[SPEAKER_00]: Welcome to Sexology, a podcast that untangles the science of sex and pleasure.
[SPEAKER_00]: And now, with this week's episode, your host, Clinical Psychologist, Dr. Naseneen Moali.
[SPEAKER_01]: We'll come back to another episode of the Sexology Podcast on your whole structure not as an email only.
[SPEAKER_01]: And today we are exploring a question that many people quiet the rest of it.
[SPEAKER_01]: Can you be deeply spiritual and fully embrace your sexuality?
[SPEAKER_01]: For a lot of people, especially those raised in religious environments, sexuality and spirituality have been framed as opposite.
[SPEAKER_01]: You're taught that desire is dangerous, pleasure is selfish, or that being a good person means disconnecting from parts of yourself.
[SPEAKER_01]: But what happens when you stop seeing your body as the enemy?
[SPEAKER_01]: Today's guest Shushanku Blanca has built her work around the very question.
[SPEAKER_01]: Through her writing, her performance art and exploration of faith, pleasure and embodiment, she challenges conventional
[SPEAKER_01]: and this conversation we talk about religious shame, desire, repression, psychedelics, and how people can begin reconnecting with their bodies after years of filling disconnected from them.
[SPEAKER_01]: And before we dive in, if you're a woman who feels lost touch with your desire or simply want to better understand it, I create a free guide called a woman's guide to reviving sex drive.
[SPEAKER_01]: I wrote it based on the most common challenges I see in my clients and the practical solutions that help them reconnect with pleasure, desire and their bodies.
[SPEAKER_01]: You can download it in the show notes.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think it first beautifully with today's conversation because both are ultimately about the same thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: Learning to trust your body is set up fighting it.
[SPEAKER_02]: Alright, well let's dive in.
[SPEAKER_01]: Hello and welcome back to another episode of The Sexology podcast.
[SPEAKER_01]: I am so excited to welcome back Shoshana Blanca, AKA Jesus Christ, for some, I'm getting used to it.
[SPEAKER_01]: All of those are just so exciting.
[SPEAKER_01]: Shoshana, welcome to our show.
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, tell us a little bit about this new journey that you're on.
[SPEAKER_01]: You're creating content under Shoshana Blancah and the title is Jesus Christ, Bornstar.
[SPEAKER_01]: Tell us more about the evolution of this project.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, so I'm also a feminist writer, sex educator, and therapist, known as Susanna Weiss, and I'm the author of two books on women's sexual empowerment, including Eve's Blessing, which talks about
[SPEAKER_02]: religion and this idea of the curse on women in the Garden of Eden.
[SPEAKER_02]: So I was already doing things along the theme of bridging sexuality and spirituality and the idea to actually make it into porn was it came from a psychedelic trip.
[SPEAKER_02]: with Ebola, which is a psychedelic that comes from Africa.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's a wood that they put into a capsule, and it's very intense, and I received all these downloads on the trip that what the reason I like part of my mission on earth was to help people see their bodies as something that is not at odds with God, but that is something that is defined in Holy and
[SPEAKER_02]: It came to me to make a porn hub channel called the second coming and it's gone through different iterations.
[SPEAKER_02]: It started out on the second coming spelled with you.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I came up with the name Jesus Christ porn star, which I was shocked to know when had taken yet.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's like Jesus Christ super star, but the next iteration.
[SPEAKER_02]: And what I do, I call it high vibe porn.
[SPEAKER_02]: I haven't actually had sex on camera.
[SPEAKER_02]: What I do is I have a few different series.
[SPEAKER_02]: One of us have vlogged series where I talk about my trips and about Jesus and basically at Jesus' visitations that I've had on psychedelics and what I believe he truly wants for us, which is to live a shame free life.
[SPEAKER_02]: And that is what I aim for through this work.
[SPEAKER_02]: historical literature Bible readings where I leave read from the Bible with a vibrator between my legs, and I've done it with other books too.
