[SPEAKER_02]: This episode and the entire season of episodes is proudly brought to you by California Cryobank.
[SPEAKER_02]: Use code queerfam26 for a free, level 3 subscription to their donor catalog.
[SPEAKER_02]: Make those babies y'all and then come tell me about them.
[SPEAKER_01]: Love is love is love on the queer family but good Love is love
[SPEAKER_03]: Our surrogate, but I think because she's deaf, she has this, like, she's very intuitive, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: And very intimate.
[SPEAKER_03]: They're almost like the sixth sense.
[SPEAKER_03]: And she was like teasing us before because her levels were really high.
[SPEAKER_03]: And she was like, I think you guys are pregnant with triplets.
[SPEAKER_03]: And we're like, ha, no, we're not.
[SPEAKER_03]: Is your, you know, that's not for us.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's for you.
[SPEAKER_02]: Welcome y'all to the queer family podcast to show all about family, but with gay, I'm your gay host Jamie and this is the show as you know that highlights, celebrates uplifts and normalizes LGBTQIA plus families in all of our fabulous identity.
[SPEAKER_02]: And if you're tuning in during June, you need to know, this is the third or fourth annual Pride Extravaganza.
[SPEAKER_02]: What does that you ask?
[SPEAKER_02]: What is it?
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, it means that all through the month of June, Pride Month, I release double the episodes.
[SPEAKER_02]: So you don't only get an episode on Monday, you also get one on Thursday just so we can spread all the queer family goodness possible during Pride.
[SPEAKER_02]: So I hope you're enjoying these episodes.
[SPEAKER_02]: This one today is
[SPEAKER_02]: A really special.
[SPEAKER_02]: I really loved this conversation.
[SPEAKER_02]: I sat down with Jake and Sean.
[SPEAKER_02]: They are daddy's to three on social media.
[SPEAKER_02]: They have, they have an account where they document their lives together and in their kiddos and it's just, they're being the representation that we all need to see.
[SPEAKER_02]: So if you don't follow them, you should go follow them and check them out.
[SPEAKER_02]: And they have this beautiful
[SPEAKER_02]: fell in love and left the church and came out like it's it we cover in so many bases here it's beautiful and now they are dads to three triplets through surrogacy you're going to hear the whole journey it's just lovely I'm just finished speaking with them and I'm left with such a warm feeling in my heart so I hope you are left with that by the end of this as well.
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't want to drag this intro on too long because I want to get right into their story.
[SPEAKER_02]: So, I hope you're enjoying these episodes.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm going to roll the tape by Helen and Bula.
[SPEAKER_02]: Ladies, can you come over here and roll this tape?
[SPEAKER_02]: Okay, thank, I mean, Helen, Bula, I forgot.
[SPEAKER_02]: I have to say it sweetly, or they won't come.
[SPEAKER_02]: Here they come.
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't have assistance.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm talking to the air.
[SPEAKER_02]: We know this.
[SPEAKER_02]: But they are consistent characters on this show and I will keep it going.
[SPEAKER_02]: Alright, Helen and Bula, they're ready.
[SPEAKER_02]: They want to get back to their whiskey on the couch.
[SPEAKER_02]: So rolling the tape, here we go.
[SPEAKER_02]: Let's do it.
[SPEAKER_02]: Thank you for coming on the show.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm really, really excited to dive deep into your full story.
[SPEAKER_02]: I stalk you on the Instagram as you do.
[SPEAKER_02]: So I know a little bit of part of it.
[SPEAKER_02]: We're going to dive deeper.
[SPEAKER_03]: We're excited.
[SPEAKER_03]: Thanks for having us.
[SPEAKER_03]: How do you be here?
[SPEAKER_02]: Without further ado, we're just going to dive into what I warned you about the 30 second elevator pitch.
[SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_02]: Are you ready?
[SPEAKER_04]: Ready.
[SPEAKER_02]: Get set.
[SPEAKER_02]: Go.
[SPEAKER_04]: I'm Jake, and I'm Sean, and we are gay dads to triplets.
[SPEAKER_04]: We both grew up in conservative Utah, very more men.
[SPEAKER_04]: We're actually each other's very first boy friends.
[SPEAKER_04]: We were gonna help each other find understanding wives and feeling like it's dead.
[SPEAKER_04]: We had our kids through surrogacy.
[SPEAKER_04]: We were trying for at least one and did that's amazingly having three, and it's been a wild right ever since.
[SPEAKER_02]: boom, that was beautifully done.
[SPEAKER_02]: 30 seconds, like pros, because your content creators, you don't mess around.
[SPEAKER_02]: Hold on, let's rewind.
[SPEAKER_02]: You were trying to find each other nice, Mormon wives.
[SPEAKER_02]: Can we start there, please?
[SPEAKER_02]: Because I feel like.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'll tell you what, I love hearing stories of conservative up-bringings and breaking free and Mormon.
[SPEAKER_02]: I want to know the stuff.
[SPEAKER_02]: Tell us the stuff.
[SPEAKER_03]: So, Jake and I, like he said, we both grew up in the LDS church, you know, known as Mormon, and
[SPEAKER_03]: that's kind of all we knew growing up.
[SPEAKER_03]: Very big churchgoers, you know, when every Sunday, Jake actually went on a mission, I'll let you him tell that story.
[SPEAKER_03]: But yeah, when we first met, we were still closeted and it was just so early on and so new to us that when we first met,
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, wait, Grinder trying to hook up with guys or Grinder?
[SPEAKER_02]: Is Grinder only for guys?
[SPEAKER_04]: There was nothing of making the call.
[SPEAKER_04]: And so really, at least my part of the story, I had come home for my mission.
[SPEAKER_04]: I was still gay.
[SPEAKER_04]: The girl that I had dated before we tried to make it work, it didn't honestly come gay.
[SPEAKER_04]: And my whole world just kind of fell apart and I felt like a deep depression.
[SPEAKER_04]: But through the lens of Mormonism, there's so much pressure on appearances, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: And really showing that you're perfect and you're suffering in silence.
