[SPEAKER_00]: Last week, we talked about the seven signs while your relationship might not feel emotionally safe.
[SPEAKER_01]: Today, we're talking about how to actually rebuild it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Because emotional safety isn't created by ignoring difficult conversations and or avoiding conflict.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's created by how couples move through conflict together.
[SPEAKER_00]: And one of the biggest things we've learned?
[SPEAKER_01]: Most couples think they're arguing with each other.
[SPEAKER_00]: When actually their nervous systems are arguing with each other.
[SPEAKER_01]: And today we're going to show you practical ways to rebuild trust, honesty, and deepen your connection.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, difficult conversations can stop feeling dangerous and wait for it, get ready for this.
[SPEAKER_00]: They can actually bring you closer together and make you feel more connected.
[SPEAKER_01]: So let's renovate.
[SPEAKER_00]: Are you ready to renovate your relationship?
[SPEAKER_00]: Welcome to the Relationship Innovation Podcast.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm Tara Kerwin.
[SPEAKER_01]: And my name is EJ Kerwin, and we are today launching into part two of our emotional safety series.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so in that first part of the series, we really laid out like, what are the seven signs that emotional safety is in existing in your relationship?
[SPEAKER_00]: One, you don't tell each other the whole truth.
[SPEAKER_00]: Two, difficult conversations get delayed.
[SPEAKER_00]: Three, defensiveness shows up quickly and is basically automatic.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's your autopilot when tension arises.
[SPEAKER_00]: Four, you feel lonely in the relationship.
[SPEAKER_00]: Five, vulnerability feels risky.
[SPEAKER_00]: Six, you filter yourself and seven conflict feels dangerous, where there's a constant threat to your relationship.
[SPEAKER_00]: If conflict happens.
[SPEAKER_01]: And why this is so important is that we believe that emotional safety is really at the heart of a healthy, loving, connected, intimate relationship.
[SPEAKER_01]: That terror and I can deal with really difficult things in ways that actually at the end of the conversation, we feel closer, not farther apart.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so today, we really want to give you like some actionable steps, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: Like some things like,
[SPEAKER_01]: these are the things that you can do to build emotional safety in your relationships.
[SPEAKER_01]: So we want to jump right in because we know everybody loves that ability to have something that take out of the podcast and move forward with their partner.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and just to share a few listen to part one, you'll know that like each and I have that
[SPEAKER_00]: Before that podcast was recorded because we had like a 45 minute conversation and recorded that podcast But video wasn't going and so I was like oh my god That was so good.
[SPEAKER_00]: I was so sad and I was so disappointed.
[SPEAKER_00]: I was so angry at EJ for like Accidentally missing to hit record and so like recording that one for the second time Like my brain does not work like it used to so I have to just be on and when like we lost all of it that 40-minute conversation
[SPEAKER_00]: I was super sad, but then there was also like, maybe this happened for a reason because it took me like 20 minutes to like feel better like we all have our own different processes when conflict happens or disappointment happens.
[SPEAKER_00]: But Ej was right.
[SPEAKER_00]: He fought with his defense andness, but he was able to like,
[SPEAKER_00]: be emotionally safe for me.
[SPEAKER_00]: So now we're here in the studio in our later recording our part two.
[SPEAKER_00]: So it just goes to show that like, you know, it could have gone a totally different way.
[SPEAKER_00]: I could have stomped out of the podcast studio.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, I can't believe this.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, I can't believe this happened.
[SPEAKER_00]: But we didn't because I'm flexible.
[SPEAKER_00]: Each is flexible.
[SPEAKER_00]: We're supporting each other.
[SPEAKER_00]: It was hard though.
[SPEAKER_00]: I got really anxious and angry.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, and I think it feeds into the first thing that you need to be aware of in rebuilding emotional safety.
[SPEAKER_01]: And this is what is happened to us in the past and what we really tried to work against in that difficult moment is that our nervous systems are arguing on the other, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: And what we want is we want to be aware of our nervous system
[SPEAKER_01]: know we're going into a really instinctive place and find a way to settle our nervous system because like for me defensiveness, when my nervous system is tripped, when I sense anger towards me, my automatic reaction,
[SPEAKER_01]: is going to be defensiveness.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not a conscious choice because it's my nervous system, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: And so the very first tip is getting an awareness for you and your partner of when has the topic, the content of what you guys were arguing with, gone out the window and it's just your nervous systems reacting to one another.
