[SPEAKER_04]: Hi.
[SPEAKER_04]: I'm David.
[SPEAKER_04]: Come on in.
[UNKNOWN]: I'll make some tea.
[SPEAKER_03]: Hey, everybody, welcome to our cult.
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, podcast, I'm Jason.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm Rima.
[SPEAKER_03]: This is Legion podcast episode.
[SPEAKER_03]: Twenty.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yay.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm so glad to be back.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I just binge the first two seasons over the last like week and a half to get it all, you know, back in my head and just totally reinforced a how much I love the show and b how gritty that ending was.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that season two finale just kind of leaves you with a bad tasting your mouth a little bit.
[SPEAKER_00]: But aside from that, I like you.
[SPEAKER_00]: I didn't binge at all in a week, but I took the whole month of June and watched seasons one and two.
[SPEAKER_00]: And yeah, it definitely brought back the love for it.
[SPEAKER_00]: And oh my gosh, this episode, I'm really excited.
[SPEAKER_00]: So excited for it to be back and really excited to talk about it, because it was so good.
[SPEAKER_03]: Right, me too.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm so happy it's on and we get now that I've beenched all the ones that I've seen before and gotten, you know, seen some things that I didn't know just before but just refresh myself on how great it was and then to have a new fresh one to watch now is awesome to get new content.
[SPEAKER_03]: So I'm excited.
[SPEAKER_03]: Before we get into this week's episode, I just wanted to mention speaking of cult leaders that this is a joint production with bald move and Aeron is going to be joining us next week and every week thereafter.
[SPEAKER_03]: Cool.
[SPEAKER_03]: A-Ron Hubbard.
[SPEAKER_03]: So, um, this, you get a copy.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's what he calls himself.
[SPEAKER_03]: It is.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, Jim Jones.
[SPEAKER_03]: And this week, you can hear A-Ron's thoughts on the season three premiere on their bald movie TV podcast.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'll put a link to that in the show notes.
[SPEAKER_03]: And you can also just search for bald movie TV wherever you get podcasts.
[SPEAKER_03]: So if you want to know what he thinks about the pilot, then he'll be on with us after that.
[SPEAKER_03]: So let's get into our top five highlights.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's our top five highlights for Legion season three episode one chapter twenty before we do I wanted to just reiterate why we do a top five highlights instead of just going through seen by scene.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I like that because we can make these connections that span across the episode like talk about thematic things or stylistic or character arcs things like that.
[SPEAKER_03]: And also it just feels a little bit more how people normally talk about something like we wouldn't be like, hey, would you think about Legion the last night?
[SPEAKER_03]: Would you think that first thing?
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay, what about the second scene?
[SPEAKER_03]: And the third scene, don't talk about the end.
[SPEAKER_03]: So I just like that it's interesting and it kind of fits with Legion because Legion can be so chaotic and not a non-linear.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's actually harder to prepare because we take notes for the whole episode and then once we're done with that we rearrange them into these.
[SPEAKER_03]: topics, but I just feel like it's more, it's an interesting way to do it.
[SPEAKER_03]: So now that that's all said, what did you think you liked?
[SPEAKER_03]: You really liked it.
[SPEAKER_00]: I really, really liked this episode.
[SPEAKER_00]: I thought it was a really great way to start it off.
[SPEAKER_00]: I thought that it had all of Holly's best traits with his inventiveness, questions of morality, and blasts of fun sprinkled throughout.
[SPEAKER_03]: And also, it really dark violence, too, can be kind of cartoony fun, and then somebody gets imploded and blood spurts out.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_00]: So if I can get burned and cinched in a wall or, you know, shot in the head with a finger gun and it's cool music.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: I loved it.
[SPEAKER_00]: I thought it was great.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: Absolutely.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm happy to be back in this world.
[SPEAKER_03]: I like that we're going in this new direction.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm a little bum because it looks like a three act play in an act three.
[SPEAKER_03]: We get to see David become this uber villain, but I'm ready for that.
[SPEAKER_03]: So fine.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I'm kind of okay with it.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think that's I don't I don't think this is a redemptive story, so I Yeah, I'm just gonna be wrong.
[SPEAKER_03]: It could be you never know Okay, what's your own five?
[SPEAKER_00]: So my number five, I just want to start with the visuals because that is what's so great about Legion and everyone who watches knows that and I think most really appreciate it because if you don't, why would you be watching because there's so much of it but this episode did not disappoint like the opening scene when Switch is like crawling through that tunnel and she's going through buildings and then like through trees
[SPEAKER_00]: and I thought that was all beautiful.
[SPEAKER_00]: I really love that musical sequence that they had when she comes through.
[SPEAKER_02]: The wardrobe?
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, with the wardrobe.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, like you're at a dry cleaners or something and all these clothes are shifting all over the place and she squeezes the room.
[SPEAKER_00]: I loved that.
[SPEAKER_00]: I loved that imagery.
[SPEAKER_00]: I loved the colors, the bright colors of the clothes as she comes through.
[SPEAKER_00]: I loved that we got a musical sequence, you know, straight away.
[SPEAKER_03]: I really like that the girl is sitting at the desk and just had this blank look on her face.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then she just slides off.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's like, hey, come back here.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then when it looks like Switch is gonna guess wrong or can't answer the riddle.
[SPEAKER_03]: They're all just like drifting away.
[SPEAKER_03]: They're gonna disappear forever.
[SPEAKER_03]: No, no, no.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's the salmon.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then you get this really like uplifting musical number that's just a pleasure of the ears and a feast for the eyes.
[SPEAKER_03]: And it's like,
[SPEAKER_00]: You answer correctly you win and you get to go go through this little tunnel again, but you know that was like a real band They're called the super organisms We're super organism.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's the real band and that's their song that they sang in that sequence and I love it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I love that he he got the real band To do that and they're on screen.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, they're own screen.
[SPEAKER_00]: They're in that scene as she's turning around as Switch is kind of looking at everybody at those little individual like desks that's been around the room.
[SPEAKER_00]: Those are all members of the band.
[SPEAKER_00]: That super organism band.
[SPEAKER_00]: And they, when they're playing those instruments, that's really them.
[SPEAKER_00]: And that girl that sings is really the singer.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I love that Noah Holly got them and of course the song totally fit, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, the mind and things you want.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know.
[SPEAKER_03]: I didn't study it too hard, but it sounded like it was just trying to be an appealing kind of a dream mental dream song or something.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it was really good.
[SPEAKER_00]: The Division III invasion, when they do invade David's home and the fighting sequence in the hallway, like I said, it was, you know, had had these dark images as well as the funny and light stuff, but you had like David, it's, I know he's like not supposed to be a good guy.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's a bad guy and I feel almost kind of guilty for
[SPEAKER_00]: Like he said in the things he does but I love it when he demonstrates his power because he's so so powerfully is a very powerful mutant so to see how he can just like wave his hand and like wave the bullets away and flip a shelf that lands on people he can wave his hand and cart catches on fire there in the hallway he can you know point a spinger someone like a gun and it blows their head off
[SPEAKER_00]: I love that whole fighting sequence.
[SPEAKER_00]: I thought that was great.
[SPEAKER_00]: And when Ferruc gets kind of like tackled and gets pushed into it, there's George.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that's absolutely great.
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, I wouldn't necessarily at this point just paint David as as a bad guy unless I'm forgetting something.
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean,
[SPEAKER_03]: What he did to Sid was really bad.
[SPEAKER_03]: But I don't know if he deserves to be killed.
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, I don't think he's this.
[SPEAKER_03]: So I really do like even watching it again.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I know I remember I felt this way last year too.
[SPEAKER_03]: I just think the shadow king poisoned everyone against him.
[SPEAKER_03]: And when he saw that he tried to take it out of Sid's head with his powers and
[SPEAKER_03]: I didn't approve of that.
[SPEAKER_03]: I understood the impulse to want to do it.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think that's where David goes wrong.
[SPEAKER_03]: He's so powerful that he'll just use his power to alter people without a second thought, but he feels like he's doing it for the right reasons.
[SPEAKER_03]: And so it's definitely great area, but
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm not sure yet about that he's earned just kill on site.
[SPEAKER_00]: No, I don't think he's earned that.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't think that they should just because I don't know that the whole good guy bad guy thing is so black and white in the show and that's one thing that makes it really great is
[SPEAKER_00]: you know because division three in my opinion in this show can just as easily or at least in this episode can be just as easily seen as the bad guy they were willing to just kill yeah violent and then just when they were talking about switch they're like oh okay we'll kill her too I mean they think about her
[SPEAKER_03]: Right, they think that their what their goal is is to protect humanity and and she's collateral damage which is a horrible term and I mean, I think you know different people are going to have different kinds of judgment about that kind of behavior and there's validity to all of it.
[SPEAKER_03]: I really do still think though that fruit is just a bad guy.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I do think that he is firmly a bad guy.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't trust him really.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I think that to say for division three or to say that David, either one of the good guys or the bad guys, those are great areas.
[SPEAKER_00]: For Luke, I think is just straight up bad.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't think so.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, change.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I could be wrong about that, but I just don't.
[SPEAKER_03]: You can't ever take anything for granted on the show because the grounds are shifting.
[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I thought all of that was really great imagery.
[SPEAKER_00]: The timeline wins switch like creates those doors and she goes into that hallway with and it has those timeline visuals with the one hour ago symbols and things on them.
[SPEAKER_00]: I thought that was really clever and I like those visuals.
[SPEAKER_03]: Really cool, interesting way to represent time travel.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, it was so good.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then like the alchemist when he's being yanked by the giant hook and his T-Camp spins in the air for like the full second.
[SPEAKER_00]: Those are just wonderful.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, just wonderful visuals and just pleasing to the eye, which is what I love about this show.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like always at the top of my list, just, you know.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then some scenes, of course, you're looking at and you're like, it's like being high on drugs without the side effects.
[SPEAKER_00]: So that's a fun part of it for me.
