[SPEAKER_00]: Welcome back to room for us, a space-square queer voices thrive.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm your host P and every single week.
[SPEAKER_00]: I like to sit down, get vulnerable, and talk about all things queer with all of you.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I want to say I appreciate all of you just giving me this like time to get into this topic.
[SPEAKER_00]: All about the believer to lesbian pipeline.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is something that was so fascinating to me.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I really wanted to try and do some digging, do some research.
[SPEAKER_00]: Truly like there is no backed up research around this.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I kind of try to look into my own experience, especially like back to when I was in high school.
[SPEAKER_00]: I graduated high school in 2013, but I remember specific areas of Justin Bieber that I was like super fascinated about and how so many people can relate to that feeling like they were believers and now they're lesbians.
[SPEAKER_00]: And this all came up after I watched his Coachella performance, so thank you for giving me that week.
[SPEAKER_00]: I really did try to dig into as much research as I could, but yeah, that's it right now.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not finding anything specific, so I would be curious to know what you all think about my interpretation or why I believe this could be a thing and why so many lesbians love Justin Bieber.
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like that is just a well-known fact.
[SPEAKER_00]: But before we get into the episode, I wanted to do a few housekeeping things and just some overall updates.
[SPEAKER_00]: So it's been a pretty busy week for me and that is also why I haven't been posting as much as I want to.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to get into this because there are some changes that I also want to be making for this podcast.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't want to announce anything right now and write this second.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I feel like you'll start to see some changes happening in the summer, which I'm really, really excited about.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I feel like it needs a bit of a refresh as you all know.
[SPEAKER_00]: I've been hosting this podcast for five years and most recently rebranded it to room for us.
[SPEAKER_00]: I believe it was last summer I did that and I've been loving it.
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like it's been helping me get more vulnerable with the listeners.
[SPEAKER_00]: I talk a lot about my mental health or things I try to do to kind of improve my daily life that a lot of people can relate to, especially when things are
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, we're dealing with a lot.
[SPEAKER_00]: The world can be really hectic.
[SPEAKER_00]: We're dealing with so much news and negativity.
[SPEAKER_00]: And sometimes I look to this podcast as a place where I even feel safe to talk about my thoughts and things that I go through.
[SPEAKER_00]: the hardships that also come with it.
[SPEAKER_00]: And hopefully you all can relate to that to some degree.
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's the whole reason why I love doing this podcast.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like yes, I love to talk about queerness.
[SPEAKER_00]: I love to talk about pop culture news.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I also like to talk about things that maybe aren't always out there in the open, but if you're tuning into this podcast and you need a chat to help you feel seen or you just need
[SPEAKER_00]: a little bit of clarity.
[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe there's something you're going through.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's very similar to me.
[SPEAKER_00]: We can kind of relate to each other on that.
[SPEAKER_00]: I am excited to see what's to come with this.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm excited to kind of experiment with different formats.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's one thing I really really want to start doing.
[SPEAKER_00]: this year and challenging myself to do more is long-form content.
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like there is in need for that and I was inspired to talk about this a little bit more on this podcast because a creator who I've been following for so long, Cammy Scott, an amazing lesbian content creator.
[SPEAKER_00]: I've been following since like probably 2017.
[SPEAKER_00]: Love watching her YouTube videos.
[SPEAKER_00]: I love listening to her podcast with her wife,
[SPEAKER_00]: And Kami had posted about how she really misses long form content, and I was like that is actually something I want to do a little bit more this year.
[SPEAKER_00]: When I first launched my YouTube channel, I believe it might have been in 2019 when I had started posting.
[SPEAKER_00]: And most of the content was a little bit more on the long form side.
[SPEAKER_00]: It wasn't, you know, like YouTube shorts.
[SPEAKER_00]: It wasn't these like quick digestible clips where you're capturing your audience with the hook and you kind of need to sum it up.
[SPEAKER_00]: I felt so comfortable with that content because I felt like
[SPEAKER_00]: I was talking so naturally and just as me, like I wasn't overthinking how am I supposed to capture attention in 30 seconds to a minute and keep it like that.
[SPEAKER_00]: I would post a lot of reaction videos with my friends and then some videos I would post just speaking out about my queer experience.
[SPEAKER_00]: And with that, I actually bought a new camera last summer that I've used for some videos, but I really want to take it out and vlog a little bit more.