[SPEAKER_00]: And for me, so each I love that you use that like what you do and like your defensiveness For me, I could feel like pressure building in my head and I was angry So I said, E.J.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm just gonna like I've got to go outside for a minute and I set outside for like seven minutes
[SPEAKER_00]: And I was like, I'm okay, like, we're okay.
[SPEAKER_00]: My brain will still work terror.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, you've got this.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, I had to like get my nervous system back on track to come back into the studio.
[SPEAKER_00]: So like, I had to take my own break.
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel it somatically.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think you feel it cognitively, but again, just taking that two minutes, seven minutes, whatever it might be.
[SPEAKER_00]: And even like when we're recording the part one, I kept saying, like, I'm okay.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm safe, cause I could still residually feel.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, oh, my brain, this isn't as good as the one we just recorded.
[SPEAKER_00]: I was comparing it on, like, my brain's not on.
[SPEAKER_00]: Then I'd be like, it's okay.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's okay.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, I just tried to, like, really center myself and ground myself.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, if you notice in part one, I was not me.
[SPEAKER_00]: I was working on it.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, using that example and then helping you guys to continue to think about this number one, don't let your nervous systems argue with one another.
[SPEAKER_01]: We took that distance.
[SPEAKER_01]: Then we came back and both of us, it was still difficult and it was like a bit of a grind.
[SPEAKER_01]: But I think both of us
[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe not completely suppressed our nervous system or completely sued it.
[SPEAKER_01]: But then when we came back, we were able to manage our nervous system.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, I could feel myself, you know, I could feel my heart rate picking up.
[SPEAKER_01]: I could feel myself tightening.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I was like, consistently being like, okay, like, I don't have to let my nervous system run this argument.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: So number one, don't let your nervous system run the conflict.
[SPEAKER_00]: So number two, stop trying to win.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, that was so hard on that.
[SPEAKER_01]: That was in that one it was hard and in anyone.
[SPEAKER_01]: I see it with couples were like, they're talking about really intimate things.
[SPEAKER_01]: They're talking about maybe they're intimacy and instead of it being on something that they're working on together and solving together, one of them is trying to win.
[SPEAKER_01]: I call it, it's the war of perspectives.
[SPEAKER_01]: My perspective is the right one.
[SPEAKER_01]: You need to tell me that you accept that I am right.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: And for me, like, even, again, I'm just going to use that moment we had.
[SPEAKER_00]: I was like, I can't believe he didn't.
[SPEAKER_00]: I wanted to know, like, why didn't you press record?
[SPEAKER_00]: How could you have forgotten to press record?
[SPEAKER_00]: How could you not have seen it?
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, I wanted to make sure that, like, it was your fault, not mine.
[SPEAKER_00]: then when I went out to go take my break, I was like, Tara, you have to be flexible.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like right now your nervous system is rigid and you want to prove who was wrong and who was right.
[SPEAKER_00]: So you can just like make this win this argument and like that is not helpful.
[SPEAKER_00]: So like for me, when I'm thinking about winning or in that place because we're just human, we're going to mess it up.
[SPEAKER_00]: We want to like have our point when I think of like flexibility versus rigidity and it was really helpful.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and can I give you, I love this phrase around stop trying to win, is shift from proving your point to understanding your partner.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I was like, you didn't do this shit on purpose, dude.
[SPEAKER_01]: But like, what can I kind of offer you like one thing that if you might have said it, it would have really helped.
[SPEAKER_01]: Please like if you would have like said E.J.
[SPEAKER_01]: I can tell you probably feel really bad about this.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, I just wasn't in that space yet But I can say that now E.J.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm sure you felt really bad about that.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, I did.
[SPEAKER_01]: I felt horrible.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know I fucked up and I like I felt bad I know I just didn't have that space yet because I was so scared that my brain wouldn't work again
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, well, and then my, on my side of that was trying to prove my point that it has never happened before and and like I had the bomb many times has just happened I had the back off away from that.
