[SPEAKER_00]: This episode is presented by Yahoo Fantasy.
[SPEAKER_00]: Welcome everyone to SI Media with Jimmy Trainer.
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you so much for listening.
[SPEAKER_00]: You will love this week's show.
[SPEAKER_00]: We've got Brian Curtis from the Bringer.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm about regulars.
[SPEAKER_00]: Brian was an outstanding in discussing the latest sports media news, obviously big news.
[SPEAKER_00]: From the past week, Fox and bar stool partnering up for their NFL, excuse me, college pregame show as well as a daily show on FS one.
[SPEAKER_00]: And the mornings get into the ESPN NFL media story.
[SPEAKER_00]: It looks like we're very close to ESPN acquiring NFL media, which includes red zone NFL network, get into that.
[SPEAKER_00]: And where baseball stands with their package that's still out there of something like baseball and the wild card round.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then we also we discussed
[SPEAKER_00]: CBS.
[SPEAKER_00]: canceling Stephen Colbert as well for the last, I don't know, ten, fifteen minutes of the pod and do little nostalgia on late night TV.
[SPEAKER_00]: So it was a great, great conversation with Brian Curtis.
[SPEAKER_00]: We don't have Sal in training for us this week as he told you last week, Sal is on his staycation.
[SPEAKER_00]: Sal on staycation.
[SPEAKER_00]: Try to say that quickly.
[SPEAKER_00]: But, and it's, you know, I'm a little pissed off because it would have been a great week for Sal.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's so much to discuss with him.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's a Billy Joel documentary on HBO.
[SPEAKER_00]: which it's not the worst thing that I don't have them this week because there's a part two coming up this Friday.
[SPEAKER_00]: So we'll discuss the entire thing when he's back next week.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's a lot to talk about with part one of that doc.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you haven't watched and I can't recommend that enough.
[SPEAKER_00]: You must watch it.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think it's called and so it goes.
[SPEAKER_00]: So on HBO Max, I'll do a full-blown discussion of it with sound next week.
[SPEAKER_00]: Obviously passing of Malcolm control, a mortar, the passing of Aussie, Osborne,
[SPEAKER_00]: We could have went into that and I had my first root canal ever on Monday.
[SPEAKER_00]: So we'll have a ton of topics with the sound next week.
[SPEAKER_00]: We can do a whole episode with the sound we'll see.
[SPEAKER_00]: But we don't have them this week.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's enjoying this vacation.
[SPEAKER_00]: Hopefully, no snakes.
[SPEAKER_00]: So this week, we give you Brian Curtis and believe me, you will be satisfied.
[SPEAKER_00]: Before we get to it, just a quick reminder.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you missed any recent episodes, Scott Hanson,
[SPEAKER_00]: the host of the NFL Red Zone, which we discussed on this week's show, Brian Curtis.
[SPEAKER_00]: He was on the podcast last week, and two weeks ago, great, great interview with Dan or Lasky from ESPN who recently resigned with the company.
[SPEAKER_00]: So check those out.
[SPEAKER_00]: Make sure you subscribe to this podcast.
[SPEAKER_00]: Hit that subscribe button.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's very important.
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[SPEAKER_00]: And if you want to send in any emails for me to read and answer on the podcast, send them into Jimmy.traina at sight.com.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's a dot there between first and last name.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think I may have said it wrong last week.
[SPEAKER_00]: So some of you may have sent emails and someone else has them.
[SPEAKER_00]: But for me, it's Jimmy.traina at sight.com.
[SPEAKER_00]: All right, let's get to it.
[SPEAKER_00]: from the ringer and the pressbox podcast on all the latest sports media news, Brian Curtis, all right here right now on SI media with Jimmy Trana.
[SPEAKER_00]: All right, joining me now.
[SPEAKER_00]: You guys always love it when he comes on SI media podcast regular from the ringer editor at large.
[SPEAKER_00]: And of course, the pressbox podcast, he's Brian Curtis.
[SPEAKER_00]: Brian, how are you?
[SPEAKER_00]: I always love it when I come on.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's great to see Jimmy.
[SPEAKER_00]: I appreciate that.
[SPEAKER_00]: Great to see you.
[SPEAKER_00]: Are you in a vacation spot?
[SPEAKER_00]: Looks very good.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm a Connecticut.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's my East Coast residency for a lot of weeks.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to go to Bristol and yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: I've been already exploring all the beautiful lunch options around the Yisping and Campus.
[SPEAKER_01]: Still working on finding the perfect place.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to talk to Stephen A. Pat McAfee who was talking to me.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't believe they're here in Bristol, Jimmy, but I'll keep it out for him.
[SPEAKER_00]: Stephen A's been on vacation.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's been like three days since I've read a story about him.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's crazy.
[SPEAKER_00]: I hope he's on right.
[SPEAKER_00]: Probably on what's drawn.
[SPEAKER_00]: All right.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, let's start there, Bristol, um, because there's sort of a player in this, the biggest sports media story of the past week was the announcement FS one in bar stool and Fox sports and FS one, then bar stool teaming up.
[SPEAKER_00]: Let me start with this.
[SPEAKER_00]: I said this on Twitter.
[SPEAKER_00]: If people follow me there, I'm way more intrigued by the daily FS one part of this than the pre game show part of this.
[SPEAKER_00]: Because in NFL, a college football pregame show, there's only so much that can be done.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's only so much of a reinvention of the wheel.
[SPEAKER_00]: It sounds like Portner is going to go on there and play a big ten in Michigan versus Ohio State.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I'm intrigued to see if the daily eight a.m.
[SPEAKER_00]: to ten a.m.
[SPEAKER_00]: Eastern Show can provide any sort of competition to ESPN.
[SPEAKER_00]: You take on that.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, I think it's first interesting to say that living in L.A.
[SPEAKER_01]: as I do, you know, I go over to Pico Boulevard and Fox headquarters as much as I go anywhere just because it's local.
[SPEAKER_01]: And over the years, I have barely heard an executive or honor a person or anybody over their mentioned FS one.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, mention, I mean, the energy always seems to be about big foxes, about super bulls, about college football, it's about the world series.
[SPEAKER_01]: They love Colin Coward.
[SPEAKER_01]: They love Nick Wright, but just in terms of the intrigues and the daily lineups for all the stories we get about this one, for all the awful announcing things we see about FS one, it to me has always been a much smaller part of Fox Sports's pie.
[SPEAKER_01]: Then I think people from the outside might understand.
[SPEAKER_01]: So when I saw this, I'm like, oh, well, this is at least then paying attention to FS one.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is them trying to do something interesting here.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, let's be honest, could you name the cast of the facility before that show was canceled?
[SPEAKER_00]: No, no.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, it's funny you say that because I'm in total agreement there, which that's what made my frustration about the fact that FS-One would air the NLC or ALCS.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's such, listen.
[SPEAKER_00]: Whether it's reality of perception, my perception has always been as that FS one is low rent.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then baseball's biggest series is on there.
[SPEAKER_00]: And it just made baseball look bad.
[SPEAKER_00]: That was always how I thought of it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe low rent is a little harsh, but like you said, I can tell you this.
[SPEAKER_00]: I write a column every single day.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't think I've ever written about one person on any FS one day time show.