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like that kind of content is so relatable.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's something I've always admired when I see other people do it, especially travel vlogs, and it comes at a good time because Crystal and I are going on a long vacation, and we are going to Portugal and Spain.
[SPEAKER_00]: And even for our own memories, I really want to vlog it and kind of get out of my comfort zone and film those moments.
[SPEAKER_00]: So that is something we will always have to look back at together.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I can edit it, make it look super cute, and I'll post it to the YouTube channel.
[SPEAKER_00]: I love seeing videos like that.
[SPEAKER_00]: I also think seeing representation always more queer couples is so important.
[SPEAKER_00]: And while I have
[SPEAKER_00]: My own little platform where I like to show my experiences.
[SPEAKER_00]: I want to make sure that I can do that because you never know Who that's gonna reach and it makes them really happy or it makes their day.
[SPEAKER_00]: I Love watching vlogs.
[SPEAKER_00]: It could be anything.
[SPEAKER_00]: It could be like just a day in the life It could be travel vlog.
[SPEAKER_00]: It could be decorating a home.
[SPEAKER_00]: It doesn't really matter what the specific topic is I feel like there's so many things you can do with vlogging and I just need to get out of my comfort zone and start to do it
[SPEAKER_00]: So, stay tuned for that.
[SPEAKER_00]: That is something I'm definitely going to be focusing on for the rest of the year and hold myself accountable to doing that.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, that is what I wanted to kind of like start the episode off of.
[SPEAKER_00]: You're going to definitely be seeing more long-form content for me.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know you kind of get that with the podcast, of course, with guest episodes.
[SPEAKER_00]: We have long conversations and they're very vulnerable with my solo episodes.
[SPEAKER_00]: You do just get my perspective, but that is something I've been missing and I feel like I need to implement it more into my own passion projects.
[SPEAKER_00]: On another note, before we get into the episode, I actually went to a creative network accession that I loved.
[SPEAKER_00]: It was at Cowdog Coffee and Kits, which in Vancouver, that coffee shop is actually one of my favorites for Mocha.
[SPEAKER_00]: I really love it.
[SPEAKER_00]: And the vibes are exactly what I love.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like the wood accents, the black leather furniture, they have the vinyl.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's such a cool look, especially for that main strip
[SPEAKER_00]: Westforth has so much to offer, but I feel like having this super cool, Vibe coffee shop is exactly what it needed, and they were holding this creative networking session for creatives who just want to like brainstorm ideas with others, whether you're launching an event, whether you're trying to sell something, whether you're coming up with a new business idea, I went in with the perspective of talking about my podcast and how I would love to eventually do like in-person events, or partner with some queer companies,
[SPEAKER_00]: and that's something I really want to lean into.
[SPEAKER_00]: So it was nice to kind of hear different perspectives from other creators, and they were letting me know what they really appreciate about podcast too, which gave me some more ideas as to what I want to do with room for us.
[SPEAKER_00]: So all in all, lots of exciting things happening.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm so excited to take you along for the journey with me.
[SPEAKER_00]: And also, thank you so much for keeping up with this podcast and following along it truly means so much to me,
[SPEAKER_00]: So without further ado, let's get into the believer to lesbian pipeline.
[SPEAKER_00]: So we all know, like this has been circulating on social media, especially after Justin Bieber's Coachella performance.
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like that performance specifically sparked up so much nostalgia for our generation, like the Millennials and like early Gen Z, like people who are just on the cusp.
[SPEAKER_00]: I really feel like we all needed that.
[SPEAKER_00]: It was so good for our soul and it got a lot of lesbians, I think thinking about how their younger selves were hardcore believers.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I wanted to look into that a little bit more because I was like, I wonder why that is?
[SPEAKER_00]: For me personally, I love Justin Bieber.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like I do want to make that point very, very clear.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think Justin is so talented.
[SPEAKER_00]: I love his voice.
[SPEAKER_00]: I loved watching his career, especially that he started posting videos on YouTube and that is how we got discovered through his covers.
[SPEAKER_00]: I absolutely loved that.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I never really got super into Justin Bieber through his baby era.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like I kind of missed that wave.
[SPEAKER_00]: I wasn't as into that, but 2012 onwards.
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh my gosh, I loved Justin Bieber.
[SPEAKER_00]: That is kind of when he started shifting into a little bit more R&B sounds and his pop started to sound a little bit edgier.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I remember being like, okay, I'm really getting into Justin.
[SPEAKER_00]: I remember the confident music video.
