[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, I'm not a bad person.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not.
[SPEAKER_02]: You've been arrested thirteen times.
[SPEAKER_00]: Sure.
[SPEAKER_00]: But there's bad and then there's really bad, right?
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean.
[SPEAKER_00]: What did I ever do except hustle to get high?
[SPEAKER_00]: Man, I mean shit.
[SPEAKER_00]: Sometimes you got to throw a brick through a window or make some guy think you're gonna suck his dick under the highway and then your pimps shows up and he's got a rubber revolvers with the guys on the ground and he's begging, please don't kill me.
[SPEAKER_00]: I've got a family or whatever.
[SPEAKER_00]: Shit, that's just business, okay?
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not a villain.
[SPEAKER_03]: Hey everybody, welcome to our podcast time, Jason.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm Rima.
[SPEAKER_03]: This is Legion cast episode thirteen.
[SPEAKER_01]: Lucky thirteen.
[SPEAKER_03]: I wanted first off to say something that has nothing to do with this podcast, but thank you for guessing for me on why the dead cast with Lucy this week.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, it was fun.
[SPEAKER_01]: I wish it was under better circumstances.
[SPEAKER_01]: It was fun to do, but only because you were sick that I got to do that.
[SPEAKER_03]: We were, even now, we're just talking about how I was faced down pressed with my cheek against the cold bathroom tile, rather than in agony.
[SPEAKER_03]: It was so much fun.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think we've all probably pictured you doing that at one point or another.
[SPEAKER_01]: Really?
[SPEAKER_01]: No, I'm really saying I don't know.
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, anyways, I'm totally fine now and I'm ready to start.
[SPEAKER_03]: So let's get into our top five highlights for Legion season two episode thirteen creatively entitled chapter thirteen.
[SPEAKER_03]: So, did you like it?
[SPEAKER_01]: I did.
[SPEAKER_01]: I will happily admit I was confused for much of it.
[SPEAKER_01]: I still am not sure if I'm going to make it through this podcast and be able to really have anything intelligent to say not that I ever do any other time, but anything intelligent to say about this one because I'm really just so confused on so much of it.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think pretty clear but just like everything that led up to the like those last eight minutes I just I'm so confused but I did like it because it's Legion and it's beautiful and there's great music and great writing and actors I mean Aubrey Plaza I mean Holy Hell she knocks it out she's always a pleasure to watch on the screen so I did I liked it I'm pretty sure I have a handle on it but but maybe by the end of this I will be just confused as you
[SPEAKER_01]: No, I think you're not.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think it's going to be the other way around.
[SPEAKER_01]: You're going to help me.
[SPEAKER_01]: You always help me figure it out.
[SPEAKER_03]: I liked it too.
[SPEAKER_03]: I liked that there's a change of pace.
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, I stand by what I said last week.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think that was my favorite episode.
[SPEAKER_03]: It was just really beautiful.
[SPEAKER_03]: But this was a completely different kind of Legion and I loved it too.
[SPEAKER_03]: All right.
[SPEAKER_03]: Let's get into our top five.
[SPEAKER_03]: Do you mind if I go first this week?
[SPEAKER_01]: Not at all, since you let me have your guest spot yesterday.
[SPEAKER_01]: You can say the link.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay, so I really enjoyed that they came right in and you could tell even from apparently on Legion, which I loved.
[SPEAKER_04]: I love that.
[SPEAKER_03]: that it was going to be about Lenny because they showed a lot of Lenny scenes.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I'm like, awesome because that's one thing that we've talked about on the podcast that I felt like, you know, I love Aubrey Plaza, I love the character, but it feels like they don't really have a handle on what's going on with Lenny because sometimes she's the shadow king, sometimes she seems like Lenny.
[SPEAKER_03]: And she used to be Benny, and so sometimes I wonder if the writers even know or if they just kind of lost control of it.
[SPEAKER_03]: So maybe feel good to see, oh good, it looks like they're gonna really dive into that not ignore it.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then when you had Clark sitting there asking her questions, they're the same questions I have.
[SPEAKER_03]: What's your name?
[SPEAKER_03]: That's good work.
[SPEAKER_03]: What body is that?
[SPEAKER_03]: Or, you know, you used to be a disembodied consciousness.
[SPEAKER_03]: Now you have a body.
[SPEAKER_03]: What the hell's going on?
[SPEAKER_03]: So I really enjoyed that.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think that, yeah, it was confusing, but we, I think by the end of it, what we could piece together.
[SPEAKER_03]: is that she was Lenny Busker.
[SPEAKER_03]: She's a huge addict.
[SPEAKER_03]: She got caught up.
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, when Sid and David cheered at places and said lost control of David's powers in his body, it caused her to get fused in the wall with her ass in one room and it tits in another.
[SPEAKER_01]: We've all been there.
[SPEAKER_03]: Even out in the wall of it, so how or another.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then she died.
[SPEAKER_03]: But the shadow king took her consciousness, took control of her consciousness.
[SPEAKER_03]: And so I think she was inside David at that point, but under the control of the shadow king.
[SPEAKER_03]: her consciousness and D three took her body out to the desert and buried it which apparently this is where they kind of stash things because I feel like David Sisters stashed there to maybe like a witness protection kind of thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: They're like the mob.
[SPEAKER_03]: Kind of.
[SPEAKER_01]: Everything in the desert.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I just hide it out there.
[SPEAKER_03]: And that's convenient, too, because they were trying to make us think that fruit and Oliver were going to get fruit's body, which we know is a desert.
[SPEAKER_03]: But actually, they had grabbed this device from D-three when they were there trying to find the monk.
[SPEAKER_03]: And they went out to the desert and they dug up Lenny's body.
[SPEAKER_03]: And it was funny how Furuk was just like drinking his tea.
[SPEAKER_03]: Wow, all of us struggling.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then he's all, now let me just use my telecasts.
[SPEAKER_01]: I know, like why do you just do that in the beginning?
[SPEAKER_01]: You can see all of us pissed off already about like he's he's like dude.
[SPEAKER_01]: I just got this new suit.
[SPEAKER_03]: Do I have to touch it?
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, it is new suit.
[SPEAKER_03]: Stylin and so anyway, they dig it up.
[SPEAKER_03]: They just need a little piece of flesh and it took me the whole episode to figure out figure the saw out.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think it was supposed to take everyone but
[SPEAKER_03]: They take the flesh, they put it in the device.
[SPEAKER_03]: It gives the pattern of Lenny's body.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's what they needed that for.
[SPEAKER_03]: So then they went out to his sister, Amy, and just killed her basically.
[SPEAKER_01]: Essentially.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, and then they used that device to transform her body into Lenny.
[SPEAKER_03]: But we know also that Lenny was, uh, I believe everything she said about her.
[SPEAKER_03]: What was it her grand grand that used to drink from the orn soda, but it had.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: And she, uh, her mom, her father would rather watch.
[SPEAKER_03]: What was it?
[SPEAKER_01]: It's like men having sex with preaching girls on the internet.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, just a shitty life and that she and I loved when she's trying to convince Clark that she's not a bad person.
[SPEAKER_03]: Sometimes you gotta make some guy think you're gonna suck his dick under the highway and then your pip shows up and he's got a rubber revolver so the guy's on the ground and he's begging, please don't kill me.
[SPEAKER_03]: I got a family or whatever.
[SPEAKER_03]: Shit, that's just business, okay?
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm not a villain.
[SPEAKER_01]: We've all been there, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: So she's, she's had a rough life.
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, it's funny, all that stuff, but also, there are people who have that life and it's really, really.
[SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely.
[SPEAKER_01]: So it's like, absolutely.
[SPEAKER_01]: She has not had a great childhood, you know, her grandma gets her drunk at nine years old.
[SPEAKER_01]: Mom doesn't seem to mind too much, and probably a little resentful of her life.
[SPEAKER_01]: And yeah, she had a pretty rotten life.
[SPEAKER_01]: She was a junkie and an addict, and it probably did some questionable things in order to obtain those drugs.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: And she's been arrested several times, bricks and windows.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then when Lenny took her consciousness, she said, he kept her kind of like, it was a nice turn of phrase, like drawers, like in a morgue, and let's them out, only when he wants to play.
[SPEAKER_03]: And so then he would use her image sometimes in the mind scape.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think we only saw her in the mind scape and sees one after she died.
[SPEAKER_03]: Now's the first time she's been in the physical world, but mostly just kind of trapped.
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, yeah, and she said something about the whole that whole evil, anything.
[SPEAKER_03]: I was faking it so that he whatever.
[SPEAKER_03]: So that makes me feel like when they were traipsing through D three together, disintegrating people that really was her kind of
[SPEAKER_03]: playing along.
[SPEAKER_03]: But so the only thing I feel like I really don't quite understand is why the Shadow King would make David think that his old friend Benny was Lenny.
[SPEAKER_03]: You remember that?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I don't know why.
[SPEAKER_03]: Because there were lines and he's also an addict.
[SPEAKER_03]: So that was weird.
[SPEAKER_03]: Why?
[SPEAKER_03]: I feel like maybe that was a remnant of another storyline that never went anywhere or something.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know.
[SPEAKER_03]: Or else just the shadow king messes with people.
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, because there was supposed to be a real Benny that was a junky and a drug addict, but Lenny did exist too.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I'm still kind of confused about that as well.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think the idea is that he met Lenny at Clockworks and Benny had been his friend who got him into all kinds of trouble before that, convinced him to steal from his psychiatrist and all that.
[SPEAKER_01]: Mm-hmm.
[SPEAKER_03]: So what do you think does that seem all right?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so far.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think he sounded up pretty well.
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_01]: Cool.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think we can wrap it up from here.
[SPEAKER_03]: I actually did two points just then.
[SPEAKER_03]: I see.
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, well, what's your number five?
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, you kind of went over some of it already and my number five was the interrogation of Lenny.
[SPEAKER_01]: So we talked a little bit about Clark.
[SPEAKER_01]: I just like seeing the different like versions of Lenny that we that we got and how she kind of played it to try to get what she want because she kept asking for David.
[SPEAKER_01]: She wanted to talk to David.
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's what she kept asking for consistently throughout her interrogation.
[SPEAKER_01]: At least until the end when she finally did get to see David.
[SPEAKER_01]: But you know with Clark she seemed kind of sad playing a victim role sound like she was like trying to gain some sympathy You know telling her story of her grand grand.
