WEBVTT 00:02.760 --> 00:11.464 [SPEAKER_00]: Just to spend, from common lives, and you're listening, listening to listening, to the high-carum podcasts. 00:19.122 --> 00:39.355 [SPEAKER_04]: welcome everyone to the high carbon podcast this week we're missing Paulie he's a little under the weather i think he's been uh overworking himself getting ready for the Napster Austria maybe uh or just a bad immune system who knows but taking this place tonight um we have Fingle Ferguson welcome Fingle to the show hey good to be here guys thanks for having me 00:39.635 --> 00:40.416 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, nice to see you. 00:40.436 --> 00:41.597 [SPEAKER_04]: We got the cameras on this time. 00:41.617 --> 00:45.162 [SPEAKER_04]: I think we haven't used those before, but it makes a little bit easier, so we don't talk over each other. 00:45.182 --> 00:47.564 [SPEAKER_04]: So you can flip the birds together. 00:47.584 --> 00:48.105 [SPEAKER_04]: We need to. 00:48.385 --> 00:48.626 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah. 00:51.431 --> 00:53.693 [SPEAKER_04]: So, uh, what's everybody's weeks looking like? 00:53.913 --> 00:54.914 [SPEAKER_04]: I know everybody's busy. 00:54.954 --> 00:58.096 [SPEAKER_04]: We don't hear a lot of chatter on Instagram and all the chats are quiet. 00:58.496 --> 01:00.178 [SPEAKER_04]: How have you been doing classes or? 01:00.338 --> 01:00.538 [SPEAKER_01]: No. 01:00.798 --> 01:04.841 [SPEAKER_01]: We're preparing for NAVshaustria and breaking on shit loads of custom orders. 01:05.201 --> 01:06.442 [SPEAKER_01]: We're just making nice. 01:06.683 --> 01:09.044 [SPEAKER_01]: We wanted to have 15 ready for NAVshaustria. 01:09.264 --> 01:13.207 [SPEAKER_01]: Now it looks like we're gonna have 10 ready, but that's just how it is. 01:13.408 --> 01:14.749 [SPEAKER_04]: You'll be bringing a bunch of steel too. 01:15.109 --> 01:16.270 [SPEAKER_04]: Oh yeah, are you bringing pellets? 01:17.010 --> 01:20.692 [SPEAKER_01]: No, we're not bringing any steel, we will bring belts. 01:20.792 --> 01:32.358 [SPEAKER_01]: So we ordered lots and lots of belts from VSM, the white ones, the arctilics, the standard ceramic belts, and we're bringing gas-wine stones, so materials. 01:32.398 --> 01:33.358 [SPEAKER_01]: So we have two tables. 01:33.778 --> 01:35.579 [SPEAKER_01]: So one for knives and one for material. 01:36.039 --> 01:42.483 [SPEAKER_01]: That's why on the floor plan, our tables are yellow, and not white, like the knife makers. 01:43.483 --> 01:50.732 [SPEAKER_01]: I think that's the color coding on the floor plant and whenever your tables call it yellow that you're also a material supplier. 01:51.534 --> 02:00.365 [SPEAKER_01]: So we have one table with material and one table with nice, but maybe not a full table with nice, but yeah, they're small room for material then, I guess. 02:01.335 --> 02:03.156 [SPEAKER_04]: We're going to set up all the work out for your belts. 02:03.336 --> 02:04.537 [SPEAKER_04]: Are you just going to throw them on the table? 02:04.797 --> 02:06.719 [SPEAKER_01]: It's just going to throw them on the table. 02:07.699 --> 02:10.021 [SPEAKER_01]: But we won't have electricity at our table. 02:10.141 --> 02:12.162 [SPEAKER_01]: Which sucks because we were counting on that. 02:12.702 --> 02:15.844 [SPEAKER_01]: We had electricity, all the knife shows we went to. 02:16.905 --> 02:23.227 [SPEAKER_01]: And we need electricity, usually because we don't have a banner or something because we use these two large monitors. 02:23.667 --> 02:27.628 [SPEAKER_01]: One with the logo and the other one where there's forging videos and stuff. 02:27.728 --> 02:33.709 [SPEAKER_01]: But Martin told us a few days ago on Sunday that we won't have electricity at our table. 02:33.930 --> 02:35.570 [SPEAKER_02]: Because what about a battery pack? 02:35.950 --> 02:39.771 [SPEAKER_02]: Can you bring one of those sort of little charge-up battery packs? 02:39.831 --> 02:44.893 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I don't know how much consumption you'd need for monitor if I think more than that. 02:45.193 --> 02:49.574 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I think so we need 240 volts for the monitor. 02:49.754 --> 02:52.755 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know if there's battery packs out there that can supply that 02:53.575 --> 02:54.456 [SPEAKER_02]: They're hungry aren't they? 02:54.496 --> 02:57.998 [SPEAKER_01]: Manifers are kind of... Yeah, especially if they're running all day. 02:58.699 --> 03:03.162 [SPEAKER_01]: So they're running 10 in or 9 in the morning till whenever they show ends. 03:03.882 --> 03:04.382 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. 03:04.422 --> 03:06.284 [SPEAKER_01]: We will have to figure something out. 03:06.344 --> 03:11.587 [SPEAKER_01]: Because apparently only the table next to the walls have outlets or power. 03:11.707 --> 03:11.947 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. 03:12.408 --> 03:14.769 [SPEAKER_01]: So you're going to have electricity, I guess, Keith? 03:14.889 --> 03:15.049 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. 03:15.189 --> 03:17.171 [SPEAKER_01]: Because you're next to a wall. 03:18.072 --> 03:21.733 [SPEAKER_04]: I believe I'm kind of a cross from your table or a section of mines across me. 03:21.753 --> 03:24.254 [SPEAKER_04]: We can get a beam a set of projection. 03:24.374 --> 03:32.016 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, we asked if we could use an extension cord, but the trim has it probably then. 03:32.116 --> 03:34.037 [SPEAKER_01]: It's not allowed to use a cable. 03:34.057 --> 03:35.798 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, we would have used duct tape too. 03:35.938 --> 03:39.579 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, to put it over it, but that's not allowed Martin told us. 03:39.599 --> 03:41.639 [SPEAKER_01]: So we won't have electricity. 03:41.699 --> 03:45.981 [SPEAKER_01]: We might have to order a banner or to something like that. 03:47.161 --> 04:06.813 [SPEAKER_02]: I think I'm close to Alfredo and I hope he has power for his coffee machine I think that's it Alfredo or the third hill that usually brings a coffee machine I'm looking forward to being near those guys I think it's Alfredo and I thought about Alfredo as well because of that I'll have to bring a little manual, a little manual maker with a little believers or something like that 04:09.155 --> 04:11.937 [SPEAKER_02]: this is actually going to be my first knife show that I've ever done. 04:12.517 --> 04:17.981 [SPEAKER_02]: In 15 years of making knives I've never stood behind a table and sold my knives at an any form of crap thing. 04:18.021 --> 04:22.745 [SPEAKER_02]: It's kind of I'm kind of going through everything in my head as to what I actually need to bring. 04:22.825 --> 04:30.250 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I sell stuff every week that I'm not a stranger to kind of selling food but actually never standing behind the knives. 04:30.750 --> 04:36.675 [SPEAKER_02]: So it'll be kind of an interesting thing for me and I suppose that the thing I'm not looking for is having to be behind the table for the entire day. 04:37.835 --> 04:41.376 [SPEAKER_02]: Fine, he's going to want to wander off, but yeah, now I'm looking forward to. 04:41.636 --> 04:46.358 [SPEAKER_04]: Well, maybe you'll sell out early and you have some time in the last two. 04:46.378 --> 04:49.799 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm trying to work out what to bring, because I'm at a crossroads. 04:49.839 --> 05:01.643 [SPEAKER_02]: I've started making all the knives for the Damestyle, so I have kind of a good, I've been forging a lot of Damestyle, so I have probably about 10 or so knives from Damestyle, and then I've probably got about 05:03.484 --> 05:12.790 [SPEAKER_02]: 50 or so knives finished because I was going to do a knife drop and then I held back from doing the knife drop and, you know, I've got knives for Austria and then afterwards as DCI. 05:12.850 --> 05:24.819 [SPEAKER_02]: So I'm kind of kind of working out what to bring with me and there's no point to sort of bringing everything because I need to do a knife drop as well and it just saves the damage to the ones for later on, but and in this Christmas afterwards. 05:24.839 --> 05:28.822 [SPEAKER_02]: So it's do I just bring kind of some of my nicest ones or bring a little bit of everything. 05:28.882 --> 05:30.403 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm kind of trying to work it out myself. 05:30.655 --> 05:35.458 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, that's always tough before the show's like, you know, you know what it's coming up. 05:35.999 --> 05:45.365 [SPEAKER_04]: You want to have stuff to sell at the tables, but at the same time, if you did a knife drop right now, you'd probably sell half of those or all of them that you put online. 05:45.485 --> 05:46.126 [SPEAKER_04]: I mean, that's all. 05:46.146 --> 05:51.870 [SPEAKER_04]: And so you're pretty much going to the show to meet people and just get some maybe some new some fresh eyes on your knives and person and 05:52.134 --> 05:56.097 [SPEAKER_02]: And if anything, get people to probably physically pick them up and look at the nice for the first time. 05:56.117 --> 06:17.593 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, pictures only do so much and I feel even even in the past couple of years, you always feel how you evolve and, you know, and I think that in the past couple of years of forging have really sort of changed my attitude towards edge geometry and everything else like that being able to manipulate the steel and play around with it almost kind of 06:18.673 --> 06:43.280 [SPEAKER_02]: changes your perspective on it and so I'm kind of yeah I've had the most fantastic run of bad luck earlier in the year with sort of like screwing up blades and trying to get my head around sort of creating systems and like we I had the new forged the New Helios and dialing that in and finding all these systems that you know absolutely user error but once I had that up and running the you know 06:44.040 --> 06:48.342 [SPEAKER_02]: it was fantastic, but because I don't make knives every day. 06:48.362 --> 06:50.884 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm probably in the food side or doing the knives. 06:51.444 --> 06:56.027 [SPEAKER_02]: There's too much time kind of let goes between the processes. 06:56.107 --> 07:02.630 [SPEAKER_02]: So you almost begin to forget what you learned the weeks before, if you know what I mean, as opposed to doing it day after day after day. 07:03.391 --> 07:05.452 [SPEAKER_02]: But the hunger of wanting to get back in there. 07:06.535 --> 07:17.921 [SPEAKER_02]: you know is brilliant but that's something I'm looking for to bring into this knife show is is probably the latest evolution of probably what I've been what I've been doing of the past couple of years so it's definitely been inspired by Forging. 07:18.861 --> 07:28.987 [SPEAKER_04]: So running out your own farm and with the family everything in the background do you find yourself like working at the farm and then wanting to get in the forge and then being in the forge and like kind of knowing the back of 07:32.955 --> 07:35.176 [SPEAKER_02]: It is, but it's a good struggle. 07:35.336 --> 07:43.038 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, the wonderful thing is that I very much have incredible support from everybody around me. 07:43.058 --> 07:49.820 [SPEAKER_02]: Like there is a manager in the smokehouse, there's a manager in the dairy, there's, you know, there's people helping other farm, you know, we have 20 people in Gabini. 07:49.840 --> 07:52.221 [SPEAKER_02]: So as long as nothing's broken and known is missing. 07:52.881 --> 08:01.485 [SPEAKER_02]: you know, technically all is good for me to kind of go and make knives, but I'm always getting cold, you know, like there's an incredible space of breakages lately. 08:01.505 --> 08:07.708 [SPEAKER_02]: There's always a machine that goes a light bulb that's kind of gone, a pump that's not behaving the well, that's not working. 08:07.728 --> 08:10.150 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, there's all these sort of things you get pulled away for. 08:10.950 --> 08:26.712 [SPEAKER_02]: and that's okay because you know the one thing as long as you're not gluing the blades up it's nothing you can't walk away from but forging is a different example but you know there's always ability to put them down and go and sort it out and I think that's one of the things I really appreciate about the knives and what was lovely is 08:27.433 --> 08:40.337 [SPEAKER_02]: the past few years of making knives, I mentioned before, like a lot of that investment went into putting a solar system, like a PV system on the farm, and that's very much reduced electricity consumption on the farm. 08:40.397 --> 08:50.701 [SPEAKER_02]: So the knives are acknowledged as being a collaborative part of the entire system, not only because they're food related and everything like that, but actually that they give back. 08:50.961 --> 08:54.162 [SPEAKER_02]: So I mean, like what I kind of do with the knives, 08:55.382 --> 08:58.444 [SPEAKER_02]: and the profit of that sort of speak comes back into the company. 