[SPEAKER_00]: Hey, Andre, we got a lot to talk about in this week's TFL car chat.
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you guys for joining us as always.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's Roman and Andre, where's Tommy?
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I was gonna ask you, why am I here?
[SPEAKER_00]: You're here because Tommy's on a program.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's driving Toyota's on the West Coast.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, let me back the normally scheduled,
[SPEAKER_00]: presenters next week by for now you've got manager editor of TFL truck so there will be some truck talk on this car chat a tiny bit of truck talk relating to SUVs actually yes yes we've got a lot look at this there are right now we got a lot to talk about what a lot is happening and this is going to be the uh Roman is grumpy episode because Andre I am grumpy I'm going to shine some light so I'm going to try to balance your grumpyness but I also have my own grumps okay I'm also
[SPEAKER_01]: No, that's Karrish.
[SPEAKER_01]: No, we can't talk about what's going on here.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, boyals are breaks.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, boyals are breaks.
[SPEAKER_00]: We're talking about what boyals are breaks.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, uh, and I want to say I want to say hello and thank you to all of our patrons.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, we're also this is live on patrons
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so if you want to get it first, head on over to patreon.com slash tfl car, exactly.
[SPEAKER_00]: And thank you guys for joining us.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you have any questions, we will be happily answering them for you.
[SPEAKER_00]: So if you have any interesting things that you want to talk to us about, jot down your questions and by the end of the show, we'll answer them.
[SPEAKER_00]: But let's start with my grumpyness, Andre.
[SPEAKER_00]: OK.
[SPEAKER_00]: And this is the first topic.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is something I've been talking about and thinking about a long time.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't understand the Mustang GTD.
[SPEAKER_01]: You mean the most amazing, the most powerful, the most technologically advanced Mustang ever?
[SPEAKER_00]: The most expensive Mustang ever is more where I'm going with it.
[SPEAKER_00]: So as you know Ford has built, and I say that once again with air quotes, because really it's multimedic that built the new Mustang GTD.
[SPEAKER_00]: The Mustang GTD is ostensibly a competitor to the Porsche 911 GT3.
[SPEAKER_01]: OK, so I was actually fortunate enough.
[SPEAKER_01]: I was in Detroit when they first unveiled the GTD Mustang.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I was really psyched.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I saw one of the pre-production cars in person.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I was pretty excited.
[SPEAKER_01]: I wasn't quite sure what it competed against.
[SPEAKER_01]: In my mind, it's a car that was kind of an answer to the C8 Corvette, because Chevrolet and they're very competitive, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: Ford and GM.
[SPEAKER_00]: except the GTD, this is where it gets sticky, it's $200,000 more, and $200,000 more.
[SPEAKER_00]: It started to like $350,000, and when you spec it, it can easily get to $450,000, and correct me if I'm wrong, but the Mustang has always been kind of the people's muscle car slash, pony car slash, sports car slash, muscle car, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: You're not wrong.
[SPEAKER_00]: It started out as a Ford Fairling,
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, first year 64 and a half, it sold like gangbusters and mainly those were the V6.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, these were affordable smaller cars that looked good, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: There were approachable for a lot of people like my wife's family back in the 60s, her grandfather, but actually several original Mustangs.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, he fell in love with that car.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, and according to published reports, there's only three parts that the current Mustang GT actually shares with the GTD.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is a vehicle that was specially built to go on the racetrack to compete directly with, you know, so the best portion is out there and that's racing cars out there.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and I get that, but I don't understand why you had to go with the Mustang for that.
[SPEAKER_00]: For Ford has, of course, done this before.
[SPEAKER_00]: They've done the Ford GT, which is a purpose-built race supercar, supercar, yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: And they've done two versions of that.
[SPEAKER_00]: But that goes directly to the lineage of racing at Lamar racing Formula One, back when Ford took on Ferrari.
[SPEAKER_00]: So there is, there is a lot there.
[SPEAKER_00]: But the Mustang Andre, in my mind, has always been like I said, the
[SPEAKER_00]: trying to compete directly with Porsche instead of let's say Corvette, which to me seems like the more natural.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now there's other things about it that I don't like.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I've seen a bunch of times I saw it the Auto Show.
[SPEAKER_00]: I haven't been behind the wheel.
[SPEAKER_00]: Other journalists have, which is fine, this is not sour grapes on my part.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't do trackwork, so that's fine.
[SPEAKER_00]: But look, can you actually do an image?
[SPEAKER_01]: Sorry, I didn't interrupt.
[SPEAKER_01]: No.
[SPEAKER_01]: Where did they show the chassis?
[SPEAKER_01]: Like the engine and the tunnel go up a little bit.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that.
[SPEAKER_01]: So that's pretty interesting.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, keep going.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, let me tell you kind of the things that are weird about it.
[SPEAKER_00]: First and foremost, it's big.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, it might have a footprint approaching the F-150.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's also heavy.
[SPEAKER_00]: I believe it's 500 pounds heavier.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, then the regular GT, so I don't know exactly how long the GTD is, but I know the weight.
[SPEAKER_01]: So the curb weight and the GTD Mustang I just looked this up is just over 4,300 pounds, which a regular Mustang GTV8, we actually owned one.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, recently.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's about 500 pounds lighter than that, about 3800.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I agree.
[SPEAKER_01]: I am also gaining weight in my age.
[SPEAKER_01]: So the lighter you are, the more high performance you can be.
[SPEAKER_00]: right exactly and so you would think that a high performance car would actually be lighter and lighter instead of bigger and fatter if I'm being honest well that's how the American way isn't it we need a lot of hamburgers and the other thing that I think would kind of you know what we just bought a Chevy Corvette zero one and that was well who bought we did
[SPEAKER_00]: a C4 zero one oh yes not the new zero I was like you did what the C4 let me clarify the C4 zero one four generations yeah for 27,000 yeah that's a little above our pay grade but that
[SPEAKER_00]: Corvette is powered by an engine that was developed by Lamborghini, and then built by Zed Lotus.
[SPEAKER_00]: No, no, Marine.
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, no, sorry.
[SPEAKER_00]: It was developed by Lotus.
[SPEAKER_00]: At that, I'm thinking of the Viper.
[SPEAKER_00]: So the Corvette engine was developed by Lotus because at that time GM owned Lotus, and then was built by Mercury Marine.
[SPEAKER_00]: And what happened was,
[SPEAKER_00]: When they did that, it really chafed a lot of the Ford engineers because they were like, hey, this is Jim engineers.
[SPEAKER_00]: Jim, sorry, the Jim engineers.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is our car.
[SPEAKER_00]: Why is Lotus developing the engine for this?
[SPEAKER_00]: Why is Mercury Marine building it?
[SPEAKER_00]: And basically, it kind of poked the fire under their butts and made them develop what became the Austin Engine, eventually.
[SPEAKER_00]: And so I would think if I'm a Ford engineer and you're
[SPEAKER_00]: working on the Crown Jewel in the Ford family, at least for sports cars, you'd be kind of bummed out that really this is a multi-manic product and not a Ford product.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, it has a Ford badge on it.
[SPEAKER_00]: It does have a Ford badge or a Mustang badge on it.
[SPEAKER_00]: But it's really built in Canada.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I understand and developed and engineered
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think like I said, I think it shares three parts with the regular Mustang.
[SPEAKER_00]: So there's just a lot of things about it that don't feel like Ford.
[SPEAKER_00]: They feel like somebody's side project or maybe you were at a moment in time when these highly expensive cars are the way you make money in the auto business.
[SPEAKER_00]: But it doesn't feel like something that Henry Ford would be doing.
[SPEAKER_00]: I thought always Ford was, you know, we make affordable cars, we pay our employees, a living wage, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: This is what Henry Ford established so that they can afford the cars.
[SPEAKER_00]: But now we're building $450,000 super cars that are contending for Nürburgring records.
[SPEAKER_00]: And it just doesn't feel like it's the right brand for this kind of a car, especially with the Mustang name.
[SPEAKER_00]: I guess I wouldn't be so upset if they had called it something else, like the GT.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and when the last generation Mustang came out, you could get the GT 500 for over $100,000.
[SPEAKER_00]: I actually drove that car, but it didn't have a problem with it, because it felt like it was still a Mustang.
[SPEAKER_00]: It was the ultimate Mustang.
[SPEAKER_00]: But then to go from 110 or 120, which is what the GT 500's were.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you expect them out with carbon fiber and got all the bells and whistles, to $450,000,
[SPEAKER_00]: Now we're in a completely different world, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: We're in Ferrari, Ville, and Porsche Ville, and it just doesn't feel like Fordville.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I guess that's the bottom line that really kind of rubs me the wrong way.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, well let me shine a little bit more cheerful.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, yeah, on this.
[SPEAKER_00]: I just pull up.
[SPEAKER_01]: I've had my say, okay, so you have your position, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: So I get a lot of what you're saying.
[SPEAKER_01]: But what I think, if I could peak,
[SPEAKER_01]: you know, into the minds of Ford leadership here and you know, the 14th.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think this is Jim Farley project.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: And actually, I actually haven't met Jim personally.
[SPEAKER_01]: Jim, maybe we can meet one day.
[SPEAKER_01]: But at least I was
[SPEAKER_01]: No, no, he comes across as a very approachable person.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is a person who you can come up to, you know, in a social setting very easily and actually a approach and talk about.
[SPEAKER_01]: And he actually is a passionate about what he's doing.
[SPEAKER_01]: He loves cars.
