WEBVTT 00:00.171 --> 00:10.719 [SPEAKER_02]: This episode of True's Table is brought to you by our NAACP Image Award-nominated book, True's Table, Black Women's Musings on Life, Love, and Liberation. 00:11.140 --> 00:12.701 [SPEAKER_02]: Get it where all books are sold. 00:14.222 --> 00:15.403 [SPEAKER_00]: Sisters, how y'all feel? 00:16.150 --> 00:17.490 [SPEAKER_00]: Brothers, y'all all right? 00:17.870 --> 00:21.111 [SPEAKER_00]: If this is your first time at Truth's Table, welcome to the table. 00:21.311 --> 00:23.832 [SPEAKER_00]: And you've been sitting at the table with us all these years. 00:24.112 --> 00:33.774 [SPEAKER_00]: We are so grateful that you have been listening to us through these years, and we are inviting you to partner with us and support our work at patreon.com slash Truth's Table. 00:34.074 --> 00:36.995 [SPEAKER_00]: Now pull up a chair and have a seat at the table with us. 00:37.775 --> 00:39.116 [SPEAKER_00]: Hey y'all, welcome to Truth Table. 00:39.136 --> 00:40.676 [SPEAKER_00]: May wise the culture for Grace and Truth. 00:40.836 --> 00:42.317 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm a Camini and I'm Christina. 00:42.677 --> 00:45.118 [SPEAKER_00]: This table is built by Black woman and Fort Black woman. 00:45.138 --> 00:46.198 [SPEAKER_00]: So welcome to the table. 00:46.258 --> 00:47.439 [SPEAKER_00]: See how you doing, girl? 00:48.119 --> 00:48.860 [SPEAKER_03]: I feel welcomed. 00:49.480 --> 00:50.160 [SPEAKER_03]: Mmm. 00:50.240 --> 00:51.100 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm at the table. 00:51.120 --> 00:51.561 [SPEAKER_03]: Hey. 00:51.941 --> 00:54.602 [SPEAKER_03]: Listen, we got things to talk about today. 00:54.622 --> 00:54.862 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm doing it. 00:55.002 --> 00:55.683 [SPEAKER_03]: I want to pretty good. 00:56.083 --> 00:56.803 [SPEAKER_03]: I will say this. 00:56.883 --> 01:04.269 [SPEAKER_03]: Let me just take a moment to give space to those who are suffering from allergens all around this land. 01:04.769 --> 01:11.114 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, the allergies are going up a level and I just, you know, I think we've done something wrong. 01:11.154 --> 01:14.777 [SPEAKER_03]: I think we've broken the world and I don't understand why the trees don't like that. 01:14.817 --> 01:18.560 [SPEAKER_03]: The trees don't like us anymore, so I have been fighting for my life. 01:18.840 --> 01:20.641 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, I was fighting for my life yesterday. 01:20.721 --> 01:21.562 [SPEAKER_00]: It was bad. 01:23.349 --> 01:28.891 [SPEAKER_00]: And well, there isn't a lot of better things to throw. 01:29.111 --> 01:30.011 [SPEAKER_00]: But you right, we don't know. 01:30.071 --> 01:32.812 [SPEAKER_00]: There's a lot going on, but yes, I'm better today. 01:32.832 --> 01:33.312 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, good. 01:33.332 --> 01:35.212 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, because how to be in Yeshok wouldn't have been able to record. 01:35.232 --> 01:37.453 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeshok would have been able to record Yeshok would have been in Yeshok. 01:37.513 --> 01:43.054 [SPEAKER_03]: And stock in the allergy med companies because I'm telling you, how that true state successful. 01:43.274 --> 01:44.955 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, how that true state. 01:45.015 --> 01:48.996 [SPEAKER_00]: So no, I'm glad to be back at the table that she my sister. 01:49.056 --> 01:50.456 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, yes, how are you? 01:53.373 --> 01:56.155 [SPEAKER_00]: Honestly, as good as one can be in 2025. 01:56.415 --> 02:02.079 [SPEAKER_00]: He's Louis, you know, that comes in a lot of context. 02:02.239 --> 02:03.340 [SPEAKER_00]: Anybody's paying attention. 02:05.001 --> 02:10.746 [SPEAKER_00]: So it's, I'm glad we're back at the table at this juncture where we are toward the end of 2025. 02:10.786 --> 02:11.466 [SPEAKER_00]: How? 02:12.086 --> 02:12.487 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know. 02:12.507 --> 02:20.132 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, yeah, it's been a year of chaos, misery, strife, and mayhem, but the topic on a table today is 02:21.193 --> 02:22.414 [SPEAKER_00]: Steady in the store. 02:22.594 --> 02:23.674 [SPEAKER_00]: Steady. 02:23.794 --> 02:24.254 [SPEAKER_00]: Steady. 02:24.594 --> 02:25.355 [SPEAKER_00]: Hunger down. 02:25.495 --> 02:28.196 [SPEAKER_00]: The waves are beaten down. 02:28.636 --> 02:31.637 [SPEAKER_00]: But we lay right next to sleeping Jesus on the boat. 02:31.657 --> 02:33.238 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, and Jesus. 02:33.278 --> 02:34.559 [SPEAKER_00]: Welcome up, Jesus. 02:34.939 --> 02:35.879 [SPEAKER_00]: You're a little face. 02:36.199 --> 02:36.399 [SPEAKER_00]: What? 02:37.100 --> 02:37.660 [SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely. 02:37.680 --> 02:38.220 [SPEAKER_00]: It was done. 02:38.240 --> 02:39.961 [SPEAKER_00]: I was willing to stay back. 02:40.001 --> 02:41.502 [SPEAKER_00]: Let me stay next to sleeping Jesus. 02:41.562 --> 02:42.142 [SPEAKER_00]: It's better than a. 02:43.222 --> 02:49.546 [SPEAKER_00]: No, Jesus that I'll listen listen, but he don't slap a no sleep right well because he's at the right hand I've got the father. 02:49.847 --> 02:51.708 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, we believe come on theologically. 02:51.728 --> 02:59.373 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know what you're okay to do because I don't know what's going on It's humbly bad. 02:59.473 --> 03:03.235 [SPEAKER_00]: It's alive, but we're gonna talk about being steady in the storm, right? 03:03.676 --> 03:09.940 [SPEAKER_00]: And talking about really I guess in some ways it's a remix on why we believe what we believe and that 03:10.760 --> 03:18.447 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, how has our theology changed, if so, in what ways, you know, what are we observing, too? 03:18.827 --> 03:19.468 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I'm seeing. 03:19.528 --> 03:21.369 [SPEAKER_00]: So, what do you seeing? 03:21.749 --> 03:22.530 [SPEAKER_00]: What's the storm? 03:22.570 --> 03:24.972 [SPEAKER_00]: What's making up the stormy meal? 03:25.012 --> 03:26.433 [SPEAKER_03]: You want to define the storm? 03:26.474 --> 03:28.015 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, what's the storm? 03:28.415 --> 03:29.296 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, why don't we do that? 03:29.316 --> 03:30.377 [SPEAKER_03]: Why don't we do a roll call? 03:30.397 --> 03:30.657 [SPEAKER_03]: Okay. 03:30.977 --> 03:31.478 [SPEAKER_03]: Of the storm. 03:32.018 --> 03:35.882 [SPEAKER_03]: Yes, because I think I think the winds are coming from variety of places. 03:35.902 --> 03:36.402 [SPEAKER_03]: Hello, right? 03:36.442 --> 03:43.889 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean obviously the the clear one is the political climate, the current administration in the United States. 03:45.871 --> 03:48.093 [SPEAKER_03]: Makes global travel rather embarrassing. 03:48.233 --> 03:52.276 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, I think we left up the country and our drivers were like 03:53.354 --> 03:54.615 [SPEAKER_03]: What's happening to y'all country? 03:54.735 --> 03:55.735 [SPEAKER_03]: That was the beginning, too. 03:55.875 --> 03:56.936 [SPEAKER_03]: I wasn't that in January. 03:56.956 --> 03:57.316 [SPEAKER_00]: I was in January. 03:57.356 --> 03:58.577 [SPEAKER_00]: I was in January. 03:58.637 --> 03:59.477 [SPEAKER_00]: On an international trip. 03:59.677 --> 03:59.837 [SPEAKER_03]: Yes. 04:00.218 --> 04:00.538 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah. 04:00.578 --> 04:03.419 [SPEAKER_03]: So I think that clearly is a thing. 04:03.519 --> 04:13.024 [SPEAKER_03]: And that's not about the nuances of just political ideology, because I think we're not talking about political ideology and in governance. 04:13.725 --> 04:17.907 [SPEAKER_03]: I think we're talking about ethics and human dignity, 04:19.387 --> 04:38.447 [SPEAKER_03]: And yeah, so basic just kind of moral conversations is not a political one although although politics absolutely has to do with resource allocation and the the care of the populace and the advocacy of the populace, however, this at bare bones is just about decent human dignity. 04:38.487 --> 04:38.707 [SPEAKER_03]: Sure. 04:38.847 --> 04:38.967 [SPEAKER_03]: So. 04:39.842 --> 04:52.185 [SPEAKER_03]: That's a wind, that's a wind, that's a wind that's blowing with real implications for our neighbors who are so jurners in our land or people have decided that they look like so jurners in our land. 04:52.305 --> 04:54.586 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't know, or they just don't like what they say, I don't mind. 04:54.986 --> 04:57.866 [SPEAKER_03]: So it's so that that we're very threatening. 04:58.787 --> 05:04.388 [SPEAKER_03]: Then yeah, I think obviously some of the concrete cuts or until they have already impacted people, but that are to come. 05:05.088 --> 05:14.598 [SPEAKER_03]: Related as a health coverage and Medicaid specifically and then you know, I would say in addition to that what we see happening amongst different states 05:15.417 --> 05:24.259 [SPEAKER_03]: the redistricting dynamics the way that people's voting rights, their ability to use their political voice and agency, absolutely, are being stripped. 05:24.279 --> 05:25.319 [SPEAKER_03]: Poles are in the lives. 05:26.019 --> 05:29.060 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, it's highly dysfunctional in disturbing. 05:29.540 --> 05:32.281 [SPEAKER_03]: And then the original, what is with me? 05:32.301 --> 05:33.381 [SPEAKER_03]: Don't cry, that didn't happen. 05:33.581 --> 05:41.783 [SPEAKER_03]: And then the erasure of history, as if people's bodies, DNA, story, don't tell the narrative of historical slavery. 05:42.103 --> 05:43.144 [SPEAKER_03]: It's just the blood doesn't cry. 05:43.524 --> 05:44.164 [SPEAKER_03]: Exactly. 05:44.244 --> 05:46.645 [SPEAKER_03]: So, and people's literal bloodline, you know? 05:46.925 --> 05:47.286 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah. 05:47.306 --> 05:54.269 [SPEAKER_03]: That's one thing about United States is like what you can, you can take down and exhibit, but the walking fruit of exhibits are amongst us every day. 05:54.349 --> 05:56.891 [SPEAKER_03]: The last names of people are amongst us, every day. 05:56.911 --> 06:01.093 [SPEAKER_03]: You cannot scrub America's historical racialized reality. 06:01.133 --> 06:04.434 [SPEAKER_03]: So, those are part of the whiz, but there are other ones too. 06:04.454 --> 06:05.715 [SPEAKER_03]: Like, what would you add to that list? 06:05.755 --> 06:07.336 [SPEAKER_03]: No side of the political context. 06:07.836 --> 06:19.645 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I would add occupied DC and so the National Guard being called and I literally having a meeting in DC the day that the National Guard are 06:20.852 --> 06:45.190 [SPEAKER_00]: uh... reported are are sent into uh... into occupy uh... dc uh... the weaponization of the national guard the military against american citizens declaring war uh... on american citizens which is an impeachable uh... uh... uh... uh... a fence and i don't know it's things are not the system's a hold 06:45.770 --> 06:55.455 [SPEAKER_00]: It's a problem, you know, so declaring war, you know, against black led cities and states, Maryland, Baltimore within Maryland, Chicago, right? 