WEBVTT 00:26.845 --> 00:33.595 [SPEAKER_00]: Welcome back to Murder in the Rain, where today we've got a gaggle of updates for you, one of which I'm extra excited about. 00:34.016 --> 00:48.819 [SPEAKER_00]: Today I'll be talking about new information in Kristen Tomlin's case, how an artist in Seattle is honoring the victims of Gary Ridgeway, a new documentary about Molligate to Sarra, and how day parole was revoked for one of the murders of Reno Verk. 00:48.839 --> 00:51.503 [SPEAKER_00]: So let's not waste any time and get to it. 00:54.622 --> 00:59.793 [SPEAKER_00]: alert alert breaking news alert literally while we were coming out here to record this. 00:59.854 --> 01:03.341 [SPEAKER_00]: I finally got something of an update regarding Cameron Hooker. 01:03.361 --> 01:11.820 [SPEAKER_00]: You'll recall he's the horrible horrible, horrible man who put Colleen Stan in a box for seven years. 01:11.800 --> 01:15.924 [SPEAKER_00]: So, we finally have something resembling an update in his so-called case. 01:16.064 --> 01:32.820 [SPEAKER_00]: He has a trial that has been moved to San Mateo County because of publicity, and it seems like today, April 17th, 2026, motions are being heard, and jury selection will happen May 18th, and that's all coming from actionnewsnow.com. 01:33.581 --> 01:41.368 [SPEAKER_00]: So it looks like by our June update, maybe we'll know what's going on with Cameron Hooker, 01:42.108 --> 01:44.111 [SPEAKER_00]: And that's it for the Breaking News Alert. 01:48.257 --> 01:57.472 [SPEAKER_00]: In March 2018, the true crime podcast, the trail went cold, covered the story of Kristen Tomlin, as we did in our episodes, the kid parts 1 and 2. 01:58.113 --> 02:01.037 [SPEAKER_00]: The trail went cold posted about Kristen's case on Reddit. 02:01.498 --> 02:10.191 [SPEAKER_00]: When we covered it a few months ago, I found that Reddit and shared our episode as it included updates and the interview with Kristen's friends Theresa and Rhonda. 02:10.171 --> 02:14.556 [SPEAKER_00]: For a teeny recap, as the story is so epic, it took two episodes to cover it. 02:14.937 --> 02:25.949 [SPEAKER_00]: Kristen lived in the Portland area, moved to Virginia City, Nevada, and wound up working with two men and a woman who were not honest about who they were, or what the actual dynamics between them were. 02:26.270 --> 02:28.232 [SPEAKER_00]: Virginia City is where they have the camorries. 02:28.292 --> 02:29.173 [SPEAKER_00]: The camorries. 02:29.193 --> 02:29.553 [SPEAKER_00]: The camorries. 02:30.254 --> 02:31.055 [SPEAKER_00]: You do recall. 02:31.095 --> 02:31.336 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes. 02:31.756 --> 02:33.478 [SPEAKER_00]: Who could forget? 02:33.458 --> 02:34.600 [SPEAKER_00]: Camel Knights. 02:34.700 --> 02:35.742 [SPEAKER_00]: That was the boat. 02:36.423 --> 02:37.224 [SPEAKER_00]: That is the boat. 02:37.325 --> 02:37.645 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes. 02:38.206 --> 02:51.889 [SPEAKER_00]: So at that point, Kristen then got on their boat off the California coast and while the two men and the woman were seen after and recognized for the liars and thieves they were Kristen has never been seen or heard from again. 02:51.869 --> 03:00.817 [SPEAKER_00]: So, when about two weeks ago, I received a notification someone had responded to that Reddit, I could not wait to tell Teresa, and here's what that post said. 03:01.758 --> 03:04.501 [SPEAKER_00]: I saw Kristen on the boat on November 3, 1981. 03:05.041 --> 03:08.084 [SPEAKER_00]: I was with my dad, who was friends with Bobby and John. 03:08.485 --> 03:11.227 [SPEAKER_00]: I got on my way to boot camp in San Diego that night. 03:11.648 --> 03:13.810 [SPEAKER_00]: Everyone was laughing and having a great time. 03:13.850 --> 03:15.391 [SPEAKER_00]: Nothing suspicious to me. 03:15.411 --> 03:19.395 [SPEAKER_00]: I worked on freedom to that summer, helping them get it ready to sail. 03:19.983 --> 03:31.064 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh my gosh, I could not believe when I read that new information from a new witness, which was literally the entire reason for this shows existence, let alone those specific episodes. 03:31.425 --> 03:37.536 [SPEAKER_00]: So I immediately sent that information to Teresa, the author of the book about the case, Kristen, can you hear me? 03:37.516 --> 03:43.408 [SPEAKER_00]: The poster Rick was able to get in touch with Teresa and they have since exchanged emails and information. 03:43.909 --> 03:47.656 [SPEAKER_00]: She then posted what she learned to the Facebook page, Kristen, can you hear me? 03:48.057 --> 03:58.157 [SPEAKER_00]: And I highly suggest you follow that page so you can see those updates when they happen and see all the photos that not only Teresa has, but the photos that Rick ended up sending to her. 03:58.137 --> 04:02.404 [SPEAKER_02]: did she get new information that she didn't have before about Kristen's time on the border? 04:02.664 --> 04:09.976 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so I'm going to share that, but I do want to say what the caveat of it's nothing groundbreaking as far as Kristen's location. 04:10.036 --> 04:15.285 [SPEAKER_00]: It's more confirmation of how long the con was. 04:15.670 --> 04:16.732 [SPEAKER_01]: the depth of every. 04:16.752 --> 04:17.052 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes. 04:18.655 --> 04:23.943 [SPEAKER_00]: So here's a bit of that information that Rick shared from his time around Bob, John, Suzanne, and Kristen. 04:24.705 --> 04:29.773 [SPEAKER_00]: From what Rick shared with Teresa and what she has since posted, here is the new information. 04:30.574 --> 04:36.344 [SPEAKER_00]: Rick knew the group but knew Suzanne as Sherry, which is who she was pretending to be in Virginia City. 04:36.864 --> 04:41.492 [SPEAKER_00]: Rick had the opportunity to spend time with 04:41.472 --> 04:49.386 [SPEAKER_00]: Back in the summer of 1981, Rick's father and Sheriff Bob, who I didn't talk about much in the episode, but he was featured in the book. 04:49.767 --> 04:53.153 [SPEAKER_00]: They were all invited to sail from LA to Richmond, California. 04:53.574 --> 05:00.426 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not sure who was involved with that invite or who was at the helm, but I would assume one or both of the guys. 05:00.406 --> 05:05.635 [SPEAKER_00]: Neither Rick's father nor the sheriff knew they were aboard the stolen boat inspiration. 05:06.176 --> 05:13.348 [SPEAKER_00]: During that trip, there was an unexpected and unexplained stop that had them wondering if there was some sort of drug deal taking place. 05:14.069 --> 05:24.507 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not sure how suspicious it all was since the sheriff was there and if he had been suspicious, why he didn't investigate further, but that information's probably lost to time. 05:25.263 --> 05:38.798 [SPEAKER_00]: Also during that summer Rick worked on the Freedom 2 aka the stolen inspiration, Rick had been on the Freedom 2 on November 3, 1981, which was 10 days before the supposed sinking that may have taken Kristen's life. 05:39.559 --> 05:45.365 [SPEAKER_00]: After the sinking off the coast of California, John and Bob stayed in Reno with Rick's parents. 05:45.866 --> 05:54.055 [SPEAKER_00]: So the guy who's posting this, the dudes who were on the sunken boat supposedly then stayed 05:54.035 --> 05:58.020 [SPEAKER_00]: as close as we can get to people that were involved at that time. 05:58.260 --> 06:01.104 [SPEAKER_02]: But this is just a ledge, there's no- What this is a ledge. 06:01.124 --> 06:03.467 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, he could be totally making this up. 06:03.667 --> 06:05.390 [SPEAKER_00]: I would hope someone wouldn't do that. 06:05.510 --> 06:11.958 [SPEAKER_00]: But so the men claimed that having the freedom to sink had caused them to lose everything. 