[SPEAKER_00]: He loves racing.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_01]: He loves everything on a motive.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I just saw him in Moab, Utah, driving Broncos, you know, over mountains and rocks and sand.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I can really appreciate that.
[SPEAKER_01]: Also,
[SPEAKER_01]: The 4GT, right, the previous generation that just kind of wrapped up, it's the 500 GT or just the regular, no, not the exotic, the exotic GT, okay.
[SPEAKER_01]: So Cole, can you bring that up maybe just the 4GT?
[SPEAKER_01]: So you're talking about the last 2GT, the EcoBoost, the EcoBoost, twin turbocharged, sports car that just recently, like the yellow one, or any one of these.
[SPEAKER_01]: So that car was also largely developed and built by Multimatic, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: So they have a relationship together with Multimatic.
[SPEAKER_01]: I totally get with the story you referenced, you know, with the C401, and it not being, you know, in-house, so to speak.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, if somebody came in here into TFL and they made a truck video for TFL without me,
[SPEAKER_01]: I would be really pissed off here.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, you might be a little bent out of shape.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, so I understand that completely.
[SPEAKER_01]: But it seems like for chose instead of building the next GT, which I don't know whether it could be, you know, maybe it will fly by the time they're done, um, they chose to extend the Mustang into the Syria.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's a halo car, okay, because every brand needs a halo the Ford Raptor is a truck halo for them It's done really well for Ford to have a you know 115 thousand dollar Raptor are and so I was looking at the GTD in a similar light I was looking at it as their halo car
[SPEAKER_01]: that people, well, I don't think I'll ever own one, because I don't think I'll ever afford a car this price.
[SPEAKER_01]: But something to aspire to.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, first of all, that's also another problem that I have with this car.
[SPEAKER_00]: You have to, I'm gonna be a little crass here, but it's actually true, you have to beg for to sell you one.
[SPEAKER_00]: You have to get an allocation.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, I don't like this.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, you're not going to walk into a four dealership and buy GTD.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, yeah, that's true because you have to be kind of approved by for it in order to buy one.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, same thing with the GT.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is also happened, but this is not and at that point when you have to ask the manufacturer or in
[SPEAKER_00]: But word I use was beg to buy a $450,000 car.
[SPEAKER_00]: It is no longer aspirational.
[SPEAKER_00]: It loses any halo effect because I know that even if I had Let's say I won the lottery.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's no way I could buy that car at least not new from Ford because I don't have the connections or I don't have the Not off of this video
[SPEAKER_00]: No, I don't, I don't, I can't afford it anyway, it doesn't matter.
[SPEAKER_00]: But you see what I'm saying?
[SPEAKER_00]: The car has to be approachable, and at some point, I have to think to myself for it to be a Halo car, that this is a vehicle that I could own, and I could see myself behind the wheel.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't see myself behind the wheel of this car on the track, or on the road, because it's so unapproachable, because it's such an unobtainian vehicle, that I don't think it fills that role of the Halo car, which I think is a good point.
[SPEAKER_00]: You're right, companies do need Halo cars.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think Cadillac's kind of doing the same thing with the solidestique, but that one because it's electric and because of other reasons, it's probably very getable if you actually wanted one.
[SPEAKER_00]: This one on the other hand.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, this one on the other hand probably prints money for Ford because when you have to go and request...
[SPEAKER_00]: To be able to buy a car, that to me suggests that there's a lot more demand, and that means that the price is a lot more elastic, and that's why I ended up with a Mustang that's now $450,000 when configured the right way, but that to me also undercuts the brand of Mustang, which has always been the people's muscle car.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'll give you another example of that.
[SPEAKER_00]: When Ford came out with their electric Mustang, the Mach E. I think a lot of people,
[SPEAKER_00]: had no problems with it but a lot of people were rubbed the wrong way right because to them the Mustang was never meant to be electric it was always about the eight cylinders under the hood and so it kind of cuts both ways it has a different problem the marquee because it had four doors not too good but it was another problem
[SPEAKER_01]: Because if you do have a strong brand like Mustang or Corvette, you know, in theory, it signifies something which is sporty to do or vehicle that you can enjoy, maybe convertible also.
[SPEAKER_01]: So we actually have a comment from Don Megahan here on Patreon, Roman, relating to this as well.
[SPEAKER_01]: But whenever you have that strong brand, when you read it, you can't
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, whenever you have that strong brand, it's hard to bend it in another direction.
[SPEAKER_01]: So what does that have to say?
[SPEAKER_01]: Ah, Don says the GTD is only Mustang by name, okay?
[SPEAKER_01]: It's also a test-bed since it's a Halo card.
[SPEAKER_01]: Don't be surprised if some of the tech goes into the next gen Mustang, but at a lot less cost.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's a interesting point, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: So the GTD has a supercharged V8, which is what over 800 horsepower, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: So, they have a dispension design that's very sophisticated, even though the car is heavy, Max Verstappen recently drove it, and he was, watch that video, and he was relatively impressed, but it's at least it seemed like he was impressed.
[SPEAKER_01]: So maybe a lot of the carbon technology, a lot of this dispension technology, I kind of agree with Don here.
[SPEAKER_00]: We could see that.
[SPEAKER_00]: Can I make a point?
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_00]: How long ago was the previous GT unleashed on the world?
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like 10 years now, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: That's not 2016.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, like 10 years ago about nine years.
[SPEAKER_00]: One of the key features of that car was active arrow.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_00]: So how much active arrow was in the F-150?
[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe a chin, you know, the chin, the deploys, but that's that's active arrow, that's not that's not from the GT.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's just something that all the manufacturers are doing.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I guess my point on Dre is if that's kind of the publicity and company talking points at this stuff eventually makes a toy down to regular cars.
[SPEAKER_00]: But where is the active arrow from the GT in the current Mustang?
[SPEAKER_00]: Not the GTD and any name active arrow, not not the chin spoiler, active arrow in terms of the way that it was designed for Well, where it increases downforce or it increases breaking.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's what active arrow does in sports cars.
[SPEAKER_00]: Where is active arrow in any car you can go by off the street in the Ford dealership?
[SPEAKER_01]: other than the chin spoiler yeah that's not that's not that's not that's aerodynamic device that improves real efficiency right but in the sports car they don't care about field efficiency I know but in truck world we do care about field efficiency and we do care about it and cars as well in a lot of it but once again it's apples and oranges here
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so I mean, no matter how I mean racing drives innovation, do you agree racing?
[SPEAKER_01]: So when you have the lightest engines or the best materials or the most powerful engines and all the technologies like the hybrid technologies and Formula One that you know is being developed to the end degree, hopefully
[SPEAKER_01]: All of that stuff will trickle back down into the stuff we can buy.
[SPEAKER_00]: Sounds like trickle down economics to me.
[SPEAKER_00]: I just don't buy that company line.
[SPEAKER_00]: Sorry, I'm just maybe a jaded journalist, but that's just, I think, an excuse that a lot of CEOs use to develop a bigger, better, faster toy than their competing CEO.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then they say, well, this will trickle down.
[SPEAKER_00]: I just don't see any of the technology and the GT actually trickling down to anything that Ford's building right now.
[SPEAKER_00]: I just don't.
[SPEAKER_00]: I haven't seen anything.
[SPEAKER_00]: If anything, it went the other way.
[SPEAKER_00]: The GT actually used the EcoBoost engine that was developed, not for the GT, but was developed for the F-150 and for some other vehicle.
[SPEAKER_00]: So the technology actually went up and set it down.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well I don't know which way it went because I thought they explained the V6 because of the skininess of the car, right, and the size of it, and that they wanted to make the GT.
[SPEAKER_01]: But the dynamic is much more skinny.
[SPEAKER_00]: But the engine, I'm saying it went up because the engine was there before the car was there.
[SPEAKER_00]: They didn't introduce the EcoBoost in the GT.
[SPEAKER_00]: Right, it wasn't right.
[SPEAKER_00]: It wasn't like right we have a GT and now guess what it's got this new power train It was we have this power train and we're gonna put it so the technology went from the mainstream to the sports car Not from the sports car to the mainstream That that would be my that's true.
[SPEAKER_00]: All right.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think we're beating this to death.
[SPEAKER_00]: Let us know in the comments below what you egregol
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you, Cole.
[SPEAKER_00]: Just stop us.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think our producer is telling us to move forward.
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's move forward.
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's keep going.
[SPEAKER_00]: So let's talk about something else.
[SPEAKER_00]: Completely different, Andre.
[SPEAKER_00]: We have a spy shot.
[SPEAKER_00]: One of our keen eyed viewers caught this car.
[SPEAKER_00]: Look at that.
[SPEAKER_00]: What is that?
[SPEAKER_00]: Mune's accent, the whole day, scratch your head, try to figure out what the heck that is.
[SPEAKER_00]: It is an SUV or a crossover.
[SPEAKER_00]: But it's of, I would say, it's a...
[SPEAKER_01]: First of all, it's Talish's boxy, it's all camouflaged except for the headlamps, and some of the grill elements in this particular prototype.
[SPEAKER_01]: But dude, it looks amazing, and you guys figured it out, you finally know we know what this is.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, exactly, I didn't figure it out.
[SPEAKER_00]: So this is Yuenetown, Dremmerl, please.
[SPEAKER_00]: The 2028, we think,
[SPEAKER_00]: Mitsubishi Montereau.
[SPEAKER_00]: Montereau, right.
[SPEAKER_00]: And if Nathan were here, he would be falling off his chair.