[SPEAKER_01]: You know like you know don't you feel bad for me look at my shitty life You know that kind of aspect of it and she seemed very innocent you felt you could almost like really kind of feel for her a little bit And I think that we were not working for the
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, but she, at least she's telling the truth about it.
[SPEAKER_01]: She's lying about it, but she is at least like saying, well, yeah, I kind of am, but this, you know, I do still want, like she did want to live.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think that we're seeing some, I think we're seeing more of real Lenny than what we've seen before.
[SPEAKER_01]: We saw maybe a little glimpse in season one before the whole incident before she got
[SPEAKER_03]: I like how when she goes on that story about a grand grand and it's like oh, there's so much detail here.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's making me believe what she's saying but then maybe that's suspicious because it might seem like she's trying a little too hard and Clark comes back with are you the shadow king?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I really liked his interrogation of her.
[SPEAKER_01]: I liked how he was, at first I didn't know what he was doing when he picked a finger.
[SPEAKER_01]: I thought it was like a little DNA thing because they didn't know whose body that was.
[SPEAKER_01]: It looked like it was just proving that she could bleed, that she was real.
[SPEAKER_01]: and like a real body.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: And because then after he did that, a living, bleeding, yes, bodies.
[SPEAKER_01]: So they know that, okay, you are real.
[SPEAKER_01]: You are here.
[SPEAKER_01]: We know it's not your body, but it's somebody's body.
[SPEAKER_01]: And who is it?
[SPEAKER_01]: And he just wasn't, he wasn't taking her crap.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's for sure.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I liked his, you know, the little scene with them.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: We have rooms in this building down below where we forget about people.
[SPEAKER_01]: I can imagine anything worse than the room that she was already in.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's a pretty messed up.
[SPEAKER_03]: I know, which was all it's been.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and I'm sure it's on purpose to really like throw her off balance.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm sure, but yeah, I was very disconcerting.
[SPEAKER_01]: I was getting a little bit dizzy there at the beginning is that the room, he's walking in in the room, starts the turn, as he starts walking down the steps.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm like, okay, good way to start Legion.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm already dizzy.
[SPEAKER_01]: I have no idea what's going on.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then we get autonomy.
[SPEAKER_01]: And autonomy is talking to her about the past and the present and how the now doesn't exist.
[SPEAKER_01]: I thought this was a real interesting and confusing exchange.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't really know what was happening there with Potonami.
[SPEAKER_01]: I know he tried to, he was like, nope, essentially reading her mind, but like reading her memories.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like he does.
[SPEAKER_01]: And he was getting these really weird memories.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then he sees Fikiyama.
[SPEAKER_01]: And he sees the vermillion.
[SPEAKER_01]: He sees, you see that little dark greasy chicken looking thing that delusion essentially going into his ear again.
[SPEAKER_01]: And you see,
[SPEAKER_01]: Is that really the face and are that basket for Admiral Fukui?
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know, but I was just really confused about that whole exchange and then he wakes up and he's he's choking her Yeah, this happens.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, we both experienced Yeah, by a girl a drink first, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: It's just if you're gonna choke me out by me a drink It seemed like he loosened his grip, but he still had his hands around to throw it for a while there
[SPEAKER_01]: He did.
[SPEAKER_01]: It was just kind of a confusing exchange.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't quite know what was supposed to get from that, but I'm sure we're going to get a little bit more.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I was just interested thinking does she know or understand what's been done to her?
[SPEAKER_01]: And is she faking it?
[SPEAKER_01]: Like how much is she faking?
[SPEAKER_01]: How much is really her?
[SPEAKER_01]: And her like genuine responses and genuinely Lenny.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then of course we had David and that whole exchange.
[SPEAKER_01]: I really loved that exchange between her and David because it was kind of like, you know, she's lifting her head up and he's just looking at her kind of grin and at her and she gives in that smile and it was like old times at Clockworks and he gives her the twizzler.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, and he's all I know you're here because of the shadow king so he's talking to her like a friend But it's like I can read your mind.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's almost like you would to your to any friend who's not being totally honest, you know, it's like come on dude
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I just like the different different like different Lenny's that we kind of got in which one was really genuine how much was she manipulating how much was, you know, really her.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not sure if she's still under any type of influence if she's truly free from the shadow king being in this different body.
[SPEAKER_03]: So just I don't think shadow king would let her.
[SPEAKER_01]: Wow, it's so many questions.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's just so many questions, but that's what I liked about.
[SPEAKER_01]: It was just that first or the all the exchanges interrogation that we got up plenty.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay, a couple of things you mentioned.
[SPEAKER_03]: So the delusion, shit going into autonomy.
[SPEAKER_03]: I feel like that was a lot to throw us off to doubt anything we're seeing because when autonomy goes into somebody, well, in this case, I'm like, yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: All right, Mr. Memory Man's going in and now we're going to get some answers.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then the delusion thing goes, I call it delusion check goes in and I'm like, oh, now I can't trust anything we see here because it might be delusion.
[SPEAKER_03]: Right.
[SPEAKER_03]: But then he goes into, he sees Fukiyami and I don't know, but I wonder.
[SPEAKER_03]: So we see later that Amy has been dreaming about Vermillion that she's one of them and then we find out that I want to say Aubrey.
[SPEAKER_03]: Lenny was in the sister's body, so maybe there's some kind of psychic connection between Amy and Fukuyama for some reason, and maybe because it's her body, some of that carried over, so that when Patonmy went in there, he found some rest of that, because it's all melted together.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think, I don't know, but I'd like to think that yeah, there's just like weird insectoid creature in there, because that's kind of cool.
[SPEAKER_03]: And it would make kind of explain a little bit why he doesn't talk, because he doesn't have any tongue or lips or anything, or at least, you know, can't make human.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, very, very creepy, very strange whole thing that happened there.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I'm interested to see if that means anything or forced the post to think it means anything because of that whole delusion thing that we've been shown before.
[SPEAKER_03]: And if it is real, I don't necessarily mean that means anything.
[SPEAKER_03]: Think that means anything bad about Adam Rolfukiyama.
[SPEAKER_03]: Because I think one theme in the X-Men is some mutants are born looking kind of horrific.
[SPEAKER_03]: And that just adds to this whole how the rest of humanity fears and hates them.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like a net crawler, I actually think net crawler.
[SPEAKER_03]: Do you know a net crawler?
[SPEAKER_04]: Of course.
[SPEAKER_03]: He's blue with a tail and he looks kind of like a demon, but he actually doesn't look ugly.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think he looks kind of cool.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think he loves coloration.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, but his story is that people fear him right away because he looks like a devil and he's actually a super nice guy.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like beast, you know.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, yeah, so Fukiya could be like that could be the nicest insectoid you ever want to meet
[SPEAKER_01]: He could be that just happens to wear a basket on his head.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it should go on Tinder.
[SPEAKER_03]: Take that basket off and be proud.
[SPEAKER_03]: So another thing he said was that he might, he seems to be in some weird polyamory thing already.
[SPEAKER_03]: with the vermillion yeah with the there they're like androids that's like west roll territory so uh let's see the the thing about whether she's faking and uh
[SPEAKER_03]: I think that a mall really fucked with her head, because she's at one point talking about her mother's funeral, and then she asked David, did that really happen?
[SPEAKER_03]: And it kind of reminded me of David last season where he wasn't really sure about a lot of things, because Shadow King had been mucking around and said, and I liked when they first met up like you're saying, he's like, oh, with him out, it just, I can appreciate the silence.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I think that I had no idea what silence was until freak was out of my head.
[SPEAKER_01]: Probably how it feels for her too.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, but she still messed up.
[SPEAKER_03]: She's got this.
[SPEAKER_03]: She said he put a bunch of spiders in there.
[SPEAKER_03]: I forget exactly what she said, but it was like, you know, he really doesn't number on you when he gets gets in there, I think.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then also how much of what she knows or remembers is mixed up with Amy, like being murdered with Amy.
[SPEAKER_01]: Right because we don't know that.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, we don't know that at that we were getting ready to find that out during that moment in the show, but we don't know that just yet.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, and it made me wonder if Amy's mother died.
[SPEAKER_03]: Maybe I don't know if we know that and she was mixing it up or something.
[SPEAKER_03]: Well speaking of Amy, I guess I'll make that my number four that I actually was thinking about her before she ever appeared.
[SPEAKER_03]: Because when, uh, I keep wanting to say, Aubrey, when Lenny was sitting in that room, it said on the wall, keep hands and playing view at all times, no physical contact permitted.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm pretty sure it said the same thing when David visited Amy in Clockworks.
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, Amy visited David when last season and maybe they even tried to touch and they got reprimanded.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know if I'm Mr. Remembering all that.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know if they tried to touch but she it was like in this it was in the pilot I believe of season one and she it was David's birthday and she had given him a like a cupcake with the sparkler candle on it.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's like you can't do that.
[SPEAKER_01]: I can't have that or whatever.
[SPEAKER_03]: Wasn't that there a flash of that too?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, there was.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, so I think even maybe subconsciously, I recognize, hey, they're putting things related to his sister here.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then when they talked about the eye color, which is a cool little moment with autonomy, and her eyes are now blue.
[SPEAKER_03]: And it showed David's face for a long time, and I'm like, his eyes are blue.
[SPEAKER_03]: And at that point, I'm like, I think it might be the sister somehow.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then it did turn out, then they start showing the sister.
[SPEAKER_01]: And did you notice her eyes right away?
[SPEAKER_01]: Because I did her eyes.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, right away.
[SPEAKER_01]: And we saw every closet, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: I saw immediately her eyes were blue and I'm like, what?
[SPEAKER_01]: I was blue.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then when I got the flash of David, they showed the y'all like I said that close up and his eyes were blue and then I was like, oh shit.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I made that connection.
[SPEAKER_01]: I didn't know.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, oh my gosh, that's Amy.
[SPEAKER_01]: It was just like, oh my gosh.
[SPEAKER_01]: Why are her eyes blue?
[SPEAKER_01]: David's eyes are blue.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, and then when they showed Amy I think for some reason that pushed me away from thinking that it was Amy I think it was because I thought all this stuff was going on at the same time So that's it.
[SPEAKER_03]: What's your number what for?
[SPEAKER_01]: So my number four is Oliver.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm, I'm stoked that we got some more Oliver.
[SPEAKER_01]: I feel like we have been running very shy of, uh, German Clement the season.
[SPEAKER_01]: We've gotten tidbits.
[SPEAKER_01]: We've gotten some good stuff when he's on there.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's good.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's on, um, but I really, really enjoyed, um, you know, he's, we talked a little bit about how he was having that exchange asking for Luke, like, well, what am I going to have to do?