08:58.924 --> 09:16.933 [SPEAKER_02]: So I feel very much supported and people get what I'm doing because at the drop of anything I can walk away and go and be with them whenever they need me and I think that that's probably the most important thing when it comes to work with others is knowing that your team and the whole process, but my obsession would knives. 09:17.773 --> 09:18.253 [SPEAKER_02]: strong. 09:18.754 --> 09:22.736 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, it's a pretty pretty deep under the skin kind of thing. 09:24.757 --> 09:37.983 [SPEAKER_02]: But yeah, it's been it's been good where we kind of had a busy summer and I'm looking forward to kind of the winter months of sort of, you know, we've seen a camera, if not more predictable kind of period compared to summer because we live in such a touristy area. 09:38.363 --> 09:44.366 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, watching the Instagram page looks like you're out like on island retreats and doing food festivals all the time and you've got 09:46.789 --> 09:58.434 [SPEAKER_02]: There's always, I mean, I do find myself doing the festivals over summer periods and stuff with that, and that's brilliant, because there's some things I don't know about you guys, but I really feel like the world's becoming a smaller place. 09:58.754 --> 10:03.836 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, we have friends, from the nightmare community, we have people from all over the world that we come to know. 10:04.576 --> 10:25.404 [SPEAKER_02]: And merge that, I suppose with the food side of things as well, like I've, you go up to the food festivals and there's the barbecue guys and that you kind of meet and it's always that kind of reunion that you kind of, like if you go to the big real festival in Dublin, we're all catching up and it's dangerous because you're meeting up with great friends and you're burning the candle both ends and you know, you know, you know, you know, 10:26.204 --> 10:33.649 [SPEAKER_02]: you probably need a holiday after your holiday, so to speak with these guys, you know, like that they go bigger, go home, you know, they're the most fantastic characters. 10:34.510 --> 10:42.996 [SPEAKER_02]: And so they're but definitely inspired, you know, by the time spent with them and sort of on a cooking and that sort of things. 10:43.476 --> 10:52.123 [SPEAKER_02]: But also the feedback from the knives, you know, I'll always bring my knives with me to the festivals and guys can kind of use them and you kind of get that interesting kind of 10:53.924 --> 10:54.865 [SPEAKER_02]: interaction with them. 10:55.446 --> 11:00.231 [SPEAKER_02]: So it's good surrounding yourself by people passion, you know what I mean? 11:00.312 --> 11:04.877 [SPEAKER_02]: It's like, surround yourself by people who are passionate and Jesus the days are just fantastic. 11:05.077 --> 11:10.223 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, everything about them is great and I think that's something that's really important. 11:10.770 --> 11:24.081 [SPEAKER_04]: that must be great to get some real feedback from people who are constantly using your knives like daily and I can imagine a lot of your knives that you sell, you probably don't hear back from most of them, they don't know like, you don't have any more. 11:24.101 --> 11:31.087 [SPEAKER_02]: I think I find with automated systems, you know, in the email kind of automatically get sent with a tracking number and then you automatically 11:31.848 --> 11:41.811 [SPEAKER_02]: kind of get all the notifications that I suppose were numbed to sort of like sending that message or it's arrived, thanks very much because you feel like it's just a system or a metadata thing. 11:43.111 --> 11:57.856 [SPEAKER_02]: So it is rare when you sort of hear back from people, but what is lovely is when you see social media or whatever else you see the knives in use and you kind of get tagged in, that's like the biggest compliment is actually seeing a well-used knife that you know you sold 12:01.317 --> 12:24.268 [SPEAKER_02]: that that means the world and yeah so I suppose like that's that's the thing you kind of strive for is that but I suppose the the the contradictions that you kind of give yourself you know that whole thing of like there are two types of customer I was feel out there in the world there's people who want to buy a very precision knife with way for thin tip and edge geometry 12:29.610 --> 12:33.832 [SPEAKER_02]: And then you know there's the person who probably got gifted the knife, there's probably going to try and open a tin of beans. 12:35.272 --> 12:35.812 [SPEAKER_02]: You know what I mean? 12:36.153 --> 12:37.273 [SPEAKER_02]: Like there's two people in the world. 12:37.293 --> 12:40.894 [SPEAKER_02]: There's somebody who's gung-ho and then there's people who like precision. 12:41.355 --> 12:53.299 [SPEAKER_02]: And I often fight with that, you know, that whole element of sort of, should I make this knife to on the safe side of edge geometry or actually make it a laser? 12:53.799 --> 12:57.161 [SPEAKER_02]: And I think we'll never have the answer to that, especially when it's not a custom job. 12:57.401 --> 12:58.241 [SPEAKER_02]: What do you guys think about that? 12:58.561 --> 13:05.385 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I think it's always going to be, I think it's always going to be out there. 13:05.405 --> 13:07.066 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, you're going to have knives to come back. 13:07.126 --> 13:07.727 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, what is it? 13:07.827 --> 13:17.333 [SPEAKER_02]: Less than 1% every one in the hundred knives or something will maybe find this way back to the workshop because somebody did put in the wash machine or did, you know, open a chain of beans. 13:17.353 --> 13:20.335 [SPEAKER_02]: So it's always, I love the fact that it was never them. 13:21.015 --> 13:26.079 [SPEAKER_02]: It was always that tragedy visited their son and I'm the way for it. 13:26.099 --> 13:27.600 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, yeah, yeah. 13:28.281 --> 13:28.881 [SPEAKER_02]: Exactly. 13:29.281 --> 13:29.882 [SPEAKER_02]: But you know what? 13:30.042 --> 13:30.702 [SPEAKER_02]: It's better. 13:31.043 --> 13:32.264 [SPEAKER_02]: I love the honesty. 13:32.364 --> 13:35.326 [SPEAKER_02]: I think that's something I've always very much tried to reward. 13:35.586 --> 13:36.787 [SPEAKER_02]: And I never charge. 13:36.907 --> 13:37.768 [SPEAKER_02]: I try not to charge. 13:38.148 --> 13:54.186 [SPEAKER_02]: in any way, maybe the shipping, you know, to fix the knife because, you know, it's potentially a return customer in the future, but more than anything, I actually really appreciate it because there's nothing worse than something I don't know how this happened and you know, damn well, it went to the one machine or it was like it was unbelievably abused. 13:54.567 --> 13:56.449 [SPEAKER_02]: So I think I do reward honesty. 13:58.902 --> 14:09.485 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean it helps a lot if you can talk to your customer before he buys the knife right so even of course it's difficult if someone's buying a knife online because then you usually don't have this personal interaction. 14:09.625 --> 14:15.467 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah mine mine are all online but I know to me and I think that's probably where the knife need the knife show is going to be quite interesting. 14:15.667 --> 14:26.671 [SPEAKER_01]: But we have loads of customers coming to our shop and buy a knife from from us and then we can explain to the customer's different knife geometry and what they can do with an knife and what they can't do with a knife. 14:26.731 --> 14:27.631 [SPEAKER_01]: Let's say it laser. 14:27.891 --> 14:28.351 [SPEAKER_01]: for instance. 14:29.292 --> 14:33.695 [SPEAKER_01]: And if they're not happy with that, they're if they have different plans then we can do a custom job. 14:33.715 --> 14:37.018 [SPEAKER_01]: But yeah, it helps a lot if you can interact with your customer. 14:37.178 --> 14:38.779 [SPEAKER_01]: That's what I wanted to say. 14:38.859 --> 14:44.443 [SPEAKER_02]: I found that because I'm largely online, I lean heavily towards stainless and I think you're probably the absolute opposite, aren't you? 14:44.504 --> 14:45.224 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, would you? 14:45.424 --> 14:45.604 [SPEAKER_01]: I am. 14:45.744 --> 14:50.448 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, no, you've got IWL 34, but I would what's your ratio of high carbon to stainless that you sell? 14:51.028 --> 14:54.909 [SPEAKER_01]: Probably 95% to 5%, something like that. 14:55.209 --> 14:56.250 [SPEAKER_02]: So, 95% is? 14:56.790 --> 14:57.010 [SPEAKER_02]: Yes. 14:57.690 --> 15:18.757 [SPEAKER_02]: And the 95% being Damascus, I was probably that way round, and because of the forging, I'm leaning more and more into the high card, because, you know, you kind of know that a stainless knife is going to come back to haunt you, you know, in as many ways as props, like the, you know, people's surprise of it being 15:20.157 --> 15:31.748 [SPEAKER_02]: But yeah, no, I think that this, I think I've said this before that when in my earlier years of making knives before, you know, many people wouldn't know who I was and somebody just was gifted a knife or anything else like that. 15:31.808 --> 15:33.549 [SPEAKER_02]: I suppose the knives got abused a lot more. 15:34.170 --> 15:41.577 [SPEAKER_02]: And I suppose if they, you know, if you do get to position where, you know, people are looking for your knives and it's something they're choosing to buy then they probably look after it more. 15:42.638 --> 15:46.083 [SPEAKER_02]: And I think that's probably a key thing. 15:46.163 --> 15:47.625 [SPEAKER_02]: It's the person who comes to visit. 15:47.826 --> 15:50.530 [SPEAKER_02]: And then the relage of that does the damage. 15:52.580 --> 15:56.244 [SPEAKER_02]: But I think the, I feel like how do you think that will go into the future? 15:56.624 --> 16:04.652 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, would you very much, I mean, we know of the wonders of apex ultra, and we know of all these incredible stainless steel on the parallel. 16:04.672 --> 16:05.532 [SPEAKER_02]: There are also coming up. 16:06.193 --> 16:08.756 [SPEAKER_02]: I still have an astralgic love towards high carbon steel. 16:08.896 --> 16:14.621 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I mean, I feel like all the knives I reach out for in my knife rack are, are probably the high carbon steel ones themselves. 16:15.082 --> 16:15.602 [SPEAKER_02]: But, um, 16:16.783 --> 16:19.004 [SPEAKER_02]: Do you think there will always be a place for that? 16:19.064 --> 16:20.324 [SPEAKER_02]: Is there going to be a nostalgia? 16:20.344 --> 16:21.524 [SPEAKER_02]: Will it sort of weighing away? 16:21.544 --> 16:26.386 [SPEAKER_02]: Do you think or actually there will always be a place for that because of the forging world and the hand made element? 16:26.726 --> 16:29.686 [SPEAKER_02]: And perhaps the fact that having to care for it is perhaps why you love it? 16:30.307 --> 16:34.288 [SPEAKER_01]: I think there will always be place for non-stainless plates. 16:34.708 --> 16:38.309 [SPEAKER_01]: So that standard high-carbon plates or Damascus plates. 16:38.889 --> 16:43.150 [SPEAKER_01]: But I think stainless Damascus is going to take over at some point. 16:43.710 --> 16:52.438 [SPEAKER_01]: Because more people are starting to forge stainless Damascus, it's become, and not the knowledge is becomes accessible even more how to do it. 16:52.959 --> 16:54.380 [SPEAKER_01]: But still doesn't make it easier though. 16:55.080 --> 16:57.102 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. 16:57.122 --> 16:58.043 [SPEAKER_01]: That's exactly my point. 16:58.063 --> 17:02.407 [SPEAKER_01]: That's why I think that will always be stainless at non-stainless. 17:02.527 --> 17:06.831 [SPEAKER_01]: The Damascus place because there's easier to forge and easier to heat with and everything. 