[SPEAKER_02]: I have one 40 minute video where I'm reading a philosophy essay.
[SPEAKER_02]: I really have fun with it.
[SPEAKER_02]: I have videos where I'm singing Christian and Jewish songs topless in my bed or in the shower.
[SPEAKER_02]: I just started a series called The Food Horror.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's like a
[SPEAKER_02]: And yeah, a lot of it is just divine inspiration, but I have a mission and there's also a only fence called uncovering Eve where I decorate my body with Bible verses and crosses and things like that and talk about the representation of women in the Bible.
[SPEAKER_02]: So I see myself as helping people realize that they can
[SPEAKER_02]: be into Jesus, they can be religious, they can be spiritual, and also be sexual, and we've made sex into this dirty thing, and that's part of my reason for making porn because porn has been made into something very dirty, and it doesn't need to be.
[SPEAKER_02]: It could be a clean, pure way of celebrating your body.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, this is brilliant, and I have so many questions.
[SPEAKER_01]: A question.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, how many about, I'm actually curious, partly about people's reactions, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: Because like people have this rigid day, I mean, if you're on a corner on the only fan, you're the whole piece of your sex positive.
[SPEAKER_01]: But do you people have like a negative reaction?
[SPEAKER_01]: What's been some of the feedback that you get on comments section?
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, cornered comments are funny, because they're all just like, hey, I got a big dick, you want it?
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, it's not really substantive.
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank God.
[SPEAKER_02]: I know it's the least-ish mental place because everyone there is already looking at porn so who are they to judge?
[SPEAKER_02]: So it's kind of, it kind of felt like a safe space, funny, funny enough.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I have gotten social media messages from men.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's really funny.
[SPEAKER_02]: I got one like southern gentleman being like, wow, you really like changed my opinions.
[SPEAKER_02]: I want to be more sex-positive and I got one from
[SPEAKER_02]: a man, another man in L.A. who was just saying I helped him rethink his views on religion.
[SPEAKER_02]: And the I have gotten some negative pushback, but it was mainly from an ex of mine who I think was jealous and had and possessive and like was telling me Jesus doesn't support this.
[SPEAKER_02]: And he didn't make me think about like the Bible and reread the sections about Jesus.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I think if Jesus were alive today, I don't think he would be on an anti porn crusade.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think he would like first of all back then, he said barely anything about sex.
[SPEAKER_02]: He said that our prostitutes will get into heaven.
[SPEAKER_02]: And he did seem that there is this narrative of him saving prostitutes, but if you actually read it, these women he saves, we don't actually have proof that they were prostitutes.
[SPEAKER_02]: We just see like immoral women, like, like it's very vague.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I also don't love that term prostitute.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think we should use that term equally if we're going to use it for people in sex work.
[SPEAKER_02]: We should use it for people who are at 9 to 5's.
[SPEAKER_02]: They don't like who are like,
[SPEAKER_02]: prostitutes for their bosses.
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, I think that's the better use of that term.
[SPEAKER_02]: But I think if he were alive today He would realize there's so many people in this profession who do it not out of force, but because they actually do have a choice and they find it fun and they think it's more
[SPEAKER_02]: Delightful to get paid to orgasm, then to get paid to work, and I think, in that way, I think it's a very feminist profession, because I think it is good for our bodies to receive sexual pleasure.
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't think it's good for our bodies to be crunched over a computer from nine to five every day.
[SPEAKER_02]: So, long story short, I've gotten a few people say Jesus wouldn't like this, and I question that.
[SPEAKER_01]: I agree with you that I'm an atheist, but part of my drift religion was negative view of women and how people are women are, especially a group in Muslim majority country.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like how women are less than or even underwriting any you write like is it really on the kind of script and the kind of a scripture and Quran and all of that or is people's interpretation I love that you got that in the journey
[SPEAKER_01]: a psychedelic gen. Did you go in with, I know when I do psychedelic journeys, I do with the intention, like part of the psychotherapy process is like setting intention.
