WEBVTT 00:02.217 --> 00:07.582 [SPEAKER_01]: Hey everyone, welcome to the Christian parenting podcast where we help you grow into the parent God made you to be. 00:08.062 --> 00:15.169 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm your host, Steph Thirling, and each week we bring you conversations at encourage, equip, and remind you that you are not alone on this parenting journey. 00:15.852 --> 00:17.493 [SPEAKER_01]: Today, I'm joined by Jenny Yurik. 00:17.813 --> 00:21.795 [SPEAKER_01]: She's a homeschooling mom of five in founder of the thousand hours outside movement. 00:22.195 --> 00:28.177 [SPEAKER_01]: We're covering a lot of topics today, homeschooling, Jenny's new book, The Power of Outdoor Living for your child's development. 00:28.638 --> 00:34.060 [SPEAKER_01]: Why boredom is actually a gift and how to parent with confidence in the culture that's so full of pressure. 00:34.360 --> 00:42.245 [SPEAKER_01]: So whether you homeschool or not, this conversation will really challenge and encourage you to make space for wonder, creativity, and growth in your family's everyday life. 00:42.605 --> 00:50.650 [SPEAKER_01]: And if you really resonate with us, go check out Jenny's new book, homeschooling, you're doing it right, just by doing it, I will have links and show notes to find it. 00:50.670 --> 00:52.531 [SPEAKER_01]: Thank you so much and enjoy! 01:01.016 --> 01:01.416 [SPEAKER_01]: Hi, Jenny. 01:01.556 --> 01:03.137 [SPEAKER_01]: Welcome to the Christian Pairding podcast. 01:03.397 --> 01:04.137 [SPEAKER_01]: Thanks for having me. 01:04.257 --> 01:05.078 [SPEAKER_01]: That's such a great name. 01:05.438 --> 01:06.698 [SPEAKER_00]: It's like so clear what it is. 01:07.018 --> 01:11.120 [SPEAKER_01]: It is, you know, we went back and forth on a few names and that's what we came down to. 01:11.280 --> 01:15.382 [SPEAKER_01]: No one's going to be confused about what they're getting when they got the Christian Pairding podcast. 01:16.182 --> 01:16.663 [SPEAKER_01]: So great. 01:17.184 --> 01:18.586 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. 01:18.726 --> 01:20.028 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, I'm really glad to have you here. 01:20.088 --> 01:21.891 [SPEAKER_01]: So thank you for joining me. 01:22.331 --> 01:26.237 [SPEAKER_01]: For people who don't know you, can you just tell us a little bit about yourself? 01:26.297 --> 01:30.263 [SPEAKER_01]: What you do and then tell us what your family do because we're Christian parenting and we care a lot about families over here. 01:30.283 --> 01:30.804 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. 01:31.064 --> 01:31.444 [SPEAKER_00]: For sure. 01:31.584 --> 01:32.385 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, so I'm a mom. 01:32.645 --> 01:33.786 [SPEAKER_00]: And that's mainly what I do. 01:34.086 --> 01:34.766 [SPEAKER_00]: We have five kids. 01:34.806 --> 01:36.567 [SPEAKER_00]: They are currently ages eight to sixteen. 01:36.627 --> 01:39.289 [SPEAKER_00]: So we are in, that's a pretty sweet spot of ages stuff. 01:39.649 --> 01:40.749 [SPEAKER_00]: It's like someone can drive. 01:40.850 --> 01:41.850 [SPEAKER_00]: So that's great. 01:42.150 --> 01:46.093 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, if you need someone to read the store or kind of just fill in those gaps. 01:46.433 --> 01:47.213 [SPEAKER_00]: So that's incredible. 01:47.273 --> 01:48.234 [SPEAKER_00]: And nobody's in diapers. 01:48.694 --> 01:51.115 [SPEAKER_00]: So I don't even know when everyone goes to the bathroom. 01:51.576 --> 01:54.357 [SPEAKER_00]: And wow, what a stage this is. 01:54.897 --> 01:57.399 [SPEAKER_00]: We live in Michigan in a, in a little hobby farm. 01:57.679 --> 02:05.486 [SPEAKER_00]: We've been here about five years, grew up in the suburbs, and we're a little outside the Ann Arbor Michigan area, which is where the University of Michigan is. 02:05.846 --> 02:10.190 [SPEAKER_00]: We are a homeschooling family, which is one of the best decisions that we have ever made as a family. 02:10.210 --> 02:12.833 [SPEAKER_00]: And we do not regret it for one second. 02:12.893 --> 02:14.534 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm also the founder of a global movement. 02:14.834 --> 02:20.099 [SPEAKER_00]: It's called Mondauze and ours outside, which has been around for quite a while, but not popular for as long as it's been around. 02:20.119 --> 02:24.343 [SPEAKER_00]: At the beginning, it was kind of considered weird, especially by my friend. 02:24.903 --> 02:27.345 [SPEAKER_00]: And now, though, it's gone around the world. 02:27.465 --> 02:30.067 [SPEAKER_00]: And it's just a simple message, just simple message. 02:30.107 --> 02:31.809 [SPEAKER_00]: It's not super easy to implement. 02:32.149 --> 02:38.374 [SPEAKER_00]: But it's a simple message that if we are intentional about hands-on living and especially hands-on living outside, it really changes everything. 02:38.754 --> 02:40.576 [SPEAKER_00]: It changes things for our family dynamic. 02:40.636 --> 02:42.157 [SPEAKER_00]: It changes things for child development. 02:42.497 --> 02:45.900 [SPEAKER_00]: And it really is an answer to a lot of the modern day parenting problems. 02:46.500 --> 02:54.744 [SPEAKER_00]: We have got a retail brand, we have got a podcast, a top ranked podcast, app, a top ranked app, and I've got a lot of books that I've written in a speaker on the country. 02:55.124 --> 03:02.107 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm at just that simple thing of returning to sort of an old fashion childhood, but for the sake of actually preparing kids for the future. 03:02.267 --> 03:03.548 [SPEAKER_00]: And that's just a lot, you're very busy. 03:03.568 --> 03:05.409 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, he busier than anybody else. 03:05.629 --> 03:07.250 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, I mean, the bad luck we're out. 03:07.531 --> 03:10.132 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, the Bible talks about just, you know, do today. 03:10.292 --> 03:16.977 [SPEAKER_00]: Give us this day our daily bread and the Bible talks about, um, no, not worrying each day has enough trouble of its own. 03:17.037 --> 03:18.598 [SPEAKER_00]: And so that's what we try and do. 03:18.638 --> 03:24.202 [SPEAKER_00]: We try and give each day our full effort and fettically and it seems to work out. 03:24.842 --> 03:25.022 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. 03:25.383 --> 03:25.563 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. 03:25.703 --> 03:27.284 [SPEAKER_01]: And you, your kids are at a great age. 03:27.344 --> 03:28.385 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't have a sixteen year old. 03:28.445 --> 03:29.386 [SPEAKER_01]: My oldest is thirteen. 03:29.686 --> 03:33.710 [SPEAKER_01]: But there are so many times that I've told my husband, I'm like, can we just teach him to drive like a little bit? 03:33.970 --> 03:34.751 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. 03:34.791 --> 03:37.433 [SPEAKER_00]: People kind of freak out about it because I think they feel sad. 03:37.493 --> 03:40.035 [SPEAKER_00]: It's a, it's a big milestone and off they go. 03:40.095 --> 03:41.757 [SPEAKER_00]: And I was like, this is fantastic. 03:42.017 --> 03:44.638 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, there's supposed to get more independence, right? 03:44.779 --> 03:45.579 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, that's the goal. 03:45.899 --> 03:46.479 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I think. 03:46.660 --> 03:50.321 [SPEAKER_01]: That's the one I hear is independence is the goal, but it is hard. 03:50.602 --> 03:50.782 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. 03:51.182 --> 03:51.402 [SPEAKER_01]: I know. 03:51.482 --> 03:58.946 [SPEAKER_01]: I would just, I'm like, if you could just run to the store for me, or even just like pull my car out of the way for your, like, help, be putting basketball in my car. 03:58.986 --> 04:00.747 [SPEAKER_01]: I'll be in the way and I'm like, can't you just move it? 04:01.107 --> 04:01.567 [SPEAKER_01]: But he can't. 04:02.348 --> 04:02.908 [SPEAKER_01]: He can't drive. 