WEBVTT 00:00.091 --> 00:06.435 [SPEAKER_02]: When did you start doing that where you would take each arrest of a pastor in Greenville and check the BJU your books? 00:06.675 --> 00:11.798 [SPEAKER_00]: That was about two thousand ten I started doing that because people would cast down. 00:11.938 --> 00:12.918 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, he didn't tend. 00:13.018 --> 00:13.719 [SPEAKER_00]: You don't know that. 00:13.739 --> 00:14.719 [SPEAKER_00]: There's a lot of gas lighting. 00:15.139 --> 00:16.280 [SPEAKER_00]: So evidence is important. 00:16.520 --> 00:18.401 [SPEAKER_00]: There are a lot of graduates and a lot of problems. 00:18.601 --> 00:21.183 [SPEAKER_00]: And Myron Shabajji and there's one of them. 00:21.901 --> 00:23.883 [SPEAKER_02]: Hey everybody, welcome back to the Prejudice podcast. 00:23.943 --> 00:30.688 [SPEAKER_02]: My name is Eric Scorsinski, and if you're first time tuning in, I am a former member of the Independent Fundamental Baptist Movement. 00:31.037 --> 00:35.260 [SPEAKER_02]: And on this show, I shed a light on the dark side of the church from the pulpit to the pews. 00:35.280 --> 00:45.148 [SPEAKER_02]: Today, I'm going to be talking about two stories, one of which I covered in depth over on my sub-stack involving the former camp director for Bob Jones University, Stephen Cobb. 00:45.448 --> 00:48.430 [SPEAKER_02]: For those of you that haven't read the story yet, here is the breakdown. 00:48.850 --> 00:57.077 [SPEAKER_02]: On July, sixteenth, twenty-five, Fox Carolina reported on detail surrounding the arrest of a former Bob Jones University employee named Stephen Cobb. 00:57.597 --> 01:00.340 [SPEAKER_02]: According to the reporting, Cop was the director of B.J. 01:00.380 --> 01:04.064 [SPEAKER_02]: Hughes, Edu Camp, from two thousand eighteen to two thousand twenty-four. 01:04.685 --> 01:13.975 [SPEAKER_02]: The Edu Camp website says it provides a friendly and fun summer program for campers to experience God, develop life skills and consider possible career pathways. 01:14.435 --> 01:18.139 [SPEAKER_02]: It appears to service campers from fourth grade on two seniors in high school. 01:18.920 --> 01:29.392 [SPEAKER_02]: The arrest warrant states that during the latter part of his tenure from November, twenty twenty three to February twenty four, cop was allegedly engaging in multiple sex acts with a team victim. 01:29.872 --> 01:33.016 [SPEAKER_02]: The victim was allegedly under his guardianship at this time. 01:33.616 --> 01:40.183 [SPEAKER_02]: He was charged for criminal sexual conduct with a minor or attempt victim under sixteen years of age, second degree. 01:40.844 --> 01:48.375 [SPEAKER_02]: Records show that Stephen Cobb was arrested on April, sixteenth, twenty-two thousand twenty-four and was released on a twenty-five thousand dollar bond the same day. 01:49.056 --> 01:52.041 [SPEAKER_02]: Bob Jones University released the following statement to the press. 01:52.481 --> 01:55.866 [SPEAKER_02]: We are aware of the series allegations involving a former employee. 01:56.407 --> 02:03.930 [SPEAKER_02]: We have fully cooperated with law enforcement throughout their investigation and continue to encourage anyone with relevant information to come forward. 02:04.570 --> 02:15.594 [SPEAKER_02]: Since the alleged crimes were not alleged to have occurred on campus or to have been related to his employment, they do not fall within the annual higher education reporting requirements established by federal law. 02:16.194 --> 02:19.996 [SPEAKER_02]: Our prayers are with all those who may be affected and we pray that justice will prevail. 02:20.476 --> 02:24.958 [SPEAKER_02]: As legal proceedings remain ongoing, we will not provide any further comment at this time. 02:25.718 --> 02:40.935 [SPEAKER_02]: I was personally very perplexed by the inclusion of this line that says, since the alleged crimes were not alleged to have occurred on campus or to have been related to his employment, they do not fall within the annual higher education reporting requirements established by federal law. 02:41.375 --> 02:50.965 [SPEAKER_02]: My understanding is that they are claiming that they have no legal requirement to include this incident in their annual Clary Report that publicly discloses crime statistics relating to the college. 