WEBVTT 00:08.680 --> 00:14.785 [SPEAKER_01]: Welcome back to feeding them out the bite you, a weekly podcast guide on parenting teams and launching them into the world. 00:15.326 --> 00:20.490 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm Cynthia Gannonff, and as always, I'm joined by psychologists and author, Dr. Ken Wilgus. 00:21.271 --> 00:22.752 [SPEAKER_01]: Hey, Dr. Ken, welcome. 00:22.932 --> 00:24.474 [SPEAKER_01]: I always like it when I say, welcome to your show. 00:24.514 --> 00:25.515 [SPEAKER_01]: It makes me laugh every day. 00:25.535 --> 00:29.358 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, you are the host, and I'm the very consistent guest. 00:29.538 --> 00:31.940 [SPEAKER_01]: So, you're the, I thought you were going to say you're the talent. 00:32.020 --> 00:34.722 [SPEAKER_00]: And I was like, well, I, I true, I was back up. 00:34.743 --> 00:35.463 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's do it that way. 00:35.483 --> 00:36.104 [SPEAKER_00]: I like that better. 00:36.664 --> 01:02.174 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm the host and he's the talent and here we are well listen we are headed into well we're into summer but we're headed into the middle of summer and so we're going to let everybody know that we are going to take July off and I we're going to take some RNR and by RNR I've got all my kids home so there's that but I hear that you're a manny this summer you know what that is a male manny right I do now 01:03.094 --> 01:06.535 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, it's just we're old opairs, maybe. 01:08.116 --> 01:19.719 [SPEAKER_00]: My wife and I are going to be over in Europe because our youngest has her baby is there while she's doing research and so it'll be exotic babysitting. 01:20.299 --> 01:23.060 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, well, hey, if you're going to babysit why not babysit in Europe? 01:23.140 --> 01:28.182 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not sure if you've always said and I'm learning how to say it in Spanish. 01:29.674 --> 01:30.715 [SPEAKER_01]: even better, even better. 01:31.075 --> 01:40.363 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, yes, so we are going to, in July, we are going to put up some shows that we're very popular, shows that answer questions that we get all the time. 01:40.924 --> 01:45.908 [SPEAKER_01]: And so you can check in for those, but we recognize that that's content. 01:45.928 --> 01:47.690 [SPEAKER_01]: Some of you may have heard before, some of you haven't. 01:48.130 --> 01:49.772 [SPEAKER_01]: We will be back in August. 01:49.852 --> 01:53.635 [SPEAKER_01]: I nearly said we're gonna be back in better than ever, but let's keep expectations. 01:53.655 --> 01:54.616 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's be realistic. 01:54.696 --> 01:55.357 [SPEAKER_00]: Be realistic. 01:55.904 --> 01:56.164 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay. 01:56.665 --> 02:00.127 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, this week we get to talk about the kids are back. 02:00.668 --> 02:02.629 [SPEAKER_01]: They're back, the college kids. 02:02.990 --> 02:06.452 [SPEAKER_01]: And maybe that's not everybody has a college kid coming back. 02:06.513 --> 02:11.296 [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe sometimes you've had a young adult that's moved out and they've needed to come back for whatever reason. 02:11.857 --> 02:17.862 [SPEAKER_01]: But when they leave, you know, they always say they soil the nest, especially the boys before they leave. 02:18.482 --> 02:39.936 [SPEAKER_01]: And I felt like that was senior year with my son like when he left like he didn't soil it like he tried to burn the place down just like just grumpy and grouchy and I'll I know everything and you guys know nothing and then he came back I mean the first couple of breaks so pleasant and so enjoyable again I'm like oh the kid I know but it's summer 02:40.336 --> 02:53.244 [SPEAKER_01]: And they're back, and they've lived a year if they're freshmen, and if they're older, a couple of years, like they've lived their own life, and they've managed their money, as poorly as that might be, and they've done all the things, and then they're back in our house. 02:53.845 --> 02:59.628 [SPEAKER_01]: And what's the biggest mistake as parents we can make the first couple of weeks that they walk in the door? 03:01.169 --> 03:03.771 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, okay, that's, I didn't see that coming. 03:04.291 --> 03:04.832 [SPEAKER_00]: I think, 03:06.409 --> 03:34.118 [SPEAKER_00]: I think the reason we're recording this is the biggest mistake is that you do not address what is the what's the setup here this summer Basically on what basis are you here at home and what do we need from you and what is it you're expecting from us because you know and you so it's funny I'm 67 so I sit just Sunday I was with a whole bunch of other 03:35.138 --> 03:40.110 [SPEAKER_00]: let's just say older people and and I asked them as I do as a shrink at points. 