06:12.118 --> 06:14.562 [SPEAKER_00]: So they were down to the close that they had on their back. 06:14.602 --> 06:18.827 [SPEAKER_00]: So Rick's parents were allegedly happy to help them. 06:18.807 --> 06:30.440 [SPEAKER_00]: Speaking of her experience, they too had known the gang for years, and they knew Susanna Sherry and that she was Bob's wife and John Stodder when in reality she was Susanna married to John. 06:31.281 --> 06:34.165 [SPEAKER_00]: As you'll recall, I didn't say anything. 06:34.565 --> 06:35.366 [SPEAKER_02]: I do recall. 06:35.426 --> 06:37.729 [SPEAKER_02]: I do recall so many of the details of this case. 06:37.789 --> 06:39.250 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't really stuck with me. 06:39.290 --> 06:41.513 [SPEAKER_02]: It was a well, it was an unsolved mystery, is what it was. 06:41.553 --> 06:44.677 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's interesting for how complicated it is with all the names. 06:44.777 --> 06:48.561 [SPEAKER_00]: It's really kind of not. 06:49.199 --> 06:54.789 [SPEAKER_00]: That marital setup was what added to Rick's shock one morning when he had slept on the freedom to. 06:55.570 --> 07:12.118 [SPEAKER_00]: Waking up, he spotted Sherry, aka Suzanne, leaving John's room, not her supposed husband, Bob's room, adding to the scandal and confusion, she was only wearing a teddy, who enters or leaves their father's room in lingerie. 07:12.098 --> 07:14.041 [SPEAKER_00]: Again, this is all alleged by Rick. 07:14.181 --> 07:18.026 [SPEAKER_00]: We have no way of proving it, but it sounds a very legitimate. 07:18.126 --> 07:22.893 [SPEAKER_00]: It's very on-brand for this group of loser jerks. 07:24.055 --> 07:28.421 [SPEAKER_00]: I think it's totally valid and appropriate to be skeptical and to question things. 07:28.942 --> 07:41.920 [SPEAKER_00]: I will say that Rick, the one who posted on Reddit and spoke with Teresa, he did provide several photos from that time of all everybody on the boat and stuff. 07:42.153 --> 07:42.854 [SPEAKER_02]: Well, that is a lot. 07:42.954 --> 07:44.056 [SPEAKER_02]: That does help quite a bit. 07:44.797 --> 08:04.583 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, but it's totally fair to go, hey, if you were involved with these really, really, really shady people, it's fair for us to take everything with a great assault and say, all right, all of this information left Teresa believing that Kristen probably knew the group under their false names and relationships since they had played it out so well. 08:04.563 --> 08:17.406 [SPEAKER_00]: She also thinks it's possible Kristen developed feelings for John as he was charismatic and older, which given Kristen's history with her father and the relationship she had with her teacher, that would make sense. 08:18.007 --> 08:23.938 [SPEAKER_00]: That crush could have possibly left Susanne upset as John was her actual husband. 08:23.918 --> 08:27.184 [SPEAKER_00]: So, was that the motive for getting rid of Christen at sea? 08:27.224 --> 08:33.475 [SPEAKER_00]: As Theresa said, she is sure, Suzanne or John will reach out any second to set all of this straight. 08:33.996 --> 08:37.022 [SPEAKER_00]: So, let us not hold our collective breath on that. 08:37.743 --> 08:41.590 [SPEAKER_02]: Was Christen's father abusive or just overbearing and controlling? 08:41.705 --> 08:47.210 [SPEAKER_00]: From what I gathered in the book, there was kind of an overbearing but also that cowardly element. 08:47.250 --> 08:58.721 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know if you recall the time that she had gone back home and one of her brother's friends had come into her room and messed with her and then she told the dad and the dad was like, he said he was sorry. 08:58.741 --> 08:59.842 [SPEAKER_01]: I do remember that. 08:59.882 --> 09:10.632 [SPEAKER_00]: So kind of this wet noodle about him so it's not surprising to think she met someone like 09:11.185 --> 09:15.456 [SPEAKER_00]: And she could have had the crush on him, not realizing he's actually married to Suzanne who is Sherry. 09:15.616 --> 09:25.701 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, someone assertive who can run a boat and a town has a whole town believing whatever you say, there's a charm to that. 09:26.153 --> 09:30.402 [SPEAKER_00]: The summer of 1981 was devoted to getting the freedom to set for sailing. 09:30.663 --> 09:37.097 [SPEAKER_00]: Some of the work Rick did on the boat was reinforcing the main mast with stainless steel plates, made by Rick and his father. 09:37.137 --> 09:41.867 [SPEAKER_00]: They raised the mast and installed hardware while Christian and Suzanne varnished. 09:41.847 --> 09:57.814 [SPEAKER_00]: According to Rick, the boat was immaculate and all of that and the work that they did has him convince that they weren't really planning on sinking it but sailing it to either get away or like they had possibly planned selling it in another country. 09:57.794 --> 10:05.904 [SPEAKER_00]: The group claimed the plan was to go around the world, stopping at Hawaii, then Australia, Rick's parents would then meet up with them in Hawaii. 10:06.585 --> 10:20.562 [SPEAKER_00]: When the time for the trip was getting closer and Rick's parents were meeting to, you know, plan, there was confusion and frustration when Bob and John were constantly moving the data round, eventually Rick's parents just gave up on the plan for meeting up with them. 10:21.453 --> 10:29.553 [SPEAKER_00]: Rick had also been planning on sailing with the four on the boat for the entire trip, but the excuses with him started to pile up as well. 10:30.134 --> 10:39.597 [SPEAKER_00]: The guys didn't think Rick joining them was a good idea and they started this whole thing of, oh, if you come with us, we're going to have to pay thousands of dollars for a foreign post bond. 10:39.577 --> 10:47.270 [SPEAKER_00]: There was even an occasion in which Bob took Rick on a walk, and he told him not to come, as things weren't what they seemed. 10:47.891 --> 10:59.691 [SPEAKER_00]: Rick thought that was regarding the Suzanne in a Teddy situation, but the pushback was eventually enough to cause Rick to give up on the idea as well, with nothing to do with his summer, Rick signed up for the Marines. 11:00.312 --> 11:04.740 [SPEAKER_00]: And then that goes back to him saying that he was on the boat on the third the night before he went to boot camp. 11:05.125 --> 11:06.568 [SPEAKER_02]: I just think it's that's very cool. 11:06.708 --> 11:07.750 [SPEAKER_02]: No matter what comes of it. 11:07.770 --> 11:11.156 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it's it's just like saying that this did happen. 11:11.196 --> 11:12.158 [SPEAKER_02]: It was right. 11:12.779 --> 11:13.360 [SPEAKER_02]: He was there. 11:13.760 --> 11:14.482 [SPEAKER_02]: He saw her. 11:14.582 --> 11:15.644 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, yeah. 11:15.664 --> 11:16.686 [SPEAKER_00]: And it adds another element. 11:16.706 --> 11:18.068 [SPEAKER_00]: It's like this other group of people. 11:18.108 --> 11:21.875 [SPEAKER_02]: They were around and a different perspective to a slightly different angle. 11:22.196 --> 11:23.879 [SPEAKER_02]: He's not in it. 11:23.899 --> 11:24.720 [SPEAKER_02]: Same in the same way. 11:24.700 --> 11:27.445 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, he's not lost like Kristen and he's not bullshitting like them. 11:27.585 --> 11:28.046 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, he had it. 11:28.066 --> 11:28.647 [SPEAKER_00]: He had it out. 11:29.028 --> 11:36.221 [SPEAKER_00]: So I've reformatted what was written by Teresa through their emails and stuff to, you know, kind of tell the story. 11:36.541 --> 11:44.656 [SPEAKER_00]: But he even says, I wish I had not been a teenager to really kind of dig in or understand better why he's telling me things are what they seemed. 