[SPEAKER_01]: And instead of proving my point, I had to try to help you know that I was understanding you.
[SPEAKER_01]: So the thing is stop trying to win and try starting to understand.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_00]: The third one, regulate before you communicate.
[SPEAKER_00]: It definitely piggybacks on the first one.
[SPEAKER_00]: Your nervous systems are arguing.
[SPEAKER_00]: But for the regulate before you communicate, you really want to slow down and name what's happening internally, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: And so,
[SPEAKER_00]: Again, I will go back to like the example that we're using.
[SPEAKER_00]: I got really frustrated, scared, disappointed that like we just lost 40 minutes of what we were recording because I was like funny, I was adorable, I had my caffeine high, I was like freaking on it because I got good sleep last night, like rare moments people, women if you're struggling with freaking menopause, period of menopause, when you were on it and you were just clicking
[SPEAKER_00]: So I was like so proud, and then when we lost it, I literally felt devastated.
[SPEAKER_00]: So when I went out to take my little break, because I didn't want to be reacting to your nervous system.
[SPEAKER_00]: Number one, your nervous systems are arguing.
[SPEAKER_00]: I was like, oh, I'm really scared that I won't be able to produce something more awesome.
[SPEAKER_00]: Right?
[SPEAKER_00]: And so I was able to identify it.
[SPEAKER_00]: So then I could regulate, and then we could share what happened.
[SPEAKER_01]: And this goes right back to our first episode where one of the seven signs was,
[SPEAKER_01]: Vulnerability feels risky, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: It feels like almost dangerous to open up, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: And if I become regulated, if I name what's happening for myself, I'm feeling defensive.
[SPEAKER_01]: Once I regulate myself, I can drop down into a more vulnerable place, or I could have, and I did kind of miss this.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'll be honest of like, I feel so bad.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think and I may have said it, but I didn't say it like
[SPEAKER_01]: from the heart of like, I'm so sorry, you know, because it didn't feel safe in that moment to do it, not because it wasn't safe and that's what's interesting in couples is not because it was actually unsafe, but my nervous system because I wasn't regulated was telling me, don't be vulnerable.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not safe to do it.
[SPEAKER_00]: See, and now you know, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: Now you know, because you're
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, and then so this next one, number four, again, relates back to the first episode where you may delay talking about things, you may filter, you may only share parts of the truth or open up about parts of yourself.
[SPEAKER_01]: And number four says, tell the truth faster.
[SPEAKER_00]: not perfectly just sooner not perfectly not not perfectly like for example hey got to let you know what happened at first I wanted to blame you and get really pissed at you because you freaking didn't record that I feel like you're still working through this right now no no no no no no no no no no no tell me truth
[SPEAKER_00]: Right, and then I just want to blame you and like and then it reminded me of all these things that I can't trust you with and all these things to her to spiral Like I can't count on EJ like can't count on him, but then I went out, got into my window of tolerance Really reframed you turned it to flexibility.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know you would never do this on purpose Like I'll be okay everything is safe
[SPEAKER_00]: you know, like just sharing that whole truth, like not only did you not press record, I started thinking about all the other things that I can't like rely on you for like past stuff, which I know just comes up in moments of suffering and it's not true, but so many of us don't have these skills that other things get piled upon it.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then it's like, it wasn't just about not hitting record, it was a thousand other things that you freaking got wrong in our relationship
[SPEAKER_00]: No, but I'm just saying for other, yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: So this is so huge as I would tell the truth faster.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think what you also are, because you're hearing this in a two-part series, but we recorded this in one day after we had this conflict.
[SPEAKER_01]: What you're hearing in real time,
[SPEAKER_01]: is our central nervous systems over the last hour have begun to come back into our window of tolerance and we're still, we're moving closer and closer to following our own advice and having the awareness to tell the truth, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: Is when our central nervous system is all jacked up?
[SPEAKER_01]: I can't, I don't even know what my truth is, so if you do these things like stop trying to win, regulate before you communicate, then it allows you, okay, then I can actually look inside, understand what's happening, and I can actually tell you the truth, and it took us like an hour or so, but that's pretty darn good compared to where we were 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 15 years, it keeps getting better guys.
[SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely.
[SPEAKER_01]: So tell the truth, Master.
[SPEAKER_01]: Number five, number five is like sort of a more preventative approach, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: It's it's saying like let's make emotional check-ins a habit.
[SPEAKER_01]: And this is this is why like we really want you to also become a part of our community on Patreon.
[SPEAKER_01]: If you're interested in working privately and coaching with us,
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, these are things that are in our model that we work with people because if you consistently emotionally check in with one another, you build that transparency even in moments that are you're not activated yet, you build emotional safety because you learn how to communicate about stuff that's below the surface.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, and if you're sensing distance, you talk about it like just the other day, like normally you're like, you're really happy, go lucky self in the morning and I could feel something was weighing on you right if we didn't have emotional safety, but like, oh god, I'm like, not I'm going to avoid that like the plague right, but I was like, hey, you didn't check in and you're like, yeah, I've got
[SPEAKER_00]: you know this financial stress right you are able to like share and be vulnerable so like it's so important that like the minute the second the hour you start to perceive this like disconnect checking in about it and don't let it go too long because again research shows couples usually wait.
[SPEAKER_00]: nine years, I believe, nine years of feeling separate and disconnected before seeking out coaching or therapy, do not do that way.
[SPEAKER_01]: And because we have the habit of doing an emotional check-in with each other in the morning, we didn't have to wait to a crisis point to have the conversation because we use our emotional check-in that some days is just like two minutes and we carry out with our day because nothing's going on.
[SPEAKER_01]: where we had a place to check in about our motions, we have safety within that space as well.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so something that might have been a big hiccup in our life four or five years ago was something that we then got together in very quickly, because we had a place to do it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Number six is like maybe one of the most important priority things you want to remember to build emotional safety and that is to validate first and we help each other with that.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like sometimes we don't validate and I'll be like, each of you have to validate me first and then you can move into what you wanted to say.
[SPEAKER_00]: And you tell me that too.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like we have to validate first.
[SPEAKER_00]: What does that mean?
[SPEAKER_00]: Wow, I hear that you're feeling really anxious or angry or blaming right now.
[SPEAKER_00]: Right?
[SPEAKER_00]: You're just validating the other person's experience before moving into what your experience was.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_00]: Safety first, solutions second.
[SPEAKER_01]: And that whole validation is a whole beast on its own, which seems like a simple thing, but couples struggle deeply with it.
[SPEAKER_01]: And we have an episode like three or four episodes ago, which is all about validation does not mean agreement.
[SPEAKER_01]: that I can validate something that Tara is seeing, feeling, thinking, I don't necessarily have to 100% agree with it, but if I validate it, it has a lot of value in building emotional safety.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: All right, number seven, which seven is like sort of the culmination of all of these things put together is that your goal in this is to create a relationship where hard things can be said.
[SPEAKER_00]: The goal is not to avoid conflict.
[SPEAKER_00]: We actually know conflict of women and couples are actually in the most disconnected place they feel so alone.
[SPEAKER_00]: So it's not to avoid conflict.
[SPEAKER_00]: The goal is staying connected through it, repairing it, and it brings you conflict should bring you closer together.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like I know people probably have heard like when EG and I have, because EG used to be very conflict-avoidant.
[SPEAKER_00]: So when we'd have conflict, I'd be like, yes.
[SPEAKER_00]: That feels so good.
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel so much more connected to you.
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you, and he would be like, what?
[SPEAKER_00]: What just happened?
[SPEAKER_00]: But now that we've learned a lot of the skills, we use a lot of the skills.
[SPEAKER_00]: We're not perfect at it.
[SPEAKER_00]: But it's like, I know that conflict actually brings us closer together.
[SPEAKER_00]: Makes me learn more about myself, more about each other, and it also shows, you know, we have kids at home.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like that conflict is okay.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's a lot of parents are like a void conflict in front of the children.
[SPEAKER_00]: We'll guess what.