[SPEAKER_00]: Because, you know, they are what they are.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't, I know people will say, oh, what's the difference between that and Steven A?
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, but first take we'll have on Brian Winhorse and reporters, you know, I don't know what those FS-one shows that we're supposed to be.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I actually think FS-one, in that case, needs barcel, more than barcel, needs FS-one.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, I think you really make a good argument for that, absolutely.
[SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, it feels like what they're doing is channeling podcasters in the same way that ESPN did with McAfee, and really that the whole media is right now, coming off the election like we did.
[SPEAKER_01]: What do we hear over and over again, whether you're a political person or not, the energy is in podcast.
[SPEAKER_01]: The energy is in these people that have captured an audience.
[SPEAKER_01]: And yes, sometimes they will say things and make everybody mad.
[SPEAKER_01]: That make media columns for people like you and me.
[SPEAKER_01]: But that's where the energy is.
[SPEAKER_01]: What you do is you put them on TV and you hope that some of their audience comes over with you.
[SPEAKER_01]: Now that brings us to the second question here, which is, is any stooly going to buy a cable subscription to see their guys on FS one?
[SPEAKER_01]: And FS one was on our excuse me, bar stool was on serious for quite a while.
[SPEAKER_01]: How many people do you think bought a subscription to satellite radio to hear the programming there?
[SPEAKER_01]: So you see, do you have a bridge?
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that needs to be crossed between podcast world and in this case, linear television.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's funny to say that a macophie was on serious as well, which a lot of people forget.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, I did a male bear column for SI.com on Wednesday.
[SPEAKER_00]: And a question came in, do you think, you know, bar stool can help FS one put a dent into ESPN in terms of the daily show?
[SPEAKER_00]: And my thought on that is simply, you have to sort of get out of that thinking in, in,
[SPEAKER_00]: because that show is going to be about clips, social media, YouTube.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's not going to be people putting on channel, whatever, five, eighty, three on Verizon Fios at eight a.m.
[SPEAKER_00]: in the morning.
[SPEAKER_00]: It to me, it's similar to late night, which is ironic, because we can get into sort of Colbert later, but late night, and that
[SPEAKER_00]: time slide in the morning for sports.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's the same situation.
[SPEAKER_00]: No one's very few people are home in their houses sitting on their couches watching those shows live.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's all about the clips, the clips, the clips.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I wouldn't look at it as can they put a dent into ESPN in terms of ratings.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, maybe they can.
[SPEAKER_00]: And you know, I think like they'll have higher ratings, maybe that was whatever they have before.
[SPEAKER_00]: They come into that time slot.
[SPEAKER_00]: But it's not just a TV play.
[SPEAKER_00]: People have to understand that.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and for FS-One, the first goal is just to get into the clips.
[SPEAKER_01]: The first goal is to become part of the conversation on social media, because as we said, it's not.
[SPEAKER_01]: I do want to direct you the college football part of this too, because there's a lot of people's radars a little bit, but Big noon Kickoff is a really interesting show, because college game date is the granddaddy of them all is the cash machine of cash machines.
[SPEAKER_01]: And they've been able to make some inroads there talking about Fox, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: They have a noon game every week that is their game in the week.
[SPEAKER_01]: We'll see this on August thirty at the big game and one of the biggest college football games the year is Texas versus Ohio State.
[SPEAKER_01]: Both pre-game shows ESPN and Fox will be there, but Fox has a little bit of an advantage because it is actually airing the game at new Easter time.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, they've been able to do this.
[SPEAKER_01]: Now, what are they trying to do here?
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, they've got a McAfee type character or characters in Dave Portnoy and Big Cat that they're going to put on there.
[SPEAKER_01]: And to me, there's a question of again, how much bar stool energy transfers over there?
[SPEAKER_01]: Are you going to have more rabid people behind the set?
[SPEAKER_01]: If you have port knowing Big Cat on there, I have no doubt that's the case.
[SPEAKER_01]: As it changed the ratings all that much, I don't know.
[SPEAKER_01]: But I do think there's an interesting question going forward with MacaFee and ESPN because that could end.
[SPEAKER_01]: at any time.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, would you be surprised if that relationship just stops it, you know, you're now two years from now six months, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: We could we could envision anything.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: And Matthew, if he really is a key to game day, like I think he is, especially as Lee Korsa goes away, he is the guy who's stirring up the crowd who is that great relationship with Nick Sabin on the set.
[SPEAKER_01]: He is part of that must watch.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I just think when you think larger about
[SPEAKER_01]: college pre game shows and the little bit of vulnerability maybe that game day has right now going forward or at least hypothetical vulnerability.
[SPEAKER_01]: That to me makes this story interesting too.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and like you said, of course, I was going to do the one game this year and be done.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I know for me, again, you know, and I always say this when I talk college football, I'm coming at this as a New Yorker.
[SPEAKER_00]: So my take on college football is going to be way different than people like you who are in hotbeds there with the teams you love and you know, big ten SEC and all that.
[SPEAKER_00]: My Saturday is, I want to watch Lee Corso give his pick and put on the head and do that bit.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like that's what I care about.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now that's going away.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think a big factor in this is age because people like you and me, we know what game day is, we know what the history is, whereas
[SPEAKER_00]: bar stool, portnoy, big cat coming into FS, uh, big noon kickoff, clearly a much younger audience will go to that than game day.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I don't know if someone who's eighteen to twenty five understands sort of the, or cares about the history of game day.
[SPEAKER_00]: So again, a situation where I think
[SPEAKER_00]: FS one needs Fox needs bar stool more than bar stool needs.
[SPEAKER_00]: But yes, listen, if Dave Portnoi and Dan Katzen can get on national television during a pregame show before no Ohio State Texas game, yes, that helps them.
[SPEAKER_00]: But overall,
[SPEAKER_00]: This should do nothing but help Fox.
[SPEAKER_00]: I would, I would guess.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I, and I don't want to overstate the game day thing either because they do have a lot of assets at ESPN, Herbie, McAfee, Sabin.
[SPEAKER_01]: They have the best college football inventory and it's not really even close to anybody else, including college football playoff in the final.
[SPEAKER_01]: So like, I don't want to overstate that.
[SPEAKER_01]: But I think when you think about pre game shows, part of what you think about is, why am I watching?
[SPEAKER_01]: Why am I going to watch to see if something happens?
[SPEAKER_01]: What's the clip I'm going to look at?
[SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, conventional college football analysis, as great as it may be, is probably not going to get you over that finish line all the time.
[SPEAKER_01]: So you just think of things that are unpredictable.
[SPEAKER_01]: Look, that's what, that's the formula of game day.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's course.
[SPEAKER_01]: So that's McAfee.
[SPEAKER_01]: And this is Fox trying to capture their own version of this.
[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, listen, I could even see it being as simple as, because this is how the TV business works.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I could see it as being as simple as,
[SPEAKER_00]: Fox saw every week last year how the McAfee field goal kick thing became it became a thing it became a thing it became a viral most weeks it people were tuning in it was getting a lot of buzz on social media and there's a fox executive sitting there saying we where are we on this and
[SPEAKER_00]: Boom, here's Dave Pornoi.