11:45.397 --> 11:47.080 [SPEAKER_00]: He was only I think 19 at the time. 11:47.180 --> 11:47.721 [SPEAKER_00]: So 11:47.701 --> 11:51.612 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, you've got this grown dude being like a man, you don't want to come on the boat. 11:51.672 --> 11:55.243 [SPEAKER_00]: Things aren't what they seem like and you just go, oh, okay. 11:56.827 --> 12:00.698 [SPEAKER_00]: So again, it all, it all makes sense and you hope that it's real, but 12:01.640 --> 12:06.727 [SPEAKER_00]: For Rick, he never felt John and Bobby were dangerous or even capable of murder. 12:07.047 --> 12:10.532 [SPEAKER_00]: He felt very different about Cherie's slash Suzanne. 12:11.093 --> 12:13.576 [SPEAKER_00]: She, quote, scared of the crap out of me. 12:14.097 --> 12:17.942 [SPEAKER_00]: Rick described her as smiling, but then she would look right through you. 12:17.982 --> 12:21.066 [SPEAKER_00]: There was just a feeling he had about her. 12:22.075 --> 12:33.391 [SPEAKER_00]: While that new information doesn't explain anything about Kristen's location or what happened to her, it is interesting to at least hear from someone else who was around that group and had some unique insight. 12:34.212 --> 12:39.660 [SPEAKER_00]: Again, you can follow updates and see photos provided by Rick on the Facebook page, Kristen, can you hear me? 12:40.100 --> 12:46.429 [SPEAKER_00]: That is also where you can share any information you may have regarding Kristen Tomones disappearance. 12:46.409 --> 12:55.903 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think anyone's naive enough to think and then one thing will come up and we'll find her But just to know someone else saying like, oh, yeah, she was great. 12:56.003 --> 12:56.484 [SPEAKER_00]: I knew her. 12:56.504 --> 13:09.723 [SPEAKER_00]: She was here I was spent with her because she was just such a charmer It continues to give her life Because it's not just two people carrying that weight of Remembering that person yeah, even he's saying yeah, Kristen, can you hear me? 13:10.304 --> 13:13.589 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah, well, that's really nice because it mattered. 13:13.809 --> 13:15.792 [SPEAKER_02]: That's right the matters that she disappeared 13:16.868 --> 13:23.235 [SPEAKER_00]: Now we're headed up to Washington to talk about an amazing art installation being put in place to memorialize victims. 13:23.856 --> 13:35.829 [SPEAKER_00]: Tacoma-based artist Laura Lee Moon has spent two years taking photos of the locations where the 49 victims of Gary Green River Killer Ridgeway were either last seen or their bodies were discovered. 13:36.229 --> 13:39.433 [SPEAKER_00]: Her series is titled What the Earth knows. 13:39.413 --> 13:43.019 [SPEAKER_00]: Laura has a personal history that connects her to many of the victims. 13:43.519 --> 13:47.085 [SPEAKER_00]: She too has been trafficked and was involved in sex work. 13:47.105 --> 13:53.855 [SPEAKER_00]: That connection and her connection to the Earth telling the Seattle Times quote, what happened happened and the Earth knows it. 13:54.356 --> 13:57.000 [SPEAKER_00]: Was her biggest inspiration for creating this art? 13:56.980 --> 13:59.185 [SPEAKER_00]: Laura was born and raised in Washington. 13:59.385 --> 14:05.178 [SPEAKER_00]: She's a contributing writer to outlets like the Huffington Post, and she wasn't a photographer looking for a job. 14:05.459 --> 14:13.116 [SPEAKER_00]: She happened to come upon an old camera and decided to use it as a means of expression on behalf of the 49 known victims. 14:13.096 --> 14:19.308 [SPEAKER_00]: Unfortunately, the inspiration for creating the series occurred after Laura was raped while conducting sex work. 14:19.789 --> 14:25.299 [SPEAKER_00]: Realizing she couldn't report the incident because of how our system works, she wanted to do something more. 14:25.760 --> 14:32.893 [SPEAKER_00]: She wrote an article titled, I was raped as a sex worker and this is what I want you to know, and I highly suggest you read it. 14:33.464 --> 14:49.482 [SPEAKER_00]: She told the Seattle Times I deeply deeply already know what it's like to get into a car with a Gary Ridgeway, to get in a car and be terrified, to walk into a room and truly, and I don't think many people can say this, truly not know if you'll ever walk out. 14:49.462 --> 14:57.698 [SPEAKER_00]: Laura's goal with the series is to change the public outlook towards sex workers saying quote, the hatred and discrimination in stigma and violence. 14:57.998 --> 15:07.757 [SPEAKER_00]: There wasn't as much fervor to arrest and prosecute someone killing prostitutes, which she feels allowed for Ridgeway to feel empowered to target those sex workers. 15:07.737 --> 15:25.358 [SPEAKER_00]: You can see some of her collection from What the Earth knows via her website, LauralyMoon.com, that's Laura, L-E-M-O-O-N.com, or in-person at LottiesLounge located at 4900 Rainier Avenue South in Seattle. 15:25.338 --> 15:30.364 [SPEAKER_00]: The photos are hard to describe, I think there's something about a thousand words and so forth. 15:31.285 --> 15:36.352 [SPEAKER_00]: While the topic of the photos are very grim, the pictures themselves are stunning. 15:36.852 --> 15:41.338 [SPEAKER_00]: There's a simplicity to the view that allows you to feel like you are there. 15:42.099 --> 15:49.708 [SPEAKER_00]: Kind of an unspoken weight to feeling like you're seeing a similar image to that of the last one of 15:49.688 --> 15:58.101 [SPEAKER_00]: And I'm going to be reaching out to Laura for an interview, I would love to hear her perspective on protecting sex workers and her art, so stay tuned. 15:59.723 --> 16:06.854 [SPEAKER_00]: Way, way back, for episode 24, I discussed the vanport floods and the murder of Molligate to Sarra. 16:07.394 --> 16:14.565 [SPEAKER_00]: Since this was, again, a very old case, my writing was subpar and concise, we'll say. 16:15.305 --> 16:23.979 [SPEAKER_00]: The update is that there is a fantastic documentary about Moligata, his death, and the impact it had on Portland, thanks to Oregon Public Broadcasting. 16:24.720 --> 16:27.164 [SPEAKER_00]: Briefly, this is the story of Moligata. 16:27.945 --> 16:35.777 [SPEAKER_00]: The lure of Education Portland State University could provide was the motivation behind Moligata Saras move from Ethiopia to Portland. 16:35.757 --> 16:41.847 [SPEAKER_00]: Growing up on a farm in northern Ethiopia, Mollagata had big dreams of coming to the U.S. for schooling. 16:42.388 --> 16:50.061 [SPEAKER_00]: It was difficult for him to leave his young son behind, but he knew he could do more for his family by taking the opportunity to achieve his dreams. 16:50.842 --> 16:57.934 [SPEAKER_00]: It was 1980 and Mollagata was settling into Portland, attending classes, and working at a car rental company by the airport. 16:57.914 --> 17:06.756 [SPEAKER_00]: He had made a life for himself, living at the Park Lane apartments at Southeast 31st and Pine, and immersing himself in the Ethiopian immigrant community. 17:07.238 --> 17:14.556 [SPEAKER_00]: He was known for his gentle, kind, loving demeanor, for always being even killed, and just being an overall good guy. 17:14.536 --> 17:23.370 [SPEAKER_00]: Now, for some lesser-known Oregon history, in 1922, Walter Pierce, a member of the Ku Klux clan, was elected governor of Oregon. 17:23.711 --> 17:27.898 [SPEAKER_00]: He then served as a member of the U.S. House of Representatives from 1932 to 1942. 17:27.958 --> 17:37.253 [SPEAKER_00]: In 1923, Oregon was home to the largest population of Ku Klux clan members west of the Mississippi. 17:37.233 --> 17:49.184 [SPEAKER_00]: Fast forward through the remainder of the 50s, 60s and 70s, and Portland was starting to develop into the progressive city we all know, love, and perhaps pretend at times for it to be. 17:49.244 --> 17:54.309 [SPEAKER_00]: But they remained an unspoken anger in society, boiling just below the surface. 