03:40.170 --> 03:44.600 [SPEAKER_00]: I said, after high school, did any of you want to stay at home? 03:45.592 --> 04:07.163 [SPEAKER_00]: and they all said the same thing every one of them it's it's not no it's new of course not I don't want to be there this creates a problem because I'm telling you there are many parents listening who have actually established a home where there are teenagers even after high school just love being at home and that's a mixed bag 04:07.983 --> 04:33.021 [SPEAKER_00]: because again how could possibly what's wrong with that in that great well the problem is that it's your home and they are supposed to be in the process years long but of preparing for their own home and it can actually interfere with that so it's a good idea to avoid the i guess impulse to just almost act like oh 04:33.621 --> 05:01.808 [SPEAKER_00]: good that last nine months of you being on your own that's all over with let's just come back and make cookies and be all kind of warm and fuzzy it either it doesn't go well like with your son like it's supposed to not go well or even worse it does go well and then they're not really moving on so I think your first step is to talk very maturely about hey this is going to be great 05:03.720 --> 05:09.924 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's talk about what we're going to need from you if you live here, and we want to know from you what you need from us. 05:10.504 --> 05:13.186 [SPEAKER_00]: For some parents, that's going to feel like a real downer. 05:13.306 --> 05:17.288 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, well, I don't want to, shouldn't we let them know they're always loved and welcome here? 05:17.629 --> 05:24.153 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, until kindergarten, and then after that, the expectations change, and you need to be realistic. 05:24.193 --> 05:25.713 [SPEAKER_00]: You're adults talking to adults. 05:26.534 --> 05:29.556 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, so let's do a little rapid fire here, curfew. 05:31.333 --> 05:36.038 [SPEAKER_00]: No, no, you'd stopped curfew the day after high school. 05:38.099 --> 05:39.601 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to give you a minute to reconsider. 05:40.851 --> 05:41.971 [SPEAKER_00]: Hey, here's the thing. 05:42.131 --> 05:48.073 [SPEAKER_00]: I know what you're probably thinking about, but we don't get to sleep until she's home. 05:48.133 --> 05:49.294 [SPEAKER_01]: What we're thinking about. 05:49.414 --> 05:50.194 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay. 05:50.314 --> 05:51.154 [SPEAKER_00]: Here's my favorite. 05:51.535 --> 05:57.116 [SPEAKER_00]: You slept like a baby when she was 400 miles away or whatever. 05:57.577 --> 06:01.498 [SPEAKER_00]: You mean I can't sleep when I think that this kid is on my watch. 06:02.653 --> 06:24.462 [SPEAKER_00]: that is condescending your kid is not on your watch you're not responsible no one in the world is going to say wait a minute your kid had a car accident at 10 p.m. where were you no one only you is going to say that so only you is going to say anyway you would be the only one so so things like that the other thing is any basically if they're 06:25.182 --> 06:35.077 [SPEAKER_00]: curfew if you have needs in your house like it wakes us up when they come in all that that's not the same thing as a curfew it's saying things like if you can't get here 06:36.943 --> 06:53.073 [SPEAKER_00]: before 11, then please text us and find somewhere else because we don't want to weigh it way up so that you're protecting your boundaries, but no, no curfew that especially especially this happens not infrequently. 06:53.473 --> 07:04.539 [SPEAKER_00]: Your kid might have just spent the last month in a life that says, hey, you decide for yourself when you come in at night and now I'm going to go home and roll back six years and now I'm 07:06.340 --> 07:18.290 [SPEAKER_00]: They're I have to answer to my parents feels like you had a pin in on that one did we want Yeah, I didn't even get into the deal of what your mother and I let each other know When don't even go there don't it's all in the book. 07:18.390 --> 07:19.171 [SPEAKER_00]: So no. 07:19.191 --> 07:19.371 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay. 07:19.451 --> 07:19.651 [SPEAKER_01]: Great. 07:20.191 --> 07:22.934 [SPEAKER_01]: What about need they need to tell me where they're headed? 07:24.575 --> 07:26.336 [SPEAKER_00]: No, I don't think so. 07:26.597 --> 07:26.857 [SPEAKER_00]: Why? 07:28.170 --> 07:30.071 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, bad things happen. 