WEBVTT 00:01.877 --> 00:09.262 [SPEAKER_00]: Welcome to the intentional fatherhood podcast where we explore what it means to live on purpose as a father and how legacy starts at home. 00:09.922 --> 00:16.627 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm Justin Whitmorely, and I'm Brooke Moser, we'll be your hosts, and we desire to bring biblical hope and practical hope. 00:17.167 --> 00:17.988 [SPEAKER_01]: Thanks for listening. 00:22.595 --> 00:49.989 [SPEAKER_01]: uh... welcome back to the intentional fatherhood podcast here we are today uh... episode eight i can't believe we're here season three we've done it a whole season on vocation and work and calling and ambition and all the things last week with spiritual disciplines and the things that we really believe that help in the hidden as a father hidden practices of fatherhood that sustain your vocation and lovely conversation love lovely conversation with you about that and 00:51.310 --> 01:04.160 [SPEAKER_01]: Today, we're going to get into just really a topic that is obviously so, I would say literally I'm using this word but it's an important one, the climax of the season in many ways because it's family and work. 01:04.981 --> 01:19.372 [SPEAKER_01]: And this is the, we would say tension point or what it feels like a tension point, but really how do you honor all the things of your family as a father, but then all the things of your work and a lot of the questions we get work life balance is that such a thing, I think. 01:19.732 --> 01:21.454 [SPEAKER_00]: Actually, no, all these different topics. 01:21.474 --> 01:22.074 [SPEAKER_00]: We're going to come to that. 01:22.094 --> 01:29.380 [SPEAKER_01]: But before we do, just in tell our folks, tell our gentlemen, our friends, our sisters listening, how they can follow along, how they can help us. 01:30.141 --> 01:34.184 [SPEAKER_00]: You should like, subscribe and send us a question. 01:34.375 --> 01:37.756 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, like it, liking this podcast really helps share it with other people. 01:38.996 --> 01:44.477 [SPEAKER_00]: Subscribing helps you stay informed in the content and we love hearing from you. 01:44.517 --> 01:56.019 [SPEAKER_00]: So shoot us a voice memo, your name, where you're from, your question, state it in the form of a question and send it to hello and intentional fatherhood.org so that we can hear from you. 01:56.059 --> 01:56.860 [SPEAKER_00]: We want to hear from you. 01:56.940 --> 02:00.720 [SPEAKER_00]: And when we talk about fatherhood and work this whole season. 02:00.900 --> 02:03.301 [SPEAKER_00]: And when we announced it and when I posted on social media about it, 02:04.041 --> 02:09.225 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, a lot of the questions are basically this, I kind of imagine it's taking us a year. 02:09.325 --> 02:10.886 [SPEAKER_00]: It's seven episodes to get here now. 02:10.966 --> 02:11.186 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes. 02:11.407 --> 02:15.790 [SPEAKER_00]: But so many of your questions are about this idea. 02:15.890 --> 02:20.373 [SPEAKER_00]: How do I balance, you know, work life and family life? 02:20.974 --> 02:22.215 [SPEAKER_00]: It is one of the premier questions. 02:22.255 --> 02:23.776 [SPEAKER_00]: We want to tell you it's an illusion. 02:23.856 --> 02:24.817 [SPEAKER_00]: It's an illusion, Michael. 02:25.077 --> 02:25.357 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes. 02:25.817 --> 02:27.459 [SPEAKER_01]: You haven't seen a rest of development. 02:28.402 --> 02:28.943 [SPEAKER_00]: Turn off this. 02:28.963 --> 02:30.385 [SPEAKER_01]: I was going to go crazy. 02:30.465 --> 02:30.886 [SPEAKER_01]: Great. 02:31.187 --> 02:31.567 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, wow. 02:31.587 --> 02:32.108 [SPEAKER_01]: It's great. 02:32.168 --> 02:35.694 [SPEAKER_00]: Because balance, it's not the goal. 02:36.696 --> 02:38.499 [SPEAKER_00]: There's two problems with that way of thinking. 02:40.320 --> 02:48.102 [SPEAKER_00]: One, it assumes that your work and your family are opposed to each other. 02:48.142 --> 02:52.063 [SPEAKER_00]: Balance literally means they're the opposite ends of a scale. 02:52.643 --> 02:56.524 [SPEAKER_00]: And so, you know, their intention and you need to find the perfect balance. 02:56.544 --> 03:00.325 [SPEAKER_00]: And that's the second reason doesn't work is that they would never perfectly balance. 03:00.625 --> 03:02.166 [SPEAKER_00]: And they're not intention in the first place. 03:03.406 --> 03:04.946 [SPEAKER_00]: They must be integrated. 03:05.126 --> 03:07.147 [SPEAKER_00]: You are called to be a father. 03:07.207 --> 03:08.987 [SPEAKER_00]: You are also called to be a worker. 03:09.647 --> 03:12.248 [SPEAKER_00]: And yeah, what we want to talk about on this episode is how to integrate them. 03:12.268 --> 03:12.968 [SPEAKER_00]: What does it look like? 03:13.008 --> 03:14.088 [SPEAKER_00]: We're not saying it's easy. 03:14.968 --> 03:17.529 [SPEAKER_00]: It's going to be filled with mistakes and errors. 03:18.349 --> 03:20.730 [SPEAKER_00]: And you getting the order of your loves wrong. 03:20.750 --> 03:22.330 [SPEAKER_00]: We talked about this in the last episode. 03:22.350 --> 03:22.570 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes. 03:22.790 --> 03:23.750 [SPEAKER_00]: On spiritual disciplines. 03:23.830 --> 03:24.110 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes. 03:24.190 --> 03:26.111 [SPEAKER_00]: You need to be ordering your loves rightly. 03:26.151 --> 03:28.071 [SPEAKER_00]: But so how do you love work and 03:33.232 --> 03:39.173 [SPEAKER_00]: I think five categories we want to hit on it because we were, well, I was just going to say one thing about the work life balance. 03:39.233 --> 03:39.753 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yeah. 03:39.913 --> 03:40.994 [SPEAKER_00]: That don't give me the five. 03:41.074 --> 03:41.494 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. 03:41.514 --> 03:44.074 [SPEAKER_01]: The only reason because you said that's up so perfectly. 03:44.114 --> 03:49.976 [SPEAKER_01]: It was just the question that basically maybe the the meta way to think of it. 03:50.016 --> 03:56.397 [SPEAKER_01]: The way I think of it is that a lot of dads ask, how do I fit my, how do I fit my family into my work? 03:57.318 --> 04:05.898 [SPEAKER_01]: So how do like I got this big thing, but how do I fit my family into it, but it's really actually how what is my work for in light of my family so 04:07.479 --> 04:11.441 [SPEAKER_01]: What am I doing to actually help invest into my family? 04:11.461 --> 04:15.604 [SPEAKER_01]: How can I bring my family in, where is their overlap for Elizabeth and I? 04:15.644 --> 04:22.487 [SPEAKER_01]: This is actually something that's really interesting because we do work together, but it's also something that we try to integrate our kids in. 04:22.548 --> 04:30.132 [SPEAKER_01]: So I know this different for everybody, but it's just to say they're not opposed as you highlighted they are actually in many ways we are trying to figure out. 04:30.792 --> 04:32.553 [SPEAKER_01]: What is your work for in line of your family? 04:32.574 --> 04:32.734 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. 04:32.894 --> 04:33.514 [SPEAKER_01]: You know what I'm saying? 04:33.534 --> 04:35.095 [SPEAKER_01]: It's not like how you can fit these things in. 04:35.116 --> 04:38.919 [SPEAKER_01]: So if we can start from the very beginning, recognize these are not opposed. 04:39.059 --> 04:44.023 [SPEAKER_01]: They are, it's a new way of thinking about the thing that you're living in every day, which you said. 04:44.063 --> 04:47.846 [SPEAKER_01]: So the five things that you were mentioning. 04:48.066 --> 04:52.970 [SPEAKER_00]: I'd love to say this is not systematic, even though I am prone to systematic and diagrammatic thinking. 04:53.550 --> 04:55.091 [SPEAKER_00]: This is honestly just kind of fun. 04:55.111 --> 04:55.831 [SPEAKER_00]: I should've least so. 04:56.252 --> 04:59.974 [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe yes, I might be out of order in my love. 05:00.014 --> 05:01.194 [SPEAKER_01]: I was trying to look conversation with you. 05:01.234 --> 05:02.095 [SPEAKER_01]: He's like, can we diagram it? 05:02.115 --> 05:03.316 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm like, no, just listen to me. 05:03.356 --> 05:03.836 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm your friend. 05:03.876 --> 05:06.057 [SPEAKER_01]: I just want you to bear my burdens. 05:06.157 --> 05:07.038 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm a corporate lawyer. 05:07.078 --> 05:11.560 [SPEAKER_00]: If you can't make an entity diagram of the transaction, then you don't know what you're doing. 05:11.820 --> 05:12.100 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes. 05:12.461 --> 05:13.821 [SPEAKER_00]: But yes, let's talk about this. 05:14.102 --> 05:19.084 [SPEAKER_00]: These really, if I was going to write a book on family and work, I wouldn't necessarily. 05:19.224 --> 05:19.965 [SPEAKER_00]: You call it a musical. 05:20.005 --> 05:21.386 [SPEAKER_00]: You call it a musical. 05:22.246 --> 05:24.228 [SPEAKER_00]: Do let me, let me cook here. 05:24.569 --> 05:25.189 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm sorry. 05:25.209 --> 05:27.952 [SPEAKER_00]: I wouldn't necessarily write it out at least five categories. 05:27.972 --> 05:29.374 [SPEAKER_00]: You're just five common questions. 05:29.414 --> 05:33.498 [SPEAKER_00]: We get How do you have appropriate boundaries for work number one? 05:34.679 --> 05:41.406 [SPEAKER_00]: number two, how do you Stay intentional in the evenings and on the weekends with your family? 05:42.227 --> 05:43.689 [SPEAKER_00]: Though you're exhausted from work 05:44.209 --> 05:48.631 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, reach number three, hear this more from the wives and the husbands. 