[SPEAKER_00]: Nathan, what are you?
[SPEAKER_00]: Where are you?
[SPEAKER_00]: We need you.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know we know where you are.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know, but your huge Montereau fan.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's actually owned Montereau's.
[SPEAKER_00]: Many Montereau's.
[SPEAKER_00]: All of which have overheated.
[SPEAKER_00]: No, not some of which have overheated.
[SPEAKER_00]: But this is interesting because Mitsubishi, let's face it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Doesn't have a huge lamp of cars.
[SPEAKER_00]: No.
[SPEAKER_00]: In fact, I would say there is very few Mitsubishi plattles except for maybe what three the street?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, but they're closely related, I mean, they are partnered with Nissan, right, on a lot of their products.
[SPEAKER_01]: For example, you know, the rogue, you know, the Nissan rogue partnership that they have.
[SPEAKER_01]: And the technologies that they're sharing together and I'm excited about this.
[SPEAKER_01]: You know why?
[SPEAKER_01]: Because in this image from the rear of the vehicle, you can kind of see the solid rear axle and that pumpkin hanging in the middle, right there, we are zooming in on it.
[SPEAKER_00]: So you're saying this is body and frame, which...
[SPEAKER_01]: Could mean it's a solid rare axle.
[SPEAKER_01]: It could be body on frame, which could be truck based, which could be the next frontier as well.
[SPEAKER_01]: They could share a lot of the components with the next one.
[SPEAKER_00]: So it's totally the next X-steira.
[SPEAKER_00]: And the next X-steira romance.
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, we're looking at it because here is a frontier based.
[SPEAKER_00]: platform that will underpin both the Montero and the extero, and let's talk about the extero for a second because Mitsubishi's time and could not have been worse.
[SPEAKER_00]: Just when the overlanding slash offroading craze took off, they decided to kill the extero.
[SPEAKER_00]: I never since then I have been scratching my head wondering why and how and what in God's name made them do that.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.
[SPEAKER_01]: I wasn't a preview to that, but I'd believe the last Nissan Xtera was 2015, model year, which is 10 years ago.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's hard to believe.
[SPEAKER_01]: Remember, you and Nathan and I, we reviewed several Xteras.
[SPEAKER_01]: We love Xteras, they're really tough.
[SPEAKER_01]: There were affordable, they were easy to, you know, just acquire.
[SPEAKER_00]: And yet, I would say, since that time,
[SPEAKER_00]: At least a million and that's because you're more if you have if you're around back then It's not that long ago, but back then years the foreigner was still around.
[SPEAKER_00]: It was it was it was cranking Yes, the right in the was around the Bronco wasn't the Bronco there was no even the rumor of a new Bronco No, but but what would happen is of course to it had a reputation for reliability and so there was a premium even back then
[SPEAKER_00]: on a forerunner.
[SPEAKER_00]: So if you couldn't quite swing a forerunner, you could basically go to the value brand, which is Nissan, of course, and pick yourself up in Exterra, which had the very similar capabilities and some kind of unique stuff that the forerunner didn't have.
[SPEAKER_00]: It had that, for instance, stadium seating where if you were sitting in the second row, you could actually see over the heads of the first row.
[SPEAKER_00]: Can we see the 2015 external call if our producer will
[SPEAKER_00]: Hill, he'll allow us to see what we're going to do.
[SPEAKER_00]: The other thing that the exterior had, which is precious in my mind, is it had a dedicated and enthusiastic core of customers.
[SPEAKER_00]: So there were people who swore by
[SPEAKER_00]: Exteris to the extent that they would actually like brand Exteris by tattooing it on their bodies.
[SPEAKER_00]: There was a burgeoning aftermarket for Exteris parts that Nissan wasn't doing, but that people were doing.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, there was a shop, you know, there was toy tech for Toyota, and there was, you know, this tech, in the Sontech shop, they were modifying Exteris frontiers and titans, and it was all, you know, all happy until they completely killed it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Big fan of the extero.
[SPEAKER_00]: I thought it was a better looking car than the foreigner.
[SPEAKER_00]: I thought the foreigner was kind of dull, but extero had some pretty interesting looks.
[SPEAKER_00]: And the other thing about it, of course, was that it was based on the frontier at the time and the frontier has always been a very solid truck, which made the extero very off-road worthy.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, they have afro-ed versions and then they rename them ProForex, ProForex brand is still around right now.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I'm really psyched that we saw that prototype.
[SPEAKER_01]: By the way, if you can go back to that website, call the images.
[SPEAKER_01]: I wanted to thank our viewer who sent them.
[SPEAKER_01]: Just not sure.
[SPEAKER_01]: Can you go back to the text?
[SPEAKER_01]: You know the story in the final of the story too, is yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, we'll think our man or lady who was Sean B. Thank you.
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you.
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you, Sean.
[SPEAKER_01]: Really appreciate it.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not sure I'm loving the Monterero right now.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's got this kind of funky lights that there.
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, it reminds me of the Nissan Leaf.
[SPEAKER_01]: It doesn't have to remind you.
[SPEAKER_01]: No, I mean, it's not swoopy, but the light signature.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I like the fact that it's very upright.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a little too slab-sided.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's got a little bit of that, um, this is, all cars are going with this with USB MW's.
[SPEAKER_00]: Do you remember when of the Jaguar Double Zero project came out, everybody hated it?
[SPEAKER_00]: the concept.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, the concept.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's very slab-sided.
[SPEAKER_01]: It looks like an air conditioner.
[SPEAKER_01]: Is that what you mean?
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's got this kind of cheese grate on the front.
[SPEAKER_00]: This has a lot of those aspects.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's very slab-sided.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's got that kind of cheese grate in front on this.
[SPEAKER_00]: And now go back to the material.
[SPEAKER_01]: I disagree.
[SPEAKER_00]: Look at it.
[SPEAKER_01]: Let's see.
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_01]: Sporty cars like Jaguars need to be stylish.
[SPEAKER_01]: SUVs, especially off-road body and frame SUVs need to be square.
[SPEAKER_01]: They need to be rectangular.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is.
[SPEAKER_01]: This prototype has all of that.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's squareish.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's slap sided.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's rectangular.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's butch.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's attractive.
[SPEAKER_00]: So.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to disagree with you, Andre, and I'll tell you why.
[SPEAKER_00]: The same guy who did the Jaguar 00 concept, also, or at least the same team, Jerry McGover, and also penned the latest defender.
[SPEAKER_00]: And that is anything but that.
[SPEAKER_00]: That to me is like you could take three boxes, typical three boxes, or two boxes at upright, one box bottom, one box on top, or the people live.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then just it's very square, but there is not a lot of like intricate,
[SPEAKER_00]: interest.
[SPEAKER_00]: Look at the size, they're completely flat, completely slabby.
[SPEAKER_00]: The front, like I said, has a G's greater look to it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Was it if you look at a defender?
[SPEAKER_00]: There's just a lot of visual interest, including the lights, including the way that it kind of goes back.
[SPEAKER_00]: And this, I'll tell you the reason, I am so grumpy today.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm sorry guys, I'm just kidding.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's okay, I'll ring a man.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, you were okay, but the reason I had such a hard time was that I was figuring out what this material looks like, is that there is nothing that says Montero in that to me.
[SPEAKER_00]: Nothing, like they didn't mean heritage.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, heritage.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, yes.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's it.
[SPEAKER_00]: That defender, even though it's much more modern, there are still cues that harken back to the previous defender, the new one.
[SPEAKER_01]: I agree that the new defender has some heritage in it, but look at the new defender.
[SPEAKER_01]: I could draw it with a ruler.
[SPEAKER_01]: I could put a ruler next to the side of it and I can draw that box.
[SPEAKER_01]: There's nothing more boxy than that.
[SPEAKER_00]: Look at the wheel wells on it.
[SPEAKER_00]: What's how interesting the profile looks?
[SPEAKER_00]: Look how tall the greenhouse is compared to the body.
[SPEAKER_00]: And now go back, go back to the, you know, my integral.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_00]: Look how tall that slab side is.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know why?
[SPEAKER_00]: Why?
[SPEAKER_01]: You know why?
[SPEAKER_01]: You're afroading in Moab.
[SPEAKER_01]: You want to look out of your glass, of your windows.
[SPEAKER_00]: Just the glass is smaller than the side of the vehicle.
[SPEAKER_01]: No, it's, it's, it's still large.
[SPEAKER_01]: You know what we need to do?
[SPEAKER_01]: We need to wait until they debut this car without camouflage.
[SPEAKER_00]: I like the hood.
[SPEAKER_00]: I like the dual bumps on the hood.
[SPEAKER_01]: But look, the rear, behind the rear door, it kinks up and then there's like a little bit of a hip in the back of this rear comb.
[SPEAKER_01]: You see what I'm saying?
[SPEAKER_00]: I think we can agree with you.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think Roman is once again wrong.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, thanks.
[SPEAKER_00]: I like I do like the hood.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's got a little bit.
[SPEAKER_00]: So when I was just driving the new Porsche MacCon.
[SPEAKER_00]: Uh-huh.
[SPEAKER_00]: And that the Porsche calls those wings because they're hard come back to the 911.
[SPEAKER_00]: Those kind of bulgees on top of the hood.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: and I do like the ballages.
[SPEAKER_00]: That to me is the most interesting part of this.
[SPEAKER_00]: Obviously with the camouflage, it's hard to get a good sense for it because the camouflage is designed to fool your eye.