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, he's like, it's going to be dirt.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's going to be a coffin, a pine box to start coffee gifts.
[SPEAKER_01]: What's happening here?
[SPEAKER_03]: And he said something like about it.
[SPEAKER_01]: And he's like, oh, he was kind of like, oh, he kind of made a face.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, oh, you know, he's like, I've got this new cream colored suit.
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, he doesn't like the idea of bugs and beetles in dirt.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I really like the exchange that he had with fruit about the morality debate.
[SPEAKER_01]: And some of the lines that came out of that.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I really
[SPEAKER_01]: Rallity.
[SPEAKER_02]: What is it?
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, all right.
[SPEAKER_01]: But I thought it was really interesting.
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, it's like he's I do like his one line he had.
[SPEAKER_01]: He said nothing spelled real to me for a very long time.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm like, oh, thank you all over for saying that for all of us because I don't know what's real either and nothing is spelled real to me at the same time.
[SPEAKER_01]: But I thought
[SPEAKER_01]: that was like a true Oliver moment and not for root in Oliver speaking that I felt that was really him and I also think that it was him when he turned around and he told him just very calculated like he he still somewhat has I think a psychic connection with Melanix we heard him say Melanie we get that flash of Melanie and and then he turns around and the seat looks at fruit and he's he tells him he's like I'm gonna kill you you know and I thought there he is that's Oliver that's the Oliver that we love so I really love that whole exchange that they had
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: He said that right when Faruq is explaining his philosophy of almost superior.
[SPEAKER_03]: And that's what you call mutants by the way in the comic books.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_03]: People who don't know.
[SPEAKER_03]: And it's about like whether the lion asks the morality of killing a deer.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think this is exactly what I was saying when you and I were talking about whether people think of themselves as villains, and I was like, probably just thinks of people like ants, you know, that this is him just basically saying that, like, I'm lying and everyone else is a deer.
[SPEAKER_03]: and so they don't really matter and so yeah anyways then that's when he thinks of Melanie and I think it's because as far as we know anyway Melanie doesn't have any powers so he's like you're calling my the love of my life a prey here I thought Melanie was a telepath I think Melanie doesn't have any powers but I could be wrong somebody wrote in and says hey guys Melanie doesn't have any powers
[SPEAKER_01]: I thought in season one, she was speaking to David through her mind.
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, maybe David was reading her mind, I think.
[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know if that was ever really clarified, but I remember her speaking, but her words or her lips were not moving.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: So when they're not it was that person.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, maybe I don't know.
[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe she does it.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I'm okay with that.
[SPEAKER_03]: Either way, that's what I was taking from this that that's why he thought of her and then got like, I'm gonna kill you right right in that moment.
[SPEAKER_03]: But this nurse let us know what you think.
[SPEAKER_03]: Does she have powers or not?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, because she's not in the comics, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: Melonus is not in the comics, so we don't really have a base line for her.
[SPEAKER_01]: I really like when they were outside of the vehicle out in the desert and Oliver tells him, or Frick says, what you said before that you that you killed me well, you've been in the sun too long.
[SPEAKER_01]: He said, I'm more powerful than you.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's being very cocky, very arrogant.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then Oliver says, well, then again, maybe I found your weakness.
[SPEAKER_01]: He says, oh, my weakness.
[SPEAKER_01]: You'll see.
[SPEAKER_01]: But in the moment of attack, and then it will be too late, what fun?
[SPEAKER_01]: What a grand amusement.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's like, can I have a hint?
[SPEAKER_01]: He goes, you may.
[SPEAKER_01]: He says, he's like, it's a simple mathematical question.
[SPEAKER_01]: What is one plus one?
[SPEAKER_01]: For who says, too, incorrect.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's on your very fly, a true snake.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I love that whole exchange.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm really interested in what that means.
[SPEAKER_01]: We're getting mathematical questions.
[SPEAKER_01]: One and one is not to being led to believe something that we think is true, but it's not like what we were learning in previous episodes about green means stop and red means go.
[SPEAKER_01]: what we think is I just think that this whole episode just really questions because like you said they did they apparently on Legion which I think makes this question everything that we've seen and how it's been presented so far yeah so I just I love Oliver I'm so glad we got some Oliver I like that we saw a little bit of true Oliver coming I'm a little bit worried about him how he ended up in the end because I don't know how much that was truly Oliver and if it was is he too far gone
[SPEAKER_01]: So, that's my number.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, yeah, I think sometimes Oliver is, I don't think he's ever in control of his body actually.
[SPEAKER_03]: And when we see Oliver with Frook, Frook is just a psychic projection.
[SPEAKER_03]: He's not real, you know?
[SPEAKER_03]: And so when we see Oliver going through D-III, disintegrating people, that's Frook.
[SPEAKER_03]: And when we see him here killing Amy, it's also fruit.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think.
[SPEAKER_03]: But what I love is, yeah, when they're having this whole kind of ego battle a little bit, but it's very gentlemanly.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's very genial.
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, I'm going to kill you.
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, how are you going to do that?
[SPEAKER_03]: You'll see, but not until it's too late.
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, man, I have a hint.
[SPEAKER_03]: You may.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't ever just amused a whole thing because he is so confident in his abilities that he's not worried at all.
[SPEAKER_03]: It just reminds me of in the show how I think instead of doing typical like side battles or just struggle that you have in every other superhero thing, they find more refined and artistic ways of representing it like with the dance, you know, the dance off.
[SPEAKER_03]: And here it's just this funny gentlemanly conversation, it kind of reminds me of that thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's like a war of words instead of like combat or whatever, or you see them like wrestling, like when David and fruit were wrestling and they turned into a tank and
[SPEAKER_01]: for turns into smoke and that whole the whole exchange back and forth that battle of the world.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is more vigilant for us.
[SPEAKER_01]: War words.
[SPEAKER_03]: I didn't really get the one plus one thing.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know if we were supposed to.
[SPEAKER_03]: Maybe it has something to do with some in Legion.
[SPEAKER_03]: There's a lot of times where one person is actually a melding of multiple people.
[SPEAKER_03]: But she had a king seemed to understand it right away.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know, but anyway, I hope I love that yeah, he came with that cockiness though that he seems to have a plan and it reminded me that Oliver is supposed to be a pretty powerful mutant himself.
[SPEAKER_03]: So maybe there'll be a some kind of a weird battle there.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yep, I'm excited and I just love seeing Oliver.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I know.
[SPEAKER_03]: I like to make claimant so much.
[SPEAKER_01]: I do too.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know if I I probably said it on the podcast, but I went and saw him and what who's this partner Brett McKenzie so I saw them live and they're super funny and They I think had every woman in this theater wanting to sleep with them by the end of it
[SPEAKER_01]: I can see why.
[SPEAKER_03]: They're super charming.
[SPEAKER_01]: They are very charming.
[SPEAKER_01]: Germain Clim at there is something about him.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's very swath, very smooth, very charming.
[SPEAKER_03]: And they know how to work the humor just right to come off as kind of this charmingly aloof and desperate at the same time.
[SPEAKER_03]: And in absent and somehow swath all together in one.
[SPEAKER_03]: Falflort every time.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay, what is my turn?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: Number three.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay, so I was like, why is the shadow king doing this?
[SPEAKER_03]: Why take David sister's body and turn it into Lenny and send him to D three?
[SPEAKER_03]: Lenny said that, you know, she wanted that shadow king told her to go there and tell David that he knew shadow king knew where his body was.
[SPEAKER_03]: But I don't think shadow king knows where his body is because
[SPEAKER_03]: He would have it.
[SPEAKER_03]: He would be getting it.
[SPEAKER_01]: But does he care?
[SPEAKER_01]: Is that what matters after this?
[SPEAKER_01]: Is this what matters?
[SPEAKER_03]: What?
[SPEAKER_01]: Him finding his body.
[SPEAKER_01]: Is that really what he was after?
[SPEAKER_03]: I think he want, well, I don't know, but my impression was that, you know, it's always been said if he finds his body, he's going to be way more powerful.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I was just, I had assumed that David knew where his body was, but I guess not, because David was working with him before this, and so he would have told him.
[SPEAKER_03]: But I think he just saw an image of it, but he isn't nowhere it is.
[SPEAKER_03]: Just remember the monk took him in and showed him
[SPEAKER_03]: and that was making me wonder why why did the monk show David all this stuff if the monk knew that David was working with the shadow king and the monk wants to stop the shadow king I'm not totally clear on that you didn't show him how to get there because it was a valley that's now a desert see I knew that that landscape had changed I know I said that
[SPEAKER_03]: But why haven't given these clues to it?
[SPEAKER_03]: But anyways, I think that in a metaway, in our real world, that they want to keep our replaza on the show and keep doing new and interesting things with her, so they figured out a way to bring her back into the physical world.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think that's why.
[SPEAKER_03]: Maybe that he sent her there so that she, well, I think heat for some reason wanted David to know that he had put Lenny in his sister's body.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think it was personal to David about his sister and Lenny was just a tool.
[SPEAKER_03]: And because, you know, when David figured that out, he got really pissed off and said, I'm coming for you.
[SPEAKER_03]: But then I'm like, well, why would Shadow King do that if David was already working for him with him, then why would he want to piss him off?
[SPEAKER_03]: There was this article on bustle.com that says, in the comics, David Holler's full powers weren't triggered until his stepfather was barely murdered by terrorists in front of his eyes.
[SPEAKER_03]: Maybe the show is adapting some form of this origin story with a different family member, and Fruke is trying to coax out David's true potential for his own nefarious purposes.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's one idea.
[SPEAKER_01]: I was on your own paper.
[SPEAKER_01]: I have that exact name.
[SPEAKER_03]: The second one, though, is maybe he just has, I think he probably has Amy's consciousness.
[SPEAKER_03]: The article I saw said they thought she was just dead, but that's Shadow King's MO is to steal the consciousness and hold the captive, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: So I don't think we've seen the last of Amy and maybe she's a hostage so that he can have more leverage over David.
[SPEAKER_01]: That is a really good point and I thought the same thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: I thought, you know, maybe her body is sort of not really dead, but it's it's clearly Lenny has taken over like her DNA has merged.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I say merge because you can tell that she hasn't fully taken over Amy's body.
[SPEAKER_01]: There are the blue eyes and maybe some other attributes.
[SPEAKER_01]: She has.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and maybe some leftover memories, but I think clearly Lenny is isn't that body alone?