04:03.368 --> 04:03.949 [SPEAKER_00]: But it would be great. 04:04.229 --> 04:11.373 [SPEAKER_00]: Or like, okay, if you're at the store and it starts to downpour, and your car is way at the back of the park, not like you can send your kid to go get it. 04:13.357 --> 04:14.378 [SPEAKER_00]: It is like top notch. 04:14.739 --> 04:16.540 [SPEAKER_00]: It's one of my favorite things that's ever happened. 04:16.801 --> 04:20.604 [SPEAKER_01]: I think you're the only person I've ever met that has set that, but that gives me a lot of encouragement. 04:20.905 --> 04:21.105 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. 04:21.125 --> 04:25.269 [SPEAKER_01]: People usually freak out because I mean, it is one scary to give them a beautiful practice. 04:25.289 --> 04:31.275 [SPEAKER_00]: They practice for a long time and there's also to there's segments, different segments they have to take. 04:31.656 --> 04:32.577 [SPEAKER_00]: We felt pretty good about it. 04:32.817 --> 04:33.398 [SPEAKER_01]: I remember when I 04:34.118 --> 04:37.741 [SPEAKER_01]: started learning to drive the very first time I actually got in the car with my mom. 04:37.761 --> 04:42.886 [SPEAKER_01]: We were just in the neighborhood and I got so excited when the car door automatically locked. 04:42.906 --> 04:45.148 [SPEAKER_01]: Because it meant I went over like ten miles now. 04:47.109 --> 04:48.010 [SPEAKER_00]: There is something about it. 04:48.170 --> 04:52.854 [SPEAKER_00]: I remember the first time I drove by myself and you just feel like my goodness, I could go anywhere. 04:53.235 --> 04:55.977 [SPEAKER_00]: And I do think that that sense of independence and that sense of 04:56.637 --> 05:20.744 [SPEAKER_01]: internal locus of control matters a lot for kids and a lot of kids are missing them yeah absolutely and I think we're gonna cover that a little bit as we continue our conversation so we actually like recently did a whole series on school choice and had spent a lot about a lot of time talking about different schooling options homeschooling included and I think it's just so interesting how homeschooling is on the rise in popularity like more and more people are doing it more and more people are seeing the benefits 05:21.164 --> 05:23.246 [SPEAKER_01]: So I'm excited to touch on it again today. 05:23.426 --> 05:25.908 [SPEAKER_01]: And I just love, okay, so your latest book is Home Scoring. 05:26.069 --> 05:27.710 [SPEAKER_01]: You're doing it right just by doing it. 05:28.251 --> 05:29.472 [SPEAKER_01]: And I love this up title. 05:29.832 --> 05:33.335 [SPEAKER_00]: And the main title is just Home Scoring. 05:33.355 --> 05:34.837 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, kind of like this. 05:34.857 --> 05:36.298 [SPEAKER_00]: I want to take on cast. 05:36.318 --> 05:37.279 [SPEAKER_01]: You know what you're getting. 05:37.839 --> 05:38.360 [SPEAKER_00]: Exactly. 05:38.660 --> 05:39.381 [SPEAKER_00]: What is this about? 05:39.541 --> 05:41.483 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, yeah, it's about Home Scoring. 05:42.071 --> 05:43.792 [SPEAKER_01]: But I think so many of us need to hear it. 05:44.233 --> 05:47.034 [SPEAKER_01]: You're doing it right just by doing it for a lot of parenting. 05:47.375 --> 05:48.595 [SPEAKER_01]: So I sure for sure. 05:48.655 --> 05:53.038 [SPEAKER_00]: And I think a lot of the things that we'll talk about really extend into every choice that parents make. 05:53.378 --> 05:56.440 [SPEAKER_00]: It has to do with the time that you do have the choice to make. 05:56.460 --> 05:58.041 [SPEAKER_00]: Because after noon, it's the weekend. 05:58.382 --> 06:02.404 [SPEAKER_00]: It's, you know, maybe taking a trip during the school year and saying it's all right if they miss some things. 06:02.704 --> 06:04.165 [SPEAKER_00]: We're going to skip some of that homework. 06:04.285 --> 06:04.726 [SPEAKER_00]: It's really a 06:05.346 --> 06:12.451 [SPEAKER_00]: a broader topic of how we raise children and how much we trust children and how much time we give them to let it be their own. 06:12.651 --> 06:12.971 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. 06:13.572 --> 06:13.752 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay. 06:13.772 --> 06:22.098 [SPEAKER_01]: So let's start with kind of, I feel like in general, parents are there's like a lot of pressure and messages about what their kids should be doing. 06:22.458 --> 06:26.001 [SPEAKER_01]: And I think there's a lot of pressure around school to an education. 06:26.561 --> 06:34.087 [SPEAKER_01]: So how can parents discern what's best for their own family and then like push back against some of that pressure that we feel? 06:34.267 --> 06:40.272 [SPEAKER_00]: So this is, I think, a really, really great time to be a parent's death because everyone can look around them and see what's going on. 06:40.612 --> 06:45.576 [SPEAKER_00]: Whereas in the past, you may not have been able to have so much insight, but everybody can look around them and see, huh? 06:46.397 --> 06:48.198 [SPEAKER_00]: AI is probably going to change a whole lot of things. 06:48.378 --> 06:49.279 [SPEAKER_00]: In fact, it already is. 06:49.659 --> 06:55.622 [SPEAKER_00]: There's companies that are laying off a thousand employees today, four thousand employees tomorrow by twenty twenty seven. 06:55.762 --> 06:58.223 [SPEAKER_00]: We're going to reduce our workforce by X amount. 06:58.603 --> 07:09.509 [SPEAKER_00]: So everybody can see that that's happening and everybody can start to extrapolate and to use their common sense as to what that might look like for their children in the future, which is this is a future that they're stepping into. 07:09.869 --> 07:12.711 [SPEAKER_00]: And what we have is a situation I think is wonderful. 07:13.231 --> 07:19.255 [SPEAKER_00]: is that what differentiates us from AI and from machines and from robots is our humanity. 07:19.656 --> 07:36.847 [SPEAKER_00]: So we actually are in the situation where the jobs of the future are relational, the jobs of the future are problem solving, the jobs of the future require flexibility, they require creativity, they require grit, they require the ability to take risk to learn from failure, the ability to see what's needed and jump in and do that thing. 07:37.048 --> 07:38.549 [SPEAKER_00]: So the statistics are something like 07:39.392 --> 07:42.235 [SPEAKER_00]: The average kid today will have seven careers in a lifetime. 07:42.295 --> 07:45.898 [SPEAKER_00]: That's careers, not jobs, twelve to twenty four jobs, seven careers. 07:46.138 --> 07:47.679 [SPEAKER_00]: That's a lot of people you're interacting with. 07:47.960 --> 07:48.880 [SPEAKER_00]: That's a lot of bosses. 07:48.920 --> 07:50.001 [SPEAKER_00]: That's a lot of coworkers. 07:50.182 --> 07:52.724 [SPEAKER_00]: Entrepreneurship is on the rise dramatically. 07:53.024 --> 08:00.571 [SPEAKER_00]: Something like seventy five percent of everyone by twenty thirty five will either be an entrepreneur or someone who is dipping their hands in a bunch of different hats. 08:01.031 --> 08:03.113 [SPEAKER_00]: So when you take a look at that and 08:03.373 --> 08:04.315 [SPEAKER_00]: Everybody can see it. 08:04.675 --> 08:05.536 [SPEAKER_00]: Nobody is exempt. 08:05.677 --> 08:08.400 [SPEAKER_00]: Everybody knows, okay, things are changing, things are changing. 08:08.741 --> 08:18.395 [SPEAKER_00]: We can use that to inform how we parent and what happens is when we step back to those things that sort of seem old fashioned or seem like they're kind of a waste of time. 08:18.615 --> 08:22.356 [SPEAKER_00]: Those are the places where we learn the skills that we need for the future. 