[SPEAKER_00]: This is the sales gravy podcast.
[SPEAKER_00]: Hi, I'm Jeb Blunt, gasoline author, fanatical prospecting objection, sales EQ, and ink.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm here to help you open more doors, close bigger deals, and rock your commission check.
[SPEAKER_01]: Welcome here to sales gravy podcast.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's absolutely wonderful to have you back with us again.
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's having me.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, you're welcome.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I want to jump right into, I want to know, how did you get your start in tech and like, SaaS sales in that world?
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, I fell into it.
[SPEAKER_02]: I wasn't on the hunt.
[SPEAKER_02]: I wasn't ready, you know, let's go into this role and find this industry.
[SPEAKER_02]: I was an events organizer and then managed to get myself an role in a tech company doing events, which was like the Google Ask and we had a slide that went outside and really cool things.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so I was let loose there and kind of found my feet in other roles and helped them grow the business and saw out some of the different departments.
[SPEAKER_02]: landed in sales, which to see I would always want me to do, and I was over my depot, it was my vibe at the time, and then the more I got to know the company and the organization, the impact, the more I want to help them have that impact wider, and that's essentially what sales is.
[SPEAKER_02]: So...
[SPEAKER_02]: what with them grew that grew an outbound sales team and then moved to Australia and then forged the cybersecurity path that I have today.
[SPEAKER_01]: I hope that's awesome.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I loved your background and events, you know, especially being in the in the tech and like SaaS space.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's a much more complex sales cycle.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I'm sure there's a lot of skills that you developed and with your events background that contributed to that.
[SPEAKER_01]: So what might some of those things
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I think for me the the piece was the confidence piece around dealing with people and I was you're I didn't go to university so I was young going into a workforce and you know I was 16 I had three jobs and then I was a nanny and then I went into all these other roles so I've I've done everything and so I think for me coming into that event role was that I was running events all over the UK so I did about 150, 160 events a year which is a lot when you break it down into how many per week.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I was jumping in a car, and I had this big Chrysler, like, slidy door, job, and then I had to stand up in front of all the delegates and present, you know, who was gonna be speaking that day.
[SPEAKER_02]: And that was new for me.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I've always been confident, but not in a position of standing up in front of people.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I remember the sweaty kind of palms.
[SPEAKER_02]: And now I do it in front of thousands, and don't even think about it.
[SPEAKER_02]: So it was really where I forged, I think, my confidence.
[SPEAKER_02]: And the translation to the technical of the so many moving parts,
[SPEAKER_02]: was being able to understand something and make it relevant to other people.
[SPEAKER_02]: And that's what we have to do in sales.
[SPEAKER_02]: It doesn't matter if it's technical or if it's something that's a bit more complex or even not, our job is to make everybody understand what it is that we do and how we do it.
[SPEAKER_02]: So that people can refer us and translate it and understand where it impacts.
[SPEAKER_02]: So for me, I think there's been a multitude of reasons or things that I've done that have impacted the way that I'd sell today, especially in a technical space.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's really cool.
[SPEAKER_01]: I was having a conversation earlier today, and the person I was talking to, I stopped for a second.
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is about to get really technical, but I'm going to explain.
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, stop me if we need to, but let's start here.
[SPEAKER_01]: And you know, it's just definitely understanding your audience and finding that line of how to translate.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's almost like sitting down with the doctor sometimes.
[SPEAKER_01]: They have all the, you know, medical terminology that they're using
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, what does that mean for me and those things that they bad are they something I should do and if it was your child or your daughter or your friend?
[SPEAKER_02]: What would you recommend and yeah, and it does it definitely comes back.
[SPEAKER_02]: I remember there was a is a salon and they had seven salons across across Western Australia and I knew her through a friend and she said,
[SPEAKER_02]: technical, but it was, you know, we need Wi-Fi.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so I said, I'm going to come out.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm going to bring one of my engineers.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm going to figure out how many you need, because her idea was I'm just going to buy, you know, three, three for each space.
[SPEAKER_02]: And this is what this is how we're roll it out.
[SPEAKER_02]: But when you've got doors and frames and metal and all those things, you have to know more about it.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so I was there as the translator almost between the engineer.
[SPEAKER_02]: that knows all the technical stuff and just wants to be technical, because it also makes people feel, if you can speak your own language of the thing that you do and somebody's like, wow, I don't know all of that and that's totally above my head.
[SPEAKER_02]: That can almost feel quite cool, when actually I think it does the opposite and something that the owner of the cell on said was, she said, I can do the same thing to you that you're doing to me in skin.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, she said, I can talk about all the different and she listed all these words I've never heard of before.
[SPEAKER_02]: and it was such a great scenario for me to be part of because I already knew it, but to have the example where you've got this engineer that's doing his best and trying to try to get this thing to work, but if they can't translate it,
[SPEAKER_02]: You can sell all you want, but if when it comes down to it, the person implementing it makes you feel like an idiot, you're not going to buy from them.
[SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely.
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's like a worse position to be in as a buyer and a seller.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like you want to understand just as exactly what it is you're investing in.
[SPEAKER_01]: And as a seller, you're going to be as clear as possible.