05:49.291 --> 05:52.812 [SPEAKER_00]: How do we be helpful in the work of the home? 05:53.253 --> 05:53.633 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes. 05:53.653 --> 05:57.614 [SPEAKER_00]: Because your job is not the only place your kids are watching you work. 05:57.634 --> 05:59.235 [SPEAKER_00]: They're actually watching you work at home. 06:00.135 --> 06:11.699 [SPEAKER_00]: set in the table, doing dishes, cleaning up stuff or fixing stuff, doing yard work, whatever there's a work of the home that your kids need to be invited into and need to see you do. 06:12.379 --> 06:14.080 [SPEAKER_00]: And that relates to the last two points. 06:14.140 --> 06:20.302 [SPEAKER_00]: Number four, how do you invite your kids into your work as in, how do they see you at work? 06:20.802 --> 06:22.983 [SPEAKER_00]: Can they, they ever come to the office, they ever join you on trip. 06:23.003 --> 06:24.063 [SPEAKER_00]: How do you tell them about your work? 06:24.083 --> 06:25.323 [SPEAKER_00]: How do you teach them about work in that 06:27.024 --> 06:28.084 [SPEAKER_00]: teaching your kids to work. 06:29.165 --> 06:31.725 [SPEAKER_00]: Chores, jobs, when to get a job, this stuff. 06:31.785 --> 06:36.887 [SPEAKER_00]: So we will bounce back and forth between all of these. 06:39.468 --> 06:42.629 [SPEAKER_00]: I do want to start with two verses. 06:43.649 --> 06:45.490 [SPEAKER_00]: One is first Timothy 5-8. 06:45.510 --> 06:46.250 [SPEAKER_00]: And 06:51.993 --> 07:02.380 [SPEAKER_00]: This is just some biblical backing for the idea of providing and work being central to your call. 07:03.241 --> 07:11.086 [SPEAKER_00]: Anyone who does not provide for their relatives, and especially for their own household, has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever. 07:11.566 --> 07:12.247 [SPEAKER_00]: Pretty intense. 07:13.047 --> 07:14.088 [SPEAKER_00]: Paul's excuse. 07:14.288 --> 07:14.968 [SPEAKER_00]: Pretty well. 07:16.009 --> 07:17.110 [SPEAKER_00]: Um, chill out dude. 07:17.450 --> 07:18.591 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not going to pick this apart. 07:18.611 --> 07:20.573 [SPEAKER_00]: Theologically, I'm not even going to go with Super Deep. 07:20.633 --> 07:27.058 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm just saying, you don't have to look super far in the writings of the Bible to find that God values your work. 07:27.098 --> 07:35.985 [SPEAKER_00]: This was this was, you know, episode one of the season, Paul writing in the New Testament assumes that providing for your family the life of work is central part of your call. 07:36.725 --> 07:42.970 [SPEAKER_00]: So we should make that comment assumption that us being a father, us being a husband, us being a lover of God, 07:45.372 --> 07:47.715 [SPEAKER_00]: are all integrated parts of what it means to follow Jesus. 07:47.935 --> 07:50.537 [SPEAKER_00]: So how then do we integrate them? 07:51.178 --> 08:00.967 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, number one, I suggest you have to have boundaries on your quote unquote nine to five job eight to six job. 08:01.728 --> 08:04.911 [SPEAKER_00]: The work that you make your income by, whatever you want to call it. 08:06.317 --> 08:10.039 [SPEAKER_00]: Most of us dads, me included, are prone to making this all of our life. 08:10.399 --> 08:11.440 [SPEAKER_00]: We take our identity from it. 08:11.520 --> 08:15.623 [SPEAKER_00]: We don't know how to stop it, particularly in the age of smart phones, work comes home with us. 08:16.423 --> 08:19.465 [SPEAKER_00]: And so how do you have boundaries for work? 08:20.265 --> 08:22.847 [SPEAKER_00]: Here are three of my most basic suggestions. 08:23.323 --> 08:28.787 [SPEAKER_01]: These are your boundaries that you, these are the ones that you're, these are super simple suggestions on creating boundaries from work. 08:30.027 --> 08:38.673 [SPEAKER_00]: My strong suggestion to you is that you do not work at the house while your kids are awake if possible. 08:38.933 --> 08:39.553 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I was going to say those. 08:39.573 --> 08:41.414 [SPEAKER_01]: Give me tons of exceptions to this, of course. 08:41.754 --> 08:56.638 [SPEAKER_00]: But for me as a corporate lawyer, where work is easily part of every Saturday, part of every evening, part of every Sunday, one of the goals that I have is that when I get home at 6 p.m., and by the way, I'm going a lot of the day at work. 08:57.058 --> 08:58.439 [SPEAKER_00]: I leave right around 8. 08:59.099 --> 08:59.819 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't get back till 6. 08:59.959 --> 09:02.100 [SPEAKER_00]: If anybody doing the math, you know, 09:02.520 --> 09:05.761 [SPEAKER_00]: That's 10 hours, like devoted to time away from the home. 09:05.781 --> 09:06.502 [SPEAKER_00]: You can get a lot done. 09:07.462 --> 09:12.284 [SPEAKER_00]: But before I leave the home, I'm just with the boys in the morning. 09:12.484 --> 09:19.187 [SPEAKER_00]: And after I get home at six, I try to be with them, not looking at emails, not looking at my phone, not doing any work. 09:20.028 --> 09:25.730 [SPEAKER_00]: Until maybe after they go to bed, and then if it, you know, as appropriate, I might get back out the last time and your 09:28.211 --> 09:29.051 [SPEAKER_00]: That's what I don't know. 09:29.111 --> 09:30.232 [SPEAKER_00]: Answering all Brooks today. 09:30.612 --> 09:33.153 [SPEAKER_01]: No, it folks text how will you send me a text big guy? 09:33.253 --> 09:34.414 [SPEAKER_01]: I need to return your voice. 09:34.434 --> 09:37.875 [SPEAKER_00]: But yes, so you're going to nuanced this father as appropriate. 09:37.935 --> 09:52.742 [SPEAKER_00]: But yes, one of the boundaries I would suggest is just think about can you be super present with them while they're awake and keep your work to before they're up while you're actually out at the office or after they go bad at night. 09:52.922 --> 10:00.128 [SPEAKER_01]: That's really good and I think you were appropriate to say just to be fair like that might not be possible You said that it wasn't always possible in the early stages. 10:00.188 --> 10:15.702 [SPEAKER_01]: No, no, but I also think it doesn't work for me to work from home Like we have tried it so many times it is not work when I'm dad at home I'm dad at home and I find that if it is so much easier even if that means you go to way to a coffee shop or whatever Like it was way more easy 10:16.342 --> 10:18.063 [SPEAKER_01]: So, yes, that's a great amount of time. 10:18.123 --> 10:24.126 [SPEAKER_00]: And if you do work from home, if you have a home office or something like that, you know, you're going to nuance this better than we are. 10:24.166 --> 10:24.426 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes. 10:24.566 --> 10:25.947 [SPEAKER_00]: But, but maybe think about that. 10:26.788 --> 10:29.789 [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe think about just, that's the room where you really focus in. 10:29.829 --> 10:31.950 [SPEAKER_00]: And when you're out of that room, you're really out in your present. 10:32.110 --> 10:32.251 [SPEAKER_00]: Mm-hmm. 10:32.271 --> 10:32.991 [SPEAKER_00]: Just put a boundary. 10:33.231 --> 10:33.631 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yes. 10:33.811 --> 10:33.931 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay. 10:33.951 --> 10:34.632 [SPEAKER_01]: What's your other boundary? 10:35.312 --> 10:37.453 [SPEAKER_00]: My, my other two are really brief. 10:37.834 --> 10:38.574 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, go Sabbath. 10:38.894 --> 10:39.054 [SPEAKER_00]: Yep. 10:39.074 --> 10:40.895 [SPEAKER_00]: We talked about that last time, but it's super important. 10:40.915 --> 10:43.657 [SPEAKER_00]: If you don't have a Sabbath rhythm, you are probably 10:46.448 --> 11:01.398 [SPEAKER_00]: You're also letting it over take your spiritual life probably, but you're definitely letting it over take your family, and then Saturdays are for the boys, I just a great your boys, not the boys like your friends or the boys or the two and friends. 11:02.278 --> 11:06.239 [SPEAKER_00]: There, yeah, I have four boys and I really think about Saturdays and spending time with them. 11:06.319 --> 11:08.399 [SPEAKER_00]: I have great co-workers who I respect who work. 11:08.979 --> 11:10.480 [SPEAKER_00]: I have day every Saturday. 11:11.080 --> 11:20.362 [SPEAKER_00]: I've been in stages of life where I've had to work, you know, a good bit on Saturdays, but I aspire as a norm, not a rule, but as a norm, to really just be with my kids. 11:21.462 --> 11:23.063 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, maybe giving Lauren time off. 11:23.223 --> 11:24.863 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, doing something outdoors. 11:25.723 --> 11:26.683 [SPEAKER_00]: And that leaves me, 11:30.612 --> 11:36.270 [SPEAKER_00]: 50 hours of the workweek plus a little at night if I want to add let's say that gets me up to 54 55 11:38.755 --> 11:40.056 [SPEAKER_00]: Um, that's a lot of work. 11:40.256 --> 11:40.456 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. 11:40.496 --> 11:45.518 [SPEAKER_00]: Most studies show that after that amount of work, your productivity sharply decreases. 11:45.778 --> 11:46.158 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. 11:46.298 --> 11:47.919 [SPEAKER_00]: So you can, father. 11:47.939 --> 11:49.339 [SPEAKER_00]: Um, work. 11:49.359 --> 11:50.219 [SPEAKER_00]: You can run a company. 11:50.239 --> 11:51.280 [SPEAKER_00]: You can be in private equity. 11:51.300 --> 11:52.340 [SPEAKER_00]: You can be an investment beggar. 11:52.360 --> 11:53.301 [SPEAKER_00]: You can be in a corporate lawyer. 11:53.341 --> 11:56.382 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm naming professions that I'm around that are known for their overwork. 11:57.242 --> 12:02.084 [SPEAKER_00]: You can, um, carve appropriate boundaries on those things and still do great work. 12:02.464 --> 12:02.744 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes. 12:02.764 --> 12:04.925 [SPEAKER_00]: To solve a great family life by keeping guardbrills. 