[SPEAKER_00]: Hi everyone, welcome back to room for us.
[SPEAKER_00]: A space where queer voices thrive.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm your host P and every single week.
[SPEAKER_00]: I like to sit down, get vulnerable, and talk about all things queer with all of you.
[SPEAKER_00]: I want to know how has the first couple of weeks of 2026 been treating all of you.
[SPEAKER_00]: I just actually got back home to Vancouver from a really quick trip to see some family.
[SPEAKER_00]: Back in Ontario and we saw some friends, which was so so nice.
[SPEAKER_00]: It was actually a really good way to kick off the new year because My partner and I didn't go home for the holidays, so Getting that piece of home and seeing our loved ones, which is just so special even though it was only like
[SPEAKER_00]: It was like about five days, so just a little under a week, but getting that time is like so so important, and I felt very fulfilled and just seeing all those close people and like reuniting and catching up, I definitely want to make sure we have some more trips home.
[SPEAKER_00]: I will admit though.
[SPEAKER_00]: going back to Ontario when it's really cold can be really, really, really hard.
[SPEAKER_00]: We had actually just missed a snowstorm that is going on in Ontario and we were thinking about that as we are flying back and we flew into Vancouver.
[SPEAKER_00]: The weather here is a little bit more like spring.
[SPEAKER_00]: It does get a little cold but there's no snow we haven't seen that yet and I'm pretty sure this week it's meant to go
[SPEAKER_00]: which is a little unheard of, I think, for January and Vancouver, it's usually quite cloudy, but we were thinking, wow, we just missed this no storm by a couple of days and we're like, we were trying to get home or fly back home, I think that would have been insane.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm pretty sure a lot of flights were canceled, so, you know, to all my friends and family in Ontario, stay cozy, stay safe, and warm, while this no storm passes.
[SPEAKER_00]: I was seeing some photos
[SPEAKER_00]: As I was reflecting on that home visit, it actually kind of inspired this episode topic because this topic feels like very, very close to my heart and why this podcast exists in the first place.
[SPEAKER_00]: because I spent so much time with family and my nephew's, which was so, so needed.
[SPEAKER_00]: After I got home from the trip, it really really got me thinking a bit more about family dynamics, and this is what led me to this topic idea.
[SPEAKER_00]: I really want to talk about queer families in movies and television, and how that representation was really lacking when I was growing up.
[SPEAKER_00]: Two moms, two dads, chosen families, homes that don't follow this traditional script, but are still full of love, the messiness, routine, and of course at times conflict.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I want to talk about this through my own experience growing up, because when I look back, I realize something really, really big.
[SPEAKER_00]: I never saw queer families in my life.
[SPEAKER_00]: I grew up in with Beyond Hario and growing up every single one of my friends had parents in heterosexual relationships.
[SPEAKER_00]: So in my eyes, of course, like most families looked the same.
[SPEAKER_00]: There was a mom, a dad, a kid, my friends had siblings.
[SPEAKER_00]: Of course, different houses, there's different personalities, but everything kind of followed that same
[SPEAKER_00]: And of course, at the time, it didn't feel strange, but it just felt like reality.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's all I knew.
[SPEAKER_00]: And no one ever said, this is the only way your family can look.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I truly believe that when that's all you see in your neighborhood, at school, in movies, TV, books you're reading, it just becomes this like unspoken rule of like, this is what the
[SPEAKER_00]: And I actually have a funny memory from when I was a kid in terms of like what society deems as normal and how your life trajectory is going to go.
[SPEAKER_00]: So when I was a kid, I was terrified.
[SPEAKER_00]: of the idea of giving birth.
[SPEAKER_00]: For some reason, my brain, as a young child, really thought that once you reached a certain age, every woman had to give birth.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like they didn't have a choice.
[SPEAKER_00]: I just thought that that happened to every single woman.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm pretty sure there were way too many ER shows or something playing in my living room because the thought of it completely scarred me.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I remember crying to my mom, telling her I never wanted to give birth, and she calmly told me that I didn't have to, and that if I ever did want kids, adoption was also an option.
[SPEAKER_00]: And she explained with that meant.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I remember literally screaming with joy, running up and down the stairs, yelling to my dad and sister that I was going to adopt children, like it was a huge relief for me.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I feel like that story reminds me that when there is not much representation about what you're really seeing around you, this becomes the default future you imagine for yourself.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I'm picturing my young minds and me as a kid, truly believing this is what I need to do because that is kind of what I was taught.