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, sometimes it's just something simple like that.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, that doesn't sound like most intricate idea in the world.
[SPEAKER_01]: You have some co-ed, kick a field going.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to pay him if they hit it.
[SPEAKER_01]: But it works.
[SPEAKER_01]: It was an awesome second.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: And it became something people wanted to watch every Saturday.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, if you're Fox two, don't overthink it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like
[SPEAKER_00]: have, importantly, do a pizza review every week from whatever city they're in.
[SPEAKER_00]: And a caterer than that bar stool crowd, you know, I, hopefully, Fox.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, actually, hopefully it doesn't matter to me, but if I was Fox, it'd be very careful about not, I would follow the bar stool way and not do it the Fox way with those guys.
[SPEAKER_01]: Use it what's the Fox way in the sense?
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know what the Foxway is because I don't like big noon kickoff doesn't really generate any sort of buzz.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I would think I think Fox thinks of itself though is not that different.
[SPEAKER_01]: then what you're talking about, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: They think of themselves going back to Terry and how we and Jimmy, you know, in the old days of the NFL pregame as the place where you're going to see wacky things, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: Where anything can happen.
[SPEAKER_01]: Now the media world has changed a lot since nineteen ninety four, but I think they think of themselves this that way.
[SPEAKER_01]: Now of course there's going to be when I say like the stuff people you and I write about, there are lots of downsides of bringing bar stool into the tent as well, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: You're going to have to own things that they do that are not on your air.
[SPEAKER_01]: and perhaps even stuff that they do on your air.
[SPEAKER_01]: And do you just ride that out, do you issue an apology every time?
[SPEAKER_01]: This is part of what ESPN's dealing with with macophie.
[SPEAKER_01]: And that can be everything from a headache to, as we've seen with macophie, a full-blown crisis.
[SPEAKER_01]: So that's something Fox executives have obviously thought about, but they're going to have to navigate week to week two.
[SPEAKER_00]: See, I don't think Fox executives care.
[SPEAKER_00]: I actually think they would embrace
[SPEAKER_00]: anything that would cost controversy or be considered offensive to some people, not others.
[SPEAKER_00]: We're as I think ESPN cares way more than Fox about that.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think Fox.
[SPEAKER_00]: They've made it clear like they don't care.
[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think you would think of that based on the reputation perhaps of the two entities.
[SPEAKER_01]: But again, just talking to Fox people again, that's a tends to be a very, very stable place, you know, a place that does not like to have giant intramural blowups.
[SPEAKER_01]: When we saw this when Joe and Troy left, you know, it was very shocking to people over there because nobody leaves, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: Like there's a lot of Terry and Howard still there.
[SPEAKER_01]: There's just a lot of consistency to Fox.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I think that could probably go either way.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, you touched on it.
[SPEAKER_00]: I do think if you're hard core media people like us, there is an interesting sort of spin-off with the story, it's sort of the turnaround of bar stool.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, there was a time where a network wouldn't think of getting in bed with them.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, that, I mean, that to me was an ESP.
[SPEAKER_01]: Why would you
[SPEAKER_00]: bring them on and cancel them after one show like to me that was a yes pianist you're more than that was not a barstable should but it the barstal controversies I know they had a big one with um... because macophie was involved to uh... the first two years ago that i don't know if the father is some nonsense or something like that but like to enroll us yeah but overall their controversies have plummeted compared to where they used to be i mean they've
[SPEAKER_00]: They've, I'm not gonna say they've got mainstream, but it does seem like in the last few years, they've avoided really major problems that they used to have fairly often.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know if I agree with that, or if the world has just changed in the way we perceive these things has changed.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, here's what I think helps barstold more than anything in terms of that.
[SPEAKER_00]: You might like it, you might not like it.
[SPEAKER_00]: You might feel one way about it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Every single athlete loves it, which gives them a huge, huge advantage.
[SPEAKER_00]: And a lot of media people love it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, I also think it's, you know, maybe it's not the right way to sort of frame it to talk about bar still as a whole, but like if you just look at part in my take for instance,
[SPEAKER_00]: They get better guess than any show that exists in any form of media in sports, anywhere.
[SPEAKER_00]: Athletes want to be on that show.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, look at, you know, you have spin-checklets, you have biz nasty doing their podcasts, these on TNT.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think that the outside of the sports world may still have that
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, get triggered when they hear the word parcel, but inside the sports world, I don't think it's like that.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think the argument's been won in a lot of ways.
[SPEAKER_01]: What you're talking about, guests, mainstream guests coming on the show, people lining up wanting to get on those shows, especially part of my take.
[SPEAKER_01]: I do think also that we've come into an era where things are graded differently, at least by certain people.
[SPEAKER_01]: because in old media world where you and I come out from, we're looking at ESPN's Air, we're looking at ESPN.com, we're looking at newspapers and we're saying, oh, you stepped over the line here.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is unacceptable.
[SPEAKER_01]: Let's do this.
[SPEAKER_01]: So a lot of people that process this and say, hey, I like podcasts and the hosts are going to step through a trapdoor a couple of times a day and I'm just going to roll with that and that doesn't bother me at all.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I think it just sort of in a way it depends on how you look at the world.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it is interesting to how it was framed in so many places is like, this is going to be now McAfee versus Portnoi.
[SPEAKER_01]: They used to work together.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I don't know.
[SPEAKER_00]: I didn't, I think McAfee's, I do think Fox wanted some sort of McAfee like person, but, you know,
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know, maybe maybe a more lenient, but like, I don't think McAfee's been like so wild on game day.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like what maybe cursed ones, I mean, whoa, he's not doing anything that I'll land this.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's just exuberant, loud.
[SPEAKER_00]: has fun stands on the desk.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's doing it a lot of ways of version of what Lee Corso did for twenty plus years.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, Pat's told me that in a way.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like his job is to boost the crowd, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: Is to keep people into it.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, wait.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yo.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's the gig.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then when you have, when you're doing a live television show, not just the television show, but a live show in front of a, unless they studio audience, but an audience out there on the quad, like that's a gift, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: Like that's,
[SPEAKER_01]: That's, and that's part of game days magic is that atmosphere there.
[SPEAKER_01]: So what Pat is doing, yeah, jumping up and down and doing that thing and doing the fight songs and all that kind of stuff.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's, but it's a gift and it's a big thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: You have any kind of prediction on how this plays out the big dude kickoff versus game day.
[SPEAKER_01]: I really don't.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, there's a whole rating story there that I, you know, I will let the numbers come in before make predictions up that.
[SPEAKER_01]: But I think we've sketched it out.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, to me, it's, it's Fox saying, what's the element we can add to that to this show that makes it something that people will have to pay attention to, whether they love it, where they get mad and get pissed off, but it's something they will have to pay attention to week after week.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: And also,
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't, you know, from the releases, again, like we're talking about this, but we still don't know, like what exactly is going to be the role of Portnoi, and like how long he's, you know, maybe he, I mean, he could maybe he's on there for five or ten minutes and then over two hour, free game show.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's not going to, again, I think all of those partial clips will do numbers on social without a doubt, but in terms of like a TV rating, if someone flips it on and it's Brady Quinn and Urban Meyer, I mean,
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[SPEAKER_00]: The other thing I wanted to just to wrap this up
[SPEAKER_00]: Again, I'm coming at it from a New Yorker, so I want your take.