[SPEAKER_01]: I love that.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I guess my next question for you is in terms of sales cycles, walk me through the tech sales.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I go, says, close to staff got into tech is I was in telecom sales for a while.
[SPEAKER_01]: So again, yeah, depending depending depending on your client, it's kind of determines, you know, the level of complexity and at least the sales cycle for us in there.
[SPEAKER_01]: It was usually pretty short.
[SPEAKER_01]: It wasn't
[SPEAKER_01]: Too long, but if you don't mind going into that, of course.
[SPEAKER_02]: So I would say in general just to generalize it's about six to nine months it can be it I would say on average if you get the right place right time or if you're not replacing technology with a new technology or new service
[SPEAKER_02]: That will could be anything from, you know, if they let's say if they're reviewing it, now it could be a renewal in three to six months, but it could be an outbound conversation that then has turned into, look, we'll review again, but we've got two years after my contract.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's dependent on that, and I think today.
[SPEAKER_02]: We're very rarely going in, sharing something mind-breakingly different.
[SPEAKER_02]: We're still using firewalls and we're replacing a firewall.
[SPEAKER_02]: There are new softwares often coming out that's security-lip related and obviously AI.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's out there.
[SPEAKER_02]: So all of those, they tend to be something new.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so all we're doing is matching against budget.
[SPEAKER_02]: The challenge with tag is the budget or cybersecurity, the budget is just constantly going up and I think we can probably say that for most things, but it's always going up and it's always the thing that keeps people up at night.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so you could then say, well, the cost of leasing cars is going up.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, but you can deal with an old car, you know, it's not going to be the end of the world.
[SPEAKER_02]: But if you keep with old technology, it could be the difference between a breach or somebody hacking and holding it.
[SPEAKER_02]: Rensen is so much at stake.
[SPEAKER_02]: So sales cycles tend to be a bit longer and so therefore you want a pipeline that supports that and to be mindful of how you're gonna go to market because I've seen it where I've had, especially people coming from advertising that's quick.
[SPEAKER_02]: Do you wanna be on that billboard?
[SPEAKER_02]: If you wanna be on that billboard by now,
[SPEAKER_02]: Versus, we need to have a conversation, we need to consult, we need to qualify, and then we design a solution.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's like building or buying a house, it's going to take a bit longer, because you're not necessarily going straight to something that's already there.
[SPEAKER_02]: I've been going to build it and design it and make those decisions.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I think that's probably why it takes a little bit longer in this industry.
[SPEAKER_01]: I love that.
[SPEAKER_01]: I like how you put it to design the solution, which is a consultative approach.
[SPEAKER_01]: in the process and selling, which is actually a style of selling that I prefer because when I like to really learn about my clients, but I also want to make sure that solution is specifically tailored to their needs.
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, I've seen it before where people said, I have all this extra stuff and I don't need it.
[SPEAKER_01]: So it happens more than, you know, we care to see, but yeah, no, I love that love the design of it.
[SPEAKER_01]: So my next question is going to be, what's kind of like your philosophy in your own style of selling?
[SPEAKER_02]: So for me, I also love a consultative sales approach and I wonder if it's more female driven.
[SPEAKER_02]: I would end you to know if it's what you think of that because we are naturally nurturers and you know, we're like tallers about it and give me all the insights.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so I think for me, my philosophy is always definitely been around that consultative, tell me more, let me understand everything and then we can find a path.
[SPEAKER_02]: The thing I think I've always
[SPEAKER_02]: done really well, which has helped me get to where I am today, has been in that qualification.
[SPEAKER_02]: I've usually uncovered five, six, seven opportunities, but I've only ever driven one to begin with.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so that's been my approach of, let me, if you tell me everything, I'm going to find more than one thing in here.
[SPEAKER_02]: And then when I find more than one thing, I'm then going to work with you to figure out what could we do first.
[SPEAKER_02]: And what happens and is that we uncover, we draw about the curtain and then we have a conversation to determine what will have the biggest impact for you.
[SPEAKER_02]: We get an opportunity to work together in something quite small before we do the next thing.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so we start to build trust and then from that trust we can do more together.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I think that for me is just coming around back to the what's in it for the client and that's what I really care about maybe a more in more of a fortunate position now or was especially in the the late days of of being in tech sales.
[SPEAKER_02]: is that I didn't need the sale because I made so much money.
[SPEAKER_02]: It didn't really matter.
[SPEAKER_02]: So it wasn't, I was no longer driven by the money, but it was driven by, can I have an impact?
[SPEAKER_02]: And therefore, if I couldn't, I would then say, look, I don't know if I'm the best because you want this and I work in this way with these with these people, with this technology.
[SPEAKER_02]: So, can I recommend somebody else, or do you mind if I just don't throw my hat in the ring this time?
[SPEAKER_02]: And what I've found it does is just make people want you more, which is not really what I was doing.
[SPEAKER_02]: And because I'd still say no, and still have to be like, who's still a still can't, you know, don't want to or can't support you?
[SPEAKER_02]: But by doing that, it then meant that I could really approach it very naturally.
[SPEAKER_02]: And also, if I found, because you've mentioned before, that, you know, people walk away feel like they've got all this stuff that they don't really need.