[SPEAKER_01]: Did you set intention around spirituality or it was something that just got a reveal to you out of the intention that you had?
[SPEAKER_02]: It was very interesting.
[SPEAKER_02]: My intention was actually around physical healing.
[SPEAKER_02]: I was dealing with severe genital pain.
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't know if I need to go into the whole story, but I essentially had severe genital pain that was not responding to Western treatments.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I think it's really interesting.
[SPEAKER_02]: It did actually that and also two ceremonies with Cambo and five of me, ODMT actually healed that.
[SPEAKER_02]: And it did.
[SPEAKER_02]: And it feels related to all of this that all these themes around sexuality came up.
[SPEAKER_02]: It felt like there was a theme of sexual shame that was somehow connected to the pain.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I remember in the ceremony, experiencing full body orgasms.
[SPEAKER_02]: And it felt like it was coming from Jesus.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like he was like visiting me.
[SPEAKER_02]: and telling me he was like being my dumb and being like, now get on your knees and like, and it felt like that part of me needed healing that I needed to feel as if my body was divine and holy.
[SPEAKER_02]: Which is interesting because I wasn't really raised religiously, but I think we all carry that a little bit.
[SPEAKER_02]: This idea of M.I.2 sexual, especially women, does that make me a slut, is sex shameful.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so it felt almost like healing that part of me
[SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely.
[SPEAKER_01]: I see a lot of women with experiencing sex, a pain-dearing intercourse, like so common conservative community, big part of it comes from shame.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, it could be like issues with pelvic floor, like injuries, but majority of the people I see comes from shame.
[SPEAKER_01]: And sometimes it's people think about major trauma, maybe like sexual abuse, which could be part of it.
[SPEAKER_01]: But it's like sometimes for people, it's this negative internalized
[SPEAKER_01]: that they internalize and kind of stays in their body.
[SPEAKER_01]: And they're just all they are not open to sex because of that dichotomy that you were talking about.
[SPEAKER_01]: Part of them they love the kind of like freedom, liberation that comes with sex that that part of themselves, but they learn early on to not
[SPEAKER_01]: engage with it, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, even now, people are getting bored when they caught their children and masturbating.
[SPEAKER_01]: They think, oh, something happened to them.
[SPEAKER_01]: What's the thinking about it at the self-suding behaviors?
[SPEAKER_01]: Just a normal part of child development.
[SPEAKER_01]: But tell me is it the first time like how did you arrive to this place of religion and the centrality doesn't need to be in kind of like duality is not something that is conflicting with each other?
[SPEAKER_01]: Is that something that you were thinking about it before?
[SPEAKER_01]: Like tell us how did you came to that conclusion?
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I remember, and like, along maybe a decade ago, I interviewed a woman named Heidi Johnson who calls herself the pussy pastor, and she was a sex-positive pastor for an article for El magazine, and that was my first exposure to that idea.
[SPEAKER_02]: And then it started coming up on my trips because I met a few people who were Christian, including a massage therapist who was actually on in the Boga retreat with me and she would massage me and talk to me about Jesus and Mary Magdalene and
[SPEAKER_02]: Mary Magdalene was a follower of Jesus and there's all this folklore about her being a whore or her being his lover or her being his wife.
[SPEAKER_02]: We're not really sure what she was except in the Bible.
[SPEAKER_02]: She's basically an apostle.
[SPEAKER_02]: And after that, it started sleeping into my trips.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I had my first Jesus trip in 2021.
[SPEAKER_02]: where I was told like my life path was like to be Mary Magdalene to be a sacred whore and and Jesus it it wasn't like I saw Jesus it was more like I felt like I talked to the spirit and he he was like this cool hippie and he was like
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, Son of God is the biggest hoax where all sons of daughters of God, and so that's why I identify as the daughter of God.
[SPEAKER_02]: And he said, um, when you're in love with someone you see the face in God with it, like in them and you could have that with everybody.