12:05.555 --> 12:09.177 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, the boundaries of love, them kind of just blow some Sabbath. 12:09.277 --> 12:11.538 [SPEAKER_01]: Sabbath is a really important one to us as well. 12:11.558 --> 12:12.279 [SPEAKER_01]: We keep it every week. 12:12.539 --> 12:13.399 [SPEAKER_01]: Let me highlight something. 12:13.419 --> 12:14.880 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to say a word that's going to be a blessing. 12:14.920 --> 12:16.521 [SPEAKER_01]: All you men, Sabbath, sex. 12:17.061 --> 12:23.045 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm telling you, you're having a rhythm where you plan that into my favorite essence, back to back. 12:23.865 --> 12:26.987 [SPEAKER_01]: And actually, really three because it's Saturday, Sabbath, sex. 12:27.007 --> 12:28.128 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, like, wow. 12:29.288 --> 12:30.189 [SPEAKER_01]: the Trinity of Essas. 12:30.770 --> 12:37.034 [SPEAKER_01]: And I think when you plan in, like, there's so much restoration and blessing. 12:37.074 --> 12:40.657 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, one of the boundaries is having that, I know for us, we end up traveling. 12:40.677 --> 12:45.441 [SPEAKER_01]: So our work looks different, but you also, you travel as well, but your work week is very established. 12:45.801 --> 12:50.765 [SPEAKER_01]: And I have a very established work week, but when I'm traveling, like, all end up traveling. 12:50.805 --> 12:51.525 [SPEAKER_01]: This is a great example. 12:51.545 --> 12:54.428 [SPEAKER_01]: I was in Nashville for our motherhood retreat that popped right over here. 12:55.008 --> 12:57.290 [SPEAKER_01]: And I'm going to be a gone, a total of like eight days. 12:57.470 --> 13:02.934 [SPEAKER_01]: So my rhythm when I'm gone and I just told you, I was like, we were talking about like, maybe we'll hang tonight. 13:02.954 --> 13:09.460 [SPEAKER_01]: I was like, I think I'm going to do a Sabbath night if you might sit up, but not, but because like, I'm my body's already feet. 13:09.500 --> 13:12.062 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm, I feel like I kind of rest like it's been almost a week. 13:12.742 --> 13:17.887 [SPEAKER_01]: And so, but with the family, um, there's like times when we're at home and then there's times when we're away. 13:18.387 --> 13:22.410 [SPEAKER_01]: And when we're not traveling, I'm telling you that rhythm of Sabbath. 13:22.450 --> 13:23.391 [SPEAKER_01]: We all look forward to it. 13:23.471 --> 13:28.616 [SPEAKER_01]: Our kids get sugary cereal and they get to watch something in the morning on on Sabbath. 13:28.676 --> 13:31.839 [SPEAKER_00]: George, all you want, anybody any Sabbath feels different due to feels different. 13:31.959 --> 13:36.923 [SPEAKER_00]: And they know what day it is based upon how close, how far we are from Saturday or how 13:37.023 --> 13:38.245 [SPEAKER_01]: close we are to Saturday. 13:38.265 --> 13:38.625 [SPEAKER_01]: That's great. 13:39.066 --> 13:40.588 [SPEAKER_01]: And so it's an amazing gift. 13:40.669 --> 13:41.410 [SPEAKER_01]: They get into it. 13:41.470 --> 13:41.931 [SPEAKER_01]: We love it. 13:42.011 --> 13:42.772 [SPEAKER_01]: It's time together. 13:43.273 --> 13:46.197 [SPEAKER_01]: And sometimes let me get kind of just be honest about the backs of weakness of Sabbath. 13:48.138 --> 13:51.580 [SPEAKER_01]: I want to say something, no one's going to like, but I'll just confess and it's very true. 13:52.601 --> 13:53.502 [SPEAKER_01]: You don't even know what I'm going to say. 13:53.522 --> 13:54.622 [SPEAKER_01]: And I know you're curious, Justin. 13:54.642 --> 13:55.923 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm just going to let you sit in front of me. 13:55.943 --> 13:57.664 [SPEAKER_01]: I actually have a thought of what I want to say here. 13:58.985 --> 13:59.746 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm not surprised. 13:59.766 --> 14:04.089 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, talk too much. 14:04.369 --> 14:05.429 [SPEAKER_01]: No, just say that. 14:05.449 --> 14:07.191 [SPEAKER_01]: So I want to tease this out. 14:07.231 --> 14:09.332 [SPEAKER_01]: No, it's not even the idea. 14:09.352 --> 14:14.556 [SPEAKER_01]: It's actually what happens when you're chronically overworking and you get to Sabbath. 14:15.416 --> 14:18.597 [SPEAKER_01]: When I'm chronically overworking and get to Sabbath Sabbath, it's not fun. 14:18.857 --> 14:20.278 [SPEAKER_01]: It sucks so bad. 14:21.098 --> 14:22.458 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm too tired to enjoy it. 14:23.138 --> 14:27.660 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm too, I'm catching up emotionally physically from too much output. 14:28.300 --> 14:33.282 [SPEAKER_01]: I haven't slowed down enough to enjoy my wife to enjoy my kids and vice versa. 14:33.722 --> 14:36.603 [SPEAKER_01]: Haven't made enough time to connect relationally with my spouse. 14:36.803 --> 14:42.405 [SPEAKER_01]: So it's usually a good old fat argument on that day because we haven't we've deferred connection moments in 14:44.105 --> 14:45.626 [SPEAKER_01]: Now, this isn't our pattern all the time. 14:45.646 --> 14:55.171 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm just saying we easily fall into that when there's seasons and business and overwork, Sabbath then becomes a time to just basically you're falling into Sabbath, you're basically 14:57.098 --> 15:12.375 [SPEAKER_01]: Now, now everything slowed down enough so you can feel it and all the things you haven't dealt with are now there and now it's actually a symptom of overwork before Sabbath and so that shows me like, hey, maybe I'm building in this one day, but I'm like depleted on the whole. 15:12.795 --> 15:16.239 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so it's best to say, yeah, you might be running to the rest of the week. 15:16.279 --> 15:17.180 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, absolutely. 15:17.240 --> 15:18.201 [SPEAKER_01]: So it's just to say. 15:19.022 --> 15:21.503 [SPEAKER_01]: just know that nuance like it takes time to get into that rhythm. 15:21.843 --> 15:23.763 [SPEAKER_01]: There's times when it's really, really enjoyable. 15:24.224 --> 15:28.145 [SPEAKER_01]: But if you're overworking Sabbath will be like coming down, but not the fun kind. 15:28.225 --> 15:30.946 [SPEAKER_01]: It will be like, this is really hard to like re-center. 15:31.126 --> 15:32.066 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's been my experience. 15:32.086 --> 15:35.647 [SPEAKER_00]: But you you fumble through Sabbath like that to practice the rhythm. 15:35.807 --> 15:49.910 [SPEAKER_00]: right absolutely yes it's to say like yeah I'm saying don't be surprised if that's the case right but that's always a great indicator that the week is you're doing way too much during the week that's why you learn from rhythms like Sabbath and so my closing thought here on point one with boundaries would be 15:51.628 --> 15:53.608 [SPEAKER_00]: they're going to feel like guard rails. 15:54.129 --> 15:54.649 [SPEAKER_00]: I eat. 15:56.049 --> 15:59.990 [SPEAKER_00]: It's not comfortable when you hit them, but they do keep you safe. 16:00.450 --> 16:02.530 [SPEAKER_00]: So if you're like, oh, but these are so hard. 16:02.550 --> 16:03.751 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, yeah, they're boundaries. 16:03.811 --> 16:05.151 [SPEAKER_00]: You're going to want to do more. 16:05.191 --> 16:05.991 [SPEAKER_00]: You're going to mess up. 16:06.131 --> 16:10.492 [SPEAKER_00]: And so just think of them as like the bumper rails, like the bowling ball might hit them. 16:10.532 --> 16:11.512 [SPEAKER_00]: That's not a great role. 16:11.552 --> 16:14.153 [SPEAKER_00]: The ideal, ideally you're shooting on the middle, but life. 16:14.873 --> 16:16.274 [SPEAKER_00]: Life means you hit the boundaries. 16:16.294 --> 16:17.034 [SPEAKER_00]: It kind of hurts. 16:17.334 --> 16:20.815 [SPEAKER_00]: You mess them up, but that's why their guardrails are boundaries. 16:20.835 --> 16:21.376 [SPEAKER_00]: They help you. 16:21.916 --> 16:22.256 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes. 16:23.036 --> 16:24.777 [SPEAKER_00]: This will help you with number two. 16:25.677 --> 16:37.422 [SPEAKER_00]: And that is that when you are home, you are very intentional about the second race, which is what I like to call it, which is totally a personal anecdote. 16:38.522 --> 16:40.064 [SPEAKER_00]: One time, I think I might have shared this before. 16:40.084 --> 16:41.906 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know if I've ever had this. 16:42.226 --> 16:42.987 [SPEAKER_00]: A couple years ago. 16:43.127 --> 16:43.888 [SPEAKER_00]: It's better not suck. 16:44.008 --> 16:44.509 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm just gonna suck. 16:44.529 --> 16:46.791 [SPEAKER_01]: No, I mean, it's actually, it's kind of suck. 16:46.931 --> 16:48.633 [SPEAKER_00]: You tell me. 16:48.713 --> 16:49.494 [SPEAKER_00]: I'll tell you. 16:49.634 --> 16:50.756 [SPEAKER_00]: It's just a minor thing. 16:51.056 --> 16:59.846 [SPEAKER_00]: A couple years ago, we're at the fourth of July, weekend with my in-laws down at Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia. 17:00.426 --> 17:05.530 [SPEAKER_00]: And they thought it would be fun for us to invite us into their church with sponsoring like a little Tough Mudder event. 17:05.870 --> 17:06.430 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, Tough Mudder? 17:06.450 --> 17:07.291 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, due to for these. 17:07.491 --> 17:08.692 [SPEAKER_00]: And it's super fun. 17:08.732 --> 17:09.652 [SPEAKER_00]: It was a super good idea. 17:10.553 --> 17:11.053 [SPEAKER_00]: I loved it. 17:12.334 --> 17:15.676 [SPEAKER_00]: I ran as hard as I could and did these obstacles as hard as I could. 