.
[SPEAKER_02]: So, I don't know, I just feel like they were both people that were
[SPEAKER_02]: fall into the spell to the side.
[SPEAKER_02]: They didn't get not main alliance or maybe the main alliance early on in the merge, but they fell on the wrong side of the numbers mid to late merge and then kind of hung around, made Bob and we have a little bit late and then went, you know, one in the immunity or two to solidify his spot in the end and they ended up at the end.
[SPEAKER_02]: They're like, wait, I was the most likeable.
[SPEAKER_02]: I was the most social.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm the one who's going to wipe the floor with jury votes because everybody likes me even though I wasn't in the main alliance and it wasn't really like controlling the game.
[SPEAKER_02]: I feel like those are both true narratives for their character.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't think Michelle just hangs around.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, the vote immediately after Nick Mariana gets voted out.
[SPEAKER_00]: She should be on the outskirts and instead she teams up with Aubrey Sydney and Julia to blindside Debbie in a minority vote where they go 432 on Debbie.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like that's not just hanging around.
[SPEAKER_02]: But I feel like Danny, and what I mean hanging around not that they do nothing to hang around, but that they take a backseat role.
[SPEAKER_02]: They don't make themselves a top dog or even like, they don't want to be a counter to this newly formed alliance.
[SPEAKER_02]: They are saying, I will roll with you.
[SPEAKER_02]: I can play with anybody.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, I'm not going to... Oh my god, you...
[SPEAKER_02]: You turned on me and throw a fit.
[SPEAKER_02]: They're not going to try to make any, they're not going to make any waves and they have a lower key social vibe to their game so that they do hang around.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's the thing that's going to be they linger enough, make sure they don't go home.
[SPEAKER_02]: And then at the end, they would they went a challenge or two and strike.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's kind of what where it's at.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I think Michelle just plays a better version of Danny's game, if it is Danny's game, but if you want to call it that Michelle plays a better version of it I don't think they're that similar, but Michelle plays a better game than Danny.
[SPEAKER_02]: I had her I had her at 27 in my personal and then that like I said the only attending for travel councils where you can go home
[SPEAKER_02]: when she had less weight and influence in those words.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't like what this podcast is doing to us or our chat.
[SPEAKER_00]: We're having a conversation, I think it's so soft.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's fast.
[SPEAKER_00]: Come on.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is what we're doing.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I'm going to have his on my ass in this chat right now.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, John Joseph should be on your ass right now.
[SPEAKER_00]: Brad Skolnik says Aubrey and Sid switched about the Debbie because she wants to work with Julia.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: And Julia doesn't do that without Michelle.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then he also says, having no ill will, wait, where was it?
[SPEAKER_00]: Somebody had, oh, it was this one, J.V.
[SPEAKER_00]: Bistan.
[SPEAKER_00]: Michelle over people like Nick and Tommy is kind of ridiculous.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like I don't think so, because if Aubrey wins this season, people are considering Aubrey a top 15 at least winner.
[SPEAKER_00]: Michelle beat her five two and it wasn't even close when they got the tribal council.
[SPEAKER_00]: We just thought it was going to be close when they got the final tribal.
[SPEAKER_00]: It wasn't.
[SPEAKER_00]: So if you can beat Aubrey five to two,
[SPEAKER_00]: playing the game that Michelle played clearly her game is a hell of a lot better than the editors knew what to do.
[SPEAKER_03]: Sure.
[SPEAKER_03]: No, that's fair.
[SPEAKER_03]: Final three.
[SPEAKER_03]: Of co-wrong is the the best place in final three when they all show up.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's actually crazy how they did.
[SPEAKER_00]: Matt also says Michelle played a new era style winning game.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, honestly, that's a fair assess and she had 39 days doing it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yo, so to Danny, though, you have a Blake ranked Michelle at 14.
[SPEAKER_00]: Do Danny, the Danny love from Will is weird.
[SPEAKER_02]: But anyway, it's not Danny love it's it's just a comparison that I when I went through these, you know, winter rankings and think about all these winning, winning games at once I hadn't really made that connection.
[SPEAKER_02]: Honestly, Fabio's when I feel like it's very similar.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think Chris is when is very similar to people who fall out of the main alliance but do what they can socially to make sure they're not the one who goes home when a couple of amenities late and get the win.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think that's like a very ballad way to win survivor who is
[SPEAKER_02]: And often we look at those winners as, you know, not the tippy top tier somewhere in the middle.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I think they're landing here, but there's a disparity in how we're viewing some of this stuff.
[SPEAKER_02]: But I think it's fun.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm happy with Michelle's hair.
[SPEAKER_02]: Let's move on.
[SPEAKER_00]: I got to poke holes in two things real quick and then we're moving on.
[SPEAKER_00]: These are quick.
[SPEAKER_00]: Matt is so filled, Natalie, what is the top tier winner?
[SPEAKER_00]: No, because Russell hands beats Shambo and Mick, and that's probably it.
[SPEAKER_00]: And he doesn't beat anybody else throughout the history of survivor with how he treated people.
[SPEAKER_00]: So no, he doesn't get votes.
[SPEAKER_00]: would rank way higher than Amber's.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like, yeah, it would rank way higher than Amber's, but also they played in lockstep and are married, and that's a much different situation.
[SPEAKER_02]: They were not married until after the show.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, but I'm just a member of Amber and Rob playing together is a much different thing than Michelle and Aubrey.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's just different.
[SPEAKER_00]: All right, anyway.
[SPEAKER_00]: Moving on to the top half.
[SPEAKER_00]: We asked who you all thought would end up at number 25 and nobody got it right.
[SPEAKER_00]: And don't worry, Mr. Willier, who's right about everything coming in with Tyson, Apostle and his ranking.
[SPEAKER_00]: Uh, I have Tyson at 23 a spot ahead of me.
[SPEAKER_00]: No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no,
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's start with you man.
[SPEAKER_02]: What what did the oh I don't like that Phil has all the power we should take over for the top 20 I think I'm actually like personally lower on Tyson and most you know survivor fans, but I'm not this low, and I'm surprised.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm actually surprised I was like the on the rhythm had Tyson at 45.
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh my god
[SPEAKER_02]: Um, I think is what happened was here.
[SPEAKER_02]: The win equity is not that high at final six.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think he loses to a good number of people there, to Tina likely to hate in and to Sierra.
[SPEAKER_02]: Um, other than like where, where, where does he go wrong?
[SPEAKER_02]: Uh, not a ton of challenge points.
[SPEAKER_02]: Um, it seems like he doesn't really stand out in any category.
[SPEAKER_02]: Really.
[SPEAKER_02]: He doesn't go to that many child accounts.
[SPEAKER_02]: He doesn't win that many challenges.
[SPEAKER_02]: He doesn't have a good win equity at final six.
[SPEAKER_02]: The only thing really going for him is his jury percentage of jury votes.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm surprised I didn't pop him up higher.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think, oh, he doesn't get the bonus.
[SPEAKER_02]: I have the bonus in there for first time in second time wins.
[SPEAKER_02]: If you're winning on your third try, it is not giving you any bonus points.
[SPEAKER_02]: We lose is out there and most winners do get some bump from the bonus.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I think,
[SPEAKER_02]: And this, how could I have the can't know this, but like he had to go to rocks, it finally said it's like, that's like all the rhythm knows all about rocks.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I think like even when I, because I had him at, I think 27 or 26, so like, like, in my personal and then it dropped, you know, the 45 really, really brought him down.