[SPEAKER_00]: I was fascinating that one of the things that spun off from this is Big Ten versus SEC.
[SPEAKER_00]: Fox seems like Fox is trying to really make it a, we have the best conference, which does that matter?
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, aren't people just going to go to the bed like you said Ohio State Texas?
[SPEAKER_00]: Like people are going to go to that game.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like people are going to go to the best game each week.
[SPEAKER_00]: There are many, many weeks, many weeks, we're at noon on Fox.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's Iowa against Michigan State.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's not moving the needle in any way, shape, perform.
[SPEAKER_00]: I still think the SEC is the much more dominant conference in terms of interest and viewership.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, the big tennis Michigan Ohio State Penn State.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then after that, it's a lot of hot garbage.
[SPEAKER_01]: So this is why you're in New Yorker, Jimmy, because you can just just slay fan bases like this and you're not gonna worry about being on a message board somewhere.
[SPEAKER_01]: I love this.
[SPEAKER_00]: Sorry, no one's tuning in from Minnesota, Illinois and new and on Fox.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm just, yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: No, you're right.
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's fun.
[SPEAKER_01]: What's funny is this whole conference thing gets wrapped up in the networks.
[SPEAKER_01]: Let me tell you this.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm a University of Texas alum.
[SPEAKER_01]: I have never cheered for the SEC or the big twelve.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, you know, I mean, our if I did, I,
[SPEAKER_01]: I forgot it after thirty seconds.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, you're just kind of like, well, that's cool.
[SPEAKER_01]: Hey, we want something.
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, like, we, the, does that count?
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, I mean, that just doesn't, it doesn't do anything.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, but you understand it right because you are invested in the SEC, which he has been as all of now or the Big Ten, which Fox has the biggest piece of the best piece of now.
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, you're going to wrap yourself in the colors, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: You're going to put the flag around your shoulders.
[SPEAKER_01]: And here we go.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is us.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's funny.
[SPEAKER_00]: My favorite was, I guess, awful announcing post of these clips of Colin Coward talking about how the Big Ten is so much better than the SEC.
[SPEAKER_00]: Also, the network that pays Colin Coward that also has the rights to the Big Ten, he thinks is better.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm shocked.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, let me just say this like anything you do in that space is just triggering to everybody on college football internet like you will you will win if you just say this conference sucks this team sucks this coach sucks.
[SPEAKER_00]: I guess my frustration is with the American public like how do not know Colin Coward has no credibility on that discussion.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's not going to get on there and say the SEC and ESPN has about
[SPEAKER_01]: had a package and box, but this is the thing, every Jimmy everybody's so tied into this, like an announcers, where did they go to school?
[SPEAKER_01]: What do you have the rights to who are they friends?
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, let me just tell you, this is a deep, these are deep waters.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: Speaking of deep waters, I'm a story that I've been very curious about to see how it plays out for months now.
[SPEAKER_00]: And now it seems like we're taping this on Wednesday if the new and Martian had a big story Wednesday morning.
[SPEAKER_00]: It sounds like the ESPN, the Timmy favorite right when I say this purchase of NFL media.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's not a partnership.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's going to be a purchase.
[SPEAKER_00]: ESPN's going to purchase NFL media for the NFL media means
[SPEAKER_00]: NFL network, red zone.
[SPEAKER_00]: I believe it means NFL.com as well if I'm not mistaken.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, there are assets.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: I, to me, this is the biggest sports media story that you're maybe outside of, I don't know when TNT officially lost the NBA, but if that was this year, I think that was last year.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, you could have a situation where red zone NFL network are on ESPN's direct to consumer app.
[SPEAKER_00]: This is going to be huge.
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like it's not enough buzz about this.
[SPEAKER_01]: And you hit on what's so interesting about it, which is the app.
[SPEAKER_01]: So here comes the SPN this fall with a thirty dollar per month app.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think you and I have shared a lot of the same questions about this.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's like who is this for?
[SPEAKER_01]: What's what's fan is going to say?
[SPEAKER_01]: I want to pay thirty dollars for ESPN's app, but I don't want to pay seventy eighty dollars for YouTube TV.
[SPEAKER_01]: I want sports at a very high rate, thirty dollars a month, but I only want ESPN sports.
[SPEAKER_01]: And my question is going to be like, there's always like, way to say, we live in a world where you can cancel everything as soon as you get tired of it as soon as you look at your credit card bills and I don't like this.
[SPEAKER_01]: So what's the thing that ESPN can add to that mix that would really be compelling?
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, they have lots of great sports, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: They have money in that football.
[SPEAKER_01]: They have great college footballs we just said, what's the thing that they can add to that mix?
[SPEAKER_01]: When you say red zone, that to me is like, aha.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, there's a thing that people want.
[SPEAKER_02]: Right.
[SPEAKER_01]: And you could imagine yourself a certain kind of sportsman.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not going to be you and me, but there's a certain kind of sportsman that's like, okay, maybe I already have Amazon Prime because I need to order Q tips in the mail.
[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe I, you know, have the network somehow at home and then maybe I can get by with the ESPN and I get every Sunday I can watch Red Zone.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's a more compelling, more interesting package to me than just the ESPN by itself.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm very enthusiastic what they do with the programming.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I would love to know too.
[SPEAKER_00]: Do they acquire the NFL media talent?
[SPEAKER_00]: Like I'm thinking of like a guy like Kyle Brand can we now see him on ESPN shows being used and they could do it.
[SPEAKER_00]: They could basically do a good morning football knockoff, which is Strayer's city is PN and she's some of courties at ESPN.
[SPEAKER_00]: And now.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, exactly.
[SPEAKER_00]: Peter, Peter, we're home.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and also, you know, listen, the NFL media stuff, the NFL network.
[SPEAKER_00]: For however long they've existed, you would never hear a bad word about the NFL on there.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I'm also wondering, not that he just pans out there killing the NFL because nobody who owns, who's invested in the NFL really kills the NFL, but like we saw it with Pablo Tory with this story and you know, they're not leading good morning football and things like that.
[SPEAKER_00]: I wonder, does just so many layers to this.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's why I really curious to see how it plays out.
[SPEAKER_01]: And let me add one more layer too, which has always been fascinating to me, is one of the original purposes of the NFL network, besides advertising the league, was to force ESP into cover the NFL even more.
[SPEAKER_01]: Talk to people at the NFL network about this for years.
[SPEAKER_01]: So they would say, hey, we're going to put on this crazy show called Schedule Release.
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, like schedule release way, we already know which teams play, which teams are where they play.
[SPEAKER_01]: You're just given us the dates.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's a show, but as soon as ESPN saw that, guess what?
[SPEAKER_01]: They had their own schedule release show that advertise the NFL even more on ESPN's air.
[SPEAKER_01]: Same thing with the NFL draft and a full network started covering it.
[SPEAKER_01]: ESPN's is why we can't let this stand.
[SPEAKER_01]: We got to cover it even better.
[SPEAKER_01]: So what do they do if a more resources into it?
[SPEAKER_01]: they put the NFL draft on two different networks.