[SPEAKER_00]: So maybe once they peel off the camouflage, they're making a lot of noise.
[SPEAKER_00]: Do you think that in that little under the grill, do you think that is a little slot for a winch?
[SPEAKER_00]: It's hard to know, I'm not sure what that slot is.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, that slot either.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's very peculiar, but it's not, I don't see a winch being in there, but we've seen other images of this prototype with an exhaust pipe.
[SPEAKER_01]: So this is not an all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-all-
[SPEAKER_01]: So, we think it may be a V6, maybe a twin turbo V6, that they also have in there.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, if I'm honest with the V6 that they have in the frontier, it's going to be a V6.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, frontier also has a V6.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, a different V6, exactly.
[SPEAKER_00]: And actually, now that...
[SPEAKER_00]: Everybody has gone turbo in their mid-sized trucks.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's kind of nice to have a truck with a straight Six not straight V6 that is just straight naturally aspirated.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, thank you very much for clearing up my Mumble jumble.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's okay
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm excited still.
[SPEAKER_01]: Let us know what you think in the comments below.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I think that extera could save Nissan.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I think I am hopeful, you know, when first the extero room, by the way, extero rumors have been going on for it, but recent extero rumors suggested to me that it could be a small, unibody, maybe electrified vehicle.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I thought it was a wrong way to do it.
[SPEAKER_01]: It has to be body on frame.
[SPEAKER_01]: It has to have the heritage of the exterer.
[SPEAKER_01]: And this makes me hopeful that it's going to continue.
[SPEAKER_00]: This certainly doesn't have stadium seating, but wouldn't it be cool if the next exterer, which Nissan has confirmed is coming by the way, we're not speculating on that.
[SPEAKER_00]: Wouldn't it be cool if they actually do the stadium seating?
[SPEAKER_00]: it would be amazing.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then actually came out with a good assortment of accessories that you could get with the vehicle.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think one of the biggest mistakes that manufacturers OEMs made initially when the off-road world got crazy was that they left a lot of money on the table by not giving people a choice whether they want a win or whether they want rock sliders or whether they want a rooftop tent.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think defended it a really good job of that by coming out with a full
[SPEAKER_00]: catalog of accessories and I would hope that Nissan has learned that lesson and maybe even Mitsubishi so when this does come out you can go and expect it and make it as off-road worthy as you want because that also to me says that the company cares about off-roading because they are offering these off-road bits and pieces as opposed to just making it look like an off-road or figuring that people buy just because it's got that off-road styling.
[SPEAKER_00]: Can I be
[SPEAKER_01]: Can we move on to the next story which makes me very grumpy?
[SPEAKER_01]: Let's see what your grumpy story is.
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, so this has been floating around for at least what a week or two.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, this is so sad.
[SPEAKER_01]: And Zack Butler are, you know, car editor.
[SPEAKER_01]: Roll the story about this on tflcard.com.
[SPEAKER_01]: So basically the story is that
[SPEAKER_01]: The current Durango for 2026, it continues, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: So it's going to have a several engines, five, seven hammy, which is great.
[SPEAKER_01]: Then it's also have the 392, the 6.4 liter hammy, and also the Hellcat.
[SPEAKER_01]: And the Hellcat version, according to the story, according what we hear from Stellantis, will not be sold in the 17 Carb C-A-R-B.
[SPEAKER_00]: States.
[SPEAKER_00]: Who's going to be happy about that?
[SPEAKER_00]: Who the people who bought the first version that was supposed to be the last version remember?
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yes, the last call.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, yes, the last call people are ecstatic right now.
[SPEAKER_00]: They thought they were getting the last version of the Durango.
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yeah, I'm not ecstatic.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think that was two versions ago by the way, two model years ago.
[SPEAKER_00]: So they'll be happy that at least some of the weasels in the Carvestate won't be able to buy them
[SPEAKER_01]: So here's why I'm a bit upset by this because there was a lot of researches of the V8 engines and still on this You know ramp 1500 just got a V8, you know back.
[SPEAKER_01]: They had me the five seven heavy and there is rumors about they you know Hellcat TRX coming back and Actually more than rumor now because the CEO of still on this set of V8 TRX is coming
[SPEAKER_01]: There's also rumors of 392, 6.4 litre V8 RAMs coming.
[SPEAKER_01]: There's also a rumor of a Jeep gladiator 392 coming, you know, with the V8 engine.
[SPEAKER_01]: And we live in Colorado, which follows Carb rules.
[SPEAKER_01]: So we're part of the 17 states.
[SPEAKER_00]: So does that mean, let me ask, this is what I'm thinking.
[SPEAKER_00]: If I want one of these, can I go buy it in Illinois, which isn't the car?
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't think it's a car.
[SPEAKER_00]: It could be.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, let's say Florida.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm sure Florida is not a Carb State.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm guessing at this, but I think I'm, no, no, we don't have to guess.
[SPEAKER_01]: We don't have to guess because we could read this act story.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, so the Carb States are a California Colorado Connecticut, Delaware, Maine, Maryland, Massachusetts, Minnesota, Nevada, Nevada.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's surprising.
[SPEAKER_01]: New Jersey, New York, New York is a humongous populous state, Oregon, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, Vermont, Virginia, and Washington.
[SPEAKER_00]: All right, so I'm going to play Devil's Advocate.
[SPEAKER_00]: I can pump up the Cheyenne, yes, he's less than two hours from here.
[SPEAKER_00]: So what does that work?
[SPEAKER_00]: Just pop up there and buy one and register it in Montana.
[SPEAKER_00]: wait a minute.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, that's true.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's what California's are doing.
[SPEAKER_00]: They're all registering their supercars in Montana so they don't have to do smog and they don't have to pay taxes.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm over of this.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, but I'm still upset that
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not, this is not a popular vehicle, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: They're only going to make what?
[SPEAKER_01]: A thousand of these engines, maybe?
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, this is a low production vehicle.
[SPEAKER_01]: Why can't enthusiasm pay extra money and buy them anywhere?
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't, I don't, I don't get it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Because Andre, you don't deserve it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, you're not worthy of the Hellcat Durangle.
[SPEAKER_00]: You have to be... No, I'm talking about, like, I want the next TRX, or the next Gladiators, that the next TRX won't be sold here as well.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, this is what's this is maybe suggest that it's just seem silly.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like I said, if you're really while I'm pop up to Wyoming, pick one up and register, it's once again, it's government being stupid, and instead of, you know, being there to help the people, they're there to hinder the people.
[SPEAKER_00]: Whenever I see government doing stupid stuff like this, I'm always on the other side of the issue, because
[SPEAKER_00]: like even there was a lot there was and this is an old story but we'll just touch on it in California and Leno's law they try to pass a law for car enthusiasts basically saying that if you had a car that was like 30 years old right we have that same
[SPEAKER_00]: rule here at the 1976 and it doesn't go forward, it is always 1976 where you're in terrible smart term.
[SPEAKER_00]: And so the way people got around it is, instead of getting a smart in California, they would just go and form a corporation, their companies who do that in Montana and then register in Montana and then you all of a sudden take all this revenue the California could be getting and, you know, slice it off into Montana.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then, of course, the way in California they saw that is now they're trying to crack down on it.
[SPEAKER_00]: And they, you know, they make you prove that you're living California.
[SPEAKER_00]: So if you have a Montana plate on your car, but that's just, that's just one stupidity on top of another, you know, it is just, just allow people to do what they want and tax them, if you want to tax them and you're going to make more money.
[SPEAKER_00]: And if you're worried about air quality, then use that money to clean up the air.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, use it to do fire mitigation because I promise you these massive force fires that are burning down half the West are causing a whole lot more pollution and causing a whole lot more carbon to be thrown into the air than any 1976 Gremlin.
[SPEAKER_00]: or a 2026 Durango.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_00]: Because they said, well, what do people drive these prevalence for, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: They drive them to cars and coffee and back.
[SPEAKER_00]: And back, that's it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, if you're 10 miles a month, exactly, if they start, and if they can get them into the road before they crap out of them.
[SPEAKER_00]: So come on guys, just be real, be smart and be considerate of your constituents.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and like I'm not advocating for a V8 engine in every Toyota RF4.
[SPEAKER_00]: I am not.
[SPEAKER_00]: Just put what I put on the V8 everything.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, why not?
[SPEAKER_00]: Just... Just do it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like the economy will sort that out.
[SPEAKER_00]: Because the second gas goes to $5 a gallon, which it will at some point.
[SPEAKER_00]: People will think twice.
[SPEAKER_00]: People will think all of a sudden that Durango that is, you know, giving 12 MPG is going to become very, very, very much a liability.
[SPEAKER_00]: All right, let's move on to other things that upset us.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, we've got this whole list.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is a list of tech we think will not will not wear well over time.
[SPEAKER_01]: No, it won't.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_01]: It will make a lot of people grumpy.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so we've come together with a giant list of technology and things.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's just technology.
[SPEAKER_00]: How much time do we have?
[SPEAKER_00]: How much?
[SPEAKER_00]: 25 minutes.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's right, right.
[SPEAKER_00]: We got about 25 of these.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is going to be lightning round.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so this is stuff that is going to wear out and it's going to look old Long before it's time.
[SPEAKER_00]: So you want to start with your beeping Nissan slash infinity story actually it's more than Nissan All right for infinity.
[SPEAKER_01]: So a lot of cars beep a lot
[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm talking about little chimes, little warning sounds that they make.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm okay with seed belts.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think seed belts safety, reminding the driver and passengers to wear seed belts, and I'm all for that.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's really important.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm for that.