[SPEAKER_02]: So I,
[SPEAKER_02]: I think it's, to me, he's playing his third time.
[SPEAKER_02]: He's playing against newbies.
[SPEAKER_02]: So like when I think about his win, it's like you had to kind of this set up, he's in the power of lands, so we're turning players against first time players.
[SPEAKER_02]: He had to go to rocks.
[SPEAKER_02]: He was going to lose to people that were there very, very late.
[SPEAKER_02]: He can only win against the two people he sat next to.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I can respect his game and his character.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like Tyson's in all times your driver character.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like top.
[SPEAKER_02]: 10, maybe you could say top five survivor character.
[SPEAKER_02]: When you look at his win, there are quite a few holes in it, like I just pointed out, especially being that like he's going to lose other people and he had to draw rocks so late.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I do understand what you're saying with that.
[SPEAKER_00]: I ultimately ranked Tyson higher because a lot of his win equity losses do also come down to the fact that this was a blood versus water season.
[SPEAKER_00]: So people were voting in very for very different reasons that that final travel council than in a normal season of survivor.
[SPEAKER_00]: So like, yes, Sierra would would I think Sierra would win if she sits at the end.
[SPEAKER_00]: But as she winning because people actually felt she played a better game than Tyson or because Laura Marets over there and people who like Laura.
[SPEAKER_00]: are also going to vote, and if Katie and Tina are sitting over there, they're going to look at that and say, oh, this reminds me of our situation, let's vote for Sierra instead of voting for Tyson.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I do think there's a little bit of that there.
[SPEAKER_00]: I do agree.
[SPEAKER_00]: The rock drop final six is not good.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I know that people try to spin that into like a really big positive.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, good for him for having the the balls to do that.
[SPEAKER_00]: But then at the same time, he also does have the backup of
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like him in journalism is a really good alliance.
[SPEAKER_00]: The blind side of ours is the moment for me, that's great.
[SPEAKER_00]: And the reason why Tyson's win, it's his third time will.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know I agree with you on those types of points.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like I think that if you're playing for your third time and stuff, it's why I'm going to have par ranked lower than most people.
[SPEAKER_00]: Why have Boston Rob ranked lower than most people?
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, part of it was her second time, but Boston Rob was his fourth.
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, because of that, I'm going to have people ring the lower, but I do think that of all of these half and half seasons without a question blood versus water one is by far the most competitive cast.
[SPEAKER_00]: The newbies knew how to play games and hate in in Sierra and Caleb and Vetus, like these are really good survivor players.
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, and honestly, Katie plays a better game than people Michelle.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, all right, people think I look like, oh,
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I'm looking at the comments because they're also more taken out King RS.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, taking out RS was the best move by far and Tyson sets that up for weeks.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like he does such a great job of setting RS up to take the fall.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, yeah, I mean, I don't have a much higher.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm at 23.
[SPEAKER_00]: He comes in at 25 so I can't really complain.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's just funny that it takes
[SPEAKER_00]: a ridiculous ranking like john McKenna said 11 in a ridiculous ranking like wills at 42 to get him to the spot that he belongs.
[SPEAKER_00]: So Blake, where do you have Tyson?
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, let me find that exact number for you.
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, he played 39 days.
[SPEAKER_00]: So he was number 19.
[SPEAKER_00]: So he's a top 21 for me.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think one thing takes into account how many days he played before he got his win will.
[SPEAKER_00]: So he actually played like, I don't know, 60 something.
[SPEAKER_00]: So he should be one gun boy.
[SPEAKER_03]: Um, I think one thing that is interesting because you do forget unless you're fresh watch on it here it is arm
[SPEAKER_03]: and I think that was an interesting layer of like I'm a dominant physical force because you want that for tribal but he hurts his arm in the tribal stage.
[SPEAKER_03]: He could have been voted out or he could have been.
[SPEAKER_03]: It isn't meta-vocable of course not or he would have gone, but I think it's something where you're like, oh, he played that extremely well, lowered his threat level.
[SPEAKER_03]: He sets up our so badly.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay, we're going to get Vitas to and it's something where and then he's up against a bunch of moms.
[SPEAKER_03]: And the moms are not going away 39.5 days of that.
[SPEAKER_02]: The algorithm did not account for the day zero.
[SPEAKER_02]: I had to make it in just a minute, we're holding on.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's cool that Tyson also learns from his mistakes.
[SPEAKER_03]: I do think it's something where, all right, my first time around, I was too cocky.
[SPEAKER_03]: The second time around, I thought about it too much and got duped.
[SPEAKER_03]: How can I avoid that here?
[SPEAKER_03]: And finding the right alliance members, it is funny to see somebody say, co-pepper play to top 10, Monica, co-pepper play to top 10, losing game, like whatever the hell that means, like sure.
[SPEAKER_03]: like Monica is never winning that season and it's something where like you picked your allies because Monica is Monica and then Jarvis is literally like yelling at people as they eliminated as they win immunities and like the fact that Tyson can say oh your seats over there, Katie and like I don't know who didn't vote for him was a Katie that didn't vote for him
[SPEAKER_03]: Katie, we can literally just go, I thought we'll just sit there for over 80.
[SPEAKER_03]: No, it was not the beatist, does it vote for him?
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: He goes out of his way to make Katie feel like crap and then she votes for him to win four days later.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's something where like, I'm not saying, it's cool when you make people feel like crap, but that takes a specific person.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think it is also like Rachel went home, 32 days ago, I'm gonna do my best for her and that is like,
[SPEAKER_03]: The story, like, I'm gonna rank him higher than some other people that are in tears.
[SPEAKER_03]: Blake is waffling how to hear you.
[SPEAKER_03]: That was from a long time ago, but I might say.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, but like we can just south throw it out.
[SPEAKER_02]: I can't remember.
[SPEAKER_02]: They are, I don't know the next player.
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, yeah, I mean Tyson's, Tyson's game is, is solid.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think the third time does have an impact.
[SPEAKER_00]: And honestly, the newbies are better than the returning players.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, obviously, you have Tina and there.
[SPEAKER_00]: You have ours and there are two winners.
[SPEAKER_00]: But like, cat, Monica.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, let's start with this comment up to Monica wins three immunities and is in the swing vote at seven and five swing votes, they don't exist if you don't swing.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's just a vote.
[SPEAKER_00]: The way she wanted to.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, a swing vote has to go from side to side.
[SPEAKER_03]: You swing over, you're just on the fence in my opinion on that one.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm not trying to dunk on that person commenting.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm trying to more dunk on Monica Copa because she hasn't had it, I don't know.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean, all of a sudden.
[SPEAKER_03]: Kidding Monica, I really liked you in one world.
[SPEAKER_03]: I was rooting for you, but I think Tyson not classed.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's just the cast that you have to, like, that cast just likes Tyson more than they like Monica.
[SPEAKER_00]: And Tyson's final tribal performance is better.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I do feel bad for Monica.
[SPEAKER_00]: She said, have you all just never met a neat lady in Tyson's?
[SPEAKER_00]: Like I've never used to work neat and ironically in my life.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's why I win.
[SPEAKER_03]: Tyson's never voted his mom out.
[SPEAKER_03]: Never has.
[SPEAKER_00]: You never do that.
[SPEAKER_00]: All right.
[SPEAKER_00]: We're going on the number 24.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm ready to do this one.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now that will is gone.