[SPEAKER_02]: And for me, I would go in as a consultant, really, without being that.
[SPEAKER_02]: To then say, well, if you already have this technology, it already does a lot for you.
[SPEAKER_02]: Why don't we just help you use it better?
[SPEAKER_02]: Because if you can leverage the technology you already have, you're not having to spend any more money,
[SPEAKER_02]: It's going to have a bigger impact on your organisation, and that's what I care about.
[SPEAKER_02]: Not about, do you want to buy my next solution or do the next thing?
[SPEAKER_02]: Yep, because that will come and it might not be you, it might be your friend or it might be your colleague.
[SPEAKER_02]: But that's really the integrity approach that I guess really I drive.
[SPEAKER_01]: No, I love that.
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, something occurred to me while you were explaining all that you're almost simultaneously building your pipeline but also a very strong referral network.
[SPEAKER_01]: Which I think is a beautiful thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I got to be honest, I think referrals salespeople don't take advantage enough of asking for referrals.
[SPEAKER_01]: And one of our earlier conversations you've mentioned that every time you come to a client, you're getting more referrals from them.
[SPEAKER_01]: And that is just a fabulous approach, is such a great way to again build out that network.
[SPEAKER_01]: It strengthens your pipeline especially with the longer sales cycles.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, with that said, what are some things that you do to nurture those clients through the longer sales cycles, especially if they already have an existing contract?
[SPEAKER_01]: Because I ran into quite a bit, you know, these contracts are usually multiple years.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, what did you do to help yourself stand out in those situations?
[SPEAKER_01]: I love this question.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is definitely good for me.
[SPEAKER_02]: Thank you, Ashley.
[SPEAKER_02]: Sure.
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, how do we keep in touch?
[SPEAKER_02]: It's the number one thing I think people miss out and sales people were driven for the now and if we're so driven by a number that is almost kind of our of reach each time, we're scrambling for that next thing.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so for me, if I speak to somebody and they say it's 24 months, till we can actually do something.
[SPEAKER_02]: related to what I've reached out to and sometimes that's not always just the only thing that we can do.
[SPEAKER_02]: But it's the reason why we're in that meeting or having that conversation.
[SPEAKER_02]: What I'm doing there is using all the tools that I have at my disposal.
[SPEAKER_02]: So 24 months time call that's on this day.
[SPEAKER_02]: So I block that in.
[SPEAKER_02]: I know that's happening.
[SPEAKER_02]: So
[SPEAKER_02]: 24 months time, the future me will thank now me for the thinking about this.
[SPEAKER_02]: So I've blocked it in, I know what's happening.
[SPEAKER_02]: I then work backwards because I want to remain front of mind, recent and frequent.
[SPEAKER_02]: So the easiest way for me to do that is connect with the modeling tin, and then I just post regularly.
[SPEAKER_02]: So now you're going to see me without really me having to reach out and it's that one to many.
[SPEAKER_02]: So great.
[SPEAKER_02]: Take that box.
[SPEAKER_02]: I know when it's happening and I've got my LinkedIn thing happening.
[SPEAKER_02]: The next piece that I then do is then look at the the dates of when I'd want to check in.
[SPEAKER_02]: So it's not just a hey.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's been three months.
[SPEAKER_02]: How are you?
[SPEAKER_02]: it's a reason.
[SPEAKER_02]: So it's finding something.
[SPEAKER_02]: And if you are new, you may not know what that reason is going to be, but in three months' time, you'll know what the reason is.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so future you will be better than who you are today.
[SPEAKER_02]: So if we book that in then for every 12 weeks, I have a reminder set of think of something or think of a reason to connect is often all my reminder will say, if I don't know enough about them and then therefore my next
[SPEAKER_02]: we've just closed this client or we've now got an event on that we didn't have three months ago.
[SPEAKER_02]: So now I can talk about that and things will happen where they'll come back into my mind, but we don't want to rely on memory because we'll drop the ball on something because we're human and we've got millions of things to do and you want hundreds in your pipeline, you don't want 10, you want hundreds if not thousands of people in the next two years to speak to an
[SPEAKER_02]: So I've got my day, I've got my LinkedIn and then I've got my reminder and that's really all I need at this stage because other stuff will come up and then the second or the I guess for the fourth piece but the second side to that is connecting with other people in the organization because not everyone makes a decision about everything that you offer yeah hands on your industry depends on what you do but for me in this industry I'm looking at people that are
[SPEAKER_02]: other decision makers and other departments, and so even if we look at sales trading, might come from sales, but it might come from marketing, and it might come from revenue or finance.
[SPEAKER_02]: So it depends on who's driving what?
[SPEAKER_02]: So if I connect with everybody and they all start to see my content and then they see that I'm connected with their head of sales or their head of, you know, IT, they're going to then ask that person who is that person and who are they in?
[SPEAKER_02]: And oh,
[SPEAKER_02]: and then they're happy to do the instruction because they want to beat the big guy and they will be the I know her and I know him and so that starts to happen and so without me having to do very much, just every 12 weeks think of something, reason to engage, that's it, everything else starts to fall into place and the more I learn about them and the more I learn about myself and about what's going on with my clients, the more value I can add over the two years.
