[SPEAKER_00]: Welcome to the Come Follow Him Podcast.
[SPEAKER_00]: This podcast is created by the Boise Nampa Institute of Religion for the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
[SPEAKER_00]: Here, we hope to help young adults find relevant principles each week as they study the Assign Come Follow Me in Scripture Block as outlined by the Church.
[SPEAKER_00]: This episode is simply two links to two teachers talking about what they see in the Scriptures that might be relevant to your life.
[SPEAKER_00]: It is not intended to speak for the church or to definitively define doctrines or policies.
[SPEAKER_00]: And the opinions shared here are just that.
[SPEAKER_00]: Our opinions as we have learned to come follow him.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm your host, Matt Swanson.
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's jump in.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, welcome back, everybody.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's good to be again with you this week again and with my friend, Brother John Gagnon.
[SPEAKER_00]: Brother Gagnon, welcome back.
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you.
[SPEAKER_00]: Good to be here.
[SPEAKER_00]: Not been long since we had you on last.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think we covered section seventy and the last time and then seventy three.
[SPEAKER_00]: And we're glad to have you back into a section that is huge, so huge, literally the largest section, and covers so much.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm excited to dive into it and see what we come up with.
[SPEAKER_00]: Before we do, we talk last time about this being your last, maybe semester coming up in Seminary Institute, retiring at the end of, is it December you're retiring into December school calendar year?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, you're making me make this official.
[SPEAKER_00]: I am.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I'm thinking that this might be the last official time we have you on the podcast as a, as a, a faculty member here at the Institute.
[SPEAKER_00]: So it could be kind of better sweet for me, but yeah, yeah, it's been great.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm sure we'll find opportunities to, to be around each other again and I'll, I'll still fight to keep you on the podcast.
[SPEAKER_00]: How about that?
[SPEAKER_00]: But with that, let's just dive in.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's so much to cover today.
[SPEAKER_00]: I worry about getting through it all.
[SPEAKER_00]: A hundred and fourteen sections of this verse does in this section.
[SPEAKER_00]: And you know what John, maybe we do this.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know there's some context that we want to give.
[SPEAKER_00]: But maybe after the context, we just jump into the end.
[SPEAKER_00]: and cover that last section that has to do with the school of the profits.
[SPEAKER_00]: And because it's not that it's disconnected from the first portion, but it's just a little bit different in its make-up.
[SPEAKER_00]: So it might be something we cover just fairly quickly at the beginning, make sure we get it covered, and then we jump back to the beginning, is that sound like a plan?
[SPEAKER_01]: Sounds like a plan.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I'll check it out.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, give us some context.
[SPEAKER_00]: What should we know about Section Eighty-eight and how we got what we're going?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: Looks like it's divided up into a couple of days, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: Relations to receive is not uncommon.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not the first time this has happened.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think, as I look at the dates, I realize that this is probably about six months before
[SPEAKER_01]: the summer of thirty three and if you recall from church history summer thirty three churches asked to basically from that point on that they're asked to leave Missouri people are becoming unhappy with having the saints they're coming in by the hundreds almost daily they're moving in
[SPEAKER_01]: There are political differences.
[SPEAKER_01]: There's political differences.
[SPEAKER_01]: There's differences in where they came from.
[SPEAKER_01]: There's a whole bunch of reasons why why the persecution began to occur.
[SPEAKER_01]: But this is six months before that.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm just wondering, I'd like to think of it this way, that because Heavenly Father knows everything, He's Alpha and Omega right at the beginning of the end.
[SPEAKER_01]: He knows that this section may be very helpful as the Saints run into these situations.
[SPEAKER_01]: They'll be able to look back and read these wonderful truths.
[SPEAKER_01]: that are designed to bring peace to us as it says in the second heading.
[SPEAKER_00]: I love that.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's called the olive leaf from the tree of paradise, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, as you said that, John, I kind of had a little, I don't know, it's not a vision for sure, but just a little visual representation of what probably happens on the other side of the veil.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, we learned in the temple that the Father directs everything that goes on on the earth.
[SPEAKER_00]: The sun is acting on behalf of the Father and everything he does.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's given charge to direct the affairs of the earth for sure.
[SPEAKER_00]: But the temple structure would teach us that the Savior doesn't do anything until He's told to do it by the Father and the Father having
[SPEAKER_00]: all knowledge, past, present, future, and probably the sun does as well at this point.
[SPEAKER_00]: But it's interesting to me because I think on December, twenty-seven, eighteen, thirty-two, if the father went to the Savior and said, would you go down and teach this?
[SPEAKER_00]: And then on the twenty-eighths go back and teach this, and then on the third of January, eighteen, thirty-three, would you go back and would you teach this?
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, it's the way that Adam and Eve were taught things under the direction of the Father.
[SPEAKER_00]: The Savior came and taught and the Spirit ratified and
[SPEAKER_00]: sanctioned.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I just think that that's an interesting way of viewing these revelations coming from the father who knows when to send it and the son being obedient and directing our knowledge as it's needed in our honor.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's a interesting way of viewing that knowing what's coming in our in our future here on, unlike the pandemic.
[SPEAKER_01]: Right, yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: The seizure of the pain that me was coming, and so what did he do?
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, come follow me, institute static.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's a lot of things put in place so that when that happens, we're ready to go.
[SPEAKER_01]: So that's definitely, yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: And we, you and I had some training where someone came and spoke with us, and I won't quote, because they told us not to, but said that, you know, the years that had taken to get, come follow me in place.
[SPEAKER_00]: was many years.
[SPEAKER_00]: You don't put together a home-studied resource in the three months it took from the beginning of the pandemic for the church to get all that stuff out.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's not written in, you know, eighteen different languages and correlated and all the things that are necessary.
[SPEAKER_00]: It didn't happen because President Nelson became the prophet of the church.
[SPEAKER_00]: That was well in order way before.
[SPEAKER_00]: And so the Lord knew much much earlier than, you know,
[SPEAKER_00]: Twenty nineteen that we're gonna have a pandemic in twenty twenty and started the wheel spinning much much earlier than that Much of it just happened to hit the fan right when President Nelson was called within the first couple of years of that but but that had been in the works for many years prior to that and a lot of other things missionary change that.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's been about two hours in church and Home study didn't you know all those things yeah
[SPEAKER_00]: So, well, some Lord knows what's coming and he's going to give a whole bunch of what's coming here in this section.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, with that, let's just jump in.
[SPEAKER_00]: Can we just read the first verse?
[SPEAKER_00]: Because I think there's some great things there.
[SPEAKER_00]: Is that okay?
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_00]: It says, fairly, let's say at the Lord unto you, who have assembled yourselves together to receive His will concerning you.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think there is something interesting about those two things that have been done.
[SPEAKER_00]: We have assembled ourselves, that these people had assembled themselves.
[SPEAKER_00]: And the purpose for that was to receive his will.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then verse two says, behold, this is pleasing unto your Lord.
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's interesting what is pleasing that they were gathered or that they were receiving as well.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think both have to be true.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think we're generally in the church pretty good at gathering ourselves together, but actually listening and receiving his will is something maybe we don't do as much.
[SPEAKER_00]: Think about just general conference and how frequently we
[SPEAKER_00]: We listen to a whole two days worth of conference.
[SPEAKER_00]: We come away with with three one liners that we really loved and we miss the messages in the fullness of the talks and the his will really concerning us.
[SPEAKER_00]: We just grasp on to the two or three one liners that we love there are pickled us and that's okay, but but man there's more in there.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think when it says pleasing unto the Lord, we could also say it's like, I think you were referencing that it's disappointing.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: The Lord, when we won't come with the attitude to want to receive his will, the story that I think most of us are familiar with when President Packer, when he was elder Packer, went to the BYU, it's center.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, but devotional or something.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think there were people where come spread out, and I remember he made the invitation right to come closer, come down, we want you to come closer, and after two or three occasions, an invitation to do that, then help me with the story, if I don't get this right, and I think finally, I think someone got up and said, well,
[SPEAKER_01]: That's it for the day.
[SPEAKER_01]: Basically, thanks for coming and we'll see you later.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not sure if anything more was said or if there was something.
[SPEAKER_01]: You remember the rest of that?
[SPEAKER_00]: Just that.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you're not going to listen to, I think what had happened is President Packard invited whoever was conducting the meeting to invite everybody to come down and then it did that two or three times and they just kind of refused to come down.
[SPEAKER_00]: And by the time they were excused, the message had been given.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I don't remember if President Packer stood up and gave the message or asked the conducting officer to give the message.
[SPEAKER_00]: But the message was given that if you're not going to listen to the invitation to gather closer by the person conducting, why would you listen to the apostle who's about to speak to you?
[SPEAKER_00]: Kind of message and that's not a verbatim quarter anything.
[SPEAKER_00]: But that message was received that day.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then they were excused.
[SPEAKER_00]: And that was it done.
[SPEAKER_00]: Gathered together is different than receiving.
[SPEAKER_00]: Right?
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: They are different.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, this gathering, as you said, happened over three days, there's actually a lot of revelation received at this time.
[SPEAKER_00]: Section Eighty-seven had been received on Christmas Day, and that's the one referencing the coming wars of a war in the country, having to do with the issue of racism in the country.