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't feel that she's really sharing that body or that her consciousness is still there because I think David would have picked up on that.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so would Potonomy?
[SPEAKER_01]: I think they got flash.
[SPEAKER_03]: It was interesting when David was saying he couldn't tell the difference between her ideas and shadow kings.
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.
[SPEAKER_03]: Though that was cool.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, he could read her mind and he can read all that, but he can't tell who's who's.
[SPEAKER_01]: So that's why he didn't know for sure if she was telling the truth about not really working for him and how much she knew.
[SPEAKER_01]: I know that's that's that's that's my number one is just all these questions because it's what we don't know is you know in part of that what is for plan why would he use and I put kill kind of like in quotation marks I don't know I'm like you I don't know that she's really dead but why would he use her as a warning today because I think she served as a warning
[SPEAKER_01]: you know because he essentially destroyed whatever alliance he had with David you know he implored him to help him find his body from the monks like why this is right why this is what what we need to do so he was on his side yeah so why would why is he just totally and this was planned out this was planned out back when we saw Oliver and Lenny coming into G three and when they you know we thought they were looking for the monk but they were looking for this you know so this goes way back you know maybe yeah they were like killing two birds with one stone
[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe maybe maybe the shadow king needs this device this whatever the hell this thing is that it's like a DNA merger to for his own body Maybe he needs it for it because he needs to find his body his body's dead But he's got his consciousness back in there I don't know maybe he needs it and maybe he's testing it and he's decided to like you know I'm just gonna fuck with you and I'm gonna do this to your sister and put Lenny back in your life And I'm gonna mess with her because I'm gonna think she I'm gonna let her think that she's free and she's not
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm just, I don't know what he's really after.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know if his body even matters.
[SPEAKER_01]: Is that really what he's looking for?
[SPEAKER_01]: Is he trying to draw David out?
[SPEAKER_03]: Why do you keep saying that?
[SPEAKER_03]: Why do you think he's not looking for his own body?
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know that he's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm just questioning it because we've been led to believe it that he's been looking for his body, but he was looking for Lenny's body.
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's what we've seen.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's all that we've seen him do.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know that it does.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm just questioning it.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, it's all a question, of course.
[SPEAKER_03]: I just assumed that he knew where Lenny's body was, and so he got it, but he doesn't know where Zone is, so he hasn't gotten it, you know.
[SPEAKER_03]: But yeah, you could be right who knows.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, I don't know that I'm wrong or right, just that it makes me question it because we thought that that's the path that he was on and really he was looking for someone else's.
[SPEAKER_03]: Or at least they did a good job of making us think that he was looking for his own body because that's what the show has been talking about up until now.
[SPEAKER_03]: And when Oliver was pulling out the coffin or whatever he was pulling out,
[SPEAKER_03]: They didn't show it very well, and I think they did that on purpose because we know that fruit is in this egg.
[SPEAKER_03]: It looks like it's from Ork.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know what to believe because I don't know what's real and what we're supposed to believe and what we're not supposed to.
[SPEAKER_01]: But it's like, that's just what I'm questioning.
[SPEAKER_01]: And if that was really what he's been after the whole time and what's maybe he's trying to draw David out because it worked, you know, yeah, I think he's brought out David and I was also questioning the same thing was why would for risk pissing off someone who's potentially supposed to be the most powerful mutant ever.
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, and is that setting the stage for like what you mentioned?
[SPEAKER_01]: What happens in the comic now?
[SPEAKER_01]: It was his stepfather, right, that died in the comic that triggered David's full potential with his powers.
[SPEAKER_01]: And in this essence, it's his sister.
[SPEAKER_01]: And maybe she's not really dead.
[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe he is holding her consciousness hostage, but David's being led to believe that she's dead.
[SPEAKER_01]: And he's wanting David to become
[SPEAKER_01]: That powerful mutant that he knows he can be or something.
[SPEAKER_03]: He talked.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, he talked something about that when they were talking before about come to the big boys table or something.
[SPEAKER_03]: So yeah, maybe it is something like that.
[SPEAKER_03]: Then he can use him.
[SPEAKER_03]: But it also feels like this is leading right into future since warning that it's going to kill shadow king in the desert.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, within the week.
[SPEAKER_03]: Did you watch?
[SPEAKER_03]: I didn't.
[SPEAKER_03]: Did you watch scenes from next week?
[SPEAKER_01]: I did, but not that it helps me.
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, I don't want to talk about it right now, but I wanted to talk about it.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like maybe at the end of the news.
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's a bit of a spoiler.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm going to know what happened.
[SPEAKER_03]: Because somebody else said they thought looked really good.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I only watched it once, but I don't fully remember.
[SPEAKER_01]: I just remember watching it gone well, that does not help me at all.
[SPEAKER_01]: I still don't know what was going on.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's probably, did you watch man men?
[SPEAKER_03]: I forget.
[SPEAKER_03]: When they really showed scenes from next week, it would just be like somebody getting an elevator, and then someone having a drink, and that would be it.
[SPEAKER_03]: I can't remember someone telling me that.
[SPEAKER_01]: That was, they were the best people.
[SPEAKER_03]: They didn't want to reveal anything, and they forced him to put together stuff.
[SPEAKER_03]: So he's like, all right, fuck you.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'll have to get this guy like putting on his tie, and that's it.
[SPEAKER_01]: Repeat every week.
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, so my number three is for Rook and we've talked a lot about him already.
[SPEAKER_01]: I really liked his homo superior line.
[SPEAKER_01]: You mentioned that already, which is what Magneto said in X-Men.
[SPEAKER_01]: Magneto uses that and I know it's used in the comics a lot.
[SPEAKER_01]: The debate of morality that he had, we've talked about that a lot already with Oliver.
[SPEAKER_01]: I thought it was interesting some of the words that he was using and I just I don't know I don't really understand exactly what we're supposed to get from it.
[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe it will make sense later when he says what is the universe without each sunrise?
[SPEAKER_01]: That's how we judge our gods not on their math but their poetry.
[SPEAKER_03]: He talks about how he responds to I don't even remember hearing that.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that was when they were driving in the car and Oliver was driving.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then see, he calls later on when Lenny, he calls her the sun.
[SPEAKER_01]: Isn't he colorated at the sun or the sunrise?
[SPEAKER_01]: And so it's like, OK.
[SPEAKER_01]: But I just, I love, I love the writing, I love how the actor, how he says the words.
[SPEAKER_01]: I like how he kept switching languages.
[SPEAKER_01]: Did you notice how he would speak different languages again?
[SPEAKER_01]: Like he was, he was doing that in another episode.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think whenever he and David were chatting and he was switching between, like, friends.
[SPEAKER_01]: He always does.
[SPEAKER_01]: And farcee and all of her did it too.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: So he can match him there.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: He was like, that was a really good world.
[SPEAKER_01]: But he is a man of the world, good ol' Oliver.
[SPEAKER_01]: But I think we've talked a lot about Faruk already, at least as far as my points that I had about him.
[SPEAKER_01]: So that was, that was my number three just in general.
[SPEAKER_01]: And his, his ego.
[SPEAKER_03]: Hi, Bob.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_03]: Let's see.
[SPEAKER_03]: My number two is the show.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think it's more playful this year.
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, it was always creative.
[SPEAKER_03]: One thing that comes to mind is the whole chalkboard professor X-thing for last season.
[SPEAKER_01]: But um, I love that scene.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, me too.
[SPEAKER_03]: That they're getting even more like, uh, whatever, just let's do anything.
[SPEAKER_03]: And so like when he said apparently on Legion, that just killed me.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: Or the upside down room was really good with the gravity.
[SPEAKER_03]: Are you like changing the laws of gravity in here?
[SPEAKER_03]: She's already like tweaking out about
[SPEAKER_03]: everything else it's going on.
[SPEAKER_01]: Give her some liquid paper, make her happy.
[SPEAKER_03]: The PA comes in that says things like, any shift in reality may signal an attack, if you feel something, say something, which is a play on, if you see something, say something.
[SPEAKER_03]: But she also said, a new symptom alert, unexplained malaise.
[SPEAKER_03]: So it's like, it's detecting things in people.
[SPEAKER_03]: unexplained malaise can be in any workplace, by the way.
[SPEAKER_03]: The whole posturing between Oliver and fruit that we already talked about, so I won't go over again, but I just loved talking about you know how he could kill him and what he please give him a hint.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I guess that's it.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think we've already covered a lot of the playfulness, but I love they just keep bringing that because it's funny.
[SPEAKER_03]: It makes it almost a comedy in a sense, or at least it satisfies the same part in me where I just get kind of tickled by stuff.
[SPEAKER_01]: Which is delightful.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, definitely.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, with between the little bit of the lightness of the dye, I mean, it was kind of heavy stuff.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, talking about morality and killing people and Lenny and being like tweaked out and messed up and confused and everything that was happening there.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's pretty heavy stuff, but they did it in a light way, which I think that we needed based on what happened there in the end, which is, what are we on number two now?
[SPEAKER_02]: Yes, sure.
[SPEAKER_01]: So we're just going along, we don't even know.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't even know what's real.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, that's what I was going to go into the last scene, which was a big shift from what we had in the first part, or first three-fourths of the show, where it was these playful exchanges.
[SPEAKER_01]: And we had that relationship with David and Lenny coming back together, and you could see that friendship sparking a little bit between them.
[SPEAKER_01]: Until he starts to realize what really did happen and we get to see that play out and that last scene.
[SPEAKER_01]: And for me, just personally watching that, there have been legion isn't really scary to me, but there have been a couple little scenes here and there that have been scary that I've been like, oh, you know, that kind of makes takes me back a little bit.
[SPEAKER_01]: This had to be one of the scariest scenes that I've ever seen in legion.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, Jamaan Clement, as much as I love him and he can be so charming and swath and have a little bit of goofiness to him a little bit, he was scary in that scene.
[SPEAKER_01]: That was very, he was very ominous when Amy comes into the kitchen and he's washing, he's washing his hands like a surgeon and he holds them up like a surgeon does.
[SPEAKER_01]: He was just scrubbed for surgery.
[SPEAKER_03]: And he just appeared like she turned a different direction and he was there.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know how that happened.
[SPEAKER_01]: Right, because she's like, well, I'll just go get my coat.
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, she sees him and she recognizes him because she was there in season one.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think she did see him a little bit and she's like, I think she was going to run.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think, oh, I think, totally, she was going to run.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think she recognized him, but I think she was at least going to make him believe.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, OK, sure, I'm going to go with you and he's trying to get away.