[SPEAKER_00]: But that's my top.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's my number five.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, the hook, um, I really thought was fun and funny and then I love that we see it from another perspective later.
[SPEAKER_03]: Cine goes Clark, I see and get the hook.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, right.
[SPEAKER_03]: It wasn't just something that I don't explain.
[SPEAKER_03]: But that kind of a thing in this show to me is just sort of showcasing that it has this free-wheeling attitude and it's like, it's statement saying, no need to think about this too logically.
[SPEAKER_03]: We're having fun here.
[SPEAKER_03]: We can just put little things that if you are thinking about it as something in the real world would not make sense at all, but it's more like a symphony or something.
[SPEAKER_04]: Exactly.
[SPEAKER_03]: Or something.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay, my number five is David's cults and I really dig that they're going in the direction of a cult because I've always been fascinated with cults and I think to that the way a cult
[SPEAKER_03]: operates the dynamics of the cult, the reason people are attracted to it and all of that is so related to people's psychology and their mental state and praying on psychological weaknesses with the promise of feeling better and all of the kinds of things that are perfect for this show which deals with your state of mind and
[SPEAKER_03]: mental issues and things like that.
[SPEAKER_03]: So it's a great direction.
[SPEAKER_03]: And perfect if you're gonna turn David into a villain this season to have a be a cult leader.
[SPEAKER_03]: Absolutely.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think it makes sense for David because last season, you know, what really tripped him up was he realized that he was trying to prove to himself that he was a good person.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm a good person.
[SPEAKER_03]: I deserve love.
[SPEAKER_03]: and that's where at the end he suddenly that was thrown into huge doubt because Sid didn't trust him anymore and then it made it seem like oh maybe this whole thing was Sid was just for him to fill up this void and it was more about him than it was about her and it was a narcissistic kind of thing and as a cult leader
[SPEAKER_03]: He, switch asks him, what does this place?
[SPEAKER_03]: He says, people have their pain, their hearts are sad, their minds are tired.
[SPEAKER_03]: I help them.
[SPEAKER_03]: All I ask is that they stay and keep me company after take care of the house, love each other.
[SPEAKER_03]: I need that love.
[SPEAKER_03]: So if he's being at all honest there, it's still on a grander scale about creating all this love, you know, this system where he can get everyone's love.
[SPEAKER_03]: and it's working like people are saying things like his thoughts are magic light years from home it's prayers mix with dream to spirit is the music and the word so it's just feeding into into into that but uh...
[SPEAKER_03]: As we all know, these things never end well.
[SPEAKER_05]: No.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, I know you.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, you've been following this whole next thing.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: The Keith Rainey area who had this, what turned into a sex cult and he fled to Mexico with a bunch of girls from the cold and the feds tracked him down and marched him out at gunpointing now.
[SPEAKER_03]: He's in jail and on trial.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know, I could totally imagine it going something like that.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think already he comes out in the way he's speaking to Switch, have some tea, you know, he's kind of seems smooth, but to me it reminded me of last season when he was exploring Sid's mind and he was challenged with trying to figure her out and he kept coming up with the wrong answers and she said, now try again and he was like one time
[SPEAKER_03]: He said, oh, I know what this is.
[SPEAKER_03]: You're afraid that if I see how you really are, I'm not going to love you.
[SPEAKER_03]: And he sounds kind of like he's trying to be paternal and comforting, but it just comes out douchey.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, it's like he was trying really hard to say the right things.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like he thought that's what she wanted to hear.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, it's also like he's he's acting like he's the answer to this person's prayers.
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, like he's all that basically.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_02]: Very nice.
[SPEAKER_03]: So yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: And also like a lot of cult leaders.
[SPEAKER_03]: He's paranoid about his enemies, but now he's actually right because D three is is out to kill him.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: And
[SPEAKER_03]: Anyway, it makes sense that he would create this cult to try and get everyone's love and also to create this group of people who he can sew this paranoia of division three, the forces of division and try to help have them help protect it, which they were like he said, they pushed shadow king out of the way and everything like that.
[SPEAKER_03]: And so what it ends up being is this big love in, which basically is him blizzing everyone out with this blue ooze, which is a call back to when him and back in the Lenny slash many days talking about drugs.
[SPEAKER_03]: Why is it blue?
[SPEAKER_00]: It's always blue, man.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's in that frog.
[SPEAKER_00]: She put the drugs in the frog and the smoke comes out and they're, you know, filling it out there on the floor.
[SPEAKER_03]: Right, so I think that connection is to say that this is sort of a similar situation where they're all kind of being, you know, they think that they're healing, but really they're just being numbed out, maybe.
[SPEAKER_03]: And there's this pig with its big teeth, which is like everybody sucking at the taste of David.
[SPEAKER_00]: Wonder if we're going to talk about that giant pig.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's good.
[SPEAKER_00]: I thought I had to rewind that.
[SPEAKER_00]: I thought we would see people sucking on the teeth but I don't think they actually were You did necessarily have to you could just because the smoke was coming out if you're just hovering you're gonna get it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, you're gonna touch Okay, what's your number four?
[SPEAKER_00]: My number four is just the introduction to switch in that whole open sequence that we get with her.
[SPEAKER_00]: So we see that it looks like she lives alone.
[SPEAKER_00]: She may, I guess, have a servant, but she basically lives alone.
[SPEAKER_00]: Her dad visits her at breakfast via a TV, which, okay, that's interesting.
[SPEAKER_03]: I thought, I mean, there's a lot of kind of almost stereotypically when there's not much connection between a parent and a child and their rich, then we'll show them at ups and ends of a really long dining table.
[SPEAKER_03]: But this time is the connection is so lousy that he's not even there.
[SPEAKER_03]: He's just by a TV and only for a few seconds.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it very telling, I think, this relationship that she apparently has with her dad or lack of relationship maybe.
[SPEAKER_00]: We find out that he collects robots.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then, you know, I'm, because I'm thinking, what is she like an exchange student or something?
[SPEAKER_00]: Why is she living there alone?
[SPEAKER_00]: Why is her father not there?
[SPEAKER_00]: Or, you know, around or they're not living.
[SPEAKER_00]: Clearly, I guess not living in the same home.
[SPEAKER_00]: We find out that she can time travel, which I'm really interested in.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think it's fascinating that she has this power.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm a little bit curious about her power exactly.
[SPEAKER_00]: And what her power actually is.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then I think it was really inventive how these clues are being left for her, that you see pictures of the vermillion.
[SPEAKER_00]: And Admiral Fikiyama, and, you know, she's being told to find the pregnant virgin, orange fish, look for a yellow bus that isn't yellow.
[SPEAKER_00]: I thought that was interesting.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then I was curious as to why she trusts David and not for Luke when fruit confronts her.
[SPEAKER_00]: She seems to be very intuitive.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like she seemed very sure herself.
[SPEAKER_00]: She seemed
[SPEAKER_00]: to be able to see right through fruit because like we were kind of saying earlier we you know and we could be wrong I could be wrong I do believe fruit is definitely a bad guy no gray area with him at all I think he's got a lot of people folding his manipulating them but she was able to first meeting like just see right through him and I was curious you know what it is about her
[SPEAKER_00]: You know that she can out of yarn if it's a part of her, you know, power if she's she's just that intuitive or she's that street smart and just has that within her to read people or not.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I felt that was interesting that she was able to read him right away.
[SPEAKER_00]: And so I liked and I like her just in general.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm always kind of worried when they start introducing new characters.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, we're in the third and final season.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's only eight episodes and I'm like, oh gosh, now we've got a new character.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I was kind of hesitant.
[SPEAKER_00]: I was just kind of watching and I was really just with even within just a few minutes and I was totally fascinated with her and I was completely on board with her being in the show.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think she's a great fit.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I'm curious what you think about her.
[SPEAKER_03]: Are you sure there's only eight?
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, there's like eight.
[SPEAKER_03]: I thought there was thirteen.
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, yeah, let me just go ahead and make my number four about her then and
[SPEAKER_03]: As far as, well, I was trying to figure out why she was there at the cult.
[SPEAKER_03]: And she says, well, I'm there because you need me because you have this time travel ad, which I love that he just put out like a one ad for a tablet.
[SPEAKER_03]: Got answered.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's funny because I am judging the writing in that.
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, it's so convenient that she got there right when you finally got killed and then could use her.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like if she would have gotten there at any other time in this series, it wouldn't have mattered.
[SPEAKER_03]: But just the right moment.
[SPEAKER_03]: But whatever.
[SPEAKER_03]: But then he's like, so how are you?
[SPEAKER_03]: And he keeps asking.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think he's trying to get from her like, you know, what?
[SPEAKER_03]: Maybe it's like a cult leader would ask that so he can find something that is wrong that he could use to get her feeling like she's dependent on him.
[SPEAKER_00]: But he can read her mind.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's what I was so curious about that because he told her straight up, he's like, you know, don't, what does she say don't you trust me or something or what about trust and he goes,
[SPEAKER_00]: tried that I'd rather you know I prefer reading minds or something that was really easy to do.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know I love that line.
[SPEAKER_00]: I like frickin know a whole number of their lines, but he can still I think he wants her to admit it.
[SPEAKER_00]: He wants her to say it, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, yeah, maybe so.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, so that yeah, she can be the one to choose to go along that path versus him just knowing.
[SPEAKER_03]: But I love that because he still seems pretty erratic like he's screaming
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, oh, yeah, they used to always tell me David don't have the chemicals under the sink.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, I'm supposed to get what pretend the voices aren't real.
[SPEAKER_03]: So he doesn't seem like he's totally got it together as a cult leader, but it's really funny.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then he sees, she sees him talking to himself literally.
[SPEAKER_03]: What are you going to do with this one?
[SPEAKER_03]: Give her a wee nib of the blue stuff and slinger in with all the others.
[SPEAKER_03]: That made me sort of question, okay, are you?
[SPEAKER_03]: Is this all just total bullshit?