[SPEAKER_00]: and then two days later we get the beginnings of this and section eighty eight and then the next day we get another portion of it and then four or five days later we get the the latter portion of it so that so it's kind of received over the course of a significant period of revelation coming to Joseph and like I said let's let's jump to the end of this the latter portion versus one twenty seven one forty one were received
[SPEAKER_00]: on January third of eighteen thirty three in and I'm not exactly sure why they're all compiled into the same section here and probably if I was smarter or better stored of the scriptures I would understand that but but in verse one twenty six we get kind of a sign off pray always that you may not be that you may not faint until I come behold low like I will come quickly and receive you into myself amen so we get the end of the uh...
[SPEAKER_00]: previous revelation and then we get the beginning of the new one.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is again three or four or five days later into verse one twenty seven where we get the structure of the school of the prophets kind of laid out and the school of the prophets was well, I don't know why I wanted to describe and explain to us what the school of the prophets was for those of us that maybe don't know it perfectly.
[SPEAKER_01]: Kind of I understand it as kind of the NTC for missionaries as they had out into the
[SPEAKER_01]: out into the world to teach the gospel because we know that many are being called.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is the work of gathering.
[SPEAKER_01]: They're all concerned about that.
[SPEAKER_01]: They establish, move design, teaching the gospel, they're putting the public publishing the scriptures so they can have them and extend those out to everybody.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so the versus one twenty seven to the, I don't know, one thirty one are are kind of counsel about the director, the profit leading and and the president of the school being the teacher.
[SPEAKER_00]: He that is appointed to be president or teacher.
[SPEAKER_00]: She'll be found standing in his place in the house.
[SPEAKER_00]: which shall be prepared for him.
[SPEAKER_00]: So there's a home kind of created for him to live.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then you shared something at the end of our time on section one seventy to seventy three having to do with this latter portion here.
[SPEAKER_00]: And maybe I'll just give you the floor to share that again.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think for those that missed it.
[SPEAKER_00]: And even for those that heard it, it's wonderful to hear it again.
[SPEAKER_00]: Just how these brethren were supposed to receive each other.
[SPEAKER_00]: And how they were supposed to be welcomed into each other.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, you bad if you look back at one twenty-five versus one twenty-five.
[SPEAKER_01]: All things clothe yourselves with the bond of charity as with a mantle which is the bond of perfectness and peace.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so there it is right.
[SPEAKER_01]: The ultimate attribute we're trying to acquire is the love of God.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's like the Savior and
[SPEAKER_01]: And the bond of charity, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: If we don't have charity, all things fail.
[SPEAKER_01]: Right?
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, I charity everything else fails.
[SPEAKER_01]: So we've read in the Paul's writings.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so, soon you get that beautiful description of how they're to greet one another when they come to the school of the prophets.
[SPEAKER_01]: One, thirty-three.
[SPEAKER_00]: That verse there is that one.
[SPEAKER_01]: That is one, thirty-three.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I have heard others and I can't think right off time I had.
[SPEAKER_01]: But this could also be referenced to the temple.
[SPEAKER_01]: preparation and how we greet each other and the temple as well and how we I think of the word stand there we stand and there's some anyway there's just some interesting interweaving with what we do in the temple with what's happening in the school of the prophets certainly greeting everybody with charity this morning as I went to the temple it was just great to have you walk into the temple and you feel that charity and that love there's people that you know in there and they just
[SPEAKER_01]: I'll tell you what, I don't know if I ever heard an argument in the temple.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it's just the way we greet one another.
[SPEAKER_01]: We're a counsel if you're a temple worker.
[SPEAKER_01]: You're counsel that you want to make sure that when you greet people, this is the house of the Lord.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is different.
[SPEAKER_01]: We treat each other with kindness and respect.
[SPEAKER_01]: We don't just go on talking about kinds of different things in the temple.
[SPEAKER_01]: focus on the saber and on the building of each other and you feel that when you go to the temple.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I think that relates to what's happening here and it's a preface for that role.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think that's great.
[SPEAKER_00]: You think about what it would be like to walk into a classroom and the teacher, the president of that space, standing so according to verse one thirty two.
[SPEAKER_00]: A rising and with uplifted hands to heaven, even directly saluting his brother or brethren, with these words, art thou a brother or brethren?
[SPEAKER_00]: I salute you in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and token and remembrance of the everlasting covenant, which I covenant I receive you to fellowship and determination is fixed and movable and changeable to be your friend.
[SPEAKER_00]: And brothers and the grace of God and the bonds of love, to walk in all the commandments of God blameless and Thanksgiving forever and ever amen.
[SPEAKER_00]: want to be great to just have our teachers say you're my friend.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm so glad you're here and I'm just going to covenant with you to teach and help and and lift where I can and and and be your friend and be your brother.
[SPEAKER_01]: I just can I can I just interject here.
[SPEAKER_01]: I know you have made references to me and how nice it would be to be in my office.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'll tell you what when I see this when I read this I think
[SPEAKER_01]: that every person that comes to a class with mass, Swinson would feel a fellowship and that you're immovable, unchangeable determination to be their friend and brother.
[SPEAKER_01]: Regardless of where they are on the, where they are in their journey.
[SPEAKER_01]: You know what I mean?
[SPEAKER_01]: You had many people in your classes and I just believe and I've seen this in sense that
[SPEAKER_01]: Everybody would feel comfortable to be with you, so I just wanted to thank you.
[SPEAKER_00]: Because you've been so kind to me.
[SPEAKER_00]: I appreciate that.
[SPEAKER_00]: There are definitely the occasional fifteen-year-old that is in their own special space that I can't quite grasp, but for sure, I think we all attempt that right when we're given a stewardship to teach, we try to love and get to know and understand, but
[SPEAKER_00]: But I think that that message is important, especially for those that are teachers and those that are assigned as a steward over a class, you know, that we have that.
[SPEAKER_00]: What is it?
[SPEAKER_00]: Bonds of love, to walking commandments together, blameless and Thanksgiving.
[SPEAKER_00]: So anyway, I think there's just some things in here about the school of profits that's tender.
[SPEAKER_00]: Early on, you and I looked this up before hit record because we didn't know much.
[SPEAKER_00]: verse one thirty eight you shall not receive any among you into the school save his claim from the blood of this generation and he shall be received by the ordinance of washing of feet for unto this end was the ordinance of washing of feet instituted and again the ordinance of washing of feet is to be administered by the president or presiding elder of the church it is to be commenced with prayer and after partaking a bread and wine so the sacrament
[SPEAKER_00]: He is to gird himself according to the pattern given in the thirteenth chapter of John's testimony concerning me.
[SPEAKER_00]: Amen, there it is.
[SPEAKER_00]: Stand.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, that thirteenth section of John talks a little bit about being girded about with a towel.
[SPEAKER_00]: So the president or the presiding elder would gird themselves with a towel and then the members of the school would come up and have their feet washed.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, in a little bit of looking that you and I did before we hit record, we found that
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, let me just read this, an ordinance following the pattern set by Jesus Christ in the New Testament, symbolizing unity, bestowing purification, spiritual power.
[SPEAKER_00]: At the first meeting of the School of the Prophets in January of XIII-III-III-III, so this is received at the same month.
[SPEAKER_00]: So Smith washed the feet of the elders present and pronounced them clean from the blood of this generation.
[SPEAKER_00]: Then two years later, in the fall of XIII-III-III-III-III-five, Joseph Smith directed church leaders,
[SPEAKER_00]: to prepare for a solemn assembly in the House of the Lord in Kirtland, Ohio, where they would be richly purified through the washing of feet prior to the endowment of power.
[SPEAKER_00]: A ritual washing of feet was given to church leaders and official members in the House of the Lord beginning on the twenty-ninth of March,
[SPEAKER_00]: finished at the Asalamu Assembly on March thirty fifth and then a month later April six of eighteen thirty seven or sorry a year in a month later.
[SPEAKER_00]: Asalamu Assembly attendees who had not been present in eighteen thirty six assemblage received the washing of the feet and blessings from that.
[SPEAKER_00]: We don't know because prophets haven't spoken of it.
[SPEAKER_00]: If that ordinance is still performed by apostles today for one another or for each other or or ever.
[SPEAKER_00]: But we do know that it was, at least for a time, reorganized on the Earth, that ordinance was reorganized and restored through the prophet Joseph Smith.
[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe it's part of the restitution of all things like polygamy and other principles that have been practiced in previous generations needed to be restored as part of the
[SPEAKER_01]: restitution of all things.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, like and like as reference, John chapter thirteen, I think it's verses five through sixteen are where we learn about Christ washing feet and that ordinance was something that was was done then as well.
[SPEAKER_00]: So there's the restoration of all right, whether it's for a long period of time or a short period of time, the restoration of all things is necessary, isn't it?
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, let's go ahead.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm just going to say at the end of one thirty seven that are, you know, just read this.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is a year called to do this by prayer and Thanksgiving as the spirit shall get utterance and all your doings in the house of the Lord.
[SPEAKER_01]: in the school of the prophets that it may become a sanctuary, a tabernacle of the Holy Spirit, to your anification.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, as long as that just says, this is the purpose right for their anification.
[SPEAKER_00]: edify you and to be washed clean and you know that by it would be pretty significant.
[SPEAKER_00]: Amazing.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: Had an opportunity at the end of my mission.
[SPEAKER_00]: My mission president was was told once in an interview he had with an apostle to
[SPEAKER_00]: when prompted at the end of a missionary service to share that their sins had been washed clean again, as if they had been baptized a new and my mission president shared that experience and then was able to tell me that at the close of my mission and that was
[SPEAKER_00]: Wow, that was fantastic.