[SPEAKER_02]: And he told me to read the Bible and that my.
[SPEAKER_02]: part of my life path was rewriting the Bible, which I kind of do in my book, Eve's Blessing.
[SPEAKER_02]: I talk about how there isn't actually a curse on women like we think from Genesis, how actually like Eve was blessed.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so ever since then, I started reading the Bible, I started going to church.
[SPEAKER_02]: and the people at the church were so nice but they weren't liberal in that way like they would not approve of what I'm doing but that strengthened my motivation to feel like I can be myself because I think that a lot of religions are isolating people by demonizing the body, demonizing sexuality,
[SPEAKER_02]: And there is scripture that I think should be re-examined, like my pastor kept reading this passage from Corinthian saying that we should focus on the fruits of the spirit, not the fruits of the flesh and one of the fruits of the flesh was sensuality.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I pressed him like a sensuality always bad, and he was like, well, no, like excessive sensuality.
[SPEAKER_02]: like, you know, we should just be sexual within marriage and I was like, okay, where does it say that?
[SPEAKER_02]: And it doesn't really say no sex before marriage in the Bible.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's very, very vague what it says.
[SPEAKER_02]: It says, like, leave the marriage bed undefiled.
[SPEAKER_02]: Every woman should have a husband, every man should have a wife.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's so open for interpretation and I personally think defiling the marriage bed is less about, you know, I've made high vibe porn or I've had sex before and more about like, I'm making my partner uncomfortable.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm violating their boundaries.
[SPEAKER_02]: I've criticized them.
[SPEAKER_02]: I've, like, made them feel bad about themselves.
[SPEAKER_02]: So I, I think that we really need to reinterpret the Bible and that's what I've gotten for my trips.
[SPEAKER_01]: I love that you weren't kind of having these dialogues because I think that's that is just so healthy for people's individual journey, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: I remember growing that I had so many so much question about the teaching about women because in Iran,
[SPEAKER_01]: really just studies are mandatory.
[SPEAKER_01]: You've got to attend religious studies and they can fail you like not moving up to the grade.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I was like and I was from eight years family so sitting in these classes and I had so much cost so many questions because these these belief that they were kind of like about centrality and sex just did not make sense for me.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think if people feel her mission to connect with their bodies, as they are in this journey of finding fate, he can religion can be a resource from them.
[SPEAKER_01]: But I think what the for them and what what often is an issue, people feel that when we are repressing something, it gets stronger, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: It turns to this kind of like obsessive,
[SPEAKER_01]: strong force.
[SPEAKER_01]: So it actually people have more of the thoughts and emotions that they don't want.
[SPEAKER_01]: So can you tell us more about like when have you seen the bipolar depression?
[SPEAKER_01]: I know you're a therapist, like when people repress their sexual needs, how does it show up versus celebrating it?
[SPEAKER_02]: I think that there's something I see a lot which is really unfortunate is couples where the man wants more sex than the woman and for whatever reason I don't know if that's the most common problem because I've also heard of a lot of couples where there's the reverse but I keep getting these women who lack desire for sex and their male partner wants sex.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I think it's because women haven't had the right to take the reins in their sex lives that women are so used to men making advances, men wanting things from them and it gets exhausting and women put up walls because of that and they're not told like, you know, very
[SPEAKER_02]: first sexual experiences should be with yourself, develop a relationship with your own body, find out what pleases you, find out what your fantasies are, and then ask your partner to fulfill your desires, women are kind of, and then men are kind of taught to play a game where they're trying to get sex from women, trying to avoid commitment, and I don't think that helps anyone, I think both men and women and everyone in between wants both sex and love,
[SPEAKER_02]: the issues we face in the bedroom are because of rape culture and because women just have not had a voice and what I work with women on usually is before they like negotiate with men on because often it's the men who send them to therapy like you need to have more desire for sex and I say hold on.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, before doing anything with him, why don't you try reading a rata ko watching porn, reflecting on any positive sexual experience you've had and like figure out what your fantasies are and what your desires are and once like women have that right, then I think men will have better sex lives also.