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, what I take that as is he's always got different voices in his head that represent.
[SPEAKER_03]: different facets of his psyche, and so there is one psyche that part of his psyche that feels like he's just a pretender, but there may be other parts of him that really want to actually try to help people or at least to try to create this blissful environment that will be good for everybody, you know.
[SPEAKER_03]: But another part might just be like, no, this is all bullshit.
[SPEAKER_03]: So you can have people to help protect you from division three or something.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know.
[SPEAKER_03]: But anyway, so I think, you know, it was pretty, they really harped on her relationship with her father that they're disconnected.
[SPEAKER_03]: And when she tells her father that she's doing perfect in her class, in her classes,
[SPEAKER_03]: She didn't look very happy.
[SPEAKER_03]: And she may have even been lying because when we see her in class, she's not even listening to the lecture.
[SPEAKER_03]: She's listening to her time travel lessons.
[SPEAKER_00]: And doodling.
[SPEAKER_00]: She's drawing like for a million or something in her head.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then she does save David without really knowing him.
[SPEAKER_03]: She saves his life.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I don't think she would do that if she was just answering the time travel ad.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think she wants or needs something from him.
[SPEAKER_03]: And when he asks her if she's all right, she finally starts mentioning that her dad collects those robots and that she sometimes pretends she's a robot too.
[SPEAKER_03]: And she tells fruit, she's helping David because he's a man and you're a robot.
[SPEAKER_03]: And so I don't know, one cool thing about Legion is they plant these seeds, but you don't really fully understand them until later on.
[SPEAKER_03]: So I think we're gonna get more on what this means, but maybe it's something about
[SPEAKER_03]: David's more of a feeling person or engaging like there's a connection or humanity there and she can tell it through because just doesn't have that it's more about
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know, to him trying to manipulate something to get what he wants.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know.
[SPEAKER_03]: But she also doesn't drink David's tea.
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
[SPEAKER_03]: So she doesn't fully trust him.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think, you know, we're just getting the beginning of this story, but my sense is that she does want help from David with whatever problems have stemmed from her poor relationship with her dad.
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I wonder how she, again, I don't know if she just can read something off of him because she doesn't know him or know anything about him.
[SPEAKER_00]: So how does she know that he could even help her?
[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe just because he's been able to transmit these messages to her and then communicate to her because, you know, he's sitting at those messages like the radio when you hear Lenny's voice, you know, that she's able to pick up on that and that she thinks, oh, this person's going to be able to help me with whatever.
[SPEAKER_03]: Maybe it's just the whole cult environment and how everybody else seems satisfied or maybe it's this.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, or that she's seen him exhibit this power.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I don't really know for sure.
[SPEAKER_03]: I hope we do find out more about that because I was trying to figure it out to why why did she help him?
[SPEAKER_03]: Why does she trust him?
[SPEAKER_03]: And why does she think she can get what she needs from him?
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I don't think we're going to have those answers today.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like you said, we're only one episode in and you know, it's one thing that Noah Holly plants these, you know, little seeds and and like said, it's it's once they all start to add up, then it presents that picture.
[SPEAKER_00]: So we're definitely not going to have anything figured out today.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know if that all ever have anything figured out, but I know it's not going to be an episode one.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, but sometimes, like going back, I'm like, I can be like, oh, yeah, I kind of guessed it that and then they fleshed it out later.
[SPEAKER_03]: So it's fun to try and see if we can guess and see if you're right.
[SPEAKER_03]: I did like that after she was talking about
[SPEAKER_03]: I think it was right after she told Furuk she was helping David because he's a man in your robot that they shift the scene shifted to carry making his pitonomy robot with the vermillion standing by.
[SPEAKER_03]: So I don't know if that's going to play later where she'll have some scenes with them and she won't like them or something.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I want to about that too in the connections there.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_03]: Four, right, four, three, three, my number three.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I've talked a little bit about time travel, but I'm just, I'm going to talk about it since that seems to be going to be a really big part of this particular season and the last season that we have of Legion.
[SPEAKER_00]: Typically, anytime
[SPEAKER_00]: that time travel is presented in a show.
[SPEAKER_00]: I just kind of, I'm like, oh, no.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's going to make your brain hurt and you'll think of things that don't really add up.
[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I thought this was a great representation of time travel in the show.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I don't know why I doubted Noah Hawley at all.
[SPEAKER_00]: Shame on me.
[SPEAKER_00]: I've learned my lesson.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I think that the introduction of time travel was done.
[SPEAKER_00]: It was very inventive.
[SPEAKER_00]: I thought it had a really great character building delivery device.
[SPEAKER_00]: I like how he kind of
[SPEAKER_00]: Holly was kind of avoided the over-explaining how the impossible becomes possible.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, it was just very simplistic in how she's able to just make a door, you know, and then go through a hallway where she could go through the floor.
[SPEAKER_00]: She went through the floor.
[SPEAKER_00]: She used that tray when she was with Furuk, but she's able to somehow make a door.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then, she's like, like, traces erecting.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I liked how, like, the first time we see it, we don't know what the hell is going on, which is, you could say that about so many scenes.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_03]: But she's listing to the radio.
[SPEAKER_03]: And it said something like, you know, if you go back and listen, maybe you'll get the message.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then she, all of a sudden, we'd never knew she was immune, but she just, like, traces this blaze across the, yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: And you're like, what the hell?
[SPEAKER_03]: And then you realize later that what she did was, okay, I'll just go back and listen to it right now.
[SPEAKER_00]: It made me curious a little bit about her powers.
[SPEAKER_00]: Is it just that she is able to create the doorway that opens up into this like hallway where we see you know the different portals that she can go into like thirty minutes ago an hour ago two hours ago and that she can pick a time to go back to or does she actually have the power to time travel.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's what makes me curious.
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, yeah, I mean, I think she doesn't create two versions of herself like her time travel lessons, which is a whole another question where the hell is she getting that?
[SPEAKER_03]: Exactly.
[SPEAKER_03]: How did she get them and stuff?
[SPEAKER_03]: It says a good rule of thumb.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's give yourself a margin of error.
[SPEAKER_03]: You did not want to interrupt the time and stream too often, but didn't say why.
[SPEAKER_03]: And that makes me think of that rule.
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, maybe you don't want to meet yourself.
[SPEAKER_03]: But I think the way hers works is, and we saw her rewinding this tape.
[SPEAKER_03]: that it's more like she rewines to an earlier point in her life and then she can take it again from there.
[SPEAKER_03]: So it's almost not like she's going back to where she was and would see yourself.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's more like everything just rewines and then she can keep going at the different ways.
[SPEAKER_00]: That makes sense because you notice how she can also kind of fast forward through boring conversations or she can get a fast forward at a point.
[SPEAKER_00]: So that would make sense.
[SPEAKER_03]: At least it seemed like that.
[SPEAKER_03]: That would be awesome.
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, that would be awesome.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, maybe that's how she's able to not rent into herself.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, if she goes back, she's, you know, I don't think so because I think she wasn't there.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, it's like if you, um, I don't know, you just all of a sudden, you just went, and we were back to giving us podcasts that never happened yet, you know?
[SPEAKER_03]: It's not like there would be another you, there are podcasts.
[SPEAKER_03]: just wouldn't happen.
[SPEAKER_03]: But she does still have memories of the future that she went through.
[SPEAKER_03]: So for her, that future is kind of her past, which I think is one of the things that the time travel lessons said features past or something.
[SPEAKER_00]: I love it and see at least this doesn't leave me all confused.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't even know for sure if it's this way though because then she at one point when they were under attack called to David she started to open a door and she said this way and so that leads me to think that she can bring someone else in there with her and if she does then do they like go up here wherever each one of them was what if he was in another state thirty minutes ago would he just appear there or
[SPEAKER_03]: or would they have been together and I'm all wrong about how this works because if I'm right then she needs to appear wherever she was say thirty minutes ago or whatever door she goes through you know at least in this episode is pretty simple it was just like she could rewind back to an earlier point and take and do something different and
[SPEAKER_03]: she went back an hour the first time and tried to warn David but it wasn't in time because he teleported into the middle of the battle but still got killed and then so then she went back I think two hours and we don't we didn't see that part but then we saw that the whole compound was teleported away so presumably she was able to get to David and convince him that he needed to get out of there
[SPEAKER_00]: Yep, that was cool too.
[SPEAKER_00]: But anyway, that was, that was my number three.
[SPEAKER_03]: All right.
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, I'll just make that the time travel stuff, my number three, too.
[SPEAKER_03]: Let me see if there's anything I want to say about it that we didn't already say.
[SPEAKER_03]: The whole, I don't know what you would call it, just the way it was presented with the hallway.
[SPEAKER_03]: I thought was really interesting.
[SPEAKER_03]: And the doorways that say exactly how far back, five, ten, twenty, thirty minutes.
[SPEAKER_03]: The whole thing about, you know,
[SPEAKER_03]: It says many factors, one of the time travel lessons says many factors create life's episodes factors that can't be altered within a finite period.
[SPEAKER_03]: Basically it's saying you need to go back far enough so that you can actually alter the thing you want to alter.
[SPEAKER_03]: But then it goes on.
[SPEAKER_03]: But at the same time we did not want to go back too far for the further we go, the more we risk waking the demon.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then later you see that demon waiting down the hall with its glowing eyes, which reminded me of early shadow king and it was making this weird chicken sound.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I liked that because I don't know if this is why Holly did it, but it placed a limitation on the time travel, which helps in a time travel story.
[SPEAKER_03]: Otherwise you'll be saying, well, why don't you just go further back in the past?
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, because then she'll be eaten by this demon.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's an interesting way to limit the power.
[SPEAKER_00]: Right, which we don't always, yeah, I think so.
[SPEAKER_00]: And because everything seems so limitless and it's like, well, does that same real that everything is limitless?