[SPEAKER_00]: I wasn't a perfect missionary.
[SPEAKER_00]: I tried to serve, and in the best I could, but to be told that according to my mission president from a prompting he had received, with the keys he held that I had served in a way that he felt he could say that to me.
[SPEAKER_00]: It was significant.
[SPEAKER_00]: It was something else.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, however that might happen in our lives, I think, is worth seeking after.
[SPEAKER_00]: But that could happen every Sunday with the sacrament, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: That's a serrated.
[SPEAKER_01]: And it brings us right back to Section Eighty-eight, the first couple of verses.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know if we were intended to do that, but it sounds like it goes right to where you receive special promises based on, you know, or worthy news and the promise of, you know, the computer, the second computer we call it and which, which I give and do, verse four, eternal even the glory of the source to Kingdom.
[SPEAKER_01]: And that would be the ultimate missionary interview, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: And have your mission presidents say to you and to me someday.
[SPEAKER_01]: And hopefully that will happen for each of us that some way and somehow will come to know.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I don't know how all this works.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know a lot about it.
[SPEAKER_01]: I just know that there will come a day.
[SPEAKER_01]: It came a time when you and I will know if we are sealed up onto eternal life.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's at the end of my patriarchal blessing.
[SPEAKER_01]: As soon again I'm making some assumptions, but I've heard others say that that kind of is said at the end of their patriarchal blessing that they're coming day when you will
[SPEAKER_01]: You'll know that.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that's a pretty awesome promise.
[SPEAKER_00]: And fairly common, I would venture to say, I think you're right, that there are some assumptions in that.
[SPEAKER_00]: Can we just second John, I need to plug my headphones in there, Diane.
[SPEAKER_00]: Studio's got so many things plugged into it.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's hard to find a spot.
[SPEAKER_01]: When you say studios, that thing you've got upstairs in the Institute, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's hard to find a plug.
[SPEAKER_00]: You will come back and start over.
[SPEAKER_00]: Still there with me?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I can hear you.
[SPEAKER_01]: I can hear me.
[SPEAKER_00]: You get that headphone warning that you're going to lose your ears.
[SPEAKER_01]: This time, again, I don't know if I want to go down this road, but, you know, great grandmother.
[SPEAKER_01]: has in her journal that she was invited to come to the temple and received.
[SPEAKER_01]: You know what I mean?
[SPEAKER_01]: There was something and I don't have you heard these things too.
[SPEAKER_01]: We don't do, I don't think that happens today.
[SPEAKER_01]: I haven't heard anything happening today but back in the early days.
[SPEAKER_01]: There was, there was more to this and I don't know if I want to open up because I don't know anything more about it other than that could just be anecdotal one person.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well I think it was, I don't know how comb it was.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think the point is to reference that
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, these things did happen that there was a time, if not still current, a time where the Lord instructed us to do those things for whatever reasons and for our wrong.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think that's significant.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, okay, so that gets us back the beginning of section seventy, or sorry, section eighty-eight.
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's just jump in.
[SPEAKER_00]: Verse three, he calls them friends.
[SPEAKER_00]: I now send upon you another comforter, even upon you, my friends, that it may abide in your hearts, even the Holy Spirit of promise, which the other comforter is the same that I promised them to my disciples, as is recorded in this testimony of John, that comforter.
[SPEAKER_00]: is a promise which I give unto you of eternal life.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, you've kind of referenced that that's the, you know, and patriarchal blessings that that being resurrected on the morning of the first resurrection.
[SPEAKER_00]: And, you know, I think when we dedicate graves, that's often the language we use.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, that's quite the promise to be given.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's a ceiling, it's a part of the ceiling promise.
[SPEAKER_01]: You think about it.
[SPEAKER_01]: in the temple, so there's many references to that.
[SPEAKER_01]: Matt and I were talking before we jump off here for just a minute with our equipment.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then again, I don't know, this is just to simply say that this ordinance has been restored in the latter days.
[SPEAKER_01]: My wife's motive has it in her journal that she was invited to, I believe it was to the temple.
[SPEAKER_01]: And there she received her, you know, second of no things I think they were called.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think it has reference to these verses here somewhere.
[SPEAKER_01]: Now, that's not to say, I don't know if that happened, that's happening today.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not aware of that, but certainly it was restored in the early days of the church and happened for some time, and I don't know to what extent.
[SPEAKER_01]: But anyway, I just throw that out there just to show that the restitution, part of the restitution, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: That's true.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I think that's significant.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, and the reference is that those promises and that that second comforter is given verse five, which is Gloria's, that of the Church of the first born, even of God, the holiest of all through Jesus Christ the Son.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's a blessing that, like you've said, that is a covenant made that sealed upon us through our membership in Christ's true church, organized and structured with priesthood and covenants and ordinances.
[SPEAKER_00]: But then it gets into because of that and because of who he is, the holiest of all it says in verse five, it then starts really describing Christ and giving us just a beautiful description of who he is and his power and everything we have.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you'll indulge me a little bit, I'm going to read just a few verses here and then I'd love you.
[SPEAKER_00]: Actually, I want to have you read it.
[SPEAKER_00]: You have such a great radio voice.
[SPEAKER_00]: You did radio for a little while in your life too, stuff.
[SPEAKER_00]: So if you're willing, would you start maybe having just spoken about the holiest of all Jesus Christ?
[SPEAKER_00]: Would you start in verse six?
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think maybe we just need to read to twelve or thirteen or something in there.
[SPEAKER_00]: Would you be willing to do that?
[SPEAKER_01]: As long as our listeners don't fall asleep.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, I read because sometimes I've been, I've been told that sometimes my voice is so calming.
[SPEAKER_01]: So don't fall asleep.
[SPEAKER_01]: I go Grams and sunflower seeds or something to chew on while we go through this.
[SPEAKER_01]: But it is dark chocolate.
[SPEAKER_01]: It is dark chocolate, but about the saber and not on it.
[SPEAKER_01]: So verse six, here we go.
[SPEAKER_01]: He that ascended up on high as also He descended below all things and that He comprehendeth, comprehended all things, that He might be in all and through all things, the light of truth, which truth shineeth.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is the light of Christ and also He is in the sun and the light of the sun and the power thereof by which it was made.
[SPEAKER_01]: and also he is in the moon and is the light of the moon and the power thereof by which it was made and also the light of the stars and the power thereof by which they were made and the earth also and the power thereof even the earth upon which he stand.
[SPEAKER_01]: Wow and it just goes on and on.
[SPEAKER_01]: Tell me when to stop because you go.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think goes through thirteen and we'll come back and talk about it.
[SPEAKER_01]: Alright, and the light which shineeth which giveeth you light is through him who enlighteneth your eyes which is the same light that quickeneth your understandings which light precedeth forth from the presence of God to fill the amenity of space.
[SPEAKER_01]: The light which is in all things, which give us life to all things, which is the law by which all things are governed, even the power of God who sit at the upon his throne, who is in the bosom of eternity, who is in the midst of all things.
[SPEAKER_01]: Take it away from there.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, thank you.
[SPEAKER_00]: I, I, I'm not listening to your real day long.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's so great.
[SPEAKER_00]: I, uh, this just is such a great description of the power of the Savior.
[SPEAKER_00]: And, and, and I think in, I think in connection to that is the power of the priesthood authority that's been restored to the earth.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, you and I and many in the church have, uh, all of us actually have priesthood authority given to us to act in an assignment which we have.
[SPEAKER_00]: men, righteous men in the church, are given the authority to preside in office within that priest to authority, but everything that every power that's given to man and every piece of truth or knowledge
[SPEAKER_00]: is a direct result of Christ's light, his power, the authority that he has, vested in him by God, given to him by God, like we talk, that he does nothing but what the Father would have him do.
[SPEAKER_00]: And in order to do all the things he's been asked to do, he's had to become and be given the authority to do all the things, including creating the Sun, S-U-N Sun, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: We talked when we were in section, seventy-six yesterday as I was recording that, that the moon is a reflection of the Sun, S-U-N.
[SPEAKER_00]: The light that lights the moon is wasted sunlight that passes by the Earth.
[SPEAKER_00]: And the Lord and the Father in their wisdom is trying to give us much back as possible.
[SPEAKER_00]: And so He sets the moon there that then shines back on us and gives us the ability to see in the dark.
[SPEAKER_00]: But what is an interesting that in the darkness, the darkest of our earth,
[SPEAKER_00]: that the Savior gives us not the Son, because in our dark times, I don't know that the brightness of the Son is something we'd be open to seeing, but he gives us a reflection of the brightest things he can give us.
[SPEAKER_00]: Something that's just soft enough that allows me to see my way, and that reflection of the Son's light, S-O-N, is exactly how I need it when I'm in the dark places of my life as well.
[SPEAKER_00]: He doesn't come with the Savior and angels and their wings come to my room and help me.
[SPEAKER_00]: He comes with a little bit of reflected light.
[SPEAKER_00]: And as I follow that light, it becomes brighter and brighter.
[SPEAKER_00]: But man, what a great and poetic description of the power of God and the power of Christ through God.
[SPEAKER_01]: Even the scholars, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: Because it's big about that.