[SPEAKER_00]: I was seeing that when you get to a certain age.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like you have a family, you have a marriage, you have the kids and
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't think I was even seeing representation for adoption around that time and I didn't even know that was a thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I remember when I was asking my mom.
[SPEAKER_00]: It just goes to show that because that's all I was seeing.
[SPEAKER_00]: I thought, well, that has to be what's going to happen to me.
[SPEAKER_00]: And on top of all of that,
[SPEAKER_00]: when you're queer, especially before you even have the language for it, that absence can really teach you something that your future could be smaller or harder or lower or maybe completely non-existent.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I remember there was a presentation I'd given to some younger kids when I was working at an agency in 2021.
[SPEAKER_00]: I presented a kind of like a queer story, like almost my story, to these kids who were studying to work and marketing.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I was talking about like queerness and representation.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I remember saying, when you don't see queerness in that representation in media, you do feel invisible.
[SPEAKER_00]: This, like, as I was doing research for this podcast, I was like that is very, very sad when you don't see yourself, you don't see queer families.
[SPEAKER_00]: You really don't think that it can exist.
[SPEAKER_00]: We do talk a lot about representation in terms of what is shown to us.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I also think something that is just as powerful is what isn't shown to us.
[SPEAKER_00]: When queer families are missing from the media we consume, it kind of sends a subtle message to everyone, saying that this life is rare, this life is complicated, and this life might also not be safe.
[SPEAKER_00]: and as a kid, you don't consciously think those thoughts, you actually just absorb them.
[SPEAKER_00]: You learn what adulthood is supposed to look like by watching it.
[SPEAKER_00]: You see like, this is what's going to happen when I'm a teenager and when I'm in high school, when I become an adult and I'm like out in the real world, getting a job, like doing all those next steps.
[SPEAKER_00]: And if you never see yourself out there and you don't even know how to imagine yourself growing up at all, I really do believe that seeing queer families on screen is about expanding what's possible.
[SPEAKER_00]: Because when you see a lesbian couple who are moms, you know, they're arguing about chores or two dads that are dropping their kid off at school.
[SPEAKER_00]: It actually does something very, very powerful.
[SPEAKER_00]: is incompatible with stability, love, or a home.
[SPEAKER_00]: And especially like trans representation too, I think it's really beautiful.
[SPEAKER_00]: One couple I love to watch together and how they're navigating life together too with their two babies and their kid, our load, this is Francesca Farigo and Jesse Sullivan.
[SPEAKER_00]: I love watching this couple.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think they're really great representation.
[SPEAKER_00]: They recently moved.
[SPEAKER_00]: to Canada and their kind of showcasing their life and what their family looks like, especially after Francesca recently gave birth to twins.
[SPEAKER_00]: And once again, like seeing that representation now as a 30 year old, I think it's really important.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I kind of wish like I could have seen
[SPEAKER_00]: more of that when I was younger, especially Jesse's experience being a trans dad.
[SPEAKER_00]: Seeing these stories tells queer kids that you're allowed to want this, you're allowed to dream this, you're allowed to build this and like you can have this and it tells kids who aren't queer that this is normal, this is human and it's definitely not something to fear.
[SPEAKER_00]: So when I was trying to think back to like what were some TV shows or films I could think of off the top of my head when I was in high school that showcased a queer couple that had children.
[SPEAKER_00]: One of the first films that really stood out to me when I was in high school was the kids are all right starring Julian Moore and Ep Bending and Mark Ruffalo.
[SPEAKER_00]: This came out in 2010.
[SPEAKER_00]: I love this movie.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's actually a movie I kind of like put on sometimes in the background and
[SPEAKER_00]: I was surprised.
[SPEAKER_00]: I remember when I researched it, I was like this came out in 2010.
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like when I was 19, I was like still consistently watching this movie.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I would have been 14 or 15 when the kids are all right came out.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, I want to talk about this movie for a little bit just because I loved seeing the representation of Julian Moore and a net bending as a married couple with two teenagers.
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like there wasn't a lot of movies that like openly showed that and it was a very popular movie.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, there's a lot of things that happen in this movie that are upsetting, so of course I'm going to say was this like the perfect representation or, you know, the story in ways like it's it's a roller coaster it's it's not perfect, but it.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think like for it's time, it was a very groundbreaking story.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like I said, it showed two moms raising kids as a family dealing with really real hard things.
[SPEAKER_00]: Basically, because their kids were curious about who the dad was, they end up finding, finding out that their biological dad is Mark Ruffalo and he comes into their life.