06:55.475 --> 06:57.536 [SPEAKER_00]: We see what's going on there. 06:59.177 --> 07:02.358 [SPEAKER_00]: And the attempt to try to occupy Chicago. 07:02.398 --> 07:03.899 [SPEAKER_00]: That's that's one major thing. 07:04.959 --> 07:05.420 [SPEAKER_00]: The attack. 07:06.280 --> 07:18.750 [SPEAKER_00]: specifically against black women, where the data and how shows over 300,000 black women have lost their jobs, due to federal firings, not only that, but that trickles down into all the different arenas. 07:19.150 --> 07:20.151 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm in that number. 07:21.932 --> 07:29.097 [SPEAKER_00]: And so just the ubiquity of that attack on black women, specifically, 07:35.222 --> 07:36.382 [SPEAKER_00]: even touching it a bit. 07:36.502 --> 07:42.564 [SPEAKER_00]: And I really didn't just just, you're just to think that I just didn't think the work that I did actually was D. I wasn't. 07:42.824 --> 07:45.904 [SPEAKER_00]: Personally, I didn't wouldn't have put it in that short category. 07:45.944 --> 07:48.005 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't think people really know a D. I. Yeah. 07:48.165 --> 07:51.826 [SPEAKER_03]: And I, and I. So, but really the way that it's used by the administration, just a catch-up. 07:51.866 --> 07:55.666 [SPEAKER_03]: I think that's what it was like equity, dignity, or other groups as well. 07:56.046 --> 08:02.968 [SPEAKER_03]: So, I just think that that phrase, you know, which I catch is it's being used that way, which is one of the most fascinating ways in which 08:03.748 --> 08:15.615 [SPEAKER_03]: The oppressive system has been functioning for the last several years is the collapsing of language outside of its field and then reworking the language to its agenda, which is why I've been pretty dogmatic about terms have to stay in their field. 08:16.635 --> 08:17.977 [SPEAKER_03]: Because you can see what happened. 08:18.017 --> 08:20.399 [SPEAKER_00]: We have done since the beginning of Tuesday. 08:20.419 --> 08:22.301 [SPEAKER_00]: We have been true to this like matters. 08:22.541 --> 08:29.607 [SPEAKER_00]: That's we've been true to that You met well, you mentioned the impacts of really the big beautiful bill, which I call the big ugly bill. 08:29.768 --> 08:37.435 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, which is going to this already having impacts on people losing medical care health care and again in that number 08:37.735 --> 08:58.028 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, if you have, if you get anything from the medical exchange through Obamacate, any, if you're paying for your own medical insurance, that will impact you whether you're on Medicaid, Medicare, or you're paying out of pocket for your own, that's going to impact you, and may already be impacting you. 08:58.128 --> 09:00.329 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, many things are set up for to have it in 26 right now. 09:02.030 --> 09:03.692 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, the tariffs, right? 09:03.732 --> 09:07.835 [SPEAKER_00]: We have the tariffs, the impacts of our groceries going up. 09:08.316 --> 09:08.956 [SPEAKER_00]: What do you mean? 09:09.016 --> 09:09.677 [SPEAKER_00]: That's got better. 09:12.328 --> 09:15.889 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, and so things are just, yeah, it's, it's a lot. 09:15.970 --> 09:18.150 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, and then of course, they attack on CDC. 09:18.911 --> 09:24.013 [SPEAKER_00]: And I age, and so we have all manner of pestilence and diseases in the land. 09:24.193 --> 09:28.395 [SPEAKER_00]: Plagues, plagues, COVID is, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's giving plagues in the land. 09:28.415 --> 09:29.815 [SPEAKER_03]: It's giving plagues in the land. 09:29.855 --> 09:32.216 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm not, it's not literally the old testament plagues. 09:32.276 --> 09:39.139 [SPEAKER_03]: However, walk with me in this journey of what happens when you have, when you have unrepentant fairoughs, sometimes you get plagues. 09:39.319 --> 09:42.361 [SPEAKER_00]: We can get there in a New York minute. 09:43.082 --> 09:52.769 [SPEAKER_00]: So I mean, seriously, so we don't, you know, I just think, and I guess part of it is that it is stormy outside, but it still feels like, 09:54.074 --> 09:55.395 [SPEAKER_00]: the beginnings of a storm. 09:55.455 --> 09:59.899 [SPEAKER_00]: You know when the the cloud cover is coming in, the clouds are darkening. 09:59.959 --> 10:00.299 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. 10:00.640 --> 10:06.825 [SPEAKER_00]: There's a little, this little drops of rain, but the directional down poor hasn't quite started yet. 10:06.905 --> 10:12.590 [SPEAKER_00]: And it's so wild because we just named a whole bunch of stuff, but we didn't even name the totality of every night. 10:12.790 --> 10:12.991 [SPEAKER_00]: Right? 10:13.031 --> 10:20.017 [SPEAKER_00]: The isolationist politics that are happening, where we're isolated and so now, now India and China and Russia all banning together. 10:20.577 --> 10:22.198 [SPEAKER_00]: He's liled. 10:23.039 --> 10:29.663 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, I guess in the ways in which we're isolated, it's just as a while time to be living within the empire and having it fall in real time. 10:31.224 --> 10:34.526 [SPEAKER_00]: And I believe the empire actually does have to fall in Jesus today. 10:36.108 --> 10:40.571 [SPEAKER_00]: But the way that it's going down is just, it didn't have to be this way. 10:40.951 --> 10:41.391 [SPEAKER_00]: Sure. 10:41.511 --> 10:42.452 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, people chose this. 10:43.906 --> 10:46.248 [SPEAKER_00]: And that's where we are, for sure, for sure. 10:46.268 --> 10:59.221 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, I think also the winds also include the way that people are thinking about their neighbor and their responsibility to their neighbor or lack of responsibility to their neighbor. 10:59.501 --> 11:00.342 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah. 11:00.762 --> 11:05.026 [SPEAKER_03]: I think there's a way in which social media, the psychology of it, 11:06.647 --> 11:19.835 [SPEAKER_03]: If everything from social media to dating apps to just the rhetoric that is just all over the place is kind of giving people permission, not to care, not to see people's humanity. 11:19.935 --> 11:20.155 [SPEAKER_03]: Yes. 11:21.436 --> 11:26.778 [SPEAKER_03]: So, obviously, you have the governmental dynamic that we just described in his implications on the country and so much more. 11:27.219 --> 11:32.942 [SPEAKER_03]: But I would say that that is also being expressed through not just the government, but individuals. 11:34.182 --> 11:35.963 [SPEAKER_03]: that there's like, there can be a coldness. 11:37.523 --> 11:38.743 [SPEAKER_03]: That's just downright shocking. 11:39.223 --> 11:45.785 [SPEAKER_03]: Even just from like a, you know, it took a purely evolutionary standpoint, a secular evolutionary standpoint, you know, humans are interdependent. 11:45.865 --> 11:50.566 [SPEAKER_03]: And so it is not in our best interest to disregard other people. 11:51.046 --> 11:55.607 [SPEAKER_03]: And I'm talking about the moral ethical, the moral chain we're made out of. 11:55.627 --> 12:00.088 [SPEAKER_03]: But each other, I'm just saying this in general, it's just not a good path to go down. 12:00.608 --> 12:03.029 [SPEAKER_03]: And yet kind of the Western hyper-independence, 12:03.669 --> 12:20.857 [SPEAKER_03]: has gone, it's going, it's full course of deception, and, and we're seeing that it just, it does not hold up, but you actually have to care about other people, and in not caring about other people, you ultimately put yourself in a very vulnerable position. 12:20.877 --> 12:21.037 [SPEAKER_03]: Sure. 12:21.817 --> 12:24.878 [SPEAKER_03]: I think we see that taking place as well. 12:24.918 --> 12:39.741 [SPEAKER_03]: We see the church, the church has been, and this is not just a new under this current political presidential administration, but long before this, I just think that as a long standing history of the church and politics throughout the world. 12:41.141 --> 12:47.702 [SPEAKER_03]: But if we think about more modern history, I think we have been seeing just the erosion 12:51.863 --> 12:53.884 [SPEAKER_03]: with visible church in the United States. 12:54.005 --> 12:59.628 [SPEAKER_03]: It's a prophetic voice and the prophetic voice of the church has always been a minority element of the prophetic voice. 12:59.648 --> 13:05.132 [SPEAKER_03]: It's never the majority of the church has never been the prophetic arm of the church. 13:05.192 --> 13:06.393 [SPEAKER_03]: It's always been a small group. 13:06.893 --> 13:13.938 [SPEAKER_03]: With that being said, I think that there is such a wounding that has taken place if people have responded to their wounding. 13:14.838 --> 13:27.567 [SPEAKER_03]: in a variety of ways, and some downright angry with God, some they're all in the entire faith the way, some embarrassed by their allegiance and their heritage of white evangelicalism. 13:28.127 --> 13:36.533 [SPEAKER_03]: So people are working out their stuff in different ways that it really exposes what were your roots and to begin with. 13:36.713 --> 13:37.094 [SPEAKER_03]: That's right. 13:37.937 --> 13:42.418 [SPEAKER_03]: So that when this storm comes, what are you, what are you tethered to, what is anchoring you to begin with? 13:42.958 --> 13:52.740 [SPEAKER_03]: And so I think, I think for us, as we think about being steady in the storm, it really matters, your anchor and what you believe really, really matters. 13:52.780 --> 14:03.142 [SPEAKER_03]: And my, my, you know, we've talked about, if Donald Trump could cause me to doubt the love, the historicity, the redemptive power of Jesus, 14:04.125 --> 14:06.449 [SPEAKER_03]: That's just not, for me, that's just not going to happen. 14:08.092 --> 14:14.543 [SPEAKER_03]: If Donald Trump's supporters could cause me to doubt the promises of God, that's right. 14:15.044 --> 14:16.566 [SPEAKER_03]: Whoa, couldn't ever happen. 14:17.932 --> 14:30.857 [SPEAKER_03]: But I do know that there are people who are so wounded and hurt and legitimately injured by Trumpism, family members and all kinds of dynamics that they were like, let's throw up this whole thing away. 14:31.557 --> 14:39.160 [SPEAKER_03]: And some of that, they probably should throw away into the extent that Trump is a representative of their Christianity, which is a fake Christianity that has no power to save. 14:39.761 --> 14:45.883 [SPEAKER_03]: But for those of us who never were connected to a Trumpian Christianity that fake religion anyway, 14:46.223 --> 14:46.823 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's a myth. 14:47.304 --> 14:49.385 [SPEAKER_03]: It's an absolute myth. 14:49.705 --> 14:51.186 [SPEAKER_03]: It is a idolatry. 14:52.166 --> 14:53.667 [SPEAKER_03]: It, you know, it's distorted. 14:53.687 --> 15:01.632 [SPEAKER_03]: It is designed to do the very thing that it is doing to separate, kill, to destroy, to end your people and to create this divisiveness. 