[SPEAKER_01]: I like that because what I noticed that when women try to foreshare, even internally, sometimes the pressure comes from within, women say, oh, I need to have sex to please my partner or have they have this fear of losing the partner.
[SPEAKER_01]: and they put themselves in this situation that internally they feel like it's this is not the enthusiasm they guess and that kills their desire like I have clients that several decades after those those experiences that they pressured themselves to have sex now their bodies just like rejecting sex completely like they feel like I don't want to be sexual so I think
[SPEAKER_01]: It's important for women and everyone to have this kind of build this clear understanding or some understanding of their erotic mind before engaging with someone especially if they're struggling with low desire.
[SPEAKER_01]: So you, from the content you created, you created so many different content sounds like it.
[SPEAKER_01]: Which ones are more popular?
[SPEAKER_01]: What are people are most curious about?
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, so some of actually, my most popular videos have to do with Jewish identity.
[SPEAKER_02]: I was raised Jewish, and I don't
[SPEAKER_02]: But there is so much anti-Jewish hatred and I do understand like there are very valid criticisms of Israel and their government, but something I've explored specifically is body image like that there are certain stereotypes like Jewish people have big noses and I notice if you look in the media often like there's if you think of like Jewish celebrities you think like
[SPEAKER_02]: having a big nose, even though I don't think she has such a big nose, but they're like the type cast, and so I explore that theme, and I get actually a lot of hits a lot of my audiences from Israel or of Jewish people because of that.
[SPEAKER_02]: My other, I call them orgasmic prayers, videos where I combine self pleasure with prayer.
[SPEAKER_02]: I recite a prayer that came to me in a psychedelic ceremony, which I call it the Christlight Warrior Prayer.
[SPEAKER_02]: It goes, I am the love of the light, the Lord, the law, the truth, the path of the way.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I actually pleasure myself while saying that.
[SPEAKER_02]: And it's supposed to like, they say that orgasm lifts your vibration and you can manifest so
[SPEAKER_02]: So I sort of am basing it on that idea and the hysterical literature Bible readings are very popular where I read from the Bible while using my hitachi and orgasm that actually started with
[SPEAKER_02]: my book tours as Suzanne Weiss that I do these performances in sex clubs and it came from a video series called to cervical literature.
[SPEAKER_02]: I did make it up and it was actually Eric Alus the porn director who when I told her I was going on a book tour was like, oh, why don't you read that way?
[SPEAKER_02]: Because I was reading in his sex club.
[SPEAKER_02]: So I have to thank her for that.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's brilliant.
[SPEAKER_01]: I know Eric is brilliant and your brilliance is such a wonderful idea.
[SPEAKER_01]: And that is incredible.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I love that.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like I feel like it's just again reconnecting.
[SPEAKER_01]: And actually sounds like very joyful.
[SPEAKER_01]: Right, like when you think about play, I think about sometimes come from the place of desperation, right, when you're coming from this place of pleasure and excitement and I think just as you said, such a beautiful way of reconnecting with yourself and reconnecting with your higher self.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm glad that you haven't got as much of a negative pushback because even if I'm like, if I'm saying something that around religion in my community about religion and sex is not necessarily, I need to be at, ah, people get very angry.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like people have this rigid views, but I'm glad it seems like you're presenting this part of you in as you said, safe environment, like sex positive environment.
[SPEAKER_01]: So it's in a way, it's get celebrated or you
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know which one it is.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think it's a beautiful thing that you're doing.
[SPEAKER_01]: So tell us, someone's struggling.
[SPEAKER_01]: They want to connect with their spirituality, with their body, and they grow up in a negative sex, negative culture.
[SPEAKER_01]: What are some of the first steps that you recommend them to explore?
[SPEAKER_02]: I would recommend reading some alternative perspectives on religion.