17:08.493 --> 17:24.785 [SPEAKER_01]: But it's more from a micro-perspective, that's not from a user perspective, because the user usually prefers an unstainless stainless steel blade, but even also it's stainless Damascus, I mean, I would prefer stainless Damascus, but if it wasn't that hard to forge, so yeah. 17:25.773 --> 17:46.807 [SPEAKER_02]: It's nice, in my years of, of the earlier years of just being grind stock, you know, removal and the process, you know, the stainless thing was was definitely I felt huge success rate in in making any stainless knife and if I did have a wobble or or a knife that didn't perform well, it was coming from the high carbon side. 17:47.647 --> 18:09.053 [SPEAKER_02]: And I think it I just flipped that on his head when I kind of got more into the end of the forging I'm being repetitive on that on time, but you know, it's it's that thing that you're falling in love with that The process that's teaching you something when you're making mistakes in that process that makes you kind of want to I mean like Sourado bread in some sort of ways, you know, you keep going and tell you nail that fucker But 18:10.093 --> 18:15.056 [SPEAKER_02]: No, it's, it's, yeah, very much, very much obsessed with it all at the moment. 18:15.296 --> 18:18.958 [SPEAKER_02]: But I kind of tend to set impossible goals for myself sometimes as well. 18:19.058 --> 18:22.099 [SPEAKER_02]: Like, you know, like, I'll, I'll jump too quickly to them. 18:22.159 --> 18:23.220 [SPEAKER_02]: I next big challenge. 18:23.260 --> 18:31.725 [SPEAKER_02]: And, you know, like at the moment, forging down a steel and all these kind of type things, you know, kumai, apex, ultra core kind of steels. 18:32.105 --> 18:33.365 [SPEAKER_02]: They have their own challenges 18:38.429 --> 18:41.875 [SPEAKER_02]: mean so much more and, you know, getting that whole thing. 18:41.895 --> 18:44.079 [SPEAKER_02]: So that's the rabbit hole I'm in at the moment. 18:44.360 --> 18:49.550 [SPEAKER_01]: Did you forge your dumbest to play the edge of hope thing or did you start removal it? 18:49.777 --> 18:52.158 [SPEAKER_02]: I forged that. 18:52.338 --> 19:06.405 [SPEAKER_02]: I bought some round bar and I've been forged in that and I also reached out to them to get some off-cuts and a few other things to sort of play around with and I'm now trying to, I mean, my next project is to maybe try and integrate something. 19:06.425 --> 19:06.825 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I like to 19:12.808 --> 19:13.008 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. 19:13.789 --> 19:32.080 [SPEAKER_02]: And you know, so maybe there's something kind of fun in that, you know, that probably go down that road, um, uh, lovely Gabe Fletcher was giving me advice and sort of how to make, you know, canister is to sort of forge well, stainless together, you know, so he's got the patience of a saint. 19:32.300 --> 19:36.243 [SPEAKER_02]: I think it comes to teaching me things because, 19:38.164 --> 19:43.026 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, so I think that, yeah, it was something that I'd probably been my next project to kind of go out. 19:43.046 --> 20:04.057 [SPEAKER_02]: But yeah, finding systems that work, I mean, like I said, the change in the oven around almost I had redesigned things, you know, re-changed what I kind of thought I knew because, you know, the sense of scale, you know, bigger ovens, bigger volumes, almost like different colors, different lights in the new workshop, everything like that will sort of control you out a little bit and you kind of have to dial everything back in again. 20:05.597 --> 20:09.958 [SPEAKER_02]: So, I think finding systems that you know create consistency at the backbone of everything aren't they really? 20:10.118 --> 20:15.159 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, it's expensive to make mistakes, emotionally it's a fucking whirlwind. 20:16.660 --> 20:25.661 [SPEAKER_02]: So, you do try and find things to work to kind of create success rate and the most important thing is to always be able to know that whatever you're sending out the door you're happy with. 20:26.282 --> 20:31.123 [SPEAKER_02]: So, you know, finding those systems we're beginning to end are almost essential because 20:33.423 --> 20:40.105 [SPEAKER_02]: you know, there's nothing worse than reputation or whatever else to sell something that isn't to your standards. 20:40.345 --> 20:54.608 [SPEAKER_02]: Like, sending something that you think is good and it's not, you know, so I find that that, you know, testing and edge geometry, all these things you have to find the parameters and the things that dial it in and test along the way. 20:54.668 --> 20:58.689 [SPEAKER_02]: And you know what, if you do make that mistake, it's better to throw it in the bin than to try and make it work. 21:03.711 --> 21:14.020 [SPEAKER_02]: I was, um, so everything I've been doing in the gas so far because that's what I'm really trying to, to sort of perfect and get a system down on. 21:14.761 --> 21:23.770 [SPEAKER_02]: Um, I had a failure with the copper, um, because it did actually just slightly pull the part at one point on me and then afterwards, I just, 21:24.850 --> 21:48.698 [SPEAKER_02]: I brought down the air flow and I basically was tinkering a little bit more with the balance because we know on most of these on the sort of the the forges with the what's the the ribbon burners you know you you have so much more ability to kind of play with the air the gas the flow so all these kind of things it's an amalgamation of them all that kind of plays a role and then as the forge heats up 21:49.458 --> 21:51.760 [SPEAKER_02]: and gets harder, you have to keep going back. 21:51.780 --> 22:07.994 [SPEAKER_02]: So I have a couple of thermocouples on my forge, and the biggest mistake I was making was trusting the thermocouples, because what happens the thermocouples underneath the ribbon burner, but in a bigger killing, the technically the the thermocouple was further away. 22:08.014 --> 22:09.775 [SPEAKER_02]: So even though they were giving accurate results, 22:10.576 --> 22:20.738 [SPEAKER_02]: they were in a different part of the forge, and I suppose I think even being a centimeter higher up in the forge off the floor, you can get such different results. 22:21.279 --> 22:34.222 [SPEAKER_02]: So I think I almost went back to old school and kind of the hand held infrared thermometer and merging it together helped me to calibrate and sort of create consistency in the results. 22:35.042 --> 22:36.382 [SPEAKER_02]: And yeah, so I've kind of been 22:40.603 --> 22:53.172 [SPEAKER_02]: you know, because I was just saying the bar too high for myself, literally working with Damasteel and doing coup-my apex core steals, like it's, yeah, you know, even, I think even my welder was misbehaving at the time as well. 22:53.212 --> 22:58.256 [SPEAKER_02]: So I had all these kind of things that I was trying to, you know, tie in together. 23:00.017 --> 23:18.143 [SPEAKER_02]: But yeah, I'm not looking forward to bringing these and actually even I mean, I'm looking forward to seeing you guys again It's been you know, it's been a year since since the last knife show more than a year more than a year more than a year, you know, it feels it feels like two years to be honest I feel like so much has happened since then There was in may last time right 2020. 23:18.643 --> 23:24.925 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, yeah, I'm very much looking forward to this because I mean we we you know We come to know each other so much 23:25.785 --> 23:41.339 [SPEAKER_02]: but I think messages don't live up to actually standing next to a person and drinking a bear with them and sort of the camaraderie of, you know, actually sort of meeting people face to face and I think otherwise it's I think it just it reconfirms a lot of things and 23:41.899 --> 24:02.246 [SPEAKER_02]: For me, I suppose, I mean, I'm pretty much work seven days a week, so I think sometimes I need an excuse to get away and kind of, I think this is going to be a week-long trip because I'm going to be at the knife show and then after that, I'm after Tobias Anglers event afterwards and I'm very looking, very much looking forward to that. 24:02.266 --> 24:04.227 [SPEAKER_02]: So yeah, that's something. 24:05.387 --> 24:08.751 [SPEAKER_02]: Have you worked out, are you, are you, are you have to have back to to work? 24:08.771 --> 24:09.072 [SPEAKER_02]: Do you? 24:09.112 --> 24:10.513 [SPEAKER_02]: I think after the night's show? 24:10.854 --> 24:13.737 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, and Paul is coming to visit us here. 24:13.857 --> 24:17.021 [SPEAKER_01]: We have to go back on Sunday, even I think. 24:17.361 --> 24:19.003 [SPEAKER_02]: Because that was a highlight of last year. 24:19.023 --> 24:20.445 [SPEAKER_02]: I came out and stayed with you. 24:20.465 --> 24:21.306 [SPEAKER_02]: I think it wasn't enough. 24:21.326 --> 24:26.071 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, and I've shown myself and I think Alex and yeah, and that was absolutely incredible. 24:26.531 --> 24:29.012 [SPEAKER_02]: I highly recommend anybody out there. 24:29.032 --> 24:31.192 [SPEAKER_02]: If you get the chance to do that, you have to. 24:31.672 --> 24:44.356 [SPEAKER_02]: I think working with those power hammers and I think the knowledge that you guys have, the ability, the very open-minded about letting people, I suppose, go down their own rabbit holes, because you have the toys and you have the ability to do that. 24:44.456 --> 24:49.537 [SPEAKER_02]: So I think there's a lot of knowledge in you guys and a must incredible workshop. 24:49.757 --> 24:51.338 [SPEAKER_04]: It's changed quite a bit since you've been there. 24:53.278 --> 24:58.781 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I think this is filled up a lot more, I mean, it's packed, it's packed now, yeah. 24:59.201 --> 25:06.224 [SPEAKER_01]: We have three power hammers we're restoring and we have five working power hammers of dead to the whole workshop with full with machines. 25:06.524 --> 25:08.465 [SPEAKER_02]: You probably have a waiting list for power hammers now, do you? 25:08.836 --> 25:14.182 [SPEAKER_01]: No, not really, because the one we're restoring right now, I mean, we're restoring three, but we're keeping two. 25:14.542 --> 25:19.587 [SPEAKER_01]: Don't ask me why, I don't know why, but we're just keeping two of these three. 25:19.727 --> 25:20.608 [SPEAKER_01]: And one is sold. 25:21.129 --> 25:23.732 [SPEAKER_01]: And Makogada, which is about the third one. 25:24.012 --> 25:27.876 [SPEAKER_02]: All right, incredible hoarders, hoarders, a powerhouse, but it's, I don't blame you. 25:27.956 --> 25:28.316 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, like, 25:29.217 --> 25:29.877 [SPEAKER_02]: What are you keeping? 25:29.897 --> 25:49.602 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, what's the, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there, is there 25:49.862 --> 25:52.324 [SPEAKER_01]: 1890 or something like that. 25:52.684 --> 25:53.925 [SPEAKER_02]: Well there's nostalgia there. 25:53.945 --> 25:54.785 [SPEAKER_01]: It's nostalgia. 25:54.966 --> 25:57.287 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's called an I-Ux, spring hammer. 25:57.547 --> 26:01.190 [SPEAKER_01]: And one I-Ux, spring hammer is in the Technician Museum. 26:01.210 --> 26:03.091 [SPEAKER_01]: So the Technician Museum in Vienna. 26:03.111 --> 26:06.293 [SPEAKER_01]: So the smaller version of the one I want is in a museum. 26:06.333 --> 26:10.056 [SPEAKER_01]: So that's why I want to keep it because it's a very, very old machine. 26:10.336 --> 26:11.357 [SPEAKER_01]: And it's an Austrian machine. 26:11.537 --> 26:12.217 [SPEAKER_02]: It's an asset. 26:12.257 --> 26:16.360 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, in many kind of ways, it's not going to do anything but become more valuable. 26:16.600 --> 26:24.771 [SPEAKER_01]: It has 75 kilogram ram weights, spring, however, even though we don't, wow, we won't use it because it's too heavy. 26:24.851 --> 26:28.395 [SPEAKER_02]: It's too heavy, but how fast, how fast would that be? 26:28.415 --> 26:33.782 [SPEAKER_02]: Because you know, when you see Japanese spring hammers, an action is Duk-Duk-Duk-Duk, Duk-Duk, Duk-Duk, they can be incredibly speedy. 26:34.343 --> 26:51.672 [SPEAKER_01]: what's a 75 kilo like it's faster than an air power hammer that's for sure but waste lower than these japanese hammers um but you can't control it that well like yeah compared it's compared if you want a single punch it's not going to yeah yeah okay that's why i know that we will never use it 26:53.033 --> 27:11.472 [SPEAKER_01]: Still, I want to keep it, I mean, it's a historic machine, it has some nostalgic value to me, so, because when I started out, I always wanted to have one of these machines, and I never expected to own one of these machines, and I always wanted to have the smaller one, and now we've got even a bigger one, so I'm going to keep this one. 27:11.852 --> 27:12.713 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, what's the smaller one? 27:12.893 --> 27:13.534 [SPEAKER_01]: They start. 