[SPEAKER_00]: I was so obsessed with
[SPEAKER_00]: boyfriend all around the world like I loved all of those I was I was obsessed I remember I was living in would be at the time when I was in high school and I remember just blasting that music when I would be like driving that was like my go-to soundtrack and fun fact the actor who plays Justin's love interest in confident and all that matters is Caitlin Russo
[SPEAKER_00]: And you might recognize Kaylan Russo from the song Bad Things.
[SPEAKER_00]: She's the artist who sings that song and that's the song they played in the credits of heated rivalry.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I love how Kaylan Russo is also getting her moment this year with like all that attention around her song Bad Things.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's so, so good.
[SPEAKER_00]: So that was also interesting to see how back in it would have been like what 2012 or 2013.
[SPEAKER_00]: I have to remember what dates.
[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe, maybe those ones came out later.
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like maybe it was 2014.
[SPEAKER_00]: I should fact check that really quick.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, just checked.
[SPEAKER_00]: So confident came out in 2013.
[SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, that's so interesting to see her career then and like what has been happening now.
[SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, it was such a vibe and even so when I was a teenager listening to Justin Bieber during that era,
[SPEAKER_00]: I didn't have like a crush on him.
[SPEAKER_00]: It wasn't like this traditional crush, but I was very intrigued by his vibe.
[SPEAKER_00]: I loved his sound, I loved his look, and I felt like his music was like very intentional, and I loved the direction he was going in.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, you know, in high school, I was like very much wrapped up in my crush on Alice, as I said, OG listeners will know exactly who Alice is.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like that was still very much in the forefront of my mind.
[SPEAKER_00]: I was not into like male pop artists in that way, and even if I did like them,
[SPEAKER_00]: I always felt like it wasn't a crush.
[SPEAKER_00]: Once again, maybe it was like the way they carried themselves, it was the way they talked, it was their look.
[SPEAKER_00]: So that is where things get interesting.
[SPEAKER_00]: I wonder if a lot of lesbians during that time when they look back at their maybe early celebrity crushes, are they thinking like,
[SPEAKER_00]: Am I attracted to him or is it like, do I like the aesthetic of him?
[SPEAKER_00]: And I find aesthetic attraction such an interesting thing and we're going to get into that a little bit deeper.
[SPEAKER_00]: Sarah and I had actually posted an episode all about attraction when the podcast was called Girl on Girl.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a really, really fascinating episode if you guys want to dive into that one.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's way, way back, but we get into all the different types of attraction and aesthetic
[SPEAKER_00]: that I was telling Sarah, I really relate to when it comes to men, aesthetic attraction is like not this sexual romantic attraction to someone, but it's appreciating someone's look and liking their style and maybe wanting to emulate that a little bit.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I wonder if like, for a lot of lesbian believers, when they looked at Justin Bieber, especially in like that era, he was in this space of like a soft masculinity and like very relatable, like he was emotional and not this like hyper macho, like broy dude.
[SPEAKER_00]: I just think a lot of people could like relate to him in that sense.
[SPEAKER_00]: And maybe as queer women, we kind of latch onto that as like an overall vibe, we really like, we really really like.
[SPEAKER_00]: And why it's specific to Justin Bieber?
[SPEAKER_00]: I wonder if it's like the timing of it all, even like watching him grow up.
[SPEAKER_00]: We all have this like attachment to certain stars where we, we love seeing them from when they started and where they're at now.
[SPEAKER_00]: Obviously, he had a very intense fandom culture and a lot of us at that time were in early adolescence.
[SPEAKER_00]: And he had a holistic evolution as well.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like he was like a teen heartthrob with his like that specific hairstyle.
[SPEAKER_00]: He would wear like the sweaters, the purple sweaters, the jeans, and then when he got into more of his R&B vibe, he was tattooed and very emotionally expressive in his lyrics.
[SPEAKER_00]: I actually think journals is a really, really good album.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's something I listen back to recently.
[SPEAKER_00]: and I would encourage you all to dive back into it because, yeah, like it's no doubt Justin Bieber is talented but I feel like he really grew with his fans or I should say like his fans really, really grew with them for like where they were at in their life.
[SPEAKER_00]: which is also not something a lot of artists can do very successfully.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like some artists might stay in a certain realm or a certain vibe for a while and fans don't really feel like they're growing up with them.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like I always say I think Britney Spears and you know, I'm the biggest Britney Spears fan ever.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I will bring her up any chance I can.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I felt like Britney Spears did a good job of that as well as an artist
[SPEAKER_00]: And as she was getting older, she was leaning into more of an edge of your sound.