[SPEAKER_01]: When you're in the dark, it's a beautiful look up and see the Milky Way and the stars, even there's
[SPEAKER_01]: that still gives you a sense of hope, right, that you're not alone, you're not at the total end of the work.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I have a favorite, one of my favorite artists, the pictures of the Savior is fairly famous.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think people would know what, he's laying in the kind of in the crook of a rock, and he's got a staff, he's just laying, looking at the grandeur of space in the evening, and the stars are just lit up all over the sky.
[SPEAKER_00]: In his life, there wasn't fake lights, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: They didn't have candle power and I was about it.
[SPEAKER_00]: So the stars would have always been brilliant as brilliant as they could be with no light pollution.
[SPEAKER_00]: But it's my favorite because I think of his life and how he learned line-up online.
[SPEAKER_00]: And probably even had to learn who he really was.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I imagine that that picture describes the day or the night when he realized that he was the creator.
[SPEAKER_00]: And he's looking at the grandeur of space and all that's been out there and realizes, oh, I did that.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is who I am.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's my capacity, and I've been given a charge to do this difficult thing on earth, but comparatively to what I've done before I came here, I can handle this.
[SPEAKER_00]: I didn't give him a little bit more power that night when he realized who he was in that setting.
[SPEAKER_00]: Whether it was a night that looked like that, or maybe a little different setting, but big power came that day when he realized who he was in the career as the creator.
[SPEAKER_01]: And to know that that light, you know, is through permeates all things, like you said, the sun, the moon stars, it creates all of his, all of his creations, including us.
[SPEAKER_01]: We all have the Spirit of Christ, or our conscience, that light of truth.
[SPEAKER_01]: that we all have, but sometimes it might be buried down in there somewhere.
[SPEAKER_01]: But it's there.
[SPEAKER_01]: Hence the need for missionaries to go forth, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: To remind them, you have this light, you are a child of God, you are a child of the covenant.
[SPEAKER_01]: You just need to enter into the covenant.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_01]: You have it within you.
[SPEAKER_01]: You have deity within you.
[SPEAKER_01]: You have the light of prayer.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I would.
[SPEAKER_00]: I would.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm reminded and actually kind of excited.
[SPEAKER_00]: One of my favorite all-time talks ever given by an apostle was Elder Christopheerson back in, in the eighteen.
[SPEAKER_00]: He gave a talk to seminary and institute teachers that's called Truth and Durs.
[SPEAKER_00]: And you can find it.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's on the BYU religious studies center site.
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's called Truth and Durs.
[SPEAKER_00]: And it is just foundational talk.
[SPEAKER_00]: That I think is so important to us in helping us understand the world we live in today.
[SPEAKER_00]: Forgive me for a minute.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to read a little bit of this.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think there are some things in here that I think will help us in our discussion of light and the Savior.
[SPEAKER_00]: He says, uh, truth is knowledge of things as they are and as they were and as they are to come.
[SPEAKER_00]: While that definition is straight forward, the implication of that without divine assistance, mortal man's grasp of truth cannot be very expansive.
[SPEAKER_00]: BYU Emeritus Professor Chancey C. Riddle explained it this way.
[SPEAKER_00]: No mortal being can have any but a small shred of truth about how things are and where and will be.
[SPEAKER_00]: And since we understand by relationships, we as mortals cannot comprehend that shred of truth we do know in its more in its totality because the shred of truth is false in its full significance only when related to everything else and the past present future of everything else.
[SPEAKER_00]: Truth then is a thin grass completely only by the gods, those who are omniscient.
[SPEAKER_00]: and who see and know all things past present future.
[SPEAKER_00]: Professor El-Gozon, he says to rescue humanity from this limited ability to discern truth, our Father has given us our Savior, Jesus Christ, and the Holy Ghost, our Savior gives to all men and women born into this world the light of Christ, as you just shared, John, by which they can tell good from evil.
[SPEAKER_00]: If a person receives and loves the light of Christ, and learns to use it habitually in discerning good for mevel, he or she will be ready to receive the witness of the Holy Ghost.
[SPEAKER_00]: A person with this gift of the Holy Ghost is entitled to the constant companionship of the Holy Ghost.
[SPEAKER_00]: Any person who has that constant companionship has access to all truths.
[SPEAKER_00]: The Savior confirmed this in a statement at the last supper.
[SPEAKER_00]: How be it when he, the Spirit of Truth, has come, He will guide you to all truth.
[SPEAKER_00]: The Joseph Smith he added, he that keepeth my commandments, receive it truth and light until he is glorified in truth and knoweth all things.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's a couple more things here.
[SPEAKER_00]: The first thing we should understand about truth then is that a knowledge of truth in any significant measure requires divine assistance either through the light of Christ or by the aid of the Holy Ghost given our limited mortal capacity and resources if we are unaided by revelation.
[SPEAKER_00]: We simply cannot achieve a comprehensive knowledge of things as they are as they were and as they will be.
[SPEAKER_00]: And how anyone thing relates to how everything else was is or will be.
[SPEAKER_00]: Nevertheless, the Lord counseled the prophet Joseph Smith to study and learn and become acquainted with all good works, books and with languages, tongues and people.
[SPEAKER_00]: He expands that counsel to all of us, seeking out of the best books, words of wisdom.
[SPEAKER_00]: I love this.
[SPEAKER_00]: We must give it our best effort, and that best effort includes exercising faith actively asking, seeking and knocking to have open to us truth and light that only comes from God.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think if I look at verse eleven and the light which shineeth which giveeth you light is through Him who enlighteneth your eyes which is the same light that quickeneth your understanding which light precedeth forth from the presence of God.
[SPEAKER_00]: We cannot know.
[SPEAKER_00]: I just love the description of that.
[SPEAKER_00]: We can't know truth in its entirety because we don't have the context of truth as it was as it is and as it will be.
[SPEAKER_00]: and only through the spirit can we know the truth of all things.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think about just the age of the earth.
[SPEAKER_00]: When we all we're looking at is carbon, well, that's a piece of the truth, but we've proven to ourselves that even carbon dating is difficult to follow.
[SPEAKER_00]: We know certain things have happened.
[SPEAKER_00]: For example,
[SPEAKER_00]: Mount St.
[SPEAKER_00]: Helen's eruption.
[SPEAKER_00]: We know exactly when that happened, the date of that event.
[SPEAKER_00]: If your carbon date rocks that came out of that event and came from the explosion molten lava that came from that day, you would expect to be able to pinpoint exactly the day that that happened.
[SPEAKER_00]: You can't, it comes up with a hundred thousand years off in its readings.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's something that goes on in carbon when it's created that we don't understand.
[SPEAKER_00]: And yet, how often, especially in the sciences, do we see a thing?
[SPEAKER_00]: We understand one aspect of it, and we say, we know all things, and we know all truths, and then we set doctrines of man on, on as we hold them up as the only thing that you can know.
[SPEAKER_00]: They're true, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: So interesting.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, yeah, that's great.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm glad you read that quote.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's a talk from uh, two thousand eighteen religious study center at BYU.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you just went and studied if you just Google search truth and hers elder Christopherson, it would come up.
[SPEAKER_00]: Eighteen and the whole talk I mean that's just the that's the first I don't know that's in the first quarter of the talk and it's probably an hour and fifteen minutes long That he gives this talk I think there is just so much in here about light and truth and can I just read one more thing John?
[SPEAKER_00]: Is that okay?
[SPEAKER_00]: He says, beyond pretending, this that we don't know the truth, distracting and rationalizing, people may try to get others to participate in the guilty acts that they are participating in as a way of justifying themselves.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's just perfectly describes our
[SPEAKER_00]: Our way.
[SPEAKER_00]: He says, he's quoting a guy by the name of Budzazuski, who had written for a Catholic journal.
[SPEAKER_00]: And he says, they don't sin privately.
[SPEAKER_00]: They recruit.
[SPEAKER_00]: We could say that Satan is the master recruiter for he seeketh at all men might be miserable like unto himself.
[SPEAKER_00]: Most troubling are those who insist that society must be transformed so that it no longer stands in awful judgment.
[SPEAKER_00]: So it is that they change the laws, infiltrating the schools and creating intrusive social welfare programs and bureaucracies, welded Isaiah Warren, woven to them that call evil good and good evil that put darkness for light and light for darkness to put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter.
[SPEAKER_00]: But Suzuki concludes, it is our efforts to suppress the powerful forces of conscience or what we might call the light of Christ.
[SPEAKER_00]: And rationalize guilt and propel society ever deeper into the moral abyss.
[SPEAKER_00]: I would add, it also accounts for the anger that increasingly erupts in any attempts of discussion that implicates societal standards and norms.
[SPEAKER_00]: We have pushed away light so much that truth is only
[SPEAKER_00]: a thing you can have, you can have yours and I can have mine and mine as just as true as yours, even if none of them have anything to do with actual truth and eternal truth.
[SPEAKER_01]: The district earned for average.
[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.
[SPEAKER_00]: And when we fight about it, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: Such an interesting, anyway, that talk is just something I would highly encourage everybody.
[SPEAKER_00]: Again, truth and durs, two thousand eighteen other Christophers and so good.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it was an amazing way to communicate this thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: So clear and crystal clear.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_01]: thinking and his expression.
[SPEAKER_01]: I just love that about it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, and you and I, I was excited because you and I and what is it?
[SPEAKER_00]: Four hours.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: Three or four hours.
[SPEAKER_00]: Get to go and spend some time with Elder Christophe for some night and some training.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's going to do again in a setting very similar to where he gave this one.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I'm excited to see what he has to offer this year and seven years maybe later.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, we'll see what his new counsel to us is.
