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[SPEAKER_02]: and welcome to another edition of Kyle Meredith with it's the interview series presented by WFPK at WFPK.org consequence and the consequence podcast network thanks for making you way over here check it and sat if you're not already do hit that subscribe button you know how it works
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[SPEAKER_02]: And of course we've had some great guests drop them by lately.
[SPEAKER_02]: In fact, we just talked with Jenna Malone, the actress, she's also a musician, has a new album, and a new show, a Netflix called The Burrows.
[SPEAKER_02]: We spoke with Sean Colvin, Peter Capaldi and Kush Jumbo about the second season of criminal record on Apple TV, the cast of The Audacity on AMC, Barbie Ferreira, and Devombostic about the film Mileyn Kicks.
[SPEAKER_02]: Jason Muse, one half of Jay and Silent Bob and the Kevin Smith Viewers, Blues Legends, Joe Bonamasa and George Benson, Keeley Carson, she stars and in Malcolm in the middle life still unfair.
[SPEAKER_02]: We also hung out with John Hamm, Olivia Mon, Amanda Pete and James Marston to get into the latest season of your friends and neighbors on Apple TV.
[SPEAKER_02]: Derek Trucks, Gade Mataroto, Shagia, Brunley, Lulu, Wilson, Steve, Zon, it's just an example of what you get when you subscribe to the Kyle Meredith with podcast.
[SPEAKER_02]: And that's me, Kyle Meredith.
[SPEAKER_02]: Today, I'm going to be talking with Paul Bettany and Will Sharpe about the Star's original series, Amadeus.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yes, there is a movie in the 80s, and both this series and that movie were based off of the same play.
[SPEAKER_02]: In fact, let's read the synopsis here, based on Peter Schafer's award-winning stage play.
[SPEAKER_02]: And boldly adapted by Joe Barton, 25-year-old Amadeus, arrives in Bustling, 18th century Vienna, no longer a child prodigy, and craving creative freedom.
[SPEAKER_02]: His world collides with two pivotal figures.
[SPEAKER_02]: He is fiercely loyal wife, Kristin's awebber, and devali religious court composer Antonio Salieri.
[SPEAKER_02]: As Amadeus's brilliance continues to flourish in spite of his personal demons, a questionable reputation and skepticism from the conservative court, Salieri becomes increasingly tormented by this apparent divine gift.
[SPEAKER_02]: Amadeus is a threat to all that he holds dear in life, his talent, his reputation, even his faith in God, Salieri vows to bring him down.
[SPEAKER_02]: What begins as professional rivalry turns into a deeply personal obsession spanning 30 years culminating in a murder confession and a desperate attempt to intertwine himself with Mozart's legacy forever.
[SPEAKER_02]: So we're going to get into this.
[SPEAKER_02]: We're going to dig into why this story still hits.
[SPEAKER_02]: And what a longer series that lets them really explore beyond what the film was able to.
[SPEAKER_02]: Paul's going to lean into Sally Ari's perspective, but says this version finally gives Mozart like equal weight, especially the tall genius takes it home and not just in the spotlight.
[SPEAKER_02]: Will, meanwhile, we'll talk about using Mozart's music as a way to get into character chasing the mix of playfulness ego and eventual darkness that builds across the whole series and we get to talk about genius and libraries and that will make sense.
[SPEAKER_02]: until you get into the interview.
[SPEAKER_02]: Also, as a bonus for today's episode, I'm also going to include an older interview of mine with Mark Spiropolis, the conductor of the 16-chapple choir.
[SPEAKER_02]: So that's coming up later, but right now, let's talk about Amadeus on stars.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's Kyle Meredith with Paul Bettany and Will Sharp.
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, it's a, it's pleasure to see you both on here to tell you that not only do I really love this portrayal of, of, of, of, of, of, of, of, of, of, of, of, of, of, of, of this, of, of, of, of this, of, of this show, but I liked it so well that I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've, I've
[SPEAKER_03]: what I think we do something rather different and that the play is very much from Sally Erie's point of view and I think in the by virtue of having five hours.
[SPEAKER_03]: one can open that up and learn about what the burden of genius was on Mozart, you know, that the plays very much in the position of what it's like to be mediocre, and I think that's fascinating and it's why I love the role so much, but I think that what the show
[SPEAKER_03]: And we get to see some of both of their domestic life.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think that's fascinating.