[SPEAKER_01]: I love that.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, you're leveraging those relationships in such a wonderful way that they almost become your partner in pursuing another division that's available with the opportunity.
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's also an area where I think people tend to miss is like the other opportunity that's there, the expansion for, and that's for sales and account managers.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, look into it, connect.
[SPEAKER_01]: Do we do a really good job of connecting with our clients and other individuals and organizations?
[SPEAKER_01]: They'll leverage in the relationships that you already have and treating like that partnership, if it's just beautiful.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's a great way to manage that.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I know.
[SPEAKER_02]: It feels authentic because I think that's the piece we often miss in sales is that we're not just selling.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's not the goal isn't here to sell.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's that we're just humans are human and so if we are just normal, and that may also be the challenges that if you're not normally, you know, that way in kind or conversational or consultative,
[SPEAKER_02]: It's probably gonna feel quite inauthentic and so maybe you have to find the right industry in the right and the right way to approach it But it's normal.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's the way that you know if we've we've we've connected we've been out for dinner last night We're at we're on LinkedIn and we've talked about hobbies and we've talked about life and so if something comes up I'm not gonna have a reminder that says think as I'm interested in Ashley, but if something pops up And I think of a conversation we had it's gonna take me straight back there and I'm naturally gonna send you something
[SPEAKER_02]: because it will just feel that that's what I should be doing, but there's no sale goal at the end of it.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's how I naturally communicate.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's how I build relationships.
[SPEAKER_02]: So I think it was also about finding the path that suits your personality and the way that you communicate.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so for some of you might have to go a bit more for some of you might have to pull it back.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's just dependent on how you want to show up and and who you are.
[SPEAKER_01]: I totally agree with that.
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, I had a client earlier this week that
[SPEAKER_01]: They are in learning and development for their company, but she's absolutely fabulous at reporting like she does a phenomenal job and so there's article that came to my inbox and I read it and I was like, wow, this is really cool information I sent it to her and was just genuinely like
[SPEAKER_01]: Hey, I'm working on this right now, but what are your thoughts about this information out of this?
[SPEAKER_01]: And so it's just a totally organic genuine conversation, and you know, on the other hand, you know, I shared with you, I started an automotive sale.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, of course, this is B to C. But sometimes you end up with people that aren't ready to buy a car that day, and it's going to take several months.
[SPEAKER_01]: And in those approaches, it was more
[SPEAKER_01]: I would put notes into the CRM about, you know, birthdays, if they had grandchildren that were playing sports, those sort of things and then do the same thing, I would set a reminder, come back and just have a more genuine conversation with them, and I wouldn't necessarily talk about the car.
[SPEAKER_01]: I would just say, hey, just thinking about you today, and then that resulted in me having clients that were loyal to myself and not necessarily the company that I was working with, so it's interesting in both sides of it, how that plays out.
[SPEAKER_02]: And that's so interesting because imagine companies were really super happy because I was the same in my role because people buy from people and so this is what happens to one leaves and they follow them especially for saying that industry and even if you don't but they've still a way for them to engage with you.
[SPEAKER_02]: they will still follow you there.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I've got a friend in sales over here who I've been staying with and she just got a meeting that she's been trying to get for so long and somebody moved into a different role and she got her meeting.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so that's come from remember who they are and being mindful about the things that they care about because that's what makes the impact and that's how we make people feel great.
[SPEAKER_02]: And interestingly, I would talk about buying cars or sell people selling cars as an allergies, but there's an as well as selling houses, but I know when I went to look at a car for a couple of years ago, I have two lab riddles, okay?
[SPEAKER_02]: That they're my life.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like there's, you know, people that have listened to me before, it's a lot to talk about, as well as bit of sales.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so for me, I wanted a car that we could withstand two lab riddles that they can jump in the back, that we can still have luggage, all these, all the stuff that's important to me.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so for me, it would be, you know, seats that can't be sobered on, or
[SPEAKER_02]: seats that won't rip when my Labrador decides to jump in a bag rather than in the boo and all those things.
[SPEAKER_02]: But it's very, I've never had anybody sell me the right car because they don't pick up on the things that I've given them.
[SPEAKER_02]: And obviously, I mean, I'm a sales geek, so I'm just looking at people like tell me all the things I want I want to hear.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_02]: After I find it so interesting that I don't think that's common and that's obviously why why we do what we do and why why we have these these
[SPEAKER_02]: But it's there because we think differently, but it's definitely a missed opportunity for so many to stand out from the crowd and all it takes is just to listen.
[SPEAKER_02]: Make a couple of notes and people will feel like you care when it comes right around, but you genuinely do because that's what you do naturally anyway.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, no, absolutely.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think that's just such a huge advantage when you're going into these
[SPEAKER_01]: So everybody has that one client or that one deal that stands out to them good or bad, but I want to know what is your favorite deal that you have ever closed and then you're most challenging deal that you've ever closed.
[SPEAKER_01]: They can be the same thing.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, okay, search over it and challenging.
[SPEAKER_02]: I would say, I reckon one of the most challenging was just down to time, I think.