07:30.431 --> 07:31.432 [SPEAKER_00]: I like when we argue. 07:31.772 --> 07:33.512 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, bad things happen. 07:33.533 --> 07:37.234 [SPEAKER_00]: You mean you need someone with good judgment to review where I'm going? 07:37.895 --> 07:39.155 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm the one with good judgment. 07:39.255 --> 07:40.076 [SPEAKER_00]: Thanks, mom. 07:40.876 --> 07:42.056 [SPEAKER_01]: Fine. 07:42.157 --> 07:43.757 [SPEAKER_01]: What about, oh, this is a good one. 07:43.797 --> 07:45.458 [SPEAKER_01]: What about the tracking apps? 07:45.518 --> 07:47.259 [SPEAKER_01]: The life 360, all those. 07:47.878 --> 07:53.102 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, that's funny because that comes up not infrequently that we never talked about it. 07:53.702 --> 07:59.286 [SPEAKER_00]: My kid never talked about it and we just sort of hoped that no one would say anything and all this stuff. 07:59.866 --> 08:02.588 [SPEAKER_00]: I think, as you can tell, I think you should say something. 08:03.048 --> 08:13.495 [SPEAKER_00]: After high school, here's the thing, you really do want to let them, if you want to see what's going on, then prove yourself non, and not controlling. 08:14.035 --> 08:16.237 [SPEAKER_00]: I have all my kids locations. 08:17.858 --> 08:18.858 [SPEAKER_00]: and they're fine with it. 08:19.279 --> 08:23.001 [SPEAKER_00]: But a big part of it is because we've worked hard, they're older now. 08:23.502 --> 08:31.567 [SPEAKER_00]: But we worked hard to demonstrate to them, we like to know what's going on with all of us, but you do not have to. 08:31.848 --> 08:32.808 [SPEAKER_00]: That's the whole point. 08:32.828 --> 08:35.170 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, chores. 08:36.532 --> 08:39.653 [SPEAKER_00]: All right, that's a great put, I wouldn't call it chores. 08:39.993 --> 08:56.616 [SPEAKER_00]: I think what often comes up is, it can seem, I don't know, almost both parent and kid can contribute to where your kid is actually a much better guest at anybody else's house but yours. 08:56.896 --> 09:00.837 [SPEAKER_00]: And so you often need to talk about, um, 09:01.857 --> 09:29.847 [SPEAKER_00]: will just expect you to be a good guest here and so like helping with dishes and stuff and I would start the summer by saying uh we certainly expect that we won't have to you know outline this like we assume your old enough to know how to help out and then not if but when they don't then that's not a time to sit down and go okay you're gonna be grounded if you don't it's a time to sit down and go okay it's been three weeks 09:30.627 --> 09:39.330 [SPEAKER_00]: And I don't know you noticed, but you haven't helped with, you know, dishes at all, even when I know you're not here a bunch, but when you are, you don't help. 09:40.128 --> 09:44.589 [SPEAKER_00]: And buddy, we need you to pull your weight, you're not six anymore. 09:45.010 --> 10:07.777 [SPEAKER_00]: So it usually might require four or five serious discussions, but I cannot ever imagine that you pull back out some sort of restriction list because nothing says that you're not growing up here at this house then handing out fines for not loading the dishwasher just like when you're in junior high. 10:08.283 --> 10:08.463 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. 10:08.924 --> 10:11.127 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, more specifically, clean your room. 10:12.850 --> 10:13.110 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay. 10:13.631 --> 10:16.114 [SPEAKER_00]: What is Dr. Wilkes going to say about that? 10:18.838 --> 10:23.485 [SPEAKER_01]: If there's ants and other things that they pay for the exterminator, otherwise, let it go. 10:24.763 --> 10:34.967 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, okay, I will add an addendum to that, and that is that more than ever the room that they used to live in is not their room, really not their room. 10:34.987 --> 10:44.830 [SPEAKER_00]: This isn't their house, and again, that will actually jolt some parents, like, well, we want them to feel welcome here, of course, but you want them to feel welcome in your house. 10:45.350 --> 10:50.972 [SPEAKER_00]: So ironically, in that case, I definitely wouldn't go back to any kind of cleanliness 10:53.322 --> 10:54.162 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, that's a good one. 10:54.662 --> 11:09.066 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yeah, it's, I'm sorry, even said that, but at the same time, yeah, I would definitely talk to your teenager about, hey, listen, you don't have to, but we don't like the way your room is. 11:09.546 --> 11:19.869 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, this whole last semester when you were gone, you know, we could use this room for guests and stuff, and we're fine with you being here, but you're keeping this this dirty as you did when you were a junior in high school. 