[SPEAKER_03]: Because you always ask the question, well, shoot, why didn't they just go back even further and stop that bad thing that just happened or whatever, but we know that she can't do that.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think the furthest we saw one of those doors was four hours, but she got nervous.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, because I think that's when she was at when she kind of peered down the hall and you could see that glare and that noise.
[SPEAKER_00]: And it reminded me of fruit to remind me the yellow when you saw him in the big fat fruit or whatever from season one for the fat fatster.
[SPEAKER_00]: And had the glowing yellow eyes and it also reminded me of fruit sunglasses that he wears all the time.
[SPEAKER_00]: like image of like I want to light reflects.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah and you can't you can't see into the windows of the soul with that guy.
[SPEAKER_03]: The other time travel thing I thought was interesting are these lessons and the later one seemed practical but the ones that we heard when she first appeared at the beginning of the episode
[SPEAKER_03]: Sounded like a kind of a self-improvement tape, self-help tape or something or psychology of time travel.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's things like the present is not just a date, it's a feeling, feel no shame about the past, no anxiety about the future.
[SPEAKER_03]: Every negative can be changed to positive once you know how it sounds like a cool time travel thing to do, go back and change it.
[SPEAKER_03]: The weird one nostalgia is your enemy don't think of the past while listening to music.
[SPEAKER_03]: That was interesting.
[SPEAKER_03]: Because you don't want to have a false idealized vision of the pastor or something like that.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know.
[SPEAKER_03]: But I thought that was just an indication maybe that she'd been struggling with the implications of these time travel powers and sought help
[SPEAKER_03]: You know?
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I didn't get it.
[SPEAKER_03]: She went to the bookstore and looked up.
[SPEAKER_03]: The time traveled madness or something.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think I'm a submissive.
[SPEAKER_03]: It just really seemed like it was trying to ease her mind about it or at least teach her how to do it in a way that was healthy or effective or something like that.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's like, last season's life lessons with John Hamm, but now they're.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I don't think we're going to get back this time, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: I think they could do that and we're done.
[SPEAKER_00]: No, I think it's good.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I think I think we're done with that, but I think this is kind of taking it's little bit, you know, just in a different format, different voice and a different subject.
[SPEAKER_00]: If we continue to get out, I mean, we're only in the first episode.
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know if we can get more of that.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, and this show just teaches you not to like I was saying about the hook to not question things too hard.
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, yeah, she found some time travel lessons.
[SPEAKER_03]: Cool.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, of course.
[SPEAKER_00]: Ever doesn't everyone.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's a world where means exists.
[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.
[SPEAKER_03]: So that that really is it.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's like
[SPEAKER_03]: What was the other thing?
[SPEAKER_03]: There was something else.
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, just the whole time travel.
[SPEAKER_03]: Wanted.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's like when a world like this exists for a while, you're going to get stuff like that.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's you're going to get time travel self help and people putting out one ads for mutants and things.
[SPEAKER_00]: You're going to step on a flower that squeaks when you use it.
[SPEAKER_03]: Squeals and you suck that you've added it and then you go into a blissful trance.
[SPEAKER_00]: Next time I see a blue flower.
[SPEAKER_03]: Alright, next time, next week.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yep.
[SPEAKER_03]: I want to do a podcast totally trip out sometime.
[SPEAKER_03]: Anyway, that's another story.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay, what's your number two?
[SPEAKER_00]: I think this show just does it for me.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know that I need anything else when I watch the show, but I can't imagine I've read a little bit about people doing drugs while watching this show and I can't imagine.
[SPEAKER_00]: Really?
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I can't imagine what that would.
[SPEAKER_00]: What that experience would be like?
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like just watching.
[SPEAKER_00]: It was just a drug.
[SPEAKER_02]: Normal.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, then what found what that would be?
[SPEAKER_00]: It would be disturbing more.
[SPEAKER_00]: But anyway, um, that would be an experience.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I should do that.
[SPEAKER_00]: You and Karen should light it up on the next Jason career.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay, one of those frogs.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's always blue.
[SPEAKER_00]: Anyway, sorry, my number two, we talked a little bit about it, and I could be making too much of it, but the man and robot reference.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm curious if it will mean anything as a season continues.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, in Switch says that her dad collects robots, she calls for a robot, says David is a man.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I wondered maybe if the word robot is more of a metaphor, not like a literal robot.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: Because we talked about like fruit being a bad guy, I'm wondering if she's considering him like a robot that he can't change, that he'll always be bad, and David being a man can't change.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I don't even know if I like that theory or not.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not sure if I would want David to change or if it's even possible for him too.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I could be totally wrong and it's fine.
[SPEAKER_00]: I could be just looking for meaning when there isn't any in confusing things.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I feel like Noah Holley is really deliberate about what he does, and especially like with his writing and references that he makes in this reference to robots.
[SPEAKER_00]: Because it kept coming up.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like the wrote, like you said, the vermillion, the new autonomy.
[SPEAKER_00]: She references robots with her dad.
[SPEAKER_00]: She calls for Rook a robot.
[SPEAKER_00]: In the end, when we finally get the Legion card, they're at the end.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's a little robot.
[SPEAKER_00]: The little toy robots that say Legion and then you see when it looks like Switch, you know, coming across.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I feel like it's, you know, it just it made me curious and I don't expect any answers today, of course, but I'm just wondering if it's going to mean something moving forward or going to learn a little bit about maybe what that really means.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I don't know either, but I think it's probably more of a metaphor, kind of like I think of Mr. Spock, you know, you're so cold and unfeeling.
[SPEAKER_03]: things like that, where she wants some connection, some warmth, some humanity, but I don't know, not everything fits into that interpretation, so yeah, we'll see hopefully we'll see.
[SPEAKER_00]: I just found it interesting, and I'm curious, fiddle, meaning anything moving forward, or for just like, nope, never gonna hear about it again, and it's gonna be okay.
[SPEAKER_03]: I doubt it.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think this is an important character and it would be pretty weird if she never showed up again or we didn't explore her.
[SPEAKER_03]: Who knows?
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm like, is this whole season just going to be
[SPEAKER_03]: David, I forgot his name for a second.
[SPEAKER_03]: David battling D-III.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know.
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, there's something coming up that I'm gonna mention at the very end, but it might be a spoiler, so I'll wait.
[SPEAKER_03]: but I'm really excited about it.
[SPEAKER_03]: Anyways, can I do my number two?
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, that's all that I wanted to say about my number two or all that I had but I did just find it funny that you forgot David's name when they say it like twenty times enough David David David and he's in so much of the show there was one so last season then he wasn't even in and it was a really good one but but now I forgot the actor's name
[SPEAKER_00]: Dan Stevens.
[SPEAKER_03]: Dan Stevens is so good.
[SPEAKER_03]: It is.
[SPEAKER_03]: This is like roll was made for him.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay, so I was going to do this one earlier, but I'll slot it in now.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's just the methodology of this cult and I think for the most part cults attract vulnerable seekers with the promise of giving them
[SPEAKER_03]: purpose or making them feel better stronger in some way.
[SPEAKER_03]: And also, especially with David priming them at the same time to do what he wants.
[SPEAKER_03]: So we have these signs around town, they're cryptic.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, are you indivisible?
[SPEAKER_03]: Know yourself own yourself.
[SPEAKER_03]: Beware of the forces of mine control.
[SPEAKER_03]: Those who would tell you your name who would call an armaling a leg.
[SPEAKER_03]: They are not your mother, not your father.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's the little hypocritical because which is typical of cults because they did end up renaming her.
[SPEAKER_03]: And he's saying beware of those who would tell you your name.
[SPEAKER_03]: But that simultaneously, a call to say, hey, we can teach you how to be better and also beware of this thing that's my enemy.
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, he's like embedding that in there.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I know other cults do that.
[SPEAKER_03]: They have their enemies that they teach all their members to despise to an unreasonable degree like that.
[SPEAKER_03]: and they're like find your stable center.
[SPEAKER_03]: Do you want to be whole of mind to body free from division and intoxicate yourself, but beware the basket is watching.
[SPEAKER_03]: So he's training them that Fukiyama is this bad guy.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then there's the thing about vermillion.
[SPEAKER_03]: Maybe this is actually what caught switches.
[SPEAKER_03]: I actually it's
[SPEAKER_03]: Something something would call normal abnormal.
[SPEAKER_03]: Beware the homogeneity of milk.
[SPEAKER_03]: The industrialization of cheese.
[SPEAKER_03]: No two cookies are alike unless they're cut from the machine.
[SPEAKER_03]: Don't trust the mustache.
[SPEAKER_03]: The mustache is his eyes and ears.
[SPEAKER_03]: He's she is everywhere.
[SPEAKER_03]: If you see him, her, which is a comment on their undragony.
[SPEAKER_03]: Hold your breath.
[SPEAKER_03]: Think only of cookies made by hand at home for only they are indivisible.
[SPEAKER_03]: Actually think now that I think about it, that's probably what caught our eye because that feeds into the whole machine robot, coldness kind of a thing versus the warmth and individualness of humanity or something like that.
[SPEAKER_00]: I like all that.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: So all that was said, there was so much.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's all, I mean, these are, this is what's written in all these posters around town.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think, and I'm talking about sort of his, the methodology.
[SPEAKER_03]: And it's very cryptic, which gets a person trying to figure it out.
[SPEAKER_03]: and so it's like a challenge which can hook you in and then there are these other challenges to overcome these hoops to jump through which make you feel make it like feel like this is an exclusive club and something you have to work to get into so it's a relief when you're on the inside that whole wardrobe maze which was amazing was something that she had to figure out and this whole pregnant virgin riddle and and those symbols they they look like vagina
[UNKNOWN]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_03]: Did you see that, or am I?
[SPEAKER_00]: No.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm failing the Rorschach test.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_00]: Whenever there was a pregnant virgin, they showed that circle with the... It to me to look, it was an image of a woman with her head slightly bowed down a little and a pregnant belly.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_03]: You're kidding.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_00]: No.
[SPEAKER_00]: That look again.