08:22.416 --> 08:23.796 [SPEAKER_00]: So it's really a win-win-win. 08:24.196 --> 08:29.257 [SPEAKER_00]: It's a situation where kids can really enjoy their childhood as it's meant to be as God made it. 08:29.577 --> 08:39.839 [SPEAKER_00]: God biologically made them to self-educate, to have this internal drive to play, to build relationships, to live hands on, to learn new things, to grow, grow, grow with all the things that they're interested in. 08:40.019 --> 08:40.799 [SPEAKER_00]: God made them that way. 08:41.119 --> 08:42.400 [SPEAKER_00]: So we don't have to subvert it. 08:42.840 --> 08:43.360 [SPEAKER_00]: And when we 08:44.400 --> 08:52.167 [SPEAKER_00]: encouraged that then they become more self-reliant and self-directed so that makes parenting easier and then it sets them up for the future. 08:52.447 --> 08:53.468 [SPEAKER_00]: Everything you said was so good. 08:53.488 --> 08:55.450 [SPEAKER_01]: We're just like the comments. 08:55.470 --> 08:56.891 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, nobody's so true. 08:56.991 --> 09:01.615 [SPEAKER_01]: And there's so much, so much what you're saying is just a matter of letting them slow down a little bit. 09:01.635 --> 09:03.257 [SPEAKER_01]: Like we're in such a rush. 09:03.557 --> 09:11.080 [SPEAKER_01]: And everything is such a competition and we always want to be the best and have the best for our kids, you know, because we love them so much. 09:11.200 --> 09:16.722 [SPEAKER_01]: But if we step back, maybe the best thing for our kids is to live outside the box a little bit and to slow down. 09:17.343 --> 09:20.884 [SPEAKER_01]: How do we do that as parents, though, how do we resist that rush? 09:20.944 --> 09:25.846 [SPEAKER_01]: How do we create a slower life, a more intentional rhythm so that kids can do all those things? 09:26.166 --> 09:27.547 [SPEAKER_00]: you could try one thousand hours outside. 09:27.607 --> 09:29.129 [SPEAKER_00]: That would be one of the guests. 09:29.189 --> 09:31.872 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, that really is why it answers so many of the problems. 09:32.132 --> 09:37.077 [SPEAKER_00]: We are intentional about getting outside for a certain amount of time in the year and what that does is it forces a slowdown. 09:37.317 --> 09:44.284 [SPEAKER_00]: It's a daily reminder of we infusing our life with time for the kids that is their own that they get to grapple with and use how they will. 09:44.624 --> 09:49.307 [SPEAKER_00]: Whether you do it that way or you just say, there's three hours every day where we don't fill it. 09:49.727 --> 09:51.728 [SPEAKER_00]: And the kids get to fill it with what they want to fill it with. 09:51.828 --> 09:53.950 [SPEAKER_00]: Legos are reading, art, whatever that is. 09:54.330 --> 10:01.334 [SPEAKER_00]: And what happens is slowly stuff in time, you start to see very clearly that kids are competent. 10:01.574 --> 10:16.788 [SPEAKER_00]: But they can't fill their time with things that are worthwhile to them and that they can grow on their own without us having to impose because the problem is is if you step off of a conveyor belt type system, which that is what the public school system is, 10:17.268 --> 10:19.209 [SPEAKER_00]: No offense at all to any teacher. 10:19.489 --> 10:22.390 [SPEAKER_00]: They are loving and doing wonderful job with these kids. 10:22.770 --> 10:25.311 [SPEAKER_00]: It's the system that is very assembly line-ish. 10:25.471 --> 10:28.213 [SPEAKER_00]: And that's sort of what it was designed to do. 10:28.253 --> 10:30.213 [SPEAKER_00]: It was designed to send people into the factories. 10:30.553 --> 10:32.134 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, the factories don't exist anymore. 10:32.554 --> 10:42.058 [SPEAKER_00]: So if you are growing up in this sort of assembly line system, our first grade looks like second grade and second grade prepares you for third grade and middle school to high school and high school to college and then what? 10:42.418 --> 10:42.858 [SPEAKER_00]: And then what? 10:44.219 --> 10:45.360 [SPEAKER_00]: You have no guidance. 10:45.400 --> 10:46.560 [SPEAKER_00]: It's like you fall off a cliff. 10:46.701 --> 10:50.523 [SPEAKER_00]: Everything has been for fifteen years, possibly twelve years, possibly. 10:50.963 --> 10:53.024 [SPEAKER_00]: You have been sort of told what to do. 10:53.364 --> 10:58.527 [SPEAKER_00]: And then all of a sudden there's nobody there telling you what to do and you're entering a world of seven careers. 10:58.928 --> 11:02.550 [SPEAKER_00]: So it's not a situation where you say, well, I'm going to join at the bottom of this company. 11:02.630 --> 11:03.971 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to work there for thirty years. 11:04.031 --> 11:04.911 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to get a pension. 11:05.191 --> 11:06.672 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to retire with health benefits. 11:07.052 --> 11:08.553 [SPEAKER_00]: That doesn't exist anymore. 11:08.894 --> 11:09.194 [SPEAKER_00]: So this 11:09.754 --> 11:14.016 [SPEAKER_00]: open ended time is very valuable for our children. 11:14.316 --> 11:17.598 [SPEAKER_00]: And it was just a matter of saving the space on the calendar. 11:17.978 --> 11:20.819 [SPEAKER_00]: It's a matter of saying, our kids deserve some. 11:20.899 --> 11:23.861 [SPEAKER_00]: And so we are going to make sure that we do not take it all. 11:24.061 --> 11:24.281 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. 11:24.601 --> 11:24.861 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay. 11:25.061 --> 11:26.382 [SPEAKER_01]: So two things kind of about that. 11:26.442 --> 11:29.444 [SPEAKER_01]: First I want to talk a little bit home school and how that relates to that. 11:29.504 --> 11:31.945 [SPEAKER_01]: And then moving to some of the boredom a little bit more. 11:31.985 --> 11:32.105 [SPEAKER_01]: But 11:32.545 --> 11:36.030 [SPEAKER_01]: How do you feel like home school is the answer to all of that? 11:36.050 --> 11:44.042 [SPEAKER_01]: Like I feel like you've touched on it a little bit, but just practically what are some of the things that kids are getting if they're at home that will help them with that? 11:44.162 --> 11:46.666 [SPEAKER_01]: Like all of a sudden you're eighteen and you're gonna have seven different. 11:47.947 --> 11:57.452 [SPEAKER_00]: They're getting so many things that they need for this type of a world because, actually, honestly, because of the deficits, the things that seem like deficits. 11:57.752 --> 12:01.294 [SPEAKER_00]: So when I was a public school teacher and I did some substitute teaching as well. 12:01.334 --> 12:10.839 [SPEAKER_00]: So I had my hands in a lot of different grades and situations I got to see a lot of different types of classrooms, but the basic gist of being a teacher is that you run that tight ship. 12:11.219 --> 12:14.063 [SPEAKER_00]: because it can become chaotic very, very quickly. 12:14.263 --> 12:18.148 [SPEAKER_00]: So you have plans, you have transitions, you have an opener and a closer. 12:18.188 --> 12:21.152 [SPEAKER_00]: It's almost like, I mean, it's an exhausting job. 12:22.794 --> 12:24.356 [SPEAKER_00]: It is such an exhausting job. 12:24.596 --> 12:25.938 [SPEAKER_00]: I felt like a circus performer. 12:26.218 --> 12:27.558 [SPEAKER_00]: You have to keep everybody's attention. 12:27.578 --> 12:31.459 [SPEAKER_00]: You've got to try and move them through this curriculum that they absolutely do not want to do. 12:31.799 --> 12:35.620 [SPEAKER_00]: But at the basis of it, the child is not involved at all. 12:35.940 --> 12:37.501 [SPEAKER_00]: The child doesn't decide what's going on. 12:37.761 --> 12:39.301 [SPEAKER_00]: The child doesn't decide the lesson plan. 12:39.341 --> 12:41.141 [SPEAKER_00]: The child doesn't decide the scope and sequence. 12:41.421 --> 12:43.082 [SPEAKER_00]: The child shows up and is told what to do. 12:43.522 --> 12:52.884 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, in a homeschool situation, a mother or a father or grandma's filling in for a little bit or whoever, you do not have the capacity as one person as a parent. 