17:54.829 --> 18:06.700 [SPEAKER_00]: As the decades went on and laws finally started to catch up, the anger white supremacists were feeling was being fueled by the perceived acceptance of the increasingly growing population of minorities. 18:06.680 --> 18:12.026 [SPEAKER_00]: By the time the 1980s rolled around, there was a cultural scene with roots coming out of the KKK. 18:12.607 --> 18:19.195 [SPEAKER_00]: Those who we would refer to today as Nazis, white supremacists, proud boys, or fascists were dubbed skinheads. 18:19.215 --> 18:24.080 [SPEAKER_00]: They stood out with their unique look of military jackets, jackboots, and of course, shaved heads. 18:24.681 --> 18:35.674 [SPEAKER_00]: In the new documentary, there were skinheads interviewed because that term was actually stolen from cool punk folks who would go on to 18:35.890 --> 18:48.988 [SPEAKER_00]: One fact I didn't know that I didn't either and it said on the thing you know, it said skinhead or former skinhead I was like, oh, this is kind of a scandalous documentary and they were like, fuck those guys That's like, oh, okay, this is cool 18:49.812 --> 18:58.121 [SPEAKER_00]: This was at a time when punk and metal had passed the larval stage, and some hate-filled musicians had factioned off to use their platform to preach violence. 18:58.702 --> 19:06.089 [SPEAKER_00]: For example, in early 1988, a Chinese man was walking out of a restaurant with his family when he was attacked by a group of skinheads. 19:06.530 --> 19:14.859 [SPEAKER_00]: The perpetrators were arrested, and friend of the show, who was also interviewed in the documentary, Jim Redden, wrote an article about the scene and the incident. 19:15.299 --> 19:17.862 [SPEAKER_00]: His was a warning that was not heated. 19:17.842 --> 19:23.809 [SPEAKER_00]: The man who was attacked, called it out for what it was, and in 1988 said, this is a form of terrorism. 19:24.631 --> 19:42.533 [SPEAKER_00]: With white supremacist neo-Nazi's and skinheads in abundance in Portland, a man named Tom Metzger sent some of his cronies up north from his headquarters in California to recruit racists from the hate group East Side White Pride to join his group, war, or white Aryan resistance. 19:42.513 --> 19:49.341 [SPEAKER_00]: War focused on hating all kinds of minorities and preached that the best way to handle such people was through violence. 19:49.361 --> 19:54.728 [SPEAKER_00]: Both East Sidewide Pride and War had been known to jump minorities who were just out by themselves. 19:55.669 --> 20:03.279 [SPEAKER_00]: On November 13, 1988, Molligate was being dropped off at the apartment he shared with his uncle by two friends and fellow Ethiopians. 20:03.919 --> 20:09.246 [SPEAKER_00]: Molligate took out out of the car and was leaning into the window chatting to his friends and saying his goodbyes. 20:09.226 --> 20:14.317 [SPEAKER_00]: At the same moment, there was a group of men leaving a party at the apartment complex next door. 20:15.339 --> 20:29.108 [SPEAKER_00]: And by party, I mean a gathering of East Side White priders who, during the day, were handing out hate-filled literature, then spent the evening drinking beers, drying racist cartoons, and other things that they felt were helping their cause. 20:29.847 --> 20:37.295 [SPEAKER_00]: Leaving the apartment three men and two of their girlfriends got into a car and said, we're going to go fuck up some inwards. 20:37.956 --> 20:42.561 [SPEAKER_00]: As they started pulling away, they spotted Moligata and the other two black men in the car. 20:43.162 --> 20:53.593 [SPEAKER_00]: Having been riled up by their Nazi meeting and already on a path for racist violence, it might have seemed like that car of minorities being right in front of them was some sort of twisted version of fate. 20:53.573 --> 20:58.841 [SPEAKER_00]: The three Nazis left out of their car and started to verbally assault Malagate in his friends. 20:59.421 --> 21:07.553 [SPEAKER_00]: Since Malagate was already out of the car, he took control, trying to use his skills in charm to get everyone in the situation to just stay calm. 21:08.174 --> 21:11.599 [SPEAKER_00]: His pleas for peace did not work and soon the men were beating on him. 21:12.119 --> 21:14.603 [SPEAKER_00]: It started with throwing punches and kicking. 21:14.583 --> 21:18.869 [SPEAKER_00]: It took a turn when one of the Nazis reached into his car and pulled out a baseball bat. 21:19.309 --> 21:24.036 [SPEAKER_00]: Approaching Moligata from behind, he swung the bat and twice struck Moligata in the head. 21:24.657 --> 21:26.980 [SPEAKER_00]: Moligata succumbed to the pain and fell to the ground. 21:27.401 --> 21:37.975 [SPEAKER_00]: The attacker took that chance to hit him while he was down, and with a final fatal blow, struck Moligata with full force on the head, splitting the bat and Moligata skull. 21:37.955 --> 21:41.064 [SPEAKER_00]: The cowardly murderers then got back in their car and drove away. 21:41.104 --> 21:46.358 [SPEAKER_00]: Emergency services were called, and amazingly, Amulagetta was still alive when they arrived. 21:46.799 --> 21:50.810 [SPEAKER_00]: He was transported to the hospital where he passed away from his injuries the following day. 21:50.850 --> 21:53.618 [SPEAKER_00]: Amulagetta was only 28 years old. 21:53.598 --> 21:57.688 [SPEAKER_00]: Eight days later, the parties responsible for his murder were arrested. 21:58.149 --> 22:05.405 [SPEAKER_00]: This was due to the loose lips of a warm member who had gone back to California and was talking about information he had regarding a murder. 22:06.267 --> 22:08.653 [SPEAKER_00]: This information led to the arrest of 22:08.633 --> 22:17.045 [SPEAKER_00]: 23-year-old Kenneth M. Missky, who was known for his music and acting, even befriending and working with local film director Gus van Sand. 22:17.505 --> 22:27.199 [SPEAKER_00]: 19-year-old Kyle Brewster, who was Grant High School's Homecoming King, and had a mother who was well-known in the liberal activism community, and 20-year-old Steven Strasser. 22:35.971 --> 22:43.306 [SPEAKER_00]: If you've ever visited our blog at murder in the rain.com, you have seen that most of our sources come from newspapers.com. 22:43.948 --> 22:45.070 [SPEAKER_02]: Extra extra. 22:45.110 --> 22:50.201 [SPEAKER_02]: To get started on your own newspapers.com journey go to newspapers.com slash crime. 22:50.581 --> 22:53.828 [SPEAKER_02]: Use discount code murder in the rain to get 20% off. 22:53.808 --> 23:03.660 [SPEAKER_00]: We here at Murder in the Rain are so excited, elated, overjoyed, to say that we are sponsored by newspapers.com, our favorite website. 23:04.020 --> 23:07.184 [SPEAKER_02]: And as close to the micro-efficient, as will ever be. 23:07.785 --> 23:17.537 [SPEAKER_00]: My favorite part, I've had a dream my whole life of being a little Harriet the Spying going to the library and getting the micro-efficient spin in that dial. 23:17.517 --> 23:19.680 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, oh, finding this article. 23:19.700 --> 23:24.046 [SPEAKER_00]: That dream has come true because that's basically what these papers.com has. 23:24.386 --> 23:25.948 [SPEAKER_02]: Much easier to read than my profile. 23:25.968 --> 23:27.070 [SPEAKER_00]: That's true. 23:27.090 --> 23:28.572 [SPEAKER_00]: So newspapers for the win? 23:28.592 --> 23:28.712 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes. 23:29.413 --> 23:31.215 [SPEAKER_02]: Nothing compares to you, newspapers. 23:31.736 --> 23:32.176 [SPEAKER_02]: That's right. 23:32.196 --> 23:35.521 [SPEAKER_02]: Nothing compares to you. 23:36.282 --> 23:41.869 [SPEAKER_00]: To get started on your own newspapers.com journey, go to newspaper.com slash prime. 