15:01.692 --> 15:07.936 [SPEAKER_03]: But I think that to be steady in the storm is to know what you actually are being rooted in. 15:08.496 --> 15:09.637 [SPEAKER_03]: So it's a revealing time. 15:10.557 --> 15:11.598 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I couldn't. 15:13.298 --> 15:14.059 [SPEAKER_00]: It could never happen. 15:14.619 --> 15:15.299 [SPEAKER_00]: It could never be. 15:15.700 --> 15:17.220 [SPEAKER_00]: There's some things that I know that could never be. 15:18.301 --> 15:20.902 [SPEAKER_00]: And it's not because it depends on me, it's because it all goes within me. 15:20.942 --> 15:22.243 [SPEAKER_00]: You better know it's by grace. 15:22.303 --> 15:22.563 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. 15:22.583 --> 15:31.127 [SPEAKER_00]: But I could say it could never be that Mike Johnson or HECF or Bondi or any of those wicked individuals who can be away. 15:33.028 --> 15:36.412 [SPEAKER_00]: for the brown skin Palestinian Jewish God, man, Jesus Christ. 15:36.672 --> 15:41.538 [SPEAKER_00]: City at the right hand of God, the Father right now, interceding for me now, could never happen. 15:41.939 --> 15:45.283 [SPEAKER_00]: Because my faith, our faith, we are not, we don't have the same faith. 15:46.043 --> 15:48.526 [SPEAKER_00]: They do not believe in that God. 15:49.047 --> 15:50.309 [SPEAKER_00]: Go to God of the Bible. 15:50.669 --> 15:51.350 [SPEAKER_00]: That is not the same. 15:51.370 --> 15:53.092 [SPEAKER_00]: It's, you can never, pull me away. 15:53.312 --> 15:55.293 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it was your faith in whiteness. 15:55.533 --> 15:56.574 [SPEAKER_00]: That's what you got to ask yourself. 15:57.014 --> 16:00.576 [SPEAKER_00]: Or was it truly in the yet alive? 16:01.256 --> 16:03.938 [SPEAKER_00]: Brownskin, Palestinian, Jewish God, man. 16:03.978 --> 16:06.499 [SPEAKER_00]: Jesus Christ, that's the question you need to answer. 16:06.779 --> 16:09.661 [SPEAKER_00]: See, so all time religion, I'm good with all the time religion. 16:09.861 --> 16:12.262 [SPEAKER_00]: But as you said, who's all the time religion? 16:12.422 --> 16:17.486 [SPEAKER_03]: Is it, yeah, I was saying earlier, is it, is it, is it Harriet Tubman's religion or is it the Tubman plantation owners religion? 16:17.526 --> 16:26.093 [SPEAKER_03]: And so, I think, for those of us who are rooting for something that it's substantive, the Bible in the Bible is the old saints and slaves, things used to say. 16:26.633 --> 16:35.741 [SPEAKER_03]: This is just very different, and it's almost like, I think it should be revolution, I don't think it should be revelatory, but it's almost like, like you know, and I represent the real Christianity. 16:36.261 --> 16:38.224 [SPEAKER_03]: So people will get to say, like, oh, here's those Christians. 16:38.244 --> 16:40.706 [SPEAKER_03]: They get, I'm like, do you know what they really are? 16:40.746 --> 16:41.868 [SPEAKER_03]: Do we really believe it? 16:42.188 --> 16:42.629 [SPEAKER_03]: It's not. 16:42.969 --> 16:44.691 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, it's just, and it's, wow. 16:44.771 --> 16:49.457 [SPEAKER_03]: And I don't say that to say that nothing separates us from the love of God. 16:49.477 --> 16:54.082 [SPEAKER_03]: So I'm not saying that I think that one a person's sin alone. 16:54.963 --> 16:57.084 [SPEAKER_03]: We'll snatch them out of God's saving hands. 16:57.104 --> 16:59.345 [SPEAKER_03]: So I'm not saying they're else we would all be snatched out. 16:59.765 --> 17:20.412 [SPEAKER_03]: But I am saying to give the entire faith, the faith in which there are martyrs, never where there have been great sacrifices, the faith that got us over, the faith that gave people some bodyness and identity in a world that said they were less than human to give that over and to say that the representatives of the faith of Jesus Christ are these people. 17:26.935 --> 17:34.763 [SPEAKER_03]: But it also shows the power of her in pain and the way that it distorts our lenses and that we're looking for something in someone to blame. 17:35.524 --> 17:43.351 [SPEAKER_03]: But the source of my strength is the Lord and so I think that is causing me to just that I mean I feel like there needs to be just like we got a press pause. 17:44.052 --> 18:02.629 [SPEAKER_03]: So you and I have had the experience of working in the world of the faith and justice work for a long time over a decade yeah and I was for me I was even longer than that and I would say that it whether it's in higher end or in church spaces or nonprofits and we have seen at the 18:03.510 --> 18:04.852 [SPEAKER_03]: And some of this is very reasonable, right? 18:04.912 --> 18:09.977 [SPEAKER_03]: As we grow as we experience, as we grow deeper or as life happens, people shift and change. 18:10.218 --> 18:13.181 [SPEAKER_03]: The theological views, their worldviews, right? 18:13.201 --> 18:14.703 [SPEAKER_03]: They're sense of self and identity. 18:14.823 --> 18:16.765 [SPEAKER_03]: All of that is very reasonable. 18:17.386 --> 18:22.351 [SPEAKER_03]: But I would say, particularly in the last decade, under the two Trump administration. 18:24.314 --> 18:33.890 [SPEAKER_03]: I have seen such a great falling away or revealing, yes, you know, in a way that feels unique, it feels 18:35.697 --> 18:40.380 [SPEAKER_03]: Some of it feels clarifying, because maybe they fell away from something that was a fake religion to begin with. 18:40.800 --> 18:56.371 [SPEAKER_03]: But some of it definitely feels like a spiritual attack, because people weren't able to sort out the difference in those Christianity's, the one in which is reflective of Jesus, the truth Jesus that you described. 18:56.431 --> 19:00.814 [SPEAKER_03]: And so we know of many beloved people and 19:01.834 --> 19:04.237 [SPEAKER_03]: to the point where we are asked that question. 19:04.277 --> 19:05.218 [SPEAKER_03]: Like, no, where are you at? 19:05.318 --> 19:07.781 [SPEAKER_03]: Like, you know, have you shifted? 19:07.801 --> 19:09.342 [SPEAKER_03]: And I'm like, I just want to be clear with you. 19:10.584 --> 19:13.347 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm not shifting out of the Lord Jesus Christ. 19:13.387 --> 19:20.475 [SPEAKER_03]: Like, I mean, if anything, the last decade has shown me how much I need the Lord. 19:20.575 --> 19:21.996 [SPEAKER_03]: I feel like I have locked in. 19:23.292 --> 19:27.073 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I'm like, oh, I mean, what's happening? 19:27.153 --> 19:30.214 [SPEAKER_03]: Like locked in in a much deeper way in my faith. 19:30.834 --> 19:37.315 [SPEAKER_03]: And I don't mean like an eligolic sort of way, but I do mean in a way that is boundary, that is that is that is that fast, that is focused. 19:37.355 --> 19:40.316 [SPEAKER_03]: And and honors the disciplines and development of the faith. 19:41.596 --> 19:44.097 [SPEAKER_03]: In light of what I'm seeing in the world, it hasn't pulled me away. 19:44.157 --> 19:46.477 [SPEAKER_03]: It's pulled me closer to God's throne. 19:46.517 --> 19:48.058 [SPEAKER_03]: And how would you respond to that? 19:48.078 --> 19:51.539 [SPEAKER_03]: I know that's a question that you've experienced too from folks like, where are you now? 19:54.000 --> 20:00.024 [SPEAKER_00]: Before I go in there, I think it's important to understand that, you know, we have faith in God, but it's all by God's grace. 20:00.084 --> 20:01.906 [SPEAKER_00]: It's all God's doing, you know what I mean? 20:01.986 --> 20:03.107 [SPEAKER_00]: And we thank God for that. 20:03.167 --> 20:07.290 [SPEAKER_00]: It's not in our own strength, it's not our own self-righteousness, it ain't none of that. 20:08.431 --> 20:14.856 [SPEAKER_00]: And if we just know that God's sovereign hand is upholding us, like we are truly in God's grip, which is good news, you know. 20:22.042 --> 20:26.825 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, where we feel further from God or, you know, our hearts are prone to wonder. 20:26.885 --> 20:27.225 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. 20:27.265 --> 20:30.066 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, a wander and not wonder, although we should be wondering. 20:30.367 --> 20:30.547 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. 20:30.687 --> 20:35.369 [SPEAKER_00]: On God's magnificence, that we know that God is still with us, right? 20:35.389 --> 20:41.272 [SPEAKER_00]: And still keeping us and we're producing fruit that it's in keeping with repentance, all by God's grace. 20:41.292 --> 20:43.113 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, I want to say that. 20:43.194 --> 20:46.235 [SPEAKER_00]: But, yeah, you know, people have asked me that. 20:46.255 --> 20:48.937 [SPEAKER_00]: And I go, I feel like I've been very clear on Tuesday, 20:53.025 --> 21:01.767 [SPEAKER_00]: on spiritual disciplines and the importance of staying in a narrow way and I am even more just like you more convinced of the need of that. 21:01.807 --> 21:15.810 [SPEAKER_00]: So if anything, a lot of my spiritual disciplines have tightened up for instance, you know, I really felt a true um, um, function from the Holy Spirit this year to begin to incorporate more fasting, which is not my favorite to support. 21:15.830 --> 21:16.430 [SPEAKER_00]: My wife, 21:17.679 --> 21:18.679 [SPEAKER_00]: right. 21:18.739 --> 21:20.060 [SPEAKER_00]: But that's exactly why I need to do it. 21:21.421 --> 21:23.681 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, seriously, that's exactly why I need to do it, right? 21:23.722 --> 21:35.826 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, so that the spirit, you know, can really, I can just be much more into the spirit and more dependent on the spirit and not, so I'm not letting my belly meet my, my guide, right? 21:36.467 --> 21:36.787 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, my. 21:37.767 --> 21:38.808 [SPEAKER_00]: So turn down my plate. 21:39.469 --> 21:41.511 [SPEAKER_00]: I felt that that conviction to do that. 21:41.551 --> 22:00.428 [SPEAKER_00]: That's just an example, you know, when I felt like I need to do more of that Because I actually feel like the spiritual warfare is very thick And 2025 Right, not to say it wasn't thick in 2015 and 2016 because it was thick then to under the first regime But it's even 22:01.629 --> 22:02.630 [SPEAKER_00]: much bigger now. 22:02.730 --> 22:12.162 [SPEAKER_00]: And I think that things are just, it's very truly perilous times, you know, and so when that happens, we have got to be in tune. 22:12.203 --> 22:19.252 [SPEAKER_00]: I think that we have to be more in step what the Lord is telling us to do because our systems are archaving. 22:20.033 --> 22:22.574 [SPEAKER_00]: when things are literally political systems. 22:22.695 --> 22:25.716 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, political systems are caving and truly under attack. 22:26.357 --> 22:28.958 [SPEAKER_00]: Being dismantled before our very eyes. 22:29.098 --> 22:29.598 [SPEAKER_00]: Sure. 22:29.658 --> 22:38.844 [SPEAKER_00]: And so we don't have any of those little systems and those protections that we relied upon as you can see are just not there anymore. 