27:13.734 --> 27:14.535 [SPEAKER_01]: I think it's too hard. 27:14.555 --> 27:15.577 [SPEAKER_02]: Do you have a smaller one as well? 27:15.597 --> 27:16.137 [SPEAKER_02]: I meant, sorry. 27:16.258 --> 27:17.018 [SPEAKER_01]: No, no, no, no, no. 27:17.139 --> 27:18.801 [SPEAKER_01]: That's the only spring hammer we have. 27:19.061 --> 27:23.206 [SPEAKER_01]: The ix1, I think, has a 30 kilo rem wait or maybe even less. 27:23.827 --> 27:26.390 [SPEAKER_01]: And there might be a 15 this one 75 so. 27:26.530 --> 27:27.451 [SPEAKER_02]: And is it up and running? 27:27.471 --> 27:28.212 [SPEAKER_02]: Have you been using it? 27:28.252 --> 27:51.289 [SPEAKER_01]: Now, it has been up and running where we bought it from, yeah, so it's been used, but we of course we want to restore it like we do with our machine, so we want to paint it black, then we want to grease up the springs again and everything, yeah, so have you been watching the Alex Steel as his series at the moment is restoring a giant massy power hammer. 27:51.849 --> 27:58.573 [SPEAKER_01]: I started watching it, but there's a number of episodes out there already, so I'm behind some what, but yeah, I saw that. 27:58.593 --> 27:58.933 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. 27:59.793 --> 28:14.982 [SPEAKER_02]: It's actually quite interesting watching the tolerances and the precision, and I think seeing something that's probably been rusting in a field for probably, I don't know, 50 years and being restored to that is kind of fascinating, but yeah, I know. 28:15.802 --> 28:30.137 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm quite captivated by Alex Diel's version, you know, just because I suppose it's interesting to know that once you get the dynamics and the process of them all, you know, the doctoring and you see people suffering with them, I think that there is a certain knowledge. 28:30.958 --> 28:42.429 [SPEAKER_02]: that are only probably a few people in the world really have now for diagnosing issues, you know, on the opposite side of the planet, when it comes to especially to air hammers and to all the valves and those kind of things. 28:42.469 --> 28:47.113 [SPEAKER_02]: I think that's what's lovely about the KMG, I got from you guys, it's in some ways, it's a very beautiful honest. 28:47.693 --> 29:00.777 [SPEAKER_02]: simple machine, but what would you rank out there as being a really good beginner's hammer and what would you say is you're biting off more than you can chew and in respects to probably when things go wrong they're very complicated machines. 29:01.017 --> 29:11.460 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean your machine or every cool right this is, I mean they're all simple machines so if something breaks with these machines you can easily fix it yourself because there's still the original plans out there you have 29:15.661 --> 29:30.884 [SPEAKER_01]: But on old-bish-a-power hammers, if something breaks, or it doesn't have to be a be-bish-a, but old-russian power hammers, if something breaks, you have to find a machine shop that can machine the thing for you, and not all of that, but you have to find the right material. 29:31.404 --> 29:39.346 [SPEAKER_01]: It has been made out of, which we struggle with, because we need piston rings for our 100 kilo-bish-a-power hammer. 29:40.166 --> 29:42.368 [SPEAKER_01]: And they don't sell the material. 29:42.468 --> 29:44.769 [SPEAKER_01]: It has been made out of in Europe anymore. 29:45.690 --> 29:47.611 [SPEAKER_01]: I think it's called Dr. Lyron or something like that. 29:47.651 --> 29:49.813 [SPEAKER_01]: And we had to order it from the US. 29:49.853 --> 29:53.916 [SPEAKER_01]: So in the USA, there's still a company who makes these kind of things. 29:54.797 --> 29:59.400 [SPEAKER_01]: And we had to order this stuff from the other side of the planet almost. 29:59.940 --> 30:07.406 [SPEAKER_01]: So it's not only that someone has to machine it for you, but you have to find the right materials as well. 30:09.447 --> 30:22.778 [SPEAKER_01]: And there is one, I mean, we've been talking about this guy in the show quite a number of times, but there's one guy in the US, Mark Krause, the Hammer Whisperer, and he knows everything about power Hammer's, and he helped us a lot when we were restoring these machines. 30:23.278 --> 30:27.501 [SPEAKER_01]: And he's probably the most knowledgeable person on the planet when it comes to air power hammers. 30:27.782 --> 30:28.022 [SPEAKER_01]: So, 30:28.682 --> 30:31.365 [SPEAKER_01]: And he's giving away his knowledge almost for free. 30:31.385 --> 30:34.048 [SPEAKER_01]: It meant be bought his book and stuff because we wanted to support him. 30:34.088 --> 30:39.935 [SPEAKER_01]: But he would have told us via Instagram by a direct message as well. 30:40.015 --> 30:41.736 [SPEAKER_01]: So we didn't have to do that. 30:41.857 --> 30:44.119 [SPEAKER_01]: But he's such an ice guy and he's been super helpful. 30:44.519 --> 30:48.183 [SPEAKER_01]: But without him, we would not have been able to restore these machines to be honest. 30:48.864 --> 30:51.485 [SPEAKER_02]: So, um, what would you find out there? 30:51.565 --> 31:01.848 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, because you're obviously things cross your paths, what do you feel is out there a lot in the world and what are the sort of the rare things that that actually, you know, what is the grail? 31:01.968 --> 31:09.230 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, if you still have something that you're yearning for and then what is the something that you're almost refusing to kind of get, you know, because you see them all the time. 31:09.510 --> 31:11.211 [SPEAKER_01]: Machine-wise or power hammer-wise? 31:11.271 --> 31:13.052 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, power hammer, let's let's let it go. 31:13.332 --> 31:18.015 [SPEAKER_01]: Because I really want to have one machine we don't have, and that's a hydraulic press. 31:18.295 --> 31:18.535 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay. 31:18.575 --> 31:18.915 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know. 31:18.935 --> 31:19.976 [SPEAKER_01]: It's a boring machine. 31:20.716 --> 31:21.737 [SPEAKER_02]: No. 31:22.878 --> 31:33.904 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I picked up one, it came, it's probably the most, like, it's a Frankenstein of a machine that came out of a sort of a four-japan Northern Ireland, and I had to buy a new pack for it. 31:34.304 --> 31:43.189 [SPEAKER_02]: and I sort of welded up all my own dyes and I'm wondering, you know, it's supposed to be 70-10 press and there's no way it's 70 tons. 31:43.209 --> 31:57.418 [SPEAKER_02]: I think my pack isn't as big as it was supposed to be, but they do things that the power hammer can't and vice versa and I think the emalgamation of the two it's like when you want to slowly control something there is a time in the place for them. 31:57.938 --> 32:00.359 [SPEAKER_02]: So I'm a great believer in it and I think 32:01.480 --> 32:11.204 [SPEAKER_02]: you can probably have as many dies and set up for hydraulic presses, you probably can have different power hammers, but you know, I think it's a very logical thing to have both. 32:11.484 --> 32:12.245 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, if you're into it. 32:12.365 --> 32:13.385 [SPEAKER_01]: That's why I want one. 32:13.625 --> 32:14.286 [SPEAKER_02]: What would you go for? 32:14.666 --> 32:15.386 [SPEAKER_01]: Pressure wise? 32:15.726 --> 32:17.107 [SPEAKER_02]: Well, would you buy a new one? 32:17.227 --> 32:20.028 [SPEAKER_02]: Would you actually enjoy the process of kind of restoring an old line? 32:20.068 --> 32:24.050 [SPEAKER_01]: I would buy it now and done restoring like, no, I don't know. 32:24.170 --> 32:24.490 [SPEAKER_01]: I would. 32:25.190 --> 32:34.000 [SPEAKER_01]: No, I had really, compared to power hammer, like an old power, it's not very, it's not a very interesting machine to restore, I think. 32:34.561 --> 32:41.749 [SPEAKER_01]: I would buy a new one, power hammer, I mean the holy grail would be, I think a 300 kilo busher, like a really heavy one. 32:41.989 --> 32:42.429 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay. 32:42.830 --> 32:45.653 [SPEAKER_01]: I think that's something just to look at. 32:45.953 --> 32:48.033 [SPEAKER_01]: No, we would use it for phoaching. 32:48.073 --> 32:50.474 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, we used it 150 as well. 32:50.834 --> 32:52.354 [SPEAKER_01]: So we would use it. 32:52.494 --> 32:54.675 [SPEAKER_01]: But yeah, not every thing. 32:55.195 --> 32:56.975 [SPEAKER_02]: You should go out to, you should go down. 32:57.195 --> 32:59.456 [SPEAKER_02]: That's Jeff Fader, just at the interview with it. 32:59.596 --> 33:03.676 [SPEAKER_02]: The, the, the, the, the, see, what's it? 33:04.356 --> 33:08.337 [SPEAKER_02]: What's the place that has the fantastic power hammers over in America? 33:08.757 --> 33:12.398 [SPEAKER_02]: And he's restoring the giant, the giant power hammers over in America. 33:13.619 --> 33:21.607 [SPEAKER_02]: The original, it was Jeff Fader and full blast interviews him on a regular basis, and they have those giant power hammers. 33:21.767 --> 33:26.452 [SPEAKER_02]: I'll get the name and I'll give you guys, by the way, it's late here in Ireland. 33:26.712 --> 33:28.714 [SPEAKER_02]: I've got a long day. 33:29.034 --> 33:30.516 [SPEAKER_02]: It's the main numbers. 33:30.917 --> 33:32.058 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, exactly. 33:32.619 --> 33:34.961 [SPEAKER_02]: I want to say the CIA, but is that makes sense? 33:35.021 --> 33:36.343 [SPEAKER_02]: It's the colorary. 33:37.104 --> 33:41.369 [SPEAKER_02]: Anyway, people are screaming down the mic. 33:41.469 --> 33:44.112 [SPEAKER_02]: But look, I think that there's something... 33:44.893 --> 33:52.582 [SPEAKER_02]: The biggest thing about big hammers, of course, is what workload it goes into foundations and bases and all the kind of side of things and I think what you can do them. 33:53.122 --> 33:59.069 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I suppose it leads me on to think that, you know, stainless steel, you know, back to stainless Damascus. 33:59.209 --> 34:06.497 [SPEAKER_02]: That's where you suddenly kind of go, I think, God, I've got a big power hammer, a big hydraulic press because it opens up the world of manipulation because stainless steel is a big to work with. 34:07.298 --> 34:19.815 [SPEAKER_02]: And I suppose my heart take and I probably then going through this in my mind for the past while is I'm not sure if I actually care for integral knives and integral bolsters. 34:22.018 --> 34:28.662 [SPEAKER_02]: I think it's a challenge and it's a skill to learn and I would probably be eat my own words in the future as I become get more and more into it. 34:29.363 --> 34:37.047 [SPEAKER_02]: But I feel that's back to the world of big hydraulic presses and power hammers and especially trying to do it with with Damasteela, whatever else. 34:37.568 --> 34:41.430 [SPEAKER_02]: And how do you guys feel about about sort of making knives with integral bolsters? 34:41.870 --> 34:44.512 [SPEAKER_01]: I think they're a pain in the ass to do them. 34:44.532 --> 34:45.713 [SPEAKER_02]: I think they're a pain in the ass to do them. 34:45.753 --> 34:46.514 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, yeah. 34:46.794 --> 34:47.555 [SPEAKER_02]: But to use. 34:47.815 --> 34:50.677 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean to actually use a knife with an integral buzz. 34:50.797 --> 34:51.618 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, but they're beautiful. 34:51.778 --> 34:52.999 [SPEAKER_04]: Like the transition. 34:53.079 --> 34:56.562 [SPEAKER_04]: If you're making a nice Damascus pad and if you get that transmission dialed in, right? 34:56.702 --> 34:58.503 [SPEAKER_04]: Oh, that's totally flat. 34:58.543 --> 34:58.763 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. 34:59.324 --> 34:59.624 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. 35:00.064 --> 35:00.445 [SPEAKER_02]: You're right. 35:00.485 --> 35:01.846 [SPEAKER_02]: It's a thing of beauty to look up. 35:02.326 --> 35:03.287 [SPEAKER_02]: But if you're blindfolded. 35:05.167 --> 35:06.028 [SPEAKER_02]: you're thinking up a knife. 35:07.148 --> 35:08.128 [SPEAKER_02]: It's an interesting kind of one. 35:08.508 --> 35:21.871 [SPEAKER_02]: But I suppose that there's weight balance and feel that play a role and I think two different makers will have two different completely different approaches to what to do with a bolster and an integral bolster and they don't have to be huge heavy. 