[SPEAKER_02]: And that was just, it was a long game, but they became my house paying client over the years.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I still talk about them very thoroughly today.
[SPEAKER_02]: And it was one, I remember going out and they were, they were with somebody else and they were all good, but the guy was so nice that he took my meeting and we had a good chat and got to know a bit more and I just found the opportunities to just re-engage him again and come back round and find things to kind of share with him and invite him to.
[SPEAKER_02]: and eventually it was actually because the other provider, they actually turned up in a Porsche.
[SPEAKER_02]: I found this hilarious.
[SPEAKER_02]: And they actually turned up in a Porsche or anything, and which I don't know what it's like, do people make comments on what cars people drive for your clients to be had then?
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, not necessarily for our clients, definitely.
[SPEAKER_01]: When I was an automotive, we certainly had some opinions.
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_01]: But that was also a good stage to learn not to judge a book by its cover.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_01]: Because I had a very high profile.
[SPEAKER_01]: customer that lives around here and when he walked on the lot, he was in a Hawaiian shirt in gym shorts, had a whole team with him, but everybody else refused to talk to him because they were like, no way this guy is going to buy a car.
[SPEAKER_01]: He bought four cars and one day.
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, wow.
[SPEAKER_02]: Exactly.
[SPEAKER_02]: So there's that, but what it looks like from the other side is that a lot and a hit us a lot.
[SPEAKER_02]: I thought it was mainly big in the UK, but I have seen it a little bit in Australia as well, is that the provider's shop rocked up in a Porsche and the CFO saw, and so he then went into the IT guy and said, cut every quote that he gives us down by 20% or we're not doing it.
[SPEAKER_02]: And because, in his head, he was thinking, well, they're just charging us too much, which it blows my mind still to this day that that's helped.
[SPEAKER_02]: And people do still think like that, and that's such a thing.
[SPEAKER_02]: But that was what happened.
[SPEAKER_02]: That ball got dropped in so many words, and so I was able to come in and showcase and build it through.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I think that's actually there was an example which I can probably show, which is challenging.
[SPEAKER_02]: It was actually probably the one of the only times I've ever cried.
[SPEAKER_02]: about a sale because I'm never that connected to the outcome, but it was more about the situation and the same client and I remember quoting, we've been working with him for a number of years, quoted a solution that had taken long time to design, we've got a specialist involved, we delivered it, we were told that we were going to win this.
[SPEAKER_02]: and they ended up on the Friday and wait him in the office before because we go to the public lunchtime on a Friday.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I'm in the office waiting for this purchase order to come in.
[SPEAKER_02]: Nothing.
[SPEAKER_02]: So I ring him and I'm like, hey, we're still getting this.
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, yes, sorry.
[SPEAKER_02]: We've given the purchase order to somebody else.
[SPEAKER_02]: And it was like a punch in the stomach.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I remember I just on the phone sat my desk and I said, sorry, what do you mean?
[SPEAKER_02]: And he said, yeah, we got another quote and it was cheaper.
[SPEAKER_02]: It was better than yours.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I was so just so astounded by the fact that I hadn't been committed to communicated, but be somebody that could beat me because I had dual registration, which means you protected and you've got this pricing.
[SPEAKER_02]: and like tearing up on the phone, I was like, okay, all right, I'll speak to you next week and the hung up and I burst into tears and the pure managers behind me and he came over and gave me a hug like awkwardly and it goes, well, at least we know you're human.
[SPEAKER_02]: So he said to me, so there we go, everyone learn that, that you know, I do have feelings, but then after that,
[SPEAKER_02]: the way I turn it around was I then spoke to our rap from the from the vendor I spoke to a couple of other people that had been involved and hasn't had like how has this happened because I never put anything as a done deal until I know it's a done deal and this was a done deal and so in the end spoke to the rap they looked at the quote that was provided by the other partner
[SPEAKER_02]: and said it was different.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so I was able to go back.
[SPEAKER_02]: I contacted our client and said, hey, just just a head, can you just send me the quote that you went with?
[SPEAKER_02]: And just because I would love to learn from it because you know, you either win or you learn, so I'm all about learning.
[SPEAKER_02]: So we sent me through, send me through the quote.
[SPEAKER_02]: We spoke to the rat, they said, yeah, it's completely different.
[SPEAKER_02]: And they missed out three key things that the client had
[SPEAKER_02]: And it was extension of the maintenance and management around the licensing.
[SPEAKER_02]: It was a certain size of capacity and a couple of other things.
[SPEAKER_02]: So I was able to then content because of the relationship I had.
[SPEAKER_02]: I was able to reach out and say, just see, like, that's, you know, look, I'm not bitter.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's all, you know, if you have genuinely found it at another solution that suits you better, I'll fully stand by it and I will learn from this.
[SPEAKER_02]: However, there were three things that you highlighted and these are the three things, and then not included in the proposal that you are signing off on.
[SPEAKER_02]: and he didn't know that and so he then went back and had look at it with his team and then I got the pepper soda.
[SPEAKER_02]: So I wouldn't back, clawed it back and because I fought for what I believe to be true and I think a lot of people will fight for what's true but not necessarily with any backing from it or not be prepared to lose.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I'm okay with losing if I'm not the best option, but if I'm the best option, I'm not okay with losing.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so it's really just finding those pieces.