[SPEAKER_01]: What I'm talking about beeping is, for example, in recent Nissan, especially like their SUVs, the big ones like Armada and even the QX80.
[SPEAKER_01]: I come home and they have coming extra could be exterminated.
[SPEAKER_01]: I come home.
[SPEAKER_01]: I put the vehicle into park.
[SPEAKER_01]: I shot off the engine I opened my driver door and there's a chime beeping at me.
[SPEAKER_01]: Why?
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know why is it it's a good you're keen your pocket or something?
[SPEAKER_00]: No, I like you scared me.
[SPEAKER_01]: It scares me Did I forget my headlamps or my lights on?
[SPEAKER_01]: Did I forget something about something?
[SPEAKER_01]: No, it's reminding me that I open the door
[SPEAKER_01]: I just open the door.
[SPEAKER_01]: I know I open the door.
[SPEAKER_01]: What does it have to remind me that I am opening the door?
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, can I add one out to that?
[SPEAKER_00]: What?
[SPEAKER_00]: When you're trying to do that because you're backing up and you're trying to see whether you're gonna curb your wheels or not and the car just slams you automatically and you're breaking.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't break it.
[SPEAKER_00]: But it's not just gentle, it's not like, hey, oh no.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like, bam, you can't open the door and back up at the same time.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: Why is that?
[SPEAKER_00]: Why can't I back up and open the door?
[SPEAKER_00]: Is that because that Hollywood guy died trying to do that with the grand Cherokee?
[SPEAKER_00]: Was that what caused him to?
[SPEAKER_00]: Is that's why that because he like he fell out of the car or somehow slipped out of park.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that wasn't an issue.
[SPEAKER_00]: So is that why now the rest of us can like back up and not curb our wheels?
[SPEAKER_00]: Is that where we're at?
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know exactly why, but I know what you're saying.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's very, very dramatic and very disconcerting when a car does that.
[SPEAKER_00]: Every time it does that to me, I think I've hit somebody or something.
[SPEAKER_00]: It just breaks clamping down automatically.
[SPEAKER_01]: I have a related item to that actually.
[SPEAKER_01]: I have an item where we pull a lot of trailers.
[SPEAKER_01]: We've done five vehicles on the I-Gontlet World Software Stowing Test in the last 10 days.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, we've been doing a lot of bikes.
[SPEAKER_00]: And coming soon to a TFL channel near you.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, we're already published the expedition, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: And coming very, very soon this week of this weekend, we're going to have a three truck hike, one video with three trucks.
[SPEAKER_01]: So if you're listening to this on Friday, look for tomorrow.
[SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.
[SPEAKER_01]: And also, Cole, our producer Cole, had to video and edit a lot of these.
[SPEAKER_01]: So here knows what we're talking about.
[SPEAKER_01]: Backing up a trailer, you know, the vehicles in Tahal mode, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: The wiring is connected.
[SPEAKER_01]: The lights are on in the trailer.
[SPEAKER_01]: I put it in reverse, bam, slams my brakes.
[SPEAKER_01]: Why?
[SPEAKER_00]: Because there's a trailer behind me, because some engineer thought that it was safer if it does that.
[SPEAKER_01]: But I know there's a trailer behind me.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm trying to back up with the trailer once again.
[SPEAKER_01]: I know this is configurable, but no matter what, like we have a long day, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: We film all day.
[SPEAKER_01]: We coming to the ranch to drop off the trailer.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's like 5 p.m.
[SPEAKER_01]: now.
[SPEAKER_01]: You're kind of tired and all of a sudden you're backing up your trailer to put it in storage and now it slams on your brakes and now you You know, you have to struggle and turn off some menu item that's hidden three levels down Yeah, I agree I hate anything a lot of these things have this in common.
[SPEAKER_00]: I hate anything that Basically has the computer try to outthink the driver Where it's doing something that it thinks is better for you than you think is better
[SPEAKER_00]: for doing it.
[SPEAKER_00]: And inevitably, there'll be a situation where whatever it's doing will actually be more dangerous in some ways and more unhelpful than helpful.
[SPEAKER_00]: All right, let's talk about screens.
[SPEAKER_00]: Obviously way too many frickin screens.
[SPEAKER_00]: Mercedes tripled down with the hyper screen, but the one that really chased me or what do we boil our brakes or boil our brakes?
[SPEAKER_00]: The one
[SPEAKER_00]: is the passenger screen.
[SPEAKER_00]: I just did a review of what was the card that had the passenger screen.
[SPEAKER_00]: Was it the leaf?
[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe the leaf had the passenger screen.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't understand why cars need passenger screens.
[SPEAKER_00]: I carry around a phone with me and I'm a passenger, but this is the screen I'm going to be looking at.
[SPEAKER_00]: I promise you Nissan and Porsche and Ram and, yeah, GV, this is the screen I'm going to be looking at the one I'm holding up in my hand because this is the screen that I look at all the
[SPEAKER_00]: as part of everyday life.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't need to go and see how fast the car is going, where I restarted that.
[SPEAKER_00]: I really don't need to see that.
[SPEAKER_00]: Unless I guess I could ask your driver, I could ask, or I could like, I could nag the driver.
[SPEAKER_00]: You say, going too fast.
[SPEAKER_00]: You see, honey.
[SPEAKER_00]: how fast are you going?
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't need a control of navigation.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to use Google to do that or ways.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't need to program the music.
[SPEAKER_00]: If it's cold with me in the car, I'll let him program the music because he's got excellent taste in music.
[SPEAKER_00]: So any of that stuff that that screen is doing, I don't want.
[SPEAKER_00]: And the one thing that rammed
[SPEAKER_00]: does that I don't want it to do is because there's a screen there it reflects my big ass belly right into my face so I'm sitting there and every time I look down I see I see basically just how fat I've gotten over the years and I can become very depressed ram.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, so even when the screen is off, it's making me sad.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, it's piano black, it is, it's like everything.
[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.
[SPEAKER_00]: So turning it on is irritating and turning it off is more irritating.
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's keep going down my brain, my brakes.
[SPEAKER_00]: This has been in the news.
[SPEAKER_00]: Retractable door handles, God Tesla, why?
[SPEAKER_00]: Why?
[SPEAKER_00]: And why does every freaking engineer have to copy Tesla?
[SPEAKER_00]: They're, they're not.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm sure the arrow,
[SPEAKER_00]: gains by retractable door handle or the stylish look of it is not worth the hassle of the damn thing, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: So I was talking to Jen about this, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: So we were reviewing a Genesis, you know, G90.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is now on most vehicles too.
[SPEAKER_01]: Infinity has these door handles.
[SPEAKER_00]: I just pray the trucks don't get them.
[SPEAKER_00]: Right now the sliding graces the trucks don't have most trucks.
[SPEAKER_00]: Is there a truck at Rivian, okay?
[SPEAKER_01]: Rivian, I think, Rivian and well Cybertruck has no door handles.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, the electric trucks have them.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's that's why electric trucks are in selling, I Jerry.
[SPEAKER_00]: We exactly put our finger on a door handle that retract.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, that's stop.
[SPEAKER_00]: We have a Tesla.
[SPEAKER_00]: We have a Tesla that's 10 years old now.
[SPEAKER_00]: By the way, it's for sale, 15,000 dollars.
[SPEAKER_00]: Ask and TFL truck if you want an info or TFL car.
[SPEAKER_00]: We just had a completely service just did a $2.5,000 service on it, because that's the way we are.
[SPEAKER_00]: We roll in such a way that we won't sell a car that is not, and by the way, the seat still moves.
[SPEAKER_00]: It has a ghost seat.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so the heat didn't work, which is fixed now, which is of course something we need going into winter.
[SPEAKER_00]: But the seat also would start moving out of its own to be driving along.
[SPEAKER_00]: And next thing you know, you'd be like, is this one on our list, self-moving seats?
[SPEAKER_00]: No, it's not
[SPEAKER_00]: Next, you know, your nose would be like, so when previously the sea was just attracting itself, and I took it into Tesla, and I thought it was the little switch and the door track and the chair track, yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: And of course, they didn't believe me, and so they replaced the seat module and it still doesn't.
[SPEAKER_00]: And it doesn't even war.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, they're literally, actually, they made it worse.
[SPEAKER_00]: Can you believe that?
[SPEAKER_00]: So when we took it in, the seat would move on its own, but then the little switch would actually, you know, on the side of the seat,
[SPEAKER_00]: win the screen you could push the seat back with the little switch yeah now you can't That's which gone.
[SPEAKER_00]: It doesn't work anymore.
[SPEAKER_00]: So now not only does the seat moves But now the switch doesn't sound like a noise like sell the car.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, sure if it's like putting their hands up.
[SPEAKER_00]: I want that Yeah, I want model S. I want this.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, we're gonna go take it back to test on I'm gonna chew them out.
[SPEAKER_00]: Can you just disable that feature?
[SPEAKER_00]: No You can't disable it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, but now you can't even put it back to where you need it
[SPEAKER_00]: So if you're six two or six three like you are undirect you can be driving it like you're five two by it's having to the airport Okay, so here's my final stance on retractable door handles.
[SPEAKER_01]: It seems like a good party trick when you first bought your Tesla or whatever And you're showing your neighbor and they're like, oh wow your door handles just disappeared into the door
[SPEAKER_01]: But other than that, you know, ice, snow, mud when mud goes over it, or if it stops working, or it stops working, or it traps you, or it squeezes your fingers accidentally, crushes your fingers accidentally,
[SPEAKER_01]: There's so many, or, or it wears out, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: Everything mechanical like that can wear out.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's right, definitely wear out.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, eventually you'll spend more money fixing it.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, two and a half thousand on this Tesla.