35:21.891 --> 35:28.013 [SPEAKER_02]: We're not talking about sort of those giant clunky kind of knives with a giant bolster just because the metal was there. 35:28.733 --> 35:28.913 [SPEAKER_02]: But 35:29.533 --> 35:30.133 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, no. 35:30.534 --> 35:40.880 [SPEAKER_02]: That was just a question to myself whether it was something I wanted to kind of explore, you know, whether it wanted to kind of get, you know, get into that whole process. 35:40.920 --> 35:50.045 [SPEAKER_02]: But I'm, yeah, and I actually probably don't want to, I feel like I've taken so long to kind of get to where I am at the moment that I'm going to say that for later on, or maybe not even. 35:51.186 --> 35:52.967 [SPEAKER_02]: But I will eat my words, I know it, I know. 35:55.308 --> 35:57.369 [SPEAKER_01]: do your own one and integral. 35:57.449 --> 36:00.111 [SPEAKER_01]: So the masquerade, let's say, with an integral bolster. 36:00.371 --> 36:02.673 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm thinking through, I don't think I do. 36:03.933 --> 36:10.778 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, like, we've all had, like, maybe a, you know, sabbatia or, or sort of a waste of hand color, one of those kind of things in our lives, you know what I mean? 36:10.798 --> 36:11.158 [SPEAKER_02]: Like this. 36:12.158 --> 36:35.787 [SPEAKER_02]: And I suppose they I don't have I think they will probably gone off I see the thing is is that if I don't like a knife it gets used at the farmers markets and then they kind of you know get driven over and use you know they got abuse because they go to five markets a week and get thrown at the back of vans and get put into washing machines at the you know we got a big kind of washing cupboard you know so even if you tell them not to things get put in there 36:37.108 --> 36:45.393 [SPEAKER_02]: So I suppose if I don't like a knife, that's pretty much where they end up, you know, they get downgraded off my knife block. 36:46.613 --> 36:50.556 [SPEAKER_02]: And yeah, so I suppose I don't think I do have an integral. 36:50.956 --> 37:00.882 [SPEAKER_02]: But I mean, we did make some, I had great fun making some with, when we did the, you know, that there was a downstill event and a bunch of makers came to Ireland and we, 37:01.422 --> 37:27.579 [SPEAKER_02]: We kind of, that was one of the challenges we made for self because Morocco was there and we had to bias and to be as hangler and you know, so that was, you know, it's definitely a way of showing people what's possible and what's capable and about control and moving mass is probably, you know, if you can learn to make an integral knife, then everything else is easier after that, I suppose, if it's probably one way of learning how to, you know, it's, you know, if you, yeah, it's the 37:30.673 --> 37:35.881 [SPEAKER_04]: So like earlier you get talked about people coming to your shop Albert in buying knives. 37:36.866 --> 38:01.407 [SPEAKER_04]: and it probably kind of ties into a little bit of a, maybe how you sell them at your table, like natural Austria, for instance, do you have customers that come to your shop to purchase a knife and when they get there, you talk them into a different knife because they had something in mind and it's really not for the task that they were going to use the knife for, like how do you change their knife, change their mind to get them to buy the knife that's really going to work for them. 38:01.709 --> 38:02.510 [SPEAKER_01]: It's a good question. 38:02.890 --> 38:05.892 [SPEAKER_01]: First, we asked him what they want to cut with the knife. 38:06.392 --> 38:13.516 [SPEAKER_01]: So if a vegetarian comes to our shop, it doesn't make sense for him or her to buy like a huge meat slice, right? 38:13.536 --> 38:14.417 [SPEAKER_01]: So it doesn't make sense. 38:15.003 --> 38:15.944 [SPEAKER_01]: And also the other way around. 38:15.984 --> 38:28.396 [SPEAKER_01]: So if you don't eat like any veggies or you are mostly meat, then there's some people out there who do that, then let's say a hook grind might not be the right grind for them, right? 38:28.476 --> 38:33.280 [SPEAKER_01]: Because food release and meat and stuff is not that big of an issue. 38:33.721 --> 38:35.402 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I've certainly talked 38:36.103 --> 38:43.770 [SPEAKER_01]: people into buying like hook-riding the curious and stuff because of the stuff they cook at home, the stuff they eat. 38:44.030 --> 38:49.575 [SPEAKER_01]: But usually they don't have, let's say, very strict opinions on what they want to buy. 38:50.195 --> 38:58.022 [SPEAKER_01]: Usually they come through a shop and they look at an option, they want to get inspired of whatever they take whatever they like the most. 38:59.103 --> 39:02.006 [SPEAKER_01]: But we don't really have to talk about something. 39:02.366 --> 39:08.732 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, we explain what different grinds are there for, or let's say different material combinations. 39:08.792 --> 39:18.040 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, if you're worried about the thinner than a high-carbon Damascus play, it's not the right knife for you, then we have to go to the stainless direction. 39:18.260 --> 39:20.202 [SPEAKER_01]: So, down the sinus road. 39:20.822 --> 39:29.129 [SPEAKER_04]: I don't think I've ever heard anybody at a knife show, like for instance, for a little while, and maybe it still is, Eskrain was like the thing everybody was doing Eskrain. 39:29.709 --> 39:38.296 [SPEAKER_04]: I don't think I've ever heard anybody go to a knife show saying that they're looking for like an Eskrain knife and the person selling them asked them, what are they cutting with it? 39:38.396 --> 39:40.638 [SPEAKER_04]: Like, then they're not asking like the right questions. 39:40.658 --> 39:44.281 [SPEAKER_04]: They're just selling this Eskrain knife to them because the person wants an Eskrain knife. 39:44.341 --> 39:48.524 [SPEAKER_04]: And they might not be happy with it when they get home because it's not doing a job, but they need it for. 39:51.246 --> 40:07.595 [SPEAKER_02]: One of the things I found quite interesting, but the Escrime particular, and there's some of the ones with the hook grinds and everything else, depending on how the knife age is and stuff like that, after serious amounts of use, where the hook will be, there's an element of that. 40:08.055 --> 40:14.818 [SPEAKER_02]: I definitely, if you kind of see how much use you want the knife to go through, it will definitely have to go for a case of regrinding at some point to another. 40:15.999 --> 40:30.991 [SPEAKER_02]: But the, like I was very much trying to probably bring an element of brute to forge to some of the knives I've been forging and I find that that's when actually the hook grind like sorry that the S grind actually is being done more to sort of 40:31.892 --> 40:49.414 [SPEAKER_02]: enhance sort of the the strength and the spine and sort of leave some of the character in there, but actually you know leave it very thin behind the edge and kind of you know the middle of the knife like the center point is probably like less than a millimeter but you know you've still got a three and a half mill sort of tying four mills kind of tying and spine. 40:50.215 --> 40:53.480 [SPEAKER_02]: and you're leaving that character and to create as much of a blade as possible. 40:53.520 --> 41:05.259 [SPEAKER_02]: So in some ways where there's an element of visual beauty and in sort of what you want the blade to do, combined also with perhaps the performance of the knife, you know, and you know, 41:05.719 --> 41:25.334 [SPEAKER_02]: that there's an element of practicality that comes into it as well as sort of, but the food really side of things, you know, in almost trying too much, you know, you can kind of get away from the fact that sometimes, you know, a very thin knife will almost perform better than a knife with a very fancy 41:27.515 --> 41:35.520 [SPEAKER_02]: edge geometry as grind hook, whatever else there is there, but you know, it's just how much do you want that onion that slice of onion to fall off the blade? 41:37.361 --> 41:51.991 [SPEAKER_01]: But of course, when we were talking about hook grants or as grind knives, I mean, they're also thin behind the edge, so we're not talking about just a fancy grind that's thick behind the edge, but you still need to leave an element of something there to define the hook or whatever else. 41:52.751 --> 42:05.481 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, if you do your laser, you know, so that that's kind of blatantly obvious that there is going to be a little bit more heft there to serve a purpose and a function than it would be if you were just cutting it like grinding it as thin as possible. 42:05.701 --> 42:19.533 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, but if I do that's how we do it, if I do a big hollow grind on the other side of the blade, it's super thin, so our hook is under a millimeter, so above the hook it's under a millimeter, so between one side and the other side 42:22.735 --> 42:36.725 [SPEAKER_01]: So that's why we did this whole color thing because we pretty quickly found out that if you just do a hook grind and let's say leave the other side flat or do a flat grind, you get very a lot of material above the hook grind. 42:36.805 --> 42:42.188 [SPEAKER_01]: So we want to send it out by using a big hollow grind like the Japanese do, but they're nice, right? 42:42.228 --> 42:44.670 [SPEAKER_01]: So they have hollow grinds on the backside. 42:44.810 --> 42:51.172 [SPEAKER_02]: And is it, I've actually, is it kind of quite public knowledge as opposed to the process to define the kind of the hook? 42:51.392 --> 42:54.872 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, and how people actually kind of grind that in to the blade. 42:54.892 --> 43:04.435 [SPEAKER_02]: Does everybody have their own little jig or their own kind of little trick or a view actually very much gone for a sort of a manual non jig kind of process to say? 43:04.455 --> 43:05.515 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's how we do it. 43:05.855 --> 43:07.755 [SPEAKER_01]: So we do it manually without a jig. 43:08.095 --> 43:12.557 [SPEAKER_01]: So we use the outside of the contact wheel and the edge of the belt. 43:14.857 --> 43:37.982 [SPEAKER_01]: Perfect, and it's kind of the edge, the tip of the point of the knife facing down and you're sort of No, it's not the sound of work rest that you would do with what's it called to check all of the Tobin makes with the with the lever you use a work rest and you tilt the angle grinder the contact will goes like this and you use the the edge as a guide. 43:38.102 --> 43:39.623 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, you tilt the the wheel. 43:39.803 --> 43:40.043 [SPEAKER_02]: Sorry 43:46.227 --> 43:50.234 [SPEAKER_02]: Let's see, next time I come over to you, we're going to have to try and do one of those. 43:51.696 --> 43:53.820 [SPEAKER_01]: That's super easy to do if you have. 43:53.860 --> 43:54.160 [SPEAKER_01]: I know. 43:54.621 --> 43:57.927 [SPEAKER_01]: If you have fragrance about how to do it, of course, I messed up quite a few. 43:58.790 --> 44:09.294 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, not as it you have to you have to break a few eggs to yeah because if you have to lift it up and you You really have to use the the edge of the knife as your guide. 44:09.634 --> 44:18.497 [SPEAKER_01]: All right, so if you put it up too high or not high enough The hook runs gets all messed up so I've messed up quite a few so all right. 44:19.137 --> 44:19.297 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah 44:19.717 --> 44:20.978 [SPEAKER_04]: Oh, sorry guys. 44:21.758 --> 44:23.159 [SPEAKER_04]: I forgot to shut my phone off. 44:23.179 --> 44:27.460 [SPEAKER_03]: It's probably should I answer Keyons. 44:27.500 --> 44:27.820 [SPEAKER_03]: Keyons. 44:27.860 --> 44:28.201 [SPEAKER_03]: Keyons. 44:28.261 --> 44:30.942 [SPEAKER_03]: This show is sponsored by mini-held.eu. 44:31.042 --> 44:31.442 [SPEAKER_03]: Great. 44:31.542 --> 44:31.922 [SPEAKER_03]: Keyons. 44:32.042 --> 44:33.223 [SPEAKER_03]: Amazing prices. 44:33.723 --> 44:34.123 [SPEAKER_03]: Wonderful. 44:34.183 --> 44:34.483 [SPEAKER_03]: Keyons. 44:34.643 --> 44:35.264 [SPEAKER_03]: I have one. 44:35.384 --> 44:36.604 [SPEAKER_03]: Everybody should have one. 44:37.044 --> 44:43.447 [SPEAKER_03]: You have a huge selection on mini-held.eu where you can pick from different linings of brick hard brick. 