[SPEAKER_01]: Of course he did.
[SPEAKER_01]: Of course, or Feru, I'm guessing that was a him and he's being taken over by Feru in that moment.
[SPEAKER_01]: But yes, he appears around the corner again with his hands up and he's just very slowly, you know, leading her back and she's walking backwards into the kitchen and he has this very ominous look on his face, totally scary.
[SPEAKER_01]: I love love love when they chose Tom Petty's I don't come around here no more start to play that was a brilliant some kind of slower cover by somebody else
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it wasn't hit.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's his song, but it wasn't him singing.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't think it was a remake.
[SPEAKER_03]: It was a remake.
[SPEAKER_01]: No, I've never heard it.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm wondering if it's original for this show.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know that I've ever heard that, but I think it was brilliant.
[SPEAKER_01]: I loved it so much, because I'm a big Tom petty fan, and anyone who do love that song.
[SPEAKER_03]: I thought that was really great.
[SPEAKER_01]: Great remix of it.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's a good song.
[SPEAKER_03]: Don't come around here.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'd go away.
[SPEAKER_01]: Here are you looking for.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I just thought it was so scary.
[SPEAKER_01]: Amy screaming while the transformation was happening.
[SPEAKER_01]: You've got the rooms kind of dark.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's blue.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's how I felt when I was throwing up the other night.
[SPEAKER_01]: That was horrible.
[SPEAKER_01]: That whole scene was just horrible.
[SPEAKER_01]: The image of the flowers on the floor with the blood dripping, the merging of like Lenny's DNA into Amy's body was horrifying.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, you took that gun out and injected it.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and he's like, we're going to find the sculpture in the stone.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, very, very poetic, poetically dark.
[SPEAKER_01]: That whole thing, and just to seeing that transformation, like, like Amy dying, Lenny reber thing was just, and it sounded like bones and tissue crunching and moving and morphing, and it was just
[SPEAKER_01]: I was like, what the fuck am I watching right now?
[SPEAKER_01]: I didn't know what the hell was going on.
[SPEAKER_01]: I didn't know whether or not to be excited because it was a different what I was watching or completely horrified and then to see for who kind of in the background you see like the reflection of him and all of his eyes and you seem kind of in the background and behind that screen.
[SPEAKER_01]: When everything is in Amy's house he's watching it happen.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, geez, it was horrific but but so well done in the music playing the whole time.
[SPEAKER_03]: What happened to her husband?
[SPEAKER_01]: He was dust.
[SPEAKER_03]: Really?
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I used to see even though.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, she when she was because she's like she's looking at the window and he's standing next to her and they're looking at the kitchen window.
[SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, of course we got to talk about that.
[SPEAKER_03]: I thought you wanted to get a door and then he disappeared.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, well his well there was dust and dirt or like a ash it like ash on the ground and his beer bottle was was there kind of blowing in the wind with the door open and there was just like you know whenever they were poof and people at D three Oliver and Lenny and they were going poof and they were like turning into ash that was what he looked like so that's how you can be
[SPEAKER_03]: pretty much yeah there's poof and they were like ash cool yeah so he was ash just kind of blowing in the wind oh you say ash and it makes me think of ash versus evil death sorry so much that canceled everybody yeah no I think they did this whole scene really well and even they'll lead up to it I noticed he she's standing there with her husband and he says
[SPEAKER_03]: You know that feeling like something really bad is about to happen.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think we're probably dread and I'm pretty sure because they're out the desert drinking and it's hot and I think there's a fan going but it's like really slow and you see the shadow and it's like and it's uneven.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I didn't consciously recognize it at first, but I'm like, this is annoying.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, it's just unconcerting.
[SPEAKER_03]: So they do little elements like that really well.
[SPEAKER_03]: And that just made me feel like primed for something shitty because it was so uncomfortable before I'll ever even showed up.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it was like everything just kind of stopped like the airstub, but then you could see the wind kind of coming in slowly from the from the window and it just seemed like the fan stopped at that point.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, just as very weird since he's talking about the feeling of dread and then, well, this is probably why you're feeling tired.
[SPEAKER_01]: You're getting ready to die.
[SPEAKER_01]: So
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's my number two.
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_03]: And seeing number one is chapter six conspiracy.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's, uh, what's his name, John Ham's.
[SPEAKER_01]: They're narration from John Ham.
[SPEAKER_03]: Did you see Jesus in that piece of toast?
[SPEAKER_01]: I see Jesus every time I make toast.
[SPEAKER_03]: But no, dude.
[SPEAKER_03]: You must look at it.
[SPEAKER_01]: I saw it.
[SPEAKER_01]: I saw a face.
[SPEAKER_01]: Really?
[SPEAKER_01]: No, if.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_03]: Because he told me to.
[SPEAKER_03]: I thought the point was that she was totally nuts because there was nothing like Jesus in the toast.
[SPEAKER_03]: But you saw it.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay, maybe it was supposed to, I mean, that's great because it's kind of illustrates the whole point about conspiracy theories to me is I think people see things that aren't there.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I saw it like I said, was it Jesus?
[SPEAKER_01]: No.
[SPEAKER_01]: But was it like a face?
[SPEAKER_01]: Nothing.
[SPEAKER_01]: You've never looked like a split piece of wood or a cloud or anything of that nature and saw something that resembled a face or anything.
[SPEAKER_03]: Many times the move.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, that's what I mean.
[SPEAKER_03]: But in this toast, it didn't look, I've tried to see it.
[SPEAKER_03]: I gotta go back and watch again though.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't watch this up some ones.
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, well, what I say, what I look at that, if someone hadn't said, oh, that's Jesus in the toast, I don't know that I look at it by myself and say that's Jesus.
[SPEAKER_01]: I just say, oh, I see a face.
[SPEAKER_03]: To me, it looked like they deliberately made it look as little like a face as possible, so there would be no chance you would see a face in it.
[SPEAKER_03]: To show their point that people will see things in anything, but you saw the face, so maybe I'm right.
[SPEAKER_01]: I saw the face.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, you know what?
[SPEAKER_01]: I think differently than what you do, so that might be why.
[SPEAKER_03]: I really love that they had this whole conspiracy segment because yeah, I'm going to be super biased here more than usual people, but I hate conspiracy theories.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think they're nuts and they're totally paranoid and that we landed on the moon and that, you know,
[SPEAKER_03]: All as well, killed JFK.
[SPEAKER_03]: And there's this, you know, the whole concept that they said about how we look for patterns because that's how we're biologically engineered because we needed to do that to survive in nature.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think that's true, but then we overdue it and we see things that aren't really there.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I really like that slot machine thing where it showed what was it.
[SPEAKER_03]: It was, uh, the first thing I wanted to do is suspicious facts, random details opinion, and so strong as I believe that a pattern must exist, that the human might more eject the piece that don't fit, and then coincidence gets crossed out.
[SPEAKER_03]: So I really like that.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then the pessimist sees danger behind, hiding behind every back, and there's a one guy with a knife and the audience's friendship.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then the kid looks over at Oliver at the chalkboard illustrating all this, and Oliver's been the bad guy in these.
[SPEAKER_03]: He's the one that sent the kid out to get run over by car.
[SPEAKER_03]: And so, and he's got one hand behind his back, so I'm like, he's got a knife back there.
[SPEAKER_03]: But on TV, the conspiracy theories are almost always true on TV shows.
[SPEAKER_03]: I just don't think they are in real life.
[SPEAKER_03]: And there's this great documentary that I've been watching.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's coming out in sequential episodes called This is Not a Conspiracy Theory by this guy Kirby Ferguson, who also did one called
[SPEAKER_03]: Everything is remix that was really popular about modern attitudes towards intellectual property and stuff like that.
[SPEAKER_03]: But anyways, this is not a conspiracy theory.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's talks about how our psychological and other forces in our society, mostly in the US, shaped all these conspiracy theories that have come up and his reasoning behind, he's like me, he mostly thinks they're bullshit.
[SPEAKER_03]: So that's why I like the documentary.
[SPEAKER_03]: I see.
[SPEAKER_03]: Anyways, I think this whole segment kind of went along with that, too.
[SPEAKER_03]: It was sort of saying that they're not really true.
[SPEAKER_03]: But I don't really see how it relates to Legion.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think some of these segments have related later on a couple episodes later.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, well, maybe maybe this one will relate because I did have a hard time making I mean as much as what I enjoy listening to John Ham narrate You know about whatever he wants to narrate about I don't care I Whatever he wants to talk about all listen, but I had a hard time You know relating his talking about conspiracy theories in this particular episode.
[SPEAKER_01]: I feel like some of the other ones who you're a colleague
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, I can kind of see how that ties into the episode that we're watching this one was not so much, but like I said, maybe it will be in the next one or one to come.
[SPEAKER_03]: And there's been one or two that didn't like the delusion one that really didn't come until later.
[SPEAKER_03]: So maybe it'll be like that.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah, I don't really care.
[SPEAKER_01]: What, at least that I can listen to him talking.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's really strange.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know if it's like that for everyone.
[SPEAKER_01]: When I watched this live, I had just listened to John Hamm and his narration on this conspiracy theory.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then like a minute later, I was taking notes or doing something on my computer waiting for it to come back on.
[SPEAKER_01]: And there was a Mercedes commercial.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think it was Mercedes.
[SPEAKER_01]: And John Hamm is like the voice of that car commercial.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I was like, wait, what is it back on?
[SPEAKER_01]: because it was him talking about this car when I just heard him talk about conspiracy theories.
[SPEAKER_03]: Somebody put that there so you would see it.
[SPEAKER_01]: You know there are some people in my family that were probably something like that.
[SPEAKER_03]: I had this friend in college who it's really sad but he had this totally active phase of schizophrenia.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like he never had anything like that but he was my roommate and all of a sudden I think it was triggered by drugs.
[SPEAKER_03]: He just started hearing
[SPEAKER_03]: voices from the TV talking to him and he thought we had put something on the radio against him and walking down the beach with him there was a beach seal and he thought my friend can drag it out there for him to see you know stuff like that and I started feeling kind of crazy hanging out with him too much
[SPEAKER_03]: I'd start to feel like what I could discern reality and I'd see patterns where there weren't any.
[SPEAKER_03]: In my opinion, as conspiracy theories are like a form of form of that.
[SPEAKER_01]: I know people like that, or new people like that.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm for real.
[SPEAKER_01]: I can relate.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: Anyways, yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_03]: So you're turned.