[SPEAKER_02]: So I think most challenging to get, but most challenging one that I was able to to achieve.
[SPEAKER_02]: But I think I mean there's so many of those.
[SPEAKER_02]: But no, I mean, I don't know.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think now a member has been to a guy just recently and he needed something quite quickly, but it was a big requirement.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I said, oh, gosh, I'm gonna, this is gonna, you know, I'd be a bit of a challenge to hit that deadline.
[SPEAKER_02]: And he said, well, nothing great comes easy.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I thought, it was such a great thing for a client to say, yeah, now a client, it was worth the late nights and pulling everything together.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I think now it's, it's,
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, I like a challenge because, you know, as the more sales you do, the better you get at it.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yes, the less challenging it becomes.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I have had that reflection over the last few years of what do I want to do and what does like me up because some stuff is quite easy for me now.
[SPEAKER_02]: And although that's not saying I'm definitely not complacent, but it's not as challenging as it used to be.
[SPEAKER_02]: But then I do get the ones that challenge me and I'm so grateful for them because it just makes me a better salesperson,
[SPEAKER_01]: No, I love that there's always growth opportunity and that's something that I've always enjoyed.
[SPEAKER_01]: I've never necessarily looked at a lost sale as a failure, but it's the same as you.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like always a learning opportunity, where can I get better?
[SPEAKER_01]: And sometimes it is like back to the basics of maybe I didn't ask the best qualifying questions or the discovery questions.
[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe I just hit the mark, you know, just off just a bit.
[SPEAKER_01]: Sometimes it's time, maybe I...
[SPEAKER_01]: took a little bit too much time putting this proposal together, but absolutely it's always like learning it and moving forward from it.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I think that was wonderful.
[SPEAKER_01]: I love that you won that deal and turned it back around.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I'll take that as you're an extremely competitive person to boot.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I'm a little bit convertible.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm a little done in jazz, like all done in jazz.
[SPEAKER_02]: We had a client for that outbound, and it was a different, because with all of the team that we have doing lead development, it was a different client.
[SPEAKER_02]: It was new, and they hadn't actually signed up for lead development, but we generated some leads through marketing and sales as a service piece that we'd done for them.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I like to prove.
[SPEAKER_02]: points on things I like to prove that what we've done is right or give people the next step up.
[SPEAKER_02]: I love giving more than what people expect.
[SPEAKER_02]: So we'd had these leads and so I just said to team like guys let's just ring them because that's not what they've paid for but let's have some fun.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so we got these leads and we did it them out across the team and we together we wrote a quick pitch.
[SPEAKER_02]: It was not the way we know that we'd spend so much time training our team on each individual
[SPEAKER_02]: that this is not usually how we do it, but it was quick.
[SPEAKER_02]: It was a really simple message and I said, I'll do it with you.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so there was nothing that got the team more engaged than having to compete against me because they know what I'm like, but I got two meetings like really quickly.
[SPEAKER_02]: and the two of them are scrambling, you know, they're asking me, you know, how did you do it?
[SPEAKER_02]: What did you say?
[SPEAKER_02]: Tell me exactly what you just said because I want to do it again.
[SPEAKER_02]: And then in the end, I think one of the guys got three and then I then didn't want to lose out on being, you know, two, but I'd kind of hung up my hat at that point.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's about backended again, but it's all a bit of fun and I love to see other people win and that's why I think I've chosen what it is that I do because it's so rewarding to see other people win and so great to see that smile on their face and so I'm not a sore loser, but I do love a bit of competition.
[SPEAKER_01]: Now, I love that.
[SPEAKER_01]: And you know, I think in some sales roles that I've been in that supportive of those been missing is that the competition was more a negative environment than positive like healthy and fun like that.
[SPEAKER_01]: Certainly when I have been in those atmospheres quite honestly when I've been the most successful in sales.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then also being able to almost team sell in some instances like those are typically the teams that if my play it was super full and I needed help from another salesperson on the team they jumped right in with me and it was beautiful everybody was successful everybody won the client won we won.
[SPEAKER_01]: those are my absolute favorite times of the year and that takes a certain culture doesn't it to get out of that?
[SPEAKER_02]: Because I know there's a lot and and where do I see there was something that's so recently about about this topic and it was on around like how do you get your team engaged enough to sell without constantly questioning what was their deal and what was sent to the they getting and I find it so fascinating when people are they're in on a deal they're helping and then the question is well what
[SPEAKER_02]: you know, doesn't work, I mean, in my work like that, but you're doing it to help somebody else, and they're going to help you in return, and I also believe in good karma, so, you know, that's also going to be a play, but it definitely makes for a more cohesive space.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I think, you know, for me, I love working
[SPEAKER_02]: and I don't really believe in competition.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's not something that I really care about or think about too often.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I would much rather collaborate than do nothing at all.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so if I have an opportunity, there's somebody that's out there that especially if they're local in the market to where we are and they want an insight or they want to know more, they want a connection to certain person.
[SPEAKER_02]: Absolutely.
[SPEAKER_02]: I've got sales trainers that refer work to me all the time.