[SPEAKER_00]: I did not see vagina.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay, maybe it was because they were talking about pregnant Burgess.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm leaving this in so anyways the answer is salmon and I looked up salmon at at least that's what I got out of it the pregnant Virgin the orange fish and Salmon females lay eggs and then they're fertilized by the males, but I don't think the salmon are ever pregnant.
[SPEAKER_03]: They just their virgins I think because they just lay their eggs
[SPEAKER_00]: And then they come over and spray them and spray them.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then there was a particular call towards switch or self this whole time traveler add the forces of multiplication need you, which is another antithetical to division three.
[SPEAKER_03]: painting division as a word, meaning this divides you and we're, we're about multiplication.
[SPEAKER_03]: Anyway, he says resist division, do not surrender to regret.
[SPEAKER_03]: Only you can help us unright the past, but beware the basket is watching, find the orange fish.
[SPEAKER_03]: So, and then there was the whole radio.
[SPEAKER_03]: There was, she saw a radio station, eighty nine point one, or something, and heard that cryptic message.
[SPEAKER_03]: And it was all like a puzzle for her to follow.
[SPEAKER_03]: Follow the yellow bus, but it wasn't even yellow.
[SPEAKER_03]: and the bus set on the side aren't you lonely don't you wish the world was simple again another cult's appeal slash promise so this whole thing uh really drew her in and it's hard to get into which makes it even more appealing I think
[SPEAKER_00]: That's true.
[SPEAKER_00]: They don't just open the door for you.
[SPEAKER_00]: You have kind of stuff.
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, one reason why I'm fascinated with cults is because this kind of thing, I mean, I've flirted on the fringes of groups that were kind of like this, where you all belong to something.
[SPEAKER_03]: And sometimes there's even, you start using a language that other people don't use words and things.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I also think that cults really play into that whole thing about sanity that John Hamm was saying last year about how humans are the only ones where our whole society agrees on the meaning of something and so if you don't agree then you're considered insane.
[SPEAKER_03]: And with a cult, you get sometimes a whole group of people who decide on different meanings of things.
[SPEAKER_03]: And so they seem insane to everybody else outside.
[SPEAKER_03]: But if the whole world decided to agree with a cult, then everybody would just be insane.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's just really interesting to me.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know.
[SPEAKER_00]: It is.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm fascinated by cults and how they work.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's easy to sit back on the outside when you're watching these things.
[SPEAKER_00]: We've talked before.
[SPEAKER_00]: about like the Netflix documentary, the Wild Wild West, about the cult over on the West Coast.
[SPEAKER_00]: And of course with the whole next thing going on, that's been a big topic in our group, cults and such.
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's easy to watch stuff like that from the outside and go.
[SPEAKER_00]: What in the world?
[SPEAKER_00]: How in the world are you so drawn to this?
[SPEAKER_00]: This is crazy.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is absolutely crazy.
[SPEAKER_00]: But at the same time, I can also see the appeal.
[SPEAKER_00]: I can see both sides of the continent.
[SPEAKER_00]: You can see how it's easy to be drawn in, especially if you're in a vulnerable place.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah and if you're in there feeling really connected to all the people and feeling like you're helping other people who were really stuck or feeling shitty and they come to an event or session or something and it's like their whole world opens up and suddenly they're alive again then it just it feels really great but the problem is when it gets so insular and they are so much in their own reality that
[SPEAKER_03]: And they're told not to connect with their family because they'll bring them back to their past unhealthy self.
[SPEAKER_03]: So that basically means you're cut off from the people who care about you.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then what often happens is the cult leader gets so full of himself because they're centered on one person that's adored by everybody else in the cult.
[SPEAKER_03]: on a pedestal which would be so much easier to do with somebody like David who's all powerful that they just get full of themselves and absolute power corrupts absolutely they just start sleeping with all the women in the cult taking everybody's money and rationalizing to themselves that it's actually for everybody's own good but eventually it just feels like a big sickness and it all falls apart.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yep it doesn't usually last long or end well.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, but there's some that are going strong.
[SPEAKER_03]: All right.
[SPEAKER_03]: Number one.
[SPEAKER_00]: My number one, I wanted to talk a little bit about Fruke.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know we've already kind of discussed him.
[SPEAKER_00]: There may not be too much more interesting things that I have to say, but I feel like we shouldn't really trust him at this point.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I feel like he's totally fooling, division three, still that he has them under his spell.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I was really curious when he
[SPEAKER_00]: intercepted switch and they're in the astral plane and she tells him you know well that why did that blonde kill him and he really seems surprised by that and then he later tried to keep said from going on the mission and that was like well why does he not like they're all out to kill David and he's supposed to be on their side but when he finds out that she's going to kill him
[SPEAKER_00]: that he seems to try to prevent that from happening.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I thought, what is his goal here?
[SPEAKER_00]: Then if he's trying to prevent them, if he's on their side and they feel that they have to kill David because it's his destiny to kill the world or destroy the world.
[SPEAKER_00]: And he hasn't even done it yet, but that's, you know, we've talked about that a little bit.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's basically being punished for crimes.
[SPEAKER_00]: He hasn't committed yet, but they're saying that that's his destiny.
[SPEAKER_00]: So he's trying to stop that and I'm curious why and what his motives are.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I know we're not going to have the answer for that right now, but I want to kind of see how that develops and when to get your thoughts on that, what you picked up from that.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I mean, he's talking about how, you know, I'm glad that she referenced that David took advantage of her because I don't want that just forgotten.
[SPEAKER_03]: She said, you know, he's not even the first one that took advantage of me.
[SPEAKER_03]: She's referring to the whole sex after my Dwight thing.
[SPEAKER_03]: And that to him makes him think, okay, you're doing this because of revenge.
[SPEAKER_03]: And so he's saying he mentions all that love.
[SPEAKER_03]: It doesn't just disappear.
[SPEAKER_03]: It must be transformed into an emotion of equal intensity, which it sounds true.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like it made me think of how people who are deeply in love can end up just passionately hating each other sometimes.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, yeah, you just transformed it.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think that's
[SPEAKER_00]: I think he's a bullshitter, but I think when he says, like, that's the law of the universe, I feel that that's probably the one honest thing that he really sets.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, maybe.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think you just thought, if you truly are really passionately in love with someone, I don't believe that that just goes away.
[SPEAKER_00]: You can maybe be really ingrate that person, not want to be with that person, but I don't really believe that you just stop loving that person.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think that maybe that love just translates into another little.
[SPEAKER_03]: definitive to me like sometimes it can fade away over time it doesn't just automatically alternate to hate but anyway I think he was what he was getting at was that she's too emotional right now and maybe it would be a detriment to the whole thing and I don't know if he really thought you know hey you might mess this up because of how you're how you're feeling and we really want to make sure but the fact is they went in and she's the one who got the shot in and then when they had to do it over again because of the time travel she did it again which was really shocking to see by the way
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, but so maybe he was just he thought he was wise because he's been around for two thousand years, but he was just wrong.
[SPEAKER_03]: Maybe that's kind of what it looked like to me, but maybe there's some other motive that we're not thinking of.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I don't know.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think he wants David dead, so I think.
[SPEAKER_00]: Really?
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't think he wants David dead.
[SPEAKER_00]: Remember in season two at the end when he was talking about, you know, whenever he's like telling David, you can't make someone love you.
[SPEAKER_00]: Believe me, I've tried because he said, you know, I tried with you and he called him my baby.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, that was bullshit.
[SPEAKER_03]: It didn't try to make David love him.
[SPEAKER_03]: He tortured him and terrified him this whole life.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I think that he's got bigger plans for both of them.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think he wants to to somehow join forces with David.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't think he wants to to kill him.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think maybe his own twisted way does somehow care about him.
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, maybe that's why then maybe he thought that Sid would actually be the most effective killer.
[SPEAKER_03]: So he was trying to keep her out of it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, well she seemed to be the only one that killed him and why her because he was looking at all the other soldiers and everyone coming around and just flicking his wrist and sling and gun fire away from him and flicking people with ease but then she comes out and I know that she kind of surprised him like she kept shooting him in the back.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, from behind.
[SPEAKER_03]: If you're gonna give someone the special gun that actually has the power to kill him and his ex-girlfriend, you know, he has still has feelings for his willing to do it, then I think she would be the right one to do, because it might trip him up.
[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe, like he wouldn't be expecting Sid to be the one to pull the triggers from him.
[SPEAKER_03]: It went from off guard.
[SPEAKER_03]: It was shocking to me, like, wow.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it was me too.
[SPEAKER_03]: We saw her kill him twice.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: So my number one is about that whole attack too, and we've talked it mostly out.
[SPEAKER_03]: It was jarring to be to see shadow king with division three, but the line between friends and enemies is always shifting on the show and division three was the bad guys in season one, and then we saw everybody join up with them.
[SPEAKER_03]: So it's interesting how that shifts.
[SPEAKER_00]: It was disturbing to see David keep killing Carrie.
[SPEAKER_00]: Just like, no, don't kill Carrie.
[SPEAKER_03]: But hell, man, she chopped his arm off.
[SPEAKER_03]: What are you gonna do?
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, that's war.
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, I mean, it was disturbing for sure, but he was doing it in self defense.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: She's bad news.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's hard to see the people that rallied around him and helped him in season one.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, then trying to help, you know, kind of figure out what happened there in season two, where it was David and what's going on and with the shadow king and everything, but they're all still friends and such and then just to see them all now turning on him and he's just wiping him out like nothing.
[SPEAKER_00]: And now difficult.
[SPEAKER_03]: Now we know what he'll do, given, you know, that situation, even though he raised, yeah, because I mean, she jumped his arm off.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's pretty bad.
[SPEAKER_03]: Then a couple of other random things about that.
[SPEAKER_03]: The last minute carry hands them brain wave blocking headbands.
[SPEAKER_03]: I thought, man, seems like that would have been planned earlier and talked about it a little bit, but that whatever.
[SPEAKER_03]: So that was a cool.