12:53.264 --> 13:00.131 [SPEAKER_00]: to fill the day like that, to have an opening song and transitions and for an eight hour day you just don't. 13:00.332 --> 13:04.636 [SPEAKER_00]: And so what happens because of what seems like a deficit is there's open space. 13:04.977 --> 13:10.162 [SPEAKER_00]: The home school day just provides a lot of space that's not taken up and it don't direct it. 13:10.442 --> 13:11.744 [SPEAKER_00]: So that just happens naturally. 13:12.144 --> 13:14.427 [SPEAKER_00]: Another thing that happens naturally is that kids have to fill in. 13:14.887 --> 13:15.787 [SPEAKER_00]: I just had a book launch. 13:15.927 --> 13:17.368 [SPEAKER_00]: We've got kids at our little bit older. 13:17.648 --> 13:19.108 [SPEAKER_00]: So I'm on this podcast. 13:19.148 --> 13:20.248 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm talking to this person. 13:20.268 --> 13:22.049 [SPEAKER_00]: There's a little bit of a busier season. 13:22.369 --> 13:23.469 [SPEAKER_00]: This happens in every family. 13:23.769 --> 13:24.829 [SPEAKER_00]: You're taking care of grandma. 13:24.869 --> 13:25.630 [SPEAKER_00]: She's not feeling well. 13:25.870 --> 13:26.710 [SPEAKER_00]: You just had a baby. 13:26.930 --> 13:27.810 [SPEAKER_00]: You had a job loss. 13:27.890 --> 13:28.670 [SPEAKER_00]: Your transitioning. 13:28.710 --> 13:30.891 [SPEAKER_00]: You move kids to have to step in. 13:31.251 --> 13:32.931 [SPEAKER_00]: And so some of our kids are making a dinner. 13:33.011 --> 13:33.792 [SPEAKER_00]: They're making a lunch. 13:34.172 --> 13:39.633 [SPEAKER_00]: All of these types of things that they're joining in sort of just due to the fact that we are limited people. 13:40.033 --> 13:45.155 [SPEAKER_00]: They have a lot of opportunity to engage in multi-age interaction, which is a huge deal. 13:45.396 --> 13:54.220 [SPEAKER_00]: These are their peers that are going to be marrying within this age group that they're going to be roommates with, that they're going to be co-workers with, that they're growing up together. 13:54.240 --> 13:58.802 [SPEAKER_00]: And the fact that we safe and kids off with all eight-year-olds with all eight-year-olds, it cuts us off. 13:59.102 --> 14:00.643 [SPEAKER_00]: We need to learn from those who are older. 14:00.904 --> 14:05.008 [SPEAKER_00]: We need to learn how to be empathetic when we are surrounded with those who are younger. 14:05.328 --> 14:07.430 [SPEAKER_00]: Tatlers are going to let you know how they feel. 14:07.450 --> 14:08.871 [SPEAKER_00]: A toddler is a blessing. 14:09.031 --> 14:10.593 [SPEAKER_00]: It's hard to homeschool with the toddler. 14:10.953 --> 14:18.280 [SPEAKER_00]: However, those are the times and kids are learning empathy and learning how to pay attention to somebody else's emotion and learning how to flex. 14:18.740 --> 14:24.764 [SPEAKER_00]: So there are so many things that are happening solely because a child is in the home. 14:25.185 --> 14:27.887 [SPEAKER_00]: They are exposed to adult modeling. 14:28.187 --> 14:29.928 [SPEAKER_00]: How do we depending on your situation? 14:30.228 --> 14:31.489 [SPEAKER_00]: How do we build our own business? 14:31.749 --> 14:32.710 [SPEAKER_00]: We have got a family business. 14:33.030 --> 14:34.191 [SPEAKER_00]: How do we craft a life? 14:34.431 --> 14:35.432 [SPEAKER_00]: How do we do a meal plan? 14:35.592 --> 14:36.813 [SPEAKER_00]: How do we do our finances? 14:37.093 --> 14:37.994 [SPEAKER_00]: How do we grocery shop? 14:38.454 --> 14:45.039 [SPEAKER_00]: All of those things matter and a kid gets a front row seat to their parent and to the other adults that are in their social community. 14:45.639 --> 14:55.709 [SPEAKER_01]: And it's kind of like a forced independence which I think like the homeschool community has gotten kind of a bad rap for because people like hear that and they're like oh you're putting too much on kids. 14:55.989 --> 14:58.472 [SPEAKER_01]: When the reality is you're giving them a gift. 14:59.676 --> 15:00.878 [SPEAKER_01]: to teach them how to be a plant. 15:00.918 --> 15:09.651 [SPEAKER_01]: And so, but I do feel like there was, there's been the cultural switch where people kind of, I mean, even a kind of a bad rap for that, because they wanted to do everything for their kids. 15:09.671 --> 15:12.094 [SPEAKER_01]: And I think people are starting to see the benefits of that. 15:12.194 --> 15:15.239 [SPEAKER_00]: So if someone wanted to see the other side, then I would recommend this book. 15:15.359 --> 15:15.940 [SPEAKER_00]: It's called What 15:16.060 --> 15:27.467 [SPEAKER_00]: time is noon by chip late in and he was a career guy worked in corporate America and he started to post online text messages that he got from his teenagers that were kind of just ridiculous. 15:27.787 --> 15:41.355 [SPEAKER_00]: We're in a new era right where kids can text their parents and he started to sort of be this person this hub where people would say oh my goodness my kid texted me this and so he just recently came out of this book called what time is noon he left corporate America to do this full time as a comedian. 15:41.555 --> 15:49.800 [SPEAKER_00]: But the book is bunny, but also pretty wild and eye-opening, where kids are saying, I'm at the store, where do I buy the pasta water? 15:50.360 --> 15:52.381 [SPEAKER_00]: If I use eggs, I know. 15:52.681 --> 15:57.244 [SPEAKER_00]: If I use eggs from two different containers, will my food taste weird? 15:57.664 --> 16:05.789 [SPEAKER_00]: And you know, he's had one from college students, where college student texts a parent and says, how do I get my clothes out of the washing machine? 16:06.209 --> 16:07.770 [SPEAKER_00]: Do I just use my hands? 16:08.190 --> 16:09.191 [SPEAKER_00]: And so that's funny. 16:09.911 --> 16:18.318 [SPEAKER_00]: But it's not really a funny, and the professors are saying the same thing that the kids are showing up, and they can't even make simple decisions without texting their parents. 16:18.478 --> 16:28.686 [SPEAKER_00]: So if we want to raise kids who can independently and successfully and feel good about it, enter into the adult world, they have to start young with independence. 16:28.826 --> 16:33.290 [SPEAKER_00]: And in other cultures, Michaeline declared a phenomenon called Hunt Gather Parent. 16:33.650 --> 16:37.694 [SPEAKER_00]: where she talked about, as soon as that kid can walk, they're involved in what the family is doing. 16:37.954 --> 16:40.337 [SPEAKER_00]: And that is what gives them a sense of self-control. 16:40.657 --> 16:42.318 [SPEAKER_00]: It gives them a sense of self-esteem. 16:42.639 --> 16:44.360 [SPEAKER_00]: It gives them their family membership card. 16:44.420 --> 16:45.602 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm a part of something. 16:46.302 --> 16:50.166 [SPEAKER_00]: And there are psychologists that are saying it's this lack of self-control. 16:50.186 --> 16:57.393 [SPEAKER_00]: If someone is doing everything for me, I don't feel like I'm a competent person that's contributing to a lot of the anxiety and depression. 16:57.593 --> 16:59.034 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, in that all makes sense. 16:59.094 --> 17:03.318 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's how we used to always do life before, again, the Industrial Revolution. 17:03.378 --> 17:07.062 [SPEAKER_01]: And we needed to get people to factories and all these things like kids are just part of the family contributing. 17:07.162 --> 17:07.922 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's how they learned. 17:08.523 --> 17:12.587 [SPEAKER_01]: And so I think that is just such a blessing that homeschool families have that. 17:12.827 --> 17:14.889 [SPEAKER_01]: And I think even my kids are in school. 17:15.089 --> 17:18.412 [SPEAKER_01]: But I do think that I really, we homeschool for one year. 17:18.592 --> 17:22.234 [SPEAKER_01]: But I respect the homeschoolers and I really do try to learn from them. 17:22.254 --> 17:28.437 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, okay, so how can I foster some of that independence in my kids and give them a little more ownership of the things that they're doing? 