[SPEAKER_04]: So I was leading this double life where, you know, I was going to church.
[SPEAKER_04]: And I was this perfect LDS member and then under an alias, I was hooking up with guys and experimenting and then I would feel terrible about myself.
[SPEAKER_04]: I had gone through the repentance process, and in Mormonism, that's not just between you and God, you have to have a leader that you're going through.
[SPEAKER_04]: So I went and repented to a bishop, and it was a grievous enough sin to have a council called and they call it a disciplinary council.
[SPEAKER_04]: Or basically, you'll go and relive this experience and they'll ask you lots of questions that are pretty invasive.
[SPEAKER_04]: to see if you are repentant enough to stay in the church or to receive some kind of a discipline within church structure.
[SPEAKER_04]: So I had passed that because I was repentant, I did want to, you know, follow Christ and I want to pray the gay way, pray it away.
[SPEAKER_04]: I felt terrible about having acted on these gay feelings.
[SPEAKER_04]: So, when I was chatting with Sean, it was because I had not come out to anybody.
[SPEAKER_04]: I went through all of this without coming out to my parents.
[SPEAKER_04]: I was like, I picked out of the church that's my entire family heritage and upbringing and life.
[SPEAKER_04]: And I'm going to have to come out to them at the same time if that happens.
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh my god.
[SPEAKER_04]: I'm so glad you're fine.
[SPEAKER_02]: And you went through all of that with the repentance and your family knew nothing.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like you were just like completely, like solo alone going through that.
[SPEAKER_02]: That is, you know, oh, God.
[SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, that's the only people that I had come out to were church leadership.
[SPEAKER_04]: Even the guys that I had hooked up with, I was under a different name.
[SPEAKER_04]: Like they, my was.
[SPEAKER_04]: So,
[SPEAKER_04]: When I was talking with Sean, it was really just to, again, have your story mirrored back to you, have somebody that you can relate to.
[SPEAKER_04]: And we talked for a couple of months on there because we were afraid of each other's intentions and weren't using the app to hook up.
[SPEAKER_04]: And we finally met up at a John Budgeuse to get some sort of ease where like that's very neutral.
[SPEAKER_04]: And we just talked for like three hours and just related and by the end of it, we thought we were going to be best friends.
[SPEAKER_04]: And at that point, we really thought that we were going to help each other through this experience be there to lean on each other, but eventually find a wife that was understanding enough that we could be bisexual enough to make it work with a woman.
[SPEAKER_02]: Does that happen?
[SPEAKER_02]: of all by sexual, you're not at all by sexual.
[SPEAKER_02]: But does that help in a lot in like Mormon households?
[SPEAKER_02]: Are there are there are there understandings between some couples that I'm going to be buying?
[SPEAKER_03]: It's going to help in their marriage.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, I think it's happening more and more I think that it's becoming less stigmatized to be same sex attracted as how you would put it because it calling yourself gay is taking on an identity.
[SPEAKER_04]: Whereas same-sex attracted is just saying that that's something you struggle with.
[SPEAKER_03]: And what's great, what one doesn't want to marry a gay man?
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, like, I mean, come on now.
[SPEAKER_03]: Right.
[SPEAKER_02]: What's he's probably gay myself?
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, exactly.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, we know some of those two.
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, how long did you each know you were gay?
[SPEAKER_02]: Did you know your whole life or was it like a
[SPEAKER_03]: No, I feel like both of us knew from a really young age.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, you know, in the church, there are certain milestones, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: And they kind of have your whole life mapped out for you at this age.
[SPEAKER_03]: You do this at this age, you do that.
[SPEAKER_03]: So at eight, you get baptized in the Mormon church.
[SPEAKER_03]: And
[SPEAKER_03]: I remember like, I think we both relate on this that we both felt like guilty getting baptized because we had, you know, feelings of same sex attraction and we were like, new that that was on, you know, a no-no in the church and so your A.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's not even sexual at that age.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's just like, oh, you thought this boy was cute.
[SPEAKER_04]: You're different or you've had a little crush on a boy or you relate more to girls.
[SPEAKER_04]: You're not good as sports.
[SPEAKER_04]: Just little things that are tipping you off
[SPEAKER_04]: and at least for me I felt like oh maybe that baptism is going to help change me.
[SPEAKER_04]: So I knew that that's kind of where I pinpoint that I knew I was gay because I remember having those feelings of like I think this could be what changes.
[SPEAKER_04]: There was that in your sense.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah and then it didn't.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, you can't pray the gay way.
[SPEAKER_02]: Trying not to be gay, you meet each other.
[SPEAKER_02]: I have one more question about just growing up in the church and knowing you were different, knowing you were probably gay, same sex attraction.
[SPEAKER_02]: Was there conversation in your houses?
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, about gayness at all or was that just something you didn't even talk about?
[SPEAKER_02]: It's just something that you know the church was not cool with.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think from my experience in my household, like we just didn't really talk about it.
[SPEAKER_03]: My dad had a brother who was gay and he died from AIDS.
[SPEAKER_03]: And it wasn't until later on when I came out that I really got to hear that story and understand because he had passed away when I was like two years old.
[SPEAKER_03]: So I don't remember him.
[SPEAKER_03]: But I do know that my parents were very loving and accepting of him.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think it's just different when it's like your own child, you know, I think it takes it took a lot more time for them to wrap their minds around that because they had felt like maybe they had done something wrong or.
[SPEAKER_04]: I don't know, and I will probably end to this later about parents and support and then coming around.
[SPEAKER_04]: Our parents are really good, good people, and I think that some of that in this probably happens a lot in households where parents are afraid of what their child is going to experience.
[SPEAKER_04]: And so they're forcing their mindset and their experience, they're projecting that on what could happen to their kids.
[SPEAKER_04]: So I think for my parents' point of view, they were trying to not necessarily protect us from being gay because they hated that, but they were kind of scared of what that would mean for our lives, for our salvation, for the community that would come after us.
[SPEAKER_04]: So it was a big learning curve for them.