[SPEAKER_03]: That feels like it comes right out of the comics.
[SPEAKER_03]: Just put this on and he won't detect you.
[SPEAKER_00]: right well it kind of helped you know in the because in the beginning we don't know that the first time that they come in and you're like how the hell can they just surprise him like that like just drop in and he doesn't know I mean he can read minds how can he not sense you know that they're closing in on him so then we get that later like oh here you know I've got the our soldier guys here built that into their helmets make sure that you're wearing liner whatever it'll block block your thoughts you're like
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, so that's why he can't hear them or sense them.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I like that.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, that was another cool thing about the episode that with the time travel we actually got to see that preparation for the battle that we had seen earlier.
[SPEAKER_03]: So that was pretty cool.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, let's get into notes.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm curious about Sid's tattoo.
[SPEAKER_00]: She had a tattoo that said first.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm curious.
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, it's said on one wrist, it said me and I think first me and I thought I thought that might admit I'm taking care of myself now.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, yeah, I think so because I think that she feels like she might have gotten to wrapped up in David.
[SPEAKER_00]: And now she's herself.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and then she was putting herself first.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think that's kind of what she was telling him in the finale too.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, she's like, he's like, maybe don't you trust me?
[SPEAKER_00]: And she's like, I trust myself more.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and so I was good.
[SPEAKER_00]: She's like me first.
[SPEAKER_03]: And even though like there's definitely a part of me that feels like the shadow king maybe everything could have turned out fine if there was no shadow king.
[SPEAKER_03]: There's another part that just wonders if David is just kind of toxic too, which I'm sure Noah Hollywood would love to hear me say that because he wants us to not be sure.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yep.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's definitely comfortable with the uncertainty.
[SPEAKER_00]: Or at least making SB and certain.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's certain because he knows how it is.
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, you know, I felt a little critical about this show at first because I thought it was a little bit style over substance, but I think it's been a really good exploration of psychosis and psychology and mind fuck and
[SPEAKER_03]: not quite having a handle on things and how sometimes things can seem a certain way and if you believe it enough they really are that way but if you get tripped up then they can you can get derailed and then it feels like it was always a lie you know so there's this point in time where you could continue on with something positive and it actually is totally real but if you had gotten tripped up then you would feel like no it was all lies things like that because
[SPEAKER_03]: It's a little uncomfortable sometimes to watch.
[SPEAKER_00]: Sometimes, yeah, especially some things in season two.
[SPEAKER_03]: All right, any other notes?
[SPEAKER_00]: Just a few.
[SPEAKER_00]: I noticed that when Switch walked into the room right before Lenny came in when she walked into the room that giant clock that was right in front of her, the time was eleven eleven.
[SPEAKER_00]: I love that.
[SPEAKER_00]: She noticed that, or do you even have any?
[SPEAKER_03]: What does it mean?
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I think it can mean different things to different people.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I think, you know, some people see a level of eleven and it's like they make a wish on that.
[SPEAKER_00]: Or it's supposed to be some kind of like whimsical, you know, kind of meaning like, you know, you see a level of eleven and like the date eleven eleven.
[SPEAKER_03]: Just all the ones.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I noticed that.
[SPEAKER_00]: I like the line.
[SPEAKER_00]: Why do we have a time traveler?
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's a fair question.
[SPEAKER_03]: I like to win, um, carry, uh, patonomy robot, patonomy was like, why do I have a mustache and he goes, oh, well, they had one, so I just thought,
[SPEAKER_00]: It's kind of a signify well all the robots run here.
[SPEAKER_00]: I love care.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's like so just kind of awkward sometimes and he's so adorable.
[SPEAKER_00]: I love both carries.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I like that line and I thought, well, yeah, that's a fair question.
[SPEAKER_00]: Why don't you have one?
[SPEAKER_00]: Significant music cues of the week because this show just blows me away when I think it can't anymore continuously does with their music.
[SPEAKER_00]: So we talked already about something for your mind.
[SPEAKER_00]: They're in the beginning with super organism.
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, I loved the, uh, and when they did the, it was another, Noah Holly Jeffriesso remix of the Steve Miller bands fly like an eagle.
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, loved that.
[SPEAKER_04]: Nice.
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, I liked, I thought it was interesting that, you know, switch can time travel, but she seems to have to pay a price for it.
[SPEAKER_00]: You notice she lost her tooth and how she kept favoring it throughout the episode.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, so there's another limitation because I guess Sid founded at the end there.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like you would see her sometimes like she would kind of touch it before she went through a doorway and then the last time she kind of she touched it and then she kind of you could see her tongue kind of
[SPEAKER_00]: run over that too and then said finds it there at the end it's like oh so she's kind of has a price to pay for the amount of times that she keeps looping back I guess or either either looping back or just time travel and in general I'm not sure I'm guessing we'll probably learn more about that but it was kind of like oh gross I just feel it's just seeing it tooth
[SPEAKER_00]: being picked up.
[SPEAKER_00]: Thought it was interesting of note that the director for this episode was Andrew Stanton.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's an American film director, screenwriter producer.
[SPEAKER_00]: He was based at Pixar.
[SPEAKER_00]: He joined in nineteen ninety.
[SPEAKER_00]: His work includes co-writing Pixar's a bug's life, finding Nemo.
[SPEAKER_00]: and it's sequel finding Dory Wally and he co-wrote all four toy story films and monsters ink and he is directed no episodes of Legion before.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I thought it was really interesting because I felt like there was a little bit of Pixar flavor in this episode.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I thought the spinning cup.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, and he's talented.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, they get talent attracted to the show because it's so so different.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: So that's all my notes.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay, so the whole please stand by pattern at the beginning.
[SPEAKER_03]: That was what used to appear on TVs when all the broadcasts was done for the day.
[SPEAKER_03]: You'd see, please stand by and then be.
[SPEAKER_03]: Have this tone back in the sixties and fifties.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I found out it was a pattern built into cameras, vacuum tubes to allow calibration and focus and adjustments framing and stress and stuff like that.
[SPEAKER_03]: Interesting.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think the significance is just it's supposed to be like legions been off the air and it's about to come back on.
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, that makes sense.
[SPEAKER_00]: I like that.
[SPEAKER_03]: But then it morphs, please stand by morphs to bed time is here, which I don't know.
[SPEAKER_03]: Maybe putting this series to bed.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know.
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, it's so sad.
[SPEAKER_00]: I hate this song.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, it's good.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm so sad to see this series come to an end at the same time.
[SPEAKER_00]: I just want more.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, we just, we really don't deserve this show.
[SPEAKER_00]: We just don't.
[SPEAKER_03]: I wish, yeah, I'm glad that he has an arc in mind and that he's going to fulfill it the way he wants to.
[SPEAKER_03]: I wish it was a five season arc, but this is great, too.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yep.
[SPEAKER_03]: I never understood before or else we figured out and I forgot but what cornflake girl meant and why Lenny's called that but I looked it up finally and there's the song by Tori Amas.
[SPEAKER_00]: Cornflake girl that was in C.C.
[SPEAKER_00]: too.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: And it's because they you know someone called her the queen of breakfast cereal or whatever this episode.
[SPEAKER_03]: So they always call her something cornflakes and even Audrey Aubrey Plaza did this whole ASMR thing with cornflakes on YouTube for like forty five minutes or something.
[SPEAKER_03]: She's so straight.
[SPEAKER_03]: but uh it was the song is about was inspired by something really horrible this practice of female genital mutilation in Africa and where a close female family member would betray the victim by performing the procedure
[SPEAKER_03]: And Amis said that growing up the name that gave girls who would hurt you despite close friendships was cornflake girls because like there's the raising girls which are the good ones and then the cornflake girls.
[SPEAKER_03]: And so Lenny's a cornflake girl.
[SPEAKER_03]: She's somebody who would hurt you despite your close friendship.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think that's what it means anyway.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I think we talked about that a little bit in season two when they called her that.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think we kind of dove into that a little bit about the meaning of the song or what Toreem says, you know, that she felt was the meaning of that.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think made total sense given that he's character.
[SPEAKER_03]: Another note, Shadow King said something, I thought was pretty sexist.
[SPEAKER_03]: He said, I had relations with the time traveler once Geraldine, is it true that you're all these women, pork wall?
[SPEAKER_03]: Maybe it has something to do with regret.
[SPEAKER_03]: Choices made and not made opportunities missed.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: What do you make of that?
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I thought it was a little sexist too.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's about like, you come up with a little screw you.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, we didn't have a breath.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: Opportunity is interesting.
[SPEAKER_03]: He's an old fashioned kind of guy.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's been around two thousand years.
[SPEAKER_03]: I like the carries now hungry all the time and she used to like hate food, but she got a taste of cream soda.
[SPEAKER_03]: Now she's she's like a child resisting at first, but then when she discovers what she like she compulsively wants it,
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I thought that was really fun, because I thought you hated all that stuff.
[SPEAKER_00]: You said, Carrie has to do all the boring stuff, like eating and whatever you guys do in the bathroom or whatever.
[SPEAKER_03]: Now she's like in the bathroom, pooping all the time.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then lastly, this is a little bit spoilery for something coming up this season character.
[SPEAKER_03]: So if you don't want to hear that, I would just skip ahead to the next segment.
[SPEAKER_03]: We have chapters, but it will also be just like a minute or something.
[SPEAKER_03]: So we know that Harry Lloyd who played by Sarah's Targaryen on Game of Thrones is coming on at least for one episode, maybe more to play Professor X. Which is awesome.
[SPEAKER_03]: David's father.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I was wondering why they would have picked such a young guy, but now I'm wondering if it's gonna be a time travel thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think you're right.
[SPEAKER_03]: Maybe, yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: But I hope it's more than one episode.
[SPEAKER_00]: I hope that he's in at least a few.
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like the story, you know, it's been tease so much.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know some folks have probably been able to remain unspoiled, not Washington.