[SPEAKER_01]: What happened to a little metal part you can go like this?
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and just move it.
[SPEAKER_00]: A lot of this is reinventing the wheel, literally.
[SPEAKER_00]: We'll get to that in a second.
[SPEAKER_00]: But there are things that have been invented and tested at Nazium because they work.
[SPEAKER_00]: And now we've gone away from that.
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's go to the next one.
[SPEAKER_00]: We just were doing this just in on the Volkswagen ID buzz, which is full of this thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: And that is have to controls.
[SPEAKER_00]: Have to controls.
[SPEAKER_00]: And if you really want to add insult to injury, put have to controls and make him piano black.
[SPEAKER_00]: Not, not just feel it, can you not feel it or see it or control it?
[SPEAKER_00]: But it covers itself in the most obnoxious, thus possible, which will never be wiped into your face.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, exactly.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, have to control with piano black on top.
[SPEAKER_00]: You designers have just created the perfect storm of useless crap that you could stick in a car.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_01]: I agree.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, new manufacturers like Scout realize this and thank goodness because when we saw the Scout prototypes, right, Scout Terra truck, they have a lot of physical switches and buttons and knobs.
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, you know, I know they cost more money, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, because if you were to make every feature into its own button, mechanical button, then yes, it's not very expendable, you know, it is costly.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to jump ahead on this and get rid of it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Getting rid of lights, which is something that both the GMC Canyon that we have has done.
[SPEAKER_00]: And now the
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, several of them are doing this.
[SPEAKER_00]: And they got rid of the light switch, which to me is just unthinkable because you need to be able to turn your headlights on if you're driving at night.
[SPEAKER_00]: And now those things are in the screen.
[SPEAKER_00]: And if your screen takes a dump or for some reason if the computer decides that the lights don't need to be on, you only have one way to control it.
[SPEAKER_00]: And that is through the screen, which to me just seems like a problem that's asking for a fix.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I can kind of see where many factors we're going with the removing of the physical light switch Because automatic headlamps have been around for many many years.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: We're kind of used to automatic headlamps when it gets dark they come on when it gets light like going into a tunnel coming out of the tunnel or whatever have you They work and they figured you know what that works.
[SPEAKER_01]: Let's remove the physical switch
[SPEAKER_01]: But what do we do once again at a campsite?
[SPEAKER_01]: I need a light to see the campsite.
[SPEAKER_01]: I come up to the vehicle.
[SPEAKER_01]: There's no switch to pull.
[SPEAKER_01]: Now I have to power up the accessory on the vehicle and turn it going to the screen and then change my lights.
[SPEAKER_01]: They just added several steps to what was just one button.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, once again complexity for the sake of style or for the sake of bean counting.
[SPEAKER_00]: but not for the sake of the owner or the buyer of that vehicle.
[SPEAKER_00]: All right, next one on our list is ADS.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to keep this very simple.
[SPEAKER_00]: Just get rid of ADS until we have literally level five driving.
[SPEAKER_00]: Because it's just confusing.
[SPEAKER_00]: You have these different levels of ADS just stands for the automatic driver assistance systems.
[SPEAKER_00]: which, you know, can and probably do save lives, but every time I get it in one and all that ADS stuff is enabled, it drives me absolutely crazy.
[SPEAKER_00]: In other words, when it tries to pull the steering wheel out of my hand because I've mistaken the cross to line.
[SPEAKER_01]: Or not mistakenly, what is an issue we face while going to the ranch, bicyclists on the side of a very narrow highway?
[SPEAKER_01]: I have to cross yellow line or a white line a lot.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's legal.
[SPEAKER_00]: You've got to give them three feet.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_01]: By law, you have to give a bicyclist on the side of the highway at least three feet, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: So what do you do?
[SPEAKER_01]: You're crossing lines.
[SPEAKER_00]: Even when there's a full yellow line.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_00]: You're allowed to cross it in that circumstance.
[SPEAKER_00]: But if your ADS is on, either your seats can evaporate, either GM vehicle, it bangs and bangs, or it's going to try to yank the wheel out of your hands.
[SPEAKER_00]: Just any of that, the worst offender we don't have, but we might get, and that is when it dings at you when you exceed the speed limit, there are numerous instances where it's easy to exceed the speed limit either, and I'm not talking about trying to be speedy racer, and I'm talking about safety reasons.
[SPEAKER_00]: Just passing somebody or doing something.
[SPEAKER_00]: Until you have full autonomy, let me drive the car.
[SPEAKER_00]: Because humans are really good at either driving or not driving.
[SPEAKER_00]: What we're not good at is this in between thing where we sit there and monitor the vehicle and pretend like we're actually paying attention.
[SPEAKER_00]: When let's face an undress, even with blue crews or super crews are full self-driving, how long before your mind wanders off.
[SPEAKER_01]: You can't, but Ford won't allow your mind to wander, because every 20 seconds after you... It just nags at you.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it bings and dings.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then the other thing that is next on her list, which is probably the one that is the most egregious of all of these, is a powered vents.
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh my God, I hate powered vents.
[SPEAKER_00]: One of the things that you don't realize is just how often you actually go and change the vents.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's not like you set it and forget it.
[SPEAKER_00]: The sun comes out and all of a sudden you get hot, so you move the vent.
[SPEAKER_00]: Cloud comes over, you get cold, you move the vent, and every time you have to go in, it's like the power door, it'll same problem.
[SPEAKER_00]: Every time you have to go in and fuss with it, it just becomes fricking annoying.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's also motorized.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_01]: But we had this debate before Roman, because I kind of understood where power events come from.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's like, you know, a mom and she may have, or a dad, they may have a child, or two children in the back,
[SPEAKER_01]: and they want to control the climate and do entire vehicle all at once and the powered vents system allows you to direct air.
[SPEAKER_01]: I've never seen powered vents in the second row.
[SPEAKER_01]: No, but you're just going from the side to the windshield, you can select all of that digitally in the center screen.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I think that's a cool idea.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think you've pulled a solution out of your, you know, what I'm doing.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm just trying to give them a little bit of a prop.
[SPEAKER_00]: I appreciate you standing up to the manufacturers, but that one came out of somewhere that we shouldn't have discussed.
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's talk about the destination fees Andre.
[SPEAKER_00]: And talk about what happened with the expedition.
[SPEAKER_00]: So we had an expedition at the office for, as they would say, on test Andre.
[SPEAKER_00]: It was on test here as long as the high-brow journalists and YouTubers say, on test.
[SPEAKER_00]: It was on test.
[SPEAKER_00]: It wasn't on loan, it was on test.
[SPEAKER_00]: So we had an explanation on test.
[SPEAKER_00]: And it had a destination fee that was $1,900 or $19.95.
[SPEAKER_00]: That was like six months ago.
[SPEAKER_00]: That was now two weeks ago.
[SPEAKER_01]: I know, but it wasn't $19.95 two weeks ago.
[SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, but the the the the the the the the Monroe he basically said it was $1,900 destination fee, which is ridiculous.
[SPEAKER_00]: Because you can let's say it's not negotiable.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's not negotiable unless you can get a BMW from Europe for like $1,300.
[SPEAKER_00]: So these numbers are just made up numbers that the manufacturer is using to increase the cost of the vehicle at this point and not actually put it into the real cost of the vehicle where it should be anyway.
[SPEAKER_00]: So this was $1900, but you being a very thorough and very thoughtful, I was doing a minor research.
[SPEAKER_00]: You dig your research and by the time we actually got the car you
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, or $500, it was $400, it was a lot, a lot of dollars.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah, that is not going to go to it.
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's not, it wasn't just the expedition.
[SPEAKER_01]: I checked the F-150, something, super-duty, same thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's just the way of sneaking in more profit or more,
[SPEAKER_00]: fees that you can't negotiate and you know you can't do anything about and there's already enough of those Canadians happening at most dealers or many dealers without the manufacturers adding to it.
[SPEAKER_00]: It just creates a feeling that cars when you buy them have to be negotiated and you know it's like when you got an airplane right if you realize that the person next to you paid a completely different amount of money it just kind of irks you.
[SPEAKER_00]: and that kind of feel that way about a car.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's why I like, I've been an Apple guy ever since I was in college, but I like the fact that when I go in the Apple store, the price is the price.
[SPEAKER_00]: And you're buying the no matter which store you enter.
[SPEAKER_00]: Is the same.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and you're buying that.
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's say you're buying the new iPhone.
[SPEAKER_00]: You're going to pay the same price.
[SPEAKER_00]: Sure you make a discount through your,
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, corporation or something, but for the most part it's the same price and then in the in the Card dealership it could be whatever the salesman how the manager feels that day You know, which way the wind is blowing from and it just feel like you just end up making me feel like a sucker like your a mark or you're Being somehow cheated even if you're not and that's the problem.
[SPEAKER_00]: Anyway, let's keep going How about run flat tires or lack of a spare or the wrong
[SPEAKER_00]: spare let's let's well there's a lot of subjects.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so run flat people hate we know that lack of a spare tire that a little book it But the most interesting one is happening in trucks.
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's talk about the wrong spare.
[SPEAKER_00]: What does that mean?