[SPEAKER_04]: My older sister is lesbian and she's a big part of my journey because she was my best friend growing up.
[SPEAKER_04]: So I feel like her coming out really paved the way for me to have an easier experience with my parents because they didn't handle that very well with her.
[SPEAKER_04]: It came out in high school.
[SPEAKER_04]: And I think it's almost a little bit harder for women too because there's this emotional aspect.
[SPEAKER_04]: You just haven't found the right guy.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, you're just afraid of men or you're just gotta keep trying.
[SPEAKER_04]: If a guy comes out as gay, they're like you wouldn't make that up your gay.
[SPEAKER_02]: Right.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, my family thought I was if it was a phase like the Oh, you'll meet you'll meet you got the same thing.
[SPEAKER_02]: And because I didn't look.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm doing this in quotations.
[SPEAKER_02]: I didn't look or act gay.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like I'm supposed to.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm supposed to start driving a Harley and like wearing leather jackets or something.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I don't know, you know, like.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, we come out all different ways.
[SPEAKER_02]: All right, so you meet your, you become best friends, you're going to find yourselves the perfect wives to live your by life and then what happened.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then like literally two weeks in, we were like, okay, this isn't working.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think we're actually following for each other.
[SPEAKER_03]: We were spending so much time together.
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, literally every day, you know, and every waking minute we're texting or talking.
[SPEAKER_03]: And we're like, it's still like there's me the chills to this day.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, just how beautiful that experience was and how meant to be it was.
[SPEAKER_03]: you know, obviously how far we've come since that moment, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: And everything that we've gone through since, but yeah, no, it did not last very long.
[SPEAKER_03]: We were weeks.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm, I think the outward came out.
[SPEAKER_03]: We're going to talk about it.
[SPEAKER_04]: Like, I met, it was a summer before I went back to LA for school.
[SPEAKER_04]: And so,
[SPEAKER_04]: we only had like a month together and we knew that we were in love with in that month.
[SPEAKER_04]: So I moved back to California and we did a year of long distance and kind of worked through that until until we could come out together.
[SPEAKER_02]: Wow, I love that.
[SPEAKER_02]: I love that story.
[SPEAKER_02]: And it's like slightly lesbian too because you're all everything.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, you part a little bit.
[SPEAKER_03]: We did.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, we totally did.
[SPEAKER_02]: I love that.
[SPEAKER_02]: Okay, so all right, then then yeah, to come out.
[SPEAKER_03]: So so what was crazy?
[SPEAKER_03]: Jake broke up with me for a day.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I was, because at this point, we had still not come out.
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, we were six months into our relationship and still had not come out to explain all explain.
[SPEAKER_03]: But he didn't watch some general conference, which is a Mormon, I mean, you're better at explaining more about it.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's like they do a conference, which is a big council of like the 12 apostles and profit and leadership of the church, the council, all the members, they do a twice a year.
[SPEAKER_04]: And I had just watched that and was just feeling so guilty.
[SPEAKER_04]: And this whole time that I was falling in love with Sean, I was feeling guilty and I was feeling like,
[SPEAKER_04]: This is what it means to have a broken heart and a contrite spirit, like it talks about in the scriptures, is to literally break my heart and God asked Abraham to sacrifice his son and he's only asking me just to not choose love in this life and maybe I'll have a opportunity in the next.
[SPEAKER_04]: And so it really was this heartbreaking choice that I had to make, but I felt like
[SPEAKER_04]: It was my only choice.
[SPEAKER_04]: And so even though it felt so right to be with Sean, I couldn't handle that guilt.
[SPEAKER_04]: And I felt like I had to give up my own will to serve God.
[SPEAKER_04]: And so I feel good with Sean.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then you can pick up from there.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, so it's record for a day.
[SPEAKER_03]: I was a wreck.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like I had been broken up with girls plenty of times.
[SPEAKER_03]: You know what I was like, done.
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you.
[SPEAKER_03]: But Jake was very different, and I could not keep it together.
[SPEAKER_03]: And my parents were like, what is going on with you?
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, you've been crying all day long.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I was like, well, I have to tell you that Jake wasn't just my friend.
[SPEAKER_03]: He was my boyfriend.
[SPEAKER_03]: And so I dropped the bomb on them.
[SPEAKER_03]: And my dad was really sweet.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, I remember him telling me, like, we were sitting at the kitchen table and he was just like, I love you no matter what.
[SPEAKER_03]: And we'll figure this out.
[SPEAKER_03]: And my mom took a little bit longer to just like process.
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, I mean, she
[SPEAKER_03]: didn't have much to say at first.
[SPEAKER_03]: And now, I mean, my mom's, you know, our biggest fan and she's so sweet.
[SPEAKER_03]: But she came down the next day and was like, um, you know, I want you to know that I love you no matter what, and we'll, you know, we'll get through this.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think a lot of those beginning stages kind of going back to what Jake was saying was my parents were genuinely worried about like being bullied or my salvation or, you know,
[SPEAKER_02]: The church.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like it's your whole life.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like it seems like it was your family's life.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like it's a community that you don't know anything other than that.
[SPEAKER_02]: I can see how it would be scary for the pet your parents and for you, especially and everyone.
[SPEAKER_02]: So you came out and Jake has just broken up with you like what went down.
[SPEAKER_02]: It was only a day.
[SPEAKER_03]: You don't need this letter and you know essentially asked if we could still be friends.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I said no, I was like, you know, absolutely no, you want to be your friend.
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, for 24 hours, I thought it was just the end.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then I reached back out.
[SPEAKER_04]: I send off this email, this letter to Sean ruins my night.
[SPEAKER_04]: I'm sad at this point, I'm like, this is the only thing that was bringing me happiness.
[SPEAKER_04]: Okay, I'm gonna drink for the first time.
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, well, okay.
[SPEAKER_03]: So that I'm drinking in the Mormon Church is a big, big, big, no, no.
[SPEAKER_04]: I didn't go out and drink coffee or tea.
[SPEAKER_04]: I went straight to alcohol.