[SPEAKER_01]: Matt, you made some reference to you.
[SPEAKER_01]: We talked about this off camera a little bit here, but about verse three five, they become a long to itself.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's exactly what the option just said right now, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, let's jump into that.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, let's go to verse three four to get us into that.
[SPEAKER_00]: You want to read that?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, sure.
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, it says, and again, barely I see into you that that which is governed by law is also preserved by law and perfected and sanctified by the same.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, we could spend an hour talking about just that alone.
[SPEAKER_01]: The beauties of law and why we have law and the purpose of law.
[SPEAKER_01]: And that which breaketh a law and a bindeth not by law.
[SPEAKER_01]: But seeketh to become a law unto itself and willeth to abide in sin.
[SPEAKER_01]: And all together, a bindeth in sin cannot be sanctified by law.
[SPEAKER_01]: Neither by mercy, justice nor judgment.
[SPEAKER_01]: Therefore, they must remain filthy still.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, it is exactly what other Christophus was just saying, that if you push away the light, all you're left with is darkness.
[SPEAKER_00]: And if you create your laws around the darkness, and you don't let the light in, the light can't confirm and can't sanctify you.
[SPEAKER_00]: It can't make you like our Father and Heaven.
[SPEAKER_00]: It can't make you like the Savior.
[SPEAKER_00]: And so you have created a law unto yourself.
[SPEAKER_00]: You are becoming your own being.
[SPEAKER_00]: And the next verse continues on.
[SPEAKER_00]: All kingdoms have a law given.
[SPEAKER_00]: And there are many kingdoms.
[SPEAKER_00]: There is no space in which there is no kingdom.
[SPEAKER_00]: And there is no kingdom in which there is no space.
[SPEAKER_00]: Either a greater or lesser kingdom.
[SPEAKER_00]: All of the kingdoms which kind of skipped over the kingdom discussion works were definitely going to go back and cover.
[SPEAKER_00]: But every kingdom, in fact section of seventy-six talks about
[SPEAKER_00]: Even the degrees of glory that are not the celestial degrees of glory have multiple degrees within them because we all come to it with a different level of willingness.
[SPEAKER_00]: We all come with a different level of light and that light allows for me to have whatever I'm willing to receive.
[SPEAKER_00]: But then I'm stopped there and damned at that point that damn is drawn up and I can't move beyond that because I'm unwilling to receive any more.
[SPEAKER_00]: So the kingdom discussion that we're about to have is tied directly to the amount of light and knowledge and truth that we're not only willing to receive, but willing to adhere to and abide by.
[SPEAKER_00]: That concept of abiding is something that I think has to do with how much I'm willing to do, but it also has to do with how much I'm willing to be in the presence of.
[SPEAKER_00]: If I'm not able to be in God's presence, I can't abide his presence.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think it has two different ways of looking at it.
[SPEAKER_00]: One, he is so grand, I can't be in his presence because I'm not worthy or capable of it physically.
[SPEAKER_00]: But also, I'm unwilling to live the laws and standards that he wants me to live, and so I don't abide by the principles and practices of the Father.
[SPEAKER_00]: And so he has provided for us a place that we can go that is not where he will reside, but a place where I will be happy because of that which I am willing to receive, which is lesser in many cases than what the Father would have me receive.
[SPEAKER_00]: So with that, you can add to that, but that takes us right back into that discussion about the
[SPEAKER_01]: that degrees of glory in the kingdoms and verse thirty two just basically says what you said right I think this is kind of the conclusion to the kingdom discussion about what laws you're willing to live but you know they who remain shall be quickened never the last they shall return again to their own place to enjoy that which they are willing to receive because they were not willing to enjoy that which they might have received
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, are you willing to receive more?
[SPEAKER_00]: It's so interesting when I talk to seminary classes.
[SPEAKER_00]: And you ask them the question, does God live by more laws or less laws than we do?
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think they think he's free to do it every once he lives by way fewer laws than you and me.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then in many of them will say that, not all of them, many of them will say, yeah, probably less.
[SPEAKER_00]: And you say, okay, which one can he break?
[SPEAKER_00]: Which law that you live that he asked you to live by, can he not abide by?
[SPEAKER_00]: And they always come with some goofy one like gravity.
[SPEAKER_00]: He doesn't have to.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, you can float or whatever.
[SPEAKER_00]: But then you get, you get them serious.
[SPEAKER_00]: You say, okay, well, but really, what commandment?
[SPEAKER_00]: What rule?
[SPEAKER_00]: What law of chastity?
[SPEAKER_00]: What word of wisdom component?
[SPEAKER_00]: What, what thing can he do that he doesn't ask you to do?
[SPEAKER_00]: Or he's asked you not to do.
[SPEAKER_00]: And they'll think about that and then think, well, probably none of them.
[SPEAKER_00]: And the reality is, he's willing to abide by so many more than you and I.
[SPEAKER_00]: Because he understands what rules and laws and commandments do, they are, as he says, crowns of glory.
[SPEAKER_00]: There are things that allow you freedoms to become much more than you already are.
[SPEAKER_00]: At section twenty five and fifty five of the doctrine covenant is talked about crowns.
[SPEAKER_00]: You think about ten commandments being given and the people are willing to not kill each other.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, can you imagine the laws being given and don't kill each other is one of them.
[SPEAKER_00]: You're like, okay, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: But then fast forward and you get to love Moses and now there's six hundred and fourteen or thirteen of them.
[SPEAKER_00]: And you're given a set of them.
[SPEAKER_00]: You have to abide by it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, then Christ comes and gives this an ending level of law of life that is principal-based.
[SPEAKER_00]: And it really is an opportunity for us to become because we are willing to receive more.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, if God came to a prophet, General Conference and said, I'd like to give him a new commandment.
[SPEAKER_00]: And President Nelson stood up and said, here's a new commandment from the Lord.
[SPEAKER_00]: no longer shall we wear blue ties?
[SPEAKER_00]: We would all throw our blue ties in the dirt.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, it would be over for blue ties.
[SPEAKER_00]: And even if we didn't know why if it came by way of command, we would say, okay, I think generally we would say, okay, now that we would question, well, why?
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, we'll try with my blue tie.
[SPEAKER_00]: I love my blue tie.
[SPEAKER_00]: And we might kick against that a little bit.
[SPEAKER_00]: But ultimately, we look for and want new commandments to come from our prophets to get to it this way and it'll be easier.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then we fight against them.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't fully understand the novelty of that, but we do.
[SPEAKER_00]: We fight against the light, don't we?
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, purpose of the law is right, verse twenty one, and they who are not sanctified through the law, which I have given unto you, even the law of Christ, must inherit them.
[SPEAKER_01]: So there's this idea of being sanctified by the law.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that makes it that way, too.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's really the purpose of it is to help us become more like Jesus Christ.
[SPEAKER_01]: And like our Father neving without laws, we can't do that.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think the God of Eden
[SPEAKER_01]: laws were given, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: That that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that
[SPEAKER_00]: You think you know better, sins of omission, maybe not sins of commission as much.
[SPEAKER_00]: Because you think you know better, you've become a terrestrial being.
[SPEAKER_00]: You're cast away from the celestial and you've become earthen.
[SPEAKER_00]: You've become like the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the earth, the
[SPEAKER_00]: And that idea is the end of it at section twenty one right even the law of Christ must inherit another kingdom if you can't live the law of Christ you must inherit another kingdom but then it goes on even that of a terrestrial kingdom or that of a celestial kingdom for he who is not able to abide the law of a celestial kingdom cannot abide a celestial glory and again the presence of celestial kingdom I can't be in that because I'm uncomfortable there or end
[SPEAKER_00]: I can't live the law because I don't want to.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm unwilling to abide.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's what thirty-two said, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: Unwilling to receive that law goes on in twenty-three.
[SPEAKER_00]: He who cannot abide the law of a terrestrial kingdom cannot abide a terrestrial glory.
[SPEAKER_00]: And he who cannot abide the law of T-lestial kingdom cannot abide a T-lestial glory.
[SPEAKER_00]: Therefore, he is not meet for a kingdom of glory.
[SPEAKER_00]: Therefore, I must abide in a kingdom which is not a kingdom of glory.
[SPEAKER_00]: And that speaks about our darkness, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, what is our darkness?
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a complete lack of light.
[SPEAKER_00]: There is no light, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: When we talked about section seventy-six, the celestial glory is a glory where you will at least allow the spirit to be present.
[SPEAKER_00]: Where that light, that much light can come.
[SPEAKER_00]: Terrestrial, you'll at least abide the Savior.
[SPEAKER_00]: You'll accept Him as the Savior.
[SPEAKER_00]: You don't want to do everything He's asked you to do.
[SPEAKER_00]: but he'll accept that much light as the moon, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: The reflection of the father, then his light.
[SPEAKER_00]: But the celestial glory is the presence of the father and the direct light to direct glory of the sun.
[SPEAKER_01]: So Matt, what if you're a youth now listening to his broadcast a young adult that says, I can like my life.
[SPEAKER_01]: And if I'm going to get the same kind of life that I'm living now,
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm pretty happy.
[SPEAKER_01]: I feel like I could live this way for a tournament in your community.
[SPEAKER_01]: What might you say to somebody who's maybe living a terrestrial life and happy with it?
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a great question.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm curious to know what you would say too.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I would say you're probably exactly right.