[SPEAKER_02]: There's a good book, Central Faith by Le Ron Briggs, which talks about her journey and praising her sexuality as a Christian.
[SPEAKER_02]: There's also Bad Theology Kills by Kevin Garcia.
[SPEAKER_02]: He's a gay man who is also a Christian and talks about like how much misinterpretations of the Bible can hurt us and how Jesus actually advocated acceptance.
[SPEAKER_02]: So I would, there's also Beverly Dale, who's a sex positive reverend to, I think her book is called No One Told You You Were Naked.
[SPEAKER_02]: Then of course, there's my book, Eve's Blessing by Susanna Wise, just get some alternative perspectives.
[SPEAKER_02]: And just I would actually have conversations with religious leaders like I did with my pastor and not everyone is open enough to do that, but if a pastor is good, they will at least answer your questions and they will at least take a look.
[SPEAKER_02]: At the scripture, instead of just saying, yeah, God thinks like porn is bad, they will actually take a look at the scripture and say, here's a passage that suggests that God disapproves of porn and have an intelligent conversation.
[SPEAKER_02]: I've been surprised by how much like the people who are leaders in my places of worship are open to that.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think that we can really bridge these two communities by having these open conversations.
[SPEAKER_01]: thing is very beautiful and meaningful for people to even re-examine it on themselves with themselves, as you mentioned, that sometimes you feel kind of like this rigidity around religion, but I think would be interesting to have these conversations and safe environments, or even safe places online, and always think sex is healing.
[SPEAKER_01]: So even they can kind of check out your content if they're comfortable, but sex positive content, right, to kind of feel like,
[SPEAKER_01]: would be another template of connecting with my religion.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I would say like depends on where they are.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'd like if they're at big in early of their journey or later in their journey.
[SPEAKER_01]: So for our listeners, that they want to learn from you about the work that you're doing, what are some of the places they can find you?
[SPEAKER_02]: They can find me on Twitter, Shoshana Blanca.
[SPEAKER_02]: On Instagram, they took Shoshana Blanca's down.
[SPEAKER_02]: So you still find me on Suzanne O'Wise.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's like Suzanne O'Wise, the word instead of Wise, or at Suzanne O'Wise.com.
[SPEAKER_02]: I haven't yet made a website for Shoshana Blanca.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm gonna do it soon, but right now, you can just go to a link tree, link.
[SPEAKER_02]: The link tree links are funny.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's like link TR.e slash Shoshana Loves Jesus is where I have all of my links.
[SPEAKER_01]: Fantastic.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I put it in the show, no, so people can find it.
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you for coming in this show.
[SPEAKER_01]: And as always, it's a pleasure to have these conversations with you.
[SPEAKER_02]: Thank you.
[SPEAKER_01]: As we wrap up, I keep coming back to something we discuss in today's conversation with Shushana Blanca, the idea that many of us spend years trying to separate parts of ourselves that were never meant to be enemies.
[SPEAKER_01]: Whether you agreed with everything we talked about or not, I hope this episode invites you to reflect on your own relationship with desire,
[SPEAKER_01]: So many people carry shame around their bodies, their fantasies, or their sexuality, not because there's something wrong with them, but because of the messages they've absorbed over the years.
[SPEAKER_01]: and healing of an sword with curiosity rather than judgment.
[SPEAKER_01]: If you're a woman who wants to reconnect with desire, pleasure and trust in your body, don't forget to download my free book, a woman's guide to reviving sex drive.
[SPEAKER_01]: I created it based on the most common challenges I see in my clients.
[SPEAKER_01]: and the practical tools that help them reconnect with their sexuality in a healthy, sustainable way.
[SPEAKER_01]: You'll find the link in the show notes.
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you for listening, I'll see you in the next episode of this Exology Podcast.
[SPEAKER_01]: Thanks for listening to Sixology Podcasts for more great content visit www.sixologypodcast.com Please be advised that information presented on this podcast is not a substitute for seeking help from a licensed mental health provider