[SPEAKER_04]: But it was fraternity rush at USC in Los Angeles and so I just I remember going into the fridge my roommate's drink and I just like grabbed a little bit of this a little bit of that.
[SPEAKER_04]: I don't even remember why I took but I just remember drinking everything that was in there.
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh God.
[SPEAKER_04]: To sorority row fraternity row and then I don't remember the rest of the night.
[SPEAKER_04]: I woke up back home in my bathroom.
[SPEAKER_04]: and just humble in this life.
[SPEAKER_04]: State of weakness hungover and just all I knew to do was to pray.
[SPEAKER_04]: And so I just started praying and trying to find guidance.
[SPEAKER_04]: And that's really when it.
[SPEAKER_04]: hit me.
[SPEAKER_04]: Like I felt like I got this really strong answer from God.
[SPEAKER_04]: Like I was telling God, hey, I've read your scriptures.
[SPEAKER_04]: I know the rules.
[SPEAKER_04]: This is what I need to do.
[SPEAKER_04]: I need to give up Sean.
[SPEAKER_04]: Sorry for drinking.
[SPEAKER_04]: And I felt this.
[SPEAKER_04]: This overwhelming sense that God was saying, you know that I, I wrote those things or I'm behind those things, like they're not more powerful than I am and I'm telling you that you need to be happy.
[SPEAKER_04]: Like you need to choose him, yes.
[SPEAKER_04]: And it was such a more man answer, I don't believe in more manism anymore, but I feel like it's exactly what I needed.
[SPEAKER_04]: It was the language that I knew to connect to something higher than myself.
[SPEAKER_04]: And I feel like I did connect to something higher
[SPEAKER_04]: to breathe and allowed me to breathe them to finally, you know, make my own choices and lean into my own authenticity and follow my heart.
[SPEAKER_04]: And so I called Sean up and I was like, I don't know, how we're going to navigate this or what's to come, but I know that you're my soulmate and I know that we're going to make it work and let's figure this out together.
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, what a sweet love story you guys.
[SPEAKER_04]: Like, no, no, I'm gonna cry again over here.
[SPEAKER_02]: It needs to be like a rom-com, like, what the hell?
[SPEAKER_04]: We're a little far, hallmark movie with.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I'm like crying.
[SPEAKER_02]: So, like, so sweet, but also so, like, oh, no, you had, like, it's like, broke back mountain, why can't I quit you?
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, I can't cry.
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh my god, it needs to be made into like a little movie.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm not even kidding.
[SPEAKER_02]: We need that.
[SPEAKER_02]: We need that representation out.
[SPEAKER_03]: I like it going through, but like, right.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, it's fun to look back on.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_02]: So you got together and then Jake, you had to come out.
[SPEAKER_04]: So then I came out, I came out to my parents, the following spring break.
[SPEAKER_04]: And then I came back to Utah for the summer and then we both went back to USC the following year.
[SPEAKER_04]: Sean followed me and we finished up school and came out together and navigated trying to make it within the church and pioneering that path.
[SPEAKER_04]: Jake, I pulled me back to church.
[SPEAKER_04]: Realizing that.
[SPEAKER_04]: We weren't really welcome there and that kind of led us to doing more investigation and faith crisis realizing that this wasn't what we believed in and leaving the church from there.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, and you did it together.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's good that you had each other to do it together and you both understood it so well.
[SPEAKER_02]: Because I can only imagine that that was really a hard journey to go through.
[SPEAKER_04]: It was great that we could relate on that.
[SPEAKER_04]: I think it really bonded us and also brought a lot of baggage.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's a very little code of time.
[SPEAKER_04]: You worked through those things.
[SPEAKER_04]: We've been together now 13 years.
[SPEAKER_04]: So wow.
[SPEAKER_02]: Grats.
[SPEAKER_04]: for two different lifetimes where you can mark that end in beginnings of different chapters in your life.
[SPEAKER_02]: One hundred percent beautiful story.
[SPEAKER_02]: Now we gotta get into the baby-making journey.
[SPEAKER_02]: So when did the talk of building a family come into the conversation?
[SPEAKER_02]: Because a lot of times it comes in a lot earlier for us because we have a lot of decisions to work through together.
[SPEAKER_02]: So
[SPEAKER_03]: So, I mean, I think growing up Mormon, it's very family oriented, they push big families and, you know, so I think for us, we always kind of knew we wanted a family and that was almost like the devastating part about being gay, what's like, okay, well, you know, I'm coming out now, I won't be able to have a family.
[SPEAKER_03]: And so I think at the beginning, we were kind of like, is this possible, can we make this work,
[SPEAKER_03]: And we didn't know much.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like we didn't know a lot of people that had, you know, had successfully done it.
[SPEAKER_03]: And so we actually met this couple in San Francisco and they were much older than us and they had a daughter through
[SPEAKER_03]: they helped us navigate some of it, but I mean, a lot of that was pretty early on and we were young, you know, and we knew that it was going to be an expensive journey.
[SPEAKER_03]: And so we're like, you know, the timing wasn't right then, but, you know, it kind of planted the seed.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, like, I mean, you agreed on the method you were going to use to create your family, which that's step one, and then you make other decisions as you go.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then we knew that it was going to be expensive.
[SPEAKER_03]: So we, you know, we got into real estate.
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, I actually got my real estate license right out of high school, but, you know, I put it on hold while we lived in LA and then we moved back to Utah.
[SPEAKER_03]: We got back into real estate.
[SPEAKER_03]: And Jake was serving but also, you know, acting and he was like, you know, serving is not really the career that I want to.
[SPEAKER_04]: Dr. serving well or then I was acting and I've got a change here.
[SPEAKER_02]: I lived that life too.
[SPEAKER_02]: I was a waitress for a very long time.
[SPEAKER_03]: Uh-huh.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, it's loose faith in humanity, I think.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it's not an easy job, it's tough, but yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: So we were like, okay, some things have to change in order to, you know,
[SPEAKER_03]: save up this 150,000 to $100,000 that we need in order to make the surrogacy journey happen.