44:43.487 --> 44:45.428 [SPEAKER_03]: If you want to do some cool-minded you want to 44:45.968 --> 44:48.729 [SPEAKER_03]: Hit up the ability in your heat treatment kill. 44:49.289 --> 45:05.995 [SPEAKER_03]: Just use a mini hell and while you are shopping there, you can also look at heat treatment foil which you could use for heat treating damage steel and racks for batch hardening maybe you are doing some easy-peasy simple carbon steel EDC blades, so you can heat treat multiple set of time. 45:06.415 --> 45:10.737 [SPEAKER_03]: And while you are at the checkout, please do remember use carbon 5 at checkout to say 45:11.837 --> 45:16.161 [SPEAKER_03]: which you can spend, maybe for that must you, maybe for other steel, maybe for something else. 45:16.802 --> 45:21.346 [SPEAKER_03]: And three coup, the value, you know, the 5% make a wonderful knife, and yeah, the other. 45:21.366 --> 45:25.610 [SPEAKER_03]: So, mini-held.io, thank you for sponsoring us, and they got the next one for you. 45:25.890 --> 45:28.012 [SPEAKER_03]: And now my lead, back to the show. 45:28.993 --> 45:29.994 [SPEAKER_03]: How's that for a transition? 45:32.256 --> 45:33.036 [SPEAKER_01]: Perfect. 45:33.997 --> 45:34.297 [SPEAKER_00]: Brilliant. 45:36.088 --> 45:43.858 [SPEAKER_02]: So, Keith, tell me, tell me what are you bringing to NiveShow Austria, anything exciting that it's kind of anything new or since I've seen you last? 45:44.439 --> 45:46.201 [SPEAKER_04]: Um, I got a ton of wood. 45:46.422 --> 45:51.268 [SPEAKER_04]: I got some stabilized mammoth tooth from Raphia this time. 45:52.809 --> 45:56.050 [SPEAKER_04]: Um, bringing some hats with our podcast logo on it. 45:56.310 --> 45:58.031 [SPEAKER_02]: You can see in the camera sexy. 45:58.391 --> 45:59.211 [SPEAKER_02]: That's amazing. 46:00.412 --> 46:02.052 [SPEAKER_04]: And, uh, yeah, I don't know. 46:02.092 --> 46:03.313 [SPEAKER_04]: I got a big boost this time. 46:03.553 --> 46:04.853 [SPEAKER_04]: Eight meters by three meters. 46:04.893 --> 46:06.514 [SPEAKER_04]: So lots of space to fill. 46:06.794 --> 46:07.014 [SPEAKER_04]: See. 46:07.814 --> 46:11.235 [SPEAKER_04]: I keep getting sidetracked every time I get to the shop to try and do something. 46:11.295 --> 46:12.936 [SPEAKER_04]: Something else takes over. 46:13.036 --> 46:17.137 [SPEAKER_04]: And, before you know, it half the day's gone and we still got some time left. 46:17.177 --> 46:17.617 [SPEAKER_04]: What do we got? 46:18.317 --> 46:19.298 [SPEAKER_04]: Just under two weeks now. 46:19.418 --> 46:19.938 [SPEAKER_04]: We'll get it done. 46:20.078 --> 46:21.219 [SPEAKER_01]: You don't have to do anything. 46:21.239 --> 46:23.341 [SPEAKER_01]: You just have to pack up your shit and drink it. 46:23.361 --> 46:24.982 [SPEAKER_01]: The pleasure of what we have to do. 46:26.123 --> 46:26.944 [SPEAKER_02]: No, what's the drive? 46:27.064 --> 46:29.386 [SPEAKER_02]: What's the drive in the distance for you to stay out? 46:29.706 --> 46:31.327 [SPEAKER_04]: About an hour and 20 minutes or so. 46:31.527 --> 46:32.008 [SPEAKER_04]: It's not far. 46:32.568 --> 46:33.369 [SPEAKER_01]: Ah, that's perfect. 46:33.529 --> 46:34.490 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it's just down the road. 46:37.632 --> 46:39.294 [SPEAKER_02]: And it's a, now, we've been to this venue. 46:39.354 --> 46:41.796 [SPEAKER_02]: This venue, every venue the whole before that we're going to. 46:42.216 --> 46:48.644 [SPEAKER_04]: Um, no, this is a different one from last year, but um, close by was by, um, finger on the chat. 46:48.684 --> 46:52.628 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know if you can still open this, but I just saw that Gabe sent us a minute ago. 46:52.648 --> 46:53.509 [SPEAKER_02]: Do you want to do it a tap? 46:53.549 --> 46:54.430 [SPEAKER_02]: Do you want to bring the chat? 46:55.172 --> 46:58.493 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, so I just found this, and I sent it to Gabe. 46:58.633 --> 47:02.435 [SPEAKER_04]: And I had a similar experience. 47:02.795 --> 47:09.717 [SPEAKER_04]: I have some card-by-handness that I sell in a customer of mine said that he just found my hammer on another website. 47:09.817 --> 47:12.138 [SPEAKER_04]: And my hammer was showing up on this other website. 47:12.178 --> 47:13.079 [SPEAKER_04]: Same exact picture. 47:13.819 --> 47:17.340 [SPEAKER_04]: And the description of the hammer and how it's used and everything. 47:17.820 --> 47:22.362 [SPEAKER_04]: And it said that they were selling it as a knife material hammer, so obviously weren't. 47:22.762 --> 47:26.966 [SPEAKER_04]: So this seems to be a thing that's going on right now, a lot with these AI-generated websites. 47:27.006 --> 47:31.870 [SPEAKER_04]: They just stop pulling stuff off of websites all over the place, using their pictures. 47:32.410 --> 47:34.992 [SPEAKER_04]: And they're actually not stealing the picture from you. 47:35.253 --> 47:37.494 [SPEAKER_04]: They're just linking the picture on their website. 47:37.915 --> 47:47.623 [SPEAKER_04]: So I made a new picture and it says, uh, this, like something like this is not an original knife material, uh, carbon hammer, it's been stolen from my website if you need to want the original. 47:48.083 --> 47:49.745 [SPEAKER_04]: And I just put it on my website like that. 47:50.625 --> 47:57.087 [SPEAKER_04]: So it's showed up on their website, I sent that to Gabe and then who was going to knife on there? 47:57.827 --> 48:00.067 [SPEAKER_04]: There's a couple of people say on strobs. 48:00.087 --> 48:03.268 [SPEAKER_04]: Knife is on the same website, so yeah, I told you. 48:03.348 --> 48:05.148 [SPEAKER_02]: Is this a whole circle thing where people? 48:05.169 --> 48:13.931 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, because the knife, the collaboration I did with Gabe Fletcher, leaning against the bottle of beer with the cheese next to it that came from eating tools. 48:14.491 --> 48:15.911 [SPEAKER_04]: Stole eating tools directly. 48:15.931 --> 48:16.991 [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, Stole eating tools. 48:20.672 --> 48:39.545 [SPEAKER_04]: And actually myself myself and Gabe at the exact same time sent a message through the saying isn't it a compliment to be copied you know yeah yeah it's like come on on on wish or what is it what is he on come on some gold thing yeah it's been on the internet forever like that 48:40.745 --> 48:43.248 [SPEAKER_02]: But it's a scam if you buy one of these things. 48:43.308 --> 48:48.252 [SPEAKER_04]: There's a lot of it keep your money Sure, I mean look it's it they have it down listed. 48:48.292 --> 49:06.807 [SPEAKER_04]: I don't know what eating tools is selling a full But it was listed for like little of five grand and these guys have it on discount on sale for $147 So I mean you gotta be in You gotta be kind of stupid to think you gotta get one and it's not limited you can put five of them in your shopping cart if you want and yeah I think you guys only that one made right so 49:07.715 --> 49:08.015 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. 49:08.455 --> 49:09.316 [SPEAKER_02]: I think that's hilarious. 49:09.416 --> 49:11.517 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, you know, the highest form of flattery. 49:12.658 --> 49:14.199 [SPEAKER_02]: But still fucked them. 49:17.321 --> 49:20.443 [SPEAKER_04]: So yeah, I was actually, I was going to ask you about that collaboration. 49:20.463 --> 49:21.363 [SPEAKER_04]: Like, what happened with the knife? 49:21.403 --> 49:22.924 [SPEAKER_04]: Is it sold or what's going on with that? 49:23.024 --> 49:23.444 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah. 49:23.525 --> 49:25.085 [SPEAKER_04]: But I didn't type it into the internet. 49:25.125 --> 49:26.246 [SPEAKER_04]: And that that's the website. 49:26.266 --> 49:29.368 [SPEAKER_04]: The first thing that came up on the search and the list was that website. 49:29.388 --> 49:31.850 [SPEAKER_04]: So like, who sent this nap shot to gave it? 49:32.310 --> 49:32.510 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah. 49:33.298 --> 49:34.138 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, no, it was great. 49:34.279 --> 49:48.124 [SPEAKER_02]: I The what was lovely was that it did sell and I think it You know, the there was interesting challenges that came from from doing that big you know I never mind fucking up my own shit, but what happens? 49:48.164 --> 49:50.245 [SPEAKER_02]: I knew Dan world the billet that that you know 49:50.785 --> 49:58.129 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, the gap had made, you know, it was probably days if not weeks of work and the scent over it. 49:58.289 --> 50:03.372 [SPEAKER_02]: And like there's nothing that makes you puck your ass more than not f***ing up the entire process. 50:04.993 --> 50:13.657 [SPEAKER_02]: But so I suppose, but the knowledge of the gap has is incredible, you know, and I think that was a lovely kind of work together with the guys. 50:13.717 --> 50:14.838 [SPEAKER_02]: And I think, you know, 50:15.738 --> 50:24.506 [SPEAKER_02]: it ending up on eating tools was also wonderful and there was an interesting process where I think for the launch of the knife. 50:25.627 --> 50:30.571 [SPEAKER_02]: The bigger picture was that and for giving me for repeating myself but what happened was that there was basically we 50:31.392 --> 50:32.573 [SPEAKER_02]: Gabe made the the billet. 50:32.933 --> 50:33.753 [SPEAKER_02]: It was sent to me. 50:33.993 --> 50:37.935 [SPEAKER_02]: I kind of heat treated and ground it and then put a handle on to it and sent it back to him. 50:38.475 --> 50:55.384 [SPEAKER_02]: He made a beer which was a saison beer that was made using, you know, his beautiful anchorage, you know, glacial water and his wonderful process with bread of icey's and eight bottle aged for a year and everything that he does, you know, is incredible. 50:55.704 --> 50:57.585 [SPEAKER_02]: So this beer, he sent it over to me, 50:58.565 --> 51:03.487 [SPEAKER_02]: And in that beer we washed the rind of our cheese with that for a couple of weeks. 51:04.127 --> 51:12.390 [SPEAKER_02]: And then I had so basically it was his beer was washing the surface of our cheese, which I sent over to him and I did a couple of cases of sending the cheese to him. 51:13.290 --> 51:17.111 [SPEAKER_02]: And that got through the whole process of sending from EU to America. 51:17.151 --> 51:19.252 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, the FDA is a pain of the ass. 51:19.812 --> 51:23.653 [SPEAKER_02]: So we kind of thought, okay, they don't seem to have an issue with this, because I've sent cheese to America a lot. 51:24.074 --> 51:24.874 [SPEAKER_02]: And then so what we did, 51:25.754 --> 51:51.545 [SPEAKER_02]: was we made the motherload of cheeses and sent them over to them like well not the motherload but I think we had like 24 small cheeses or something like that and I put them onto UPS and it got stopped by the FDA and they wanted to see all the paperwork, all the process they had to go and basically what they were saying was this cannot be pushed through, it has been pulled in 51:55.387 --> 52:00.409 [SPEAKER_02]: forms and you have to have this person and this thing and basically it was like this this isn't going anywhere. 52:00.929 --> 52:03.030 [SPEAKER_02]: So like they were doomed to be stuck there. 52:03.970 --> 52:05.190 [SPEAKER_02]: So like oh fuck it we tried. 52:05.851 --> 52:07.391 [SPEAKER_02]: No harm you know. 52:08.152 --> 52:11.853 [SPEAKER_02]: So it's a large amount of cheese was sitting in the in a UPS cold room somewhere and 52:12.693 --> 52:16.935 [SPEAKER_02]: Was it three weeks later, I think Gabe sent me a message saying the cheese. 52:17.175 --> 52:18.916 [SPEAKER_02]: This is this is well after the event. 52:18.936 --> 52:32.061 [SPEAKER_02]: The launch has happened everything like that and he says you won't believe this, but there's like several boxes of cheese have just been delivered with this like Mowly stinking terrible sort of cheese have been rotting in a cold room. 52:32.601 --> 52:36.823 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, not even a cold room in a warehouse for like a courier warehouse for the past week. 52:37.843 --> 52:45.588 [SPEAKER_02]: What didn't make any sense to me is obviously they wanted to get rid of it because the The customs, you know, didn't want it up to dispose of it. 52:45.608 --> 52:52.412 [SPEAKER_02]: So they waited for it to literally, you know Become probably a thing of risk and then like oh, okay, just let them deal with it now 52:53.753 --> 52:59.977 [SPEAKER_02]: I could knock at my head around that, but at the same time, that was the only negative thing to come from. 53:00.037 --> 53:14.625 [SPEAKER_02]: What was unbelievably a totally positive event of also again to work in a collaboration with Gabe, and a lot was learned, and I had fun with that. 53:14.985 --> 53:18.547 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, it's a beautiful night, it's probably my favorite pattern, and he's done so far, I think. 