11:20.872 --> 11:24.395 [SPEAKER_00]: And you know, you need to get, you're too old for this. 11:24.736 --> 11:26.117 [SPEAKER_00]: I wouldn't have really hard discussions. 11:26.738 --> 11:31.942 [SPEAKER_00]: And by the way, all of this leads to worst case is not. 11:32.463 --> 11:33.424 [SPEAKER_00]: We're now grounding it. 11:33.484 --> 11:38.629 [SPEAKER_00]: Worst case is next summer, we think you should probably find somewhere else to stay. 11:39.327 --> 11:50.834 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and everyone shocked freaks out, but these are adult kids if they can't get take seriously, and most of them will do better at anyone else's house, but not yours. 11:51.555 --> 11:51.895 [SPEAKER_01]: Truly. 11:52.515 --> 11:56.838 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, family dinner family vacation. 11:58.499 --> 12:02.502 [SPEAKER_01]: Let's talk about those and then we're going to follow it up with church attendance. 12:02.562 --> 12:05.384 [SPEAKER_01]: But start with the family dinner, the family game night, 12:10.851 --> 12:15.874 [SPEAKER_00]: If you aren't sure the answer to that, then you haven't been paying attention. 12:15.894 --> 12:17.355 [SPEAKER_00]: You do not require a adult. 12:17.375 --> 12:17.616 [SPEAKER_00]: Think of it. 12:17.636 --> 12:17.816 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay. 12:17.836 --> 12:19.337 [SPEAKER_00]: You do not require adults in your house to do these things. 12:19.357 --> 12:19.837 [SPEAKER_00]: Think of it this way. 12:19.857 --> 12:20.238 [SPEAKER_00]: It's not your kid. 12:20.378 --> 12:27.543 [SPEAKER_00]: It's your, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh 12:27.738 --> 12:30.079 [SPEAKER_00]: it's a cousin, it's the kid of your cousin. 12:30.800 --> 12:39.104 [SPEAKER_00]: So we're connected, but it's not my child, and I'm not obligated in any sense of how I raised it, but they're staying this summer. 12:39.945 --> 12:48.830 [SPEAKER_00]: You would never say, okay, we have family time every Friday and we expect you to be too, to the cousin, but you might, 12:51.331 --> 12:58.513 [SPEAKER_00]: certainly offer and invite and definitely take stock of the same thing with the vacation. 12:58.673 --> 13:05.434 [SPEAKER_00]: Frankly, if you're going to do a big vacation, especially if you're putting out money, I think it's actually the reverse. 13:05.474 --> 13:08.035 [SPEAKER_00]: I would put it into, hey, we're wanting to do this. 13:09.095 --> 13:15.956 [SPEAKER_00]: Talk to us about, are you going to, do we even want you to go like, because we're not necessarily paying for you? 13:16.316 --> 13:19.057 [SPEAKER_00]: These are all ways of describing 13:20.307 --> 13:23.249 [SPEAKER_00]: that this is not situation as usual. 13:24.290 --> 13:26.612 [SPEAKER_00]: This is now you as an adult staying with us. 13:27.172 --> 13:34.878 [SPEAKER_00]: And yeah, you need definitely be prepared for it may not be good for them, especially if they need to be working, which they need to be doing. 13:36.240 --> 14:02.159 [SPEAKER_00]: didn't they may not be able to go on your fancy vacation uh... and probably shouldn't uh... again how terrible is that well you go with your children this one's no longer a child so you go with other kids that's that's perfectly fine and can you feel that i think i can hear the hearts the heart's breaking is we're talking they are they are we're all we're starting a different podcast um... i'll be hosting that one too where we we just baby m until they're thirty it's 14:03.199 --> 14:05.740 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, what about I think you answer the question on church. 14:05.760 --> 14:09.102 [SPEAKER_01]: You're not going to make your, you know, cousins kid get a church or whatever with you. 14:09.422 --> 14:17.745 [SPEAKER_01]: But let's talk about when when they come home and they've just changed like politically, spiritually, socially, relationally like it suddenly looks different. 14:17.825 --> 14:20.026 [SPEAKER_01]: And we've talked about politics before on here. 14:20.526 --> 14:24.848 [SPEAKER_01]: But that's a hot button in the house when the kid comes home with a different view. 14:25.308 --> 14:29.390 [SPEAKER_01]: I remember I took an economics class and college and I came home and I let them know. 14:29.410 --> 14:31.931 [SPEAKER_01]: It was okay that our country had debt. 14:32.031 --> 14:45.337 [SPEAKER_01]: I went through everything at 19 and I let my parents know and I remember my parents just listening and you know, they had opinions that didn't necessarily match up with mine and they listened and we just all kind of moved on and but it is one of those things. 14:45.357 --> 14:48.379 [SPEAKER_01]: You get a little bit of knowledge and suddenly you're a little scary. 