[SPEAKER_00]: You probably would be you're probably happier than you are right now because you'd have an immortal body.
[SPEAKER_00]: And you get to do all the things you're doing now.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I don't know what end I don't know.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't mean in the, in the, in the telestral world, the t-restral world.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know that smoking pot gives you the, your eternal body the same effect.
[SPEAKER_00]: I have no idea.
[SPEAKER_00]: But you definitely don't have to live the laws of God.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I would invite them to see it differently.
[SPEAKER_00]: I would say to them, would you consider that God's real?
[SPEAKER_00]: And if God's real, and He's giving you an opportunity to become like Him, wouldn't that be cooler power than what you got right now?
[SPEAKER_00]: Like you just got to think a little bit celestial to say, okay, if there's an opportunity to have a little more than I have now, well, that would be cool.
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's not really requiring that much more of you, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: It's requiring that you don't smoke weed.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, that you attempt here and there to be a good person and attend church and pray and some basic stuff.
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.
[SPEAKER_00]: But if the blessings of that wouldn't that.
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
[SPEAKER_00]: And blessings that on the other side are so significantly more
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, you could be happy.
[SPEAKER_00]: It came to me this way too.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think the terrestrial, the middle kingdom, is really what the world and the current Christian world has defined as heaven.
[SPEAKER_00]: It literally is a resurrected body.
[SPEAKER_00]: the ability to be with Christ, the ability to worship Him and to abide in His presence and be with other generally good people who didn't really want to live everything that was asked of them didn't really want to make covenants that were harder to do with the hope of a higher and holier glory
[SPEAKER_00]: But that's really the definition of heaven to most Christians is this great place where you get to be with Christ and you can worship Him for eternity.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, what this section, what section seventy-six in this section is teaching us is there is more.
[SPEAKER_00]: There is an opportunity to have more than that fifteen-year-old thinks is happiness.
[SPEAKER_00]: And all you have to do to seek that is abide by a little bit higher law and be willing to receive that which you're currently not because you like the worldly stuff too much.
[SPEAKER_00]: by being willing to do that.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm talking a lot here, John, but by being willing to do that, you hold up a sign to the father that says, I am unwilling, and I'm sorry, I am unworthy, but willing to have the Savior help me become like you are.
[SPEAKER_00]: And that is so much cooler than what I would do on my own at fifteen or sixteen or seventeen years older, forty seven.
[SPEAKER_00]: Right?
[SPEAKER_00]: Whatever it is, I would want and become on my own, what you can make me is so much cooler.
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's what I want.
[SPEAKER_00]: I hope for that thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, I don't know.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know how I would actually respond, but I think I would do something like that.
[SPEAKER_00]: And heaven just won't be heaven.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is a Brad Wilcox statement.
[SPEAKER_00]: Heaven won't be heaven for those who have not become heavenly.
[SPEAKER_00]: You're just unwilling to be heavenly.
[SPEAKER_00]: You would be miserable in heaven.
[SPEAKER_00]: It would not make you happy.
[SPEAKER_00]: It would be requiring of you stuff that you just don't want and don't want to do unwilling to receive right you'd be miserable there.
[SPEAKER_00]: I've talked a lot you share some thoughts here.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, I thought you were you were going to quote what I was going to
[SPEAKER_01]: quote from what Elder Holland said about speaking of, you know, exaltation, which is really what we're talking about.
[SPEAKER_01]: And he talked about the Christian view a little bit of once we die, where they're singly in heaven, you know, worshiping God and Christ.
[SPEAKER_01]: And they do such a great job on music and their services.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm sure they just, they've got that one.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think they've got that figured out that that part is, that's a good part.
[SPEAKER_01]: But what we're missing, and this is what Elder Holland said.
[SPEAKER_01]: He said,
[SPEAKER_01]: If I, he says the thought of going back to the Prince of God without Pat, my sweetheart Pat would not be heaven.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so what is it offer?
[SPEAKER_01]: It offers a sweetness and a joy.
[SPEAKER_01]: And what is it?
[SPEAKER_01]: A journal progression.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I don't know there's a lot more to that topic.
[SPEAKER_01]: It could be a journal progression and a journal creation and a journal, you know, there's a lot that's going to happen and can happen in that king.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I guess that's what I would say is the possibilities are endless and with your spouse and with your family, continually in that relationship, I would
[SPEAKER_01]: It would not be heaven.
[SPEAKER_01]: You think about your own kids and your own sweetheart.
[SPEAKER_01]: It would not be heaven about it.
[SPEAKER_00]: You didn't think that through farther.
[SPEAKER_00]: So if I could have a fullness of glory and joy with my spouse, would it be if I couldn't continue to have children?
[SPEAKER_00]: No, right, so fullness isn't full unless you have the capacity to do everything you have the capacity to do here on earth, but with a magnified capacity because you are like God, with the ability to be unending and to be uncapable of
[SPEAKER_00]: of fulfilling all measures of all creations.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, what a fantastic capacity.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's interesting in this section because he talks about the Earth.
[SPEAKER_00]: It says in twenty five again, barely I say in to you, the Earth abideeth the law of the celestial kingdom.
[SPEAKER_00]: For it, filleth the measure of its creation and then transgresseth not the law.
[SPEAKER_00]: It was told, multiply, replenish yourself.
[SPEAKER_00]: And it literally does that every day all day long without fail.
[SPEAKER_00]: Therefore, it shall be sanctified.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yay, notwithstanding it shall die.
[SPEAKER_00]: It shall be quickened again and shall abide the power by which it was quickened and the righteous shall inherit it.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then it talks about the celestial bodies, those you and I that are striving for celestial kingdom and the Savior
[SPEAKER_00]: Helps.
[SPEAKER_00]: We can then come and be here.
[SPEAKER_00]: They who are of a celestial spirit shall receive the same body which was a natural body.
[SPEAKER_00]: Even you shall receive your bodies and your glory shall be that glory by which your bodies are quickened.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yee who are quickened by a portion of the celestial glory shall then receive of the same even a fullness.
[SPEAKER_00]: So that concept of portion comes up here.
[SPEAKER_00]: And he starts using that that language in verses twenty nine to thirty two.
[SPEAKER_00]: where he says, whatever level of degree of glory you achieve, there's a portion of it that you are willing to receive.
[SPEAKER_00]: We talked about that earlier where if I go to the terrestrial kingdom and I'm only willing to receive a certain level of light that that is my highest glory and yours even in the terrestrial kingdom would be probably better than mine and so it would be brighter of brighter level of glory.
[SPEAKER_00]: So that concept of
[SPEAKER_00]: That concept of a portion of the terrestrial glory or the celestial glory or the celestial glory is what you will obtain.
[SPEAKER_00]: Up to a fullness of that glory, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: Up to that.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you're willing to abide by all the principles and standards of the terrestrial kingdom, you will obtain a fullness of that glory.
[SPEAKER_00]: But there are degrees beyond that.
[SPEAKER_00]: Many mansions of the Savior says exist, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: It reminds me of this concept.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you and I have an old Volkswagen Beetle, nineteen sixty five Volkswagen Beetle, and you and I decide we're going to get together and we're going to restore that Volkswagen Beetle, and we work on it every day, our whole entire lives, and we have it pristine.
[SPEAKER_00]: We have not restored a Mustang.
[SPEAKER_00]: We restored a Volkswagen Beetle.
[SPEAKER_00]: And at the end of the day, if all I am creating in this life is a Volkswagen Beetle, I will not be resurrected to a Mustang.
[SPEAKER_00]: I will not be given a Cadillac body if I'm not working on Cadillac life, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: And that I think that concept of restoration, we see it in cars all the time.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you restore a car to its perfect form,
[SPEAKER_00]: And even a better form, it still is that car.
[SPEAKER_00]: It is a celestial or a terrestrial body.
[SPEAKER_00]: And it will be resurrected and glorified accordingly, not to something it was not created as.
[SPEAKER_00]: And you and I daily decide what we are creating are eternal body to be like.
[SPEAKER_00]: Right?
[SPEAKER_00]: President Nelson even said that, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: He said, you're determining now what type of body and where you'll live and who you'll live with.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's significant stuff.
[SPEAKER_01]: Pretty clear, yeah, profit emphasizing clarifying, emphasizing these truths that are contained in such a way.
[SPEAKER_00]: You can tell this is a passion section of mine.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think this is just a beautiful, beautiful language and teaches us so much.
[SPEAKER_00]: We can't skip, we can't skip forward without Bentlandon on thirty-three John.
[SPEAKER_00]: Would you share your thoughts about thirty-three?
[SPEAKER_00]: I know that this is something we've talked about before and you've shared with students.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now let me read it and then share some thoughts.
[SPEAKER_00]: For what does it profit a man?
[SPEAKER_00]: If a gift is bestowed upon him and he received not the gift, behold, he rejoices not in that which is given unto him.
[SPEAKER_00]: Neither rejoices in him who is the giver of the gift.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I'm trying to think what we talked about there.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I just think I don't know.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm thinking of Elder Kieran's talk about, you know, where he received a little change.
[SPEAKER_00]: He'd be bang bang car from his father.
[SPEAKER_00]: And as much as his father enjoyed giving that gift, as much as he enjoyed receiving the gift, if he hadn't taken the gift out and played with it.
[SPEAKER_00]: really wouldn't have been a gift received.
[SPEAKER_00]: It would have been a gift given and obtained, but not really received.