17:16.137 --> 17:20.800 [SPEAKER_00]: And I lost by like 60 seconds to some like 22 year old who was like, 17:22.641 --> 17:25.422 [SPEAKER_00]: I was late in my late 30s. 17:25.442 --> 17:29.384 [SPEAKER_00]: He's still more fit than me surprise the price But I remember I never forget at the finish line. 17:29.424 --> 17:39.889 [SPEAKER_00]: It was like a 5k maybe a 10k with all these obstacles I can't remember But he like ran off and like to the snack tent like sat down and rested right when I got there 17:40.969 --> 17:42.410 [SPEAKER_00]: Um, and mind you, I done pretty well. 17:42.430 --> 17:44.432 [SPEAKER_00]: Like I got second place and lost to a 22 year old. 17:44.452 --> 17:46.853 [SPEAKER_00]: I went, I went hard, right when I got there. 17:46.953 --> 17:48.835 [SPEAKER_00]: All the kids were like, Oh, right. 17:48.915 --> 17:51.957 [SPEAKER_00]: Now it's the kid one, but they can't run it. 17:52.257 --> 17:53.458 [SPEAKER_00]: They need me to carry them. 17:53.598 --> 17:58.501 [SPEAKER_00]: So I picked them like one of my sons up, put them on my shoulders and just do the whole thing again. 17:59.482 --> 18:03.084 [SPEAKER_00]: And I'll never forget, I was like, I just had, and of course, I was happy to do it. 18:03.104 --> 18:06.866 [SPEAKER_00]: I was exhausted and would have rather been in the snack tent maybe, like, resting. 18:07.426 --> 18:11.149 [SPEAKER_00]: But I was like, oh, the difference between me and that guy, this is, of course, no shade on him. 18:11.169 --> 18:13.250 [SPEAKER_00]: He beat me fair and square and he's 22 year old and fit. 18:13.270 --> 18:13.490 [SPEAKER_00]: Great. 18:13.830 --> 18:17.832 [SPEAKER_00]: But the difference between that stage of life and mine is that you have such a 18:21.535 --> 18:35.337 [SPEAKER_00]: You're not done that you're the most important part is the come and that is that now you're home And your kids want to be picked up your kids want to be played with your wife wants to be talked to to be heard She wants to be helped rightfully so or maybe played with two who knows ideally 18:37.081 --> 18:38.001 [SPEAKER_00]: We had to ask. 18:38.321 --> 18:42.042 [SPEAKER_00]: And so I think of it as I always think of that moment as the second race. 18:42.883 --> 18:43.363 [SPEAKER_00]: That's good. 18:43.383 --> 18:49.905 [SPEAKER_00]: When you get home, you need to be ready not to collapse and be like, Hey, family served me now. 18:50.525 --> 18:54.446 [SPEAKER_00]: You need to be ready to run probably there's important part of your day, which is the second race. 18:55.046 --> 18:57.227 [SPEAKER_00]: And so I think of that just. 18:58.247 --> 18:58.907 [SPEAKER_00]: as an ethic. 18:59.027 --> 19:01.608 [SPEAKER_00]: We talked about it last week with spiritual disciplines. 19:01.648 --> 19:01.948 [SPEAKER_00]: It works. 19:01.968 --> 19:05.690 [SPEAKER_00]: Some of you are really disappointed in your work life, but not in your home life or vice versa. 19:06.810 --> 19:09.251 [SPEAKER_00]: I would just give this encouragement to you, Father's. 19:10.151 --> 19:15.293 [SPEAKER_00]: I know that it is hard to come home from a day you've woken up early. 19:15.873 --> 19:16.973 [SPEAKER_00]: You've led your team. 19:17.514 --> 19:21.675 [SPEAKER_00]: You've worked the stress of finances and crisis and clients being mad at you. 19:21.995 --> 19:22.955 [SPEAKER_00]: You've worked out. 19:23.796 --> 19:25.236 [SPEAKER_00]: You've been patient with your co-workers. 19:28.257 --> 19:35.760 [SPEAKER_00]: And people are mad at you and they want more from you and I'm just saying welcome to the sanctifying wonderful place of fatherhood. 19:36.421 --> 19:37.601 [SPEAKER_00]: It's run the second race. 19:38.021 --> 19:42.103 [SPEAKER_00]: Don't give your family your worst just because you've worked hard all day. 19:42.223 --> 19:45.004 [SPEAKER_00]: In fact, just know like that's the marathon you're running. 19:45.024 --> 19:45.624 [SPEAKER_00]: You're not done. 19:45.644 --> 19:46.905 [SPEAKER_00]: It's 6 p.m. 19:47.226 --> 19:50.608 [SPEAKER_01]: No, I actually really, I'm so, first of all, that didn't suck. 19:50.628 --> 19:51.389 [SPEAKER_01]: That was a great idea. 19:51.409 --> 19:52.490 [SPEAKER_01]: That was great analogy. 19:52.510 --> 20:00.855 [SPEAKER_01]: Ladies and gentlemen, it did not sound like something, but I do, I do think though that's an exact example of someone in their 20s versus their 30s in that sense, right? 20:00.875 --> 20:06.899 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, very tangible, like you, your, your shoulders get broader, were you more fit? 20:07.860 --> 20:12.123 [SPEAKER_01]: No, well, I mean, maybe, but what you have is way more endurance, way more grit. 20:12.623 --> 20:17.165 [SPEAKER_01]: and your shoulders are now broader to hold now literally a child through a tough motor situation. 20:17.185 --> 20:23.007 [SPEAKER_01]: You're actually a stronger human, maybe he beats you by 60 seconds, but the baby has specific kind of exercise. 20:23.327 --> 20:28.148 [SPEAKER_01]: It doesn't surprise me that a 25-year-old can crank more billable hours than I can. 20:28.288 --> 20:28.549 [SPEAKER_00]: Sure. 20:28.769 --> 20:29.029 [SPEAKER_00]: But. 20:29.789 --> 20:34.491 [SPEAKER_00]: But your home's living a life of writing of work, of leading a law firm of bills, of family. 20:34.571 --> 20:36.892 [SPEAKER_01]: Your bill hours are going to be a lot higher, right? 20:37.012 --> 20:39.052 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I'm doing a lot more work. 20:39.312 --> 20:42.934 [SPEAKER_00]: And I just want to encourage you, Father, if it feels like that, it should. 20:42.994 --> 20:48.596 [SPEAKER_00]: But that's a sign of your maturity that you're no longer getting home and being like, I'm so done from this work day. 20:48.616 --> 20:50.216 [SPEAKER_00]: But rather being like, I'm still ready to. 20:51.857 --> 21:10.973 [SPEAKER_01]: help what I'm saying is I think what your painting is a very fair picture of like if you're getting home being like I'm really tired and I should have this like noted I'm going to just say what fatherhood really is it's getting home and not whining about the fact that that is something that's needed from you and I don't mean to be rude by saying whining I'm saying 21:11.894 --> 21:16.579 [SPEAKER_01]: it is actually very much normal and I don't want you to feel surprised. 21:16.659 --> 21:25.408 [SPEAKER_00]: It's just naming this that that is a very normal part of fatherhood that you are tired and you go home and I can't tell you the moment I walk in the door. 21:25.428 --> 21:26.289 [SPEAKER_01]: Do you know what I start doing? 21:27.290 --> 21:28.791 [SPEAKER_01]: I just start picking up stuff. 21:31.193 --> 21:32.373 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't say hi to my dog. 21:32.493 --> 21:35.155 [SPEAKER_01]: My dog goes immediately to his bed because he knows I don't want to greet him. 21:35.395 --> 21:36.856 [SPEAKER_01]: I want humans before animals. 21:37.336 --> 21:40.857 [SPEAKER_01]: He knows and he knows he's not allowed to greet me until I snap my fingers and say yes. 21:40.978 --> 21:46.880 [SPEAKER_01]: If you think that's controlling it absolutely is but he's trained and we got him dialed and I see my kids first. 21:46.960 --> 21:51.423 [SPEAKER_01]: I want humans before animals and then I just start picking up stuff and then I 21:52.703 --> 21:54.765 [SPEAKER_01]: And I'm not telling you this is like oh big pat on the bat. 21:54.925 --> 22:09.896 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm just saying just if you think this doesn't touch us Like I literally don't even talk to my wife There's stuff to pick up before I even get to her wherever she's at in the house like there's stuff to help with right away And if you can think about it from a wife's perspective She's all day depending upon her situation. 22:09.916 --> 22:14.139 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, we have a special in these daughter four kids like she's dying all day 22:14.879 --> 22:16.861 [SPEAKER_01]: And I'm, and let me just be real. 22:17.081 --> 22:18.902 [SPEAKER_01]: I am pouring out all day as well. 22:19.623 --> 22:21.684 [SPEAKER_01]: And you are exhausted and that's true. 22:22.125 --> 22:25.007 [SPEAKER_01]: But your wife's not coming to work to help you. 22:25.067 --> 22:26.428 [SPEAKER_01]: And if she did, you'd be really thankful. 22:26.888 --> 22:31.812 [SPEAKER_01]: But when you get home, it's your job to also then share that load, which honestly is needed. 22:31.972 --> 22:32.633 [SPEAKER_01]: And it's normal. 22:32.673 --> 22:37.496 [SPEAKER_01]: And so if you're like, I don't even get to rest until I go to bed, it's like, dude, that's actually, that's all I want. 22:37.596 --> 22:39.558 [SPEAKER_01]: That's why the normal don't be surprised by that. 22:39.678 --> 22:40.979 [SPEAKER_01]: Don't even get overwhelmed by that. 22:41.419 --> 22:42.299 [SPEAKER_01]: You have different rhythms. 22:42.399 --> 22:44.000 [SPEAKER_01]: It's fine and that's actually good. 22:44.360 --> 22:47.301 [SPEAKER_01]: So just don't be alarmed like that is very okay. 22:47.461 --> 22:51.002 [SPEAKER_00]: And I think this very much bleeds into point three helping at home. 22:51.582 --> 22:53.843 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I started dipping into that thing. 22:53.863 --> 22:55.644 [SPEAKER_00]: No, no, it's right on that subject. 22:55.724 --> 23:02.106 [SPEAKER_00]: I think we're at our worst when the the wife is saying, oh my gosh, like 23:02.706 --> 23:04.287 [SPEAKER_00]: I've been dealing with the kids all day. 23:04.307 --> 23:06.788 [SPEAKER_00]: I've been doing all this stuff all day. 23:07.288 --> 23:11.391 [SPEAKER_00]: You've gotten to go away from the house and be away from all this. 23:12.151 --> 23:20.635 [SPEAKER_00]: So now, she's saying that, and you're a mean while saying, I've been running like a dog all day. 23:20.976 --> 23:25.358 [SPEAKER_00]: I've been doing this and that, and you've gotten to be home. 23:26.378 --> 23:27.099 [SPEAKER_00]: And now, 23:27.799 --> 23:35.587 [SPEAKER_00]: In both of us are discontent with our work, jealous of the other's work and expecting the other to do our work. 23:35.607 --> 23:37.248 [SPEAKER_00]: Like we're at our worst one or thing like that. 23:37.328 --> 23:43.574 [SPEAKER_00]: Here's where we're at our best and by the way, so I know this pattern of that intimately good learn and I have rehearsed this so often, right? 