[SPEAKER_01]: So NFL Network has always, and again, this is not a secret.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is not my interpretation.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is something that people who founded the network and work at the network say, this was the goal to force other partners to cover the NFL even more.
[SPEAKER_01]: So now look at, I don't know if irony is the right word, but look out for it.
[SPEAKER_01]: We've come now.
[SPEAKER_01]: This thing that was goading ESPN, depouring more resources in the NFL is now being bought by ESPN, at least potentially.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's fascinating to me.
[SPEAKER_01]: It is absolutely inside the house.
[SPEAKER_00]: Does the name NFL network stay?
[SPEAKER_00]: What do they do with a show like good morning football?
[SPEAKER_00]: And obviously, red zone is actually for what
[SPEAKER_00]: I know about it because I watch Sunday ticket.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I think red zone is actually one of the few things that's fairly affordable when I come, like I think it's like, tall dollars a month or something like that.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, and these people with red zone watch it one to is seven hours for twenty, twenty eight hours a week, a month, twenty eight hours a month watching red zone for twelve bucks seems like a good one of the rare fair deals in this streaming world.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and that's that's like more than you pay for one hour of while out of the week.
[SPEAKER_00]: And while we're talking about streaming, I should quickly that, of course, peacock raising their prices now before the NBA starts up on there where they'll have exclusive games.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you're sports fan, pay, pay, pay.
[SPEAKER_00]: It will be what I don't understand about the ESPN app, thirty dollars a month.
[SPEAKER_00]: I just, you hit it right on the head.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, you get the ESPN App at Storytiles a month.
[SPEAKER_00]: But if you like, and whenever I get into this discussion, I always have to preface this with, if you like more than, let's say, three sports.
[SPEAKER_00]: You still need, you need like five other surfaces.
[SPEAKER_00]: The math to me just makes no sense on all the court cutting, the streaming.
[SPEAKER_00]: Again, if you like all the sports are almost all the sports.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you like one or two sports, yeah, you can get away with a cheap streaming or cable bill, but I don't get the math on it.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and I think you and I are just built as all around sports fans.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's just like I want to watch which sports you want to watch all of them.
[SPEAKER_01]: Everything.
[SPEAKER_01]: I never want to get to a place where I can't watch something that's on right now.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I understand my way we should save the ESPN app that I think you're going to be able to get this with Disney plus and Hulu is like an add-on and it's going to be much cheaper than thirty dollars and that's made a conditional couple of dollars with that.
[SPEAKER_01]: So that again, that's a more, you know, much more palatable price.
[SPEAKER_01]: But I always just come at this like I want all this sports.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I want to get me to the happy place.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to have to have YouTube TV and then I'm going to have to have things outside of that.
[SPEAKER_00]: So do you subscribe to cable or YouTube TV?
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm on YouTube TV now.
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, so you're on YouTube TV.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I was on cable for way too long.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, so you're on.
[SPEAKER_00]: So is there anything you don't get that you wish you had?
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't think so.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know like here in New York.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'll probably tell me something.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'll whip up my credit card and buy it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I know here in New York.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know a big problem is
[SPEAKER_00]: The yes network and S and Y, I don't think are on YouTube TV, not available.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I don't get dodgy games.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's one thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, so right off the bat, that's what I'm saying.
[SPEAKER_01]: But I'm not a Dodgers fan, just right.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm averted.
[SPEAKER_00]: All right, but you, so you subscribe to YouTube TV.
[SPEAKER_00]: You have prime obviously, you have Netflix, you have, um, Apple TV.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: Peacock.
[SPEAKER_01]: HBO Max.
[SPEAKER_01]: Paramount.
[SPEAKER_01]: All the now HBO Max again.
[SPEAKER_00]: Paramount.
[SPEAKER_01]: Paramount.
[SPEAKER_01]: I might, you know, let come and go depending on the time of year.
[SPEAKER_01]: I believe we should break up with apps from time to time.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, that's my thing is the day, the second, the minute that the double UWE can get that our paper views off peacock, I will cancel peacock because nothing on there I ever watch.
[SPEAKER_00]: I can miss the MBA regular season.
[SPEAKER_00]: Wait a second, your sports media critic.
[SPEAKER_00]: You can't miss this.
[SPEAKER_00]: The day when the NFL play off game, I'll order peacock and then I'll cancel it the next morning.
[SPEAKER_00]: I can do without the Notre Dame Ohio game that airs one two year on.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, that's my favorite.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: Uh, and again, not to just keep staying on ESPN here, but they're, well, it's not just the ESPN, but MLB still doesn't have this deal for next year.
[SPEAKER_00]: And they're, again, it sounds like talking with ESPN.
[SPEAKER_00]: I saw something where Apple is a major player in this.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, yeah, go ahead base.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, put your playoff games on it.
[SPEAKER_00]: Put the wild car around on Apple.
[SPEAKER_00]: That'll go over really well with your fan base.
[SPEAKER_00]: Um,
[SPEAKER_00]: I would hope baseball's smart enough to understand that the best company to be in business with is ESPN.
[SPEAKER_00]: Even though they've had these problems and opted out of the deal.
[SPEAKER_00]: What are you going to do on Apple TV?
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't get it.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know either.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it doesn't the best scenario here.
[SPEAKER_01]: Sound like I could get back together with the SPN at a lower price.
[SPEAKER_01]: And the five hundred and fifty million dollars youth being was bang.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, take a little less and get on the network that at least has the most viewers.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know what, what, besides, I mean, let's emphasize money, which is a stupid thing to say because everything's about money.
[SPEAKER_00]: Besides money, what is the upside of making deal with Apple?
[SPEAKER_00]: I'll just, I'll never understand it.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't understand it either.
[SPEAKER_01]: And again, I think there was the thinking was, at least, there's a couple of weeks ago that maybe they could carve up the old ESPN package.
[SPEAKER_01]: So maybe you could sell back to ESPN, a version of that package has playoff games that has sunny in that baseball or something, right, to stay on ESPN, get yourself in the first take.
[SPEAKER_01]: Not a blog.
[SPEAKER_01]: No, maybe not even the B blog, but at least the C blog.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then, you know, you could also find a streamer to give some games to or whatever.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I guess that's that's a scenario too, but I just think that ESPN is the most logical and best home.
[SPEAKER_00]: And my counter to that.
[SPEAKER_00]: would be, you know, because that's a big theme is like carve up the package.
[SPEAKER_00]: But listen, if you, at the end of the day, the package is the wild card games.
[SPEAKER_00]: The, the home run derby is a one off.
[SPEAKER_00]: And something like baseball is not like the biggest need of mover if we're going to, it's one game a week, something night, if, whatever, do whatever you want.
[SPEAKER_00]: The wild card round, that's what the package really is.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's what I would hope at the very least.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's what I would hope ESPN could get their hands back on.
[SPEAKER_01]: And just again, it just feels like the best scenario for everybody if you're baseball.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, and by the way, I didn't rob man for it say that this was gonna happen before the All-Star game or did I read that?
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, now we're past it and we're still figuring this out.
[SPEAKER_00]: My guess is Rob's not getting the offer's Rob wants to get.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, Martian also had another piece of news.
[SPEAKER_00]: I found a little interesting.