[SPEAKER_01]: So that goes, more number one, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: Almost done.
[SPEAKER_01]: So kind of covered some of it already, but my number one is what we don't know.
[SPEAKER_01]: And some other questions that I had that came out of this was, why was Amy having the recurring dream about being one of Fikyama's for Million?
[SPEAKER_01]: It seems like she's got some sort of psychic link to Admiral Fikyama.
[SPEAKER_03]: And was she reaching out to her?
[SPEAKER_03]: Or is there some latent power in herself?
[SPEAKER_03]: That's the right.
[SPEAKER_01]: Did she have powers that we don't know?
[SPEAKER_03]: Just be one person like with Melanie, you know, it could have been a bit or Melanie, but yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I don't know that she had any powers because she was, because David was adopted and as far as we know, she didn't have any powers or anything to speak of, but it seems clear that there was some sort of link because then those, those things came out with autonomy had his hands on Lenny and was seeing her memories.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think those were just remnants of what
[SPEAKER_01]: was in her what was in Amy's mind after Lenny had taken over when he sees those flashes and then we see it and then we hear her talk about it before Oliver and fruit come in and do what they did to her.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I'm curious if we'll get some more information about that and what that exactly what that means and my other questions are already talked about like what's for explain why is he doing what he's doing, why would he
[SPEAKER_01]: Do what he did and how is he expecting David to respond and yeah, we've covered all of that as far as like some of the comic stuff if he's trying to get David to reach his full potential.
[SPEAKER_01]: So those are just questions what we don't know.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not really helpful at all.
[SPEAKER_01]: Just things that I'm hoping that they come out of this and other questions that we have hopefully we'll get answers to.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, yeah, I want all the answers all of all the answers.
[SPEAKER_01]: We're gonna we're gonna get them know a holly promised I got that direct lie notes
[SPEAKER_01]: So talk a little bit about the music where he's talked about Tom Petty's don't come around here no more that was performed by series composer Jeff Russo and Noah Holly.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I found that when we were saying whether we thought anyways, all right, that's awesome.
[SPEAKER_01]: Wait, we talked about it, but it wasn't the time.
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, got it, got it.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, that's really good.
[SPEAKER_01]: Time is now.
[SPEAKER_03]: I love it.
[SPEAKER_03]: So what was he doing?
[SPEAKER_03]: Do you know what?
[SPEAKER_03]: No, Hollywood was he playing an instrumenter?
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know, they didn't say, just said that it was performed by Jefferson, Noah, Noah, Holly himself, and I thought, oh shit, I don't know if he's saying, I don't know if he played an instrument, I don't know what he did, because that was the only tidbit of information I could find.
[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe I'll find out more.
[SPEAKER_01]: We also had the Velva Underground's heroine that played during Oliver and Fridge Drive, that played there in the beginning when it transitioned from, because I love how they're doing these transitions.
[SPEAKER_01]: and going into the opening credits because it went from, you know, we have that opener with Lenny and then it goes into the desert with fruit and all over.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I really like the music choices that they have and then they had cow powers where wolf and they're digging up the body.
[SPEAKER_01]: Some really great, great music that they're
[SPEAKER_01]: that they're doing.
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, some lines.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, that submarine don't at car.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's like the best thing ever.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I want to drive one like now.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, why are we talking more about that?
[SPEAKER_01]: I want to drive that thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: I remind me of the Oscar Meyer weiner.
[SPEAKER_01]: Um,
[SPEAKER_01]: They say around, I love that thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: What the hell was it doing in the desert?
[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe that's another question.
[SPEAKER_01]: What we don't know.
[SPEAKER_01]: Why the hell is that?
[SPEAKER_01]: I just aren't in the desert.
[SPEAKER_03]: Amy, the desert is D. Three's place to, like I said, push things out of the way.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think it's like the widest protection.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, they bury bodies there and they, yeah, it's like total dumbfuck nowhere, witness protection.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, very, just very weird.
[SPEAKER_03]: Trying to keep a safe failed because they had guards even, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: So, and then the guards disappeared.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: Poof.
[SPEAKER_01]: Ash.
[SPEAKER_01]: Only ground on.
[SPEAKER_01]: Sorry.
[SPEAKER_01]: I won't say that word anymore.
[SPEAKER_01]: Those were all my notes.
[SPEAKER_01]: We're pretty much covered everything else.
[SPEAKER_01]: All my other notes that I have.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay, my only other one is you mentioned that they had this discussion about morality.
[SPEAKER_03]: So all over, it's like morality, both of you.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then he goes, the electrons that make up this car were part of a star once.
[SPEAKER_03]: A star that exploded billions of years ago, killing any in all life that may have existed on hundreds of planets.
[SPEAKER_03]: Or did it?
[SPEAKER_03]: My point, if those atoms still exist, they're holding this card together as we speak.
[SPEAKER_03]: And perhaps the idea of life and death is obscene.
[SPEAKER_03]: A little way it may be obscene, not obscene, but irrelevant.
[SPEAKER_03]: First off, it felt like the wrong person was talking there.
[SPEAKER_03]: It seemed like that would be something for who would say so.
[SPEAKER_03]: I wonder if that's just the show messing with us.
[SPEAKER_03]: Anyway, it reminded me, this is a little self-indulgent, but I used to think about this kind of stuff in college where I'd be like, what is the point of life and
[SPEAKER_03]: why should we be good people and why should we do you know what is why does anything mean anything and because I thought of it like if we're all just a collection of atoms that are rearranged in a certain specific way but it's sort of it feels like it could be anything like but what I've eventually got to was that
[SPEAKER_03]: we're capable of of suffering and that's enough reason to want to have empathy for people and not and try to alleviate or prevent suffering and and on the other side of that we have capability for joy and pleasure so to try and make more of that more more of the good feelings less of the bad
[SPEAKER_03]: So it's all, I don't know if this is making any sense, but I just started to get really disassociated with the human condition, thinking that it's all just kind of arbitrary and we're all just collections of atoms.
[SPEAKER_03]: But when you get down to the way that we are organized and that we function is that because there is a capacity for suffering, and I know it's like suffer that I should not want to have other people have that experience.
[SPEAKER_03]: Or animals too, I mean, I was a vegetarian at the time.
[SPEAKER_04]: Ah.
[SPEAKER_03]: It kind of, yeah, I wonder if they were if this dialogue here came about because of similar.
[SPEAKER_03]: It seems like he's right on the same page with where I was when I used to think about this stuff I hadn't thought about in a long time, but totally brought that up for me.
[SPEAKER_03]: I just don't know why Oliver was saying it not for root because it seems like something for root would say.
[SPEAKER_01]: Hmm.
[SPEAKER_01]: Interesting.
[SPEAKER_03]: Anyways.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, it's all of it.
[SPEAKER_03]: Anything that's what we get with all of this.
[SPEAKER_03]: Anything else you want to say about it?
[SPEAKER_03]: I think we did damn good job.
[SPEAKER_01]: No, I know.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know what else to say.
[SPEAKER_01]: I just, um, I don't know what's happening.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm just going to keep watching.
[SPEAKER_03]: No, we, we, we, we nailed it.
[SPEAKER_03]: We just, there's questions.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think the questions that we have are the ones that we're supposed to have.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think.
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.
[SPEAKER_01]: I know there's it's okay having questions.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm comfortable with that.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, comfortable not knowing.
[SPEAKER_01]: I really ain't just, you know, I sit there and I watch and I'm like, I don't know if what I'm watching is real or if it's relevant.
[SPEAKER_01]: Is it just, are they just messing with this?
[SPEAKER_01]: Does it mean something?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I don't know what to make of half of that.
[SPEAKER_03]: What bothers me is if I'm watching a show and I don't get it, but I think I'm probably supposed to, and I'm just not smart enough, you know, versus I think this show does a good job of, you know, there's definitely things that we're supposed to wonder about, but they just haven't given us enough information.
[SPEAKER_03]: And there's things that we're supposed to think we know, but maybe we're wrong.
[SPEAKER_03]: But then there's a lot of things that I think they really want us to understand.
[SPEAKER_03]: And, you know, because they're giving these little revelations and things, especially with plenty, I feel like they really fleshed out what the hell is going on with plenty.
[SPEAKER_03]: A lot more of this episode, so that maybe feel good, because you get to understand a little bit more, but not everything, you know, we don't want to be given the whole shabang, but a little here and there is nice.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I am glad for more Aubrey Plaza and Lenny.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think I'm seeing more I think of what I think more true Lenny than what we've seen.
[SPEAKER_01]: And since we were introduced to her in season one, so that was nice.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's also nice though, just counterpoint to that.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'll replace a has gotten to play a lot of different things because there's been different manifestations of whatever's animating her.
[SPEAKER_03]: Last season when she was being, I think, controlled by the shadow king.
[SPEAKER_03]: There were some really good moments there too, where she wasn't this tweaked out addict, but she was more of a game's master or that psychologist or whatever.
[SPEAKER_01]: When she, when they went all black and white in silent movie and They did that whole scene in the hallway I mean that was just some of the most brilliant stuff I've ever seen I just I mean if I didn't love Legion before which that was kind of later in the season and season one I mean I was already totally hooked by the first episode But I mean it was just like I just didn't think they could take me anywhere else and then they started this
[SPEAKER_01]: silent movie thing like the monster returns or and then she you know she's doing the little signal with the gun in her it was scary back then to yeah yeah there was some more scary elements but that that whole thing she got to do is brilliant of course you know the writing and and cinematography everything was just brilliant and yeah beautiful things that we could see so I'm hoping we could see more of that like it
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, so this week on news, some really interesting news that came out this week.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is from cbr.com.
[SPEAKER_01]: FX has expanded the second season of Legion with the addition of an eleventh episode.
[SPEAKER_01]: So the season will now end on June twelfth with chapter nineteen written by series creator Noah Hawley and directed by Keith Gordon, who's also directed episodes of Fargo and Homeland.
[SPEAKER_01]: The announcement arrived ahead of last night's episode chapter thirteen, which brings the season to the midway point.
[SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, we're now halfway
[SPEAKER_01]: have way there.
[SPEAKER_01]: So what are your thoughts?
[SPEAKER_01]: Do you think this is good news or bad news?
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, I think it's great news.
[SPEAKER_03]: The only thing is I'm doing three podcasts right now.
[SPEAKER_03]: And I'm like, I could use a break, but I want more Legion.
[SPEAKER_03]: I love Legion.
[SPEAKER_03]: So I'm just shoving that stupid petty reason down and being happy.