[SPEAKER_03]: And so, you know, he jumped into real estate and it was like our big why, you know, like our big motivator was like, okay, we're going to save so that we can we can have a family.
[SPEAKER_03]: And that was in 2017.
[SPEAKER_02]: I got to stop you here because this point gets brought up in every episode and I'm the listeners are like, I know what she's going to say, but intentionality, like the people who say that queer people should not be parents need to listen to some of these stories because you got your careers in order to be able to afford to have children one day.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_02]: Talk about intentionality right there.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like we're not just going to fall pregnant accidentally here.
[SPEAKER_02]: We have to work so hard to get there.
[SPEAKER_03]: Totally.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: Literally every decision that you're making is for that future.
[SPEAKER_03]: And the hope, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: Because it's not guaranteed.
[SPEAKER_02]: Nope.
[SPEAKER_02]: You got your careers.
[SPEAKER_02]: You started saving in 2017.
[SPEAKER_02]: And then what happened?
[SPEAKER_03]: and we were really fortunate.
[SPEAKER_03]: We had a great community that really supported us.
[SPEAKER_03]: We marketed ourselves together and as the realtor hubbies here in Utah.
[SPEAKER_03]: We were like probably the first gay couple in Utah that did really take together and marketed ourselves together.
[SPEAKER_03]: And we were so nervous, but also we were like, you know, we don't have a lot to like, or I love it.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's actually brilliant.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's brilliant.
[SPEAKER_02]: It really is because I can just see all the wives like, oh my god, call the boys like, you know, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: Our first RCEO at the time was like, you're pigeonholing yourselves.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's not a good idea.
[SPEAKER_03]: And we were like, no, we're doing it.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, we're the type of people you tell us we can't do something.
[SPEAKER_03]: We're kind of doing it, you know.
[SPEAKER_03]: And so we actually ended up leaving that company shortly after.
[SPEAKER_03]: And we just like took off.
[SPEAKER_03]: Jake did 42 transactions in his first year, which is like, wow.
[SPEAKER_03]: sort of in real estate like most people do like two to three there first year.
[SPEAKER_03]: So it allowed us to kind of expedite that process quicker than we anticipate.
[SPEAKER_02]: You made the money, basically, or you were in a plate, you were starting to make the money.
[SPEAKER_04]: The contracts, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: Yep.
[SPEAKER_04]: We ended up meeting with the Utah Fertility Center and they really pivotal in kind of leading us and guiding us on what steps to take.
[SPEAKER_04]: So we started with the embryo creation.
[SPEAKER_04]: We used an anonymous egg donor and created our embryos and then just had those growth and for a while.
[SPEAKER_02]: with an anonymous egg donor.
[SPEAKER_02]: Did you choose the egg donor?
[SPEAKER_02]: Did they just give you, like you took, you got to choose your donor, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: We did choose, yes.
[SPEAKER_02]: I call this the search for the superhuman, this search.
[SPEAKER_02]: Because some of us get a little kukko.
[SPEAKER_02]: When we're looking through these potential donors, what was your search like?
[SPEAKER_03]: Totally.
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, it's, it's weird because you go in and you're like, this, like, I'm back on Tinder.
[SPEAKER_03]: So I've been profile.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I was in all these things.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, and you're like, I shouldn't have had this much power.
[SPEAKER_04]: I feel like I'm playing like, and you're really doing, and you're getting your head about like, oh, well, if I can combat these negative genetics that I have with this and that.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's crazy.
[SPEAKER_04]: And we brought in, I think, like, 10 profiles after vetting all of those.
[SPEAKER_04]: And I feel like, even though we're not religious at all, anymore, we're so pretty spiritual and into like intuition and our feelings.
[SPEAKER_04]: And none of them felt right.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like beautiful people, but we were just like, for whatever reason, it just doesn't feel right.
[SPEAKER_03]: And so the lady at the fertility center was
[SPEAKER_03]: Do you want to at least see those before you leave today and we were like, yeah, that sounds great.
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, I mean, we just waited through 500 what's three more, you know, there was this lady and she was totally different than like what we had gone in with our this criteria and it just like felt so right and we're like, okay, that's the one I love that I love that yeah, will be right back.
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you so much for this love.
[SPEAKER_02]: Speaking of donors, I have something for you.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's a promo code at California Cryobank.
[SPEAKER_02]: You're going to use code queerfam26 for a free level three subscription to their donor catalog.
[SPEAKER_02]: So if hearing, Jake and Sean's story is inspiring you at all to start your family building journey, California Cryobank is here for you.
[SPEAKER_02]: They have been around for nearly 50 years.
[SPEAKER_02]: They offer so many amazing services that tailor to the LGBTQIA Plus community.
[SPEAKER_02]: I use them to make my babies and I really think you will like what you see when you go over a California cryobank and see what they have.
[SPEAKER_02]: They offer a very wide array of donors and they really do take care of you through the process.
[SPEAKER_02]: I know I had to call them.
[SPEAKER_02]: I called them a couple times actually when we were trying to choose our donor and had some really lovely conversations with the people on the other end.
[SPEAKER_02]: So they really do think about you.
[SPEAKER_02]: They they walk you through it.
[SPEAKER_02]: They're helpful.
[SPEAKER_02]: They offer things like second parent adoption letters.
[SPEAKER_02]: If you need them, very good for our community.
[SPEAKER_02]: They offer a free-vile transfer between partners.
[SPEAKER_02]: If you decide to switch you to races, there's so many awesome perks of using California cryobing.
[SPEAKER_02]: So if donor conception is the path you think that might be the one for you, head to cryobank.com, use Code, ClearFam26, and check out their Level 3 subscription to their donor catalog.
[SPEAKER_02]: Start making those babies y'all
[SPEAKER_02]: All right, back to the show.
[SPEAKER_01]: Love is love.
[SPEAKER_02]: So you went with like just intuitive feelings.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's really interesting to hear how people go about that search.
[SPEAKER_02]: So that's good.
[SPEAKER_02]: So you found her.