[SPEAKER_00]: So that's where my mind goes and read that verse, but the concept of the gift not profiting of us, right, that it doesn't really help us if God gives us the capacity to go to celestial kingdom and we don't do anything with that.
[SPEAKER_01]: We don't grow.
[SPEAKER_01]: We also taught somewhere, and after my knee where we were taught this, but I thought it was a general confidence talk or somebody
[SPEAKER_01]: gave the kind of a mathematical way of saying it, but the further a person is from the giver of the gift and last he appreciates the gift.
[SPEAKER_01]: And he talked about in relationship to, I think it was in relationship to giving out welfare.
[SPEAKER_01]: You know what I mean?
[SPEAKER_01]: It's just a federal government, giving out welfare.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's so far removed.
[SPEAKER_01]: that they don't appreciate.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I shouldn't say that there are people out there probably a welfare that appreciate it, but the chances are strongly in favor of the argument that they're going to appreciate it last.
[SPEAKER_01]: The further you are away from the giver of the gift.
[SPEAKER_01]: In this case, right, if you're close to the giver of the gift, in this case, Jesus Christ or Father and Heaven,
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, that causes greater, you know, the greater strong relationship, about greater rejoicing in the gift you're given.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's why you wouldn't want that if you're a terrestrial person, you're living terrestrial laws, and you're given this gift by Heavenly Father.
[SPEAKER_01]: It seems so distant, so remote that you're like, oh, you know, it's like, what's this?
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah, okay, I'm not really interested.
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I'm not really amazing.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, maybe you're referencing this.
[SPEAKER_00]: Elder Renland gave a talk in twenty sixteen.
[SPEAKER_00]: That was called that I might draw him in unto me.
[SPEAKER_00]: And he is quoting Elder Wilford W. Anderson of the seventy who said, the giver in the receiver, the more the receiver develops a sense of entitlement.
[SPEAKER_00]: Then Elder Renland says, our Heavenly Father and His Son Jesus Christ are the ultimate givers.
[SPEAKER_00]: The more we distance ourselves from them, the more entitled we feel will begin to think that we deserve grace and we are old blessings.
[SPEAKER_00]: We are more prone to look around, identify inequalities and feel aggrieved, even offended by the unfairness we perceive.
[SPEAKER_00]: While the unfairness can range from trivial to gut-wrenching,
[SPEAKER_00]: When we are distant from God, even small inequities, loom large, we feel that God has an obligation to fix things and fix them right now.
[SPEAKER_00]: Wow.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's it.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's great.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: How do you feel?
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm so quickly.
[SPEAKER_01]: You're amazing.
[SPEAKER_01]: I've been a little sad listeners, but there's, there's, there's one, there's pull-out quotes in the comments.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's actually a pretty simple thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you, if you generally use Google for keywords,
[SPEAKER_00]: I usually put in conference, the word conference, LDS, general conference, use the term LDS, and then general conference.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then keywords from something that you think you kind of generally know.
[SPEAKER_00]: If I do that, I did that in this case, John, you said something I knew I remember.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I wrote in my Google search.
[SPEAKER_00]: Further away, giver, less gift is appreciated, LDS conference.
[SPEAKER_00]: That was my Google search.
[SPEAKER_00]: It wasn't even a sentence.
[SPEAKER_00]: It just, some keywords.
[SPEAKER_00]: And it literally pulls up as the very first thing where that was done.
[SPEAKER_00]: And the second thing is the member of the Seventy that Elder Rennland was quoting.
[SPEAKER_00]: So pulled it all up right there.
[SPEAKER_00]: Keywords and Google.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's cool.
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you.
[SPEAKER_01]: You taught us your good teacher, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: In fact, we didn't even bring up this stuff about teaching in this section, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: There's she diligently, yours, you're doing that right now.
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's jump around here, John.
[SPEAKER_00]: We've been a lot of time on that.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think we could, man, there's so many places in here we could land.
[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe we go to that section of being teachers and teaching here.
[SPEAKER_00]: Is that a place we could land?
[SPEAKER_01]: This is great.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, seventy seven seventy eight.
[SPEAKER_01]: I give unto you a commandment that you shall teach one another.
[SPEAKER_01]: The doctrine of the kingdom teach you diligently and my grace shall attend you that you may be instructed more perfectly in theory and principle and doctrine and the law of the gospel and all things.
[SPEAKER_01]: that pertain into the kingdom of God that are expedient for you to understand, and then he goes through all of the things, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: Having above earth beneath, underneath the earth, things which are surely come to pass, I mean, all things.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's so much in here, and an invitation to seek and to teach diligently requires that we seek it first, right, that we have obtained it, that we, yep,
[SPEAKER_01]: section eleven right don't forget to hire him.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I think I'm remembering a face to face experience we had with
[SPEAKER_00]: um elder elder not elder packer who is the who is the previous uh presiding president of the quorum oh oh oh oh oh yeah i've recovered yeah i'm remembering um and experience we had with elder ballard where he told us gone are the days where you could answer a difficult question of the student has with go pray about it
[SPEAKER_00]: We live in a time where all of the information is currently present at all the time in our pockets.
[SPEAKER_00]: And you can't just say, go pray about it, you'll be okay.
[SPEAKER_00]: There is a desire and an innate desire, I think, of young people, especially to seek for answers.
[SPEAKER_00]: And when they seek for answers with the devices that they have, they come across the whole bunch of things that are anti-answers.
[SPEAKER_00]: And so seeking diligently,
[SPEAKER_00]: to teach requires that we seek diligently to learn first.
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's in here too.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's descriptive in here.
[SPEAKER_00]: Teachy diligently.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, what does diligent mean?
[SPEAKER_00]: Definition for diligent I found was done or presumed with painstaking precision.
[SPEAKER_00]: So precision that is painstaking requires some pretty big efforts, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: the end of the seventy-eight that you read.
[SPEAKER_00]: After all those individual things to be more instructed and more perfectly in theory and principle and doctrine and law, all things pertaining to the Kingdom of God, it says that are expedient for you to understand.
[SPEAKER_00]: Not necessarily all the things I want to know, but the things I should know.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's the stuff we should be studying, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: That's the stuff we should spend our time with.
[SPEAKER_00]: And good.
[SPEAKER_00]: He goes on, if things both in heaven and in earth and under the earth, things which have been, things which are things which must shortly come past, things which are at home, things which are abroad, the wars and complexities of the nations, the judgments, which are on the land and the knowledge of the countries of the kingdoms, that E may be prepared in all things.
[SPEAKER_00]: when I shall send you again to magnify the calling, we're into, I've called you.
[SPEAKER_00]: You and I have a responsibility, especially as teachers in the kingdom, to know as much as we can about everything we can, so that we can speak intelligently to, I think of the apostles that sit at the feet of very wise men regularly, to be taught about, just random things.
[SPEAKER_00]: I remember I had an opportunity to watch a little bit of
[SPEAKER_00]: General Authority Council where they had brought in Elder Gong before he was Elder Gong.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I don't know if you know this, but he was a counselor of sorts to the quorum of the twelve.
[SPEAKER_00]: And they would ask him questions and then he would go and research everything he could about that thing and come back the next week and give them answers.
[SPEAKER_00]: So our member just has a little interaction where Elder Ballard says to Elder Gong, would you research everything you can about black holes?
[SPEAKER_00]: They've come up in science recently in the news or hearing some things about them.
[SPEAKER_00]: Would you help us understand what we need to know about black holes?
[SPEAKER_00]: Elder Gong says, OK, and then he came back the next week.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm sure he gave them as much as he could find about black holes and what was relevant to the apostles about that.
[SPEAKER_00]: But they're not ignorant to the ways of the world and the things of the world.
[SPEAKER_00]: I sometimes, in this podcast, speak a little, I don't know, despairingly maybe about science.
[SPEAKER_00]: I love science.
[SPEAKER_00]: I love that we know what we know and that we've gleaned, what we've been able to glean, but like I said before,
[SPEAKER_00]: When we pridefully say, and that is how it is, end of story, period, end of sentence, we share put God in a box.
[SPEAKER_00]: And we assume that we know what God knows with a little bit of light knowledge that we have.
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's where I'm where I maybe struggle a little bit.
[SPEAKER_00]: But if we stay open, there will receive more.
[SPEAKER_00]: Man, there's so much to learn, isn't there?
[SPEAKER_01]: There sure is.
[SPEAKER_01]: Our profits, a great example of this too.
[SPEAKER_01]: President Hinkley, they were always soon pressed with how many subjects he could sit on an airplane that was reported.
[SPEAKER_01]: He could sit on the airplane with anybody and pretty soon strike up a conversation and be able to convert.
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, with some degree of intelligence there and very impressive.
[SPEAKER_01]: Recently, I heard a story about President Nelson.
[SPEAKER_01]: I haven't verified that this story is true, but it makes sense that in meeting Pope Francis several years ago,
[SPEAKER_01]: He thanked him for the services that the the different Catholic charity and organizations and he knew the organizations.
[SPEAKER_01]: He named the organizations and went on to say that we normally pray for you.
[SPEAKER_01]: up Pope Francis, but we pray for archbishop named them and just archbishop and archbishop and archbishop.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, he was very much aware, pulling places and things.
[SPEAKER_01]: And that again, it's all about and it's not by bringing any credit to present Nelson.
[SPEAKER_01]: It is a godly principle to write, to know as much as we can, art, sciences, doctrine, people, places, things so that we can ultimately help them realize, you know, that we represent Jesus Christ and we're here to tell others how to become like Him, you know, to their fullest extent.