[SPEAKER_03]: Do you believe in genius?
[SPEAKER_03]: Do I believe in genius?
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, do you believe in the kind of genius?
[SPEAKER_03]: In the same way, I believe in libraries.
[SPEAKER_03]: They are geniuses.
[SPEAKER_03]: There are libraries.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't understand.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's a great answer, I'm not arguing with it.
[SPEAKER_02]: Some people, you know, it's not a concept they completely buy into.
[SPEAKER_02]: I agree with you but I want to know your point of view.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't understand it, and I also, and I really mean this, I think it's very hard to understand and that made the casting of will very virtuos, because I think if he's not a genius, he's a very clever boy.
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, let's hear about that.
[SPEAKER_00]: How did you want to portray Ahmadiyya's?
[SPEAKER_00]: I still try to play him as somebody who doesn't believe in libraries.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, please.
[SPEAKER_00]: No, I don't know.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, it was an interesting thing in that obviously this is a very
[SPEAKER_00]: famously fictionalised version of the truth and so in some ways I approached it like any other projects, any other acting roles, what's on the page, what can I find as a way into it and but the one thing that was different was that there was this great resource of Mozart's music and I felt like that was quite an interesting way to sort of obliquely
[SPEAKER_00]: try to get a sense of him as a human being, and there's such a breadth to his music, like some of it is very playful and frivolous and some of it is so grand and sad, you know, and sort of cinematic and trying to marry that all into one person.
[SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, as usual, you sort of start with what's on the page and be led by the director and the cast around you.
[SPEAKER_00]: So you kind of let the music piece maybe lead the way for that era.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I mean, I just found that it was a helpful way of like meditating on the character and sort of thinking about.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, you know, because in the story, he's meet him as sort of quite innocently optimistic and, you know, ambitious, and he doesn't know how to read a room, but he's kind of like a fairly bright energy.
[SPEAKER_00]: And over the course of the series, Salieri, God, circumstance, all of these things kind of grind him down into a bit more of a sort of desperate darker human being.
[SPEAKER_00]: and I found that listening to his music, which is not something you normally have, you know, the music really did come from the person, you know, it's a part of him.
[SPEAKER_00]: I've found that like a really valuable and unusual resource, I suppose, is all I mean.
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, it's beautifully played by both of you and your eyes towards the end of it in Sallieri's cat bless, as I said, I bought into it every bit, so congratulations to both of you.
[SPEAKER_02]: I so much enjoyed watching and talking to you today.
[SPEAKER_02]: Thank you very much.
[SPEAKER_02]: Thank you.
[SPEAKER_02]: Nice to meet you.
[SPEAKER_02]: Bye, Cole.
[SPEAKER_02]: And we'll be right back right after this.
[SPEAKER_02]: Welcome back.
[SPEAKER_02]: So I mentioned earlier that I was going to, it's going to replay rewind as we say an interview of mine from back in 2018 when I spoke with Mark Spiroppelous of the 16 Chapel choir, which is this is the Pope's 1500 year old choir.
[SPEAKER_02]: And what happens when a 1500-year-old choir starts digging up music that no one's heard in century?
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, Mark's going to talk about being the first British member in the group, their coast to coast U.S. tour that was happening at that time, and how they went back to original Renaissance manuscripts that were pulled straight from the Vatican archives.
[SPEAKER_02]: He's going to get into the mix of discipline and expression inside the choir, meeting Pope Francis just weeks into his job, and how a more progressive Vatican.
[SPEAKER_02]: had opened the door to collaborations across denominations.
[SPEAKER_02]: A little history, little mystery, little Indiana Jones energy.
[SPEAKER_02]: Let's do this.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's a part two special episode today.
[SPEAKER_02]: This is Kyle Meredith with Mark Spiroppelous of the 16 Chapel Choir.
[SPEAKER_02]: Kyle, good morning.
[SPEAKER_02]: So the 16-chapple choir.
[SPEAKER_02]: You're doing your first U.S. tour in the history.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I think, you know, this is, it's our first, it's our biggest U.S. tour.
[SPEAKER_04]: Oh, okay.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's not quite the first, it's our first toast toast U.S. tour.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's still something pretty landmark and noteworthy right there, especially because this is one of those choirs.