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, so perhaps controversial.
[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe we'll see how people feel about this.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, realistically, how high did you guys think we were really going to rank new era players, second highest ranked new era winner is a Kyler is a day who you think like.
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, you told me earlier.
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, it's got a BD.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's got a BD.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's got a Kyle Philvite.
[SPEAKER_02]: I am Kyle in Sandley High.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I think it can come in at number 24.
[SPEAKER_00]: The heck?
[SPEAKER_00]: This is where these main things.
[SPEAKER_00]: We can talk as much crap about wheels algorithm or my personal takes or John and McKenna just rolling dice to choose theirs.
[SPEAKER_00]: But this is where Blake's ranking really, really messed everything up.
[SPEAKER_02]: Worst than an algorithm.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is his highest ranked new era winner, and he still has the lowest ranking for D. Kind of everybody here at 37.
[SPEAKER_00]: So he's highest ranked new era winner is the lowest ranking for D at of everybody.
[SPEAKER_00]: So here's D at number 24.
[SPEAKER_00]: Look, new era winner, 26 days, obviously we're biased against the new era that's just something that we're gonna feel.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like 24, I don't know,
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like it's all that inappropriate for her.
[SPEAKER_00]: Will you didn't have her much higher, 17?
[SPEAKER_00]: Blake obviously at 37.
[SPEAKER_00]: I had D coming in at 20.
[SPEAKER_00]: John and McKenna had D coming in at 18.
[SPEAKER_00]: So who wants to go first on this?
[SPEAKER_00]: Will you want to go first?
[SPEAKER_00]: You have the height.
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, Blake's got his hand up.
[SPEAKER_00]: Blake, you go.
[SPEAKER_03]: D, I think whatever, I want to explain.
[UNKNOWN]: Oh my God.
[SPEAKER_03]: Holy crap, tribe, I think we're giving us $60.
[SPEAKER_00]: And he still has time for the shit.
[SPEAKER_03]: OK, so ready to watch Blake just make crap up.
[SPEAKER_03]: Let's go.
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, my gosh.
[SPEAKER_02]: OK, so what I'm trying to say, what is there with a 26 days for one?
[SPEAKER_03]: So here's what I mean, here's what I mean by the verses of 26 to 39 can de keep an alliance together that long through another 13 plus days.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think most people would say, yeah, probably, but she's not doing those 13 extra days.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's 13 extra days for Austin to fall out of love.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's 13 extra days for Drew to go.
[SPEAKER_03]: Maybe this isn't the smartest thing.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's 13 extra days for Jake to be like,
[SPEAKER_03]: Hey, I'm being serious, we definitely need to go after D. It's 13 extra days for to curter out of go.
[SPEAKER_02]: Hmm.
[SPEAKER_03]: These great for my game, but how am I going to get to the end?
[SPEAKER_03]: It's not, I hope I get to the end.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think that's 13 extra days is very hard.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think you could ask any survivor player ever, would you rather have an extra day to talk about a vote or one day less to talk about a vote?
[SPEAKER_03]: And it seems like it's super easy to get votes across when there's less time.
[SPEAKER_03]: You don't get to go to sleep and think on it.
[SPEAKER_03]: You don't have a dream if you're Aussie and screw up a game.
[SPEAKER_03]: You don't get to...
[SPEAKER_02]: Wait, that would happen in a 26-day season, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, wait, what if that season was only 25 days and they skipped that day that he had a dream and then Aussie wins?
[SPEAKER_01]: It's something where I told me fair.
[SPEAKER_03]: D is a phenomenal winner, but 50 people one survivor and about 39 of them played longer days.
[SPEAKER_03]: And it is something where it's hard on your body.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's hard.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, I really, I think one thing that stuck with me forever is casting
[SPEAKER_03]: after 30 days some people hit a freaking wall and you can probably see that on some seasons literally Eric Reichenbach who we think probably could win a survivor season at final five two times has a mental slam into a brick wall and then his body physically can't go on his second season that's not happening well that happened on day with 30 something not
[SPEAKER_03]: I know there's sits the, okay, the Meta Vax where they have, okay, whatever, I, I, I'm trying to get something that makes sense so we can say goodbye to me and never think about this ever again, but this is something to me, he was allergic to the next list.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's really funny.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's something.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's something where I think those extra days do matter and I think if you ask majority of the 39 players that have won playing longer than 26 days.
[SPEAKER_03]: What were your hardest days on the season?
[SPEAKER_03]: I think a lot of them would say as it gets to the end, it gets more and more insane.
[SPEAKER_03]: They are not saying, oh, you know what?
[SPEAKER_03]: I made a crazy decision on day 19.
[SPEAKER_03]: Day 19 for the new era is like, almost like final, like final state or something.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, what?
[SPEAKER_00]: We get, we get the point about the day is here, Blake.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's great.
[SPEAKER_03]: Love the, she's on big brother, watch the big brother.
[SPEAKER_00]: I did rank D at 20.
[SPEAKER_00]: I had her as the highest rank new error winner at 20.
[SPEAKER_00]: My thing with D is every the big thing that you could poke a hole in with D is that at final five she should have gone home.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's the one thing that people really want to focus in on because that's where like Katura essentially screws everything up and ultimately keeps D in the game when I remember sitting there watching that finale going, oh my god, D's about to lose.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I also think that these relationships with Katura was so good and that she had worked to build that relationship so well with Katura.
[SPEAKER_00]: that's why she's ultimately able to survive a moment where she absolutely should have in the person going home on the plan made sense to get rid of her.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I think D social game is incredible and that's why ultimately I still ranked her as the number one new era winner.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now when we get the season 48 and every season matters, maybe I'll move Kyle up.
[SPEAKER_00]: But to me, those are the top two right now and for those keeping track at home, just like what's the difference between where I had
[SPEAKER_00]: I have Marianne at 28, Savannah at 29, I have D at 20, so I didn't ring any new era winners in the top 20, beyond 20, like that's just, that's just where I end up on this.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's how I feel.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, will you under 17?
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, the algorithm like a better.
[SPEAKER_02]: Um, well, I don't know what the algorithm, why I think this is pretty spot where did she end up in the, uh, in the algorithm, uh, 22 in the algorithm?
[SPEAKER_02]: And so I think I probably had her then right around that same range.
[SPEAKER_02]: Um, maybe I had I brought her up a little bit personally.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think the social point about D already made like you can knock the Catera thing, but it's like D was so close with the Catera that Catera spilled the beans on the plant.
[SPEAKER_02]: So like that's actually D being good at surviving.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm not going to hold that against her when she had the right relationships to be told the information that she needed to hear.
[SPEAKER_02]: Also remember, pre-emerge, something that she did very well was when she caught Drew in Austin with an idol or idol hunting, it wasn't like, oh, I can't trust you anymore.
[SPEAKER_02]: We're going to split up this four-person alliance because you did this one thing.
[SPEAKER_02]: She was like, oh, no, I get it.
[SPEAKER_02]: They're playing survive or two.
[SPEAKER_02]: She was so cool of it and maintain that relationship, kept the alliance together.
[SPEAKER_02]: We're a lot of players who are like, wow, I, you lied to me about nightle that you had and now I can't trust you and now our games are done and then the whole thing with the Julie move and telling Julie what to do knowing who had the idol and who didn't and then that Austin wasn't able to make that move she had the killer instinct I think she's a really well rounded player and that she put a group of people together.