[SPEAKER_01]: And if our knowledge and understanding about all these things help people feel
[SPEAKER_01]: trusted like we're trusted like that we have some degree of you know we're willing to
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I don't know how to say it, but it increases our capacity.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's our capacity to help others find Christ, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: Everything.
[SPEAKER_00]: How many conversations do you think God could have with people and speak on their levels?
[SPEAKER_00]: Speak what they understand.
[SPEAKER_00]: Give them you just slightly more than they have now and give them a little more every conversation.
[SPEAKER_00]: He could have every conversation because he knows everything about every topic.
[SPEAKER_00]: And so the most brilliant scientists could go and sit and engage with the Savior and with our Father in a conversation about whatever it is he understands and his capacity to have a conversation that is engaging in enlightening is a hundred percent there that you and I don't make efforts to become that way in everything we can is not a godly practice, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: It would not be like God to not attempt to become versed in everything.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know in my life I attempt that.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know that I'm very good at any of it, but I try to understand a lot of different things and put my fingers in a lot of different pots and it's tiring for sure.
[SPEAKER_00]: But you learn a lot.
[SPEAKER_00]: You learn a lot of things that are hard and things that when you get better at certain things, they take more of your time and it's hard to be really good at a lot of different things and feel like you have any time to yourself.
[SPEAKER_00]: Especially if you live the love of consecration at all.
[SPEAKER_00]: and try to offer your time in your talents to the building up of the kingdom or just your family.
[SPEAKER_00]: But it is, it's hard to be like our father in heaven.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's not easy to be the state like the savior and be willing to set aside your own needs and become like him and offer that which others are in need of.
[SPEAKER_00]: But it's worth it.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's worth it.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's worth it.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's absolutely worth it.
[SPEAKER_01]: At some day we will meet
[SPEAKER_01]: them right to part of section eighty eight is talking about the second coming in those who are prepared to meet the Lord and the bridegroom come let's go out to meet him preparey preparey and like the parable of the divergence eyes and foolish versions right come a day when we will be invited to that yeah to that feast will be there with him and that will be a joyful joyful experience and if we come late and we haven't prepared well then we will
[SPEAKER_01]: But whatever kingdom we chosen to live will be our will be the place of what we want to see.
[SPEAKER_00]: Brother gang, this has been fantastic.
[SPEAKER_00]: We have, we have, we have nibbled at section eighty eight.
[SPEAKER_00]: There are there are holes and massive sections of things that we have not even touched on.
[SPEAKER_00]: He goes through the order of the resurrection and talks about the different Trumps that will sound and and who will come forth at each of those places I think that's the kind of the middle section here that well middle to end maybe you know section verse ninety six through you know, you know, hundred and sixteen we kind of get that
[SPEAKER_00]: that area and we won't take time to do that today.
[SPEAKER_00]: I kind of want to end with something that you just shared and maybe something that we've talked a little bit about here.
[SPEAKER_00]: We talked at the beginning about how you're maybe towards the tail end of your career in seminary and instituting and you have given a life of chosen service to the children of God and
[SPEAKER_00]: and the members of the church and the children of the members of the church in large measure.
[SPEAKER_00]: You're ending your career in the Institute world where you've focused primarily on helping those with some unique needs in life.
[SPEAKER_00]: And like I've said, and I've almost in every time I've interviewed with you, I think it is like watching the Savior teach when we watch John Gadman teach.
[SPEAKER_00]: And so you really have offered a life of service to the Lord and His Kingdom.
[SPEAKER_00]: My question to you is,
[SPEAKER_00]: What have you learned?
[SPEAKER_00]: What would you, if you could have every single one of your students, this is maybe a hope of mine that in the next life, the Savior will say, okay, now we can just, we're going to have breakout sessions and we get to group up in different groupings and how do you want to group everybody up today?
[SPEAKER_00]: And I just really like to talk to every student I ever had, would you?
[SPEAKER_00]: Would y'all just come to room one or wait one or wait let me let me just talk with you and see how you're doing and get to know you again if that were an opportunity you had to talk with every student you've had before thousands I would venture to say over the course of your long story career what have you learned what have they taught you what would you share what would you hope they know at the end of your career at least in teaching but maybe at the beginning of a new happy chapter
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not sure I understand entirely the question, but here it'll be a approach it and then you can tell me what direction to go, but I would hope to hear from those students that I've taught that if there's anything they learned or felt from being in my senior class and that is how important
[SPEAKER_01]: It is to daily draw close to the Lord that there is a relationship there that is so precious and so worth.
[SPEAKER_01]: The efforts we can make to know why study and study the scriptures and have a personal connection with Him in prayer, but also to keep the commandments of God.
[SPEAKER_01]: And not because we have to, but because it enables us to strengthen that relationship with God.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I hope that they would have maybe have felt.
[SPEAKER_01]: I knew in my preparation as I look back.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think the most important thing I did to prepare.
[SPEAKER_01]: You've always spent hours as you know.
[SPEAKER_01]: Right next to you.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: Preparing us and we all do.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: We all spend hours and share ideas and all of that.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's some of the most important preparation as the preparation we make personally before we ever walk into the classroom.
[SPEAKER_01]: The relationship we have with our spouses.
[SPEAKER_01]: The relationship we have with our children.
[SPEAKER_01]: and I'm not saying perfect but any means and I'm not saying that at all what I am saying is that part of teaching is not just what we're teaching but it's who we are we teach who we are and if we are trying to live close to the Savior
[SPEAKER_01]: You'll hope that that rubs off.
[SPEAKER_01]: All of the students sense that and feel that.
[SPEAKER_01]: Even though maybe you're not the most gifted, maybe not the most entertaining or you're, you know, you have some flaws as a teacher and forget things and technology goes awry and it was kind of things.
[SPEAKER_01]: Hopefully they will
[SPEAKER_01]: as they enter the classroom or in your presence they'll sense that you represent the Savior and teaching the gospel and that you hope that they in some ways sense that maybe it's rubbed off on them a little bit.
[SPEAKER_01]: The thing I've learned about students is that here's what I've learned about students is that
[SPEAKER_01]: And this is going to sound just so normal, but it is so true.
[SPEAKER_01]: Each one is so different.
[SPEAKER_01]: They come from such different backgrounds.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think it earlier, my career, I wanted everyone to kind of line up and I felt bad if they weren't lining up.
[SPEAKER_01]: But after a while, you realize, you know what?
[SPEAKER_01]: Just take them meet them where they are.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that's a term that art profits and leaders that S and I have used.
[SPEAKER_01]: meet them where they are, and what a difference it makes in your relationship with them, and hopefully they're feeling a sense of belonging.
[SPEAKER_01]: So they'll want to take the next step in their progress so they can become, well, like, well, like to say, well, brother Gagon, thank you.
[SPEAKER_00]: Again, I would echo that anybody that's had an opportunity to be in your class, had an opportunity to view the methods I think the Savior used when he taught.
[SPEAKER_00]: You have offered not just to your students either and even as a colleague, I think the measured way in which you approach life and your occupation, your job, your preparations, all those things.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think have been telling for me, they've been instructive to me.
[SPEAKER_00]: I have learned a lot over the course of my associations with you and grateful for our time together.
[SPEAKER_00]: I would I would also say that one of the things that I I think when I envision those afterlife meetings is is I think our students will just see us for who we are right and and they'll recognize all the he wasn't perfect he was struggling with this and that and and I think there'll be a lot of laughing just about that year teaching about that and struggling with that same thing at the same time and
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think that's okay.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think that the Lord uses us to help each other and lift each other and definitely he has used you over the course of your career.
[SPEAKER_00]: So grateful for you and maybe speak for all of our colleagues that were just grateful that we've been able to spend time with you and learn from you and your contribution to our lives has been significant.
[SPEAKER_00]: So thank you.
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you.
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you.
[SPEAKER_01]: Can I say just one more thing?
[SPEAKER_01]: And this is the other thing I hope my students would say as a brother, Gagnan taught us the importance of going to the temple.
[SPEAKER_01]: There is a power.
[SPEAKER_01]: Everyone, my students, to experience.
[SPEAKER_01]: There's a joy.
[SPEAKER_01]: There's a revelation.
[SPEAKER_01]: If you will,
[SPEAKER_01]: to know the Savior more as we participate regularly in temple experiences.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I see why President Nelson and all the others have said, go as often as you can.
[SPEAKER_01]: They're just something there that insulates us.
[SPEAKER_01]: It strengthens us.
[SPEAKER_01]: It gives us hope during discouraging times.
[SPEAKER_01]: gives us power to share the gospel, courage.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like you can't find anywhere else.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I would hope that my students, they know how I feel about the temple and hopefully that has encouraged them to want to go to the temple on a regular basis.
[SPEAKER_01]: So they can express that same joy.
[SPEAKER_01]: I am so grateful for what the temple has done for me.
[SPEAKER_00]: Great.
[SPEAKER_00]: Brother Gagnon, thank you.
[SPEAKER_00]: I may not see you in a classroom, but I will try to see you at the temple.
[SPEAKER_00]: What a great place to be together, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you.
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you for your time today, and we will definitely have you back though it might be in a little bit different format than this.
[SPEAKER_00]: Thanks, John.
[SPEAKER_00]: See you.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_00]: Bye.
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you, ma'am.
[SPEAKER_01]: Appreciate your brother.