22:40.164 --> 22:46.588 [SPEAKER_00]: And I guess that in some ways it's conflicting in that, where we really were relying on God, the way we thought we were then. 22:47.068 --> 23:02.772 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, or we rely on the systems that we've grown accustomed to, and so that's that's a component conviction, but it's like, okay, we really got to know what God is leading us to do in every situation and being able to move, because I know one thing when you're walking with the Lord, you got to be, you have to be agile. 23:03.373 --> 23:12.115 [SPEAKER_00]: I think in the in the in the kingdom, there is obedience, but agility, because God will tell you to move to a place that you know not. 23:12.195 --> 23:12.955 [SPEAKER_00]: God will tell you, 23:15.936 --> 23:18.377 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, okay, that was the season. 23:18.557 --> 23:19.297 [SPEAKER_00]: We're done with that. 23:19.617 --> 23:21.878 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm moving you here and it's like, well, how do you really? 23:22.158 --> 23:25.939 [SPEAKER_00]: But you have to be able to move and have the ability to be obedient to that. 23:25.959 --> 23:32.600 [SPEAKER_00]: And so my theology, it really hasn't shifted. 23:32.660 --> 23:34.781 [SPEAKER_00]: If anything, it's tightened up a bit. 23:35.221 --> 23:37.642 [SPEAKER_00]: I think if you want to think about, 23:39.966 --> 23:48.370 [SPEAKER_00]: not genderals, I don't know, say that way, but, you know, the priesthood of believers, you know, that were a profit-free sinking. 23:48.650 --> 23:53.672 [SPEAKER_00]: I think that's come through much more strongly in that woman's ordination. 23:53.692 --> 24:02.917 [SPEAKER_00]: I see that in the text now, whereas before when I first started seminary, I did not, you know, and so that's something that's shifted for me. 24:03.457 --> 24:05.118 [SPEAKER_00]: That's the only thing that I can see that's 24:08.279 --> 24:17.719 [SPEAKER_00]: I pray your disciplines, praying in the spirit, that's come back, you know, like that's something that I've recovered, like we got to pray in the spirit. 24:19.177 --> 24:20.097 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, fascinating. 24:20.117 --> 24:25.679 [SPEAKER_00]: So in some ways, I'm actually pulling back more on my, I'm pulling more deeply into my penicostal. 24:26.119 --> 24:27.520 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, you are roots actually. 24:27.560 --> 24:30.781 [SPEAKER_00]: I find that to be much more true for me. 24:31.041 --> 24:43.226 [SPEAKER_00]: And since I've done that, and it's been recent, but as of like the last couple months, right, in prison, I felt like I'm hearing God much more clearly, um, even in the midst, and I am in a storm. 24:43.666 --> 24:44.266 [SPEAKER_00]: Bless be clear. 24:44.626 --> 24:47.668 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm standing in the storm on multiple levels. 24:48.649 --> 24:52.712 [SPEAKER_00]: But I do have my joy, and that's because Jesus is my anchor for real for real. 24:52.752 --> 24:55.374 [SPEAKER_00]: Like him, he's standing me in the storm. 24:55.414 --> 24:58.416 [SPEAKER_00]: And so I've been able, and he's been speaking to me in so many different ways. 24:58.637 --> 25:04.381 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, through sermons, straight up, just through the word, you know, of sending profited words through other people. 25:06.062 --> 25:11.487 [SPEAKER_00]: So I'm just, yeah, I'm trying to, I think I answered that comprehensively, but those are the things that I'm seeing. 25:11.527 --> 25:18.172 [SPEAKER_00]: And so in some ways, I guess I'm a bit surprised, although I should not, be surprised about the falling away of people. 25:18.472 --> 25:22.836 [SPEAKER_00]: It saddens me, even though Jesus already told us that what happened is still sad to watch it. 25:23.276 --> 25:27.239 [SPEAKER_00]: But I'm also kind of shocked that I'm like, don't you all, y'all can't. 25:28.000 --> 25:29.962 [SPEAKER_00]: You guys can't see the times, you know what I mean? 25:30.002 --> 25:32.964 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, like, Sun's the sense of inshikar and knowing what to do. 25:33.445 --> 25:37.888 [SPEAKER_00]: And I'm like, yeah, this is not the time to be deconstructing and reconstructing. 25:38.509 --> 25:40.070 [SPEAKER_00]: And let's say deconstructing, right? 25:40.150 --> 25:47.176 [SPEAKER_00]: And then ultimately, a lot of them have been deconstructing themselves out of the faith, which I said that in the truth table. 25:47.456 --> 25:47.616 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. 25:47.656 --> 25:50.399 [SPEAKER_00]: Book in the decolonized discipleship, book in people got mad. 25:50.419 --> 25:53.942 [SPEAKER_00]: But I'm like, that's what happened when you start to tear a thunder. 25:55.303 --> 26:03.650 [SPEAKER_00]: The foundations of the faith, the virgin birth, you know, the bodily resurrection when you start to tear apart all of those things. 26:04.751 --> 26:08.814 [SPEAKER_00]: Eventually you're not going to have a faith that's going to anchor you or to hope to you. 26:10.255 --> 26:11.677 [SPEAKER_00]: And that it just, it's Adams me. 26:12.991 --> 26:22.115 [SPEAKER_00]: But before we continue, because I want to hear a little bit more about how you feel, how you're being studied, you know, what that looks like. 26:22.815 --> 26:28.537 [SPEAKER_00]: I want me to take a quick commercial break and then when we come back, we don't still talk about the estate in the store. 26:28.717 --> 26:29.097 [SPEAKER_00]: Help. 26:30.818 --> 26:31.378 [SPEAKER_00]: Don't go nowhere. 26:35.601 --> 26:45.070 [SPEAKER_02]: Our NAACP Image Award-nominated book, Truth Table, Black Women's Musings on Life, Love, and Liberation is making waves and shifting culture. 26:45.851 --> 26:53.137 [SPEAKER_02]: I close this book feeling like I had just partaken in a multi-course meal, filled with grace and the courage to carry on. 26:54.018 --> 26:56.962 [SPEAKER_02]: and I believe you'll finish this book feeling the same way. 26:57.643 --> 27:00.007 [SPEAKER_02]: Morgan Harper Nichols artists in Poet. 27:00.548 --> 27:07.558 [SPEAKER_02]: By Truth's Table, black women's musings on life-loving liberation at our website or wherever books are sold. 27:09.254 --> 27:14.575 [SPEAKER_01]: As you can see, we're not good for asking for money, but we are asking for money today, and here's why. 27:14.956 --> 27:18.877 [SPEAKER_01]: In order for us to bring the concept that we've been bringing to you for years at this point. 27:18.937 --> 27:26.599 [SPEAKER_01]: Eight years, we've got a whole background of folks who are talented and gifted and loving people who we have to pay to make these things happen. 27:26.999 --> 27:30.440 [SPEAKER_01]: As well as ourselves, and we want to keep bringing great content to you. 27:30.760 --> 27:33.120 [SPEAKER_01]: We are in a desert of truth. 27:33.360 --> 27:36.321 [SPEAKER_01]: Right now, there seems to be lots of lies happening 27:39.102 --> 27:39.883 [SPEAKER_01]: promoting security. 27:40.363 --> 27:45.808 [SPEAKER_01]: In any way, shape reform, we invite you to partner with your staple and become one of our Patreon supporters. 27:45.988 --> 27:52.053 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, actually when you become a support, you actually get the episodes a couple days before the rest of the world. 27:52.173 --> 27:56.476 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, you get speak to, you know, of course, communicate with us. 27:56.496 --> 27:58.097 [SPEAKER_00]: Let us know your thoughts about that episode. 27:58.438 --> 28:03.782 [SPEAKER_00]: And of course, we will be having some more private discussions about things going on in pop culture. 28:08.826 --> 28:10.988 [SPEAKER_00]: Nothing's been in my imagination, nothing to say. 28:11.028 --> 28:12.168 [SPEAKER_00]: We'll be talking about the things. 28:12.188 --> 28:16.671 [SPEAKER_00]: So I'd like to join our community today, and thank you for your for sitting at the table with us all these years. 28:17.172 --> 28:17.532 [SPEAKER_00]: Bye, y'all. 28:18.032 --> 28:22.716 [SPEAKER_00]: All right, and we are back at the table, talking about steady in the storm. 28:24.997 --> 28:25.137 [SPEAKER_00]: So. 28:27.720 --> 28:28.441 [SPEAKER_00]: What's the song about it? 28:28.461 --> 28:28.781 [SPEAKER_00]: Good head. 28:29.381 --> 28:30.342 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay. 28:30.462 --> 28:31.123 [SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, how? 28:31.443 --> 28:33.324 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, yeah, what is your anchoring look like? 28:33.444 --> 28:34.585 [SPEAKER_00]: What has that look like? 28:34.625 --> 28:37.968 [SPEAKER_00]: How has your theology shifted and evolved in some ways? 28:37.988 --> 28:39.208 [SPEAKER_00]: What does that look like? 28:39.729 --> 28:48.155 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, I would say that I think I have a deeper sense, a lived sense and appreciation for, 28:50.645 --> 29:05.048 [SPEAKER_03]: the nearness of God, and one that I feel like I've returned to, it's not that I didn't think that when I, in terms of my early development in the face, but I think it's a returning to that. 29:05.068 --> 29:11.010 [SPEAKER_03]: So when you talk about Pinocostalism, I mean, there's obviously the doctrinal and theological elements of Pinocostalism, but I would say, 29:11.870 --> 29:17.398 [SPEAKER_03]: At the bottom, you know, and I obviously put the castle scholars feel free to share your thoughts. 29:17.518 --> 29:25.870 [SPEAKER_03]: Sure, and I know some great ones, but is that one of the things that the Pentecostal tradition emphasizes is the the nearness of God. 29:27.412 --> 29:30.615 [SPEAKER_03]: and so much so an embodiment of the nearness of God. 29:30.735 --> 29:36.640 [SPEAKER_03]: So we talk about the fruit of a spirit and spiritual gifts that is that is an expression of how close God is. 29:37.001 --> 29:42.986 [SPEAKER_03]: Whereas there are other traditions who think more about the transcendence of God so that thinking of distance standpoint. 29:44.067 --> 29:45.128 [SPEAKER_03]: And that's sovereignty. 29:45.848 --> 30:03.122 [SPEAKER_03]: And it's all true, and I would say that it's all of the above, and so I think I have a deep appreciation and sense and a longing for the nearness of God, the presence of God, the work of God, visibly, I feel like. 30:03.882 --> 30:06.744 [SPEAKER_03]: I feel like God's word is just, it's just true. 30:07.164 --> 30:13.067 [SPEAKER_03]: So I think for some people, what has happened is there's been a breach in their trust in their confidence. 30:13.607 --> 30:22.712 [SPEAKER_03]: Some people have just been straight of embarrassment because the religious tradition that they associate it with has been incredibly disappointed and, you know, dishonorable and many, many ways. 30:22.752 --> 30:24.353 [SPEAKER_03]: And so, so it's kind of like, okay, let me, 30:24.713 --> 30:25.373 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm embarrassed. 30:25.473 --> 30:27.534 [SPEAKER_03]: Let me peel back all this stuff, right? 30:28.094 --> 30:30.255 [SPEAKER_03]: And because some things have been absolutely embarrassing. 30:31.295 --> 30:40.318 [SPEAKER_03]: But I think for me, you know, I don't carry shame related to the church of my origin story. 30:42.659 --> 30:44.480 [SPEAKER_03]: And I don't think that church has to be perfect. 