[SPEAKER_02]: kind of was a leader in the way she had all the information at all at all times and it was even clearly working with people outside of her alliance like Katura to get information when she needed it so I don't they're like I don't see many flaws in in these game.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: No, I mean, I think that's I think that's totally fair.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I think when you start getting into this, like again, I know Blake 37, but number one ranked new era winner and like once you start saying every other one of us had her ranked in the top 20, I know 20 might not be the spot that people want to be at.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know what will is doing.
[SPEAKER_02]: We said she sticks earlier, right?
[SPEAKER_02]: We said that we can get to use takes because of.
[SPEAKER_00]: So you did you order one to mind and Blake's house to I got one right here.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think like, you know, there's this misconception misconception in the community of like, hey, you only ranked her at 24 or like, like, this is top half in survivor history.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I know the game has changed a lot, but like, we're a group that is going to be biased in one way or another towards some of these older school players as you're going to see in a little bit, honestly.
[SPEAKER_00]: And like, you can tell me that one game isn't as impressive as D's, but I can make arguments
[SPEAKER_00]: and also arbitrary, but, you know, D at 24, I think is fair.
[SPEAKER_00]: And honestly, I think I was looking at this.
[SPEAKER_00]: And so far, we've almost ranked every single person since season 35.
[SPEAKER_00]: like I think the only people since season 35 that we have not mentioned yet are Tony winners at war and Kyle.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think every other person since season 35 has been named.
[SPEAKER_00]: So like we're not just like doing this with the new era.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like this is also 35 Ben's
[SPEAKER_00]: it's just the newer the newer seasons it's more random and it's more luck and that's been going on since pretty much season 34.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, we say that a lot and I'm one of those first Gen X, every season matter how it feels like this is the last season the rapport survivor takes a big, big shift and to what it's ultimately going to be.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so all right, we're on a number 23 old school male
[SPEAKER_00]: You'll quewn coming in at 23, item ring 12 will had him ranked 40 if final tribally beats Ozzie and Becky 540 gets five votes against him.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's never in danger of actually going home though.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know I already know what will's reasoning is going to be.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's because of the the super idol.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know that.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, that's a big deal, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: It is.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, you talk about it all the time.
[SPEAKER_00]: I rank them at 12 because the I to 4 are down 8 to 4.
[SPEAKER_00]: They make the comeback ultimately at the moment where you will could have gotten enough votes to at least get the idle played and then have it on more of an even playing field.
[SPEAKER_00]: He is willing to sit down with Jonathan Penner and convinced Jonathan Penner.
[SPEAKER_00]: It is in his best interest to come with them.
[SPEAKER_00]: You will also be as he at the end.
[SPEAKER_00]: And like, beating Aussie at the end, I think is impressive.
[SPEAKER_00]: I kind of go the same way there as I do with Michelle versus Aubrey, like I give points for that.
[SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, I have no qualms with myself ranking, you will at 12.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know if it's become more popular or less popular.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know where you wills game ranks nowadays for most people, but I still put it near the top 10 because I think it's one of the most impressive analytical game survivors ever had.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, he gets the super idol, but he's the one person who's actually able to take the super idol, you know, and and make it so that it works to his advantage there down eight to four and he still manages to get to the end and it's not just because of the super idol it's because of the social game he plays the things that he says to the other players and yeah, I love yours game so I'm putting them at number 12 and he comes in here at 23
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I can't really really go over the superl thing anymore.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's like without that.
[SPEAKER_02]: They're not flipping penner.
[SPEAKER_02]: They probably get pogong and we have a totally different.
[SPEAKER_02]: story, and he got, we had two people that just left him.
[SPEAKER_02]: Dr.
[SPEAKER_02]: Literally didn't want to play with you.
[SPEAKER_02]: They're like, I don't want to play with you.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm going to the other child.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think I can do better without you, you.
[SPEAKER_02]: And it's great.
[SPEAKER_02]: He gets the upper hand.
[SPEAKER_02]: And then we have this like OP game mechanic here, so we get a way better story.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I find the I.T.
[SPEAKER_02]: 4 story.
[SPEAKER_02]: So satisfying.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think you will so much more of a satisfying winner than Ozzy, but like when I'm ranking winning games It's not about how much I like the person who wins or how much I like the story or narrative other season.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's how impressed
[SPEAKER_02]: Am I, by the way, you played the game?
[SPEAKER_02]: And I think you was a super strategic smart and a little guy, but like so much of what his game was was hinge on having this really OP relic that probably shouldn't have been in the game.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's in only one other season of the game.
[SPEAKER_02]: So clearly the throat.
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, the hookable might as well as different than the Terry and the you'll one.
[SPEAKER_02]: No, but Tony gets it, too, in 28.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's type of idle.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, you guess you're right, I guess you're right, but at least they call that an idle with special powers.
[SPEAKER_02]: Here's the idle and how it works.
[SPEAKER_02]: So I think maybe you call it some different.
[SPEAKER_02]: And look, the algorithm also was married.
[SPEAKER_02]: But the algorithm's bottom from 44.
[SPEAKER_02]: Okay, well, let's let's just go from 42 is Michelle, 43 was ours, 44 Bob Crowley, 45 Tyson, 46 you all.
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't want to say who that 47 or we might not have a podcast anymore.
[SPEAKER_02]: So yeah, there is no, this isn't just me, this is like, like, I think.
[SPEAKER_02]: Maybe it's that he didn't even win convincingly against Aussie like that's still that's that's a knock there too Like he only won five three The best physical game the show had ever seen at that point like I don't know how that's a knock to still beat that guy
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, yeah, you got to you got to not make sure he doesn't get to the final three that's what you mean anyway, it doesn't matter.
[SPEAKER_00]: You can sit against it.
[SPEAKER_02]: I won't know you have one person having a different feeling that way and then Aussie's a millionaire.
[SPEAKER_02]: You lose.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's pretty close to losing the final six.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm going back to my cheese stick.
[SPEAKER_00]: What's his win equity at final six?
[SPEAKER_00]: That's all I want to know.
[SPEAKER_00]: Why won't I get an answer to that question?
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, I didn't get an answer.
[SPEAKER_00]: Jack Conroy says, but he used the idol master plate.
[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.
[SPEAKER_00]: He does.
[SPEAKER_00]: And like, I agree.
[SPEAKER_00]: He does.
[SPEAKER_02]: It still doesn't mean it's not OP.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_00]: But answer my question.
[SPEAKER_00]: What is this win equity at final six?
[SPEAKER_00]: If you don't have that at 10, you're crazy.
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, out of the eat.
[SPEAKER_02]: Who does he lose to?
[SPEAKER_00]: He beats poverty.
[SPEAKER_00]: There is no doubt.
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, par.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think I can add par.
[SPEAKER_00]: He beats horror.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's a 0% of what it takes on that season.
[SPEAKER_03]: I like you'll log your cheesecake.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think you'll is interesting because the the tribe starts out on he's clearly the top dog.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's like it all goes through him whenever it's time for a swap.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's kind of like you'll is.
[SPEAKER_03]: still top dog.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think he top dogs the whole time of any time we have a decision that needs to go through our tribe.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know if it's strategic or whether we're going to eat.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm pretty sure they asked you all.
[SPEAKER_03]: And that's something where it's pretty impressive, but it is something where he is the smartest person.
[SPEAKER_03]: He's going to give you exactly what he thinks and analyze everything.
[SPEAKER_03]: If we're going to talk game theory pinner, are you going to do it with poverty?