23:42.250 --> 23:47.136 [SPEAKER_00]: When you sign up, use discount code murder in the rain to get 20% off. 23:47.116 --> 23:55.951 [SPEAKER_00]: We dare you to sign up, look up a date, a location, a famous crime, or a person, and just try to not spiral for the rest of the day. 23:56.011 --> 24:01.420 [SPEAKER_00]: That's newspaper.com slash crime using discount code murder in the ring. 24:07.250 --> 24:11.757 [SPEAKER_00]: The criminal trial was pretty cut and dry, and all three involved pleaded guilty. 24:12.800 --> 24:16.907 [SPEAKER_00]: Kyle H. Brewster was 19 when he participated in the attack on Malagatia. 24:17.128 --> 24:25.242 [SPEAKER_00]: He was sentenced to 20 years for the part he played, while in prison, Kyle realized he learned his lesson and worked with inmates to write his wrongs. 24:26.124 --> 24:30.792 [SPEAKER_00]: JK Simmons, while behind bars, Kyle remained vocal about his racism. 24:30.772 --> 24:34.358 [SPEAKER_00]: his views did not affect his sentence, and he was perled in 2002. 24:34.659 --> 24:42.953 [SPEAKER_00]: He was back in prison in 2006, asked to finish his sentence after violating his parole by contacting a white supremacist group. 24:43.494 --> 24:51.447 [SPEAKER_00]: In 2008, he was sent to prison yet again this time it was for two years after he assaulted an Umatilla County officer. 24:51.427 --> 24:59.720 [SPEAKER_00]: In 2012, a man who had claimed to have served time alongside Kyle claimed that Kyle was the man who radicalized him into white supremacy. 25:00.301 --> 25:03.766 [SPEAKER_00]: The man called Kyle, quote, The first gang member I met. 25:04.047 --> 25:05.890 [SPEAKER_00]: He immediately took me under his wing. 25:06.070 --> 25:08.854 [SPEAKER_00]: He taught me and told me things I had never heard before. 25:09.275 --> 25:13.642 [SPEAKER_00]: He told me the right books to read and how to read between the lines of newspapers. 25:14.123 --> 25:16.827 [SPEAKER_00]: He had planted the seeds of racist ideology. 25:16.807 --> 25:23.414 [SPEAKER_00]: He also gave credit to Kyle for turning east side white pride from just a streaking into a full-on prison gang. 25:25.362 --> 25:26.968 [SPEAKER_00]: Good job, Kyle! 25:28.163 --> 25:39.758 [SPEAKER_00]: So, while Kyle did need to go to prison at 19, he maybe there should have been something in place to help not do that, not create a prison gang, that's just me. 25:40.919 --> 25:45.385 [SPEAKER_00]: Since those years, Kyle has been spotted by watchdogs at different hate-fueled events. 25:45.745 --> 25:49.970 [SPEAKER_00]: He got into a fight at the Salem Oregon, January 6th, attempted insurrection. 25:50.010 --> 25:53.715 [SPEAKER_00]: He was spotted at a proud boys rally in the fall of 2020. 25:53.695 --> 26:06.828 [SPEAKER_00]: Kyle commented on a post about the January 6th incident saying, and yep, I was part of a 3 on 3 fight with non-white immigrants to this country, and no part of me is sorry, remorseful, or regretful about that. 26:07.169 --> 26:13.415 [SPEAKER_00]: That's right, I got hit in the head with a hammer by Antifa BLM last week, split me up and pretty good. 26:13.815 --> 26:18.640 [SPEAKER_00]: Right after I punched one of them in the head and tripped one to the ground and kicked him hard in the ribs. 26:18.620 --> 26:26.732 [SPEAKER_00]: And that is milk of magnesium I face after we poured it in my eyes because I got bare-mased sprayed in my eyes at the same time I got hit with the hammer. 26:26.772 --> 26:30.918 [SPEAKER_00]: So it appears he really learned his lesson about being violent. 26:31.900 --> 26:36.747 [SPEAKER_00]: And in 2021 he was seen again at a proud boys rally in Portland. 26:36.727 --> 26:44.015 [SPEAKER_00]: So if you attend these events, be on the lookout for a dude that looks like the ultimate Kyle. 26:44.576 --> 26:46.218 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, Kyle Brewster, truly. 26:46.718 --> 26:47.940 [SPEAKER_00]: He's 56 years old. 26:48.440 --> 26:49.702 [SPEAKER_00]: He looks like a human toe. 26:50.182 --> 26:51.383 [SPEAKER_00]: He tends to wear a bit. 26:51.403 --> 26:57.230 [SPEAKER_00]: He little peaky blinders hat and an unconstitutional American flag scarf. 26:57.250 --> 27:02.616 [SPEAKER_00]: And he tends to 27:02.596 --> 27:06.059 [SPEAKER_00]: And you went to prison for beating someone, you're like, yeah, that's me. 27:06.640 --> 27:09.002 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm still beating people up because they don't like their skin. 27:09.062 --> 27:13.647 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, Steven R. Strasser was also sentenced to 20 years. 27:13.867 --> 27:19.873 [SPEAKER_00]: He completed his sentence November 19th, 1999 and was released on parole after serving 11 years. 27:20.414 --> 27:25.679 [SPEAKER_00]: He doesn't appear to be making the same violent choices as Kyle, but who knows? 27:26.220 --> 27:27.041 [SPEAKER_00]: There's still time. 27:27.081 --> 27:28.502 [SPEAKER_00]: There's still time. 27:28.482 --> 27:29.945 [SPEAKER_00]: But I'll give him credit. 27:29.965 --> 27:31.106 [SPEAKER_00]: He's not all over the news. 27:32.188 --> 27:34.172 [SPEAKER_00]: He's been out for 20 something years. 27:34.232 --> 27:50.119 [SPEAKER_00]: In addition to the charge of murder, Kenneth Meski was charged with racial intimidation, after it was found that he was the party responsible for the non-fatal stabbing of a black security officer at a safeway just two months before Molligate is murdered. 27:50.099 --> 27:58.780 [SPEAKER_00]: Known in the metal scene as Ken Death and more ghoulishly Batman, he had been the one wielding the bat and had dealt the fatal blow. 27:58.840 --> 28:06.538 [SPEAKER_00]: During the trial, Kenneth gave his non-remorseful reasoning for the attack saying that it was, quote, because of his race. 28:06.518 --> 28:11.685 [SPEAKER_00]: In 1990, 10 years were added to Ken's life sentence when he was busted having a weapon. 28:12.306 --> 28:18.635 [SPEAKER_00]: In his first decade behind bars, Ken racked up 150 pages of infractions. 28:19.296 --> 28:25.064 [SPEAKER_00]: They ranged from having contraband, committing assault, being disobedient, and affiliating with a gang. 28:26.265 --> 28:36.019 [SPEAKER_00]: In the late 1990s, Ken was in prison in New Mexico, and I can only assume he was possibly moved there to get him out of the white supremacy scene 28:35.999 --> 28:39.863 [SPEAKER_00]: fellow racist inmates referred to him as a prisoner of war. 28:39.883 --> 28:45.328 [SPEAKER_00]: He wasn't remorseful for what he had done to Malagata, saying it was simply an incident of road rage. 28:45.768 --> 28:51.473 [SPEAKER_00]: And by 1998, he was in control of his anger and he had seen the mistakes he had made. 28:51.513 --> 28:55.777 [SPEAKER_02]: How could it be road rage weren't they just in the neighboring apartment building? 28:56.098 --> 28:56.498 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes. 28:56.558 --> 29:04.926 [SPEAKER_00]: And he told the Oregonian, I've learned in the last ten years that hate makes one bitter and I don't like feeling negative all the time. 29:05.007 --> 29:15.489 [SPEAKER_00]: Thankfully, Kenneth served out the entirety of his life sentence for murder as he died in July 2011, due to complications from Hep C. That's a bad way to die. 29:15.750 --> 29:16.892 [SPEAKER_00]: That's not pleasant. 29:16.933 --> 29:19.137 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't wish none of anyone except to not see. 29:19.498 --> 29:20.280 [SPEAKER_00]: Except to not see. 29:20.340 --> 29:22.324 [SPEAKER_00]: Except to not see. 29:22.304 --> 29:26.370 [SPEAKER_00]: Going back to 1990, the courtroom drama was continuing. 29:26.571 --> 29:39.351 [SPEAKER_00]: Mologate's family came to the states, including his father and nine-year-old son, working with Morris D, who would eventually found the southern poverty law center and then get fired from it, and he turned out to be not such a good guy. 29:39.331 --> 29:46.963 [SPEAKER_00]: And, while respected lawyer, Elvin Rosenthall, who is featured in the documentary, they teamed up to Sue Tom Metzker and his son. 29:47.403 --> 29:53.012 [SPEAKER_00]: Tom was a former golden dragon of the KKK and had founded the War Movement in California. 