17:28.457 --> 17:31.318 [SPEAKER_01]: Because I think it's so important and it's really easy to take it away from them. 17:31.867 --> 17:33.227 [SPEAKER_01]: because it's way easier to do everything for them. 17:33.307 --> 17:37.048 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, because a low sense of sense of control causes anxiety. 17:37.428 --> 17:39.509 [SPEAKER_00]: And so that's true for both kids and parents. 17:39.869 --> 17:46.690 [SPEAKER_00]: So when you don't feel like your in control is apparent and especially in a rapidly changing world, this is a really uncertain scary time. 17:47.050 --> 17:54.432 [SPEAKER_00]: And so a lot of times when things are uncertain and scary, we tend to double down on control because we feel uncertain and we feel anxious. 17:54.692 --> 17:59.072 [SPEAKER_00]: But the problem is that our kids also feel anxious when they don't have a sense of control. 17:59.373 --> 18:01.853 [SPEAKER_00]: And so you almost, it's almost a situation where you have to 18:01.893 --> 18:02.453 [SPEAKER_00]: to choose them. 18:03.134 --> 18:07.355 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, look, one of us is going to feel anxious, is either going to be me or it's going to be you. 18:07.676 --> 18:12.938 [SPEAKER_00]: And as a parent, I would rather take on the bulk of that anxiety than have my kid do it. 18:13.078 --> 18:15.819 [SPEAKER_00]: And then what happens is over time, it lessons. 18:16.099 --> 18:17.220 [SPEAKER_00]: That's where we had no issues. 18:17.280 --> 18:19.581 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, sending our kid out into the world, he's going to drive. 18:19.621 --> 18:20.781 [SPEAKER_00]: He's got an internship. 18:21.001 --> 18:22.462 [SPEAKER_00]: We'd had a lot of years of practice. 18:22.902 --> 18:31.915 [SPEAKER_00]: It mattered quite a bit and it showed up then and I feel fairly confident that he's just going to soar in his life or oldest who's getting really close to graduating. 18:32.596 --> 18:38.464 [SPEAKER_00]: And I think that comes from a decade plus of passing the baton and allowing some freedom. 18:38.684 --> 18:56.486 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I think that's so true because I do feel like my worst seasons of parenting where I'm like, wow, this has not been a good week or a couple weeks or whatever is when I feel out of control is when I like really tighten the reins and then the kids respond to that and we just get into the cycle of who's trying to control what and it never works out, never works. 18:58.288 --> 19:03.470 [SPEAKER_00]: And they have a good internal system, and that's the thing that's really tricky to remember. 19:03.770 --> 19:05.651 [SPEAKER_00]: They learned how to crawl on their own. 19:05.811 --> 19:08.532 [SPEAKER_00]: They didn't know how to talk, but they learned how to do that. 19:08.612 --> 19:11.113 [SPEAKER_00]: And so they have this internal, God made them that way. 19:11.193 --> 19:18.436 [SPEAKER_00]: They have this internal part of them that drives them on to grow into master, to master skills, and then to move on to something harder. 19:18.816 --> 19:22.861 [SPEAKER_00]: And so it's tricky, it's tricky to sit on our hands, but that's part of the job of a parent. 19:23.102 --> 19:24.283 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, hundred percent. 19:24.463 --> 19:30.972 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, let's move back into boredom a little bit because, like I said, my kids are in school, but they're home for the summer. 19:31.192 --> 19:35.518 [SPEAKER_01]: And so everyone whose kids are usually in school, everyone's home right now, it's summer. 19:35.758 --> 19:39.902 [SPEAKER_01]: So, and I think boredom is really hard, especially in today's world. 19:39.942 --> 19:44.226 [SPEAKER_01]: A lot of, for a lot of the root same reasons we've already been talking about is we like to structure our kids. 19:44.286 --> 19:45.507 [SPEAKER_01]: We like to keep them busy. 19:45.848 --> 19:48.050 [SPEAKER_01]: We want them to follow this like track. 19:48.210 --> 19:58.320 [SPEAKER_01]: So, we kind of talked about why kids need boredom, but like how can parents kind of stop feeling guilty about boredom, whether it's feeling bad that their kids are bored or that they're busy. 19:58.560 --> 19:59.941 [SPEAKER_00]: You have to look at it like it's a gift. 20:00.341 --> 20:00.921 [SPEAKER_00]: It is a gift. 20:00.981 --> 20:02.002 [SPEAKER_00]: Do you have to change your mindset? 20:02.302 --> 20:04.263 [SPEAKER_00]: And you may have to pick up some books that remind you that. 20:04.563 --> 20:05.343 [SPEAKER_00]: There's a really good book. 20:05.423 --> 20:06.884 [SPEAKER_00]: It's called What Is It Called? 20:07.484 --> 20:11.786 [SPEAKER_00]: It's called Beyond Winning by a man in Kim Jong-pain and Luis Fernando Yosa. 20:11.986 --> 20:13.767 [SPEAKER_00]: And it's about toxic youth sports culture. 20:14.087 --> 20:19.009 [SPEAKER_00]: Now, I read it before our kids were entering into any of the sports things before travel, any of that. 20:19.109 --> 20:21.110 [SPEAKER_00]: And I read it because I like Kim Jong-pain. 20:21.290 --> 20:24.612 [SPEAKER_00]: So I thought, well, this book isn't really going to apply to me too much, but I like Kim Jong-pain. 20:24.632 --> 20:25.392 [SPEAKER_00]: So I'm going to read the book. 20:25.772 --> 20:27.492 [SPEAKER_00]: And the book is really phenomenal. 20:27.592 --> 20:29.693 [SPEAKER_00]: And it talks in there a lot about boredom. 20:30.033 --> 20:32.333 [SPEAKER_00]: And they say when your kids are bored, you have not failed. 20:32.653 --> 20:34.353 [SPEAKER_00]: There are a lot of books that would talk about that. 20:34.373 --> 20:36.834 [SPEAKER_00]: That boredom is the bridge from nothing to creativity. 20:37.194 --> 20:44.395 [SPEAKER_00]: And of course, again, in this day and age, when there's not going to be a script, Leonard Sex calls it the middle class script. 20:44.755 --> 20:50.596 [SPEAKER_00]: He says the middle class script is you go to school, you go to college, and you get a good job, and you have a good life. 20:51.356 --> 20:54.637 [SPEAKER_00]: And he says the problem with the middle class script is that it's wrong. 20:55.637 --> 20:56.839 [SPEAKER_00]: That's it. 20:57.019 --> 20:58.060 [SPEAKER_00]: It doesn't always work. 20:58.460 --> 21:03.747 [SPEAKER_00]: And there are a lot of things that can contribute to it now working, one being the changing job market. 21:04.147 --> 21:04.708 [SPEAKER_00]: That's one. 21:04.768 --> 21:07.251 [SPEAKER_00]: But he said sometimes kids don't get into the college that they want. 21:07.271 --> 21:08.092 [SPEAKER_00]: They can't afford it. 21:08.132 --> 21:09.513 [SPEAKER_00]: There's a lot of issues there. 21:09.874 --> 21:13.358 [SPEAKER_00]: So we're in a situation where we are going to have to create our own lives. 21:13.398 --> 21:14.579 [SPEAKER_00]: We have to make our own paths. 21:15.200 --> 21:20.922 [SPEAKER_00]: We have a lot of things that entertain us that basically make it so that we don't have to have any creativity. 21:21.302 --> 21:26.763 [SPEAKER_00]: I talked to this college professor who said that kids are coming to college now and they can't form any mental pictures. 21:27.183 --> 21:34.745 [SPEAKER_00]: So for example, if you would read a story to a book, a story book to a child of the purple unicorn flew across the sky. 21:35.086 --> 21:38.827 [SPEAKER_00]: And if you're listening, you would think that in your head a picture of a purple unicorn finds grass the sky. 21:39.227 --> 21:43.908 [SPEAKER_00]: And he said that kids can't even form that mental imagery because they've spent their whole childhood 21:44.308 --> 21:48.910 [SPEAKER_00]: consuming someone else's creativity instead of drawing it out of themselves. 21:49.330 --> 21:55.532 [SPEAKER_00]: So boredom is a gift and once again, I think if you sit back and think about it critically, you're like, okay, yeah, that makes sense. 21:55.692 --> 21:57.413 [SPEAKER_00]: What do you have to do to preserve it? 21:57.753 --> 21:58.834 [SPEAKER_00]: You have to be intentional. 