[SPEAKER_02]: You made your embryos.
[SPEAKER_02]: Did you each make embryos with sperm?
[SPEAKER_02]: And you don't have to tell me anything if you don't talk.
[SPEAKER_02]: If you don't if you're not open.
[SPEAKER_04]: We did the egg retrieval and then we split those in half and fertilized half with my sperm and half with shons.
[SPEAKER_03]: We actually got 26 eggs, which was like insane.
[SPEAKER_03]: Damn.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, so we had quite a few.
[SPEAKER_03]: We ended up with 13 viable embryos from that.
[SPEAKER_03]: And we did two surrogacy journeys.
[SPEAKER_03]: Our first journey, we had a surrogate.
[SPEAKER_03]: She was incredible out of Idaho.
[SPEAKER_03]: And we put in two embryos hoping that either one
[SPEAKER_03]: and then we got 12 weeks in miscarried.
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, no, I'm sorry.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, it was cool.
[SPEAKER_03]: We were at a friend's giving, when it all went down, you know, we got the call that things were up.
[SPEAKER_04]: Looking good, and she was bleeding, and when I said, yeah, devastating experience, just because you're not with her, she was out of state and you're like, that's so traumatizing for her.
[SPEAKER_04]: It became an in ordeal because it her body just wasn't up for it and we were trying again with her and we ended up having to to switch surrogates and so just all of this After that you've put into this person and your surrogates so special to you for us.
[SPEAKER_04]: We wanted we wanted to have a relationship with our surrogate
[SPEAKER_04]: have them be like an anti-figure and she was getting really close with us and our families and so to have to switch was really hard for us and then you're taking so many steps backward financially as well.
[SPEAKER_04]: Even though we were doing careers and starting to come up on on that
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, because every setback, every setback is more money like that like it breaks and that's not what you're thinking about like but it is like obviously it's it's it's in the back of your brain all the time.
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God, we're going to run out of money like what if right like it's just so stressful.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, and it took longer because of that.
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, like, I always say, like, with heterocouples, it's like obviously so devastating, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: To miss Christ.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's always devastating.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: There's an added layer with a queer couple.
[SPEAKER_03]: Right.
[SPEAKER_03]: When does it go through surrogacy?
[SPEAKER_03]: Partility.
[SPEAKER_03]: Right.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: When there's money involved.
[SPEAKER_03]: Totally.
[SPEAKER_03]: Because you're like,
[SPEAKER_02]: Cool, they went 40 grand because Yeah, you can't just wait a month and try again.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, try again and bed.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: Uh-huh.
[SPEAKER_02]: There's a lot of things that have to be put in order before you get to try again.
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, so.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know.
[SPEAKER_03]: You just feel so terrible for because she felt
[SPEAKER_03]: like a failure, you know, a way.
[SPEAKER_03]: And so she was dealing with those big emotions.
[SPEAKER_03]: And we're dealing with our emotions of like loss and grief and you want to support her as well.
[SPEAKER_03]: And so you're juggling to so much.
[SPEAKER_02]: so many emotions like we all need a therapist when we're going through this.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think that that should be a part of the package like and here is your personal therapist to talk through any feelings you have like, yes, okay, so you had to yeah to switch surrogates and who did did the agency or.
[SPEAKER_03]: They actually did connect us with our second surrogate because they had just witnessed what we had gone through and they were like, hey, we have this other incredible woman who just did a surrogacy journey with another couple, she gave her to twins, she actually has triplets of her own so for shadowing, yes.
[SPEAKER_03]: No, they were like, would you be interested in interviewing her?
[SPEAKER_03]: We're like absolutely like anyone who's willing to do this for another human as incredible, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: So we we sat down with her and her husband and it was crazy because it was during the fall of the time.
[SPEAKER_04]: So we couldn't meet in person and it was hard because she's deaf and her husband is deaf.
[SPEAKER_04]: So we couldn't even talk on the phone and we had to use this service where it was almost like face timing, but it was there three parties and we would speak and then there was an interpreter and it was such a way of doing things at that time.
[SPEAKER_03]: But again, just such an energy thing, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: Like we just felt her warmth and felt her and felt like she was the right decision, you know, again.
[SPEAKER_03]: So we moved forward with her and we put in two embryos and we were hoping to warn our both woodstick again.
[SPEAKER_02]: Did you know who's embryos?
[SPEAKER_02]: You like, you like, chose.
[SPEAKER_02]: You know what you're doing.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: And you better tell the ultrasound story.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, it's done.
[SPEAKER_03]: So our surrogate, I think because she's deaf, she has this, like, she's very intuitive, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: and she was like teasing us before because her levels were really high and she was like, I think you guys are pregnant with triplets and we're like, ha, no, we're not.
[SPEAKER_03]: You're cute.
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, that's not for us.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's for you.
[SPEAKER_03]: We like going for our first ultrasound, you know, and it's it's pretty early on like I want to say it's like nine weeks and so we're in with the ultrasound tech and we know that we have a positive pregnancy, but she's scanning through and she can see two sacks.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's like, okay, there's a good chance you have twins, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: And she's scanning through and she's like, guys, I'm really sorry.
[SPEAKER_03]: I only found one baby and we're like, no, that's great.
[SPEAKER_03]: We're actually really happy with just even just one, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: And she's like, okay, well, you know, let me go grab another tack just to make sure because like double check my work because it is interesting that there's two sacks.
[SPEAKER_03]: So she got this other ultrasound tack to come in and she starts scanning through right and doing her thing.
[SPEAKER_03]: And she's like, no guys, you are pregnant with twins like here's baby A.
[SPEAKER_03]: Here's baby B.
[SPEAKER_03]: She's printing us out the ultrasound pictures typing twins like.
[SPEAKER_03]: I was teasing our surrogate, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: I was like at least it's not three.
[SPEAKER_03]: I told you how they're like it's not three.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then she's doing all the things, like measuring the heartbeat were obviously so ecstatic.
[SPEAKER_03]: And we're just chatting with our surrogate.