[SPEAKER_00]: Richard Jefferson will be back with Bream for the SPN's lead crew.
[SPEAKER_00]: And there's talk that Doris might not be back to us, Burke.
[SPEAKER_00]: I have to say that when I saw that I was really surprised because I thought it would be maybe Richard who would get removed from that crew.
[SPEAKER_00]: And Doris would stay.
[SPEAKER_00]: I wasn't, I said this before.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's no great NBA analyst out there for whatever reason.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not a big redgie, mellow guy.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I think Stan is very saving on these very good.
[SPEAKER_00]: Obviously now things are really split up because I'm just on how to hire a whole new staff and be see hire a whole new staff.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I, I guess the rumblings are Tim Legler would get Doris's spot.
[SPEAKER_00]: My issue is,
[SPEAKER_00]: Why can't it just be Mike Brennan or enrich a Jefferson, or why can't it be Mike Brennan, Tim Lungler?
[SPEAKER_00]: Why does it, why do they need a three person booth in a sport where the action is non-stop and it's all on the play by play guy anyway?
[SPEAKER_01]: It now makes no sense to me.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, you think about this.
[SPEAKER_01]: Final four NBA finals and the other conference finals have been three man booths for how many years now.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know why.
[SPEAKER_01]: There's no time.
[SPEAKER_01]: What is the point?
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's the hardest sport I think for a color analyst to get their arms around.
[SPEAKER_01]: Because again, they just don't have much time now, imagine.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, in the whole Richard Jefferson Dorsberg thing, I thought it was very, very awkward up until the finals.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I thought that crew was a little bit smoother and just kind of found a little bit of flow during the finals.
[SPEAKER_01]: But to me, if you're, if you're going to stick with Jefferson,
[SPEAKER_01]: And again, I'm with you.
[SPEAKER_01]: I feel that's, that's you saying, well, this is the best option we've got out of here.
[SPEAKER_01]: We don't have an obvious A one.
[SPEAKER_01]: This guy's going to be great analysts except the one you got rid of, but we don't have, we don't have that guy on the roster that I would say, I would want him with bringing so that they're working on their relationship and repartage, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: You ideally want to get to what Jefferson and I and Eagle had on yes, right, whether it's a humor blended.
[SPEAKER_01]: I, and I don't think bringing, I think bringing easily get there with them.
[SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.
[SPEAKER_01]: Why would you add another person that makes just to make that job harder on everybody?
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's just the the NBA just to have two people please.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't care.
[SPEAKER_00]: I at this point.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't care.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like it could be Richard Jefferson.
[SPEAKER_00]: It could be Darzburg.
[SPEAKER_00]: It could be Tim Lago just have it.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's making a two pairs of booth in the NBA.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's not baseball where there's all this time to chit chat and bullshit and have fought like there's no downtime in the NBA.
[SPEAKER_01]: It really is.
[SPEAKER_01]: And we got a great play by playing out.
[SPEAKER_01]: There's now.
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, so you don't need, you don't need to.
[SPEAKER_01]: By the way, I'm, I'm not with you on Stan Van.
[SPEAKER_00]: God.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think he's very, very smart, but he just, he's worth kind of refusing to learn television in front of our eyes.
[SPEAKER_01]: When there's that moment, a blues during the Eastern Conference Finals, where Tyrese Halliburton has a steel, maybe it was, yeah, it must have been.
[SPEAKER_01]: Tyrese Halliburton has a steel.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's going down the court.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's about to dunk the ball.
[SPEAKER_01]: The roof is going to come off the arena in Indiana.
[SPEAKER_01]: And he's like before Tyre's algorithm even jumps.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's like, you know, the opposing coach needs to call a timeout here.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm like, Stan, this is not a teaching tape about what you need to do for what a coach he's to do.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is a freaking basketball game man.
[SPEAKER_01]: He didn't just going to let him dunk the ball and you're going to say nothing and you're going to go commercial.
[SPEAKER_02]: Right.
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.
[SPEAKER_01]: I got to talk so much.
[SPEAKER_01]: Then again, he's very, very smart in the subtleties of the game.
[SPEAKER_01]: He captures quite well.
[SPEAKER_01]: But at some point, you just got to learn TV.
[SPEAKER_01]: This is not a podcast.
[SPEAKER_01]: This, this, this is television and he just refuses to learn when it's time, it is time to just lay out.
[SPEAKER_01]: Let somebody else talk, let the man dunk the basketball and go to commercial.
[SPEAKER_00]: We'll see if Amazon, maybe they, no, maybe he'll be a little different.
[SPEAKER_00]: Amazon, we'll see.
[SPEAKER_00]: That's where we'll stand.
[SPEAKER_00]: We'll be starting in October.
[SPEAKER_00]: I before I let you go off the sports.
[SPEAKER_00]: map.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know you did a lot on Colbert on your podcast and to, you know, to me that Colbert story is much more interesting than every single thing we've talked about, not that you haven't been a rifiting guest as always.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm willing to try so hard to avoid the politics of this story, you know, which is funny to me too, but you know, I'm not allowed to talk about the politics behind this people get pissed.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I'm wondering, when the president is suggesting changing team names and sports, is that okay or is that a stick to sport?
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know, the rules are all confusing to me.
[SPEAKER_00]: When the news broke, obviously you think about whatever the political ramifications were, then it comes out, he was losing forty million a year, then it comes out.
[SPEAKER_00]: He had the higher ratings, two point four million at night, Kimmo and Fallon, I don't know, one point seven or in that area.
[SPEAKER_00]: The only thing that I kept thinking about when I saw that story was, he's going to be on CBS every night for another year.
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's ten months.
[SPEAKER_00]: They're going to have him for ten straight months on eleven thirty eastern.
[SPEAKER_00]: Go on there and just destroy CBS in Paramount every night.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's no, it might crazy to think there's no chance he's doing ten months on CBS.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_01]: And if it were a political decision, and I think some of it is clearly a political decision.
[SPEAKER_01]: But let's just, we won't stick the horse to deep in the water here.
[SPEAKER_01]: But couldn't you go out and say the things that would make a certain politician mad night after night after night after night after night?
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, into that.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: When that is his kind of mode of comedy anyway.
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it does remain, it is reminiscent of when Letterman didn't get that tonight show.
[SPEAKER_01]: And he was still on late night following Jay Leno for that very, very weird
[SPEAKER_01]: period of American history.
[SPEAKER_01]: And that was, and that was a great tension filled.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, you say, like, this prize is going to have him, but what a joy for us viewers if it does.
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.
[SPEAKER_01]: Because you have the money.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm controlled until, efficiently.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, here we go.
[SPEAKER_00]: And you'll have to watch it a D.G.R.
[SPEAKER_00]: because they're probably not going to post the clips on social media.
[SPEAKER_00]: No.
[SPEAKER_01]: And the thing about late night shows now is they just all feel so canned.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I know the interviews of always felt that way, but I just
[SPEAKER_01]: I want to show, I mean, here, this is where I am on Colbert.
[SPEAKER_01]: Again, I'll skip over the political portions of it.
[SPEAKER_01]: We'll skip over the, or we can talk about the economic parts of it, too.