[SPEAKER_00]: So it's really cool.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think that back to Justin, once again, him being this like male pop star, what a lot of Lesbians could see is that his version of masculinity wasn't this like rigid, off-putting vibe that we couldn't relate to.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like I feel like we could relate to him.
[SPEAKER_00]: It felt accessible to us.
[SPEAKER_00]: So back to like this whole TikTok thing because the internet is turning it to something bigger, you know, like fast forward to now, TikTok has taken this very niche experience and it's turned into the believer to lesbian pipeline, like step one, your believer, when you're very young, and then all of a sudden we're all lesvians.
[SPEAKER_00]: And obviously this is not everyone, it's very specific.
[SPEAKER_00]: But once again, I think it's cool because it's all part of the journey and from my own research,
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't even think it has to be that specific.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think that what a lot of lesbians were seeing when it came to Justin Bieber is that we just adore him.
[SPEAKER_00]: We adore his story from what we're able to see and what he shares.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's a very emotionally in touch person and he shows that even on stage.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, it's his expression, it's his softness, it's his performance, and of course, is aesthetic.
[SPEAKER_00]: And those things still matter.
[SPEAKER_00]: Even when Crystal and I were watching his Coachella performance together, we were very much openly talking about how good Justin Bieber looks and just being like, not in a way where we're like into Justin Bieber, but it's like,
[SPEAKER_00]: He just looks so cool and he looks very happy and it was like that vibe.
[SPEAKER_00]: He was emulating.
[SPEAKER_00]: Of course, I don't know Justin Bieber, but it's like a certain energy you can pick up on him or even his assurdness.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like the way he speaks and he's kind of um.
[SPEAKER_00]: Not monotone, but when he speaks, he's very calm, even when he's addressing the crowd.
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's something Crystal pointed out too, and something she personally really likes.
[SPEAKER_00]: Crystal, if you guys have met Crystal, you'll know this, but for listeners who haven't met Crystal.
[SPEAKER_00]: She's similar in the way she speaks.
[SPEAKER_00]: Her voice isn't like over excitable or like, she has a cool air to her, which I think is cool.
[SPEAKER_00]: Whereas me on the other end, I feel like I speak a little bit more bubbly, which is totally fine.
[SPEAKER_00]: We're different people.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I can also see how there's this like,
[SPEAKER_00]: The softness or like that subtle calm way of speaking could be something a lot of people could be drawn to a hundred percent in Justin does have this and the aesthetic I mean I want to wear his outfits.
[SPEAKER_00]: I love his outfits.
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like he has great style and when it comes to queer fashion,
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, it doesn't even have to specifically be queer fashion, but when it comes to fashion and getting out of these boxed norms, that society has, you know, fed to us for so many years.
[SPEAKER_00]: Of course, we've been getting out of that now, but a lot of queer people now feel like they can dress exactly the way their soul wants to dress.
[SPEAKER_00]: And admiring someone like Justin Bieber, like that could make a lot of
[SPEAKER_00]: feel like his style feels accessible in that way and how we would be presenting ourselves too.
[SPEAKER_00]: So that's another take I have there.
[SPEAKER_00]: I also think of that aesthetic attraction when I think of other celebrities like Harry Styles, for example.
[SPEAKER_00]: Jacob Olordy.
[SPEAKER_00]: I sometimes go back and forth with one of my very good friends, Jess, we send each other pictures or outfits that we love.
[SPEAKER_00]: And to be honest, I feel like I've sent her a lot of males.
[SPEAKER_00]: We're all be like, I love his style.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, I would want to wear something like this.
[SPEAKER_00]: And once again, I identify as a lesbian, so I don't get that same romantic or sexual attraction for men, but I can appreciate a good-looking man and appreciate how he dresses in his style and almost be like, that is kind of the vibe I would like to emulate.
[SPEAKER_00]: I like that, like I could see myself wearing this outfit.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I go to Harry Styles and Jacoba Lorty a lot for that.
[SPEAKER_00]: I like to see what they're wearing or how I can kind of like make it my own by thrifting and see how my outfit can kind of match that style.
[SPEAKER_00]: I find that that really fun.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think it's fun to experiment and play around a little bit.
[SPEAKER_00]: So as we get into this a little bit more and I bring up the style.