23:44.455 --> 23:47.137 [SPEAKER_00]: And I'm like, I would love for you to come and answer my emails. 23:47.177 --> 23:58.886 [SPEAKER_00]: If I could just stay home with the kids and she was like, I would love to be out of that, because if you were to look, we're at our worst when we're talking like that to each other, we're at our best when we're saying, I bet it's been tough for you. 23:59.066 --> 23:59.626 [SPEAKER_00]: Let me help. 24:00.187 --> 24:00.727 [SPEAKER_00]: And guess what? 24:01.267 --> 24:02.909 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm at my best when Lauren's saying that to me. 24:03.029 --> 24:04.310 [SPEAKER_00]: She's like, you probably had a hard day. 24:04.330 --> 24:04.770 [SPEAKER_00]: Let me help. 24:05.550 --> 24:09.273 [SPEAKER_00]: And I'm in my best and she's at her best when I'm saying that to her I bet it's been her for you. 24:09.574 --> 24:10.014 [SPEAKER_00]: Let me help. 24:10.715 --> 24:14.898 [SPEAKER_00]: So that consider the attitude of Christ. 24:16.099 --> 24:23.665 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, being in very nature equal to God, but not considering a quality with God something to be grass, rather he took the form of a servant. 24:24.465 --> 24:27.307 [SPEAKER_00]: When both husband and wife are saying, how can I serve? 24:27.327 --> 24:29.109 [SPEAKER_00]: How can I help? 24:29.369 --> 24:31.691 [SPEAKER_00]: We're doing what Christ did. 24:31.771 --> 24:33.512 [SPEAKER_00]: So we're talking mostly to guys. 24:34.133 --> 24:40.597 [SPEAKER_00]: So I'm going to step on that perspective and I'm going to say when you're home be of good use 24:41.818 --> 24:57.872 [SPEAKER_00]: Um, you know how you can figure out how to help with laundry, you can figure out how to help set the table, you can figure out how to help cook, you can figure out how to help clean all the things that, um, a certain brand of masculinity wants to identify as women's work is actually the work of the household, right? 24:58.052 --> 24:59.033 [SPEAKER_00]: Which is you can do. 24:59.293 --> 25:01.635 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and every family is going to sort it differently. 25:01.855 --> 25:02.035 [SPEAKER_00]: But 25:03.396 --> 25:08.720 [SPEAKER_00]: I strongly believe your kids need to see you helping around the house. 25:08.940 --> 25:17.765 [SPEAKER_00]: Now also this includes the more masculine type to work, fixing the drywall, cutting the grass, taking out the trash. 25:19.186 --> 25:23.709 [SPEAKER_00]: And I really don't have a dog in the fight of how you and your spouse want to divide up the work of the home. 25:23.769 --> 25:24.770 [SPEAKER_00]: It's not a care less. 25:25.010 --> 25:28.332 [SPEAKER_00]: What I really care about is that your wife feels like 25:29.692 --> 25:38.323 [SPEAKER_00]: queen because of how much you surfer and that your kids feel like oh dad, no task is beneath him. 25:38.623 --> 25:39.925 [SPEAKER_00]: Like he'll, he'll just help. 25:40.005 --> 25:40.686 [SPEAKER_00]: He's a servant. 25:41.227 --> 25:42.208 [SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely man. 25:42.228 --> 25:55.014 [SPEAKER_00]: So let your kids are watching your kids are watching whether or not you help So set a wonderful example and by the way dudes make your wife feel like a queen whatever takes make her feel like a queen. 25:55.334 --> 26:02.037 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, absolutely and and on that but for a little separate is there's a 26:02.875 --> 26:31.008 [SPEAKER_01]: culturally it's just been kind of coming to the surface more and more and until where it's now just like the pendulum swing has been very interesting and you know there's a lot of expectation through culture I think a lot of it's fueled by social media culture but not exclusively where there's this idea that everything needs to be equal like hey husbands and wives need to split that workload down the middle 50 50 care for kids and all of that and I'm going to say now 26:31.755 --> 26:34.197 [SPEAKER_01]: If that works for you, that's great. 26:34.217 --> 26:35.678 [SPEAKER_01]: It's kind of like balance. 26:35.699 --> 26:36.499 [SPEAKER_01]: But it's an illusion. 26:36.779 --> 26:38.481 [SPEAKER_01]: It's like the lock. 26:38.501 --> 26:39.502 [SPEAKER_01]: So that's what I'm saying. 26:39.522 --> 26:45.347 [SPEAKER_01]: You want to just say, you are going to have gifts, Sister that your husband won't. 26:45.547 --> 26:47.448 [SPEAKER_01]: And man father you are going to have gifts. 26:47.488 --> 26:47.889 [SPEAKER_01]: Your wife won't. 26:48.409 --> 27:04.184 [SPEAKER_01]: And if you're giving a lot of your day to a job and your wife is staying at home and sisters listening if you are, if that's part of it, the workload of home and work as far as him being at a job, they should be different. 27:04.425 --> 27:06.426 [SPEAKER_01]: It would actually naturally be that way. 27:07.107 --> 27:16.431 [SPEAKER_01]: And of course, you want to serve one another, but this ideal that it's going to be like, hey, I did this much, therefore, you need to be this much and do this much, you are going to ruin your relations. 27:16.491 --> 27:16.771 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. 27:16.852 --> 27:17.772 [SPEAKER_00]: That's a great word. 27:17.872 --> 27:20.513 [SPEAKER_01]: And so it's just important to really be clear. 27:21.354 --> 27:23.395 [SPEAKER_01]: It's okay that it's not exact. 27:23.995 --> 27:25.415 [SPEAKER_01]: It's actually the heart. 27:25.596 --> 27:28.077 [SPEAKER_01]: So if your heart towards your wife, men is 27:28.997 --> 27:29.718 [SPEAKER_01]: How can I help? 27:29.958 --> 27:33.260 [SPEAKER_01]: I know I'm not going to do everything that you do, but I need to list it. 27:33.280 --> 27:33.721 [SPEAKER_01]: I need to help. 27:33.761 --> 27:35.722 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's going to change your heart. 27:35.762 --> 27:36.683 [SPEAKER_01]: Now, let me just confess. 27:36.943 --> 27:39.165 [SPEAKER_01]: I have not done in the last probably six months here. 27:39.966 --> 27:40.626 [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe six months here. 27:41.227 --> 27:42.508 [SPEAKER_01]: I've not done this great with my wife. 27:42.568 --> 27:47.632 [SPEAKER_01]: My wife has started having to work and wanting to work more, but intentional has been growing. 27:47.652 --> 27:48.552 [SPEAKER_01]: She's been working more. 27:49.273 --> 27:53.296 [SPEAKER_01]: She's been saying like, hey, like, so pause work stuff, 27:57.442 --> 28:05.073 [SPEAKER_01]: I have a lot more work on my plate now than I've ever had before, but we're still operating like I'm a stay at home mom and you go to work all day. 28:05.333 --> 28:08.758 [SPEAKER_01]: Now, when I didn't have as much work, this was fine. 28:09.219 --> 28:10.961 [SPEAKER_01]: But I homeschooled our two youngest kids. 28:10.981 --> 28:11.682 [SPEAKER_00]: That's interesting. 28:11.783 --> 28:11.983 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. 28:12.123 --> 28:14.006 [SPEAKER_01]: And I'm working more than half the time. 28:15.556 --> 28:19.860 [SPEAKER_01]: We have to figure this out and and she looks to me of like, well, you're my partner. 28:20.540 --> 28:23.743 [SPEAKER_01]: You need to you need to share the load now in our situation. 28:23.963 --> 28:25.925 [SPEAKER_01]: It's a little interesting because she's working more now. 28:26.105 --> 28:26.925 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm working more now. 28:27.145 --> 28:28.607 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't have any more time to give. 28:28.727 --> 28:29.908 [SPEAKER_01]: And so what's really interesting. 28:30.248 --> 28:32.250 [SPEAKER_01]: I was talking about there's therapists about this yet again. 28:32.970 --> 28:36.093 [SPEAKER_01]: And we're just processing like what am I supposed to do and he was just highlighting. 28:36.533 --> 28:41.456 [SPEAKER_01]: He's like, she's coming to you as she naturally should as a wife to a husband and say, I need your help because this is overwhelming. 28:41.476 --> 28:45.178 [SPEAKER_01]: The problem is you've already agreed that you need to be doing this job. 28:45.458 --> 28:49.520 [SPEAKER_01]: Therefore, you can't take away from your job to help domestic, like the home stuff. 28:50.825 --> 28:53.446 [SPEAKER_01]: He said, you probably have to hire help with certain things. 28:53.486 --> 28:58.947 [SPEAKER_01]: And I was like, but the idealism of my wife is she doesn't like to hire help for stuff. 28:58.987 --> 29:01.227 [SPEAKER_01]: And he was like, take that's the deeper thing you have to talk about. 29:01.247 --> 29:02.228 [SPEAKER_01]: I was like, yeah. 29:02.568 --> 29:11.290 [SPEAKER_01]: And so things like we're looking at it going, okay, well, if you're working more than in the house needs to be cleaned, then what rhythm could we invite a house cleaner in? 29:11.630 --> 29:13.850 [SPEAKER_01]: And what rhythm do we need to have some care for the kids? 29:13.890 --> 29:14.691 [SPEAKER_01]: So you can do this. 29:15.011 --> 29:19.192 [SPEAKER_01]: And so I'm telling you that really gritty, earthy example 29:20.912 --> 29:30.220 [SPEAKER_01]: If both parents are working and that's kind of an necessity, start thinking outside the box for some of that domestic stuff, for a lot of years Elizabeth was able to do it, but her health is declined. 29:30.240 --> 29:35.385 [SPEAKER_01]: So we have health help now because her health is not, she's not able to do a lot of the things she used to be able to do. 29:36.105 --> 29:41.148 [SPEAKER_01]: And I'm telling you that just to say like it looks different in different stages and we've had did even dissect it that way. 29:41.629 --> 29:42.409 [SPEAKER_01]: So we want to help it. 29:42.649 --> 29:46.112 [SPEAKER_01]: I still help in the home, by the way, FYI, but we just do it. 29:46.172 --> 29:47.132 [SPEAKER_01]: We're doing it a little differently. 