30:45.322 --> 30:56.454 [SPEAKER_03]: for me to not carry shame, but I would say just generally speaking, the tradition around understanding that Jesus is a God of justice, like I didn't have to, I didn't, that was not a revelation for me. 30:57.235 --> 30:59.097 [SPEAKER_03]: It actually was more revelatory to me. 31:01.179 --> 31:02.719 [SPEAKER_03]: not many in belief, but in shock. 31:03.120 --> 31:15.202 [SPEAKER_03]: But when I was in my 20s and later, and I realized that there were entire Christian traditions who thought the opposite, that you had to make a apologetic case that guy cares about justice, that we will be a hell, the countable in that regard. 31:15.242 --> 31:19.563 [SPEAKER_03]: So to me, that was like, that's obvious, like Sunday school read to me. 31:20.124 --> 31:28.746 [SPEAKER_03]: And so I don't, I think for people who that was not, the case, I think that they were invited into a deeper understanding, but I think also for some folks 31:30.986 --> 31:35.467 [SPEAKER_03]: experience of Jesus, then there was a particular I think vulnerability there too. 31:35.767 --> 31:41.889 [SPEAKER_03]: And so I think the anchoring has also been and that I take community very seriously. 31:41.949 --> 31:43.309 [SPEAKER_03]: I think Christian community matters. 31:43.929 --> 31:56.832 [SPEAKER_03]: And while I think it is good and right that we have friends and people who we do life with who are of a variety of backgrounds different than our own so we can learn from and be sharpened 32:01.154 --> 32:06.700 [SPEAKER_03]: a community of devout believers that can tell me something about myself and about God. 32:07.181 --> 32:08.442 [SPEAKER_03]: That's a non-negotiable. 32:08.762 --> 32:17.312 [SPEAKER_03]: And if you look at people's communities, if you look at who you surround yourself with, it's just a matter of time because we sound like our community. 32:18.627 --> 32:24.696 [SPEAKER_03]: And even if you despise your community for some reason, you will still be there. 32:24.736 --> 32:33.509 [SPEAKER_03]: People out there, you will still invite even if not the beliefs you'll invite embody the methodology of that community. 32:34.050 --> 32:48.075 [SPEAKER_03]: So you can have people who are like, I don't believe like such and such believes, but the way they hold their new positions has the same energy, the same ethics, the same demands, the same strategies as the former community they were part of. 32:48.095 --> 32:51.336 [SPEAKER_03]: So the so the doctrine has changed, but the delivery has not. 32:51.676 --> 32:57.981 [SPEAKER_03]: Because it's very hard for us to be different than whatever we're being cooked in baked-in-shaked-in. 32:58.041 --> 32:58.902 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I'm not sure, community. 32:59.242 --> 33:08.710 [SPEAKER_03]: And so for me, it is just incredibly important that I have friends, community members, people who I do ministry work with, that are devout believers. 33:08.790 --> 33:14.314 [SPEAKER_03]: If we are doing ministry work, in Jesus' name, then we believe Jesus' word. 33:14.935 --> 33:17.857 [SPEAKER_03]: And we submit ourselves to Jesus' ethics for us. 33:18.377 --> 33:19.778 [SPEAKER_03]: And if God begs, 33:20.739 --> 33:22.041 [SPEAKER_03]: God can tell us. 33:22.842 --> 33:24.785 [SPEAKER_03]: God can tell us this way or that way. 33:24.945 --> 33:26.007 [SPEAKER_03]: I guess or no. 33:26.628 --> 33:29.692 [SPEAKER_03]: And I always go back to the Genesis narrative. 33:29.813 --> 33:34.760 [SPEAKER_03]: We have Adam and Eve in this place that is designed for their flourishing. 33:35.681 --> 33:43.727 [SPEAKER_03]: It is a place in which they have been given vocational identity and work to do together in equity and mutuality and respect. 33:43.887 --> 33:54.134 [SPEAKER_03]: All of that's on the table and they have one rule because in following that one rule they're able to demonstrate God, I choose you over this and life would have been conferred to them. 33:54.995 --> 33:55.395 [SPEAKER_03]: Absolutely. 33:55.435 --> 33:56.016 [SPEAKER_03]: Absolutely. 33:56.076 --> 33:56.356 [SPEAKER_03]: Absolutely. 33:56.376 --> 33:57.337 [SPEAKER_03]: I wouldn't have been confirmed. 33:57.417 --> 33:57.537 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah. 33:57.577 --> 34:15.528 [SPEAKER_03]: And so it's so God's commands even now are an opportunity not to be a heavy weight around us, not to be legalistic, not to mock us, but God's commands even now are opportunities to demonstrate to God that we choose God over whatever else. 34:16.563 --> 34:25.369 [SPEAKER_03]: and God has a right to put us in that position because it is in our best interest and our neighbors best interest that we choose God's way to whatever else it is. 34:25.850 --> 34:27.271 [SPEAKER_03]: And so I agree with that. 34:27.831 --> 34:28.952 [SPEAKER_03]: I believe that is true. 34:29.312 --> 34:32.354 [SPEAKER_03]: And I believe the creator can tell the created. 34:33.315 --> 34:34.615 [SPEAKER_03]: how to be be created. 34:34.776 --> 34:39.537 [SPEAKER_03]: I just go figure and even even in our lives are not our own. 34:39.737 --> 34:49.781 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean and even within that there is so much liberty and beauty and creativity and transformation and freedom where we have been set free for freedom, saying. 34:49.821 --> 34:51.341 [SPEAKER_03]: And so I believe that's true. 34:51.381 --> 34:59.424 [SPEAKER_03]: I think while there are God's clear commands, these opportunities to love God and love neighbor through them and also there's great freedom in it. 34:59.984 --> 35:01.485 [SPEAKER_03]: So I have not found 35:03.330 --> 35:12.853 [SPEAKER_03]: I have not despised God's commands, even if I can't fulfill them in my strength, I believe that God is good and just. 35:13.754 --> 35:21.596 [SPEAKER_03]: And I also am grateful that the limitations of my sight and my valuation of how jacked up I think things are. 35:22.156 --> 35:27.218 [SPEAKER_03]: God is wholly impure and has a greater clear and more accurate judgment of the times 35:32.600 --> 35:33.481 [SPEAKER_03]: in due to God's time. 35:33.741 --> 35:34.241 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah. 35:34.522 --> 35:35.302 [SPEAKER_03]: And I do believe that. 35:35.442 --> 35:35.842 [SPEAKER_03]: I believe that. 35:35.862 --> 35:37.824 [SPEAKER_03]: And I do believe that that breaks into here and now. 35:38.284 --> 35:39.365 [SPEAKER_03]: And I grab a hold of it. 35:39.805 --> 35:43.668 [SPEAKER_03]: And it encourages me and it reminds me, okay, God sees. 35:44.249 --> 35:46.110 [SPEAKER_03]: We are witnesses for God's kingdom. 35:46.150 --> 35:47.371 [SPEAKER_03]: But God is our witness. 35:48.071 --> 35:54.074 [SPEAKER_03]: God witnesses everything, every heart's desire, every heartbreak, every bit of confusion, every sorrow, every injustice. 35:54.714 --> 36:09.300 [SPEAKER_03]: And as we think about standing before the judge, God is not only the judge that we stand before, God is the top witness that comes and says, let me tell you with the expert witness that let's see in everything, this is let me tell you the true story. 36:09.920 --> 36:16.463 [SPEAKER_03]: And so you get this image of, let me tell you about a man who told me everything that I've ever done. 36:17.844 --> 36:19.045 [SPEAKER_03]: and has been done to me. 36:19.845 --> 36:25.010 [SPEAKER_03]: Jesus is able to do that on behalf, and to find us pardon because of his finished work. 36:25.290 --> 36:27.231 [SPEAKER_03]: There's no other world system. 36:27.672 --> 36:28.773 [SPEAKER_03]: There's no other religion. 36:29.613 --> 36:31.315 [SPEAKER_03]: There's nothing else quite like that. 36:31.975 --> 36:33.777 [SPEAKER_03]: And I'm going to cling to it. 36:34.437 --> 36:40.099 [SPEAKER_03]: Absolutely, you know, so that is what that is what is rooting me in the midst of a storm. 36:40.159 --> 36:42.500 [SPEAKER_03]: And also, it gives us the ability to name a storm as a storm. 36:42.820 --> 36:44.220 [SPEAKER_03]: Like, we don't have to be delusional. 36:44.460 --> 36:51.242 [SPEAKER_03]: I think that there is a sense in which people think of religious folks as living in a fantasy world, right? 36:51.282 --> 36:54.083 [SPEAKER_03]: So they are other worldly to be no earthly good, right? 36:54.603 --> 37:00.065 [SPEAKER_03]: But, but no, we, we are serious about the fact that God is at work. 37:00.165 --> 37:03.086 [SPEAKER_03]: And so we can name when things are not the way that God calls 37:04.387 --> 37:19.767 [SPEAKER_03]: And so it's not people I think are uncomfortable with the level of lament and how direct even we are with that's jacked up you should not harm people you should not break up families it is cruel and wicked to way outside of an elementary school 37:21.209 --> 37:24.011 [SPEAKER_03]: to to take children away or to figure out who their parents are. 37:24.291 --> 37:25.172 [SPEAKER_03]: That that is cool. 37:25.212 --> 37:29.155 [SPEAKER_03]: And we can definitively say that that is not the way of Christ. 37:29.195 --> 37:30.196 [SPEAKER_03]: Right. 37:30.296 --> 37:35.460 [SPEAKER_03]: It doesn't take a doesn't take a lot of energy to just simply read the sermon on the mount to get the ethics of the kingdom of God. 37:35.680 --> 37:35.840 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah. 37:36.300 --> 37:38.301 [SPEAKER_03]: Um, and so we can name that. 37:38.421 --> 37:44.743 [SPEAKER_03]: And we can also name our own sin or Lord deliver me from from my besetting sin deliver me from myself, right? 37:44.763 --> 37:48.003 [SPEAKER_03]: Just the way the long list, the long list. 37:48.023 --> 37:48.123 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. 37:48.444 --> 37:52.945 [SPEAKER_03]: And and at the same time, be able to say, but I have a hope that has holded me. 37:52.965 --> 37:53.145 [SPEAKER_03]: Mm-hmm. 37:53.925 --> 37:58.966 [SPEAKER_03]: And I think that we have, we have an opportunity to do that in which I think our credibility rest in. 37:59.787 --> 38:04.748 [SPEAKER_03]: We have no credibility as Christians if we cannot name something that's broken when it's broken in front of everybody's face. 38:04.888 --> 38:09.630 [SPEAKER_03]: I just why would anyone choose to trust us or listen to us when we're like, oh, it's okay. 38:09.750 --> 38:10.310 [SPEAKER_03]: It's fine. 38:11.310 --> 38:11.590 [SPEAKER_03]: No, no, no. 38:11.630 --> 38:13.052 [SPEAKER_03]: It's actually really bad. 38:13.072 --> 38:18.075 [SPEAKER_03]: It's, it's, it's actually worse than I actually get myself room in space to talk about. 38:18.656 --> 38:21.658 [SPEAKER_03]: Our current social moment is really very, very bad. 38:21.698 --> 38:22.859 [SPEAKER_03]: It's incredibly toxic. 38:23.360 --> 38:27.003 [SPEAKER_03]: Many people have been harmed and the trajectory looks like it will continue and get worse. 38:27.623 --> 38:34.168 [SPEAKER_03]: And yet, I am trusting in a God who feels more strongly about that than I do because he's truly holy. 38:34.328 --> 38:34.549 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes. 38:35.550 --> 38:37.351 [SPEAKER_03]: and can and is doing something about it. 38:37.651 --> 38:40.692 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, I think what's interesting about that is, Amen. 38:41.472 --> 38:57.019 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, is that it's a two-fold type of situation when you think about, you know, common grace, which is not so difficult, but it's God's grace that we're strains in the world, which is like, I'm sure, right now on Twitter, I was like, this is restraint? 