29:53.613 --> 30:06.773 [SPEAKER_00]: This was a civil suit, and it claimed Tom was liable for Molligate's murder because of his pre-chings of hate and violence, which led to his followers obeying those demands 30:06.753 --> 30:14.205 [SPEAKER_00]: Going to court, Tom heard the judge's last name, asking if they were Jewish, it was confirmed, and he put in a request for a new judge. 30:14.345 --> 30:18.452 [SPEAKER_00]: This is my very favorite part of the story, and they featured in the documentary, and it had me giggling. 30:19.494 --> 30:27.607 [SPEAKER_00]: From those options, they chose the Irish sounding judge, Haggerty, to everyone but Tom's delight when the judge entered the courtroom. 30:27.727 --> 30:33.216 [SPEAKER_00]: It was then realized that he was the first, and at the time, only trial judge, 30:33.196 --> 30:36.286 [SPEAKER_00]: who was black he in the in Oregon. 30:36.627 --> 30:38.272 [SPEAKER_00]: I believe so are at least not the county. 30:38.312 --> 30:39.757 [SPEAKER_02]: Well I do love that. 30:39.897 --> 30:42.184 [SPEAKER_02]: They're like, yeah, had you tasty. 30:42.285 --> 30:43.729 [SPEAKER_00]: Haggerty will get it. 30:44.080 --> 30:45.001 [SPEAKER_00]: They'll be on my side. 30:45.021 --> 30:47.505 [SPEAKER_02]: No, no, what I'm talking about, so juicy. 30:48.586 --> 30:56.738 [SPEAKER_00]: After listening to Tom's self-representation of hate-filled rhetoric, he and his co-dependence were found responsible for the death of Moligata. 30:57.218 --> 31:04.328 [SPEAKER_00]: Damages were settled at $12 and a half million dollars, the highest amount at the time for a hate crime settlement. 31:04.949 --> 31:12.940 [SPEAKER_03]: After the verdict, Tom said, 31:14.270 --> 31:15.352 [SPEAKER_03]: We're too deep. 31:15.372 --> 31:16.274 [SPEAKER_03]: We're embedded now. 31:16.315 --> 31:17.357 [SPEAKER_03]: Don't you understand? 31:17.417 --> 31:18.620 [SPEAKER_03]: We're in your colleges. 31:18.660 --> 31:19.622 [SPEAKER_03]: We're in your armies. 31:19.682 --> 31:21.205 [SPEAKER_03]: We're in your police forces. 31:21.747 --> 31:26.457 [SPEAKER_04]: The Oregon jury award is being hailed as a blow to violent racism. 31:26.909 --> 31:36.480 [SPEAKER_00]: Knowing they would probably never get any money, Malagatus family and the community that loved him were happy with the outcome as the goal was to bankrupt war, which it did. 31:36.520 --> 31:42.106 [SPEAKER_00]: Tom lost his car, his house, and eventually influence on the groups he had worked so hard to develop. 31:42.646 --> 31:44.729 [SPEAKER_00]: For 20 years, all was taken from him. 31:45.129 --> 31:49.474 [SPEAKER_00]: In total, about $250,000 in damages were collected. 31:49.454 --> 32:01.220 [SPEAKER_00]: On the 30th anniversary of Molligate's death, 16 memorial street sign caps were placed with his name, photo, birth, and death here, in both English and Amherick, the primary language of Ethiopia. 32:01.861 --> 32:06.872 [SPEAKER_00]: Local communities work hard year after year to keep the memory of Molligate's life alive. 32:06.852 --> 32:15.403 [SPEAKER_00]: The documentary about Moligata was made by Oregon Public Broadcasting, but I've got great news for those of you who live out of state. 32:15.843 --> 32:24.955 [SPEAKER_00]: The documentary is available on YouTube, just type in Oregon experience, and I mean, you really can just watch all of those because they're really great. 32:25.295 --> 32:36.049 [SPEAKER_00]: But to help you find the one we're talking about, it's titled, remembering Moligata Sera. 32:36.029 --> 32:38.533 [SPEAKER_00]: and helpful and moving imagery. 32:38.773 --> 32:40.356 [SPEAKER_00]: So I can't suggest it enough. 32:40.877 --> 32:55.520 [SPEAKER_00]: It really touches on who he was as a person and the long-term effect of Portland dealing with the fact that we do have a lot of white supremacists here and also finding back to say, well, how can we take the power away from these people? 32:55.740 --> 32:59.526 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, if we sue them, they can't make their little magazines or travel around. 32:59.686 --> 33:00.147 [SPEAKER_00]: So, 33:00.127 --> 33:02.950 [SPEAKER_00]: Um, it was a, it was a very big deal. 33:02.970 --> 33:06.494 [SPEAKER_00]: It was a huge case up here and, and it means a lot. 33:08.436 --> 33:15.064 [SPEAKER_00]: In one of the first episodes that really hit me and stuck with me, Josh, I feel like you're kind of in the same boat. 33:15.604 --> 33:22.472 [SPEAKER_00]: Our former host Emily covered the murder of Reno Verk, and that episode was called the beginning to her end. 33:22.908 --> 33:24.793 [SPEAKER_02]: That story is what became that under the bridge. 33:25.054 --> 33:25.615 [SPEAKER_00]: Correct. 33:25.635 --> 33:26.879 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah on Hulu. 33:27.079 --> 33:38.149 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, the expansive case surrounding renaverics death was shared by Emily and yeah, there was so much that case it was the subject of the incredible mini series under the bridge. 33:38.129 --> 33:45.176 [SPEAKER_00]: Kelly Ellard, known now as Carrie Sim, was one of the 18 ages who faced charges relating to Rina's murder. 33:45.857 --> 33:50.822 [SPEAKER_00]: Out of those 18 ages, six met lesser charges as they were part of the physical assault. 33:51.303 --> 34:02.495 [SPEAKER_00]: The two other teens, Warren Paul Glowatsky and Kelly Ellard, aka Carrie Sim, I'm going to use both names because I think she just changed her name after the show came out and she didn't want as much attention. 34:02.615 --> 34:05.638 [SPEAKER_00]: So I'm obviously going to keep bringing attention. 34:06.665 --> 34:16.921 [SPEAKER_00]: It was November 14, 1997 when 15-year-old Carrie and her seven friends beat 14-year-old Rina to death under the Craig Flower Bridge in Sennich, British Columbia. 34:17.562 --> 34:19.746 [SPEAKER_00]: A days later, Rina's body was discovered. 34:20.467 --> 34:25.295 [SPEAKER_00]: The reason there were different charges is that the six teens were involved in the physical assault. 34:25.715 --> 34:28.059 [SPEAKER_00]: When Rina ran away, they did not follow. 34:28.560 --> 34:30.563 [SPEAKER_00]: Carrie and Warren did. 34:30.543 --> 34:38.077 [SPEAKER_00]: Because of the severity of the crime, Kary was tried as an adult in charge with second-degree murder, in March of 2000 she was convicted. 34:38.638 --> 34:42.585 [SPEAKER_00]: In February 2003, the Court of Appeals overturned that conviction. 34:43.086 --> 34:53.125 [SPEAKER_00]: In June of 2004, there was a mistrial due to a hung jury, and in April 2005 she was found guilty and was sentenced to life without parole for at least seven years. 34:53.105 --> 35:03.422 [SPEAKER_00]: In 2017, Carrie was granted day parole, meaning she could be out in the world doing what she pleased until the evening when she would either have to return to the prison or a halfway house. 35:04.003 --> 35:08.430 [SPEAKER_00]: Two years of good behavior earned her overnight stays out of the prison. 35:08.410 --> 35:16.340 [SPEAKER_00]: The reasoning behind this was due to Carrie's willingness in 2016 to finally take some sort of responsibility for her role in Rina's death. 35:16.960 --> 35:26.372 [SPEAKER_00]: It had long been thought that after the other teens fled, post the beating, Carrie and Warren stayed back and finished Rina off with Carrie holding Rina's head underwater. 35:26.392 --> 35:31.718 [SPEAKER_00]: In 2016, Carrie corrected that story by saying quote, 35:31.698 --> 35:33.680 [SPEAKER_00]: I didn't need to hold her head under water. 35:33.700 --> 35:35.002 [SPEAKER_00]: There would have been no point. 35:35.442 --> 35:36.823 [SPEAKER_00]: I was only thinking of myself. 