[SPEAKER_00]: He kind of proved these are really red, you know, what to expect.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I feel like that's been put out there enough.
[SPEAKER_00]: That most folks probably know.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I feel like we kind of have to.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know that they're going to be able to tell enough story with him in it in just one episode.
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like we at least need to.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, hopefully, but I'm looking forward to it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_00]: So news about Legion that we have this week.
[SPEAKER_00]: We have a couple of items.
[SPEAKER_00]: First one we have is from the Hollywood Reporter.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is taken from an interview with Noah Hawley aka God.
[SPEAKER_00]: Sorry, Noah.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's a book, and I worship at the altar of Noah Halley.
[SPEAKER_00]: So Noah Halley somehow.
[SPEAKER_03]: He should start a call.
[SPEAKER_00]: I would be assigned me up.
[SPEAKER_00]: I will drink the blue juice, I'll suck the tea of a giant pig, whatever he asks.
[SPEAKER_00]: I love this guy.
[SPEAKER_00]: You can do no wrong.
[SPEAKER_00]: But Noah Holley somehow found time for yet another journey because we know he's like the busiest guy in Hollywood.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know that people know that or not, but he's like so busy.
[SPEAKER_00]: So he finds time for one last trip through the mind of David Holley based on Marvel's relatively obscure X-Men comic book of the same name.
[SPEAKER_00]: He says, I'm not really sure how we managed it.
[SPEAKER_00]: He says about wrapping Legion.
[SPEAKER_00]: He says, I was editing the movie while I was creating this.
[SPEAKER_00]: I do feel like it ends for me the way it was meant to end.
[SPEAKER_00]: It feels like a really strong proof of concept, taking something that can be whimsical, dramatic, slightly horrifying character-driven genre piece, and using it as a mediation on mental illness in the abusive power, and all of the other things it's probably about.
[SPEAKER_03]: That really sums it up, boils it down.
[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's why he's genius.
[SPEAKER_00]: He says the show becomes about parenting and the idea we have to raise our kids the right way.
[SPEAKER_00]: We have to give them a moral center and we have to teach them about restraint, responsibility and the way they interact with other people.
[SPEAKER_00]: He says there's always a moment in Fargo.
[SPEAKER_00]: His other show, if you guys have not heard of that, which is wonderful.
[SPEAKER_00]: He says there's always a moment in Fargo where the worst person on the show says, I'm the victim here.
[SPEAKER_00]: He says, with David, there's a similar mentality and narcissism and a sense of entitlement.
[SPEAKER_00]: He has this mantra now.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm a good person and I deserve love.
[SPEAKER_00]: He uses it to justify a lot of behavior that's just not good behavior.
[SPEAKER_00]: He sees himself on some level as above morality, because of what he's suffered.
[SPEAKER_00]: He believes he is by definition a moral person, so everything he does is therefore moral.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think it's worth an exploration.
[SPEAKER_00]: Historically, much of the audience of this material is young men and boys, adolescents and older, and it's important to have conversations about the power men have, and the responsible use of it, and the things they feel entitled to, and they take for granted, you have to have those conversations out loud.
[SPEAKER_00]: He says if we're rooting for the love story with David and Sid, but that love story starts to come apart in season two, and there's a moment where he erases her memories to buy himself time so he can be with her.
[SPEAKER_00]: But in doing so he removes her consent, and then he goes to her in the night.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's a part of the audience who wants this love story to work, so maybe they're okay with it.
[SPEAKER_00]: All the way to the point where she basically says, you drugged me and had sex with me, then the audience goes, oh shit, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: That was not good.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's a moral behavior.
[SPEAKER_00]: You're presenting your audience with these challenges about rooting for this character and also seeing the behavior clearly.
[SPEAKER_00]: And he says, if I've done my subjective job right, you've been in David's mind for this whole time.
[SPEAKER_00]: And now at the end of the second season, you've realized he's an unreliable narrator.
[SPEAKER_00]: He talks a little bit about switch in the introduction of her.
[SPEAKER_00]: He says the reason why the third season starts with an entirely new character for the first twenty minutes is we're now creating an objective way into the story.
[SPEAKER_00]: The first time you see David, now in season three, is through someone else's eyes.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's not subjective anymore.
[SPEAKER_00]: Guys, proven to be an unreliable narrator.
[SPEAKER_00]: We're looking at him from the outside now, rather than from the inside.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's not to say that we won't go back to his point of view, but I feel it was important to switch the point of view for the audience.
[SPEAKER_03]: Interesting.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, it's good, even though, kind of through podcasting, we came to that.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's gratifying to hear him say pretty much the same things that we conclusions that we reached.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yep.
[SPEAKER_03]: about, you know, I mean, even just this episode, I was saying I bet he would be happy to hear be say that I wasn't sure if David was bad the whole time and that's what he's kind of saying.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, he's a unreliable narrator.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yep, absolutely.
[SPEAKER_00]: You right on the nose.
[SPEAKER_00]: So we have a second item from Collider.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is taken from an interview with Dean Stevens, who plays David Holler.
[SPEAKER_00]: They ask him, how does it feel to do the last season of the show and have to say goodbye to this character?
[SPEAKER_00]: He says it's a real privilege in a way.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm extremely proud of having been a part of something so uniquely weird.
[SPEAKER_00]: The fact that we managed to get three seasons is a wonderful thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: Noah always pitched it to me as a three season story arc.
[SPEAKER_00]: Obviously, we weren't allowed to say that at the beginning, because everybody in this age feels like things should run and run.
[SPEAKER_00]: But to have a story with the beginning, middle and end, that's so uniquely crafted as something that I feel will exist out there.
[SPEAKER_00]: I wouldn't be intimidated to take on a three season show and be like, somebody told me about the show Legion.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I'll give that a go.
[SPEAKER_00]: If it was like, nineteen seasons, and I feel like, oh, I'm not gonna watch that.
[SPEAKER_00]: and one season would not be enough.
[SPEAKER_00]: So we're going to have twenty-six chapters of this thing and I'm just so happy to have been a part of it with the uniquely weird and talented bunch of people behind it.
[SPEAKER_03]: Wait, twenty-six chapters?
[SPEAKER_03]: That means there's only seven.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm confused.
[SPEAKER_00]: He might be wrong.
[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe he's wrong.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know, but I'm telling you there's eight episodes.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm DB says so.
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, I just say chapter twenty seven isn't always right.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's not always right, but I'm relying on it for today.
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, chapter twenty seven.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, that would be eight.
[SPEAKER_03]: All right.
[SPEAKER_03]: We'll see.
[SPEAKER_00]: So they go on to say, in the comics, the nature of David's condition would change.
[SPEAKER_00]: Does it feel like he's consistently in the same condition or has it progressed?
[SPEAKER_00]: Dance even says, I would say it has progressed.
[SPEAKER_00]: In some of the comics, sometimes it's multiple personality disorder, sometimes it's paranoid, it's schizophrenia, sometimes it's something else.
[SPEAKER_00]: Ultimately, it's none of those things because he's immune and his mind has been occupied by a mall for Rook.
[SPEAKER_00]: I believe medical science has not got a name for exactly what that is, but medical science doesn't really have a name for a lot of things that are not too dissimilar.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's part of the point.
[SPEAKER_00]: Doctors are going to call David's conditional source of things, but it's none of them.
[SPEAKER_00]: We get to be playful with those symptoms and really just produce some of the experience of some of those things.
[SPEAKER_00]: The more David understands his own condition and his own makeup, our appreciation of what's up with him changes and narratively it changes as well.
[SPEAKER_00]: We start to see more of what's inside.
[SPEAKER_00]: Going from season one, it seemed to be this guy who was really having a tough time mentally, but now we get to really dig inside and bring some of that out.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I get to bring some of that out as well, which makes for a playful narrative as well.
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, so yeah, that's about it out of that one.
[SPEAKER_00]: I really great interviews if anyone wants to see them, you know, I'll post the full interviews, but they do go on quite a lot.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm happy to share those because they're really great, um, complete interviews with no Holly and Dan Stevens both.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, yeah, really like both of those.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, and when you say you'll post it, that's on Facebook Facebook dot com slash Legion pod.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's where we get your comments before each episode or after each episode that we might read during the podcast and then sometimes Rima posts interesting stuff on there about the show.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think it's interesting anyway, you guys might not like it's something that I hope you do.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, it's cool.
[SPEAKER_03]: Alright, speaking of listener feedback, we didn't get a lot this week, but we did get a couple things.
[SPEAKER_03]: We call this section mental notes and our one written note comes from Matthew J. Morrison who says about the episode amazing.
[SPEAKER_03]: I love the show so much.
[SPEAKER_03]: I have no idea what's happening, but I can't stop watching and I want more.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's I see that written so much like I don't know what the hell I'm watching but I just know one more of it I Just can't ever describe the show enough to people who've never watched like really what's it about and I'm like oh shit just here just to never watch it I'm like it's great you watch in you and you feel like yours gets a frenic and they're like oh
[SPEAKER_03]: really good.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know they think that sounds really weird like why would you want to fill that way, but I'm like you do when you watch it, you want to.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay, and we have one call.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's from Steve Brown and I'm going to play right now.
[SPEAKER_01]: Is this a cult?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_01]: Hello, we can cast this esteemed and just got a few quick notes because I was watching this for a second time.
[SPEAKER_01]: I started jotting out even more notes and thought I'm going to run way long.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I'm cutting it off.
[SPEAKER_01]: where where does this take place in the three years later that we saw in the last episode of season two with Melanie and Oliver or was that three years later just a McGupon or whatever it's only to throw us off but it just that puzzle me at first because you know I rewatch season two and that last episode starts with a little three years later with Melanie and Oliver in his ice cube
[SPEAKER_01]: mind-scape and they're talking about that the world has already ended and then here we are at this point where that hasn't happened yet so just figured trying to think of where that where this episode or where we're at in that timeline and David's looking for a time traveler David needs love gosh squirrel the alchivist he gets hooked that was great
[SPEAKER_01]: Is David, do you think there's more people in his circle that are super powered or is it just him?