02:51.545 --> 02:56.570 [SPEAKER_02]: I reach out to Bob Jones University for clarity on this and I'll update if I receive a response. 02:57.420 --> 03:04.383 [SPEAKER_02]: Regardless of whether or not there is a legal requirement for the school discloses information, I would think that they would feel a moral obligation too. 03:04.403 --> 03:14.168 [SPEAKER_02]: This is not only a staff member, this is a camp director of six years who likely bore responsibility for hundreds of underage campers during his time of employment. 03:14.728 --> 03:21.832 [SPEAKER_02]: I would hope the college is actively informing the families of past campers in addition to cooperating with law enforcement on the current case. 03:22.492 --> 03:29.754 [SPEAKER_02]: After I reported on the story on Substack, I connected with Dr. Camille Caminsky Lewis, who is the author of Clandomenalism. 03:30.034 --> 03:34.595 [SPEAKER_02]: Bob Jones at the intersection of revival, politics, and white supremacy. 03:35.195 --> 03:42.437 [SPEAKER_02]: She's been documenting stories connected to Bob Jones University for a long time, and I wanted to get her feedback on this particular case. 03:43.040 --> 03:53.329 [SPEAKER_00]: So I've been doing the documentation of BJU at whatBJU.org, W-U-T-B-JU.org for ten years. 03:54.230 --> 03:59.614 [SPEAKER_00]: And I say that it's the oldest and the latest about John's University. 04:00.395 --> 04:02.997 [SPEAKER_00]: So it's ten years. 04:03.378 --> 04:10.744 [SPEAKER_00]: So people that are in the community, in BJU's community, trust me. 04:11.652 --> 04:13.192 [SPEAKER_00]: They know I'll keep their identity safe. 04:13.353 --> 04:25.396 [SPEAKER_00]: And so I had a parent from Bob Jones Academy, message me on Monday to June, excuse me, twenty-third, so a month ago now. 04:25.916 --> 04:28.537 [SPEAKER_00]: And they said, have you heard about this? 04:30.597 --> 04:33.498 [SPEAKER_00]: My children just told me about it and they're all upset. 04:35.520 --> 04:43.191 [SPEAKER_00]: So the next day, the twenty fourth of June is my vibe report that I looked at the arrest record on the county website. 04:43.792 --> 04:46.356 [SPEAKER_00]: Got all that data on trying to look at the law. 04:46.536 --> 04:49.821 [SPEAKER_00]: I looked at where he worked, you know, from archive.org. 04:51.070 --> 04:51.991 [SPEAKER_00]: list of it all out. 04:52.411 --> 04:59.817 [SPEAKER_00]: Then I thought, you know what, this is a vocal interest and the news isn't reporting it, so I went to Reddit to the subreddit, uh, Greenville. 04:59.997 --> 05:05.822 [SPEAKER_00]: And I think that eventually got to fit snooze, eventually Fox Carolina picked it up. 05:06.102 --> 05:11.066 [SPEAKER_01]: The first to look for you right now, if I have a clock that's on the arrest of a former Bob Jones University employee. 05:11.266 --> 05:13.288 [SPEAKER_02]: Do you know anything else about Stephen Copp? 05:13.308 --> 05:23.419 [SPEAKER_02]: Did you come across anything else aside from, I mean, the piece that's out to me is that, again, the statement really kind of dismisses how connected he was and the reality of this. 05:24.020 --> 05:25.321 [SPEAKER_02]: What else do you research? 05:25.922 --> 05:33.350 [SPEAKER_00]: In the Marshall Islands, he was a principal right out of graduated, principal of a Baptist Christian Academy. 05:34.478 --> 05:38.299 [SPEAKER_00]: Then in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, 05:54.756 --> 05:55.616 [SPEAKER_00]: summer camp program. 05:55.656 --> 06:00.999 [SPEAKER_00]: So he was working full time in either of those organizations. 06:01.439 --> 06:04.540 [SPEAKER_00]: He got a graduate from Bob Jones in twenty one. 06:04.560 --> 06:06.581 [SPEAKER_00]: And then proof he was gone. 06:08.102 --> 06:13.244 [SPEAKER_00]: He was not working at Bob Jones in the fall of twenty four. 06:13.814 --> 06:17.979 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, you probably know as well as I do, there's rarely ever just one victim. 06:18.579 --> 06:29.752 [SPEAKER_02]: This is something where I think there's the obligation, morally, if not legally, for an institution to reach out to any past places and students and parents and see if something's happened. 