[SPEAKER_02]: I've got people
[SPEAKER_02]: the sales world that I refer to all the time because I can't serve everybody.
[SPEAKER_02]: I can't, I don't want to help everybody.
[SPEAKER_02]: So if they're not right for me, they're probably going to be racked to somebody else.
[SPEAKER_02]: And now I've got a couple of people that are just, you know, if I qualifying out, I will then say, look, that's not a me thing.
[SPEAKER_02]: I can absolutely help you.
[SPEAKER_02]: But if you want the best,
[SPEAKER_02]: they work with this person, I do an introduction, they close it straight away because I've already done the work for them and I don't take rebates on that, I don't take clips on that referral work because it means that I'm not authentically recommending and absolutely and I think that that is also something key to share is that if you're getting somebody to do it it's it's got to be done because from a place that I want to help you.
[SPEAKER_01]: No, I love that.
[SPEAKER_01]: I have absolutely a matter of spectra that and that's, you know, we were talking about that even last night, like that's some of the culture just professionally that that I really enjoy seeing developed here.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's just being able to refer like that and just work together is better for everybody.
[SPEAKER_01]: I see signs all the time that say better together and that's absolutely true.
[SPEAKER_02]: is absolutely true.
[SPEAKER_02]: And if you think like technologies and different things like that, it's all they can connect together and they can do great things.
[SPEAKER_02]: We'll do it together, become an alliance, become a force because then you've got your circle of people that breathe about you and talk about your rooms that you're not in and that is so much better than trying to hold everything back and not say anything about anything else that's going on in case you might sneak in and take it away
[SPEAKER_01]: I love that.
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you so much for sharing.
[SPEAKER_01]: What's something people in your industry would find surprising to learn about you?
[SPEAKER_02]: I think the most part of the people who take is that I'm a Tom Boy at heart, so I'm a motorbikes, I say all I do all the fun stuff and I think that's always the bit that people are like what you wrote across Australia and you did this thing and you lived here and you do that.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think that's always the bit and you know we had this conversation that you do you know yesterday is that I present well and so they can't imagine me being like dusty faced and you know in boots and jumping on the two wheel motorbikes.
[SPEAKER_02]: But it's I love doing things that are adventurous and interesting and I think that's probably the bit that people don't really know I reckon maybe the second thing would be that I are quite like my own space so I travel a lot on my own.
[SPEAKER_02]: I love it.
[SPEAKER_02]: I love people.
[SPEAKER_02]: and I get energy from other people but I also really love my own time and I think people don't realise that because I'm so I'm on and I love people and I'm always in with everybody that they can't imagine I would ever want to be on my own but I also like that so the on two wheels is just perfect.
[SPEAKER_01]: I absolutely relate to that because growing up there was actually a picture of me when I was younger where I had on the super-frily dress but I was sitting in the mud just playing and like her effects it was great and my family so you like dirt bikes so I am four-wheeler quads type person my family has a farm up in Pennsylvania we went to visit one year and
[SPEAKER_01]: They have all the toys up there.
[SPEAKER_01]: So like some of my cousins, they're all mostly guys.
[SPEAKER_01]: I was one of like three girls out there.
[SPEAKER_01]: We came back up to the house and apparently all my rest of my family's talking about, oh, all the guys are gonna be so muddy.
[SPEAKER_01]: I was covered head to toe.
[SPEAKER_01]: I was the only one covered head to toe.
[SPEAKER_01]: My mom goes, oh, she found a mud hole.
[SPEAKER_01]: I heard you did not destroy across the face and the best part about it was like that following week I had a figure skating competition in the national so you know playing out on the farm one week and then competing in rhinestones the next so both sides.
[SPEAKER_02]: I love that that's what you do.
[SPEAKER_02]: I just picture this elegance because it is so elegant and I think I'm not very elegant, so I mean I would love to give it a try.
[SPEAKER_02]: But I love that.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think you need the contrast otherwise it's either all or it's nothing or it's this or it's that and I think you can have a bit of both and it just makes life a bit more interesting conversations a bit more
[SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, I've been selling, having stories are super important.
[SPEAKER_01]: They help really help build rapport and, you know, contributes to that.
[SPEAKER_01]: So how did you get your podcast started?
[SPEAKER_02]: That is a great question.
[SPEAKER_02]: I have to think back.
[SPEAKER_02]: So we've been doing now for just over three years and I remember at the time thinking, I'm going to do a podcast.
[SPEAKER_02]: I just thought it was a great way to give back to my clients.
[SPEAKER_02]: It was a great way to share content.
[SPEAKER_02]: We weren't on YouTube then.
[SPEAKER_02]: We had Instagram, which is not where our clients are, and we had LinkedIn obviously.
[SPEAKER_02]: So LinkedIn was kind of our thing.
[SPEAKER_02]: We had a lot of content going out for our clients through creating videos and we had universities and platforms and all these things.
[SPEAKER_02]: So I felt like I was missing a place.
[SPEAKER_02]: to share information.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so, I'm a big podcast listener.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, all I do is listen to podcasts.
[SPEAKER_02]: So, I'm driving to work and I have one on and I'm, you know, I'm doing stuff around the house.