[SPEAKER_03]: Are you going to do it with with Flicka?
[SPEAKER_03]: Are you going to do is cowboy or you're going to do it with you'll quon and it's something where, all right, you probably need to flush it and it is something where, but everyone you trust that you're going to flush this with and somebody's going to go home.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's going to be you.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think him saying the whole thought process of, all right, yes, I'll keep you one round further if I can have your jury vote is something that has not really been utilized three or four more times in the history of the game, and he does have all the power where he can big dog that, but I think that is a winning play for him, because
[SPEAKER_03]: is Piner going to vote for you or Ozzy, like he could feel some type of way towards you if he doesn't do that.
[SPEAKER_03]: So I think you'll is doing everything with intention and I think Ozzy's doing everything with his hearts.
[SPEAKER_03]: And for as much as we would hope part wins survivor, I think about seasons 10 11 12 13 14 is where strategy became so much more important than how did you make me feel and am I okay or whatever.
[SPEAKER_03]: So, and whether this is me making shit up or kind of how I felt watching those four seasons, you will was the big, bad boss all the time and nobody ever went with them.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes, he had full time security blanket, but it didn't matter.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, you got to go at the dude and they never did.
[SPEAKER_00]: Glad the impeller here says you guys are only talking about the super right of what about the bottle twist that definitely helped you a lot.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that really helped him a lot, but what about the
[SPEAKER_00]: Mutiny that really didn't help him a lot.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know Will you just said oh two people left because they felt their game was going to be better without you Well, okay, like why because they wanted to go join three people from their original starting tribe or whatever it was on the other side like to me It's like those two things level each other out because yeah He gets he gets the big benefit from the fact that they do the bottle twist But also he gets put in a down eight four position or nine four whatever it is.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think it's eight four
[SPEAKER_00]: He gets put in down eight or four position because of a mutiny, so yeah, they mutiny and then he benefits from the bottle twist like I can't really be all that knad at him, you know, those two things it's kind of like when you're ranking Rachel they level out I just think you will you can say it was so easy because of this super idle, but I really think that in Aussie's hands.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't think I too gets the numbers.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't.
[SPEAKER_00]: I really don't.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like I think in Aussie Sands, it probably goes the way that it went in Panama with Terry, where Cassiah ends up being the majority and Aussie pretty much has to win every immunity or uses immunity in order to survive it and you'll goes out first.
[SPEAKER_00]: You'll having it is impactful and it's how he gets his entire alliance to the final four.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I just think that that's unbelievably impressive.
[SPEAKER_00]: Is it an overpowered idol?
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's a lot of things in Survivor that are crazy and that don't work out right, but how does you will play it?
[SPEAKER_00]: We just saw Terry play it and I obviously love Terry talking about Terry all the time, but you will be able to use this so successfully.
[SPEAKER_00]: and therefore I'm going to give them a boost.
[SPEAKER_00]: I also hate Coke Island, so you know, I can't really defend the season and the twists in the season, but I can defend you.
[SPEAKER_03]: So 23 is the only play, you can only win the game, they put in front of you.
[SPEAKER_03]: True.
[SPEAKER_02]: You can only rank the winners that have played the games that were put in front of them.
[SPEAKER_02]: I could only put, I can only rank the winning games that were put in front of me.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's right.
[SPEAKER_00]: Until you hear, well, who else will has around you, guys?
[SPEAKER_00]: Just wait until you just wait until you hear.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm just saying, what was that 40?
[SPEAKER_00]: You remember, you will have 40 Tyson was that 42.
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's move on to number 22, because this is who will has at 41.
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, I don't have anyone in my 43.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm sorry, Boston Rob from redemption island coming in here at number 22 obviously wins eight one seven boats against one negated never in danger of ever going home the entire season.
[SPEAKER_00]: Jonathan McKenna ranked them at 12.
[SPEAKER_00]: Also, I want to say this on the last one, Blake had you will rank that 13.
[SPEAKER_00]: So we were almost in lockstep.
[SPEAKER_00]: I just have to take the heat because I had him once about higher will hear coming in with Boston Rob at number 43.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's the Zapatera effect.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you guys ever wanted to hear that, St.
[SPEAKER_00]: Clip O's says, will pick the names out of a hat.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, get me in to Justin, get us out of here.
[SPEAKER_02]: Let's take a cross here up as one of the least impressive games of all time.
[SPEAKER_02]: What are we talking about?
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, you're right.
[SPEAKER_03]: You're right.
[SPEAKER_03]: I had a med 21.
[SPEAKER_02]: 4th time playing.
[SPEAKER_02]: like against absolute nobody's who don't do anything his when equities not that he sits next to two of the biggest goats of all time and he's not sitting next to either of them.
[SPEAKER_02]: He's not waiting.
[SPEAKER_00]: Coach and to account now you were praising people for sitting next to like garbage last week.
[SPEAKER_02]: No, I'm just saying like, it's not taking time to go.
[SPEAKER_02]: If you're, if you're my hallway and you got goats for days, no matter who you get there with, up to you.
[SPEAKER_02]: If you need to find an area, but I'll get out of the sheet of one.
[SPEAKER_02]: Someone wins immunity at final three or final four, or if something happens where you sit next to not this perfect combination of people and you lose a million dollars, like, yeah, it's a knock on your game.
[SPEAKER_02]: True.
[SPEAKER_02]: So to me.
[SPEAKER_02]: From this isn't even the algorithm.
[SPEAKER_02]: This is me just rank.
[SPEAKER_02]: I just am owned and pressed by this win because the people he's playing with just are so blind.
[SPEAKER_02]: They're all recruits don't know survive or at all.
[SPEAKER_02]: He got this perfect cast with this dumb redemption island twist and.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it's Boston Rob's victory lap.
[SPEAKER_02]: Who's up her?
[SPEAKER_02]: It's all star's game is much better.
[SPEAKER_02]: I would rank that much higher.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm not rocking him as a player.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm ranking the specific win and I'm extremely unimpressed with it.
[SPEAKER_03]: tag me in tag me in.
[SPEAKER_03]: Are you in?
[SPEAKER_03]: I think this is the dumbest survivor cast of all time, but Russell also lost with the dumbest cast of all time.
[SPEAKER_03]: So some of what Boston Rob does is impressive because they see Russell go out on that side and they don't go
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, we should do that, too, but it's reputation at that point, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: And is it just as simple as thank God Boston Rob drew the old to Elmatepio thing, or could he have done it with Zapatero too?
[SPEAKER_03]: And I will never know, but I think this is the dumbest cast in survivor history.
[SPEAKER_03]: It is something where if I see an Elmatepio member walking down the street,
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not flagging them down to say a load.
[SPEAKER_03]: Hey, I have a survivor pack.
[SPEAKER_00]: I was like, oh my god, keep walking quick.
[SPEAKER_00]: Go let this be.
[SPEAKER_00]: You filmed an entire video of me and Natalie Teneralei competing in a challenge.
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, that was then.
[SPEAKER_03]: And this is now, now that I know more, now that I know there's going to be a new era and we're allowed to hate the show.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's, yes, Natalie Teneralei was fun to meet in person.
[SPEAKER_03]: And she was playing challenges with my friend Phil, and I'll take a video for your podcast.
[SPEAKER_03]: But Boston Robb, I think the other thing that's cool is he's kind of a self-insert of going literally in confessionals.
[SPEAKER_03]: These have to be some of the dumbest people alive.