[SPEAKER_01]: But I'm also just like, that showed to me, I, I thought Stephen Colbert was incredibly talented guy in Connie Central, and I just thought that show was not funny.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, I did not think that dignified his comic gifts, especially over the last few years.
[SPEAKER_01]: I predict he's going to have a cone on the tonight show kind of moment here where he's going to go off.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's going to do his own thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's going to dignify the things he does well.
[SPEAKER_01]: And people are going to remember why they like to make it.
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.
[SPEAKER_01]: Right now this is kind of political martyrdom and there's this whole bigger story about it.
[SPEAKER_01]: But I actually don't think we've been getting one hundred percent of Stephen Colbert.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't think we've been getting that for a long time.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, listen, all of those shows completely changed because of the political landscape.
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's more commentary than jokes.
[SPEAKER_00]: Or it's common, you know, jokes pose this commentary.
[SPEAKER_00]: And from their standpoint, I get it, how do you avoid talking about what's the biggest news in the day?
[SPEAKER_00]: I also think, doesn't need to be every single show every single day.
[SPEAKER_00]: No.
[SPEAKER_00]: But again, if you take the content away, I mean, if any of those guys fall in Kimmel, although Fallon has no chance because of his annoyance.
[SPEAKER_00]: But if they put on the best show humanly possible,
[SPEAKER_00]: They're still gonna get little ratings.
[SPEAKER_00]: No one's watching television at eleven thirty at night.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I've mentioned this before here.
[SPEAKER_00]: In other conversations, I will never forget many years ago.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know, it was probably, I don't know, six, seven years ago.
[SPEAKER_00]: James Corden did an interview with Howard Stern.
[SPEAKER_00]: And it was the first time I've heard someone in that position saying he says, he goes, I'm not doing that show for CBS.
[SPEAKER_00]: So I'm doing that show for YouTube.
[SPEAKER_00]: He goes, who's who is sitting at home watching TV at eleven thirty he will twelve thirty he was on a twelve thirty he's a notes watching TV at twelve thirty in the morning goes up you know it's it's basically for social media and we talked about it with the morning shows in sports late night out what makes me the saddest about the colbert situation is someone who's like who likes colbert isn't I wouldn't say I'm like a diehard fan I like them like you said more in comedy central
[SPEAKER_00]: it's is the overall death of late night like they've killed the late show which let them in started the franchise is dead doesn't sound like well CBS hasn't commented but you don't know what's what they're eleven thirty strategies going to be but it is the beginning
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know if it's the beginning, but it's a significant moment in the death of late night.
[SPEAKER_00]: And if you are our age and do what we do and we're pop culture people and media people, late night means a lot to you from Letterman and, you know, Johnny Carson or Sineo, et cetera, et cetera.
[SPEAKER_00]: So that was my, I was just sad about, you know, obviously, yes, there's a whole political angle here.
[SPEAKER_00]: There's a financial angle.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I mean, I remember kids just being riveted to Letterman in twelve thirty at night.
[SPEAKER_00]: I remember when our city came on it, like changed everything.
[SPEAKER_00]: Johnny Carson was like the veteran, the classy guy.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, it's all gone.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's all gone.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's, you know, a bummer for people I think of our age.
[SPEAKER_01]: I agree.
[SPEAKER_01]: And you know, you think of like what made late night so exciting, especially when you were a kid.
[SPEAKER_01]: One, it was dangerous, felt dangerous.
[SPEAKER_01]: Now danger exists elsewhere in the media, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: That's not dangerous, comparatively speaking.
[SPEAKER_01]: Two, you saw celebrities for only only times you ever saw celebrities.
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, they wasn't the one you didn't have.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's a gram.
[SPEAKER_00]: By far, that's the biggest thing right there what you just said.
[SPEAKER_01]: And now you just get fed pictures of celebrities, you know, or, or, you know, reels of them talking to you.
[SPEAKER_00]: And they also, they also all have their own podcasts.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah, there's that too.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it's like, so that like the scarcity of the kind of celebrity interview is bad is so many of them were like just seeing them there was just so incredibly excited to get in and third you got some laughs, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: Like that was, that was the mix.
[SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, for people like me, I feel exactly like you do by, like, the nostalgia for late night.
[SPEAKER_01]: But I think it's mostly nostalgia because I wasn't watching any of these shows.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, here we are.
[SPEAKER_01]: We're at the end of the late night era or somewhere close to it.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not seeing that on watching this.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not even watching the clips for the most part.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, it's so funny.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'd be curious to know if you get this.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, like, Colbert gets canceled.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then, like, so I'll have friends of mine who aren't in the business and don't do what we did.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'll say, like, oh, like, did you watch Colbert?
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'll say,
[SPEAKER_00]: Do you understand how dumb that question is?
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm really spotting any of those shows anymore.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like you get the clips on Twitter or YouTube that like that's how everyone consumes it now.
[SPEAKER_00]: So like, you know, I will say one thing about the financial aspect of it.
[SPEAKER_00]: If he was losing forty million dollars a year, how did he last ten years?
[SPEAKER_01]: Now, and again, that figure, I mean, the people who will report that figure will also add in, there are benefits to the show that aren't in that forty million dollar figure.
[SPEAKER_01]: You can put CBS stars on Colberg, but Paramount stars on Colberg, you're advertising in a way that you'd have to pay to advertise them otherwise.
[SPEAKER_01]: There are other reasons you would do that.
[SPEAKER_01]: You can run commercials for your own shows during.
[SPEAKER_01]: There are other ways you can count that.
[SPEAKER_01]: But I agree.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, that's, it's just one of those things where
[SPEAKER_01]: We just, the world changed, you know, under our feet so much.
[SPEAKER_02]: Right.
[SPEAKER_01]: And, and I'm with you, man, I miss that.
[SPEAKER_01]: I just, it felt, I mean, to me, I would say when we like, when you watch those shows of the kid, because I think for a lot of us, that was our first introduction to the grown-up world.
[SPEAKER_02]: Right.
[SPEAKER_01]: So it comes kind of seemed like the grown-up world, but late night really seemed like the grown-up world.
[SPEAKER_00]: But you hit on it, too, about, you know, for me is like a Howard Stern guy.
[SPEAKER_00]: When Howard Stern would go on Letterman,
[SPEAKER_00]: There was a buzz, watch, and it also had that thing that we don't have where you knew everyone you knew was watching this at the same time.
[SPEAKER_00]: That we don't have anymore.
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, you know, the robbers had like legendary relationship with Dave when Julia Roberts was on Letterman.
[SPEAKER_00]: It was a big deal.
[SPEAKER_00]: They would flirt all the time.
[SPEAKER_00]: And now it's there's just nothing like that.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, and in a defense, I think those people who have it now acclimated, I mean, like, according to the Carpool karaoke, Jimmy Kimmel came up with the mean tweets that replaced
[SPEAKER_00]: the other stuff and now though that stuff is run it's court now we're in a different era where it's I don't know what people want from those shows and I do think there is something like it I think podcasts are kind of like it you know I think that people do and it's it has certain notes of old late night right
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, that's the kind of thing it did, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: Like it has that notes of like, you know, your friends are here.
[SPEAKER_01]: They're talking.