06:30.072 --> 06:32.415 [SPEAKER_02]: Do you know if that's happened from before? 06:33.265 --> 06:36.386 [SPEAKER_00]: They have not reached out to the parents in any way. 06:36.466 --> 06:43.389 [SPEAKER_00]: That was why my contact, my initial contact from June twenty, third was subset. 06:43.629 --> 06:51.371 [SPEAKER_02]: Is there anything else people should know about this particular case that comes to mind or anything that you think didn't make it to the local reporting that you wish would? 06:51.411 --> 06:56.273 [SPEAKER_02]: Aside from obviously the main story, but to the ones that have reported, what are the missing pieces here? 06:56.453 --> 06:58.134 [SPEAKER_00]: Here's what I'm concerned about. 06:58.214 --> 06:59.534 [SPEAKER_00]: People have said to me, 07:03.321 --> 07:05.002 [SPEAKER_00]: was acting creepily. 07:05.923 --> 07:06.643 [SPEAKER_00]: That's all they've said. 07:07.484 --> 07:10.326 [SPEAKER_00]: Now being a creep, acting creepily is not a crime. 07:11.867 --> 07:21.353 [SPEAKER_00]: But I'm wondering if there are victims out there that have not had the opportunity or the courage yet to speak up. 07:21.986 --> 07:26.852 [SPEAKER_02]: After we finished discussing Steven Cobb's story, we turned our attention to another recent arrest. 07:27.333 --> 07:32.919 [SPEAKER_02]: This time involving Miren, Trabajian, a longtime pastor and bot Jones grad. 07:32.939 --> 07:38.486 [SPEAKER_02]: I asked her how she first made the BGU connection and what she told me added a whole new layer to this case. 07:39.407 --> 07:41.248 [SPEAKER_02]: So, this is Myron Turbagian. 07:41.648 --> 07:44.489 [SPEAKER_02]: The article was from June, twelfth, twenty twenty five. 07:45.089 --> 07:49.431 [SPEAKER_02]: And he was pastoring a Southern Methodist Church, which is why he bounced right off my radar. 07:50.351 --> 07:52.732 [SPEAKER_02]: But there's a Bob Jones University connection. 07:53.293 --> 07:53.513 [SPEAKER_00]: Right. 07:53.653 --> 07:57.674 [SPEAKER_02]: First and foremost, how did you realize there was a Bob Jones connection? 07:57.694 --> 08:01.256 [SPEAKER_00]: I honestly don't remember exactly with this. 08:01.916 --> 08:05.918 [SPEAKER_00]: If someone said, hey, I think this is someone you should look into if it notified me. 08:06.978 --> 08:08.999 [SPEAKER_00]: Or if it was my usual every 08:10.368 --> 08:12.330 [SPEAKER_00]: local arrest. 08:13.391 --> 08:16.153 [SPEAKER_00]: I check to see if this person attended BJU. 08:16.593 --> 08:17.614 [SPEAKER_02]: When did you start doing that? 08:17.634 --> 08:22.938 [SPEAKER_02]: Were you would take each arrest of a pastor in Greenville and check the BJU your books? 08:23.498 --> 08:30.844 [SPEAKER_00]: That was at least, boy, that was about two thousand ten I started doing that because it was people 08:32.898 --> 08:35.079 [SPEAKER_00]: would cast out what he didn't tend. 08:35.179 --> 08:35.899 [SPEAKER_00]: You don't know that. 08:36.019 --> 08:39.080 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, there's a lot of gaps lighting, you know this. 08:39.120 --> 08:40.120 [SPEAKER_00]: There's a lot of gaps lighting. 08:40.540 --> 08:48.162 [SPEAKER_00]: So evidence is important for us all to know, yes, this person attended, no, this person didn't attend. 08:48.943 --> 08:56.225 [SPEAKER_00]: And you know, there's a lot of people that have been rumored to attend different institutions over the years. 08:56.325 --> 08:57.245 [SPEAKER_00]: I would check for that to 08:58.195 --> 09:02.600 [SPEAKER_02]: Do you know how many people you've found that were indeed in the your books? 09:04.462 --> 09:06.184 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, oh, what a great question. 09:06.425 --> 09:07.466 [SPEAKER_00]: No, I don't. 09:07.967 --> 09:09.769 [SPEAKER_00]: I have a, I could look that up for you. 09:09.789 --> 09:13.173 [SPEAKER_00]: Wow, no, I don't know that. 09:14.955 --> 09:16.396 [SPEAKER_02]: There was a case when you said that before. 09:16.416 --> 09:16.836 [SPEAKER_02]: No, that's okay. 09:16.856 --> 09:20.537 [SPEAKER_02]: When you before we hit recording, you mentioned I was like, I wonder how many names have? 09:20.657 --> 09:21.317 [SPEAKER_00]: That's a great. 