[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, anything associated with, I guess, the Pope, there's still so much mystery, I think to it.
[SPEAKER_02]: And when you've got something like this, like, the choir itself has been around for 1500 years.
[SPEAKER_02]: Is that right?
[SPEAKER_02]: That's right.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm guessing there's no original members at this point, though.
[UNKNOWN]: I think so.
[UNKNOWN]: That's right.
[SPEAKER_02]: So what brought on this tour in this magnitude?
[SPEAKER_02]: Why now?
[SPEAKER_04]: Well, the city choir, of course, has been over 1,500 years, and I think now is the right time because in recent years we've made now four discs with a Deutsche Grammophone, and the city choir is really excited to share the music that we think for a regular day and they're out for the pope with a broader audience, and the Vatican is very keen that we should send out this extraordinary culture that we are very fortunate to be a part of.
[SPEAKER_04]: to Catholic and anybody worldwide.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, and what I gather, where the choir is right now, as I read the press release, somebody just read the quote here, the cutting-edge research and study of Renaissance music.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's the focus, right, Renaissance?
[SPEAKER_04]: Yes, because the right one is the time in which
[SPEAKER_04]: In the 16th chapter of the Vatican, there is this extraordinary flowering of art and music.
[SPEAKER_04]: It really is this incredible time of creativity.
[SPEAKER_04]: That's where the 16th century is so important.
[SPEAKER_04]: And you can see it in the art.
[SPEAKER_04]: Through everybody knows the great frescoes of Michelangelo, the singers of Adam and God coming together.
[SPEAKER_04]: This is the music contemporary with that.
[SPEAKER_04]: And we have great composers, Patafrina, Laos, Victoria and Allegri who wrote at that time, writing some of the most beautiful and spiritual music.
[SPEAKER_02]: And what we're going to be hearing on the tour here is the music from these last few releases that you put out.
[SPEAKER_04]: That's right.
[SPEAKER_04]: So some of the best music from our last recordings.
[SPEAKER_04]: And some of the music, you know,
[SPEAKER_04]: It's not very famous, it's sung by, you know, quite across the world, but some of it has not been heard for hundreds of years.
[SPEAKER_04]: The Vatican Archives, as you say, we talk about mystery.
[SPEAKER_04]: There is huge mystery in these archives.
[SPEAKER_04]: Some of this music has been sitting there collecting dust for centuries.
[SPEAKER_04]: And Maestro Palambele, who's a kind of, like an Indiana Jones of an A-thon of music, who goes into the Vatican archives, finds this stuff, it's all covered in dust, and makes these new additions from it, because of course, he is the maestro of the city chapel, but he's the only person who has,
[SPEAKER_04]: full 100% access to this music.
[SPEAKER_04]: So he has the access to the time which he puts a great youth to revise this really astonishing tradition.
[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, this lost music, well, not lost anymore, but, you know, seemingly lost for so long, was there anything that you personally were surprised to find in it?
[SPEAKER_02]: Something that you didn't quite expect in the music.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yes, well, I mean, there's a piece, the Allegri Miserera, which, for anybody who knows a little bit about crime, you think, knows this is a piece, but it's sort of, has an absolute misdeic about it.
[SPEAKER_04]: And it went through various different concepts, while the, the, the, the cathartis sang it for hundreds of years, and then Mozart heard it, and nobody would have had it, copy it out of the 16th century.
[SPEAKER_04]: Then he was sung once a year, and then the young Mozart came and heard him in 14 wrote it all out from memory.
[SPEAKER_04]: Then that piece went around Europe and went into various different geyses and recorded for the first time about 100 years ago.
[SPEAKER_04]: But what might have happened, the ability to find the original, the earliest edition of this, we have from 1661, with a legaries owned hand on it, and that we sing that, we sing the original notes that were written from the early 17th century, so
[SPEAKER_04]: It's a very famous piece of music, which has gone through so many different interpretations.
[SPEAKER_04]: We went right back to the beginning and found what it really was.
[SPEAKER_04]: And this is the piece that I've been very familiar with growing up with a young choral singer.
[SPEAKER_04]: But then to come back and rediscover this piece.
[SPEAKER_04]: And it's original, fantastic, but that's one example.
[SPEAKER_02]: All right.
[SPEAKER_04]: You're thinking that, and I'll concentrate.
[SPEAKER_04]: I'll let it in with that area.