[SPEAKER_01]: So I had a struck Chevy Colorado trail bus, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: It came with really aggressive because I expected out
[SPEAKER_01]: with these Dura truck territory MT tires.
[SPEAKER_01]: With these are good years, they're very beefy, they have big lugs, they're very aggressive, they're helping go off road, and then you go underneath the truck to look at the spare tire, which is there, and it's just a street tire, it's completely different.
[SPEAKER_00]: from my other tires.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and if you're on the trail and you get a flat and all of a sudden you've got three off road tires and one, not off road tires.
[SPEAKER_00]: If I'm on red cone and I have to go through the rock garden, I promise you I do not want to do that on a street tire because the chances of me blowing out the sidewall or puncturing it with the point of your rock are pretty significant, which makes that spare tire sort of useless.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and I've seen this over again, like we recently had the RAM Warlock.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, same thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: Had the Dure trucks, very aggressive tires on the outside, and then kind of an old season tire underneath.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, this was the cool thing about trucks.
[SPEAKER_00]: The manufacturers understood the trucks were work tools, and they didn't tend to play these shenanigans, but now they're playing the shenanigans with pickup trucks as well.
[SPEAKER_01]: And you know what also irks me, like the latest electric truck from GM, you know, the CRIT for EV, Silverado EV, Trailboss,
[SPEAKER_01]: They're very beefy tires, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: There are 35s that are on them, but they have no spare whatsoever Because it doesn't fit underneath, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: These big tires are hard to kind of place inside of a vehicle sometimes Then we'll have spares.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I know it's crazy.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so I'm gonna put these next two together a login screens and paper view
[SPEAKER_00]: or play preview stuff.
[SPEAKER_00]: So log and screens are insidious, ostensibly the manufacturer says, hey, if you log into the vehicle, it'll remember your seeding position, remember your temperature, remember your favorite radio stations.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's nice.
[SPEAKER_00]: It'll also remember where you're driving.
[SPEAKER_00]: And it will also share that information at a cost.
[SPEAKER_00]: to you, but at profit to the manufacturer with whatever person wants to know whatever you're up to when you get in their car.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's just insidious and it's just, you know, cars to me always represented freedom, so do trucks.
[SPEAKER_00]: And now, not only is the manufacturer tracking me, but they're selling that information.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's better not cool.
[SPEAKER_01]: And let's say that you got, that's more than not cool.
[SPEAKER_00]: No, let's say that you've got some kind of a medical condition and all of a sudden, you know, next thing you know, hey, do you have cancer, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: How does your phone know that you have cancer unless, of course, the car is track- listening to your local cancer clinic.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not saying that this is something that's being done by a suspected is.
[SPEAKER_00]: I suspect this is worth heading, and then the other thing that Toyota does is the pay per view stuff.
[SPEAKER_00]: In other words, pay per view.
[SPEAKER_00]: So everybody, if you want to unlock all the features of the car, whether it's more horsepower, or whether it's more remote start, or maybe it's like, what's, what's,
[SPEAKER_00]: a satellite radio or a blue cruise is a subscription is a subscription super cruise super cruise is a subscription what's the other one satellite radio the the one the GM does at the safety thing oh on star on star yeah or it notifies
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, one piece of a crash or like two to dozens in their system.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you want to actually have all the use of all of the cars IP If you want to have full use of like I think and two to navigation Make a native you can always have navigation your phone, but you don't want to use in your phone if you want the native system you get a pay for it
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, come on guys, you know, cars already, the average cost of cars already $50,000.
[SPEAKER_00]: You really need to now penny nickel and dime us so that we pay extra for some other things.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's just crazy.
[SPEAKER_00]: Just crazy.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's embarrassing, it makes car companies.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you're listening to me, anybody, it makes you look like a cheap uncle.
[SPEAKER_00]: So here's the way to solve this.
[SPEAKER_01]: I have a solution, yeah, just for this item.
[SPEAKER_01]: I hate subscriptions because I think all of us pay for many different subscriptions like our producer Cole to watch a football game.
[SPEAKER_01]: You have to pay three different providers.
[SPEAKER_00]: providers to watch all the football games.
[SPEAKER_01]: I know, but there's a solution for cars and trucks.
[SPEAKER_01]: Create enthusiast items, for example, for me.
[SPEAKER_01]: I love, you know, with tow trailers all the time.
[SPEAKER_01]: And a lot of the vehicles don't provide a lot of the, you know, gauges that are required by me to monitor the truck.
[SPEAKER_01]: Just charge me another $100, not a subscription, but at one time fee and give me more gauges.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'll pay for that.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's the way for that.
[SPEAKER_00]: But then, people saying that they'll pay for Google, native Google, Android apps, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: And there are people saying that they'll pay for blue crews.
[SPEAKER_00]: So there's always somebody who's willing to pay, and from a manufacturer point of view, if you're willing to pay for this, then there are probably other people in the pay for it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Here's the real solution.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is the answer, Andrew.
[SPEAKER_00]: What?
[SPEAKER_00]: The answer is, build a freaking cheap trucker car, like slate, maybe?
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then, then, if you want to go and say, hey, you want,
[SPEAKER_00]: The navigation, or you want ADAS, or you want more horsepower, retractable door handles, then charge me for it.
[SPEAKER_00]: If I'm paying $20,000 for a slate, I'm like, hell, yeah, okay, I can, you know, it's kind of like spirit airlines or frontier, it kind of makes sense.
[SPEAKER_00]: If I'm paying, you know, $14.99 to fly to Fort Lauderdale, then I'm probably gonna pay $100 to bring my bags on board and $15 for a Coke.
[SPEAKER_00]: I understand that, I understand low cost airlines.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I understand that if you're paying nothing for the car or very little then maybe you have to make up that somewhere else But don't charge me 50,000 don't charge me premium pricing or 80,000 and then yeah, and it's like I said it looks like you're cheap uncle like he brings you lunch and by the way Where's the 20 you owe me?
[SPEAKER_00]: All right This is also another way that makes car makers look cheap nine powered passenger seats.
[SPEAKER_00]: What's wrong with that?
[SPEAKER_00]: Because I feel like if I'm a passenger I'm a second class citizen it's so often that you have a driver has full passenger electric controls But the driver is the second class poor citizen who has a way.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah, so the passenger gets non-powered seats Where the driver gets all of the luxuries why not just put it in both seats.
[SPEAKER_00]: Come on.
[SPEAKER_01]: Don't cheap out But you're saving weight you're saving cost like if I'm okay with that
[SPEAKER_01]: simplicity.
[SPEAKER_00]: I can move my own seat.
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like I'm a bad host.
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like I get in my car on Dre and I sit in the car and I'm like, oh, and I retract the seat.
[SPEAKER_00]: I've moved my lumbar support.
[SPEAKER_00]: I got that 800 way thing and I'm so comfortable and like, hey, Andre, just reach underneath there between your legs and slide back and forth.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then reach behind you and you may feel a lever where you can actually rely on or decryses.
[SPEAKER_01]: I can't see the message, can you see Brian's message over there?
[SPEAKER_01]: Can you give us Brian's message, please?
[SPEAKER_01]: No, it's on the screen, it's bling blocked by the camera.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, I see.
[SPEAKER_01]: Can you greet it?
[SPEAKER_00]: Or is he coming from my glasses?
[SPEAKER_00]: No.
[SPEAKER_00]: Hold on.
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, Brian, thank you.
[SPEAKER_01]: I got it.
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_01]: Brian, 100% agree that dealers' actions make me feel dirty and like I don't want
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't want to deal with them.
[SPEAKER_01]: Excellent point, Roman.
[SPEAKER_01]: See you, Brian.
[SPEAKER_01]: Appreciate it.
[SPEAKER_01]: Brian agrees with you.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm with Roman on the power passenger seat.
[SPEAKER_00]: Once again, yeah, and then how about this one?
[SPEAKER_00]: How about when they cheap out on the lumbar?
[SPEAKER_00]: I have a bad back, and lumbar to me is so critical, especially on any trip over, let's say, an hour.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I hate when they just decide that, how much can a lumbar, even like the European manual ones, remember once upon a time, Andre?
[SPEAKER_00]: You were a Volkswagen guy once upon a time.
[SPEAKER_00]: Volkswagen would do this, so they look a little lever.
[SPEAKER_00]: A little lever on the inside of the seat.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, the outside.
[SPEAKER_00]: And you would just push it forward and it would push out the lumbar.
[SPEAKER_00]: Boom, how expensive can that be?
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know.
[SPEAKER_00]: I hate it when I get in the seat and actually the I8 that we own which is a very 150,000-dollar car.
[SPEAKER_00]: No number.
[SPEAKER_00]: Really?
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think they were mindful about weight cost.
[SPEAKER_01]: That could be weight.
[SPEAKER_00]: That one actually could be weight.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well because it's a hybrid.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a kind of a high show.
[SPEAKER_00]: That was like it was like their moonshine.
[SPEAKER_00]: So that's like a moonshot sending a rocket to the moon.
[SPEAKER_00]: You're probably going to be a little weary of added weight.
[SPEAKER_00]: All right, let's finish this up So here's one of the biggest ones that I absolutely hate and then when I get in the car and I see this I just want to walk out non-round steering wheels
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I agree.
[SPEAKER_00]: What's why why do we have to have workers either squircles or little pentagons or yokes little yokes Yeah, I don't know why why reinvent the wheel and speaking the reinvent the wheel how about the ever changing shift slash Nabs slash lever slash Rotary Nabs slash stock slash button for engaging transmissions.