[SPEAKER_03]: Why are they not coming after me?
[SPEAKER_03]: And it is kind of why?
[SPEAKER_03]: It is kind of shitty to watch him have the same confessional every single day on the island of they should come after me.
[SPEAKER_03]: they're not because every single minute of every day I am reassuring every single person.
[SPEAKER_03]: It is some of the most boring gameplay ever because nobody comes together to eliminate him, but it is everybody thinks they're three, but they are four.
[SPEAKER_03]: They are five.
[SPEAKER_03]: That person's six.
[SPEAKER_03]: That person's seven.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm going to prove it.
[SPEAKER_03]: You ready to watch this person go home twice?
[SPEAKER_03]: I think him sending Matt home that second time.
[SPEAKER_03]: Is a genius move that you could maybe screw up if you hadn't played this as your fourth time and in it whenever he does come back to play heroes versus villains You not heroes or films.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm saying the right thing into three one Or winners at war is winner at war game is bad because this is what it looks like whenever It's against people that know what they're doing and we can eliminate him before merge happens because he's a threat They should have done it on redemption island.
[SPEAKER_03]: They're not going to whether it's hero role hero effects or
[SPEAKER_03]: to have somebody that's already done this.
[SPEAKER_03]: The cast was stupid, but Boston Rob dominates from beginning to end.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean, I had him ranked at 14.
[SPEAKER_00]: And if you listen to this podcast enough, you know that I'm not a huge Boston Rob fan.
[SPEAKER_00]: I do think this is the Boston Rob victory lab.
[SPEAKER_00]: However,
[SPEAKER_00]: Voting out the three people that he voted out first on Omatepe are why he ends up in the situation he ends up in.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like voting out Francesca first was very smart when everybody wants to vote out Philip.
[SPEAKER_00]: Voting out Matt second to break up any potential craziness happening and not letting Christina know that's going to happen so she plays a nightle is very smart.
[SPEAKER_00]: Voting out Christina, even though he votes for Philip,
[SPEAKER_00]: But making sure it's Christina who goes home after that, you have now gotten rid of anybody who could ever try to overthrow you.
[SPEAKER_00]: Then he gets to the merge, he's willing to use Matt and Matt just spills because Matt just plays the worst game ever and Rob very wisely tells everybody, let's just get rid of Matt and it lets him take over control.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like you can say that this is easy, this is a victory lap, like I agree, it's just fourth time, like I'm not overly impressed, but at the same time,
[SPEAKER_00]: He is making moves and decisions that most players playing on their fourth time would not be making and that is that is a fact and so I think that like ranking him at 43 I think just totally disregard all the positives here if you were to ask me which season has the player who plays the most dominant game It is probably Boston Rob and redemption island if you don't take into account cast or any of that
[SPEAKER_00]: he literally does everything right the entire season and there is never a chance that anybody in his alliance or himself go home.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I rank it at 14 because it's his fourth time and he is playing against the worst cast of all time on the worst season.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like it's really, really bad.
[SPEAKER_00]: However, he also is willing to put up with fill up that entire time, which is not something that most people would do.
[SPEAKER_00]: And sure, he keeps around Natalie,
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, he just, he does what he's supposed to.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a boring ass game, but it is a dominant game.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think saying you're totally unimpressed.
[SPEAKER_00]: That to me is crazy.
[SPEAKER_00]: He had his family on his back, I think, too.
[SPEAKER_00]: He did, well, come on.
[SPEAKER_00]: He carried six women or something on his back up a staircase.
[SPEAKER_00]: Literally, as Jeff says, he uses the word literally, and that sentence, don't forget it.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, something else here too, I think going against Russell is like very beneficial to him early, so it's like when the two are brought out, it's like you see Russell and you see Boston Rob and you're like, okay, who do you want on your try everyone's like, okay, I don't want Russell on my tribes you're starting this position of begging for Boston Rob to come to your tribe, which sets it up for him even more and it's like when coach and Ozzy came out for South Pacific, it's like everyone's like I would weigh rather of Ozzy than coach.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like like I don't like there's like your sand here.
[SPEAKER_02]: I like I like that it just to me it was like Russell's the enemy Russell's anti cuz it's still reputation if it was Boston Rob and let's say at this point who's who it's like Boston Rob and Sandrich like I live in the idols before it even happened
[SPEAKER_02]: And it's like, oh, we want to send our Boston Rob Euro.
[SPEAKER_02]: I remember you, you're a snake or whatever.
[SPEAKER_02]: And he's coming off like his worst performance and he rose for his villains.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so you're not as threatened by and you have growing its Russell who is like the number one public enemy of Survivor right now who went back to back being an absolute asshole.
[SPEAKER_02]: So it's like, well, you're like, welcome to this environment.
[SPEAKER_02]: So I don't know.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think it was just a, it felt,
[SPEAKER_02]: it feels watching it that you're like, I don't understand how any of these people even consider eliminating Boston Robb.
[SPEAKER_02]: But it doesn't even like come up in conversation.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like it's not even like a question ever of like, huh, do you think Boston Robb is going to like get to the end and beat us really easily?
[SPEAKER_02]: No, it's like never even thought about.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so to me,
[SPEAKER_02]: I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, but everything else about your sentence just went against Kim being ranked high.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's all I'm saying.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, look, I don't want to defend Boston Robb.
[SPEAKER_00]: I love Boston Robb being at number 22, which is also his season, Blake.
[SPEAKER_00]: How'd you not point that out?
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, we've got a lot of those.
[SPEAKER_00]: Wasn't Erica 41.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, Larry.
[SPEAKER_00]: She was, I know, and he was.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, but I mean, I don't want to be defending Boston Rob.
[SPEAKER_00]: I just think, look, I think, ultimately we got to a spot that I'm content with.
[SPEAKER_00]: The difference between Boston Rob and D was not much.
[SPEAKER_00]: So Boston Rob could have easily been even lower.
[SPEAKER_02]: The algorithm was super low at Boston Rob.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean, your algorithm has problems, man.
[SPEAKER_00]: So far, this episode is like the algorithm has issues episode because some of these rankings this episode are just absurd.
[SPEAKER_00]: And guys ready for 21 last one of this episode.
[SPEAKER_00]: Sure.
[SPEAKER_00]: Who doesn't make the top 20?
[SPEAKER_00]: Who's not making the top 20, Blake?
[SPEAKER_00]: What's up, yeah?
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, who's not making the top 20?
[SPEAKER_02]: Kenzie.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that's true.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm right.
[SPEAKER_02]: And that, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: You are.
[SPEAKER_02]: John Cochrane.
[SPEAKER_02]: Natalie Anderson.
[SPEAKER_00]: Don't call bad.
[SPEAKER_00]: Interesting.
[SPEAKER_00]: uh... close with the sappy of the lake but not quite it's bright all right coming in here at number twenty one this is one where it's like me and will again or an opposite into the spectrum but this is a close gap compared to some of these other ones and we're coming off off the road that the gap was like thirty one ranking spots or something here it's twenty uh... he literally lands right in the middle of where will and i have him he comes in at twenty one i have eleven will have some thirty one
[SPEAKER_00]: everybody knows that I'm a huge Brian Stan for his season on Thailand.
[SPEAKER_00]: I need to make sure everybody knows that.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think that is.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think that his Thailand game is one of the most impressive in the history of the show.
[SPEAKER_00]: I understand that it is boring and that Thailand is bad and that we don't like Thailand.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like I understand all of that.