[SPEAKER_02]: That is amazing.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's just amazing to have that kind of access right there.
[SPEAKER_02]: And it's like finding one of those, as you're saying, it's like finding an old recipe almost, you know, hundreds of year old, something you thought you knew what it tasted like, and here's the original version.
[SPEAKER_04]: It really is.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_02]: The background on you, by the way, we should bring this up.
[SPEAKER_02]: You come from London.
[SPEAKER_02]: You've got a pretty amazing resume.
[SPEAKER_02]: Do I get this right?
[SPEAKER_02]: You're the first ever Brit in the Sistine Chapel choir?
[SPEAKER_04]: And, well, yeah, as far as we know, I mean, suddenly since the Reformation, we don't know of any British thing.
[SPEAKER_04]: I don't know any British thing.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's what I've gone over since the Reformation.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's possible there was one before, although we don't have any record, and there were some things that came from all across Europe, but as far as we know, I'm the first British member of the 16-subtle qualiers.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's amazing.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's, I mean, that's got to feel pretty heavy right here.
[SPEAKER_04]: That's, yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: It was only when I first started, it was, it was, I think, surreal, it's really
[SPEAKER_02]: And we'll be right back right out to this.
[SPEAKER_02]: Welcome back.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's Kyle Meredith with Mark Spyropless of the Sistine Chapel Choir.
[SPEAKER_02]: And you've got, I mean, you've got a really great resume leading up to this.
[SPEAKER_02]: But I wonder, you know, to land something like this, is this the big time?
[SPEAKER_02]: Is this like where, you know, a choral singer would want to get to or is, or would you say this is a stop on the line?
[SPEAKER_04]: Oh, you know, perhaps I'll only know that in retrospect.
[SPEAKER_04]: All I can say is it's, uh,
[SPEAKER_04]: It's an amazing experience.
[SPEAKER_04]: It really is something quite extraordinary.
[SPEAKER_04]: And I'm very lucky, and of course, to be a member of this choir, but to be a member of this choir at this time, as it, you know, in the 20th century, though, the choir had kind of got itself into a bit of a rot, and then in the last sort of 10 years with Maestro Palombella, it has completely
[SPEAKER_04]: renewed itself to become a fantastic force in in core music and particularly in Renaissance music to really and and confidently express as I suppose the Catholic church and it's most beautiful I think that's how I see it and I know it's from what I understand pretty competitive to get into this too I mean this is sort of like the All-Star team for for Coral singers right?
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah I mean you could say that it's some there are a lot of people who would
[SPEAKER_04]: I, you know, I come from England and we have a great court edition in England and I, I'm sung in Catholic and Anglican, choirs in England and I think, you know, my sort of Alabama, I wanted, I think, a little bit of that ingredient, a bit of a bit of the sort of the choral, the discipline of the English choral of music.
[SPEAKER_04]: The Italians are fantastic at being expressive and they have such an instinctive connection with this music.
[SPEAKER_04]: But you know, we can be quite disciplined and perhaps the ingredients that he wants it in the choir.
[SPEAKER_02]: There are some definite stereotypes it plays.
[SPEAKER_04]: Absolutely.
[SPEAKER_04]: And I hope that both Italians are too offended.
[SPEAKER_02]: So I've got to ask some of the questions.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm sure you get to ask all the time.
[SPEAKER_02]: Do you get to meet the Pope?
[SPEAKER_04]: I have met the Pope.
[SPEAKER_04]: I didn't get much of a chance to talk to him, but if I met the Pope in a couple of lineups, I met him three times.
[SPEAKER_04]: The first time I met him was in my second week, and that was kind of mind blowing, you know.
[SPEAKER_04]: It was the morning of my first papal math.
[SPEAKER_04]: which is in some teachers which is anybody has been to table math and those is an an amazing event, thousands and thousands of people broadcast live across the world and it was just before that and I was told to line up in front of the Michelangelo P.A.Tard as a beautiful sculpture and I didn't quite know what was happening and then you know himself appears.
[SPEAKER_04]: and I was the first person in the lineup, and you know, I've never let a pope before, I didn't know how to do it.
[SPEAKER_04]: And he, he, if no, my sister came longer than an introduced Holy Father, this is Mark, for hopefully there's a thing from London.