35:37.164 --> 35:37.885 [SPEAKER_00]: I pushed her in. 35:38.385 --> 35:42.470 [SPEAKER_00]: It's like almost I just thought in my mind it would just carry the problem away. 35:42.530 --> 35:48.476 [SPEAKER_00]: When first granted day parole, Carrie was already the mother to a nearly one-year-old child. 35:49.077 --> 35:51.880 [SPEAKER_00]: But how does a person serving life get pregnant in prison? 35:51.900 --> 35:53.702 [SPEAKER_00]: No, it wasn't a guard. 35:54.122 --> 36:00.709 [SPEAKER_00]: It was the boyfriend she had met through prison who had ties to a gang that robbed homes to help with his 36:00.689 --> 36:08.320 [SPEAKER_00]: He was given day parole as part of his seven-year sentence, which allowed for of all things logical visits within mates. 36:09.541 --> 36:10.643 [SPEAKER_00]: So that's cool. 36:11.945 --> 36:15.930 [SPEAKER_00]: Then while on day parole, Kary got pregnant, again, by the same boyfriend. 36:16.431 --> 36:21.097 [SPEAKER_00]: While some people, like say myself, would say, who the hell do you think you are? 36:21.117 --> 36:30.190 [SPEAKER_00]: You not only took a life, but you selfishly decided to create two lives that you won't be able to take care of because you have a life sentence for a brutal 36:31.790 --> 36:38.340 [SPEAKER_00]: Carrie claims motherhood has helped her to see the error of her ways and has given her a new perspective on everything. 36:39.670 --> 36:42.693 [SPEAKER_00]: Four years Carrie's day parole was going just fine. 36:43.013 --> 36:45.856 [SPEAKER_00]: She was doing so well it was extended in March of 2024. 36:45.916 --> 36:53.164 [SPEAKER_00]: Things changed in January of 2025 when she was arrested by Surrey police based on a warrant. 36:53.784 --> 36:58.229 [SPEAKER_00]: The details as to what part of her parole she had violated have not been made public. 36:58.629 --> 37:09.660 [SPEAKER_00]: What has been made public is that it was noted by staff in the halfway home and other facilities that Carrie's demeanor had changed. 37:09.640 --> 37:14.646 [SPEAKER_00]: After being picked up and within a few months, she had several failed drug tests. 37:15.448 --> 37:25.701 [SPEAKER_00]: Told she had disregarded minimum supervision expectations, and when it was brought up to her she, quote, became hostile argumentative antagonizing lack to accountability and deflected blame. 37:26.442 --> 37:32.830 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, due to all of these violations, Cari's day parole was revoked in February 2025. 37:33.417 --> 37:41.091 [SPEAKER_00]: Carrie and her legal team fought against the revocation, saying the meds she was on were causing a false positive for meth and fetemines. 37:41.632 --> 37:46.140 [SPEAKER_00]: Besides, she couldn't be doing drugs, she was busy being the mother to two babies. 37:46.881 --> 37:57.400 [SPEAKER_00]: In response, the board said, quote, according to your files since your suspension, you have remained adamant that you have not used drugs and any positive results are due to your prescribed medication. 37:57.380 --> 38:06.233 [SPEAKER_00]: Once again claimed the medication you were prescribed caused a false positive, it was confirmed the medication you were taking would not provide a false positive. 38:06.694 --> 38:16.509 [SPEAKER_00]: The board did not fail to observe a principle of fundamental justice, make an error of law, or basis decision on erroneous or incomplete information. 38:16.549 --> 38:20.755 [SPEAKER_00]: They were basically like, yeah, we get your appeal too bad. 38:21.899 --> 38:28.334 [SPEAKER_00]: And now we've come to possibly Josh's library corner and our hot streamers. 38:28.354 --> 38:29.276 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, God, okay. 38:29.737 --> 38:31.561 [SPEAKER_02]: What the hell did I just read? 38:31.701 --> 38:32.242 [SPEAKER_00]: You read that. 38:32.984 --> 38:33.485 [SPEAKER_02]: Blue book. 38:34.367 --> 38:35.510 [SPEAKER_02]: I did read a blue book. 38:36.111 --> 38:40.060 [SPEAKER_02]: I read a book called Mystery by Peter Straub that was incredible. 38:40.040 --> 38:44.370 [SPEAKER_02]: I read a book called Just Mercy, Incredible. 38:45.031 --> 38:50.464 [SPEAKER_02]: I read Clive Barker's first volume of books of blood, incredible. 38:52.709 --> 38:53.671 [SPEAKER_02]: What else did I read? 38:53.811 --> 38:56.698 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, I read Peter Straub's floating dragon, Incredible. 38:56.678 --> 39:07.333 [SPEAKER_00]: I'll tell you what's incredible that we do an update every four episodes, so it's only about eight weeks if not less because of recording time and you always have a pile of books that you've read. 39:08.575 --> 39:10.017 [SPEAKER_02]: It's awe-inspiring. 39:10.097 --> 39:10.478 [SPEAKER_02]: Thank you. 39:10.538 --> 39:11.239 [SPEAKER_02]: I love to read. 39:11.259 --> 39:11.840 [SPEAKER_02]: I always have. 39:11.880 --> 39:17.488 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm also reading the autobiography of British comedian Bob Mortimer, which is incredible. 39:19.882 --> 39:23.348 [SPEAKER_02]: The theme of Josh's library corner today is incredible. 39:23.508 --> 39:25.071 [SPEAKER_02]: I've been writing a lot. 39:25.492 --> 39:27.215 [SPEAKER_02]: We've been working on that project forever. 39:27.576 --> 39:33.747 [SPEAKER_02]: And I've found that the only way to get to fuel up my tank in the morning is to start by reading. 39:33.767 --> 39:38.515 [SPEAKER_02]: So I read for about an hour every morning when I get up and drink my coffee and then I'm off. 39:38.495 --> 39:39.958 [SPEAKER_02]: I've read seriously in the past. 39:40.038 --> 39:42.142 [SPEAKER_02]: I've read so many books in the past two months. 39:42.162 --> 39:43.545 [SPEAKER_02]: It's got to be a dozen at least. 39:43.585 --> 39:45.048 [SPEAKER_02]: I feel like I've read so many books. 39:45.289 --> 39:46.130 [SPEAKER_02]: And that's not a brag. 39:46.171 --> 39:47.674 [SPEAKER_02]: It's just like, whoa, how do I do that? 39:47.714 --> 39:47.934 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. 39:48.435 --> 39:49.036 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, it's good. 39:49.056 --> 39:51.481 [SPEAKER_00]: You're like waking up that part of your brain before you get to work. 39:51.521 --> 39:52.343 [SPEAKER_02]: And it helps every day. 39:52.604 --> 39:53.686 [SPEAKER_02]: That's cool. 39:53.706 --> 39:57.313 [SPEAKER_00]: Speaking of watching things, hot streamers. 40:10.810 --> 40:12.314 [SPEAKER_02]: Dark winds that we talked about that. 40:12.354 --> 40:26.187 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think we have talk about incredible it's incredible and I recommend it's got a little fuel of breaking bad and I don't know if that's because of the landscape or that it's on any or just a high production value. 40:26.167 --> 40:26.968 [SPEAKER_02]: And see you mean. 40:27.549 --> 40:29.553 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, is any even a channel anymore? 40:29.593 --> 40:30.194 [SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely. 40:30.494 --> 40:31.275 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay. 40:31.295 --> 40:32.978 [SPEAKER_00]: We're also going to watch the first 48. 40:32.998 --> 40:34.982 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, of course. 40:35.763 --> 40:37.386 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, Stark wins is excellent. 40:37.546 --> 40:42.193 [SPEAKER_00]: It is kind of a procedural mystery. 40:42.214 --> 40:45.559 [SPEAKER_02]: 70s cop shows set on the Navajo. 40:45.539 --> 40:47.483 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, there's no reservation. 40:47.523 --> 40:53.276 [SPEAKER_00]: Great music, great clothes, great acting, great characters, and it's just you're just trying to solve it. 40:53.316 --> 41:00.932 [SPEAKER_02]: It's not about all the melodrama and it's just ever so slightly tinge with ideas of sort of the supernatural. 