14:48.779 --> 14:50.580 [SPEAKER_01]: What do we do when we're not lining up? 14:50.680 --> 14:53.041 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, do we still have a right to speak into that? 14:53.081 --> 14:54.302 [SPEAKER_01]: So you need to rethink that? 14:54.682 --> 14:57.143 [SPEAKER_01]: Do we need to just smile and listen? 14:57.243 --> 15:00.525 [SPEAKER_01]: Do we need to say it's fine that you think that way spiritually? 15:00.565 --> 15:03.426 [SPEAKER_01]: But we're not, we don't want, you're not talking to your siblings about that? 15:03.506 --> 15:04.587 [SPEAKER_01]: Or how do we do that? 15:05.027 --> 15:14.852 [SPEAKER_00]: I think those are very important discussions that really set the tone for the relationship you'll have with this adult, the rest of your life, your life. 15:15.753 --> 15:22.857 [SPEAKER_00]: And so the ability to be able to be really light-hearted about where we seriously disagree. 15:23.557 --> 15:33.920 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, there's no more effective way of really giving the message we see that you are on the same level that we are. 15:34.701 --> 15:50.566 [SPEAKER_00]: So that you can say things, well, you know, here's my take on it and I'm sure Al Jazeera boy who will have a different view as he always seems to, you know, and just chuckle about it, or even, hey, we're thinking about going to that restaurant after church tomorrow and I'm sure 15:51.412 --> 15:54.134 [SPEAKER_00]: Joe atheist here, you don't want to go, is that correct? 15:54.394 --> 16:00.078 [SPEAKER_00]: Like ways that signal, we don't agree, but I still care about you. 16:00.118 --> 16:03.641 [SPEAKER_00]: This is, you know, it is okay that you do not see it the same way I do. 16:04.261 --> 16:12.107 [SPEAKER_00]: And particularly faith, because the Christian parents listening, I've got to remind you, our faith is not an ideology. 16:12.227 --> 16:13.168 [SPEAKER_00]: It is not like 16:13.788 --> 16:16.949 [SPEAKER_00]: We taught him to be a capitalist and he came home socialists. 16:17.329 --> 16:37.794 [SPEAKER_00]: We believe that there is a spirit involved and the spirit calls one to faith and so this idea of turning everything into an argument about the Bible or whatever is no better way to make the faith seem unreal and it's all about what my parents think than to do that. 16:37.874 --> 16:41.695 [SPEAKER_00]: So I think it's a huge deal for parents to practice 16:42.495 --> 17:01.838 [SPEAKER_00]: really challenging each other if you're still married about hey you know that you came across like a jerk yesterday you really pushed on that you know like you know she's doesn't think that's funny when you do that and we've had those conversations I've talked to you many times about how I am very funny and the audience here is 17:02.759 --> 17:27.245 [SPEAKER_00]: not good sometimes they just it's a tough crowd in my house so you need to be cautious about that all of that is like I say though an excellent way to signal we love you as the adult person that you are and the choices that you make we may not agree with we might even grieve over them but of course you're welcome here and we want to hear what you think about things. 17:27.803 --> 17:28.023 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. 17:28.463 --> 17:38.310 [SPEAKER_01]: What about things that like, let's say, let's say the 21 and they want to have alcohol in the house and you don't have alcohol because or you have high schoolers or other kids that you don't really want that in front of them. 17:38.650 --> 17:42.633 [SPEAKER_01]: We've talked a little bit about this before, but there's the vaping, you know, that situation. 17:42.673 --> 17:42.873 [SPEAKER_01]: Right. 17:43.873 --> 17:47.054 [SPEAKER_01]: Those ones that, or maybe they want their significant others to spend the night. 17:47.595 --> 17:51.296 [SPEAKER_01]: Some of these things that you're like, listen, that's just, it's not what we do. 17:51.376 --> 17:59.499 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, is the position, this is our house and yes, you're an adult and you can make your own decisions, I guess, although we don't agree with them, but you're not doing it in our house. 18:00.186 --> 18:04.789 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I would say that's the only way you can describe what that position is. 18:05.330 --> 18:06.991 [SPEAKER_00]: And that's a very weak position. 18:07.531 --> 18:12.595 [SPEAKER_00]: So for example, it makes a lot of difference if you have younger siblings there. 18:13.576 --> 18:20.541 [SPEAKER_00]: And so we have not, we don't have alcohol at home, and we don't want you to drink here because of younger siblings. 18:21.201 --> 18:27.745 [SPEAKER_00]: But if you don't have younger siblings, then you get into really two things. 18:27.765 --> 18:31.547 [SPEAKER_00]: Number one, wow, my parents are so sensitive about their decision. 