[SPEAKER_00]: Then they don't know how to build resilience around that either.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, and crazy enough is that when you build this emotional safety, when it gets stronger and stronger,
[SPEAKER_01]: Like you have a conflict like you like I honestly am with terror now in this moment of like It was not a great environment between us an hour ago, but right now I am actually feeling like closer because like we worked through it.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I don't feel like it's not gonna pollute the rest of our day And that feels freaking amazing.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm sorry, I didn't mean to interrupt, but this is so important.
[SPEAKER_00]: It doesn't just, it's not a light switch, we're like, all right, we just built a emotional safety, like, agent I have been working on this for like 10 plus years.
[SPEAKER_00]: And like, it's a process, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a process we were able to come back with in an hour.
[SPEAKER_00]: But just like every time you're able to do it a little bit differently, it builds confidence that you can do it.
[SPEAKER_00]: So just have very realistic expectations around emotions.
[SPEAKER_00]: They do our nervous systems.
[SPEAKER_00]: We'll hijack the shit out of us, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: But we are going to become Esas, emotionally safe as shit.
[SPEAKER_00]: Esas people.
[SPEAKER_01]: And this is the, the byproduct of all of this is you begin to realize that in your relationship you don't have to face conflict alone that it's that it's not this fracturing moment.
[SPEAKER_01]: that actually, okay, we have a conflict and we're going to get together in it.
[SPEAKER_01]: We're going to understand each other more deeply.
[SPEAKER_01]: We're going to support each other through each of our sort of instinctive reactions in these moments.
[SPEAKER_01]: We're going to sue each other's nervous systems.
[SPEAKER_01]: Then we're going to deal with whatever the problem was.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then we're like, we did this together.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, I don't have to just like, you know, white knuckle my way through it by myself.
[SPEAKER_00]: And we have so many tools that can help you guys be like objective to this like if you just go to our website there's like emotional safety assessment you can take that and then you can even like hey let's look at the intensity frequency duration of our arguments right now and then let's start doing all these tools and like in another three months let's go back and do the intensity frequency duration.
[SPEAKER_00]: High likelihood, you will see intensity go down, frequency of conflict go down, duration of being separate in it, go down because you're starting to build the emotional safety tools.
[SPEAKER_00]: And we have so many podcasts on this you guys.
[SPEAKER_01]: And if you want like more like everyday help with this, I think our Patreon community and it's free.
[SPEAKER_01]: You can go and join it and almost every day of the week, Monday through Friday there's a tip of the day.
[SPEAKER_00]: JJ is doing his tip of the day.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, we do it, we do a video for it.
[SPEAKER_01]: There's a description.
[SPEAKER_01]: There's almost always some action point, like something you can take out of it and work on with your partner.
[SPEAKER_01]: You can share it with your partner.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's an amazing way to like stay plugged into this relationship wellness game.
[SPEAKER_01]: Again, Tara and I coach couples, the two of us with couples.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's awesome if you're interested in that, just head on down to our show notes.
[SPEAKER_01]: There's a link to that.
[SPEAKER_01]: I have a men's group that I'm running.
[SPEAKER_01]: Please reach out about that.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's just a bunch of guys like talking about these exact things.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like how do I?
[SPEAKER_01]: How do I be my best self in my relationship?
[SPEAKER_00]: Men who do the work?
[SPEAKER_01]: Men who do the work.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so we have like all of these offerings.
[SPEAKER_01]: We have a Sedona retreat for couples where we have four spaces left.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's an actual
[SPEAKER_01]: It's going to be beautiful, it's going to be an intimacy creating experience, it's going to be well curated, like that, that's something we're super excited about.
[SPEAKER_00]: We, I mean, you guys know, we have a ton of resources, you can always reach out.
[SPEAKER_00]: We are the ones emailing you back.
[SPEAKER_00]: We don't have any AI assistance, though sometimes I wish we did.
[SPEAKER_00]: And so, no, it's like our hearts to yours, and we are here to support you.
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you for being a part of our relationship renovation community.
[SPEAKER_00]: We love it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Relationship renovators, you go.
[SPEAKER_00]: As always, thanks for listening, take care of yourself, take care of each other, take care of your nervous systems.
[SPEAKER_00]: Bye-bye.