21:59.214 --> 22:06.376 [SPEAKER_00]: You have to be confident that it's okay that your kid isn't in sixteen camps this summer, even though the neighbor kid is. 22:06.736 --> 22:07.877 [SPEAKER_00]: You have to be confident in that. 22:08.277 --> 22:16.719 [SPEAKER_00]: And you also have to have a few skills to help yourself move through that time board because that is irritating and grating. 22:16.739 --> 22:21.480 [SPEAKER_00]: And you already are feeling a little guilty because the neighbor kids at camp in your kid isn't. 22:21.840 --> 22:29.342 [SPEAKER_00]: So some of the skills they come out of the love and logic books, which are fantastic, they say have a phrase that you say that's empathetic. 22:29.722 --> 22:30.302 [SPEAKER_00]: Be empathetic. 22:30.562 --> 22:31.083 [SPEAKER_00]: They're bored. 22:31.263 --> 22:32.183 [SPEAKER_00]: It can be hard to be bored. 22:32.483 --> 22:34.603 [SPEAKER_00]: Be empathetic, but be a broken record. 22:34.943 --> 22:35.884 [SPEAKER_00]: It's okay to be bored. 22:36.224 --> 22:37.164 [SPEAKER_00]: It's okay to be bored. 22:37.304 --> 22:38.265 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, you just have a couple. 22:38.566 --> 22:39.427 [SPEAKER_00]: It's okay to be bored. 22:39.487 --> 22:42.471 [SPEAKER_00]: You'll be boring yourself and then they go find something to do. 22:42.791 --> 22:46.075 [SPEAKER_00]: You could say boredom is the bridge between nothing and creativity. 22:46.155 --> 22:47.337 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, kids get so irritated. 22:47.357 --> 22:48.538 [SPEAKER_00]: They're like, that's so cheesy. 22:48.558 --> 22:50.481 [SPEAKER_00]: You've got over and over again. 22:50.741 --> 22:55.207 [SPEAKER_00]: We say, you know, when our kids like, I'm hungry, we always just go hunger is the best seasoning. 22:56.228 --> 22:57.089 [SPEAKER_00]: And they're like, stop! 22:57.109 --> 22:58.289 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, yours does, they give it. 22:58.689 --> 23:07.834 [SPEAKER_00]: And then they go find something to do, or you say, that's great, because I need all these socks matched, and I'm so glad you have nothing to do, because I have a lot of chores, and you could really help me out. 23:08.055 --> 23:08.755 [SPEAKER_00]: They're gonna run away. 23:09.115 --> 23:10.776 [SPEAKER_00]: Off they go, they're gonna find something to do. 23:11.116 --> 23:17.860 [SPEAKER_00]: Angela Hanskin is a pediatric occupational therapist, and she says it can take up to forty-five minutes for kids to develop a play scheme. 23:18.180 --> 23:18.981 [SPEAKER_00]: That's a long time. 23:19.321 --> 23:21.462 [SPEAKER_00]: Forty-five minutes is a long time to sit through. 23:21.882 --> 23:22.602 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm bored. 23:22.623 --> 23:25.064 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know what to do, but you have to wait it out. 23:25.484 --> 23:28.226 [SPEAKER_00]: And then eventually they're going to pull from their own inner resources. 23:28.586 --> 23:36.690 [SPEAKER_00]: And they're going to be a kid who goes into an adult that has mental imagery and can figure out what to do at that mental imagery thing is so alarming. 23:37.030 --> 23:42.333 [SPEAKER_00]: But it's so, I mean, yeah, if you think about like for my own self, one of my favorite parts of life is reading. 23:42.734 --> 23:43.914 [SPEAKER_00]: I love to read as an adult. 23:43.974 --> 23:45.595 [SPEAKER_00]: And I love to read fiction and nonfiction. 23:45.615 --> 23:46.716 [SPEAKER_00]: But if you're reading a story, 23:47.236 --> 23:56.824 [SPEAKER_00]: So that person, if someone becomes an adult and they don't have the capacity for mental imagery, you've taken away an entire lifetime of really enjoying books. 23:57.765 --> 23:58.225 [SPEAKER_01]: I hate that. 23:58.505 --> 23:58.825 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. 23:59.306 --> 24:00.667 [SPEAKER_00]: I hate every book. 24:01.387 --> 24:02.108 [SPEAKER_00]: Can you imagine? 24:02.168 --> 24:04.670 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, think about the books that you read in your life that you love. 24:05.331 --> 24:08.033 [SPEAKER_00]: They're such a great part of your just of life. 24:08.453 --> 24:15.179 [SPEAKER_01]: So very practically again, when your kids are bored, what are some things that you have seen from them that have really helped them? 24:15.859 --> 24:18.984 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, step away away from born into creativity. 24:19.064 --> 24:20.266 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, have you seen that in your own kids? 24:20.486 --> 24:23.391 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, I mean, we don't even hardly have the issues anymore, right? 24:23.411 --> 24:24.933 [SPEAKER_00]: Because they're older. 24:24.953 --> 24:28.959 [SPEAKER_00]: But with the littler, I mean, you know, you just have stuff around. 24:29.039 --> 24:30.722 [SPEAKER_00]: You have spy or graph and you have 24:31.082 --> 24:33.904 [SPEAKER_00]: yarn and you have art, you know, art materials. 24:34.125 --> 24:35.346 [SPEAKER_00]: You have a little pool. 24:35.386 --> 24:36.166 [SPEAKER_00]: You have a hose. 24:36.346 --> 24:38.068 [SPEAKER_00]: A hose will do wonders. 24:38.508 --> 24:39.829 [SPEAKER_00]: And they just eventually find things. 24:40.029 --> 24:41.531 [SPEAKER_00]: Ideally, you have some friends around. 24:41.631 --> 24:45.154 [SPEAKER_00]: If you can make that happen, either in your neighborhood or inviting kids over. 24:45.494 --> 24:49.077 [SPEAKER_00]: Once again, the Angela Hanscom talks about having full day play date. 24:49.337 --> 24:51.018 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, play dates didn't used to be a thing. 24:51.398 --> 24:57.761 [SPEAKER_00]: It was like you just went and knocked on your neighbor's door and you found who could play in the neighborhood and you had an expansive time. 24:58.201 --> 25:01.042 [SPEAKER_00]: And the expansive time allows for more boredom. 25:01.403 --> 25:08.646 [SPEAKER_00]: It allows for sort of those rough edges where someone wants to play something that you don't want to play and you have to negotiate, which is a really huge skill. 25:08.966 --> 25:11.008 [SPEAKER_00]: the jobs of the future are relational. 25:11.328 --> 25:18.193 [SPEAKER_00]: And so you have to have those skills of how to deal with people and how to be assertive, but not to assertive, how to be empathetic, all of those types of things. 25:18.553 --> 25:22.517 [SPEAKER_00]: So if you can include friends in the mix, that really helps to cut down the boredom. 25:22.937 --> 25:24.178 [SPEAKER_00]: But you just have some stuff around. 25:24.218 --> 25:24.918 [SPEAKER_00]: You have some books. 25:24.938 --> 25:26.239 [SPEAKER_00]: You can have some suggestions. 25:26.580 --> 25:30.223 [SPEAKER_00]: But overall, you can trust that they're going to figure it out. 25:30.963 --> 25:36.828 [SPEAKER_01]: We have, right now, we have just like this bin on my dining room table and to be totally honest, it's driving me crazy. 25:37.429 --> 25:44.135 [SPEAKER_01]: And there's puff paint involved, which makes me very nervous because I'm like, that's not coming out if you get it on our fabric chairs. 25:44.755 --> 25:50.961 [SPEAKER_01]: But for days now, my daughter has been making all these little contraptions and there are pipe cleaners in there. 25:50.981 --> 25:53.823 [SPEAKER_01]: So she's made, she like keeps bringing me pipe cleaner butterflies. 25:54.484 --> 26:06.638 [SPEAKER_01]: different colors every time and she's making these like bracelets out of ribbon she found with puff paint with all her friends names on them and I'm like it's great it's keeping her entertained for hours but you have to let go of the mess a little bit 26:07.148 --> 26:08.028 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and think about it. 26:08.068 --> 26:09.168 [SPEAKER_01]: You have to be okay with puff paint. 