[SPEAKER_03]: And she says, guys, I think you're actively pregnant with three.
[SPEAKER_03]: And we're like,
[SPEAKER_03]: You just heard us joking about this, like you're funny, like, I spoke, you know, we didn't, I did not believe her at all.
[SPEAKER_03]: And she's like, no, I'm, I'm actually serious.
[SPEAKER_03]: I was like, well, the only way I'm going to believe you is if you get all three of them in one phrase.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, like, you're little jelly beans at this point.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, how do you tell that there are two, like it didn't just bounce around and, you know,
[SPEAKER_03]: And so, she, Chernaf gets all three of them in one frame.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think the first thing that came out of my mouth was like, I am not driving a mini-can.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like...
[SPEAKER_03]: He used to drive a mini-ban.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm like, no shame to anyone who shows up like that.
[SPEAKER_03]: And it's honestly easier.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, I'm sure your life is easier if you drive a mini-ban.
[SPEAKER_03]: Right, and door sets.
[SPEAKER_02]: I want a mini-ban, but that's the last one.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm not going to, you know.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think it does make life easier, but I don't have one either.
[SPEAKER_03]: I know, I'm like, I just can't roll up to a listing at point in a Honda's, you know, what are they called?
[SPEAKER_02]: No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_02]: So okay.
[SPEAKER_02]: So then the pregnancy, everything I'm hoping everything was fine and then babies came.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: So she was like our rock during it.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think because she had already given birth to triplets, we just like trusted her so much through the process and she was like, I got this guys.
[SPEAKER_04]: Like, I had her triplets weren't even in the NICU.
[SPEAKER_03]: She literally carried them to 36 weeks, which is full term for triplets.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like they will not let you know past 36 weeks with
[SPEAKER_03]: Wow, not one of them ended up in the name.
[SPEAKER_03]: You're like crazy.
[SPEAKER_03]: That never.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think she's probably the only case where that hasn't been the case.
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh my god, amazing.
[SPEAKER_04]: Our girl shared a placenta and so Ren was pretty growth restricted.
[SPEAKER_04]: Well, I was taking a food and so by the end, she wasn't growing a ton.
[SPEAKER_04]: It felt, so we were doing like weekly, I think non-stress time was just us twice a week.
[SPEAKER_04]: I think we were going in for the non-stress tests and in the end they just figured that it would be easier if we planned a C-section and they could monitor them from the NICU as opposed to having them say in the womb.
[SPEAKER_04]: We were trying to get to 34 weeks, but she started
[SPEAKER_04]: two of them were born around four pounds and red was born just under three pounds.
[SPEAKER_02]: baby.
[SPEAKER_04]: We'll try to get rid of it all, but they were, they were little fighters.
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, they did so good.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm going to make you.
[SPEAKER_03]: They all three of them came home on the same day.
[SPEAKER_03]: They were 23 days in the next few.
[SPEAKER_03]: We got that tattoo on the last 23.
[SPEAKER_04]: They were born on the 23.
[SPEAKER_04]: There's two of us, three of them.
[SPEAKER_04]: So that's kind of just become our little number.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's so sweet.
[SPEAKER_02]: And we got to love that.
[SPEAKER_02]: Wow.
[SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_02]: So amazing.
[SPEAKER_02]: And now they are
[SPEAKER_02]: They're five, five, five years old.
[SPEAKER_02]: You're in it.
[SPEAKER_02]: You are in it.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm trying to tell us.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm a daily.
[SPEAKER_03]: They're just like, you know, taking everything out of us that they can have.
[SPEAKER_02]: But yeah, three of them, three of them.
[SPEAKER_02]: I had, I had one at a time.
[SPEAKER_02]: You know what I mean?
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, yeah.
[SPEAKER_02]: And that killed me.
[SPEAKER_03]: So it's, yeah.
[SPEAKER_02]: Have you done like DNA to do?
[SPEAKER_02]: No, like, who
[SPEAKER_03]: like who's that you don't have to tell me, but like do you know who's embryo and we do and we're not super public about it just because we never want them to feel like you're both or you're all our jids and it like doesn't matter where you or how you they'll they'll know of course but like yeah i do think it's sweet i feel like to us it feels pretty obvious but um a lot of people get it wrong and i think that's kind of sweet i
[SPEAKER_04]: really.
[SPEAKER_02]: People are always telling me and my daughter that we look so much alike and oh my god if she's not the spitting image of you and we love it, you know, like because it's like our special thing that we have.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_02]: So it's cute.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then they all look like triplets still because it like they literally all have the same eyes.
[SPEAKER_03]: They didn't get either our eyes.
[SPEAKER_03]: They got egg donor eyes.
[SPEAKER_02]: This is something that comes up a lot.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like how do you talk to the kids about their origin story and like what's your favorite ways of doing it?
[SPEAKER_02]: Like I use a lot of books.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I still bring the books out.
[SPEAKER_02]: I've been bringing the books out all the time and discuss it.
[SPEAKER_02]: But what is yours like at home?
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, we're just on the regular talk about, I mean, books for sure, right?
[SPEAKER_04]: That's a definitely a pillar of how we communicate it to them, but we're really big on sharing, you know, just we've always said families come and lots of different shapes and sizes and we have, you know,
[SPEAKER_04]: We have friends that are single parents.
[SPEAKER_04]: We have friends that are raising their grandkids.
[SPEAKER_04]: We have you know, lesbian parents, gay parents, and I think just exposing them to that to where it feels normal.
[SPEAKER_04]: It hasn't really become an issue yet.
[SPEAKER_04]: They're starting kindergarten soon.
[SPEAKER_04]: I think that's always scare or you're like, we're
[SPEAKER_04]: we have three kids but they're all our first kids so we'll kind of navigate that as we go but for them we always want it to be part of their story.
[SPEAKER_04]: So we talk about incredible women that help get them here.
[SPEAKER_04]: We made little chat books.
[SPEAKER_04]: I don't know if you've heard of chat books but like little photo albums of like the surrogacy journey and all that they look through and they
[SPEAKER_04]: they know our surrogate Heather and they're like, when we were in Heather's tummy and so it's just always been a part of their vocabulary.