29:47.292 --> 29:53.817 [SPEAKER_00]: So I think that's the that's the thesis right there of this point is going to look different for everybody because jobs are different. 29:55.037 --> 29:56.198 [SPEAKER_00]: life stage is very different. 29:56.518 --> 30:02.803 [SPEAKER_00]: If you feel like this is hard and you both have more work than you can manage, know that you are in the realm of normal. 30:04.204 --> 30:10.528 [SPEAKER_00]: If I have the vast majority and we're broken I, why don't I have better advice for you than Philippians has? 30:10.768 --> 30:30.417 [SPEAKER_00]: No, the best advice for all situations is take the nature of a servant and say, you know what, I don't care about a quality, I don't care about a quality with God something to be grass, I don't, this doesn't have to be equal, let me serve when both people are saying that marriages turn out phenomenally, when only one person is, is tough when no one is. 30:32.199 --> 30:33.420 [SPEAKER_00]: you're in the dangers, yeah. 30:34.101 --> 30:38.666 [SPEAKER_00]: But I don't want to go, I don't want to go too hard on that because we got to talk about kids now. 30:38.706 --> 30:39.928 [SPEAKER_00]: So we got our last two of here. 30:39.988 --> 30:43.352 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's do biting kids into your work and teaching them to work. 30:43.412 --> 30:47.056 [SPEAKER_00]: So for me, this is the idea of both one. 30:47.977 --> 30:52.742 [SPEAKER_00]: pulling your kids into your jobs so that they can see like what does dad do? 30:53.463 --> 30:55.305 [SPEAKER_00]: What does it look like for him to do his job? 30:55.745 --> 31:01.871 [SPEAKER_00]: Many of us like me have jobs that are primarily out of the home and, by the way, on computers. 31:02.151 --> 31:04.554 [SPEAKER_00]: So they can't like, they can't do the work job. 31:04.574 --> 31:06.236 [SPEAKER_00]: They can't walk out of the shed and be like, oh my, 31:06.796 --> 31:11.318 [SPEAKER_00]: What working father like, look how he shapes a chair, you know, that'd be amazing. 31:11.358 --> 31:12.399 [SPEAKER_00]: Most of us don't have jobs like that. 31:12.559 --> 31:12.779 [SPEAKER_00]: Nope. 31:12.899 --> 31:17.982 [SPEAKER_00]: How, so how do you invite them into your work so they can see what it's like and what it means to work. 31:18.022 --> 31:23.885 [SPEAKER_00]: And then the second point and we're just going to intertwine these last two here, what does it mean to teach them to work? 31:24.825 --> 31:28.827 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, I've struggled with this on my life because I'm a lawyer working in computers generally out of the house. 31:29.127 --> 31:30.408 [SPEAKER_00]: And so here are a couple of things I do. 31:30.668 --> 31:30.848 [SPEAKER_00]: Yep. 31:31.429 --> 31:31.569 [SPEAKER_00]: One. 31:32.489 --> 31:39.575 [SPEAKER_00]: If I do have to work a Saturday or a holiday, and this is often like something like Labor Day, ironically, or Memorial Day, or like I'm going into work, not always. 31:39.615 --> 31:43.938 [SPEAKER_00]: But those Monday holidays, the lawyers don't actually take them off. 31:44.519 --> 31:47.601 [SPEAKER_00]: All the kids are off school, often bring them to work on those days. 31:47.621 --> 31:48.522 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay. 31:48.562 --> 31:51.704 [SPEAKER_00]: They might get a donut, they might get a show, but they get to come into my office. 31:52.665 --> 32:14.855 [SPEAKER_00]: mess around with the paper shredder like mess up things take candy out of people's trays they feel like the king's here and they just get to see the environment number two if I do have to work at home if I have to maybe answer an email like wall with the park or on a walk or just hanging out around the kitchen and I'm like oh this is urgent I actually need to take care of this when they were little I would often get down on one knee and be like 32:15.475 --> 32:17.517 [SPEAKER_00]: Hey, I got to answer our work email. 32:17.537 --> 32:38.033 [SPEAKER_00]: So I'm gonna tell this person, you know, and today I understand what I'm saying like no But my kind of like rooting an idea of like, okay, this is part of his job like let them to the extent you can't let them see what you do Yes, this is grown now that my kids have grown into something I know you do and so I want you to comment on this in inviting them on work trips 32:38.413 --> 32:40.054 [SPEAKER_00]: Not everybody travels, but you and I both do. 32:40.214 --> 32:41.054 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. 32:41.074 --> 32:48.618 [SPEAKER_00]: And one of the highlights of my past couple years has I've made a new goal, bring one kid on one trip every year. 32:49.638 --> 32:51.459 [SPEAKER_00]: They have been amazing, dude. 32:52.280 --> 32:56.461 [SPEAKER_00]: Um, the, the kids think airplanes are amazing, right? 32:56.481 --> 32:57.562 [SPEAKER_00]: Because airplanes are amazing. 32:57.582 --> 32:58.102 [SPEAKER_00]: They're pretty great. 32:58.122 --> 33:02.224 [SPEAKER_00]: They think staying in hotels and like eating out is amazing because actually they kind of are amazing. 33:02.304 --> 33:04.805 [SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, it's not much quality time with them. 33:04.965 --> 33:06.026 [SPEAKER_01]: And then they get to see 33:06.366 --> 33:13.888 [SPEAKER_00]: Like what I do, and most of these are speaking trips, um, related to work, and I'm sorry, authorship and writing, not loyering, loyering. 33:13.908 --> 33:15.548 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm usually just working enrichment remotely. 33:15.768 --> 33:15.988 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. 33:16.268 --> 33:18.769 [SPEAKER_00]: But it's just been a joy to bring you on trips. 33:18.809 --> 33:20.009 [SPEAKER_00]: And I know you do this. 33:20.349 --> 33:26.891 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, yeah, I was going to say just, I won't add too much to it, because I do a lot of the similar stuff that you just said, including them into it. 33:27.231 --> 33:36.073 [SPEAKER_01]: With ministry work, it was really easy because it was like, hey, the church we go to, dads here, dads a pastor, like, they understood a lot of the work that I did, because it was a part of their church as well. 33:36.633 --> 33:39.415 [SPEAKER_01]: And so there was just a lot of natural overlap in the non-profit space. 33:40.275 --> 33:41.916 [SPEAKER_01]: We have a studio for podcasting, right? 33:41.936 --> 33:44.377 [SPEAKER_01]: So they're like, they come to the studio for different stuff. 33:45.858 --> 33:50.361 [SPEAKER_01]: We try to, I really want to instill good leadership in our kids. 33:50.441 --> 33:55.344 [SPEAKER_01]: And so I will, as it's appropriate, share, hey, here's something I've had to deal with at work today. 33:55.384 --> 33:57.765 [SPEAKER_01]: Whether that's with an employee, I'll keep names out of it. 33:57.785 --> 33:59.326 [SPEAKER_01]: But like, here's a situation. 33:59.366 --> 34:00.446 [SPEAKER_01]: Here's something that I had to deal with. 34:00.466 --> 34:01.607 [SPEAKER_01]: Here's how I handled it. 34:01.807 --> 34:03.348 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, when are you sharing this? 34:03.929 --> 34:13.036 [SPEAKER_01]: It will often be either before dinner or at dinner like, hey kids, you're just going to learn today because that was actually, that was on my list and I forgot to say it, sharing it at the table. 34:13.336 --> 34:13.496 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. 34:13.516 --> 34:13.656 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. 34:13.796 --> 34:14.136 [SPEAKER_00]: There you go. 34:14.497 --> 34:17.119 [SPEAKER_00]: One of the things, we asked them to give a high and low of there. 34:17.139 --> 34:17.279 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. 34:17.379 --> 34:17.759 [SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely. 34:17.799 --> 34:18.420 [SPEAKER_00]: And I tried it. 34:18.480 --> 34:23.704 [SPEAKER_00]: I said, I'm actually pretty bad at being like, well, such and such happened at work today because like, they don't understand it. 34:23.824 --> 34:24.784 [SPEAKER_00]: And I'm like, you know what? 34:24.804 --> 34:25.005 [SPEAKER_00]: You could 34:28.207 --> 34:34.468 [SPEAKER_00]: In order to dumb down either way, it'd be like, so it's working on a transaction today where someone's trying to buy a. Yeah. 34:34.968 --> 34:36.209 [SPEAKER_00]: So that's just a factory. 34:36.249 --> 34:38.949 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, what that's actually fascinating is that. 34:39.189 --> 34:40.390 [SPEAKER_01]: That's what I try to do. 34:41.130 --> 34:50.232 [SPEAKER_01]: And then we have the privilege of like, we get to do these trips and we get to do, well, I speak, but then also I found that when we do mother-hubbertreats or father-hubbertreats, 34:51.412 --> 34:58.054 [SPEAKER_01]: It's so cool because my older kids, whether the time comes out or 17 or 14, do you can Scarlet have one boy and three girls? 34:59.295 --> 35:00.995 [SPEAKER_01]: And my kids are 17 down to eight. 35:02.456 --> 35:07.277 [SPEAKER_01]: We have this, our older two, like literally fly with us in our part of the team. 35:07.397 --> 35:08.378 [SPEAKER_01]: So let me just say this. 35:08.918 --> 35:09.338 [SPEAKER_01]: They have job. 35:09.398 --> 35:10.558 [SPEAKER_01]: You're like a princess. 35:10.978 --> 35:15.300 [SPEAKER_00]: Dude, well, you know what's so funny is, I got to watch this at the Intentional Fatherhood retreat. 35:15.880 --> 35:19.442 [SPEAKER_01]: So they can hear their dad ask, it's her masturbation question. 35:19.663 --> 35:23.605 [SPEAKER_00]: I stage when I know when I was so embarrassed. 35:23.645 --> 35:24.326 [SPEAKER_00]: That did happen. 35:24.506 --> 35:25.066 [SPEAKER_00]: That did happen. 35:25.086 --> 35:27.508 [SPEAKER_00]: What's your question about masturbation with kids? 35:27.528 --> 35:28.688 [SPEAKER_00]: My teenagers in the room. 35:28.809 --> 35:30.109 [SPEAKER_00]: That was a good thing we talked about. 