[SPEAKER_04]: And the Pope Francis said to me, you want to trouble London, I said yes, Holy Father.
[SPEAKER_04]: He said, he said,
[SPEAKER_04]: It is wonderful, you know, hey, welcome to the Vatican.
[SPEAKER_04]: It's so happy you are singing here with us.
[SPEAKER_04]: It was like somebody inviting me into their home almost.
[SPEAKER_04]: You're here with us, you know, you're welcome with us.
[SPEAKER_04]: That's great.
[SPEAKER_04]: Welcome to the Vatican.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's just right there at ease.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, here you are.
[SPEAKER_02]: Right, there it is.
[SPEAKER_04]: I really understood, you know, this amazing personality that she's so thankful for having.
[SPEAKER_04]: It was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, you know, this Pope, you know, he sort of known as one of the more progressive popes than what we've known in the past.
[SPEAKER_02]: And what does that affect the choir in any way that sort of sense and direction?
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, very much so.
[SPEAKER_04]: Because Pope Francis has called for practical acumenism and our response to that is that we can we can take
[SPEAKER_04]: this beautiful Catholic tradition, and we can sing with other choirs from other Christian denominations.
[SPEAKER_04]: So we have sung now with many Anglican choirs in London and here in New York we sung with some Thomson-Seth Avenue, also Lutheran choirs we sang in the Vittonburg, we have to serve a choirs in Germany and Stockholm and also the Mosque Patriarch choirs.
[SPEAKER_04]: Because when we sing together we can express our closeness
[SPEAKER_04]: a real understanding of the faith from where we come from and we can focus on what we understand and what we appreciate about each other rather than always focusing on the difference.
[SPEAKER_02]: No, I mean, and to be an artist, you know, in just a basic sense, I mean, sharing and collaboration is everything sort of be able to open that up.
[SPEAKER_04]: Absolutely.
[SPEAKER_04]: And of course, as you say, it's a cultural exchange as well.
[SPEAKER_04]: And that's for me is it's such a wonderful thing to be a part of.
[SPEAKER_04]: You know, the Anglicans or Russians or Lutherans can sing together.
[SPEAKER_04]: And we understand a common language.
[SPEAKER_02]: to beautiful sentiment.
[SPEAKER_02]: I will kind of wrap up here by asking, you know, Pope Francis did put out a record a few years ago.
[SPEAKER_02]: It was a Prague rock record.
[SPEAKER_02]: Have you heard it?
[SPEAKER_04]: No, it's not really my speciality I've got to say.
[SPEAKER_04]: More about the 16th century myself, but I'm sure it's fantastic and I'll make sure I get a copy immediately.
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, it exists.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's out there.
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't think it's going anywhere.
[SPEAKER_02]: But maybe maybe one day, you know, there'll be a great collaboration in that sense.
[SPEAKER_02]: I I don't know.
[SPEAKER_04]: Maybe that's why I'm going on for this.
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, Mark, it really has been a pleasure talking to you.
[SPEAKER_02]: Um, enjoy this tour, this US tour.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like I said, I know this is a really, really big deal.
[SPEAKER_02]: and we're so honored to have you over here in the country.
[SPEAKER_04]: Thank you very much.
[SPEAKER_04]: I should just say, I know that we don't do one income to Kentucky, but our closest.
[SPEAKER_04]: St. Louis, to the way.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's the Louis and Chicago.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's a Chicago place.
[SPEAKER_02]: We're centrally located.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's the nice thing about Kentucky.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's everything is just around us.
[SPEAKER_02]: So you got options.
[SPEAKER_02]: We got objects.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, but yeah, definitely the St. Louis one is the closest one, and we'll look to see you out there.
[SPEAKER_02]: OK.
[SPEAKER_02]: Thank you very much indeed.
[SPEAKER_02]: My thanks to Mark.
[SPEAKER_02]: My thanks to Paul Bettany and Will Sharp and my thanks to you for checking out the episode.
[SPEAKER_02]: Hit that subscribe button.
[SPEAKER_02]: Before you get out of here, keep up with all the interviews that I put out every single week at Spotify, Apple Podcast, NPR, WFPK.org, consequence, YouTube for the video versions or anywhere you get your podcasts from.
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[SPEAKER_02]: That does it for another edition.
[SPEAKER_02]: Don't cry on Meredith, I'll see you next time.
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