38:57.439 --> 38:58.019 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it is. 38:58.059 --> 38:58.539 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it is. 38:59.019 --> 39:00.060 [SPEAKER_03]: Isn't that the paradigm here? 39:00.160 --> 39:02.561 [SPEAKER_00]: You can get worse and worse and worse. 39:03.141 --> 39:23.050 [SPEAKER_00]: Hello, hello, and so and that even with that common grace and even those of us with disarmament and some of the prophet it gives We can see some things, you know, that even then we're not seeing we see through a glass dimly and we're not even seeing everything right with Talk about God, you know, being the expert 39:23.370 --> 39:24.071 [SPEAKER_00]: witness, right? 39:24.852 --> 39:38.426 [SPEAKER_00]: Um, and just, um, and how much of that, I just wait for the day I have when God will judge, you know, and bring justice for it all for all of this in all the sons committed against us. 39:39.707 --> 39:50.575 [SPEAKER_00]: since that that we've committed, but by God's grace are covered by the blood because we wave this blood state banner we believe in the finished work of Jesus Christ, right? 39:50.616 --> 39:57.681 [SPEAKER_00]: That's how we escape that judgment, but I'll never be ashamed of the gospel of Jesus Christ. 39:57.721 --> 40:00.503 [SPEAKER_00]: I'll never be ashamed of God's judgment. 40:01.504 --> 40:07.047 [SPEAKER_00]: I'll never be ashamed of the implications of God's judgment, which is hell, a literal hell. 40:07.347 --> 40:15.670 [SPEAKER_00]: I will never be ashamed of God's way, his order. 40:15.690 --> 40:19.332 [SPEAKER_00]: I might not always be happy with God's time. 40:20.012 --> 40:20.733 [SPEAKER_00]: Ha! 40:20.853 --> 40:22.014 [SPEAKER_00]: Come on and talk about it. 40:22.534 --> 40:26.818 [SPEAKER_00]: But because patience is rough, it's hard. 40:26.878 --> 40:28.059 [SPEAKER_00]: That's the way for your dad is. 40:28.859 --> 40:29.480 [SPEAKER_00]: Woo! 40:29.620 --> 40:31.982 [SPEAKER_00]: By grace of advice for us, you're going to have to wait on God. 40:33.989 --> 40:35.450 [SPEAKER_00]: You go on the way, Freddie, you like it. 40:35.710 --> 40:38.471 [SPEAKER_00]: Whether you like it or not, and that's the meaning of my name. 40:38.511 --> 40:39.351 [SPEAKER_00]: God, it's time is the best. 40:39.371 --> 40:44.192 [SPEAKER_00]: So you know, okay, that's a fruit that's the work and all of that. 40:44.232 --> 40:45.073 [SPEAKER_00]: That's been working to me. 40:45.133 --> 40:45.813 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, man. 40:46.153 --> 40:51.054 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, but I'll never be ashamed of God's way, God's order. 40:51.795 --> 40:57.596 [SPEAKER_00]: I think it took a lot of time to get there on some particular things in areas in my life. 40:57.616 --> 40:58.497 [SPEAKER_00]: Things have been all right. 40:58.517 --> 41:02.578 [SPEAKER_00]: I think ever since I said, yes, to God, in ministry, things have been 41:03.158 --> 41:03.819 [SPEAKER_00]: Just difficult. 41:03.839 --> 41:15.047 [SPEAKER_00]: But then I looked at the life of I have been looking at the life of David and now I'm first Samuel and yeah into second Samuel and from the time that he got annoying to many finally. 41:16.433 --> 41:28.501 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, over 14 years later, I mean it's as soon as it's a stretch in a hard 14 a hard 14 fighting for his life literally from his father Right, let us all right, who attempted to kill him. 41:28.561 --> 41:32.083 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't know and maybe three times the highest position in power 41:33.524 --> 41:44.051 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, you know, and so I, you just been studying his life, and I was like, wow, really, I mean, good company, you know, because it's actually been 14 years, actually, it's a Lord called me, you know, into ministry. 41:44.071 --> 41:49.695 [SPEAKER_00]: And I was like, I just seeing those parallels and things like that things in the word, in the word, because I believe the word is living inactive. 41:50.535 --> 41:55.419 [SPEAKER_00]: And I still believe in the, in fallibility, in an airancy of the word. 41:56.860 --> 41:58.581 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't care what you all think about that. 41:59.838 --> 42:05.601 [SPEAKER_00]: I believe the guys were just true and having an earth a fast way of the guys were, it wasn't that fast way of that. 42:06.102 --> 42:06.602 [SPEAKER_00]: I believe that. 42:07.242 --> 42:09.124 [SPEAKER_00]: My Bible says, do I have a Bible reader? 42:09.424 --> 42:15.827 [SPEAKER_00]: But you know, I've been taking a lot of refuge and solace in that. 42:16.068 --> 42:23.172 [SPEAKER_00]: And I find a lot of peace in God's judgment, knowing that he will judge sin and people, 42:23.932 --> 42:41.665 [SPEAKER_00]: We'll pay for the consequences of those sent and yet myself as one who is always offering the gospel has an evangelistic type of bet right in that please come come to the come to the wedding banquet y'all 42:42.085 --> 42:50.571 [SPEAKER_00]: your invitation for you, come, come, come, come, come, you know, but only the spirit, you know, can move upon somebody to have them accept, um, accept Christ. 42:50.611 --> 43:00.138 [SPEAKER_00]: I think that to me, that feels much more urgent, continuing to, to preach our gospel to share their gospel to know that this, this God doesn't love me more than He loves you. 43:00.558 --> 43:09.145 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, you know, and that, that's saying off of grace and love and salvation and redemption and deliverance is all available to you. 43:09.346 --> 43:17.713 [SPEAKER_00]: Just as it was, it was and is still available to me, but I'm not more gracious than God. 43:18.413 --> 43:20.974 [SPEAKER_00]: you know, and I'll never judge God's judgment. 43:21.634 --> 43:22.494 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm just not. 43:23.394 --> 43:38.897 [SPEAKER_00]: And you're not going to convince me that wicked people that refuse to repent to turn, wicked people that that continue to attack the oppressed, the least, the lost, the left out will not pay for their sins. 43:38.917 --> 43:39.997 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't believe that. 43:40.478 --> 43:41.538 [SPEAKER_00]: I just don't believe that. 43:41.738 --> 43:41.878 [SPEAKER_00]: And I 43:42.718 --> 43:59.105 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't, I can't worship a God that that does not show up on the behalf of the oppressed, that does not bind themselves to the oppressed, that could, that's just not, that's not the God of the Bible. 44:00.366 --> 44:05.008 [SPEAKER_00]: And I can say that very definitively, you know, Jesus had nowhere to lay his head. 44:06.762 --> 44:08.704 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, he was a man of sorrows. 44:09.124 --> 44:20.814 [SPEAKER_00]: And so I just don't recognize this white capitalistic mythical figure that this white supremacist regime is propping up. 44:20.874 --> 44:22.035 [SPEAKER_00]: It's a life from the pit of hell. 44:22.455 --> 44:33.744 [SPEAKER_00]: And it will be judged if they will not repent, return, and make a reparation for the sins and the harm so they have committed, but they can never ever tear me away. 44:34.565 --> 44:39.149 [SPEAKER_00]: from the thriceholdy god, it's just not possible, because it doesn't, my salvation doesn't depend on me. 44:39.229 --> 44:47.175 [SPEAKER_00]: Thank God to fans on God's grace and power, you know, and so I'm not ashamed. 44:47.295 --> 44:52.599 [SPEAKER_00]: If I was ever ashamed, which I haven't, you know, since I came to faith, I'm not ashamed. 44:52.859 --> 44:53.860 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm definitely not ashamed. 44:54.220 --> 44:54.480 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. 44:54.540 --> 44:56.282 [SPEAKER_00]: Now, you know, and I'm doubling down. 44:56.722 --> 44:58.023 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, double it down. 44:58.203 --> 45:08.613 [SPEAKER_03]: It is a love and adoration and a deep gratitude for the real Jesus that causes you to go, that's not Jesus that you're all talking about. 45:09.854 --> 45:10.674 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, it's really clear. 45:10.855 --> 45:16.259 [SPEAKER_03]: And this, this, whether it's the Jesus who's like, I have nothing to say about how you live. 45:17.175 --> 45:17.576 [SPEAKER_03]: at all. 45:17.856 --> 45:23.922 [SPEAKER_03]: Do your thing because obviously just with them just overflows from you naturally and you'll always make right decisions just trust your gut. 45:24.563 --> 45:25.544 [SPEAKER_03]: That's not your spleen. 45:25.664 --> 45:26.905 [SPEAKER_03]: That's not your spleen. 45:26.945 --> 45:27.326 [SPEAKER_03]: Come on. 45:27.346 --> 45:27.646 [SPEAKER_03]: Come on. 45:27.666 --> 45:28.207 [SPEAKER_03]: Come on. 45:28.247 --> 45:28.647 [SPEAKER_00]: Don't listen. 45:35.174 --> 45:43.479 [SPEAKER_03]: But I think it's being rooted in and walking in the way of Jesus that helps you to see the counterfeit, right? 45:43.539 --> 45:47.662 [SPEAKER_03]: The closer we get to the real, hello, are we got to stay close? 45:47.722 --> 45:51.224 [SPEAKER_03]: You guys, then we're going to have to stay close on Jesus's church. 45:51.264 --> 45:57.788 [SPEAKER_03]: You got to feel it on Jesus actually gets to tell us how, you know, God tells us how God wants to be worshiped. 45:58.868 --> 46:00.569 [SPEAKER_03]: And when we decide, no. 46:02.862 --> 46:04.283 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm gonna do what I want to do. 46:04.623 --> 46:12.569 [SPEAKER_03]: This is strange fire, and there are all kinds of consequences, but one of them is we end up developing a distorted view of who the real Jesus is. 46:12.629 --> 46:16.051 [SPEAKER_03]: And so the counterfits come and we cannot discern that. 46:16.131 --> 46:23.476 [SPEAKER_03]: We are seeing people as trees, we need to continue to be sanctified that we might even see Jesus rightly. 46:23.516 --> 46:24.216 [SPEAKER_03]: And other people. 46:24.736 --> 46:29.199 [SPEAKER_03]: And so I think that is what I have learned in the storm. 46:30.400 --> 46:32.102 [SPEAKER_03]: is that Jesus is with us in the storm. 46:32.182 --> 46:36.566 [SPEAKER_03]: He is well practiced in bringing peace in the midst of storms. 46:37.147 --> 46:46.015 [SPEAKER_03]: Jesus is not intimidated by the circumstances now and there is a type of faith and spiritual resilience that has worked in us as Jesus is with us in the storm. 46:47.256 --> 47:02.970 [SPEAKER_03]: And that is some of the fruit that will come on the other side of this season is that I do believe there will be a maturity and a sober bindedness and a commitment to loving and even knowing how to love our enemies well, we will have that kind of fruit. 47:03.150 --> 47:07.194 [SPEAKER_03]: And for those of us again, godliness with content minutes great. 47:07.374 --> 47:09.516 [SPEAKER_03]: When becoming more like God, 47:10.608 --> 47:14.991 [SPEAKER_03]: in God's character, sacrifice, love and humility is great gain to you. 47:15.711 --> 47:17.472 [SPEAKER_03]: There's a work of the Spirit will get us there. 