18:32.147 --> 18:36.349 [SPEAKER_00]: Like I say, without call, that they can't even stomach it being in their house. 18:37.390 --> 18:38.951 [SPEAKER_00]: That's not a great look. 18:39.531 --> 18:42.873 [SPEAKER_00]: And the other is, my parents are like little... 18:43.793 --> 18:50.436 [SPEAKER_00]: prints and princes that they own their little kingdom of their home, and they have rules of what you can't do. 18:50.757 --> 18:52.558 [SPEAKER_00]: Just pick carefully on those things. 18:52.618 --> 18:56.259 [SPEAKER_00]: If it's not going to do harm to anyone, that'd be the same thing. 18:56.299 --> 18:56.580 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. 18:56.720 --> 19:02.583 [SPEAKER_00]: I definitely think about that for Christian parents that he really wants his girlfriend there. 19:03.043 --> 19:13.048 [SPEAKER_00]: It's something to think about, that without younger siblings, what are we gaining by establishing that we don't believe that, but you can't do it either. 19:13.548 --> 19:17.592 [SPEAKER_00]: it's not that you should never do that, but I would be very cautious with that. 19:17.932 --> 19:19.714 [SPEAKER_00]: You're certainly not teaching. 19:21.435 --> 19:30.704 [SPEAKER_00]: They learn, you know, you're never going to have an adult say, well, I really learned the Bible is true because my parents wouldn't let my living girlfriend stay in the same bed. 19:30.724 --> 19:32.466 [SPEAKER_00]: That really struck me. 19:32.546 --> 19:33.687 [SPEAKER_00]: That's not what happens. 19:33.727 --> 19:35.168 [SPEAKER_00]: It's not influential like that. 19:37.868 --> 19:43.289 [SPEAKER_01]: Let's, I've already heard parents, my friends who have college kids home complaining about this. 19:43.390 --> 19:54.092 [SPEAKER_01]: Their kids have jobs, but maybe they're, you know, afternoon jobs or evenings, whatever, and they stay at half the night when they get home and then they sleep until 11 and all the things, sleeping patterns. 19:54.553 --> 19:59.754 [SPEAKER_01]: Is it any of our business as long as they're doing what's expected, job-wise or otherwise? 20:00.025 --> 20:11.946 [SPEAKER_00]: listen on all of these things just look at it this way do you want to have input on that you know like all of us that are older people know that feeling of you know you've got that kid that's 20:13.112 --> 20:22.661 [SPEAKER_00]: after high school upstairs, it's 2 p.m. what in the world is he doing, line a bed, yes, but do you want to be effective in that? 20:23.242 --> 20:27.966 [SPEAKER_00]: Then number one, don't make a rule about it because that's just silly. 20:28.487 --> 20:34.433 [SPEAKER_00]: And number two, don't just kind of start sniping and saying stuff, be clear about it, that 20:35.654 --> 20:53.691 [SPEAKER_00]: Have you ever thought about, you know, you've seen kind of unhappy, you're not connected, you're doing, you're going to work, but you ever think your schedule is affecting you, and really using that kind of communication to talk to them about it, including it's perfectly fair to add. 20:54.781 --> 21:06.464 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, I'm not telling you you can't do this, but I just get so annoyed when you're up there, I'm telling you, it just bugs the heck out of me because it looks no offense, but it looks like a lazy person. 21:06.965 --> 21:14.707 [SPEAKER_00]: That's fine, it's all communicating, but when it comes down to this false idea, well, I'm not sure if I'm gonna let them do that. 21:15.027 --> 21:17.648 [SPEAKER_00]: You don't have the power to not let them do that. 21:18.028 --> 21:20.209 [SPEAKER_00]: You're gonna have the power to have a miserable summer, 21:21.769 --> 21:26.574 [SPEAKER_00]: or you have the power to say, you know, I just can't stand that you can't stay here if you're going to keep doing that. 21:26.855 --> 21:27.916 [SPEAKER_00]: That's your real power. 21:28.537 --> 21:30.579 [SPEAKER_00]: But is that something you really want to pull the trigger on? 21:30.599 --> 21:31.099 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know. 21:31.119 --> 21:31.820 [SPEAKER_00]: That's up to you. 21:32.481 --> 21:32.701 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. 21:33.442 --> 21:33.722 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay. 21:33.982 --> 21:38.547 [SPEAKER_01]: What about the student that had a bad semester or maybe two bad semesters? 21:38.728 --> 21:42.151 [SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, they're back home this summer and that you're 21:43.043 --> 21:43.904 [SPEAKER_01]: You got to get it together. 21:44.024 --> 21:45.245 [SPEAKER_01]: We're going to talk about your grades. 21:45.285 --> 21:47.227 [SPEAKER_01]: We're going to hone in on some things. 21:47.247 --> 21:52.512 [SPEAKER_01]: We're going to like we've got you in our house in his time with a week series. 