09:21.457 --> 09:22.238 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't even know. 09:22.258 --> 09:23.018 [SPEAKER_00]: I could look. 09:23.538 --> 09:42.845 [SPEAKER_00]: They started in both fours in two thousand thirteen when the executive vice president for academic affairs at Bob Jones Gary Weir went on a talk radio show and said that BJU was safe for families and the proof is in the product. 09:43.909 --> 09:50.292 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, that's not a good, that's not a good thing to say. 09:50.912 --> 09:58.456 [SPEAKER_00]: It's a university, first of all, it's not a, it's not oriented toward families, such a regular toward families. 09:58.776 --> 09:59.577 [SPEAKER_00]: That's one problem. 10:00.790 --> 10:06.779 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, there are a lot of graduates and a lot of problems and Myron Chobagian is one of them. 10:06.979 --> 10:12.467 [SPEAKER_02]: This this story came out and this is something that was a decades long series of crimes. 10:12.707 --> 10:15.131 [SPEAKER_02]: Be used to begin in the late and they list out a 10:16.152 --> 10:17.993 [SPEAKER_02]: long list of abuse. 10:19.134 --> 10:38.465 [SPEAKER_02]: Right now he's facing multiple charges and the list of things that he's facing are three counts of second degree criminal sexual conduct with minors ages eleven through fourteen three counts of incest one count of second degree criminal sexual conduct fourteen counts of place in child at risk harm or abandoned 10:38.945 --> 10:55.615 [SPEAKER_02]: two counts of second degree assault and battery, and his wife is also being charged on fourteen counts of placing a child at risk, harm, or abandon and two counts of accessory after the fact of felony, and they're both tonight bond on May twenty-third, which is the sentence I always love to see. 10:56.016 --> 11:02.740 [SPEAKER_02]: According to the arrest warrants, I'm iron forced one of the children to quote search dumpsters to eat rotten and discarded food. 11:03.700 --> 11:08.965 [SPEAKER_02]: Another arrest warrant alleges that Miron be a child with a belt to the point that the child lost consciousness. 11:09.866 --> 11:15.111 [SPEAKER_02]: In another instance of alleged abuse, Miron stripped a child to their underwear and tied the child to a basketball post. 11:15.551 --> 11:18.774 [SPEAKER_02]: He then hit the backside of the child more than fifty times with a belt. 11:20.196 --> 11:26.382 [SPEAKER_02]: Additionally, Miron is accused of breaking a coffee mug over the head of a child which later led to the child's diagnosis of epilepsy. 11:27.343 --> 11:32.048 [SPEAKER_02]: According to one of the warrants, Miron killed a child's dog and forced the child to bury the dog. 11:32.608 --> 11:38.214 [SPEAKER_02]: And Miron also ran over a child's pet kitten and shot the kitten in the head while the child was present. 11:38.734 --> 11:39.575 [SPEAKER_02]: That particular 11:40.416 --> 11:56.823 [SPEAKER_02]: accounts stood out to me one because it's cruel and horrifying, but also it reminded me a lot of Jocelyn Zickerman's book, I fired God, which was one of the first books that I read coming out of the Independent Penimal Baptist Movement. 11:57.103 --> 12:01.885 [SPEAKER_02]: And she recalls a very similar story with her father involving her cat. 12:02.326 --> 12:03.366 [SPEAKER_02]: And it's amazing. 12:03.386 --> 12:07.668 [SPEAKER_02]: I remember that book probably, I was either still in high school thinking about leaving 12:08.148 --> 12:09.229 [SPEAKER_02]: Or it just laughed. 12:09.749 --> 12:11.411 [SPEAKER_02]: I think I just graduated when I read it. 12:12.171 --> 12:16.875 [SPEAKER_02]: And it kind of shook me how similar those those two stories were. 12:16.895 --> 12:18.316 [SPEAKER_00]: The cruelty is just. 12:19.817 --> 12:22.819 [SPEAKER_00]: Is the point is it has a expression ghost. 12:22.939 --> 12:23.240 [SPEAKER_00]: It's just. 12:24.177 --> 12:24.557 [SPEAKER_02]: Right. 12:24.717 --> 12:25.358 [SPEAKER_00]: My bag line. 12:25.398 --> 12:25.618 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. 12:25.798 --> 12:31.821 [SPEAKER_02]: Authority's accused, Kathleen, of putting the children to risk by not doing anything to stop or deter her husband's alleged actions. 