26:09.229 --> 26:10.449 [SPEAKER_01]: You can put the plastic down. 26:10.709 --> 26:17.531 [SPEAKER_00]: And you can start to really take a step back and once again sort of use your critical thinking and think, OK, well, she's learning how to be generous. 26:17.831 --> 26:18.971 [SPEAKER_00]: She's learning what her friends like. 26:19.231 --> 26:21.391 [SPEAKER_00]: She's learning what color combinations go get together. 26:21.732 --> 26:22.452 [SPEAKER_00]: That's a job. 26:22.512 --> 26:28.053 [SPEAKER_00]: If someone down the road wants to have an interior designer, I don't think they want a robot to show up at their door. 26:28.493 --> 26:31.054 [SPEAKER_00]: I think they want a person who's going to come in and say, you know what? 26:31.094 --> 26:32.054 [SPEAKER_00]: This looks good with that. 26:32.374 --> 26:34.375 [SPEAKER_00]: And she's working on her fine motor skills, right? 26:34.415 --> 26:35.575 [SPEAKER_00]: So all that puff paint. 26:35.815 --> 26:41.296 [SPEAKER_00]: That is actually doing a whole lot for a school prep in terms of getting ready for the next school year. 26:41.336 --> 26:42.917 [SPEAKER_00]: You don't really need the worksheet, right? 26:42.937 --> 26:46.037 [SPEAKER_00]: You, your present, those puff paint bottles are actually hard to squeeze. 26:46.057 --> 26:48.078 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, they're hard to make really accurate. 26:48.138 --> 26:50.178 [SPEAKER_00]: I remember that as a kid, they're so fun. 26:50.559 --> 26:55.820 [SPEAKER_00]: But there is a lot of learning going on even in the things that seem like a messy chaotic situation. 26:55.980 --> 26:56.220 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes. 26:56.460 --> 27:02.903 [SPEAKER_01]: That is such a good reminder and I mean for me and for probably everyone listening and like all those things can just be reframed. 27:03.283 --> 27:05.524 [SPEAKER_01]: Like that's all it is reframing it into something. 27:05.744 --> 27:07.705 [SPEAKER_01]: My kids learning or this is a skill set. 27:08.325 --> 27:10.426 [SPEAKER_01]: Even though I would be just like I would love to clean it up. 27:10.646 --> 27:11.006 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. 27:11.546 --> 27:11.846 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. 27:12.247 --> 27:18.549 [SPEAKER_00]: And this is the part of parenting where you pass the baton and you remember that someday there's going to be no more puff paint and you're going to be sad. 27:18.629 --> 27:20.450 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, always so sad when there's no more puff paint. 27:20.928 --> 27:23.650 [SPEAKER_01]: So the puff paint stays out and that's just real. 27:23.991 --> 27:25.011 [SPEAKER_01]: I get that for sure. 27:25.192 --> 27:32.718 [SPEAKER_01]: So what like final encouragement would you have for parents who are listening and are just thinking about all the things that we've already talked about? 27:32.738 --> 27:37.162 [SPEAKER_00]: I would say if you're leaning toward homeschooling and it's something that's on your heart, I would say to take the leap. 27:37.482 --> 27:39.944 [SPEAKER_00]: I think in general in life, you have to just go for it. 27:40.044 --> 27:45.789 [SPEAKER_00]: And that's the the season of life, the situation of life that we're in is that you make decision and you iterate. 27:46.189 --> 27:51.573 [SPEAKER_00]: And when I say you're doing it right just by doing it, that doesn't mean that every single day is perfect. 27:51.913 --> 27:58.118 [SPEAKER_00]: That doesn't even mean that every week or every month or even a year, you may have a year that was like, that one didn't really feel good. 27:58.298 --> 28:00.039 [SPEAKER_00]: That felt off and we're going to adjust. 28:00.279 --> 28:02.081 [SPEAKER_00]: But that is really what life is. 28:02.401 --> 28:11.728 [SPEAKER_00]: So over the course of a childhood, you're doing it right because you are doing all of these things that help prepare a childhood, child with the childhood that prepares them for adulthood. 28:12.808 --> 28:16.712 [SPEAKER_00]: And I think that that is really an amazing thing that we can pass on to our kids. 28:17.032 --> 28:23.918 [SPEAKER_00]: That life is not static that we have the capacity to seek God's will and to seek God's wisdom. 28:24.259 --> 28:28.863 [SPEAKER_00]: If anybody lacks wisdom, he can ask of God who gives liberally without fault finding. 28:29.203 --> 28:30.263 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, I mean, whatever. 28:30.543 --> 28:30.904 [SPEAKER_00]: Whatever. 28:30.924 --> 28:33.104 [SPEAKER_00]: She's like, gosh, I really have been messing up. 28:33.524 --> 28:40.006 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm stinking at this mothering thing or homeschooling thing or whatever the situation is without fighting fault. 28:40.066 --> 28:41.366 [SPEAKER_00]: God will give you wisdom. 28:41.767 --> 28:47.108 [SPEAKER_00]: And so you have to go with what the Holy Spirit is guiding you to do for your family. 28:47.408 --> 28:48.468 [SPEAKER_00]: You know what that is. 28:48.809 --> 28:49.729 [SPEAKER_00]: And there is a 28:50.389 --> 28:56.231 [SPEAKER_00]: a section of Stephen Pressfield's book, it's called The War of Art, where he says fear is your guide. 28:56.451 --> 29:02.493 [SPEAKER_00]: Fear actually, you know, I think a lot of times in the Christians circle we talk about feeling peace, a God, I don't really feel peace about it. 29:02.573 --> 29:07.815 [SPEAKER_00]: I feel nervous, but he says, no, the nerve, the fear, they're telling you what you should do. 29:08.155 --> 29:10.016 [SPEAKER_00]: And that's the direction you should go. 29:10.336 --> 29:13.837 [SPEAKER_00]: And then things open up and you can never know. 29:13.857 --> 29:16.858 [SPEAKER_00]: And so I sit here as some random mother. 29:17.298 --> 29:18.999 [SPEAKER_00]: I was a high school math teacher. 29:19.019 --> 29:23.060 [SPEAKER_00]: I would be retiring in the next two years with a pension and health care. 29:23.400 --> 29:24.520 [SPEAKER_00]: And I have none of that. 29:24.660 --> 29:27.641 [SPEAKER_00]: But I'm sitting here talking to you and God opens doors. 29:27.781 --> 29:31.743 [SPEAKER_00]: So the Bible says that the word is a lamp unto our feet. 29:32.083 --> 29:33.363 [SPEAKER_00]: It's a light unto our path. 29:33.783 --> 29:35.524 [SPEAKER_00]: And that means you just get a couple steps. 29:35.944 --> 29:38.787 [SPEAKER_00]: Wouldn't it be lovely if we could get five years down the road? 29:39.087 --> 29:41.449 [SPEAKER_00]: What on the other hand, that's kind of boring, too. 29:41.970 --> 29:45.653 [SPEAKER_00]: It's kind of amazing to have things that you don't know what's going to happen. 29:45.974 --> 29:49.357 [SPEAKER_00]: Our brains are wired for novelty and the screen manufacturers know that. 29:49.457 --> 29:51.659 [SPEAKER_00]: That's why they have all the swipes and the notifications. 29:52.059 --> 29:57.224 [SPEAKER_00]: But God provides us novelty to in his creation in the way that we live our lives. 29:58.225 --> 30:01.527 [SPEAKER_00]: I would suggest that you do what the Holy Spirit is guiding you to do. 30:01.587 --> 30:09.870 [SPEAKER_00]: You be brave even if it's different than what your neighbors are doing or even if you come from sixteen generations of teachers in your family and they're all going to judge you. 30:10.250 --> 30:15.533 [SPEAKER_00]: You have to do what's best for your family and trust that God is going to work it out for you and for your kids. 30:16.333 --> 30:16.854 [SPEAKER_00]: That's good. 30:17.314 --> 30:20.276 [SPEAKER_01]: You've listed so many resources through this entire podcast. 30:20.317 --> 30:23.539 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to make sure that I'm like, I'm going to go first of all, read them off for myself. 30:23.880 --> 30:31.126 [SPEAKER_01]: And then I'll like get them all and show notes to but tell us where we can find you and your book and your podcast just so I can make sure everyone follows you. 30:31.406 --> 30:32.067 [SPEAKER_00]: My thing's easy. 30:32.167 --> 30:33.588 [SPEAKER_00]: Everything is one thousand hours outside. 