[SPEAKER_04]: We're going to kind of get more age appropriate then we'll be able to include and explain more details based on what they can comprehend but we just always wanted to feel like this is your story and it's special and it's normal.
[SPEAKER_03]: Just like everyone's right
[SPEAKER_02]: That's amazing.
[SPEAKER_02]: I love it.
[SPEAKER_02]: And y'all are doing it all right.
[SPEAKER_02]: And you're the amazing daddies and like, I just love your story.
[SPEAKER_02]: And you know, your kids are gonna be great because they're being raised by dads who get it and who are open and honest and loving and all the things.
[SPEAKER_02]: So just, I just wish the whole world would listen to our story so they could hear like, how much goes into
[SPEAKER_02]: not only the journey to become parents, but the parenting as well, like we put so much, I mean, everybody, I know all parents do.
[SPEAKER_02]: And queer parents have extra layers that we have to navigate with our kids to make sure that they feel safe and loved and don't feel other and never feel
[SPEAKER_02]: the shame of any internalized homophobia or anything like that.
[SPEAKER_02]: So we put a lot of work into working on ourselves.
[SPEAKER_02]: and parenting our kids so that they can go out into the world and be proud of their family.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, so in a lot of ways we're breaking cycles that we had to go through or, and yeah, like a lot of work in our work so that you're not projecting and I mean, because we all experience like so much guilt and shame for who we were and we don't want to pass that along.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's a thing that we learn and then our children see it and then they build the muscle themselves too.
[SPEAKER_02]: And that's the cutest thing when they start outing you.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, no, like my daughter one time was like, this older woman said, oh, look, she just has the same faces.
[SPEAKER_02]: You know what?
[SPEAKER_02]: A durable buck, she was like five or six.
[SPEAKER_02]: And she goes, that's so funny.
[SPEAKER_02]: Cause she didn't born me.
[SPEAKER_04]: Oh, so guys, you and some cute little things they say like that.
[SPEAKER_02]: But the kids, like, the kids start flexing that muscle, too.
[SPEAKER_02]: And then it's really cool to see your kids be little advocates as they go and just be like, yeah, gay, whatever.
[SPEAKER_03]: If you remember, I think it was Willow, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: God asks, like, if she had like her death.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's something she should about her mom and she's like, I don't have a mom.
[SPEAKER_04]: I have a mom.
[SPEAKER_04]: I have two doubts.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm lucky.
[SPEAKER_04]: I'm lucky.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, but she said she did say it.
[SPEAKER_02]: Get it?
[SPEAKER_02]: Get it, Willow?
[SPEAKER_02]: It's amazing.
[SPEAKER_02]: They're going to teach the kids a lot that they encounter, and it's a beautiful blessing.
[SPEAKER_02]: I love it.
[SPEAKER_02]: So what a great story, you too.
[SPEAKER_02]: Thank you for joining.
[SPEAKER_02]: Thank you for sharing your story.
[SPEAKER_02]: Thank you for doing what you do on social media and showing
[SPEAKER_02]: people are not always nice.
[SPEAKER_02]: I know this because it happens to me and I'm not as I don't have as big a following as YouTube.
[SPEAKER_02]: So I'm sure it's not always easy and sometimes scary.
[SPEAKER_02]: But so I just want to say thank you for showing up.
[SPEAKER_03]: No, thank you.
[SPEAKER_03]: We appreciate you and all you're doing and I feel like the more, you know, that we collectively are a voice for our children and the community and I think that that's where the real differences are the, you know, people start changing their perspectives and their minds.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_02]: Changing hearts and minds when posted a time and one one episode at a time.
[SPEAKER_02]: Tell everybody where everyone can find you.
[SPEAKER_02]: If you're not following them yet, get on it because they're the cutest.
[SPEAKER_04]: Oh, you can follow us on all of our channels.
[SPEAKER_04]: We're at Daddy's to three.
[SPEAKER_04]: I'll spell down.
[SPEAKER_04]: Daddy's to tear it up, send downs and crazy life of raising triplets and growing up more men and doing our best every day.
[SPEAKER_04]: So we love our the community that we built and we're great for our opportunities like this because I feel like human stories and really getting to know people on that human level is really what changes hearts.
[SPEAKER_04]: So thank you for what you're doing, Jamie.
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, thank you.
[SPEAKER_02]: Cut, this is just a love fest.
[SPEAKER_02]: Happy Pride.
[SPEAKER_02]: Y'all, thanks for being on the front.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, thank you.
[SPEAKER_03]: Happy Pride.
[SPEAKER_02]: Right, extravaganza.
[SPEAKER_01]: Clear family of our guests.
[SPEAKER_02]: A huge, huge thank you to our sponsor of this year episode, California Cryo Bank.
[SPEAKER_02]: Don't forget to use code queerfam26 to get that free level 3 subscription to their donor catalog.
[SPEAKER_02]: Go make those babies y'all and then come tell me about them.
[SPEAKER_02]: Let's do this.
[SPEAKER_01]: Love is love.
[SPEAKER_02]: Whew, well folks, I hope you enjoyed that episode as much as I enjoyed it.
[SPEAKER_02]: And if you did enjoy it, feel free to listen to another or watch another.
[SPEAKER_02]: I have so many episodes for your listening or viewing pleasure.
[SPEAKER_02]: Just go pick one and enjoy.
[SPEAKER_02]: There's a lot.
[SPEAKER_02]: They're really nice.
[SPEAKER_02]: And also, if you really do like this show, please, I know I say it all the time, but please do consider supporting the show on Patreon.
[SPEAKER_02]: You're just gonna go to patreon.com slash the queer family podcast.
[SPEAKER_02]: You're gonna pick a tear, you're gonna join, and you're gonna get that bonus content.
[SPEAKER_02]: And you're also gonna get my love and adoration for the rest of my life.
[SPEAKER_02]: I love you all, thanks for tuning in, keep on tuning in, and I'll see you next time.