41:00.912 --> 41:01.954 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, but I like that. 41:02.374 --> 41:11.527 [SPEAKER_00]: But in a natural way or Gannas, it's an insight to how Indigenous people, or at least those Indigenous people at their representing what their lives are. 41:11.628 --> 41:17.216 [SPEAKER_00]: It'd be like following a Catholic family, like, oh, you got to go do this in this and it's the same idea. 41:17.256 --> 41:19.699 [SPEAKER_00]: We're just like, oh, that's how you integrate that into your life. 41:19.760 --> 41:20.220 [SPEAKER_00]: That's cool. 41:20.941 --> 41:21.642 [SPEAKER_00]: Another true crime. 41:21.662 --> 41:25.007 [SPEAKER_00]: We've got a new season of homicide New York. 41:25.428 --> 41:26.970 [SPEAKER_02]: That's right. 41:26.950 --> 41:29.193 [SPEAKER_02]: from the makers of lawn order, I believe. 41:29.233 --> 41:30.454 [SPEAKER_02]: That's because the dick will show. 41:30.494 --> 41:31.215 [SPEAKER_00]: I believe you're right. 41:32.117 --> 41:34.640 [SPEAKER_02]: And they kind of play out like that, kind of like a lawn order. 41:34.700 --> 41:43.791 [SPEAKER_02]: But there's a lot more motion than you see in a lawn order episode that is the police and people affected by the crime or represented in there allowed to a vote. 41:44.172 --> 41:45.574 [SPEAKER_02]: And they're allowed to talk about the mistakes. 41:45.654 --> 41:49.358 [SPEAKER_02]: And those detectives really seem to have carried a lot with them. 41:49.378 --> 41:50.540 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know how they do that job. 41:50.760 --> 41:51.000 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. 41:51.381 --> 41:51.781 [SPEAKER_02]: Great show. 41:52.102 --> 41:54.645 [SPEAKER_02]: It was all five episodes incredible. 41:56.718 --> 42:17.005 [SPEAKER_00]: And not true crime related, but we stumbled upon this because we've talked about our obsession with taskmaster and now there's a second season of a show, I'm sorry to say it's on prime, but you can find your way around that called LOL last one laughing UK UK we're going to watch Canada next it's almost all taskmaster contestants, so you know it's funny. 42:16.985 --> 42:32.019 [SPEAKER_00]: And it's literally this is like when you need when your brain is like I wish I had bubble gum to chew on or nerds to eat just nothingness except laughter and stupidity last one laughing. 42:32.959 --> 42:37.864 [SPEAKER_00]: It's a bunch of comedians in a room for six hours and they have to not laugh. 42:38.024 --> 42:46.992 [SPEAKER_00]: So they keep trying to make each other laugh and they aren't supposed to and if they laugh twice 42:46.972 --> 42:48.515 [SPEAKER_00]: And it's a real delight. 42:48.996 --> 42:50.719 [SPEAKER_00]: It seems painful what they're going through. 42:50.759 --> 42:51.981 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes. 42:52.001 --> 43:01.117 [SPEAKER_00]: And I have had, I think, two dreams now, where I've either been watching, and I woke myself up laughing, or I've been in the room trying to get people to laugh. 43:01.218 --> 43:10.414 [SPEAKER_00]: So, with the weight of the world being what it is, when you need that complete escape for 20 minutes, last one laughing. 43:10.630 --> 43:22.411 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, when I was having my read this morning, reading Bob Mortimer's book, I had an image of one of the contestants who was holding in their laughter to the point that they looked like they were going to explode. 43:22.431 --> 43:25.897 [SPEAKER_02]: I never really mean me laughing just thinking about. 43:25.917 --> 43:28.622 [SPEAKER_02]: It's such a funny steeper little concept, but yeah. 43:28.602 --> 43:31.647 [SPEAKER_02]: So enjoyable to watch people try not to laugh. 43:31.667 --> 43:36.975 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and they've all worked with each other in some or at least know each other's buttons. 43:37.116 --> 43:42.444 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and so it's like your group of friends hanging out trying to not laugh, which would be really difficult. 43:43.065 --> 43:47.893 [SPEAKER_00]: So I think that's all we have for hot streamers. 44:00.142 --> 44:02.806 [SPEAKER_00]: All right, that's all we have for updates this week. 44:03.026 --> 44:06.170 [SPEAKER_00]: We've got, I think, some pretty interesting cases coming up. 44:06.190 --> 44:11.317 [SPEAKER_00]: I'll finally get to Tony Carter, who I've been trying to get to since the episode, Night Freak. 44:11.338 --> 44:22.052 [SPEAKER_00]: I have found another case about two indigenous women who disappeared from their job course site, other people that have written in about cases that they want to share, missing people in their lives. 44:22.112 --> 44:29.743 [SPEAKER_00]: So I'm really looking forward to the next batch of episodes we've got coming your way. 44:29.723 --> 44:30.284 [SPEAKER_00]: Be safe. 44:31.225 --> 44:39.774 [SPEAKER_00]: Shoot us a message if you've got a case or an idea or if you have a hot streamer of your own, we're always looking for things to watch and obviously books for Josh's library corners. 44:39.834 --> 44:44.999 [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, please I love a recommendation and I like to read them. 44:47.502 --> 44:49.865 [SPEAKER_00]: Is that good? 44:50.285 --> 44:51.346 [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, I love a book record. 44:51.366 --> 44:52.267 [SPEAKER_00]: No, that's the end. 44:52.287 --> 44:53.028 [SPEAKER_02]: Give me the paper. 44:53.428 --> 44:59.595 [SPEAKER_00]: Give me the paper. 45:01.820 --> 45:03.202 [SPEAKER_02]: Build a bear? 45:05.025 --> 45:08.190 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, a teddy. 45:08.891 --> 45:27.861 [SPEAKER_00]: I... I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I- 45:28.162 --> 45:29.063 [SPEAKER_02]: truly embarrassing. 45:29.403 --> 45:32.367 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm horrified and I don't want you to divorce me. 45:33.468 --> 45:43.760 [SPEAKER_00]: The man called Kyle quote, quote, quote, quote, the man called, quote, quote, quote, quote, quote, quote, that's offensive. 45:44.261 --> 45:49.247 [SPEAKER_00]: A CKQ, a classic CKQ. 45:49.267 --> 45:50.088 [SPEAKER_02]: It did away from me. 45:51.209 --> 45:53.952 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, it had been Hillary. 45:53.992 --> 45:56.515 [SPEAKER_00]: What are 45:58.486 --> 46:05.539 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, to a bang those demands, ultimulti ultimulti ultimulti. 46:06.140 --> 46:07.582 [SPEAKER_00]: That's a new one. 46:07.642 --> 46:08.223 [SPEAKER_02]: That is. 46:08.885 --> 46:09.125 [SPEAKER_00]: Wow. 46:09.706 --> 46:10.367 [SPEAKER_02]: Wow. 46:10.387 --> 46:10.628 [SPEAKER_02]: Wow. 46:11.670 --> 46:12.631 [SPEAKER_02]: I find you. 46:13.673 --> 46:14.194 [SPEAKER_02]: Quilti. 46:14.575 --> 46:15.877 [SPEAKER_00]: That's your personal one, isn't it? 46:15.897 --> 46:19.163 [SPEAKER_02]: That's my toilet paper ad that I've been thinking of for 35 years. 46:19.243 --> 46:19.784 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, you have. 46:19.844 --> 46:21.928 [SPEAKER_02]: The gavel comes down. 46:22.482 --> 46:46.649 [SPEAKER_02]: Way the jury and the above in title action find the defendant quilty well we should send the Sherman bearers to court prison well you ever yeah well they have a book no I want a movie They don't have that I know that's what I'm saying what do you want to do just how about how about we watch wicked But then we just slow down the singing parts. 46:46.669 --> 46:50.313 [SPEAKER_02]: So it sounds like they're talking oh, okay It's six hours long. 46:50.593 --> 46:50.633 [UNKNOWN]: Oh 46:51.271 --> 47:14.308 [SPEAKER_02]: to find gratitude.