53:19.445 --> 53:21.126 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, he keeps on amazing. 53:21.146 --> 53:23.647 [SPEAKER_02]: And what he's doing with Stainless Damascus now is incredible. 53:23.707 --> 53:27.489 [SPEAKER_02]: He's basically taken that whole element of gradient and bringing in to the Stainless world. 53:28.109 --> 53:31.671 [SPEAKER_02]: And the creativity of the etching. 53:31.751 --> 53:35.693 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I hold back now from Concey Sending or a message and saying, how do you do this? 53:35.713 --> 53:36.233 [SPEAKER_02]: How do you do that? 53:36.854 --> 53:42.096 [SPEAKER_02]: Because if you think of it, like it's, he elevates everything he puts his mind to. 53:42.196 --> 53:43.037 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, you know, 53:44.838 --> 53:53.202 [SPEAKER_02]: everything just pops so much more, you know, the definition, the contrast and the etching, the entire process, everything is incredible. 53:53.642 --> 53:57.424 [SPEAKER_02]: So I'm looking forward to seeing what he brings to Austria and I'm very much looking forward to seeing the month. 53:57.464 --> 53:58.144 [SPEAKER_02]: He's quite right. 53:58.565 --> 54:02.707 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, he did some of that deep etching on the edge of hope knife that he made this year with the Domestyle. 54:02.727 --> 54:06.028 [SPEAKER_04]: I don't know if you saw any sneak peeks of it, but I didn't. 54:06.048 --> 54:07.129 [SPEAKER_02]: How do we actually see those? 54:07.149 --> 54:09.070 [SPEAKER_02]: Because I mean is it on his own? 54:09.790 --> 54:11.411 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean when do we actually, is the 54:14.212 --> 54:16.294 [SPEAKER_04]: The website is updated today. 54:16.414 --> 54:20.598 [SPEAKER_04]: I released four makers and then every day until the tickets go on sale. 54:20.658 --> 54:23.201 [SPEAKER_04]: I'll do four knife makers a day and be releasing. 54:23.221 --> 54:28.706 [SPEAKER_04]: I was we've already introduced all the knife makers, but I'll be releasing all the finished pictures of the knives. 54:29.447 --> 54:31.288 [SPEAKER_04]: So, people might be getting updates soon. 54:33.029 --> 54:38.231 [SPEAKER_04]: October 19th is when tickets go on sale and also at Napier Austria you can buy them in person. 54:38.491 --> 54:43.953 [SPEAKER_04]: But the knife pictures will be released online in the next few days with doing four a day in tow. 54:44.153 --> 54:45.113 [SPEAKER_04]: Okay tickets go on sale. 54:46.534 --> 54:47.154 [SPEAKER_02]: Fantastic. 54:47.654 --> 54:49.054 [SPEAKER_02]: And yeah we're going to see them all in one place. 54:49.315 --> 54:49.815 [SPEAKER_02]: Okay cool. 54:50.795 --> 54:51.635 [SPEAKER_04]: See mom. 54:51.695 --> 54:56.757 [SPEAKER_02]: Have you, have you, you're saying trying to get everything into the one table or into the one case. 54:56.917 --> 54:57.017 [SPEAKER_02]: Have 55:00.622 --> 55:04.965 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, I mean, I got the case, the same size as the table that Hoover gave us. 55:05.005 --> 55:08.507 [SPEAKER_04]: So if it takes up more room than that, then I don't know what we're going to do. 55:08.907 --> 55:11.108 [SPEAKER_04]: But it should, we should be able to get them all in there. 55:11.188 --> 55:12.869 [SPEAKER_04]: There's just a few knives that are really big. 55:13.350 --> 55:15.191 [SPEAKER_04]: Like, Prince made us a shorter knife. 55:15.211 --> 55:18.353 [SPEAKER_04]: This, I mean, with the different size knives, we'll fit them all in somehow. 55:19.733 --> 55:44.283 [SPEAKER_04]: The last one is the fact it's it's going to be unmanned so that's probably why you want to have a case is that it now There'll be a person there because we're doing ticket sales life It'll be somewhere there to take ticket sales credit cards and stuff like that But um now we just have in the case so people don't reach from I mean this 20 of them just kind of laying out on the table and the person so on the tickets is not really Very knowledgeable knives. 55:44.343 --> 55:46.424 [SPEAKER_04]: She's there to help so I'll take it so 55:47.821 --> 56:03.774 [SPEAKER_02]: I was kind of, that's one of the things that's going through my head because stainless knives aren't an issue, but the high carbons still knives, you always kind of think about sort of thumb prints and sort of the mulling up of the blades and, you know, you don't spit no knives. 56:04.014 --> 56:09.078 [SPEAKER_02]: There's definitely a case of high carbons still knives to make them look their best, you 56:10.600 --> 56:18.575 [SPEAKER_02]: greasy sweaty hands will definitely kind of leave marks and I think after two days if a knife is picked up every ten minutes by somebody I mean 56:20.086 --> 56:30.053 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't think knives are handled that much and people usually have a lot of respect to actually kind of, you know, to ask before and stuff like that, but it probably depends on some sort of ways. 56:30.193 --> 56:35.317 [SPEAKER_02]: Like I said, I don't have enough experience behind the table, but what do your thoughts out about on sort of the whole process? 56:35.337 --> 56:40.081 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, of sort of the man handling of your little babies. 56:40.861 --> 57:00.155 [SPEAKER_01]: I have quite a few nice with rusty finger print marks under it's not just the shows but also we have I mean you've been to our shop we have this office space and we have this magnetic knife boards for all our finish knives 57:00.855 --> 57:01.975 [SPEAKER_01]: are under. 57:02.575 --> 57:02.736 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. 57:02.936 --> 57:08.557 [SPEAKER_01]: And our students every time they pick up these knives and they touch them and stuff. 57:09.117 --> 57:19.679 [SPEAKER_01]: And then it didn't noise the shit out of me because we've put up five science which say, um, don't do not touch, don't take off the knives of the, of the magnetic knives. 57:20.200 --> 57:21.480 [SPEAKER_01]: And they always do. 57:22.060 --> 57:32.024 [SPEAKER_01]: like every other you could you electrify could you electrify the the magnetic board I thought about you know is this fantasy stay have like yeah Jesus 57:36.020 --> 57:43.504 [SPEAKER_04]: I mean, even if you just had some, some like, some like laser pointers or something around, so it looks like he got some laser kind of fenced thing around it. 57:44.344 --> 57:50.187 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, but I'm honest, the out of ideas, we've tried everything, we've, we've, we've, all this time. 57:50.287 --> 57:57.510 [SPEAKER_01]: So every other week, we, yeah, of course, a bit, but I, I, that's too much of, obviously. 57:57.911 --> 58:01.712 [SPEAKER_01]: Then I have to open a glass case if I want to take off and I have to put it on my 58:03.393 --> 58:07.575 [SPEAKER_02]: It's another barrier between selling it, you know, it's another thing that's kind of taking it away from people. 58:07.935 --> 58:14.539 [SPEAKER_02]: But have you ever, I bought someone, I've never tried it, how do you pronounce it, Karuba wax? 58:14.899 --> 58:17.340 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, this is Kanoba, Kanoba. 58:17.780 --> 58:20.582 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, that's supposed to be incredible, but it's a pain in the ass to put on. 58:21.602 --> 58:29.947 [SPEAKER_02]: Um, but I mean, and there's a few other variations, some of those wax that leave a very good sort of more robust finish, but like, yeah, if it was easy, everybody do it. 58:30.227 --> 58:33.709 [SPEAKER_02]: And have you, um, Keith, brought over what's the gator skin? 58:34.390 --> 58:37.692 [SPEAKER_02]: Is there any any look at kind of getting gator skin over the side of the world? 58:38.548 --> 58:46.091 [SPEAKER_04]: I have GatorSkin and I have I had a company here in Europe make the formula of GatorSkin here. 58:46.971 --> 59:00.276 [SPEAKER_04]: You can't always you can't brand it as GatorSkin and I've sent out I think five or six test bottles to different makers and got a little bit of feedback from people here and there a lot of the people liked it for shipping. 59:04.657 --> 59:10.260 [SPEAKER_04]: They said that it worked well for shipping, but on a kitchen knife and heavy use, it doesn't last very long. 59:10.920 --> 59:14.822 [SPEAKER_04]: So I was kind of on the fence, whether I want to carry it or not. 59:16.062 --> 59:21.465 [SPEAKER_04]: But the people who liked it, loved it, and the other guys, you know, kind of said it was more for shipping. 59:21.505 --> 59:24.547 [SPEAKER_04]: If it's only good for shipping, you can use pretty much anything. 59:25.527 --> 59:27.528 [SPEAKER_04]: A wax or any other kind of oil, you know what I mean? 59:29.383 --> 59:29.984 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I tried. 59:30.064 --> 59:38.907 [SPEAKER_02]: There was a version that I used to be able to get this kind of spray on sort of greeny liquid that you sort of spray it on afterwards. 59:38.927 --> 59:43.068 [SPEAKER_02]: But I didn't notice that whether did anything at all, it was supposed to have a text, you know. 59:43.108 --> 59:49.631 [SPEAKER_02]: But it was, again, it was one of those sort of very wet liquids that sort of 59:50.311 --> 01:00:03.418 [SPEAKER_02]: Once it dried on, probably gave some bit of a, but then you don't know if that was designed for a food grade or not, and that's another element of of of concern, making sure everything's legit that way. 01:00:04.240 --> 01:00:13.945 [SPEAKER_04]: One of the, one of the things that was cool from the company that made the formula for me, they had an option to put them, like, in small, impregnated towels, like hand wipes would have been. 01:00:14.486 --> 01:00:22.350 [SPEAKER_04]: That would be kind of a cool thing for people to have atros, because then you could just got the towel, you can wipe it down, throw it away, just like the little disposable squares. 01:00:23.417 --> 01:00:23.917 [SPEAKER_02]: I suppose so. 01:00:24.097 --> 01:00:33.240 [SPEAKER_02]: In the longer run those, I don't know, I mean, because we have them around for the food side of things a lot, because you have the antiseptic wipes for cleaning probes and whatever else that they're everywhere. 01:00:33.260 --> 01:00:37.802 [SPEAKER_02]: And the thing is, you leave that fucker open and you come back the week later in the entire package, right out. 01:00:37.842 --> 01:00:48.306 [SPEAKER_02]: And I mean, I think after, I think 10 years of changing nappies, I feel like we've created enough waste in the world with sort of baby wipes or whatever else, you know. 01:00:49.046 --> 01:00:50.826 [SPEAKER_02]: But there is a time and a place for them, you know. 01:00:52.407 --> 01:01:03.257 [SPEAKER_02]: But yeah, no, it's an interesting, you know, it's an interesting process, but I suppose you, I think the whole process probably how you dry that on and you're just giving it a wipe isn't enough. 01:01:03.317 --> 01:01:12.565 [SPEAKER_02]: It's usually a combination of spring, spritzing something on and then using an air compressor, whatever else to kind of prevent that little, I mean, I've never noticed that when you're taking something out. 01:01:13.025 --> 01:01:16.069 [SPEAKER_02]: you know, get a pace or out of, you know, any of these things. 01:01:16.109 --> 01:01:22.238 [SPEAKER_02]: If you have a sneaky little drip that stays there for too long, it will leave a little snail trail. 01:01:22.678 --> 01:01:22.879 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. 01:01:23.519 --> 01:01:26.744 [SPEAKER_02]: So, I think, I think, but I suppose you don't know until you try. 01:01:26.975 --> 01:01:43.081 [SPEAKER_02]: for your first knife show that you're coming to do you already have ideas for your table set up because you had said you've never really done yeah I'm going to do what I've always done I'm going to bring a role of butchers paper with me and I'm going to do the the whole process of sort of like um this 01:01:44.421 --> 01:01:45.242 [SPEAKER_02]: drawing out. 01:01:45.322 --> 01:01:46.923 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm basically going to graffiti the table. 01:01:47.104 --> 01:01:53.149 [SPEAKER_02]: The whole table will become like a sort of a, you know, a sort of the way I've always done it. 01:01:53.169 --> 01:01:56.532 [SPEAKER_02]: I've always kind of, you know, written everything out, highlighted it. 01:01:57.072 --> 01:02:04.258 [SPEAKER_02]: I've showed that, oh, this is dinosaur bone and this is apex ultra and this is dinosaur, this is forged and this is the price and whatever else. 01:02:04.298 --> 01:02:09.303 [SPEAKER_02]: And then if a knife sells, then whether I'm just going to kind of keep 01:02:09.863 --> 01:02:21.311 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, but I'm going to probably next week is my plan basically before I fly out as basically when I'm really going to, you know, kind of put my thinking cap on and how I'm going to do it. 01:02:21.331 --> 01:02:22.492 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm going to have all the toys there. 