[SPEAKER_00]: But throughout this movie,
[SPEAKER_00]: It shows marriage, there's jealousy, mistakes are made, how and at Angelian communicate and their experience parenting teens.
[SPEAKER_00]: So what did stay with me about this movie is that...
[SPEAKER_00]: It was very raw.
[SPEAKER_00]: It was very real.
[SPEAKER_00]: It definitely didn't show this perfect family because they weren't.
[SPEAKER_00]: It was that their story wasn't trying to prove anything.
[SPEAKER_00]: This family was just navigating real life, especially as one of their kids is navigating college, like they're actually going to college for their first year.
[SPEAKER_00]: and seeing that at the time felt very, very rare.
[SPEAKER_00]: And the complex that this married couple had gone through had nothing to do with queerness.
[SPEAKER_00]: It was just like real-life problems that sometimes married couples do go through.
[SPEAKER_00]: And
[SPEAKER_00]: are they going to come out stronger or is it going to break everything?
[SPEAKER_00]: One other series that I actually like had only watched a little bit of, I never really got into it too much.
[SPEAKER_00]: Was the fosters and I kind of want to give it more of a chance because this show centered queer parents without making like queerness the problem or this like tragic story or anything like that.
[SPEAKER_00]: From what I've heard about the show, these parents were nurturing, protective, they restrict when they were needed, and very emotionally complex.
[SPEAKER_00]: They had kids who trusted them, they had responsibility, and they showed authority.
[SPEAKER_00]: So for many people, especially queer kids, this could have been their first time seeing queer adults in positions of care and leadership within a family.
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's really, really huge.
[SPEAKER_00]: because queerness is often portrayed as like this freedom or this bravery, you know, but really as a responsibility.
[SPEAKER_00]: I really want to watch the fosters and if any of you know more about this show or if you've seen it, I definitely want to check this out.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know Noah Centennial is in its Sierra Ramirez, Terry Polo, it's definitely a show I need to check out.
[SPEAKER_00]: So sometimes when I
[SPEAKER_00]: early adulthood.
[SPEAKER_00]: I sometimes wonder what it would have changed if I had seen more representation of two moms with their kids at the dinner table or two dads like showing up to the school event for their kids.
[SPEAKER_00]: I wonder if it would have made coming out a little less scary for me, or would it have made my future feel less uncertain because I was so concerned about not fitting into the mold that I was shown was like supposed to be my life.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like when I started to realize that I didn't see my life turning out in the way that was like so ingrained in our heads in terms of like these next steps it caused a lot of uncertainty and a lot of anxiety so I wonder if like
[SPEAKER_00]: It would have made the coming out process like maybe a little easier for me, or maybe it's something I would have recognized when I was a little younger.
[SPEAKER_00]: I really really think so because like I know representation won't answer like every question or every.
[SPEAKER_00]: Fear you have like you're always gonna have this with like what we're always gonna have forms of this is what I'm saying But I think it can make the questions like less terrifying.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's also something that I came across very recently That really made me stop and think about how early representation can actually begin and
[SPEAKER_00]: It actually has to do with the children's book that I bought for my cousin and his wife for baby shower because their goal is to kind of start their child's library and, you know, have them like reading books and this book really caught my eye and kind of inspired this episode because I thought it was so beautiful.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I bought this children's book called Families Can by Dan Sacks
[SPEAKER_00]: and I'll be honest, I had no idea this book even existed until I bought it.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's it.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's so simple, it's beautifully illustrated and it's written and rhyme, but it talks about all the different ways families can look.
[SPEAKER_00]: It literally lists it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Two moms, two dads, one parent, big family, small families, and it's not that it was like,
[SPEAKER_00]: what it showed that really struck me but it was just how like casually and beautifully done it was.
[SPEAKER_00]: There wasn't like this big explanation, no lessons attached to it, no justification, it's just showing children like this exists and this is what your family can look like.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I was so excited.
[SPEAKER_00]: So my partner and I gifted this.
[SPEAKER_00]: And we were so excited because we flipped through it.
[SPEAKER_00]: And we were like, what a simple message, but so powerful and meaningful.
[SPEAKER_00]: And how beautiful is it to show this to a young kid so early on?
[SPEAKER_00]: Because as I've mentioned, like, kids absorb everything.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I feel like when kids see that, they see that message.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's teaching them from like a
[SPEAKER_00]: This is how many families look, because as I mentioned, I feel like when I was growing up in such a small town, I didn't see much representation at all and growing up in an immigrant family, and feeling like the only, one of the only people of color, definitely like on my street, maybe we were the only people of color on our street.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now that I think about it, we very much could have been.