[SPEAKER_03]: It makes me wonder if they must have plotted it out, but they miscalculated.
[SPEAKER_03]: That happens in comics all the time, by the way.
[SPEAKER_03]: They say it's going to be a certain amount of issues, and they're like, oh, we're expanding it because we needed more space to tell our story.
[SPEAKER_03]: So I think that's great.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, I think it's great.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I was initially very happy and excited because I'm like you, more Legion.
[SPEAKER_01]: Great.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think maybe they maybe need an extra episode to tell the story that they're telling and knowing that we're only at the halfway point.
[SPEAKER_01]: However, I did get a little bit concerned that ratings are not so great right now.
[SPEAKER_01]: And with this.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, ratings are down compared to season one and they've continuously gone down for season two.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't keep up much on ratings.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't try to pay too much attention to it because I know that I love it and but I should be concerned because if I love it and other people are not in the ratings suck.
[SPEAKER_01]: That is a good reason for them to cancel it and I really worry that this I mean filming has been over I mean this this has been wrapped in the bag for a while Wow, and they have an and they have an announced a season three No, so you're saying you think they might want to just wrap up the whole thing Yeah, my fear is that they've added this last episode to wrap the series up because they're fearful of being I'm quitting podcast.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't want to be hurt again
[SPEAKER_03]: there's too many shows like there's just too many shows so that the audience gets split I mean I think numbers are down for everything
[SPEAKER_01]: They are.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know what everyone else is watching, but I don't know what the hell else is on Tuesdays that everybody's watching.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not watching anything else, but Legion.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm podcasting and then I'm watching Legion right after.
[SPEAKER_01]: So come on, people will go watch Legion.
[SPEAKER_01]: Get those ratings back up because that's what I'm fearful for because like I said, this should have been filmed like this whole season, too, was filmed in rap months ago.
[SPEAKER_01]: So why would they just announce?
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, maybe they say this late date and they haven't filmed it.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know but it's possible that they filmed a lot of stuff and when they're cutting it together the episodes they couldn't shorten them enough and they had enough material to make another episode out of it sometimes that happens
[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe.
[SPEAKER_01]: Anything is positive.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm kind of stretching, but yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: Anything is possible.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm open to anything positive at this point, because once I was thinking that route, I thought, why would they do this?
[SPEAKER_01]: Why would they add something?
[SPEAKER_01]: And then when I start reading a little bit about ratings and that maybe this isn't such a great thing after all, and that this could potentially be a wrap up for season two that they're winning, because they're going to be canceled.
[SPEAKER_01]: then that wouldn't be such a great thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I don't know.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to try to remain positive and just hope that it carries on because it's a freaking brilliant show.
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, okay.
[SPEAKER_01]: So yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, if it doesn't, then it's a good thing that they do want to wrap it up because there's nothing worse than a show that abruptly ends right in the middle with no warning to the creators.
[SPEAKER_03]: Right.
[SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then you're left.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's the silver lining.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: If that's happened.
[SPEAKER_01]: If it doesn't happen.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't want it to end.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh my gosh, I will be I love this show so much.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm so wrapped up in the show that I will be terribly sad.
[SPEAKER_01]: But yeah, if they're at least thinking that because yeah, you're right.
[SPEAKER_01]: There's nothing worse than all of a sudden you think that it's there's more story to tell and they leave it with more story to tell.
[SPEAKER_01]: It was ends.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, like deadwood.
[SPEAKER_03]: I never saw but I was here people or fucking firefly.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah, there's a big one.
[SPEAKER_01]: Everybody knows about that one.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, exactly.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I don't know.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm gonna try to remain positive, but I did try to, I thought, man, why don't I have to think too much?
[SPEAKER_01]: You should just stay positive.
[SPEAKER_01]: Stop if you're turning your damn brain off.
[SPEAKER_01]: Stop being a pessimist.
[SPEAKER_01]: So the next item that we have is from Gothamist.com.
[SPEAKER_01]: And this comes from an interview with Noah Hawley.
[SPEAKER_01]: We don't see too many of these.
[SPEAKER_01]: So this was fun.
[SPEAKER_01]: to look at.
[SPEAKER_01]: So they're asking him, they said, how concerned are you about holding the audience's hand?
[SPEAKER_01]: Is there a line where you feel like things may get too far out or do you even worry about that?
[SPEAKER_01]: He says, nope, he said, I worry about it.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think my goal is to really focus on characters much as possible with the idea that if you're invested in these people, you're invested in the story.
[SPEAKER_01]: Obviously, we're not a plot driven show.
[SPEAKER_01]: An episode of Legion doesn't add up to this happened and then this happened.
[SPEAKER_01]: A lot of it is the experience of the show and trying to put you in David's shoes.
[SPEAKER_01]: And whenever you have a subjective show about someone who sees the world differently, you're going to see the world differently.
[SPEAKER_01]: But obviously, I worry to the degree that I sometimes tell the story that I want people to enjoy and follow, but I also have confidence from season one that the audience is willing to spend their need for answers as long as they trust that they're going to get them eventually.
[SPEAKER_01]: Next question they ask is how much did you adjust your storytelling process heading into season two?
[SPEAKER_01]: How much did you think about changing it?
[SPEAKER_01]: He says, I've said that I've never made a second season of anything, which is true to the degree that I've never continued to story into a second season.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so honestly, I didn't really have a strong sense of how to simply continue the story as funny as that might sound.
[SPEAKER_01]: For a show that is attempting to get below the surface of a complicated mind, it just didn't seem like we went from confusion to clarity in season one, and we're just going to live in clarity now.
[SPEAKER_01]: I tend to build a story from a base of ideas in.
[SPEAKER_01]: So there's a lot that goes in before the actual action of the story is figured out.
[SPEAKER_01]: What is the story about this year?
[SPEAKER_01]: I had a feeling I wanted the show to be a little more serious this year because I do feel it's important to invest the audience in the characters.
[SPEAKER_01]: And the way to do that is really.
[SPEAKER_01]: And the way to do that is to really raise the stakes of the story, certainly for David and Sid and their love story.
[SPEAKER_01]: I really think what drives the show for most people is wanting that love to be real and wanting that relationship to work.
[SPEAKER_01]: So they asked about, they said, why do you think so many superhero shows in end up being so conventional and cookie cutter?
[SPEAKER_01]: Holly says, my feeling is that maybe that the majority of comic book stories are more interested in entertainment than exploration, but the genre itself is capable of real depth and innovation and my goal was to test those boundaries and see how much can I reconstruct the story, how much can I play with the structure while still keeping it grounded emotionally?
[SPEAKER_01]: And you ask about whether or not I'm worried about losing the audience?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, we all lead busy lives with very little time to commit things.
[SPEAKER_01]: And if the show feels like too much work, if it requires too much for me to track everything, I would imagine a lot of people will drop out after a certain point.
[SPEAKER_01]: So my goal has to become that each hour has some critically entertaining or compelling or mind-blowing element to it that's going to keep pulling you through because I guarantee you in the end it all pays off.
[SPEAKER_03]: I love all that, like playing with structure while keeping it grounded in emotion is right at my alley, love it.
[SPEAKER_03]: I want new and fresh things, but he said character and experienced focused versus plot focused.
[SPEAKER_03]: I just, yeah, you're just spelling out reasons that I didn't even realize why I love the show.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's got so brilliant.
[SPEAKER_01]: I would just love to have conversation with this guy.
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, not everyone likes that.
[SPEAKER_03]: Like people like these procedures, these cop shows or because they have intricate plots with twists and things and I can understand that, but I'm more into like these weird mind blowing things and also, yeah, just getting to know the characters really well and caring about them.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, there's a lot more to that interview but that's the pieces that I cut out.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's a really great interview with him and he really kind of goes into a lot of it and it's brilliant.
[SPEAKER_01]: I love every interview that I've read of him and he's got a lot of interesting things to say and I just love him.
[SPEAKER_01]: I wonder if he's single.
[SPEAKER_01]: The next item that I have is from the Daily Beast.
[SPEAKER_01]: This was an interview with Aubrey Plaza.
[SPEAKER_01]: As she says, I think it was really kind of traumatic for me to experience that transition as Lenny says.
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's from her character's fall from the height of lunacy in season one to the powerless wreck she is now.
[SPEAKER_01]: She says, you know, we don't get the scripts and advance that much.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I'm kind of flailing around on the astral plane, trying to ground myself in something real.
[SPEAKER_01]: And you kind of never know what's real and what's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: It was a really different experience to go inward and find the vulnerable side of Lenny and let all the other stuff fall away.
[SPEAKER_01]: So she said they say Lenny's shapeshifter quality and showrunner Noah Holley's reliably last minute scripts require that she essentially play according to her.
[SPEAKER_01]: multiple characters with one role which I've never really gotten to do.
[SPEAKER_01]: I feel I've pushed that to the max in every different situation on the show.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm always interested in coming up with a different look in a different version of Lenny because when you have something that's so open to interpretation and not grounded in reality you can really really let your imagination go.
[SPEAKER_01]: She said they say Lenny now has half the DNA of David's poor sister in her body and likely another voice in her head and she says it's a really confusing time for her.
[SPEAKER_03]: that's interesting another voice in her head maybe that's Amy's consciousness or it could just be sort of remnants of her psyche or something like that.
[SPEAKER_01]: I bet.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then just another little interesting tip that came out this last week is the mystery writers of America announced the twenty-eighteen Edgar award winners at the Edgar Allan Poe award winners and Noah Hawley for a one for best television episode tell play for the episode somebody to love from Fargo.
[SPEAKER_01]: So that that was pretty cool.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's pretty prestigious.
[SPEAKER_01]: Those Edgar awards.
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, um, it's shoot, who plays Sid?
[SPEAKER_01]: Rachel Keller.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, she was a big character in Fargo season two.
[SPEAKER_03]: Totally totally different.
[SPEAKER_03]: She's a bad girl.
[SPEAKER_01]: I still need to, well, I've seen the movie, but I have not had a chance yet to, it's on my list, like, every about thirty other shows are on my list, and that's definitely, especially because I love Noah Holly so much.
[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe that'll be the next one we've had.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, those are each season is its own story, and I think you might, like, number three the best, actually.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's got, it went with the record.
[SPEAKER_01]: You're a recorder.
[SPEAKER_03]: Mm-hmm.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, you're a recorder fan.
[SPEAKER_01]: I can dig that.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so that's it for the news.
[SPEAKER_03]: Awesome.