30:33.908 --> 30:35.469 [SPEAKER_00]: We have a website, a month social media. 30:35.790 --> 30:37.651 [SPEAKER_00]: We have an app that one thousand hours outside. 30:37.851 --> 30:39.113 [SPEAKER_00]: App in the podcast is the same. 30:39.133 --> 30:40.634 [SPEAKER_00]: The one thousand hours outside podcast. 30:41.034 --> 30:45.358 [SPEAKER_00]: It is the number two parenting podcast in the entire country, which is unbelievable. 30:45.678 --> 30:46.379 [SPEAKER_00]: It's unbelievable. 30:46.399 --> 30:53.845 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm just like a random mom over here with like a messy house and piles of laundry and what have we just had like leftovers for lunch and all of that type of thing. 30:54.205 --> 30:55.846 [SPEAKER_00]: But books, I have two books that are 30:56.567 --> 30:59.608 [SPEAKER_00]: the most recent and the most recent one is called homeschooling. 30:59.849 --> 31:01.189 [SPEAKER_00]: You're doing it right just by doing it. 31:01.289 --> 31:02.210 [SPEAKER_00]: I believe it wholeheartedly. 31:02.230 --> 31:03.590 [SPEAKER_00]: You can get it wherever you buy your books. 31:03.810 --> 31:11.314 [SPEAKER_00]: And the book that came out before that is called until the streetlights come on, which is, which is kind of like how a return to yesterday year, kids used to have a lot of freedom. 31:11.494 --> 31:14.435 [SPEAKER_00]: And they play in the sign to come back in was at the streetlights would come on. 31:14.755 --> 31:16.236 [SPEAKER_00]: There was no GPS tour watches. 31:16.316 --> 31:17.276 [SPEAKER_00]: No one was really yelling. 31:17.356 --> 31:19.277 [SPEAKER_00]: No one was even paying attention to where they were. 31:19.297 --> 31:24.399 [SPEAKER_00]: Starting off in at age four or five, pretty young kids are out with a lot of freedom. 31:24.740 --> 31:25.320 [SPEAKER_00]: And this 31:25.760 --> 31:28.162 [SPEAKER_00]: return to play makes today better. 31:28.442 --> 31:31.845 [SPEAKER_00]: We get to enjoy our kids more and build all these memories and let them build all these memories. 31:32.125 --> 31:33.567 [SPEAKER_00]: But it also prepares them for the future. 31:33.587 --> 31:37.170 [SPEAKER_00]: So that one's called until the street lights come on and I think they both will change your life. 31:37.390 --> 31:39.492 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, no, they're both very, very good. 31:39.572 --> 31:40.833 [SPEAKER_01]: And I would agree with that. 31:41.493 --> 31:44.475 [SPEAKER_01]: And congratulations on their podcast because I have seen it up. 31:44.515 --> 31:48.537 [SPEAKER_01]: The charts consistently and it's that's amazing and such an accomplishment. 31:48.878 --> 31:50.018 [SPEAKER_00]: So it's really fun. 31:50.479 --> 31:51.039 [SPEAKER_00]: What a gift. 31:51.219 --> 32:01.926 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, in that sort of the type of thing where it's an example of what we've talked about, I didn't take a podcast podcast class in high school because podcasting wasn't a thing. 32:02.146 --> 32:05.848 [SPEAKER_00]: And the skill is that I learned to like this and enjoy it. 32:06.248 --> 32:07.229 [SPEAKER_00]: came through downtime. 32:07.569 --> 32:09.231 [SPEAKER_00]: It came through learning how to converse. 32:09.271 --> 32:17.258 [SPEAKER_00]: I had a really good friend growing up that was really good at asking questions and I remember feeling really seen by that and really cared for. 32:17.458 --> 32:27.187 [SPEAKER_00]: And so it's a skill set that I tried to cultivate just from that just from play with this friend, her name is Beth and then I like to read and that also came from downtime. 32:27.367 --> 32:27.527 [SPEAKER_00]: So 32:28.633 --> 32:32.374 [SPEAKER_00]: It came from that, didn't come from any class, didn't come from any instructor, didn't come from any adult. 32:32.754 --> 32:34.454 [SPEAKER_01]: And he knew that that would be a job. 32:34.694 --> 32:36.075 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, it's like, we don't know. 32:36.115 --> 32:36.255 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. 32:36.595 --> 32:44.117 [SPEAKER_01]: We don't know what our kids are meals to do, because they're like, so part of your job is just like reading books and then talking to people about the books. 32:44.357 --> 32:45.557 [SPEAKER_00]: That is the job. 32:46.017 --> 32:46.197 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. 32:46.577 --> 32:50.018 [SPEAKER_00]: I talked to this man Austin Cleon recently, who wrote some fabulous books. 32:50.678 --> 32:52.459 [SPEAKER_00]: It's called Steel Like and Artist. 32:52.579 --> 32:53.399 [SPEAKER_00]: It's a set of three books. 32:53.799 --> 32:55.659 [SPEAKER_00]: Feel like an artist show your work and keep going. 32:56.019 --> 32:58.240 [SPEAKER_00]: And he says, I'm a professional reader. 32:58.900 --> 33:02.403 [SPEAKER_00]: The ideal job, but people don't really read that much anymore either. 33:02.423 --> 33:04.264 [SPEAKER_00]: So you just don't know. 33:04.324 --> 33:05.465 [SPEAKER_00]: We don't know what the jobs are. 33:05.765 --> 33:06.826 [SPEAKER_00]: They're always changing. 33:07.126 --> 33:09.248 [SPEAKER_00]: There aren't bowling pin setters anymore. 33:09.268 --> 33:10.709 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, that used to be a job. 33:10.749 --> 33:12.090 [SPEAKER_00]: There are so many jobs that don't exist. 33:12.470 --> 33:20.676 [SPEAKER_00]: And so those soft, what people refer to as soft skills as opposed to, you know, knowing every equation and all that kind of stuff doesn't matter quite as much. 33:21.076 --> 33:23.518 [SPEAKER_00]: The other things are, you know, are really going to set our kids ahead. 33:23.778 --> 33:24.458 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. 33:24.558 --> 33:26.259 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's such an important reminder. 33:26.279 --> 33:26.619 [SPEAKER_00]: Which is my turn. 33:26.639 --> 33:27.020 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, the time. 33:27.200 --> 33:27.440 [SPEAKER_00]: Isn't it? 33:27.460 --> 33:27.560 [SPEAKER_00]: It is. 33:27.580 --> 33:29.821 [SPEAKER_00]: It's just hope because it's actually the easier route. 33:29.961 --> 33:33.123 [SPEAKER_00]: We wouldn't be awful if it was like, you have to have your kids keep up with AI. 33:33.143 --> 33:35.464 [SPEAKER_00]: They're going to fall behind unless they keep up with AI. 33:35.604 --> 33:38.065 [SPEAKER_00]: But well, there's no hope in that so much stress and pressure. 33:38.365 --> 33:40.987 [SPEAKER_00]: But actually the opposite is through the jobs of the future are human. 33:41.407 --> 33:42.888 [SPEAKER_00]: And that's great news. 33:43.148 --> 33:43.968 [SPEAKER_01]: That is good news. 33:44.408 --> 33:49.391 [SPEAKER_01]: I think we all need to remind ourselves of that every like couple days that we don't absolutely panic. 33:49.571 --> 33:52.032 [SPEAKER_01]: Thank you so much for being here and for sharing with us. 33:52.112 --> 33:52.813 [SPEAKER_01]: I appreciate it. 33:53.393 --> 33:54.433 [SPEAKER_01]: Thank you so much for having me. 33:54.453 --> 33:55.594 [SPEAKER_01]: Thanks to everyone who listened in. 33:55.914 --> 33:59.015 [SPEAKER_01]: Thank you so much for joining us today on the Christian parenting podcast. 33:59.095 --> 34:05.998 [SPEAKER_01]: I hope that Jenny's words inspired you to step outside both literally and figuratively as you trust God with your parenting journey. 34:06.178 --> 34:10.620 [SPEAKER_01]: I have links to all her things to connect with her and show notes including a link to her book. 34:11.280 --> 34:13.181 [SPEAKER_01]: Until next time, make God bless you this week. 34:13.661 --> 34:16.422 [SPEAKER_01]: May you feel confident in the decisions you're making for your family. 34:16.722 --> 34:19.403 [SPEAKER_01]: May your kids grow in creativity and resilience. 34:19.883 --> 34:23.214 [SPEAKER_01]: and may you always know that Grace covers you as you grow together.