35:30.129 --> 35:30.670 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I don't know. 35:30.690 --> 35:31.630 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, you were witnessing, sorry. 35:31.650 --> 35:32.911 [SPEAKER_00]: No, I just saw you. 35:33.892 --> 35:35.193 [SPEAKER_00]: Your kids were setting up the merch table. 35:35.733 --> 35:36.373 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. 35:36.393 --> 35:39.815 [SPEAKER_00]: And one, I could tell already, it was like, oh, they're going to work ethic. 35:39.835 --> 35:41.076 [SPEAKER_00]: They're like doing a job. 35:41.496 --> 35:42.136 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, they're have to. 35:42.156 --> 35:43.877 [SPEAKER_00]: They're getting a free trip soon. 35:44.057 --> 35:47.559 [SPEAKER_00]: Like I watched you give them advice, like even on folding a t-shirt. 35:47.679 --> 35:49.340 [SPEAKER_00]: And I remember you said, you know, details matter. 35:49.400 --> 35:50.120 [SPEAKER_00]: This is how you do it. 35:50.140 --> 35:50.840 [SPEAKER_00]: This is how you present. 35:50.860 --> 35:52.581 [SPEAKER_00]: And I was like, this is cool. 35:52.861 --> 35:54.962 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, because it wasn't like you weren't. 35:56.123 --> 35:58.224 [SPEAKER_00]: Or you're not doing it right as we're so often prone to do. 35:58.244 --> 35:59.545 [SPEAKER_00]: Like just correcting our kids. 36:00.165 --> 36:02.126 [SPEAKER_00]: You were showing them. 36:03.908 --> 36:20.091 [SPEAKER_00]: the best way to do a task because work is important and it ought to be done well and I just feel like they're going to have a memory of you of like, oh, not that cared about work in such a way that invited me in, not like kept me out because I'm not doing it right. 36:20.792 --> 36:23.013 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's a good way to say that dude. 36:23.573 --> 36:43.783 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, let me just just to land the plane on this thing ever since it's very kind and I would just say the thing that I love about these is we give them jobs like even they knew the motherhood retreat was coming and it's like, okay, here's a deal Scarlett, you're on merch, Duke, you're on merch, but then you're also on set up and tear down with the whole team so you don't report to me. 36:44.043 --> 36:50.456 [SPEAKER_01]: I told him, you know, reports me, you approach the chat or he's like, you've directed just like everyone else, and if he tells you to do something, do you pay them to this? 36:51.558 --> 36:54.043 [SPEAKER_01]: Most of the time no will give him like a gift card. 36:54.685 --> 36:58.847 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, so we actually, because I'm about to, I want to talk about chores after this. 36:59.247 --> 37:07.411 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, there's a level here where it's like, hey, kids, you have to understand what it costs to bring you, the whole, like you, what, what your pay is, you're not worth it. 37:08.052 --> 37:13.174 [SPEAKER_01]: No, it's that it's that at the end of the day, this is a lavish thing that you're getting to do. 37:13.194 --> 37:13.714 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, okay. 37:13.734 --> 37:14.895 [SPEAKER_01]: Now we don't force them. 37:15.295 --> 37:21.176 [SPEAKER_01]: We all, but dude, listen, we all, yes, we in our own way, whether that's like, hey, here's some money to go shopping while we're here. 37:21.216 --> 37:27.598 [SPEAKER_01]: We, we don't do it directly all the time, but organizationally, they might get a gift card, but that's just for legal purposes. 37:28.738 --> 37:33.479 [SPEAKER_00]: So we know we're not paying our kids, but it's also, I don't want them to feel like they need to get paid for everything. 37:33.539 --> 37:36.219 [SPEAKER_00]: I want them to get married at the end of the day, you think they're serving. 37:36.239 --> 37:36.799 [SPEAKER_01]: That's good. 37:36.899 --> 37:38.900 [SPEAKER_01]: Like you don't need to get money for helping people. 37:39.660 --> 37:44.425 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, so that said they have jobs and I don't let them report to me. 37:44.445 --> 37:45.426 [SPEAKER_01]: They report to our team. 37:45.567 --> 37:46.908 [SPEAKER_01]: And I'm like, I don't like that. 37:46.948 --> 37:48.349 [SPEAKER_01]: One of my supposed to be at the venue. 37:48.369 --> 37:49.210 [SPEAKER_01]: I was like, I don't know. 37:49.471 --> 37:50.131 [SPEAKER_01]: We have to ask the team. 37:50.151 --> 37:50.592 [SPEAKER_01]: That's Chad. 37:50.612 --> 37:58.040 [SPEAKER_01]: Do you mean my, my, my, my, my, my job is to lead this team and to speak into communicating. 37:58.060 --> 37:58.840 [SPEAKER_01]: Here's my jobs here. 37:58.861 --> 37:59.781 [SPEAKER_01]: And I know what my jobs are. 38:00.362 --> 38:04.385 [SPEAKER_01]: And I can help get you the answers, but it's your job to be responsive to that. 38:05.105 --> 38:06.446 [SPEAKER_01]: They don't, they don't bad at night. 38:06.486 --> 38:07.667 [SPEAKER_01]: They love being a part of it. 38:08.007 --> 38:18.034 [SPEAKER_01]: And so it's just to say, that's one way for us that they, they intimately know what we do, especially with these events because they get to be a part of them and work them. 38:18.354 --> 38:19.715 [SPEAKER_01]: And my hope, I had to stop you today. 38:19.735 --> 38:23.458 [SPEAKER_01]: My hope is that they grow up in these are such fond memories for them. 38:24.058 --> 38:31.521 [SPEAKER_01]: But I had to thought the other day, I wonder how much of what God is calling us into and letting us do stuff like this is actually for my kids and less for me. 38:32.981 --> 38:34.342 [SPEAKER_00]: And what I mean by that. 38:35.302 --> 38:40.024 [SPEAKER_01]: What I mean is, like, this is kind of the truth for all of us, but I'm thinking specifically with what I do. 38:40.064 --> 38:41.664 [SPEAKER_01]: My daughter's like an insane singer. 38:41.684 --> 38:47.747 [SPEAKER_01]: When I say that, like, we just had all passion worship lead at Motherhood Retreat and she led with them. 38:47.807 --> 38:48.427 [SPEAKER_01]: She's 14. 38:48.907 --> 38:51.428 [SPEAKER_01]: And when I say she led with them, like, she led probably half the songs. 38:51.928 --> 38:54.791 [SPEAKER_01]: not because we're like, hey, passion, will you please let our daughter sing with you? 38:55.372 --> 39:03.179 [SPEAKER_01]: But because she is sincerely that good and there's an overlap and there's a natural connection with our friends there. 39:03.940 --> 39:14.651 [SPEAKER_01]: And I was like, this girl jumped up in every way was on par with this crew of professional musicians who lead all around the world, hundreds of thousands of people. 39:15.311 --> 39:28.548 [SPEAKER_01]: And I was, I'm not, this is not a dad bragging as much as I'm thinking, I think, and I think the success of these things are about me, what if these things are actually about what God's called her to do, which is going to be way beyond what I could ever do. 39:33.815 --> 39:37.157 [SPEAKER_01]: us blessing through opportunity that's going to set her up for what he called her to do. 39:37.177 --> 39:41.158 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't was getting met up, but due to it's so it's so big. 39:41.198 --> 39:42.179 [SPEAKER_01]: It's like that for me a lot. 39:42.339 --> 39:52.023 [SPEAKER_01]: And so, mate, so when I get like overwhelmed in a good way about it, because I'm like, wow, I think it's about my success, but I wonder how much it's about what God wants to do in my kids. 39:52.043 --> 39:56.725 [SPEAKER_01]: And so, I don't know what your very vocation is, but don't be surprised if he's called you into something really rad. 39:56.865 --> 39:58.746 [SPEAKER_01]: Wow, that's actually for your kids even more than you. 40:00.422 --> 40:01.502 [SPEAKER_00]: That's a beautiful thought. 40:02.723 --> 40:05.143 [SPEAKER_01]: It's a prayer, really, it's a point. 40:05.263 --> 40:16.427 [SPEAKER_00]: I think it perfectly sets us up for our final point here as well, which is your kids need to learn to work and depending on where you are in the parenting stage. 40:18.866 --> 40:22.927 [SPEAKER_00]: You need to be both inviting them into and encourage them to work. 40:23.267 --> 40:25.928 [SPEAKER_00]: So ways this happens in our house. 40:26.108 --> 40:30.570 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, I'm just huge on chores with the kids. 40:30.590 --> 40:31.690 [SPEAKER_00]: So generally not paid for this. 40:31.710 --> 40:34.531 [SPEAKER_00]: They get a sort of allowance for being part of the household grind. 40:34.951 --> 40:40.073 [SPEAKER_00]: But it's also actually less to compensate them for the work and more to teach them how to use money. 40:40.253 --> 40:41.513 [SPEAKER_00]: That's okay. 40:42.313 --> 40:43.974 [SPEAKER_00]: We're going to give and we're going to spend it. 40:45.054 --> 40:49.156 [SPEAKER_00]: But generally, it's not like you do this chore, you get paid extra dollars. 40:50.497 --> 40:53.318 [SPEAKER_00]: Chores are just more like, you're a part of the work of the house. 40:54.459 --> 40:55.499 [SPEAKER_00]: And do they like that? 40:55.519 --> 40:56.379 [SPEAKER_00]: Of course, they don't like that. 40:57.220 --> 41:02.582 [SPEAKER_00]: It's just super important for you as a dad to be inviting them in. 41:03.863 --> 41:07.945 [SPEAKER_00]: You're commanding them in, but you're inviting them in when you say, do this with me. 41:08.825 --> 41:12.648 [SPEAKER_00]: So, a ton of the ways that Lauren has chores for them around the house. 41:12.968 --> 41:16.470 [SPEAKER_00]: Things they have to do after they get home from school before they're allowed to go play. 41:16.490 --> 41:17.930 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, check the boxes. 41:17.970 --> 41:21.693 [SPEAKER_00]: For me, more when I'm home, it's like cleaning the kitchen after dinner. 