[SPEAKER_01]: I wasn't sure about that.
[SPEAKER_01]: and I would absolutely love the call back to the Cornflake Queen.
[SPEAKER_01]: Being with me, if I hadn't rewatched season two, I probably would've told me forgot that when the blonde girl says the Cornflake Queen and then later they say the breakfast cereal queen is coming.
[SPEAKER_01]: I would've told me for God that but I was so glad to rewatch season two and get that side.
[SPEAKER_01]: There's love.
[SPEAKER_01]: The show is back and it's got me confused but I can't wait to see how they wrap it up.
[SPEAKER_01]: Talk to you later.
[SPEAKER_03]: Good views, but I love it.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's what everyone says.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know how long the time was between season.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm guessing at least handful of months.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, we don't really know, but it's enough time for him to sort of set up this group as a cult and assume it's before the three years.
[SPEAKER_03]: But I also feel like that three year thing was just a way to get Oliver and Melanie to have a happy ending.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think we probably won't see them again.
[SPEAKER_00]: No, I don't, I think that that was a way to kind of write them off, and that was our goodbye to them.
[SPEAKER_03]: I was kind of wondering if this was going to be a big mutant cult, but I think the only ones we know for sure that have powers are David and Switch, and maybe there's others, but I don't think Lenny does.
[SPEAKER_03]: She's got Amy consciousness inside her maybe, so that might be sort of weird.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, but he mentioned the blonde girl.
[SPEAKER_03]: I forgot to mention that back the other genie the episode he had that that featured Lenny and she and hurt they had their like hot lesbian sex scene and then later she comes out patting her belly and says You expecting a prince yeah, or and that was
[SPEAKER_03]: It was suggested that it was going to be their child and you're like, huh?
[SPEAKER_03]: How did that happen?
[SPEAKER_03]: But now, it's going to hurt the pregnant virgin who's been afraid for twenty-five years.
[SPEAKER_03]: So I don't, yeah, that's a big question I have.
[SPEAKER_03]: What the fuck is going on there?
[SPEAKER_03]: Interesting.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and well, and if that's true, if she somehow conceived that moment from season two, and she looks like she could potentially give birth at any moment.
[SPEAKER_00]: She looked heavy with child.
[SPEAKER_00]: It could be the eight or nine months after that.
[SPEAKER_00]: I guess that could establish a timeline if that's, you know, we'll say that.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: We're going to go with that.
[SPEAKER_00]: I love that the Lenny cornflake.
[SPEAKER_00]: When they were talking about the cornflake queen or queen or breakfast, and I was thinking Lenny queen of breakfast, frosty or flakes, first of her name.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know.
[SPEAKER_00]: Just, I love Lenny.
[SPEAKER_00]: She's such a great character.
[SPEAKER_00]: She was smoking as hot in that, like, jumpsuit thing that she was wearing, too.
[SPEAKER_00]: She's a singer.
[SPEAKER_00]: Who's a singer?
[SPEAKER_03]: Who are you?
[SPEAKER_03]: Are you a swimmer?
[SPEAKER_00]: She's been penis free too.
[SPEAKER_03]: She hasn't though.
[SPEAKER_03]: No.
[SPEAKER_03]: Alright, now we're just gonna We're going a little long, but I thought it would be cool just to say a couple things that we're hoping for this season What's like the main couple of things that you're hoping for?
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, one of my hoping for, I kind of want to find out what's up with the robots.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's kind of a lame one, but it's just sticking in my brain.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm really curious, will we see David become Legion World Killer?
[SPEAKER_03]: me too.
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, I was looking to suggest multiple personalities.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's why he's called that because there's a region of people inside him and in the comic as I've said on this podcast before probably each one of those has a different power.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't think we're going to see exactly that, but we didn't see that vision last year of him with Lenny and his feet and his hair spiked up with his track suit or whatever.
[SPEAKER_00]: He looked very much
[SPEAKER_00]: I thought was amazing because he looked very much more like the comic character than he ever had in this show.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I know that this show is loosely based.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know that they take care of characters or you know, but that was, I just think, you know, will he really fulfill this destiny?
[SPEAKER_00]: But I do feel like they're kind of exploring that legion part because they called him that in season two.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's the first time we ever heard
[SPEAKER_00]: that uttered aloud.
[SPEAKER_00]: The show's called Legion.
[SPEAKER_00]: We see it every week.
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, I don't remember that part anymore.
[SPEAKER_00]: Melanie called him that whenever she was showing Sid, David was torturing.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, she says Legion, World Killer.
[SPEAKER_00]: And she calls him that.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then we've seen that, like you said, that vision of him holding this crystal ball looking thing and his hair spiked in that jumpsuit.
[SPEAKER_00]: And it looks like a pregnant lanyan riding on the ground and being all weird.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I'm curious if we'll go there and I feel like we got a little peek at that, that little Scottish version of him when Switch starts to open that door and he's gathering the tea when he's going to come out to her and we've seen, we saw that in the end of season two as well when he had these different versions of himself, you know, talking to him, arguing with him.
[SPEAKER_00]: So wondering if we'll get a little taste at that, I think that's super fun.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I just, the ending, I just want it, it doesn't have to be a happy ending.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I want it to be a satisfying one.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, I don't know what the hell's gonna happen.
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like I can't predict what no Holly will do or what journey he'll take us on.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I'm okay with it.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not being happy.
[SPEAKER_00]: I just want it to be satisfying.
[SPEAKER_00]: So that's it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Those are my big things.
[SPEAKER_03]: I hope that we would get a happy ending.
[SPEAKER_03]: That would be subverting my expectations.
[SPEAKER_03]: But yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: I really would not bet anything on that, not even five dollars because I'm totally expecting a tragedy and I'm ready for that.
[SPEAKER_03]: So, and I'll be happy with that too because, well, the show and I just have had a sense for so long that that's where it's headed.
[SPEAKER_03]: But with all the downer TV lately, you know, and I mean, I kind of, I'm a little sad because
[SPEAKER_03]: We got to see David so mentally off balance in season one.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then he got rid of fruit.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then for a while there, it seemed like, oh, this is so nice.
[SPEAKER_03]: They're in their white room, him and Sid.
[SPEAKER_03]: And you know, it's just seemed like he was really together and centered and connected.
[SPEAKER_03]: Now it's all trashed and so now we're unlike the the come down and don't a holly knows how to make that Really fun and a great experience even when terrible things are happening.
[SPEAKER_03]: So I'm ready for it, but there is definitely a part of me that just wishes that they could be happy together.
[SPEAKER_03]: So that's not gonna happen
[SPEAKER_00]: No, he's going to destroy me because I mean, I totally get the whole thing with what he did with Sid.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I just feel like that's going to completely prevent them from getting back together or ever having a reconciliation or things being the same that they were before.
[SPEAKER_00]: I have a feeling it might be a little bit of a bit of a bit of sweet ending.
[SPEAKER_03]: Maybe, yeah, yeah, you're probably right.
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, I'm always trying to figure out if a show, well, let me start that over.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm most impressed when I feel like a show is true to itself.
[SPEAKER_03]: So I've said this a few times, but Game of Thrones, I feel like it is well established as
[SPEAKER_03]: a lot of cruelty and getting you to hope for something and then pulling the rug out.
[SPEAKER_03]: And so I would have been critical of that show if the last season had been all nice and it wasn't.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I thought that was perfect for the show.
[SPEAKER_03]: In other examples, if there's a dumb comedy and it's just a dumb comedy, I'm like, yeah, I'm on board with that if I'm laughing, that's great.
[SPEAKER_03]: But shows that really are ambitious and try to do something big and fail, but I'm kind of critical of it like, oh, it didn't really work.
[SPEAKER_03]: For for Legion, I could see them pulling off a happy ending and making it work for the show.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't think they're going to do that, but I think Noah Holley could do it if he wanted to and make it work and it wouldn't feel like a cop out.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know, I could be wrong about that, but that's just my feeling.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I feel like this guy is the magic man.
[SPEAKER_00]: They caused him to love the magic man.
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like Noah Holley is the magic man.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I feel like this guy can pull off anything.
[SPEAKER_00]: He impresses me at every turn.
[SPEAKER_00]: Seriously.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm just, I love him every time.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I think we're on the same way.
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, he just knows how to do it with style and intelligence that he could just do whatever and it would work.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yep, it almost seems like that.
[SPEAKER_03]: All right, we're finding way too much.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yep.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know.
[SPEAKER_00]: No, Holly needs to start spreading the bugs.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: Thanks for all the love.
[SPEAKER_03]: All right, that is our show.
[SPEAKER_03]: I've said twenty.
[SPEAKER_03]: Thanks for listening, everybody.
[SPEAKER_03]: Glad to be back.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's been so long and I'm so happy that the show is back.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: So if you guys want to get in touch with us, write, ask questions, comments that will read on the podcast.
[SPEAKER_03]: You can email or you can send a voice message to us at Legion at podcastica.com.
[SPEAKER_00]: You can find us on the web at facebook.com slash Legion pod.
[SPEAKER_03]: And be sure to check out our other shows at podcastica.com, Strange Indeed, which Rima hosts with Sean is about to start covering, Stranger Things.
[SPEAKER_00]: Stranger Things comes back next week.
[SPEAKER_00]: Amazing.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, lots of exciting TV getting right at it happened here.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yep.
[SPEAKER_03]: And also check out baldmove.com too.
[SPEAKER_03]: They are the best.
[SPEAKER_03]: They cover so many shows so intelligently with wit and style and I'm always in awe of those guys.
[SPEAKER_03]: And next week, we're going to be fortunate enough to have Aeron with us for the rest of the season.
[SPEAKER_03]: So that's going to be super fun.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I can't wait.
[SPEAKER_03]: Alright, that's our show.
[SPEAKER_00]: Thanks for listening.
[SPEAKER_03]: And don't forget the basket is watching.