12:32.321 --> 12:37.004 [SPEAKER_02]: She's also accused of forcing a child to eat an entire bar of soap, causing the child to be sick. 12:37.684 --> 12:44.228 [SPEAKER_02]: And in another restaurant, Kathleen is accused of striking a child in the head with a skillet, leaving visible bruises and head trauma. 12:44.748 --> 12:46.429 [SPEAKER_02]: And then it adds a note here in the article. 12:46.569 --> 12:51.752 [SPEAKER_02]: If you're listening, YFF News four has chosen not to release the details of sexual allegations. 12:51.772 --> 12:52.432 [SPEAKER_02]: I will add. 12:53.897 --> 12:59.361 [SPEAKER_00]: a detail here, that we alumni have, I'm gonna send you the link. 12:59.481 --> 13:03.104 [SPEAKER_00]: Have digested after the story came to light. 13:04.605 --> 13:07.848 [SPEAKER_00]: One of the things that I do, there we go. 13:08.888 --> 13:14.933 [SPEAKER_00]: Every year is, try to remember, at the end of every year, try to remember who, 13:15.680 --> 13:19.724 [SPEAKER_00]: died would be to you alumni died the previous year. 13:20.225 --> 13:26.872 [SPEAKER_00]: And so this link that I just sent you is for a person who died in twenty-twenty-two. 13:26.892 --> 13:32.759 [SPEAKER_00]: And if you look, you see his name, he was the adopted son of Myron Tribagian. 13:33.492 --> 13:35.853 [SPEAKER_00]: interest and any die by suicide. 13:36.233 --> 13:46.376 [SPEAKER_02]: The article had said that all the male children were subjected to physical abuse, all the female children suffered sexual abuse, two of the victims who were children during the abuse are now dead. 13:46.656 --> 13:49.738 [SPEAKER_02]: And so the link you just sent me is for one of them. 13:50.558 --> 13:50.818 [SPEAKER_00]: Right. 13:52.779 --> 13:55.319 [SPEAKER_00]: So it just, it feels heavier to me. 13:55.339 --> 13:59.801 [SPEAKER_00]: I just, and closer. 14:00.888 --> 14:07.012 [SPEAKER_02]: As we are de alluded to, back in twenty twenty-two, Jonathan David Vallelli's obituary did not make headlines. 14:07.613 --> 14:14.797 [SPEAKER_02]: But now, as I read it with the full context of the recent charges, it adds another heavy layer to an already painful and horrible death. 14:15.438 --> 14:19.741 [SPEAKER_02]: The obituary openly knowledge the abuse and trauma that Jonathan experienced in childhood. 14:20.321 --> 14:28.267 [SPEAKER_02]: It also said that he became the first male in the state of South Carolina to adopt his wife's name, officially making him Jonathan David Vallelli. 14:28.967 --> 14:31.248 [SPEAKER_02]: I think that statement says a lot in retrospect. 14:31.829 --> 14:42.154 [SPEAKER_02]: He battled Dictions and trauma his entire adult life which ultimately left him homeless and unrecognizable before he ended up dying by suicide on April twenty six, twenty-two. 14:42.534 --> 14:45.616 [SPEAKER_02]: This story is of course heavy and uncomfortable and it should be. 14:46.156 --> 14:51.339 [SPEAKER_02]: I know a lot of times these episodes can just feel like more the same, but this isn't just about headlines and arrests. 14:51.959 --> 14:54.420 [SPEAKER_02]: There are victims out there paying the ultimate price. 14:54.740 --> 14:57.282 [SPEAKER_02]: Many of whom will never get to see justice. 14:57.742 --> 15:03.105 [SPEAKER_02]: So let the weight of this episode be a reminder to you that these stories matter and we need to keep telling them. 15:03.945 --> 15:10.692 [SPEAKER_02]: I want to take a moment and honor Jonathan's life and end with this quote from the obituary that reveals his true personality. 15:11.573 --> 15:16.959 [SPEAKER_02]: The authentic John could put a smile on anyone's face, sell bikini to an Eskimo and love like no other. 15:17.439 --> 15:26.168 [SPEAKER_02]: He'll be remembered as a jokester, a lover, and one with charismatic soul, with a love for fishing, boating, singing, playing games and spending time with his family. 15:26.949 --> 15:30.095 [SPEAKER_02]: If you or someone you know is struggling, please know you're not alone. 15:30.555 --> 15:35.684 [SPEAKER_02]: You can call or text the suicide in crisis lifeline at nine eight eight anytime to talk with someone. 15:36.065 --> 15:37.327 [SPEAKER_02]: Help is always available.