[SPEAKER_03]: All right, let's get into the listener feedback.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'll start Steve Brown says love the apparently on Legion instead of previously.
[SPEAKER_03]: Aubrey Plaza no need to say more.
[SPEAKER_03]: I want to I wonder what he would have said if he would have said more.
[SPEAKER_03]: I would like to date her.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think that's what he would have said Steve.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'd I insist you elaborate.
[SPEAKER_03]: And then he says it's always five somewhere.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yep.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm drinking some whiskey right now.
[SPEAKER_01]: I have that clock.
[SPEAKER_01]: That was my role.
[SPEAKER_01]: Jose C. Jimenez says, damn, dude.
[SPEAKER_01]: As soon as they showed his sister after making such a big deal about Lenny's eyes, I was just thinking, no, no, no, no, damn.
[SPEAKER_01]: And hearing his sister scream while she was being transformed, oh man, is the sister's psyche now held within that gun or is it trapped in the head with Lenny or with the shadow king?
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm assuming she can be switched back, and this is what pushed David to kill for, for Rook.
[SPEAKER_01]: All the other things I'm wondering is, why doesn't Oliver resist the shadow king a bit?
[SPEAKER_01]: When the shadow king was inside David, we would get David and shadow king, and the struggle is what made David appear crazy.
[SPEAKER_01]: With Oliver, however, the shadow king is in complete control of the body.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oliver saying that he was going to kill him is the only bit of resistance, unless Oliver is just playing along to find the body to get him out and be able to actually kill the shadow king.
[SPEAKER_01]: Anyways, amazing episode.
[SPEAKER_03]: I've been unsure, but I think in season one it was said or implied or something that the shadow king was getting stronger and stronger the whole time David was growing up.
[SPEAKER_03]: So maybe he's strong enough now to have more control over a body.
[SPEAKER_03]: Also, maybe it's that Oliver just responds differently to this kind of thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oliver, I don't know.
[SPEAKER_01]: We know exactly how strong he is.
[SPEAKER_01]: He is.
[SPEAKER_01]: I know we've been told the powerful mutant in his own right, but when you look at how the shadow king fed off of David because he was such a powerful mutant and he fed off of that and that energy versus how he's kind of feeding off of Oliver who isn't as strong as David and maybe that there's a difference there.
[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe Oliver can't fight him as much as what David is because he's not as strong as David.
[SPEAKER_03]: and David didn't consciously know that the shadow king was in there either and I think Oliver does so that changes the dynamic somewhat I think Oliver's also the type of guy who likes to keep his composure no matter how he's feeling so it's interesting yeah I mean I see what I see your point but I think it would be kind of boring if they did exactly the same thing anyways with a different person so I like they're presenting it in a new way
[SPEAKER_03]: Mate Vivo says, I found David's discussion about silent slash quiet, amazing.
[SPEAKER_03]: This episode took me back to the first episode of an introduction about the desert maze.
[SPEAKER_03]: Looking forward to hearing how you think the device works.
[SPEAKER_03]: I kind of wonder if the Dead Sea Donuts was a play on having dessert in the desert.
[SPEAKER_03]: maybe.
[SPEAKER_03]: But this device, I think you just extract someone's maybe DNA or something from the flesh that can make it so that it can then inject that pattern onto another body to make the other body take the form and it probably injects some other qualities like memories and things like that, something like that.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's it's a DNA merger and that's as far as I know about how I think this thing works.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't have the slightest because I thought it was really interesting.
[SPEAKER_01]: We got a little peek at some of the other devices.
[SPEAKER_01]: Did you happen to look at some of the other?
[SPEAKER_01]: It was really quick shot, but I couldn't carry me to all though.
[SPEAKER_01]: Sure.
[SPEAKER_01]: Why not?
[SPEAKER_01]: He probably made that little sphere to that David was in.
[SPEAKER_01]: But I thought, and I'd have to go back and watch again, and maybe pause the screen.
[SPEAKER_01]: I just never have time for this stuff.
[SPEAKER_01]: It looked like there was something, what, what the heck is that thing?
[SPEAKER_01]: Professor X wears on his head.
[SPEAKER_01]: I could have swore I saw something that went on their head like when he's in.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, a cerebral.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_01]: It looked like something like that in there.
[SPEAKER_01]: I thought that was whether or not that was the one.
[SPEAKER_03]: If it was, then they use it to find other mutants.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I don't think that's really what it was.
[SPEAKER_01]: I just think maybe if there was something that looks similar to that, it was probably just supposed to be a nice little tie in because they always try to kind of tie in just a little bit.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, or they do the versions of things.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so I don't know that that was kind of cool.
[SPEAKER_01]: Anyway, next one is from Abby.
[SPEAKER_01]: Is it Reese?
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to say that.
[SPEAKER_01]: Sorry, that's wrong.
[SPEAKER_01]: She says, hey guys, regarding the phone, pointer fingers in the sky outside of division three.
[SPEAKER_01]: You guys spoke of them during last week's podcast for chapter eleven.
[SPEAKER_01]: I've been paying close attention to these fingers.
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you.
[SPEAKER_01]: In one of these scenes, I can't remember which episode, but I think it's episode three.
[SPEAKER_01]: It is clearly seen that they are present throughout the entire sky pointing in different directions, not just at David.
[SPEAKER_01]: What's interesting to me is that in the previous episodes we've seen them specifically last week when he was on the roof with the monk, the sky was crystal clear and sunny.
[SPEAKER_01]: This week when we see the carries run to the roof after everyone is awoken from the plague, I noticed that the sun was still out, but the sky was very cloudy and almost completely obscuring the green fingers.
[SPEAKER_01]: All that could be seen was blobs of occluded green.
[SPEAKER_01]: Could this have something to do with the fact that in this episode, David wasn't awake, and maybe somehow the sky fingers reflect his mental status.
[SPEAKER_01]: If so, what does that say about division three?
[SPEAKER_01]: Could it mean that the whole setting is another plane that David can access?
[SPEAKER_01]: I can't get enough of this show, and I look forward to hearing both of your analysis each week.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't have anyone else on my astral plane who watches this show, so I depend on you guys for hashing things out.
[SPEAKER_03]: all of some things Abby that's a really great observation about the fingers I was paying attention but I will admit I wasn't paying that close attention make sense though I've never seen one of these and I think you guys are all conspiring to mess with me and there's never been any green fingers in this show and everybody writing in is part of a conspiracy no I've never sat you down that rabbit hole so you believe in conspiracy theories
[SPEAKER_03]: So that sounds interesting.
[SPEAKER_03]: I like the sky being cloudy is a reflection of David's state of mind.
[SPEAKER_03]: As far as all of division three, being a setting that's another plane, I don't think that's true.
[SPEAKER_03]: That would be pretty far out.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I don't know that I go that far, but I do like the thought of the sky cloudy, obscuring the green fingers versus sunny, and his mental clarity, and maybe where he's at mentally, that I think could be a pretty cool connection.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm kind of obsessed with those green fingers.
[SPEAKER_01]: I can't stop thinking about him.
[SPEAKER_01]: I was wondering, even watching this up suddenly.
[SPEAKER_01]: And we're gonna see the green fingers.
[SPEAKER_01]: We're gonna see him again.
[SPEAKER_01]: No, there was not.
[SPEAKER_03]: I didn't see any, but I hope they show up again.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't want it to just be somewhere thing that never gets brought up again.
[SPEAKER_03]: All right, that's our show episode thirteen.
[SPEAKER_03]: Thank you for listening everybody.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, thanks everyone.
[SPEAKER_03]: If you guys are not watching Westworld, I forget have I mentioned that on this podcast before?
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, you may have because it kind of I mean, if you because if you do like this show and you're not watching Westworld, I mean, talk about my research on my Westworld podcast now I'm going to pitch Westworld because
[SPEAKER_03]: Legion's more playful and it's more of a fun show but Westworld is dramatic and epic and it's about these endroids that appear human and sometimes you don't know which is which so it feels like Legion because you're not sure what's real and it also plays with time and a lot of mystery and revelations and it's very deep and
[SPEAKER_03]: I imagine just about everyone watching Legion is probably already watching Westworld, but if you're not, I highly recommend you check it out and then you're going to need a podcast to figure it out.
[SPEAKER_03]: So luckily we have, if you go to Westworldcast.com, it's me and my friend David who is, it's so good.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's so good.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's so good.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's so
[SPEAKER_01]: No, I was so glad when you had asked me to help you with fear the walking dead and not Westworld because I would have been like, I'm sorry, I'm sick too, I can't do that.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm sick to be honest.
[SPEAKER_03]: I got sick and I had to choose one and I might have picked walking dead cast to go and do and get help on Westworld because walking dead cast gets more downloads and everything and there was a big episode this week because of a big character moment.
[SPEAKER_03]: But I was like, who's going to go to Westworld?
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know who would want to do that.
[SPEAKER_01]: I would have been like, I'm still feeling this like myself.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay, if you guys want to write to us, if you want to get in touch with us, you can email or it would be awesome to if you'd send a voice message.
[SPEAKER_03]: I would love to play more calls on this podcast, but either way, you can send text or voice to Legionatpodcastica.com.
[SPEAKER_01]: You can find us on the web at facebook.com slash legion pod.
[SPEAKER_03]: Be sure to check out our other shows at podcast to get dot com.
[SPEAKER_03]: I know you guys are starting a lost in space.
[SPEAKER_03]: Have you started that yet on strangers this week.
[SPEAKER_01]: We are starting with lost in space.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay, have you so you watched it?
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, you watched it first episode.
[SPEAKER_03]: How was it the first episode?
[SPEAKER_01]: It was really good.
[SPEAKER_01]: I liked it.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_03]: It looked looked pretty cool.
[SPEAKER_03]: I actually haven't seen yet, but I think it's good.
[SPEAKER_01]: Put a lot of family.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think there's some really, yeah, I think they've put some many into it.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think what's different maybe Stranger Things maybe you can probably watch for family depending on what your kids can handle because some there are some elements that can be pretty scary on Stranger Things.
[SPEAKER_01]: But this is definitely I think you can watch with the family.
[SPEAKER_01]: So that's not a little bit different that we, we haven't done yet.
[SPEAKER_03]: All right.
[SPEAKER_03]: That is our show.
[SPEAKER_01]: Thanks for listening.
[SPEAKER_03]: Do you have any adder all by the way, or Robotussin?
[SPEAKER_01]: I got some liquid paper here at my desk.
[SPEAKER_01]: I sniff it every day.