47:18.152 --> 47:25.997 [SPEAKER_03]: This condition, everything in our life, whether it's the political injustice and instability, whether it's our own heart breaks, illnesses, you name it. 47:26.717 --> 47:30.899 [SPEAKER_03]: All of that stuff, we can name it as bad, we can name it as not the way we would wanted to be. 47:31.520 --> 47:34.381 [SPEAKER_03]: We can name it as, even outside of maybe God's moral will, right? 47:35.102 --> 47:35.222 [SPEAKER_03]: But 47:35.762 --> 47:43.124 [SPEAKER_03]: No matter what it is, it has to bend its knee into conforming into a pathway that makes us more like Jesus. 47:43.144 --> 47:54.906 [SPEAKER_03]: And so come what may, may God's will be done, may God's will be done in us, may God's will be done in the world and in the kingdom of God, so that we come out and we see him looking like him. 47:55.366 --> 47:57.086 [SPEAKER_03]: That's the end of the story for us. 47:57.607 --> 48:03.128 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I think I've been, I think one of the other enclosures in the Holy Mist is, 48:05.289 --> 48:19.361 [SPEAKER_00]: Holiness and it's relationship to justice, you know, and I think in the ways in which we come to church compromises, it's prophetic witness when we cast aside Holiness. 48:20.102 --> 48:27.788 [SPEAKER_00]: Because you, your credibility, to speak prophetically, your credibility to speak true to power, 48:28.929 --> 48:35.055 [SPEAKER_00]: all hangs on your holiness, your whole your integrity, right? 48:35.135 --> 48:41.981 [SPEAKER_00]: How you're living, your private life, you know, is congruent with your public life. 48:42.542 --> 48:48.547 [SPEAKER_00]: What you sign on to, who you associate with, how you live, right? 48:48.567 --> 48:51.110 [SPEAKER_00]: That doesn't mean that you don't make mistakes, you don't send you don't. 48:51.430 --> 48:52.191 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not saying that. 48:52.251 --> 48:53.272 [SPEAKER_00]: You're just not a hypocrite. 48:53.432 --> 48:55.414 [SPEAKER_00]: But you're not even paying your mistakes as much as that. 48:55.434 --> 48:56.455 [SPEAKER_00]: You, yep, exactly. 48:56.495 --> 48:58.037 [SPEAKER_00]: It's like, I compromise there. 48:58.477 --> 48:59.578 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not going to do that again. 48:59.899 --> 49:08.428 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, you know, I was in a moment of desperation and getting impatient, you know, with God and thinking, oh, well, if I don't do it, 49:08.908 --> 49:10.449 [SPEAKER_00]: Then it's not going to happen, you know what I mean? 49:10.489 --> 49:15.491 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, that shows up a lot, like at least that's something I learned even in dating, right? 49:15.511 --> 49:20.394 [SPEAKER_00]: And I was like, I compromise on that, I shouldn't have, and that's the truth of the matters. 49:20.474 --> 49:23.896 [SPEAKER_00]: I just can't compromise on face, I just can't, that's just of true confession. 49:23.916 --> 49:25.477 [SPEAKER_00]: I was like, no, I'm not doing it anymore. 49:25.497 --> 49:25.877 [SPEAKER_00]: I can't do it. 49:26.277 --> 49:30.699 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, you know, but, but you confess it and you keep on on moving, you don't like it. 49:30.719 --> 49:35.482 [SPEAKER_03]: Holy, holyness and righteousness be so attractive that it becomes, 49:36.421 --> 49:39.023 [SPEAKER_03]: at the, at the top of the list got to me. 49:39.343 --> 49:40.003 [SPEAKER_00]: It's got to be. 49:40.083 --> 49:40.623 [SPEAKER_00]: It's got to be. 49:40.643 --> 49:41.184 [SPEAKER_00]: It's got to be. 49:41.384 --> 49:41.884 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, at least me. 49:41.944 --> 49:42.444 [SPEAKER_00]: It's got to be. 49:42.725 --> 49:44.045 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's got to be real. 49:44.345 --> 49:56.032 [SPEAKER_00]: No, but, holyness and justice, I think there's in, in some ways, I think the reason why my God's grace, true staple, can do what it does. 49:57.368 --> 50:03.834 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, is that we try to be as congruent as possible. 50:03.854 --> 50:08.237 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, our private and public lives, you know, so our friends outside of the table had no worse. 50:08.718 --> 50:12.181 [SPEAKER_00]: I think that they would say we're pretty consistent, pretty predictable. 50:12.761 --> 50:16.525 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm, I'm, I try to be deeply, I deeply, I'm valued. 50:16.545 --> 50:18.887 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm not just, I don't like to be tripped. 50:19.703 --> 50:21.086 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't like, I don't like mass. 50:21.286 --> 50:23.690 [SPEAKER_03]: And so I want, I like why. 50:23.710 --> 50:24.451 [SPEAKER_03]: That's the best thing. 50:24.491 --> 50:25.213 [SPEAKER_03]: Both of you are not. 50:25.373 --> 50:26.956 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, it makes me feel incredibly unsafe. 50:27.196 --> 50:28.879 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm like, well, I'm like, yeah, I'm like, 50:29.987 --> 50:31.268 [SPEAKER_03]: is just, I see in the right thing. 50:32.088 --> 50:35.610 [SPEAKER_03]: So, and I understand that we're working there are issues, we don't even love all the parts of who we are. 50:35.630 --> 50:37.852 [SPEAKER_03]: There's all kinds of things like the word man. 50:37.952 --> 50:41.994 [SPEAKER_03]: But to your point, I just wanted to put dobs on it and underscore it. 50:42.074 --> 50:42.534 [SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely. 50:42.694 --> 50:43.295 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. 50:43.675 --> 50:47.717 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's so, you can, those are in a strictly linked. 50:48.238 --> 50:54.801 [SPEAKER_00]: And I think there are too many, how can I say, people perpetrating profits? 50:55.762 --> 51:14.165 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, out there, that are, you know, not sticating out of a place of unrighteousness, you know, because their life, their private lives, do not align with their public witness, with what their public injection, actually. 51:14.726 --> 51:18.806 [SPEAKER_00]: It's a public projection, you know, because the thrice Holy God sees it all, right? 51:19.406 --> 51:21.747 [SPEAKER_00]: And so I think it's very important to be 51:22.807 --> 51:26.310 [SPEAKER_00]: congruent in order to be especially in these times. 51:26.610 --> 51:29.012 [SPEAKER_00]: So this is not the time to compromise. 51:29.112 --> 51:33.015 [SPEAKER_00]: I just don't just I'm like, come on church, like this is not the time. 51:33.496 --> 51:37.819 [SPEAKER_00]: It is time for us to truly be serious about walking in the narrow way. 51:37.899 --> 51:41.002 [SPEAKER_00]: And the interesting thing about that, that's scripture, I was looking at it. 51:41.582 --> 51:44.545 [SPEAKER_00]: I feel like it was like about last month that I was looking at the narrow gate. 51:44.565 --> 51:50.930 [SPEAKER_00]: I can't think of the address right now, but like you actually have to bend to get into the narrow gate. 51:51.270 --> 51:53.051 [SPEAKER_00]: It's not like you can't just walk up on it. 51:53.932 --> 51:55.232 [SPEAKER_00]: You got to let some bags go. 51:55.573 --> 51:56.893 [SPEAKER_00]: You got to contort your body. 51:56.913 --> 52:01.856 [SPEAKER_00]: You're going to have to lean in, literally, in order to get through the gate, you know? 52:02.517 --> 52:04.458 [SPEAKER_00]: And because of the gate, it's small, right? 52:04.658 --> 52:05.899 [SPEAKER_00]: And the road is narrow. 52:06.319 --> 52:07.320 [SPEAKER_00]: Which means you can't just be. 52:08.497 --> 52:13.823 [SPEAKER_00]: We're wrong, we're all in and doing whatever you, you know that you've got walk circumspecting. 52:14.003 --> 52:16.005 [SPEAKER_00]: We're as on the broadest in humility. 52:16.225 --> 52:18.488 [SPEAKER_00]: On the broad road, you could do what you could do whatever. 52:18.948 --> 52:20.290 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's humility. 52:20.550 --> 52:26.076 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, there's there's a humility by God's grace that we are shaped in to be able to walk in that narrow way. 52:26.096 --> 52:28.018 [SPEAKER_03]: And again, it is to your point that you're on your score. 52:28.038 --> 52:28.379 [SPEAKER_04]: Cruning. 52:28.799 --> 52:33.920 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I mean, you've understood it is God's keeping power working in and through us, it's so that no man and no woman can boast. 52:34.640 --> 52:38.021 [SPEAKER_03]: And yeah, it is a surrender that is required of us. 52:38.201 --> 52:47.144 [SPEAKER_03]: And I think the call, again, is not to be a perfect prophet or preacher or Christian or co-worker, or wherever you are letting your life shine. 52:48.044 --> 52:49.824 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't think he will have an expectation of perfection. 52:49.864 --> 52:51.005 [SPEAKER_03]: We know that that's just not true. 52:51.065 --> 52:54.525 [SPEAKER_03]: And we in possible period, but certainly in our own strength, 52:58.068 --> 52:59.650 [SPEAKER_03]: leader is a requirement. 53:00.511 --> 53:02.973 [SPEAKER_03]: We cannot gas like me, gas like people. 53:03.674 --> 53:04.915 [SPEAKER_03]: And we have too much. 53:04.975 --> 53:08.299 [SPEAKER_03]: And I understand there are leaders who have made anything that they have done. 53:08.319 --> 53:10.722 [SPEAKER_03]: Anything that's like, I was like, done this way. 53:11.142 --> 53:13.925 [SPEAKER_03]: They're absolutely our people who will latch on to that. 53:14.125 --> 53:16.588 [SPEAKER_03]: And that's, and, and, and, and, unloving and unkind ways. 53:16.748 --> 53:19.251 [SPEAKER_03]: And yet in steel, I would say you still got to do it. 53:19.711 --> 53:19.991 [SPEAKER_03]: You do. 53:20.051 --> 53:21.011 [SPEAKER_03]: You still have to do it. 53:21.311 --> 53:23.412 [SPEAKER_03]: And of course, of course, we hear about these scandals. 53:23.432 --> 53:30.653 [SPEAKER_03]: And I do think that the average person, the who who leads in the church and who seeks to live faithfully, we don't know their name. 53:30.673 --> 53:31.913 [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, of course. 53:31.953 --> 53:33.334 [SPEAKER_03]: They're not all over the place. 53:33.934 --> 53:37.194 [SPEAKER_03]: They're by vocational that, you know, they do not own a jet. 53:37.314 --> 53:38.735 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, they're doing the work of the men. 53:38.795 --> 53:39.155 [SPEAKER_03]: Exactly. 53:39.175 --> 53:44.616 [SPEAKER_03]: There's a there's this whole that there's an unfair narrative that gets projected on all all Christian faith leaders. 53:45.336 --> 53:46.336 [SPEAKER_03]: But with that being said, 53:47.320 --> 53:53.206 [SPEAKER_03]: Those who do have platform, those who do have access, too much is given, much is required. 53:53.226 --> 53:58.292 [SPEAKER_03]: They have a particular burden that they've got to live in confession and repair. 53:58.332 --> 54:03.337 [SPEAKER_03]: And like all of us do, and they're a great consequences when we don't. 54:03.437 --> 54:08.763 [SPEAKER_03]: And so I think when we talk about ways to help people to be steady in the storm, 54:09.704 --> 54:13.848 [SPEAKER_03]: Modeling, you know, I have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. 