[SPEAKER_02]: I've got it on.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's just, I always have, I'm always consuming.
[SPEAKER_02]: I probably shouldn't do as much of that.
[SPEAKER_02]: But I always consuming content.
[SPEAKER_02]: So, and I love it.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I find it so interesting.
[SPEAKER_02]: So, I thought, well, if I could give something back, then I think it would be a great way to do it.
[SPEAKER_02]: And it's a platform and it's audio and
[SPEAKER_02]: and I can kind of do it from anywhere.
[SPEAKER_02]: So that was where it started.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think I was decided to do it once a fortnight, maybe sometimes once a week, but I knew consistency was going to be keys.
[SPEAKER_02]: So I spent ages figuring out the name, because they're like you, I should probably give credit.
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't remember who it was.
[SPEAKER_02]: I came up with it.
[SPEAKER_02]: It wasn't me.
[SPEAKER_02]: And it was great.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I worked with this small agency and they create the opening of the music and all these things and then I just started talking on this podcast and I got people in and I got some people in that were different sales, but talked about sales, they might have been my past clients and that was kind of where it started and I think I was about three months in and thought, oh, okay, this is this is a thing.
[SPEAKER_02]: like I'm gonna now have to do this every week and and and they're remembering the you know the listener numbers like I they were low I can't remember how many they were but I remember I just kept doing it and then after about six months in my friends little girl
[SPEAKER_02]: realize I was unspotted by and thought I was the coolest thing ever.
[SPEAKER_02]: Still to this day, she thinks I'm cool, which I will take.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so she put it on the spot spot by on and put it on the TV while all they're having dinner and I was so embarrassed.
[SPEAKER_02]: I was like, please can we turn it off?
[SPEAKER_02]: Because I don't want to listen to myself, yeah, that and then, you know, I'm there and in my picture, I've got my hours folded, I look real fancy and that was kind of really where I thought, wow, okay, this is a thing and now people know about it.
[SPEAKER_02]: And then we did a big billboard in the Pers city centre, and that was really fun to just see my face on this huge billboard.
[SPEAKER_02]: A lot of things happening, but since doing it, I think for me, it was started out as just a bit of an idea just to share content.
[SPEAKER_02]: Now I still want to share content.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's what I do and I bring people on, but I've found over the years that it's, I'm so particularly about who I want on there, because I listen to so many podcasts and I get ideas and sometimes I think
[SPEAKER_02]: Fluid around what we talk about, but I think people listen to it because it's sales related.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's not business.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's not and sometimes it's a bit business because it's nice story and it's what I've got going on, but I try and keep it very sales focused and
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, three years now, we're doing it weekly this month, though we've done it fortnightly.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I have to apologize to my editor, but I've just haven't had the time.
[SPEAKER_02]: And yeah, that's not usually something you'll ever hear me say, but to do it properly.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I think that's the other thing is that I've taken Rose back in back in the day.
[SPEAKER_02]: It was just done tick.
[SPEAKER_02]: move on.
[SPEAKER_02]: Now it's okay people are listing and they're all over the world and they care about what I've got to say which is awesome but also terrifying at the same time and so yeah so now now we do it every week and we're leveling up the way that we do it we're not quite at the sales grading level because this is epic.
[SPEAKER_02]: The amount of work that goes into it and not the cameras and the lights and one day I'll have this but it's Yeah, it's been a journey, but I think for me it was just really bad adding value, which is a lot of how I make a lot decisions
[SPEAKER_01]: Now, I love that.
[SPEAKER_01]: And you're speaking up content.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's been absolute pleasure to have you on our studio this week.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I know all of our listeners are going to be really excited to dig into your content as it starts releasing on Salesforce University.
[SPEAKER_01]: So thank you again.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then you just had something interesting about your podcast that you also started it until you give back to your clients.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that's an interesting take-in to know that you had some of them on there.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that is a beautiful way to do it.
[SPEAKER_01]: I can see that it's brought you a lot of joy and I think that's cleared a lot of the success that you've had.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's just you've just dug in and started.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think that's the hardest part for a lot of people.
[SPEAKER_01]: So they're just scared to take that leap and you've done it.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, thank you.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's and I think people are afraid and if I can add this one piece is that you put yourself you put your head above the line and you you pop up and it happens on LinkedIn happens when you make a move in a business or or start a business or release release a podcast or do a YouTube video and people will tell you not to do it.
[SPEAKER_02]: They will mock the situation.
[SPEAKER_02]: They will be like, oh, so that post-on LinkedIn or that podcast.
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, that was, yeah, interesting.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I'm still blown away that people still have opinions like that on something where someone's given something to go.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so, I think the great things happen when you are outside of your comfort zone.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so, for me, creating something that challenged me, as I said before, I need more things that challenged me because you get good at something and you become a little bit complacent or maybe
[SPEAKER_02]: but you want things to challenge you and so for me I think putting myself out there flying over here and doing the content you know for the last few days it's something different and it's not something that everyone gets an opportunity to do but I've been extremely fortunate to do it and I will keep popping my head up above the line and and see what all some things come from it.
[SPEAKER_01]: I love it.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well thank you so much for joining us on the Sales Group podcast.
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you.