[SPEAKER_00]: Just pick one and stick with it
[SPEAKER_01]: You know what I used to like and I still love and a lot of new vehicles also have this column shift.
[SPEAKER_01]: Sure, like it just goes down.
[SPEAKER_01]: Go down for drive, up for reverse, up for part.
[SPEAKER_00]: Hey, Brian, thanks for all the comments.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's got some work on that.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I agree.
[SPEAKER_01]: I also have a bad back.
[SPEAKER_01]: Brian, you should do this podcast.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's going to do it.
[SPEAKER_01]: You can do the grumpy podcast for us.
[SPEAKER_01]: Manufacturers that make them really worthwhile.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and here's the scary part.
[SPEAKER_00]: We're all done with this list.
[SPEAKER_00]: I came up with this list in like five minutes.
[SPEAKER_00]: I didn't have to actually use a lot of brain power on this list.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's how easy this was because over the last, let's say five to 10 years, manufacturers have decided that they're going to reinvent everything, and I blame Tesla for this.
[SPEAKER_00]: because Tesla, you know, came along and completely rethought what a car is, you know, it took it from, well, they took it from, it took it from a car to mobility, it took it from kind of car centric to tech centric, and now all the other manufacturers are following suit, and they still have a stock price, everybody saw Tesla stock price, and they're like, why can't we be like them?
[SPEAKER_01]: So are you saying the GMs that started building robots?
[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe, all right, I'll end on this trivia before we close the word robot, word of the word come from it's near and dear to my heart I'll give you a clue and it's the same word for the same thing everywhere in the country in the world as well So it's not just in America, but it's robot is robot and Spanish and English I don't know if it's robot in Chinese.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm guessing but it came from one place and you guys have to name where the word robot came from it Like I say it's near and dear to my heart
[SPEAKER_00]: So that's a hint.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, robot is robot in Russian.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, exactly.
[SPEAKER_00]: Is it robot in Spanish?
[SPEAKER_00]: Hello?
[SPEAKER_00]: Anybody out there?
[SPEAKER_00]: Cold, do you know Spanish?
[SPEAKER_00]: By the way, colonists from Oregon, you can't get a Hellcat during go either.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, you're one of the Carb State people, too.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know we're planning the new one, getting her that RAF4.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, he's going to get a couple.
[SPEAKER_00]: So invested in it, like, yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: So please comment, what is the origin of the word robot?
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, why is it the same in robotics, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: Or yeah, yeah, just the word robot.
[SPEAKER_00]: All right, guys, thank you for watching and listening.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you want to watch this, feel free to have an over to TFL talk that
[SPEAKER_00]: podcast channel Andre, thank you for sitting in for telling me today.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm really grateful that you have the time to do this.
[SPEAKER_00]: You're welcome.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, and thank you guys for watching and remember where should they go if they want to see all of our actually before we do that.
[SPEAKER_00]: Why don't we tell them what videos are being broadcast published this weekend because we got a bunch of great stuff coming out this weekend.
[SPEAKER_00]: I love your video.
[SPEAKER_00]: So once you're talking about the three truck comparison.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's, we're trying to figure out what is the best V8 brand new pickup truck with a V8 engine for towing.
[SPEAKER_01]: So we're comparing a GM V8, 5-3, Hemi 5-7, and 4-5-0, Kaori engine.
[SPEAKER_01]: So one video that's coming this weekend, then on the, update, update, update.
[SPEAKER_01]: Then on Afro channel, our colleague case, this is actually with Tommy.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_01]: On the Toyota program.
[SPEAKER_01]: A-Bade.
[SPEAKER_01]: He drives an eighth by eight man cat.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is a military truck from Germany.
[SPEAKER_01]: He drives it It's pretty awesome.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's not a hybrid human that's half man half cat That would be more interesting in some ways.
[SPEAKER_01]: So you know there's a company called man M.A.N But then they built military trucks and they were called caterpillar?
[SPEAKER_01]: No, okay, so but they uh They called him category one
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, so that's where they came up.
[SPEAKER_01]: So they shortened the category.
[SPEAKER_01]: They said, how about we call them mancats?
[SPEAKER_01]: OK.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know why.
[SPEAKER_01]: No, this is amazing.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and now in our classic channel, you know, I have a sickness.
[SPEAKER_00]: We have this auction here in Denver called the donated car auction where people basically donate cars to their favorite charities.
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's say you have a favorite charity that you like to support a lot of people.
[SPEAKER_00]: But also like unwanted cars.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, a lot of people do that with like their local radio and national public radio stations.
[SPEAKER_00]: Is it MPR?
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah stations Then of course those radio stations either take them in the junkyard and they get whatever junkyard pays for them or They take them to this donated car auction and usually the donated cars a lot of them aren't actually bad.
[SPEAKER_00]: They're they're just either unwanted or A way to something broke that was too expensive to fix or something like that
[SPEAKER_00]: So you can get screaming bargains, actually time you got his land row row this auction He still drives it.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's still drives it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's called the peak Auto I shouldn't be telling people because they're gonna go to it No, that doesn't exist.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a mystery the donate a car auction the peak It's peak don't need a car auction It's peak right peak out of auction don't need a car Yeah, because there's a bunch of most of them are basically a lot of states have peak peak out of auction
[SPEAKER_00]: yeah so most of these are like uh... records and uh... toy companies and basically sell the cars that they either tow back to the yard and that they the people don't want them or they are wrecked but these are actually real cars that have real titles that mostly run so i picked up get this i picked up the only italian can't like and you guys know what that is
[SPEAKER_01]: No, Brian is already commenting about robot.
[SPEAKER_01]: Brian.
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you very much.
[SPEAKER_01]: What do you say?
[SPEAKER_01]: Did you get it?
[SPEAKER_01]: I think you got it.
[SPEAKER_00]: What the hell?
[SPEAKER_00]: Brian?
[SPEAKER_01]: Can we send them our challenge coin?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, we'll send you a challenge coin.
[SPEAKER_00]: Brian.
[SPEAKER_01]: Can you please email ask at TFL?
[SPEAKER_00]: We can look up his address in the, in the Patreon.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's a patreon.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, you're a patreon.
[SPEAKER_00]: We'll send you a challenge coin.
[SPEAKER_00]: A TFL challenge coin.
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, I'll untay.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yep, you got you got a chance.
[SPEAKER_00]: So Sean, we will send you a sticker Because that was an easy one But what did Brian say?
[SPEAKER_00]: We got to give him the answer.
[SPEAKER_00]: What did he say about the the turn robot?
[SPEAKER_01]: He says originated from a check word Who's checking this room or robot that?
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, very good.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a check word.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, okay.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, take take that mystery Russian It's the checks who came up with that word
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not going to argue with this right now.
[SPEAKER_00]: So we have these challenge coins.
[SPEAKER_00]: They're cool Andre made him.
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you very much.
[SPEAKER_00]: And well, Brian, we'll send you one of those.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think your address is in Patreon and then Sean.
[SPEAKER_00]: Did he get the, did he get the, a lot to your right?
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, he did.
[SPEAKER_00]: All right, congratulations.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, just shoot us an email guys, just to be on the safe side.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, because I don't know if we have it so strong, you can send it to Info with TFL car or ask a TFL truck.com.
[SPEAKER_00]: Both of those, and we'll send you that as a thank you for participating in this podcast.
[SPEAKER_00]: And if you guys want to join us, please head on over to patreon slash tflcar.com where you can become part of the team and you get early access to this videos.
[SPEAKER_00]: You get early access to
[SPEAKER_00]: unusual and interesting content that we don't publish anywhere else and you get, of course, as podcasts and you get the grateful support and thanks of a team that really appreciates that you guys are helping us.
[SPEAKER_00]: We do pay the bills because it's not getting any easier in my friend.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's getting harder.
[SPEAKER_00]: No, that's not getting any easier.
[SPEAKER_00]: So that's coming.
[SPEAKER_00]: Right, the classic.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: So we bought an Alante and that video is coming up on classics.
[SPEAKER_00]: So we've got the
[SPEAKER_00]: That's plenty out.
[SPEAKER_00]: What's a truck podcast?
[SPEAKER_00]: There's a truck podcast, too.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's publishing.
[SPEAKER_00]: What did you guys talk about?
[SPEAKER_00]: With case.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: We weren't that grumpy.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, we were a little grumpy.
[SPEAKER_01]: The grumpy podcast.
[SPEAKER_01]: Which is the grumpy podcast.
[SPEAKER_01]: Hold on for that.
[SPEAKER_01]: But.
[SPEAKER_01]: But we talked about really coolest trucks, pick-up trucks, that we can't have.
[SPEAKER_01]: Also, trucks that are sold in other markets, mainly Australia, so our friends in Australia, you're quite lucky, you do have some really cool stuff over there.
[SPEAKER_01]: That we can get and we're quite upset by this.
[SPEAKER_00]: So if you're a patreon, you're probably or you're listening to it, or you have access to it.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, we had a, no.
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, that's what we had a technical difficulty.
[SPEAKER_00]: We had a equipment failure, didn't we?
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_01]: We had something fail, but thanks to your support on patreon.com, we will be able to, we're fixing it.
[SPEAKER_01]: We fixed it.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, yeah, we bought a new piece of equipment.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a box.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's $200.
[SPEAKER_00]: The Zachbot that we had to pay for.
[SPEAKER_00]: So thank you, Zach, as well for being so conscientious.
[SPEAKER_00]: All right.
[SPEAKER_00]: We'll see you next time, child.