[SPEAKER_00]: But he came out.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is the fifth iteration of survivor.
[SPEAKER_00]: He does exactly what you are supposed to do.
[SPEAKER_00]: He creates an alliance of five
[SPEAKER_00]: He creates an alliance of three within that alliance of five and he ensures that he is every single person's number one in that final five Which is why he ultimately gets zero votes against him.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_00]: He only beats clay four to three But he is always getting the four votes that he gets at the end I know people will say Jake might not have voted for him Jake was always voting for him.
[SPEAKER_00]: That is just the
[SPEAKER_00]: you know whatever that's the edit trying to be like oh there's drama like there was no drama brim was gonna win and for as much as people say clay is like the ultimate goat soup jai really liked clay which is like you know clay might not be a very good survivor player but soup jai like that guy man
[SPEAKER_03]: And he's a real piece of shit, but he's our piece of shit.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, but you know what I mean?
[SPEAKER_00]: Here's the thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, Rob, everybody liked him because Rob choked them, and they were like, all right.
[SPEAKER_00]: But look, I always say, Brian is, if I was gonna say, you told me, you can have one winner in the history survivor, go back out there and play it again, and you're putting your money on them, and they're gonna win.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm picking Brian.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't care what era it is.
[SPEAKER_00]: I understand, like, I am saying 33, or whatever how old he was,
[SPEAKER_00]: Brian from Thailand.
[SPEAKER_00]: I will pick that winner over everybody because he is a flat out sociopath on this season.
[SPEAKER_00]: He does not care about anybody.
[SPEAKER_00]: He doesn't care about their feelings.
[SPEAKER_00]: He doesn't care about their interests.
[SPEAKER_00]: He lies about everything to everyone because this was a business trip and he wanted to win the game.
[SPEAKER_00]: He might not be the most exciting player, but he does a great job to the point that everybody is calling him a class act and a great guy, the entire time.
[SPEAKER_00]: And we all know the stuff that went on in his life outside of that.
[SPEAKER_00]: This was 24 years ago.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know what he's like now.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's pretty much gone off the grid.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know Johnny Fair played an interview to him once.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think the first question he asked is why do you shoot a puppy?
[SPEAKER_00]: But like, look, that's Johnny Fair plays business.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's not mine.
[SPEAKER_00]: And so my thing with Brian is,
[SPEAKER_00]: Like if you're asking me just ranked the survivor player, this is early enough in the show where you could just win it in the most basic way and he does.
[SPEAKER_00]: And he is never ever, ever in danger of not being the sole survivor on this seat.
[SPEAKER_00]: So,
[SPEAKER_00]: I haven't met 11.
[SPEAKER_00]: I probably could have won even higher, but you know, I'll take the 21 ranking.
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel it's fair.
[SPEAKER_00]: I see a lot of people nowadays ranking him in like the bottom five or bottom six.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm just like guys, I get Thailand stanks and I get Brian's not the most compelling.
[SPEAKER_00]: But that's a little ridiculous.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think
[SPEAKER_03]: the Sepia showed up by now and having her be lower than Brian is kind of, I get maybe some people being like, wait, what?
[SPEAKER_03]: So that'll be an interesting thing to see how we, how we give the Sepia higher.
[SPEAKER_03]: Brian, Brian had one of the most dominant games of the first, some, yet yes, there's still some people that are around like Tina and Rich.
[SPEAKER_03]: But it is something where
[SPEAKER_03]: No one else was ever winning, but he did not cross his teeth and dot his eyes to make sure everybody loved him too, and it just wasn't important to him.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think there's some lore of like, what's the most despicable thought process we can have for a job?
[SPEAKER_03]: And they were like, use car salesmen, and then we're like, let's just go find a use car also.
[SPEAKER_03]: The first one is Brian Heideck and he's also a motionless, is he associate path who knows that's for the island to decide and it's something where how many I think he played the first game where it was like everyone thinks he's their final two and that was not true that's not how this worked.
[SPEAKER_03]: and it was probably seen as sloppy gameplay the first time somebody does it.
[SPEAKER_03]: If you do it on season 52, you're probably a genius of six different people thought you were a final two with them.
[SPEAKER_03]: But everyone in his final five alliance thought that they were going to the final two with Brian because of something that he said specifically to them that nobody else could ever know and then he knocked him out at five four and then I don't know how much he went
[SPEAKER_00]: And they all go up from the way into, which is really for Chewigon, all those Brian, even though he'd be trade all of them, which is crazy.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think that's crazy because yes, I think this has always been something that's mattered to I think most of the survivor community, if it not, maybe it's just me, but it's like when there's discrepancy in votes or which votes did you get?
[SPEAKER_03]: What's more exciting?
[SPEAKER_03]: The majority alliance votes for a win or the minority who never really had a pulse on the game and was kind of fed scraps, the minority votes who did they vote for, oh, they voted for clay.
[SPEAKER_03]: And it's like, okay, because Brian kicked their ass so bad.
[SPEAKER_00]: is because Brian did not care about any of them either and that's what I mean when you say his associate path he knew that the game was you always need to have one more number than everybody else and that's the only way he played it and it might not be the flashiest but tire supposed to play a striker like how to met 17 John and McKenna met 28 so
[SPEAKER_03]: I think the other thing I want to say real quick to is for every time someone comes from behind in wins.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't think Brian was ever lower than one or two in the entire game.
[SPEAKER_03]: So what is more impressive?
[SPEAKER_03]: What is a better survivor player?
[SPEAKER_03]: I think it's different for every single person.
[SPEAKER_03]: but much like Kim, much like you'll, much like some other players that are coming around here.
[SPEAKER_03]: These are the people that Boston Rob, we just said another one.
[SPEAKER_03]: Never lower than one or two on their season, but maybe that's because the season doesn't know to get rid of them.
[SPEAKER_03]: There isn't something they ever have to face adversity.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then like Brian's the worst at like, how did he almost lose to Clay who probably was 15 one day of the best eight.
[SPEAKER_03]: No, there were 16 of them.
[SPEAKER_03]: He was probably 13 one day and then was eight and then never got higher than five until we voted people out of five four and three.
[SPEAKER_00]: Mm-hmm.
[SPEAKER_00]: Will you have them at the lowest?
[SPEAKER_00]: Still not that low though, 31.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I mean, I couldn't say, look, Brian played a really good game in one.
[SPEAKER_02]: Um, we're in an era of survivor where it, that's, that is the goal.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like get a group of people and pick on the other group, like get numbers, you know, early, you know, before you even merge, like come in with numbers, keep the numbers and go to the end and find your way to get to the end.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's what Brian did.
[SPEAKER_02]: He did it very well.
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, the question that we've been talking about is it's funny.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's like, is it the septia or Brian?
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't know why the septia is really coming in here.
[SPEAKER_02]: Vesepia didn't have the numbers, and Vesepia worked to get a flip, and then Vesepia at the end, even wasn't sure of it, and then she had to make a deal at her final immunity challenge, or she's like, I'm gonna get a deal with basically, but I'm really guaranteed my spot in the final two during an immunity challenge.
[SPEAKER_02]: To me, that's actively doing more to ensure you're win, whereas Brian, it's like, okay, let's make sure we win enough immunities, pre-merge, and that relies on the entire tribe, not just yourself.
[SPEAKER_02]: And of course, he was competitive with challenges.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm not knocking that against him.