21:52.532 --> 21:52.952 [SPEAKER_00]: That's true. 21:54.316 --> 21:56.278 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, well, what do we get about that? 21:56.699 --> 22:15.560 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, again, the whole chapter in the book that I talk about benevolent bank is that you want to use that as your, as your, if we're going to have a meeting, think of yourself as this, the trustees at this bank that are in charge of this account that we are subsidizing and we do have to talk about some things. 22:16.120 --> 22:23.542 [SPEAKER_00]: But a bank does not have on the agenda getting yourself together or that hairstyle you're wearing. 22:23.762 --> 22:25.763 [SPEAKER_00]: That's not what banks is none of their business. 22:26.323 --> 22:38.187 [SPEAKER_00]: It is that we're reviewing that we said that we will, for example, you should have something set if you're paying for college, that we will help with that or help with it, pay for whatever you can afford. 22:39.367 --> 23:06.465 [SPEAKER_00]: if you pass for passing grades so that may need to be reviewed because your first semester we've noticed that you you owe us you know $7,000 because you didn't pass or whatever that is or you can have a meeting of you are in fact passing but we are concerned about investing next year at with this kind of behavior the point being is you you really talk externals 23:07.205 --> 23:15.530 [SPEAKER_00]: and don't try to get into their head or comment on how you think they're being because that is exactly what will shut the whole thing down. 23:16.431 --> 23:26.457 [SPEAKER_00]: It's the kind of conversation that makes parents feel better about their anxiety, that when she gets home, we're going to have a real heart to heart. 23:26.517 --> 23:29.820 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, that's not particularly helpful for your adult. 23:30.540 --> 23:46.035 [SPEAKER_00]: kid, it can make you feel like you've accomplished something, but I'd rather you be effective and much more effective to talk about, we're not sure this is working because we're paying money and we're not getting the return that we agreed you would do. 23:47.826 --> 23:59.993 [SPEAKER_01]: And then I think that elephant in the room, especially maybe for moms, but I think maybe for dads too, that is hard in the summer is, and maybe we can wrap with this, is it just kind of hurts your feelings at some point that they're never there? 24:00.093 --> 24:02.294 [SPEAKER_01]: They always want to be somewhere else, they're always doing something else. 24:02.654 --> 24:03.895 [SPEAKER_01]: They want to be back at college. 24:04.115 --> 24:07.278 [SPEAKER_01]: They're all they talk about is the words to seven more weeks. 24:07.378 --> 24:10.341 [SPEAKER_01]: All that talked to us just a little bit about just that. 24:10.621 --> 24:13.464 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, there's that posture of hurt feelings. 24:14.104 --> 24:16.607 [SPEAKER_01]: And it's easy to say get over it, but it's real. 24:17.027 --> 24:21.912 [SPEAKER_01]: And so thoughts on how to kind of as a parent walk through that and not put it on your kid. 24:22.492 --> 24:29.122 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I think the first thing is to take it into account why am I hurt and there's reasonable reasons to be hurt. 24:29.162 --> 24:37.835 [SPEAKER_00]: I want my, you know, college age kid to like me, but when it really hurts, the parents that it really hurts, 24:38.576 --> 24:41.657 [SPEAKER_00]: are those that don't have their own emotional support. 24:42.137 --> 24:56.881 [SPEAKER_00]: This kid was my emotional support, and so I would use that hurt feeling as a reminder of red flag that I've got to refocus on my supports. 24:57.481 --> 25:02.822 [SPEAKER_00]: If you're married, I talk all the time about you're marriage is more important than your kids. 25:03.442 --> 25:06.683 [SPEAKER_00]: So if you're feeling really hurt because one of your kids left, 25:07.805 --> 25:16.087 [SPEAKER_00]: I'll bet you money, it's because you're a mom and you've got this husband that is actually wanting to be your hero, but he did, I don't know quite how. 25:16.547 --> 25:25.169 [SPEAKER_00]: And so you telling him that I miss her so much we were so close and I want you to be that guy for me. 25:25.669 --> 25:31.050 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know a husband, and now I know a lot of husbands that won't know exactly what you want me to do, that's a big one. 25:31.730 --> 25:42.293 [SPEAKER_00]: But they would love to be told that because you don't need to be burdening this teenager that hey You are my emotional needs are still a big part of your life. 25:42.814 --> 25:46.535 [SPEAKER_00]: So I think that's almost like a signal that I need to 25:47.375 --> 25:49.356 [SPEAKER_00]: gather the people that are my people. 