01:02:23.913 --> 01:02:28.856 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, because I was thinking I have to bring everything, I mean, I'm used to throwing everything in the back of a van and driving to somewhere. 01:02:29.197 --> 01:02:30.798 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, everything has to fit under suitcase. 01:02:31.718 --> 01:02:40.563 [SPEAKER_02]: And it's probably even too late now to ship over a parcel, and if I did, I don't, you know, anybody I know is going there is going to have their own things to deal with. 01:02:40.623 --> 01:02:43.265 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't want to be the asshole saying, oh, could you bring this for me as well? 01:02:43.345 --> 01:02:49.848 [SPEAKER_02]: And, you know, so I think, and people would with a heart and a half, I'm sure there's a lot of beautiful people out there in the world. 01:02:49.868 --> 01:02:52.290 [SPEAKER_02]: So I just thought, like, it's got to be simple, it's got to stand out. 01:02:52.870 --> 01:02:56.892 [SPEAKER_01]: It's got to have information and, you know, don't look like a, you know, 01:02:58.193 --> 01:03:05.895 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, in some ways you want the products to speak for themselves, but, you know, sometimes you have to have an element of class and style to it all as well. 01:03:08.135 --> 01:03:10.256 [SPEAKER_02]: So I think I had a bit of fun. 01:03:10.296 --> 01:03:14.397 [SPEAKER_02]: Actually, do you know what I got today, which not today, yesterday, sorry, it was NFC chips. 01:03:15.137 --> 01:03:19.978 [SPEAKER_02]: I've ever received those little, little stickers and you can touch your iPhone off it. 01:03:20.058 --> 01:03:21.659 [SPEAKER_02]: And I kind of thought, oh, fuck it, that would be fun. 01:03:21.719 --> 01:03:27.360 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, you can basically tap off whatever it is and it will bring up the link for payment. 01:03:28.862 --> 01:03:35.236 [SPEAKER_02]: It's kind of pointless because at the same time in 10 seconds you can key it into your phone and tap to my phone and pay. 01:03:35.998 --> 01:03:38.083 [SPEAKER_04]: We also don't know what the intense is going to be like there. 01:03:39.140 --> 01:03:45.205 [SPEAKER_02]: Well, the NFC chip doesn't matter because in some sort of, well, it may be a right because it just opens up whatever you tell it to. 01:03:45.285 --> 01:03:47.267 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, you can even have a file. 01:03:47.627 --> 01:03:50.029 [SPEAKER_02]: I think it's 500 bytes is on an NFC chip. 01:03:50.389 --> 01:03:52.011 [SPEAKER_02]: You can have whatever information already there. 01:03:52.811 --> 01:04:01.539 [SPEAKER_02]: But I think that was me being wanky and pretentious and I was more excited by the idea of knowing because if you've ever opened up one of my knives, you know, they're always tied up. 01:04:01.599 --> 01:04:02.519 [SPEAKER_02]: They look like a salami. 01:04:03.458 --> 01:04:04.458 [SPEAKER_02]: you open up the canvas. 01:04:04.999 --> 01:04:06.219 [SPEAKER_02]: It tells you what everything is. 01:04:06.739 --> 01:04:07.300 [SPEAKER_02]: It's signed. 01:04:07.340 --> 01:04:08.360 [SPEAKER_02]: It's got the wax seal. 01:04:08.540 --> 01:04:12.822 [SPEAKER_02]: It has the, you know, the tea towel wrapped around it and everything else like that. 01:04:13.282 --> 01:04:15.363 [SPEAKER_02]: So it's kind of multiple layers in the whole process. 01:04:15.383 --> 01:04:18.064 [SPEAKER_02]: And I'm not going to get the chance to do that at the knife show. 01:04:18.084 --> 01:04:21.425 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm not going to go through this whole slab of sort of because I don't have the room. 01:04:21.445 --> 01:04:26.287 [SPEAKER_02]: I have one table and I need to I need another full table empty to be able to draw and trace around it. 01:04:26.327 --> 01:04:26.427 [SPEAKER_02]: So 01:04:28.188 --> 01:04:45.720 [SPEAKER_02]: I think inevitably, if a knife is sold at the knife show, then it's going to be wrapped up carefully and then put in a tea towel and basically that's what they kind of stick under their arm and they walk away with and there's optional zipper cases, whatever else I'm sure we can run over to your stall and get some more zipper cases if we need to. 01:04:46.380 --> 01:04:52.289 [SPEAKER_02]: But I think, you know, there's, you know, there's apps on the phone for selling. 01:04:52.309 --> 01:04:53.892 [SPEAKER_02]: There's all this kind of stuff you can kind of do. 01:04:53.932 --> 01:05:00.401 [SPEAKER_02]: But yeah, everything has the fit into suitcase as long as well with the knives and as well with enough changes of underwear. 01:05:01.903 --> 01:05:03.224 [SPEAKER_02]: everything else for a week and ask you. 01:05:03.785 --> 01:05:16.857 [SPEAKER_02]: So it'll be an interesting kind of minimalistic, but kind of fun thing, because normally I bring more than I need in the back of a van, I'll just pull out what I need, but this is a case of minimalism. 01:05:17.998 --> 01:05:23.122 [SPEAKER_02]: So I think a lot of this is going to revolve around a Sharpie pen and some butchers paper. 01:05:24.163 --> 01:05:27.504 [SPEAKER_04]: That's a great idea to tie it in with the way you package your savings, we did not. 01:05:27.604 --> 01:05:28.204 [SPEAKER_04]: I think that's it. 01:05:28.324 --> 01:05:28.884 [SPEAKER_04]: I think that's it. 01:05:28.944 --> 01:05:34.506 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm going to have everything that I can bring is necessity like all the means of them actually taking it home with them. 01:05:35.046 --> 01:05:37.986 [SPEAKER_02]: But I've always wrapped up the, I've always used butchers paper in my entire life. 01:05:38.006 --> 01:05:41.107 [SPEAKER_02]: I've always kind of like folded it up in a certain way to become the edge protector. 01:05:41.527 --> 01:05:43.948 [SPEAKER_02]: Then wrap it up in another piece to kind of keep that in place. 01:05:44.528 --> 01:05:48.389 [SPEAKER_02]: And then, you know, so I think that's, that's going to be the 01:05:55.527 --> 01:05:59.750 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, this will be a learning curve form for me in so many ways. 01:05:59.890 --> 01:06:07.615 [SPEAKER_02]: And I think I wouldn't want to do it anywhere else, but probably not sure Austria, because I've always bounded basically with you guys. 01:06:07.795 --> 01:06:21.444 [SPEAKER_02]: And I think that it's suppose just for having been there last year, and I think it seems to be a wonderfully convivial kind of space for from makers and the fact that we know Martin Hoover and his show and stuff like that. 01:06:24.346 --> 01:06:28.989 [SPEAKER_04]: I just got back from a knife show, a small knife show that was in Germany last weekend. 01:06:29.690 --> 01:06:35.474 [SPEAKER_04]: And the German law doesn't allow people that leaving the knife show to just walk around carrying a knife. 01:06:35.574 --> 01:06:40.277 [SPEAKER_04]: It has to be like in a package or like in a backpack inside of a package. 01:06:40.297 --> 01:06:44.440 [SPEAKER_04]: You have to have like two like two forms of contact to get to the knife. 01:06:44.821 --> 01:06:49.424 [SPEAKER_04]: So what they did was had like a big stack of boxes and some wrap paper near the door 01:06:51.145 --> 01:07:04.399 [SPEAKER_04]: when you're on your way out, you can pack up your knife into this box and bring it home like that, which kind of makes a convenient for the people buying the knives, I guess, but just a crazy rule, a crazy German rule, but they have it. 01:07:05.099 --> 01:07:06.621 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, and is that a new rule? 01:07:06.681 --> 01:07:08.443 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, that's been out a couple of years now. 01:07:09.344 --> 01:07:11.726 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, probably two years, like that. 01:07:12.613 --> 01:07:20.379 [SPEAKER_02]: In Ireland, the rules are wonderfully loose, but funny enough in a country where it's not really very abused. 01:07:21.420 --> 01:07:31.629 [SPEAKER_02]: I think everybody does have knives, everybody logically walks around with a leatherman or an up-in-el or a Victoria Knox or whatever else. 01:07:31.669 --> 01:07:32.490 [SPEAKER_02]: We don't really have... 01:07:33.210 --> 01:07:47.719 [SPEAKER_02]: touch wood, you know, near much knife crime in this country, but there there was always that wonderful rule of thumb that if you know it was if a blade should reach across your palm is that kind of three inch blade, you know it was the kind of rule of thumb. 01:07:48.079 --> 01:07:55.944 [SPEAKER_02]: We don't really have that locking mechanism rule in a wonderfully loose terms I think it says that basically 01:07:57.104 --> 01:08:01.506 [SPEAKER_02]: It implies that if you have the reason to use to need a knife, then you're okay to have a knife. 01:08:02.106 --> 01:08:05.567 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, so if you're a chef walking over the knife road, you're okay. 01:08:05.607 --> 01:08:07.968 [SPEAKER_02]: If you're a builder, and you have leatherman, you're okay. 01:08:08.309 --> 01:08:11.330 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, just don't fucking walk down the Main Street with a samurai sword. 01:08:11.650 --> 01:08:14.991 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, just calm and sense rule. 01:08:15.852 --> 01:08:16.772 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I like that. 01:08:16.792 --> 01:08:24.635 [SPEAKER_02]: Again, interpretation is a big pain in the ass when it comes to rules a lot of the time, but I do like the fact that it hasn't become restrictive so to speak. 01:08:25.357 --> 01:08:25.637 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah. 01:08:25.837 --> 01:08:26.217 [SPEAKER_04]: Perfect. 01:08:26.277 --> 01:08:29.579 [SPEAKER_04]: I think we're in an hour and 15 minutes or so. 01:08:29.639 --> 01:08:30.919 [SPEAKER_04]: I think that was a great show. 01:08:31.139 --> 01:08:31.799 [SPEAKER_04]: Good time to stop. 01:08:31.819 --> 01:08:38.722 [SPEAKER_04]: We're going to record again in two days because this is kind of an extra episode to get us through the next show. 01:08:38.762 --> 01:08:43.104 [SPEAKER_04]: Austria week since Polly will be traveling and we'll be all busy tying up last minute. 01:08:43.684 --> 01:08:44.384 [SPEAKER_04]: Thanks for the show. 01:08:44.644 --> 01:08:47.285 [SPEAKER_04]: So it was great having you on again. 01:08:47.305 --> 01:08:48.366 [SPEAKER_02]: That's great to be here. 01:08:48.526 --> 01:08:48.866 [SPEAKER_02]: Thank you. 01:08:49.106 --> 01:08:50.126 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah. 01:08:50.146 --> 01:08:51.327 [SPEAKER_04]: Thanks so much for joining us. 01:08:51.927 --> 01:08:59.599 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm looking forward to catching up with you guys face-to-face, I think we should probably we should do some kind of Instagram live or something kind of like that one. 01:08:59.619 --> 01:09:02.524 [SPEAKER_02]: We're actually there, you know, probably still need to... 01:09:03.187 --> 01:09:11.869 [SPEAKER_04]: We always talk about it, but it just gets so hectic then, and me run in the booth and the edge of hope thing, and I have to do a speech at it and I at the war in ceremony, and it's good. 01:09:12.109 --> 01:09:12.309 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah. 01:09:13.389 --> 01:09:14.469 [SPEAKER_02]: I saw an audio. 01:09:14.489 --> 01:09:27.212 [SPEAKER_02]: I went around last year with taking recordings when I was going to try and do something with it, but actually the noise and the chatter and the background and the microphones and the amount of work it would take to clean up the audio and put it all together. 01:09:29.513 --> 01:09:40.718 [SPEAKER_02]: It's a labor of love, of course, at these live events to do that, but I think, yeah, we'll definitely, well, if you're listening to this, we'll be sending you the love from, from knife show Austria, that's for sure. 01:09:41.533 --> 01:09:50.759 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, people will be listening to it in their cars on the way up hopefully we'll see well all right guys We'll talk to you all next week So get off. 01:09:50.779 --> 01:09:55.622 [SPEAKER_03]: I can't run the Patreon content coming Something what out? 01:09:55.662 --> 01:09:56.103 [SPEAKER_03]: 2727 baby