[SPEAKER_02]: but it's just a more simple game, and it's not Bryan's fault that he played in an earlier iteration of Survivor, but I'm ranking winners, and I'm more impressed by more active ways to win, and given the whole Pagong of it all, like this is in an air, also where it's very few ways to counter.
[SPEAKER_02]: a pagonging that's actively happening.
[SPEAKER_02]: There's not a whole lot you can do when you don't have the numbers.
[SPEAKER_02]: First, later, like if you're in season 50, there's not even anything to pagong because there's no structure or form happening at all.
[SPEAKER_02]: And maybe somewhere in the middle in the teens and 20s, it's like, okay, you have a nightle or you have another second swap or you have some twists.
[SPEAKER_02]: There's just things that are
[SPEAKER_02]: you have to survive more through or work towards to get to your win, whereas getting the numbers early merge and writing it to the end, you can call it dominant, yes, but I think we've seen better versions of winning games, so that's why I have him love.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and people will say that Brian's win benefits from the fake merge.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I also think that that goes back to who you vote out when you vote them out.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, it was a mistake by the Sukjai tribe to not vote out she had, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, she am was going to flip on them even if it was a normal merge.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's six four advantage for Chewie gone.
[SPEAKER_00]: because Brian and it's not popular thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: And again, this goes back to kind of like the sociopath thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: When the whole Gandhi-attempt thing happens, Brian's essentially like, ooh, Gandhi is going to be a problem.
[SPEAKER_00]: We should vote her out.
[SPEAKER_00]: It keeps chewy gone all together.
[SPEAKER_00]: It really does.
[SPEAKER_00]: And the other thing that was kind of smart by Brian is a three to male advantage over women, which was a thing that was part of the discussion in the early seasons of survivor.
[SPEAKER_00]: So like he went the routes that he had to go.
[SPEAKER_00]: I though and all of course, because it's going to happen in the net.
[SPEAKER_00]: We're going to find out in the next episode anyway, but I'll support this.
[SPEAKER_00]: No, I have the Sepia ranked higher than Brian as well.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I have Brian at 11.
[SPEAKER_00]: So for people who are like, how is the Sepia there?
[SPEAKER_00]: I do still agree with you, will that?
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, the Sepia does more.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I think they're like, we're ranking with it.
[SPEAKER_02]: So it's like, I would rather see more action.
[SPEAKER_02]: And like, yes, dominance, dominance to me is often notism.
[SPEAKER_02]: Because you just, there wasn't, you had nothing to counter.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, Boston or I've had nothing to counter.
[SPEAKER_02]: Brian had nothing to counter or dominate, but they have countered.
[SPEAKER_00]: Blake was going to die if you didn't let him get this up.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I'm sorry.
[SPEAKER_00]: But say Jake Latimer's here.
[SPEAKER_00]: Just tuned in boys.
[SPEAKER_00]: Blake's looking amazing.
[SPEAKER_00]: Blake has already sent that to four different group chats on man.
[SPEAKER_00]: Who now has it up on here.
[SPEAKER_00]: Blake, did you like send it to your mom too?
[SPEAKER_00]: Like what's going on?
[SPEAKER_03]: No, no, no, no, of course not.
[SPEAKER_03]: Dude, what the hell?
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm focused.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm laser focused.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think what's interesting too is
[SPEAKER_03]: This 21 through 50 was contentious.
[SPEAKER_03]: But if you look, I think most people have their top 10, completely untouched.
[SPEAKER_03]: I have my top 10 completely untouched out of the 20.
[SPEAKER_03]: So we're not crazy.
[SPEAKER_03]: I get it's our rankings, Jesus, like that makes sense.
[SPEAKER_03]: because of how math works, but it is like, there's no somebody that one of us is like, for sure, and then everyone else does 50's 45 on or whatever.
[SPEAKER_03]: So I think it's something where for as much trouble as you had choking down some of our thought process for 37 or 44 or even some people this episode,
[SPEAKER_03]: It is the final 20 are going to be full of like, I agree, I, and there's going to be some outliers, but like that top 10 is going to be like, yes, it's, when survivor winners are bad, they're bad, but when survivor winners are good, everyone agrees are good.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, Blake, when we start ranking people at like 17 and 16, that people think should be top five that nobody's going to agree with us, but I, I will, so just to give people some stats here.
[SPEAKER_00]: Me, John McKenna and Will all have our top 10 still intact.
[SPEAKER_00]: Blake has his top 12 still intact.
[SPEAKER_00]: My lowest remaining player is ranked at 27.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, John and McKenna's lowest ranked is 37.
[SPEAKER_00]: Will's is 39 and then Blake has 135 and won it 39.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, you know, we have two people in there, but again, as you can all figure out, one of those people is Kyle Fraser, because Blake ranked all the new era people super low.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, if you
[SPEAKER_00]: cut that out really bland as John Cochran's biggest hater and yeah I recruited me yeah I mean you do your best I did my best in Goddam as far as I could yeah we we get I mean we get into some top 10s next week obviously I mean we're down to that but I think for the first 30 nobody lost you'll lose any one seeds I think is the point here and Brian was the closest to a one seed for me
[SPEAKER_03]: Um, so yeah, I like that analogy love analogies that we're doing cool.
[SPEAKER_00]: All right.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Anybody have anything else?
[SPEAKER_00]: I got the biggest joke of the podcast coming up in one second.
[SPEAKER_00]: You guys ready for this next episode is going to be Monday at 10 30 will is it going to be Monday at 10 every time this slide comes up will's like
[SPEAKER_00]: What?
[SPEAKER_00]: And then we end up doing a different day.
[SPEAKER_00]: Next week, it kind of has to be Monday at 10, 30.
[SPEAKER_00]: So hopefully it is.
[SPEAKER_00]: The week after it's going to be on Sunday.
[SPEAKER_00]: So those are the next two episodes for everybody who's keeping track at home.
[SPEAKER_00]: We'll try and come up with an excuse.
[SPEAKER_02]: But I think it works.
[SPEAKER_02]: For real, I guess.
[SPEAKER_02]: It could be good, you know, TVD, but I think as of now, as of now, that works.
[SPEAKER_02]: Cool.
[SPEAKER_02]: All right, so on the 20th.
[SPEAKER_00]: at 10 30 p.m. We're rank in 20 to 11.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you made it this far, please like the video.
[SPEAKER_00]: Please subscribe to the channel.
[SPEAKER_00]: We really appreciate y'all sticking with us.
[SPEAKER_00]: Patreon dot com slash specialist.
[SPEAKER_00]: We got game changers starting on Thursday.
[SPEAKER_00]: Wow.
[SPEAKER_00]: Who's not excited for game changers?
[SPEAKER_00]: We're going to recast it or something and then we're going to talk about the cast.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm excited.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well is excited.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's good.
[SPEAKER_00]: If well's excited, everybody should be excited.
[SPEAKER_00]: Let us know in the comments.
[SPEAKER_00]: Let us know your thoughts on this list, how you feel about what I think is probably going to be our most controversial one.
[SPEAKER_00]: But then I feel like every player that we ranked in the middle here does have some serious haters and does have some people who really, really overrank them.
[SPEAKER_00]: So we'll see what ends up happening.
[SPEAKER_00]: But top 20, coming your way soon.
[SPEAKER_00]: So thank you all so much for listening, and we will see you next week.
[SPEAKER_03]: All right, ready?
[SPEAKER_00]: See ya.