54:14.328 --> 54:15.429 [SPEAKER_03]: I need to repair this. 54:15.569 --> 54:16.270 [SPEAKER_03]: I need to repent. 54:16.310 --> 54:17.991 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm going to turn this way with my life. 54:18.391 --> 54:19.632 [SPEAKER_03]: This is the evidence of that. 54:19.692 --> 54:22.295 [SPEAKER_03]: This is my community to help walk with me and these things. 54:22.995 --> 54:29.981 [SPEAKER_03]: We need to we need more and more of that truth tell me to take place so that people can know that that's a part of the anchor. 54:30.021 --> 54:31.902 [SPEAKER_03]: That's a part of being steady in the store. 54:32.483 --> 54:34.384 [SPEAKER_03]: And again, we're not steady because we're perfect. 54:34.404 --> 54:36.206 [SPEAKER_03]: We're steady because we have we are literally 54:38.808 --> 54:41.129 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, we're standing because the Holy Spirit is standing. 54:41.149 --> 54:41.690 [SPEAKER_00]: That's great. 54:41.870 --> 54:45.371 [SPEAKER_00]: That's only really, really, truly, that's the Holy Spirit as a Holy Spirit. 54:45.391 --> 54:46.412 [SPEAKER_00]: That's really, really. 54:46.432 --> 54:47.092 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, that's the truth. 54:47.112 --> 54:49.674 [SPEAKER_00]: There's no other way for it. 54:49.714 --> 54:51.595 [SPEAKER_00]: We cannot will ourselves in to steadiness. 54:52.135 --> 54:53.816 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, we come from a faith tradition. 54:54.036 --> 54:57.038 [SPEAKER_03]: Can I talk about America, and talk about the actual real roots of Christianity? 54:57.418 --> 55:00.920 [SPEAKER_03]: We come from a faith tradition where we literally have martyrs. 55:00.940 --> 55:06.843 [SPEAKER_03]: And we have people who were commanded to denounce by the state, 55:07.603 --> 55:16.877 [SPEAKER_03]: or be ripped apart by wild animals who we come from a faith where there are people whose bodies were used as human torches. 55:17.498 --> 55:20.322 [SPEAKER_03]: This is this is the actual tradition of faith. 55:20.362 --> 55:22.225 [SPEAKER_03]: It's not telebandilism, it's not 55:23.085 --> 55:30.467 [SPEAKER_03]: It's not the slave votes named after, you know, really distorted titles as if they represented the Christian faith. 55:30.827 --> 55:35.548 [SPEAKER_03]: No, the real roots of Christianity comes from the early church martyrs. 55:35.608 --> 55:36.628 [SPEAKER_03]: It's a bloody faith. 55:37.208 --> 55:38.369 [SPEAKER_03]: It was as bad. 55:38.749 --> 55:47.731 [SPEAKER_03]: And if we don't have the ability to submit to a way of life, that grants us a com what may kind of steadiness. 55:49.432 --> 55:52.094 [SPEAKER_03]: We're not going to make it through the storm in these times. 55:52.154 --> 56:04.465 [SPEAKER_03]: And so we're not going to be able to appeal to this very, this capitalistic counterfeit, it does not have the substance to hold us up. 56:04.926 --> 56:12.192 [SPEAKER_03]: We have to have something deeper and true, and I think we have to, the blessing of the cloud of witnesses, the blessing of the capitalicity of the church. 56:12.893 --> 56:17.598 [SPEAKER_03]: every tribe nation and tongue is that those are now our siblings in Christ. 56:17.818 --> 56:19.840 [SPEAKER_03]: And we can learn from our big sisters. 56:20.140 --> 56:22.022 [SPEAKER_03]: Yes, we can learn from our big brothers. 56:22.482 --> 56:29.409 [SPEAKER_03]: Obviously within the traditions of the African diaspora, but even more broadly, we can learn from the church in Palestine. 56:30.825 --> 56:36.168 [SPEAKER_03]: we can learn amongst the saints in Gaza who could have left but choose not to. 56:37.049 --> 56:39.430 [SPEAKER_03]: We in some are trapped absolutely. 56:39.570 --> 56:45.374 [SPEAKER_03]: Some have already lost their lives and some are there in solidarity with their Muslim neighbors as they ought to be kindness. 56:46.835 --> 56:51.117 [SPEAKER_03]: We can learn from those in our faith who have truly suffered and are suffering. 56:51.157 --> 56:55.000 [SPEAKER_03]: Now how to do that with integrity and a gospel witness. 56:55.580 --> 56:55.860 [SPEAKER_03]: But we're 56:58.782 --> 57:20.909 [SPEAKER_03]: from a perverse distorted Christianity that is committed to making other people suffer so that it can get you know money money and power basically is what it comes down money power in a false identity so it doesn't have what it takes to keep us and so it is good and right to reject it to deconstruct it out to life if you want to use that language but I appeal to the listener 57:23.150 --> 57:31.153 [SPEAKER_03]: the Jesus, the true God, man, has in fullness what it takes to keep us steady in the storm. 57:32.174 --> 57:40.197 [SPEAKER_03]: So please reject the counterfeit, but do not reject the one who extends life and hope enjoy to you forever. 57:40.217 --> 57:40.857 [SPEAKER_00]: Amen. 57:41.097 --> 57:41.997 [SPEAKER_00]: Amen, exactly. 57:42.017 --> 57:43.938 [SPEAKER_00]: And I think in 2025 we've got to really. 57:44.598 --> 57:51.422 [SPEAKER_00]: And beyond about to find out truly what people's faith is made of you know It's about to be it's gonna be trying by fire for sure. 57:51.482 --> 58:02.628 [SPEAKER_00]: We won't always have access to our churches In the way that we do I know we think we will we won't we won't always have access to our bibles the way we think we do Say better hide that word in your heart 58:03.651 --> 58:04.951 [SPEAKER_00]: I think there's some real. 58:05.312 --> 58:09.993 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, there's a myth shaking come a myth of perpetual moral progress and that's just not true. 58:10.013 --> 58:10.993 [SPEAKER_03]: No, that's not true. 58:11.013 --> 58:12.714 [SPEAKER_03]: There's nothing about the human area. 58:12.734 --> 58:13.674 [SPEAKER_00]: It doesn't romantic with time. 58:13.994 --> 58:15.214 [SPEAKER_03]: Exactly. 58:15.294 --> 58:19.456 [SPEAKER_03]: You have got to get it and confess it and repent. 58:20.036 --> 58:24.317 [SPEAKER_03]: And that is the one thing that the church in America deeply struggles with is the doctrine of repentance. 58:24.617 --> 58:25.618 [SPEAKER_03]: That is it's biggest issue. 58:25.678 --> 58:26.558 [SPEAKER_00]: It's your responsibility. 58:26.618 --> 58:26.778 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah. 58:27.438 --> 58:29.980 [SPEAKER_00]: And you have to say, whoa, it was me. 58:30.060 --> 58:30.740 [SPEAKER_00]: I thought it was me. 58:30.840 --> 58:31.521 [SPEAKER_00]: I was a man. 58:32.141 --> 58:32.741 [SPEAKER_00]: It was me. 58:33.102 --> 58:33.882 [SPEAKER_00]: So let's, let's hold. 58:33.982 --> 58:35.403 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's, let's produce faith. 58:36.144 --> 58:37.845 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm sorry, let's, let's produce fruit. 58:37.925 --> 58:39.045 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm sorry. 58:39.426 --> 58:40.566 [SPEAKER_00]: And keeping with repentance. 58:40.706 --> 58:44.929 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, you know, that, that is my, my, my final thought. 58:45.449 --> 58:45.910 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah. 58:46.010 --> 58:46.910 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah. 58:47.010 --> 58:48.771 [SPEAKER_03]: And the goal is not to judge those. 58:49.212 --> 58:54.215 [SPEAKER_03]: The goal is to invite people back into something that will uphold us together. 58:54.295 --> 58:56.196 [SPEAKER_03]: We're meant to be upheld together in community. 58:56.554 --> 59:02.644 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I know, I think, yeah, we just have to, we have to aspire to live quiet lives. 59:03.065 --> 59:06.330 [SPEAKER_00]: I really do, quiet on cool lives. 59:07.446 --> 59:31.897 [SPEAKER_00]: And I think that this thirst for clicks, I think this is also part of the issue, and that's probably another topic, but the ways in which social media feeds this, how can this self, this ego, ego-tistical type of approach, and so sometimes people will do other things, for virology and whatnot, I think we have to be careful that, 59:32.837 --> 59:37.840 [SPEAKER_00]: that we're not trying to please man instead of pleasing God because those two things are diametrically opposed. 59:37.940 --> 59:41.823 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I just it is almost impossible to please both God. 59:41.883 --> 59:43.324 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I'm just kidding. 59:43.344 --> 59:46.686 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, as you as everyone speaks well of you, yeah, what what have you done? 59:46.706 --> 59:52.589 [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, I'm okay with people who are unjust thinking I'm a Debbie Downer. 59:52.749 --> 59:54.390 [SPEAKER_03]: That's really fine with me. 59:54.551 --> 59:55.691 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I'm fine with that. 59:55.791 --> 59:57.612 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, I feel like that's that's a good company right? 59:59.314 --> 59:59.714 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay. 59:59.954 --> 01:00:00.974 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, then that's good company. 01:00:01.014 --> 01:00:01.555 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, right. 01:00:01.575 --> 01:00:02.935 [SPEAKER_00]: That's all about there. 01:00:03.375 --> 01:00:03.935 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. 01:00:04.075 --> 01:00:08.596 [SPEAKER_00]: So anyway, Bob, I'm glad we got to talk about, you know, being steady. 01:00:09.497 --> 01:00:09.917 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, man. 01:00:09.937 --> 01:00:11.777 [SPEAKER_00]: They're being anchored in the storm. 01:00:11.917 --> 01:00:12.217 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. 01:00:12.257 --> 01:00:12.397 [SPEAKER_00]: No. 01:00:13.218 --> 01:00:13.718 [SPEAKER_00]: So anyway. 01:00:14.318 --> 01:00:14.618 [SPEAKER_00]: But yeah. 01:00:14.658 --> 01:00:15.258 [SPEAKER_00]: Thank you all. 01:00:15.478 --> 01:00:18.739 [SPEAKER_00]: So for taking a seat at the table, what does let's keep the conversation going. 01:00:18.799 --> 01:00:19.019 [SPEAKER_00]: Sure. 01:00:19.079 --> 01:00:22.500 [SPEAKER_00]: Your thoughts about being steady in the storm. 01:00:26.286 --> 01:00:29.787 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, you can always send your thoughts to ask true stable at gmail.com. 01:00:29.867 --> 01:00:35.689 [SPEAKER_00]: Of course, don't forget to rain, read a show on iTunes, subscribe on your favorite podcast player, and we're on YouTube now. 01:00:35.749 --> 01:00:36.390 [SPEAKER_00]: Come on. 01:00:36.650 --> 01:00:41.131 [SPEAKER_00]: Make sure you subscribe, share our little shorts and things like that, and all the things. 01:00:41.231 --> 01:00:44.473 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, in black women, we do have a black woman's Facebook Disappleship Group. 01:00:44.773 --> 01:00:50.375 [SPEAKER_00]: So if you would like to join, just answer the entry questions, you will be admitted, and you can join us there. 01:00:51.175 --> 01:00:51.716 [SPEAKER_00]: on Facebook. 01:00:51.736 --> 01:00:53.579 [SPEAKER_00]: So we'll see you soon on the next truth table. 01:00:53.900 --> 01:00:54.221 [SPEAKER_00]: Bye, y'all.