[SPEAKER_01]: They have the favorite people are dropping by to say hello to them.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not Don Rickles.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's, you know, name a podcast guest, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: They come on once in a while.
[SPEAKER_01]: And that is there.
[SPEAKER_01]: But yeah, I'm with you.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I also miss like the team aspect of it.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, you were a Leno guy or you were a letter me guy.
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.
[SPEAKER_01]: But that was a big deal in the day.
[SPEAKER_01]: You were a Johnny guy, or a little younger, Phil Johnny's a little over the hill, and we're sending you guys.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like I'm moving in a different direction.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not going to say, Pat, say, Jay, Guy, because nobody actually watched it.
[SPEAKER_00]: I love that you just said that because the next thing I was going to say to is what also was fun.
[SPEAKER_00]: Back then, we're watching all the new shows come out coming.
[SPEAKER_00]: Go Chevy Chase and say jack.
[SPEAKER_01]: Rivers.
[SPEAKER_00]: John Rivers.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, that was a big part of it was all these shows that would come and go over the years.
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.
[SPEAKER_00]: Rick Johnny's have a show.
[SPEAKER_00]: Rick D's.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, he did.
[SPEAKER_01]: The little thing and correct was in there for a while.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_00]: The Joan Rivers one was interesting because that really is what led to our scenario, because he filled in for her after they fired her.
[SPEAKER_00]: And even that Joan Rivers filled in for Johnny when he'd be off.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, it was a man.
[SPEAKER_00]: No, that's what we're talking to.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it was.
[SPEAKER_01]: And there was just some, you know, it was again, it was one of those things were like, there's just one of these jobs or two of these jobs.
[SPEAKER_01]: So it's like the ultimate zero, some game of celebrity.
[SPEAKER_01]: Either you get the job, like Jay Leno did or you didn't get the job, like David Letterman did.
[SPEAKER_01]: And there's something so cool about that, you know, it's just wonderful.
[SPEAKER_00]: This makes me want to watch the late shift again.
[SPEAKER_00]: Great.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know, but the movie is so funny.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, Jay Leno's manager producer, Psycho Pad, that was great.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's sort of my favorite.
[SPEAKER_01]: Again, it's just hard to describe how you're looking at that and be like, who cares?
[SPEAKER_01]: Like Jimmy Fallon got upended tomorrow, who cares?
[SPEAKER_01]: But you're like, it just felt so important.
[SPEAKER_01]: It felt like such the ability.
[SPEAKER_01]: And whatever Steven A and Macafe do now, like the capals in comparison, the treachery and backstabbing of the late night back in the night.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, one last thing is, do you think, do you think this would make NBC and ABC,
[SPEAKER_00]: think about getting rid of foul and or Kimmel quicker that like like see like a lot of TV stuff is copycat and who does it first then we copy obviously you know CBS gets rid of Colbert who had better ratings than the other two from what I read once they weather this storm and everything comes down I you know I hope you know for there's that's the other thing about this I just wanted to say this all week
[SPEAKER_00]: because there's a lot of people who are cheering the end of Colbert, who are on a certain side of the aisle.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, it's not just that Colbert got filed.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, fire, you know, many people are out of jobs.
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, a lot, like hundreds of people are out of jobs now.
[SPEAKER_00]: So if it happens to Fallon, then it happens to Kimmel.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, that's thousands of people out of jobs.
[SPEAKER_00]: So, you know, a little compassion might be nice, but I know that's not going to grow over well, but I wonder what this means for Fallon and Kimmel.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, I mean, one thing about the audience difference, too, is I read that Colbert's average viewer, I read this in Hollywood Report of sixty-eight years old, which is not good.
[SPEAKER_01]: Unthinkable.
[SPEAKER_01]: Unthinkably old, even for television these days.
[SPEAKER_01]: But yeah, I mean, I think you would, I think you would circle your circle, your wagons, as Chris Bourbon used to say, if you're one of those other hosts, because it's just dangerous.
[SPEAKER_01]: Now you could also argue that, hey, having the only late night show,
[SPEAKER_01]: rather than one in a fairly crowded place or having one of two is still a big deal.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I still think there's tons of benefits.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, like, you know, when you're, hey, we have Jimmy Kimmel and he, when he wants to come out and see Oscars, he can do that and he's great at it, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: Like we have people in the bullpen and we have ways to advertise our shows and do different things.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think there's a lot of benefits like that.
[SPEAKER_01]: But I'm with you.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think it feels like, you know, and then people talk about Seth Meyers, you know, how long is that going to be on the air?
[SPEAKER_01]: Is that, you know, we can do one maybe, but can we do two late night shows or three like we did in the old days with, with cost us doing later?
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, that was, yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: It was a show that started at one there.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: We're in the morning.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: That's how much late that we wanted.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's unbelievable.
[SPEAKER_00]: John Stewart had a great line on Monday night.
[SPEAKER_00]: He said, um,
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, I'm talking about comparison.
[SPEAKER_00]: Listen, I know what late night is.
[SPEAKER_00]: I know where we're at, late night.
[SPEAKER_00]: He goes, I know that we're basically a blockbuster kiosk inside of its power records.
[SPEAKER_01]: And you know what I've liked about the Stewart thing that maybe is the model here.
[SPEAKER_01]: Come back.
[SPEAKER_01]: go away and then we bring it back and we don't have to do like John Stewart originally came back for the election right then the election went the way it did so now he's back for a while but like we this could be like a British sitcom from the old days or an HBO series now you don't have to come back forever right what if we just bring the show wouldn't that make it feel more special to you and then also you don't get so just tired and and worn out that the jokes aren't funny anymore you come in we're gonna make a great shows for like a month
[SPEAKER_01]: That was to the Johnny's experience, but he would have a guest host, Philan, when he was.
[SPEAKER_01]: Johnny was working like three days a week.
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm off for this summer, guys.
[SPEAKER_01]: See you later.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, he would have comedians fill in all the time that never be a repeat.
[SPEAKER_00]: So different world, different world, different time.
[SPEAKER_00]: All right, Brian, really appreciate it.
[SPEAKER_00]: This was great.
[SPEAKER_00]: And Joy, the rest of you, some of that, we'll see.
[SPEAKER_00]: I guess they're in football season.
[SPEAKER_00]: And by then, we'll know maybe what's going on with yes, piano, NFL, media, and ESPN, and baseball, and all that stuff.
[SPEAKER_00]: So thanks for doing this.
[SPEAKER_00]: Appreciate it.
[SPEAKER_01]: Many columns to write, many segments to do Jimmy, great to see as always.
[SPEAKER_00]: Alright, my many, many thanks to Brian Curtis, my thanks to you for listening.
[SPEAKER_00]: So we'll be back next week.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you missed any recent episodes, make sure you give him a listen.
[SPEAKER_00]: Scott Hansen, the host of the Red Zone, newly signed for your deal.
[SPEAKER_00]: He talked about all that more last week.
[SPEAKER_00]: Dan Orlowski, he also of a new four year deal with ESPN was on the podcast two weeks ago.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you missed any of those interviews, give him a listen.
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[SPEAKER_00]: All right, that wraps it up.
[SPEAKER_00]: We'll see you next week.
[SPEAKER_00]: Stay safe and take care.