41:22.693 --> 41:25.815 [SPEAKER_00]: And I'm like, you know, you have to help me do this. 41:26.635 --> 41:27.296 [SPEAKER_00]: We're all doing it. 41:27.316 --> 41:28.516 [SPEAKER_00]: We call it kitchen protocol now. 41:28.536 --> 41:29.577 [SPEAKER_01]: But you didn't do it last night. 41:29.617 --> 41:30.918 [SPEAKER_01]: I was seeing you try to fix the dishwasher. 41:30.938 --> 41:32.258 [SPEAKER_01]: You were not following through in your job. 41:32.399 --> 41:32.999 [SPEAKER_00]: No, no. 41:33.159 --> 41:35.180 [SPEAKER_00]: We were, you last night was for the boys. 41:35.200 --> 41:36.041 [SPEAKER_00]: We went out and hung out. 41:37.401 --> 41:37.862 [SPEAKER_01]: And guess what? 41:37.882 --> 41:39.042 [SPEAKER_01]: We woke up with a ton of dishes. 41:39.102 --> 41:39.662 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, it's good to say. 41:39.682 --> 41:40.563 [SPEAKER_01]: It's probably more than what we call it. 41:40.583 --> 41:41.903 [SPEAKER_00]: Noron was hanging out with her book club. 41:41.944 --> 41:42.804 [SPEAKER_00]: I was hanging out with the boys. 41:42.964 --> 41:43.764 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, it's pretty. 41:43.844 --> 41:45.065 [SPEAKER_00]: Anyway, sometimes that happens. 41:45.125 --> 41:50.988 [SPEAKER_00]: But generally, my point is, it's a rhythm of expectation that our kids are going to work alongside us. 41:52.048 --> 41:54.550 [SPEAKER_00]: And so much good relationship is taught there. 41:54.610 --> 41:56.991 [SPEAKER_00]: I would just say two or three really brief things. 41:57.731 --> 42:00.592 [SPEAKER_00]: A wise, older parent wants to tell me if you do it alone, you'll always do it alone. 42:03.074 --> 42:04.194 [SPEAKER_00]: Kids at first don't help. 42:04.454 --> 42:05.695 [SPEAKER_00]: They hurt the process. 42:06.596 --> 42:14.523 [SPEAKER_00]: But if you don't invite them in and teach them how to load the dishwasher, or teach them how to build a bookshelf, or teach them how to cut the lawn, you'll always do it alone, who's gonna teach them? 42:14.903 --> 42:15.944 [SPEAKER_00]: They need to learn these things. 42:16.865 --> 42:17.646 [SPEAKER_01]: And it's good. 42:17.666 --> 42:18.086 [SPEAKER_00]: Guess what? 42:18.126 --> 42:19.707 [SPEAKER_00]: It's incredible bonding time with you. 42:20.068 --> 42:23.831 [SPEAKER_00]: If you do it in a way that's not like, oh, are you doing it wrong? 42:23.991 --> 42:24.732 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, you're slowing it down. 42:24.752 --> 42:25.593 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, are you messing it up? 42:25.973 --> 42:27.154 [SPEAKER_00]: But rather be like, oh, no. 42:27.214 --> 42:31.658 [SPEAKER_00]: So if you do it like this, it's the best way or like think about doing, you know, you're teaching them. 42:32.478 --> 42:35.399 [SPEAKER_00]: Um, my kids know, my older two, they know how to cut the grass now. 42:35.479 --> 42:38.141 [SPEAKER_00]: They're, you know, 12 and 14 and it's great. 42:38.461 --> 42:41.822 [SPEAKER_00]: One, because I don't have to do it as much as, almost never now they do it. 42:42.502 --> 42:46.764 [SPEAKER_00]: But two, I want them to make their wives feel like a queen. 42:46.964 --> 42:48.545 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, they need to know how to cut the grass. 42:48.565 --> 42:51.606 [SPEAKER_00]: They need to know how to patch dry while they know how to hang a ceiling fan. 42:51.626 --> 42:52.906 [SPEAKER_00]: Just, you know, stuff. 42:52.926 --> 42:53.727 [SPEAKER_00]: So invite them in. 42:54.807 --> 43:04.390 [SPEAKER_00]: But most importantly, then they realize that being a good worker around the household is the way that you help with the economy of love. 43:04.930 --> 43:06.691 [SPEAKER_00]: You can't do hospitality without shared work. 43:07.031 --> 43:07.711 [SPEAKER_01]: That's so good. 43:07.991 --> 43:10.912 [SPEAKER_00]: And if they don't know how to participate in the work of the house, they don't know how to do hospitality. 43:10.952 --> 43:13.493 [SPEAKER_00]: So they're missing the grand feature of the Christian life, which is 43:14.493 --> 43:18.755 [SPEAKER_00]: Keep a beautiful and well-functioning home to invite people into. 43:19.655 --> 43:22.656 [SPEAKER_00]: Even my young wild sons need to learn that. 43:23.117 --> 43:24.797 [SPEAKER_00]: This is not a big time. 43:24.837 --> 43:26.998 [SPEAKER_00]: Feminine domestic stuff exclusively. 43:27.038 --> 43:28.359 [SPEAKER_00]: This is masculine. 43:28.539 --> 43:29.819 [SPEAKER_00]: How do you keep a household? 43:29.899 --> 43:31.040 [SPEAKER_00]: How do you do the work of it? 43:31.500 --> 43:32.580 [SPEAKER_00]: Have pride in your work? 43:32.780 --> 43:33.661 [SPEAKER_00]: Have pride in your house? 43:34.341 --> 43:36.242 [SPEAKER_00]: If you're not doing chores with your kids. 43:36.842 --> 43:37.883 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, they don't know how to do that. 43:38.403 --> 43:40.584 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, it's kids learn how to work at home. 43:41.024 --> 43:46.867 [SPEAKER_01]: And so, if we're talking about work and all of that, they learn what hard work is at home, I think I'll just to be brief, very brief. 43:46.967 --> 43:48.848 [SPEAKER_01]: We use a skylight calendar if you've heard of these before. 43:48.868 --> 43:49.889 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I've had people working with that. 43:49.929 --> 43:53.711 [SPEAKER_01]: We don't use it, but I don't know for our younger kids, it's great. 43:53.931 --> 43:54.911 [SPEAKER_01]: For older kids, you're like, what? 43:55.272 --> 43:57.473 [SPEAKER_01]: But younger kids, they love looking at their list. 43:58.193 --> 44:26.542 [SPEAKER_01]: They check it off the morning that they have their list they go through and yeah, it's a huge part like your kids need to know how to do their own laundry and clean a bathroom well, not just like I sprayed the stuff we need to teach your boys not to peel over a toilet seat and if they do wipe it up now you can so long dude do that while they have one you have four like I mean even with my one right now he sees as well, but I'm just like, bro, room and don't pee on the seat, please don't do that and FY if you do just clean it up. 44:26.782 --> 44:34.909 [SPEAKER_00]: But whenever they see me cheering for them, trimming my beard or shaving, yes, I always say hey dudes, a man is responsible for all those whiskers. 44:35.450 --> 44:36.891 [SPEAKER_00]: He's responsible for his trimming. 44:36.951 --> 44:37.432 [SPEAKER_00]: Don't you? 44:37.892 --> 44:40.194 [SPEAKER_01]: Don't you hear beard and lead that crap everywhere? 44:40.534 --> 44:43.297 [SPEAKER_00]: I did that in college and as a young adult. 44:44.598 --> 44:46.619 [SPEAKER_00]: Mike, the guys I was living with are like, dude, what are you doing? 44:46.639 --> 44:47.960 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, clean up your stuff. 44:47.980 --> 44:48.941 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, they said that. 44:49.101 --> 44:50.722 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, dude, it's so real. 44:50.782 --> 45:04.451 [SPEAKER_01]: And it's just to say like, so just to land the plane here, I think that as we talk about family, as we talk about work and presence and, you know, this idea of work and family and your work, these aren't opposed to one another. 45:04.872 --> 45:06.393 [SPEAKER_01]: They are intertwined. 45:07.093 --> 45:11.559 [SPEAKER_01]: The real job is when you get home from work and it's to pour into your kids and your wife. 45:12.080 --> 45:18.489 [SPEAKER_01]: The time, the days are long, the years are short as said, you will never be bummed about that investment. 45:18.889 --> 45:23.396 [SPEAKER_01]: If you're overwhelmed and tired, that is the cost of admission for fatherhood, that's what it costs. 45:24.476 --> 45:29.158 [SPEAKER_01]: find rhythms and outlets to enjoy to be refreshed, Sabbath these things that we've already talked about. 45:29.218 --> 45:32.159 [SPEAKER_01]: But take these five things and where you can apply them. 45:32.579 --> 45:37.061 [SPEAKER_01]: And note like there's going to be a lot of things that's going to come up for you as you're hearing this like, well, what about this drawing? 45:37.081 --> 45:39.641 [SPEAKER_00]: That's what like, I suspect we're going to get the most questions on this episode. 45:39.661 --> 45:40.922 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and the men, it's cool. 45:40.942 --> 45:43.783 [SPEAKER_01]: It's cinnamon and it's really just to say like, 45:44.263 --> 45:46.283 [SPEAKER_01]: There's not all right way to do this. 45:46.804 --> 45:48.744 [SPEAKER_01]: There's not on answer and we're not going to lie to you. 45:48.764 --> 45:55.986 [SPEAKER_01]: Like you got to take this stuff and now overlay your actual life and your spouse and your kids and in your situation stage life. 45:56.006 --> 45:59.486 [SPEAKER_01]: So it's not straightforward and it's also not that complex. 45:59.646 --> 46:02.447 [SPEAKER_01]: So we want to encourage you to do it next week. 46:03.167 --> 46:04.107 [SPEAKER_01]: Another fun episode. 46:04.147 --> 46:04.848 [SPEAKER_01]: We got good one. 46:04.908 --> 46:08.268 [SPEAKER_01]: We, we're going to, let's forecast, let's forecast. 46:08.528 --> 46:09.149 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's forecast. 46:09.489 --> 46:10.749 [SPEAKER_00]: We got two more coming for you. 46:11.149 --> 46:27.268 [SPEAKER_00]: What we got to work with not we're not doing just a normal in season we're no or we because we got two more important topics to cover we need to talk about the value of Being an amateur working for the love side projects hobbies things that are not your central vocation but you love doing. 46:27.468 --> 46:39.397 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, and then that'll be episode 9 episode 10 our last one look forward to it will be on Legacy the legacy of your work leaving a legacy But y'all have to wait on the week or two for that. 46:39.557 --> 46:45.361 [SPEAKER_01]: I might my hobby is obviously bodybuilding so let's just talk about that Okay, see next week y'all