25:49.396 --> 26:00.161 [SPEAKER_00]: If you're single, then you're close friendships and take care of yourself because it's one thing to really want your teenager to like you. 26:00.301 --> 26:08.264 [SPEAKER_00]: It's a different thing to be super deep heart feelings because look at you, you're growing up and that hurts my feeling. 26:08.304 --> 26:10.005 [SPEAKER_00]: That's not the message you want to be given. 26:10.478 --> 26:21.927 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and I think it's just that we all know this, but it's just this oxymoron or the two sides of the coin of raising kids the way that you've written about your book and that we talk about every week. 26:22.247 --> 26:24.949 [SPEAKER_01]: You're raising kids that we want to be independent. 26:24.969 --> 26:26.390 [SPEAKER_01]: We want them to have their own life. 26:26.410 --> 26:28.432 [SPEAKER_01]: We want them to be successful and to go to 26:29.352 --> 26:44.286 [SPEAKER_01]: college or whatever their next thing is and to make their own decisions and at the same time you're balancing the fact that they're making their own decisions, they're living their own life and there's a whole lot of people that would love for their kids to be doing the things that make you sad that your kids are doing. 26:44.346 --> 26:54.215 [SPEAKER_01]: So I mean, I think it's always weighing and balancing this that this is the whole thing we've been working towards and we've got to celebrate that even if it's gut-wrenching at times is apparent. 26:54.613 --> 26:58.681 [SPEAKER_00]: and speaking as a grandfather who is going to 26:59.905 --> 27:12.748 [SPEAKER_00]: who's being asked to go help out with the cutest girl, oh, she's cuteer than any of your kids ever were telling it, you're to the net everybody, you know, your kids will want you there. 27:13.008 --> 27:14.108 [SPEAKER_00]: They want you with them. 27:14.848 --> 27:20.729 [SPEAKER_00]: It may take a little while, but especially if you have shown them that respect, there's not the end of anything. 27:21.129 --> 27:23.930 [SPEAKER_00]: It's just a period until they get their own 27:25.072 --> 27:26.436 [SPEAKER_00]: live set in order. 27:27.078 --> 27:28.703 [SPEAKER_00]: They're not going to not want you anymore. 27:28.723 --> 27:31.852 [SPEAKER_00]: It's just going to need some space until they get that set. 27:32.285 --> 27:32.465 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. 27:33.045 --> 27:41.187 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, on behalf of the listeners, we just want to let you know that it would not be appropriate to get to Europe and tell your adult children that have your grandchildren. 27:41.587 --> 27:43.908 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, no phones after 10 o'clock in your rooms. 27:44.608 --> 27:48.309 [SPEAKER_01]: And I'm gonna have to just stick it up after themselves. 27:48.609 --> 27:49.910 [SPEAKER_01]: Now, I will not be doing laundry. 27:49.930 --> 27:51.610 [SPEAKER_01]: Like you don't need to write the list out for them. 27:51.730 --> 27:55.451 [SPEAKER_00]: I should do that and just come back and report how that went. 27:55.883 --> 27:56.644 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, let us know. 27:57.204 --> 27:58.766 [SPEAKER_01]: All right, well, happy summer. 27:58.806 --> 28:04.592 [SPEAKER_01]: I hope you have a great, great getaway with family that you leave Europe intact. 28:05.052 --> 28:07.775 [SPEAKER_01]: Don't reference what you did in our last podcast about. 28:08.115 --> 28:10.818 [SPEAKER_01]: It was the Brits you said that don't appreciate the American. 28:10.838 --> 28:12.760 [SPEAKER_00]: Don't appreciate the tax rebellion. 28:13.413 --> 28:20.316 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, well, let's leave that here in the Dallas area and enjoy your nice trip in everyone. 28:20.456 --> 28:25.477 [SPEAKER_01]: Listen, we'll have content up in July and probably stuff you may have missed along the way. 28:25.497 --> 28:29.719 [SPEAKER_01]: So we'll have that for you in the August, we will be back with new shows for you. 28:30.179 --> 28:32.860 [SPEAKER_01]: And listen, we appreciate the emails you send us. 28:33.100 --> 28:40.783 [SPEAKER_01]: We don't, as you know, answer every single one of them, but it does give us a good feel for what's going on, what you're working through, what you're struggling with. 28:41.303 --> 28:49.875 [SPEAKER_01]: And I almost wish Dr. Ken I think this all the time I wish that we published in which we wouldn't because I think everybody would feel better because you're all asking the same ten questions true. 28:50.015 --> 28:50.696 [SPEAKER_00]: It's so true. 28:50.997 --> 28:52.078 [SPEAKER_01]: We're all in the same boat. 28:52.138 --> 28:54.201 [SPEAKER_01]: So thank you for to do Dr. Ken. 28:54.321 --> 28:55.703 [SPEAKER_01]: We'll see you in August. 28:56.003 --> 28:56.925 [SPEAKER_00]: Have a great summer.