[SPEAKER_00]: I felt a little bit of an outsider and I kind of felt like, oh my family doesn't really look like a lot of the families around me.
[SPEAKER_00]: Even though my parents are in a heterosexual relationship like I still felt that even then just being an Indian Canadian.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I love this book because it shows different sexualities, it shows different size families, it shows chosen families,
[SPEAKER_00]: I think it's showing, you know, whoever reads this book that your family is normal, your love doesn't need to be what society is telling you, what real love means, and your child deserves to grow up seeing themselves reflected before the world ever tells them their different.
[SPEAKER_00]: So honestly, I feel like when I saw that book, I was like, I really wish this was something I had when I was growing up.
[SPEAKER_00]: I didn't grow up seeing families like that really, like, in my neighborhood or like around my school circle and I wasn't seeing them on TV and I don't think I was seeing them in children's books, at least the books that were being read to me when I was, you know, younger in the 90s.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, I don't know.
[SPEAKER_00]: I just think that, for me, navigating my queroness,
[SPEAKER_00]: I had a lot of factors, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: But I think I never used to think about it so much and like a family matter.
[SPEAKER_00]: I always thought, oh, I never saw other queer kids or queer people or queer women I could relate to.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I never thought about it as like, what if I saw more like queer families or what if I had friends who
[SPEAKER_00]: openly had two dads or two moms.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's why books like Families can matter just as much as shows and movies like the fosters or the kids are all right because they're planting the seeds early.
[SPEAKER_00]: They're telling young kids you belong here your home makes sense and your family doesn't need permission or has to overexlaim themselves and they're telling parents, especially queer parents, that you are just raising a family just like everybody else.
[SPEAKER_00]: So this is why all of this still matters, even now queer families are still often framed as like maybe very brave or different, but straight families are never described that way.
[SPEAKER_00]: They're just families and until queer families are treated the same, representation will still matter because this isn't just about the visibility, it's about letting people and especially young people
[SPEAKER_00]: can include that safety and belonging, and one other thing I was thinking about is that it's interesting that we're seeing more stories now about straight parents learning how to support their queer kids, and that representation absolutely matters.
[SPEAKER_00]: But what we still don't see as often are the stories where the parents themselves are queer, where there's two moms or two dads who are just
[SPEAKER_00]: When the only representation we get to see is queer kids inside straight families, sometimes the heterosexuality still stays at the center of the story because in many of these movies or shows we've seen as much as they're still important, it shows like the parents struggling to accept their queer child.
[SPEAKER_00]: But when you actually see queer adults raising kids,
[SPEAKER_00]: You're saying something totally different, actually.
[SPEAKER_00]: That queerness isn't just something to be accepted.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's something that can be foundational.
[SPEAKER_00]: Growing up, like I've said, I've never saw queer adults with families.
[SPEAKER_00]: So even when I started seeing queer kids on screen, I feel like there was still that navigation for me.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, wondering, is there going to be a struggle?
[SPEAKER_00]: Do I have to have a whole
[SPEAKER_00]: What is adulthood going to look like for me, especially as someone who will probably eventually want to raise kids with my partner, and we are going to be two moms.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I really hope this got you thinking.
[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe you're for able to grab a copy of the book Families Can.
[SPEAKER_00]: I really, highly recommend it or just to flip through it.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's really, really beautiful and like a really thoughtful gift to gift someone young.
[SPEAKER_00]: I really, really think so.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think it's very important.
[SPEAKER_00]: So to the room for us listeners, if you grew up never seeing families like yours or families that are possible, I do want you to know this, that there is room for you and there is room for your love and room for the family that you want to build.
[SPEAKER_00]: and this is why I do this podcast every single week.
[SPEAKER_00]: I want to keep talking about these topics and reiterating that it's important to acknowledge this and unlearn like what we've been taught from society for so many years, especially for my millennials like Gen Z, out there, we're the ones like trying to navigate through all these changes right now, you know, because we kind of grew up
[SPEAKER_00]: queerness was like rarely, rarely talked about.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's only like recently like started to become like bigger and conversations and more people are feeling confident about their queerness and openly about talking about it.
[SPEAKER_00]: But there's still so much work that needs to be done.
[SPEAKER_00]: So...
[SPEAKER_00]: just want you to know that I'm always so happy that you guys tune in every single week.
[SPEAKER_00]: It means the world to me.
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you so much for being here and if you have any more questions about this topic or you want to reach out to me, I'd be so happy what on that note.
[SPEAKER_00]: I will see you all next week.