[SPEAKER_00]: meaning that's kind of like where this all stems from a bit because it's not really like a romantic crush or completely all nostalgia, which is what some people might think, because when I was thinking back to my own, I'm very into Justin Bieber era, like around 2012.
[SPEAKER_00]: It wasn't just about his music shifting.
[SPEAKER_00]: I really do think there was something about his presentation
[SPEAKER_00]: And I mean, this was, this was at the time then.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't dress like this now, but at the time I definitely did when Justin was kind of rocking his oversized flannel.
[SPEAKER_00]: The denim, the layered shirts, the streetwear, tattoos, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like the tattoos were a big thing for him.
[SPEAKER_00]: They were really becoming a part of him and he was fully tatted.
[SPEAKER_00]: he has fully tatted actually.
[SPEAKER_00]: All of it's very curated, he has a very specific style.
[SPEAKER_00]: But in this effortless, like he's not trying too hard kind of way, it's just him.
[SPEAKER_00]: And as I mentioned, like it doesn't even have to be that deep, but I feel like I saw that.
[SPEAKER_00]: I liked it and it made a lot of sense to me, but not in the way that is like I have a sudden crush.
[SPEAKER_00]: It was a very different feeling.
[SPEAKER_00]: And that is why like bringing up aesthetic attraction is so interesting and I would encourage you to look into that a little bit more.
[SPEAKER_00]: And maybe if you haven't thought about it, it's like kind of cool too, because you have to wonder like, yeah, like, I am super into this outfit.
[SPEAKER_00]: This man is wearing, and that is something I want to kind of emulate myself.
[SPEAKER_00]: But it doesn't mean I'm into the man.
[SPEAKER_00]: I almost want to be like that.
[SPEAKER_00]: Or not be like the person, you know what I mean?
[SPEAKER_00]: But like, emulate that style.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's being drawn to someone's vibe, their energy, and that overall expressive style.
[SPEAKER_00]: So for a lot of queer people, maybe we're looking at Justin Bieber and saying,
[SPEAKER_00]: What part of this do I relate to and what part of this feels like me?
[SPEAKER_00]: What are some elements about this that I want to borrow for myself?
[SPEAKER_00]: So maybe that is my overall conclusion as I've been diving deep into my own thoughts about my love for Justin Bieber personally.
[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe it's the aesthetic attraction, it's the vibes, it's the way he carries himself.
[SPEAKER_00]: And maybe a lot of lesbians feel that is accessible.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I'd love to hear what you guys think about this.
[SPEAKER_00]: Obviously as I mentioned, I couldn't really find anything about this other than of course like people sharing their experiences on TikTok about being a believer and now they're a lesbian.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I'd love to hear what you guys think.
[SPEAKER_00]: As I'm also looking into my style and how I want to switch things up.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to look at my own mood board and even see who I'm putting on there because in the past I've always kind of gone for, you know, Zoe Kravitz is a big inspiration for me.
[SPEAKER_00]: I love her style personally, but I've never actually just fully put males on there, but in ways I love dressing in that kind of style too.
[SPEAKER_00]: I love baggy.
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like there's ways you can mix and match and make things look really cute and stylish.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I wonder if you guys will agree with me on this.
[SPEAKER_00]: Do we think the believer to lesbian pipeline does come from the aesthetic attraction and how Justin Bieber carries himself?
[SPEAKER_00]: Overall and the lesbians just love it?
[SPEAKER_00]: Also, I mean, he is just amazing.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's such an incredible talented artist.
[SPEAKER_00]: But it's like why specifically beber?
[SPEAKER_00]: Like I really needed to know.
[SPEAKER_00]: So that is where I'm going to wrap up this episode.
[SPEAKER_00]: I hope you guys really enjoyed this.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm sorry I couldn't come with like full blown facts or even like an article to reference because I couldn't find anything up until this moment.
[SPEAKER_00]: But as something does come out, please let me know because I would really want to read it and see if anyone has a better explanation than me.
[SPEAKER_00]: But for now,
[SPEAKER_00]: I hope you all have a really good rest of your day.
[SPEAKER_00]: I do want to practice this is going to be the last episode of room for us for at least a month.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'll be returning to the podcast with new episodes in June because Crystal and I will be away, traveling, and I won't be able to get recorded episodes out.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I will be posting on the room for us Instagram page and TikTok page, of course, and
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, challenge by self because those can be really fun to watch so stay tuned for that.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I will see you all in June for a refreshing update and all new episodes.
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you so much for tuning in and I will see you all soon.