WEBVTT 00:00.191 --> 00:08.658 [SPEAKER_00]: The rise of toxic, regressive, conservative, leaning, alpha male content that you see online doesn't really surprise me. 00:08.958 --> 00:21.949 [SPEAKER_00]: And it's no surprise to me that the Gen Z men who are consuming content from, you know, the alpha male kind of red-pilt creators like Fresh and Fit or Andrew Tate are being drawn to religious communities at a higher rate than women right now. 00:22.409 --> 00:28.371 [SPEAKER_00]: The reality is that many fundamentalist Christian churches treat rigid patriarchal beliefs as inseparable from their faith. 00:28.731 --> 00:39.894 [SPEAKER_00]: And when you look at the content of what's being preached in churches and you see the misogynistic content from, you know, alpha male influencers online, there's a lot of synergy and crossover between those messages. 00:40.554 --> 00:47.656 [SPEAKER_00]: The sad truth is that in many churches, boys' rule, girls' rule is actually like a core pillar of their theology. 00:50.917 --> 00:59.279 [SPEAKER_07]: out of mind if mama teaches the kids, out of mind if a strong lady and a wise woman and a gracious godly woman follows the takes your lesson from the pastor. 00:59.359 --> 01:00.719 [SPEAKER_07]: Hey, oh, you listen to me right now. 01:00.979 --> 01:04.120 [SPEAKER_07]: I still believe if you have cold day in the hell before I get my family from woman. 01:04.140 --> 01:04.760 [SPEAKER_07]: I'm a preacher. 01:05.080 --> 01:06.781 [SPEAKER_07]: I wasn't mama called popper scent. 01:07.001 --> 01:08.881 [SPEAKER_07]: No woman ever got me involved in ministry. 01:09.121 --> 01:10.682 [SPEAKER_07]: I didn't follow a woman in the ministry. 01:10.942 --> 01:12.102 [SPEAKER_07]: A woman didn't write this book. 01:12.142 --> 01:13.862 [SPEAKER_07]: Not one woman wrote the scriptures right here. 01:14.102 --> 01:15.063 [SPEAKER_07]: A man wrote the Bible. 01:15.243 --> 01:16.043 [SPEAKER_07]: Got it from God. 01:16.263 --> 01:17.283 [SPEAKER_07]: A man hung in the cross. 01:17.443 --> 01:18.523 [SPEAKER_07]: His name is Jesus Christ. 01:18.704 --> 01:20.364 [SPEAKER_07]: And God called a man to lead the church here. 01:21.325 --> 01:22.286 [SPEAKER_07]: I'm proud of a man. 01:22.306 --> 01:34.440 [SPEAKER_00]: A few weeks ago, I decided to go on Instagram and share ten lies that I was taught about masculinity when I was a young man in fundamentalism, both from my own church and a plethora of male-focused conferences and books. 01:35.001 --> 01:38.945 [SPEAKER_00]: And I decided to format the post in like the most Sigma, you know, alpha. 01:40.547 --> 01:42.688 [SPEAKER_00]: like dude way that I possibly could. 01:43.088 --> 01:58.351 [SPEAKER_00]: Hoping that the algorithm gods would bless the feeds of some of the Gen Z men who are consuming this content and allow it to be a different perspective and so I did my most like masculine cigar puffing post about this and and shared my thoughts there. 01:58.371 --> 02:04.912 [SPEAKER_00]: I think it hit some of its intended target but I'm still trying to figure out how to reach that that male audience with the show. 02:04.932 --> 02:06.513 [SPEAKER_00]: But he just hit ten lies that I shared 02:07.553 --> 02:10.854 [SPEAKER_00]: The first one I shared is that being emotional isn't a feminine trait. 02:11.474 --> 02:13.755 [SPEAKER_00]: Number two is women are by nature followers. 02:13.795 --> 02:14.895 [SPEAKER_00]: They need a man to lead them. 02:15.455 --> 02:17.756 [SPEAKER_00]: Number three, men want sex more than women. 02:18.336 --> 02:21.797 [SPEAKER_00]: Number four, it's a wife's duty to give sex to her husband when they want it. 02:22.297 --> 02:24.077 [SPEAKER_00]: Number five, men want respect. 02:24.237 --> 02:25.037 [SPEAKER_00]: Women want love. 02:25.618 --> 02:27.718 [SPEAKER_00]: Six depression is a lack of faith in God. 02:28.118 --> 02:30.579 [SPEAKER_00]: Number seven, you can't be friends with the opposite gender. 02:30.959 --> 02:35.420 [SPEAKER_00]: Number eight, it's better to get married extremely young than the risk being tempted with pre-marital sex. 02:35.960 --> 02:45.353 [SPEAKER_00]: And number nine, when it comes to attraction men are visual women are emotional and then number ten women are more easily deceived just look at Eve being tricked by Satan. 02:45.730 --> 02:58.573 [SPEAKER_00]: And at the end of the post, I asked my viewers of the content to drop their own experiences and the comments started flooding with lies about masculinity and gender that people heard within their churches. 02:58.593 --> 03:04.634 [SPEAKER_00]: And I'd say I'm gonna be reacting to some of those listener responses and trust me, we're about to get down and dirty. 03:04.674 --> 03:12.376 [SPEAKER_00]: There is some dark and wild comments here, but that lead us to some dark and wild clips relating to teaching in some of these fundamentalist churches. 03:12.976 --> 03:15.317 [SPEAKER_00]: But first and foremost, I gotta address a really important question 03:15.937 --> 03:43.080 [SPEAKER_00]: my post immediately got to railed by a couple guys that were asking what cigar I am smoking here and I hate to disappoint but I'm smoking a really cheap pack of Cuban rounds in this clip which retail for like I think like twenty bucks for three but my absolute favorite cigar for those who are watching and wondering at home is the tabernacle cigar which I'll post a picture of somewhere in here in post but just to get that out of the way to avoid the distraction 03:43.620 --> 03:47.882 [SPEAKER_00]: But the first category that I will hit that was like a main piece in these comments. 03:48.222 --> 03:52.843 [SPEAKER_00]: But we're teaching surrounding sex and sexuality and it's something I've covered in depth in the show. 03:52.903 --> 03:59.506 [SPEAKER_00]: It's something you can't avoid when you're doing a show that primarily talks about abuse, you know, twisted teaching on this topic is going to come up a lot. 04:00.286 --> 04:06.428 [SPEAKER_00]: One listener said, you know, men have a need for sex and women don't or that a woman should not or cannot enjoy sex. 04:06.928 --> 04:30.615 [SPEAKER_00]: It's just from men and immediately the clip I thought of when I read this comment was a clip from a Southern Baptist pastor in Texas named Josh Howardin who kind of really pushed this idea in a sermon a couple of months ago and maybe twenty twenty four I don't have the exact date in front of me but here's Josh Howardin talking about how men and women view sex within the relationship 04:31.725 --> 04:34.626 [SPEAKER_05]: for anybody that couldn't be at marriage night. 04:35.046 --> 04:44.068 [SPEAKER_05]: What I would like to do is this totally free, this free, you know, in addition, I would like to give you just, you know, you missed it. 04:44.588 --> 04:50.070 [SPEAKER_05]: I just love to give you a nugget, a gold piece of marriage advice. 04:50.150 --> 04:50.970 [SPEAKER_05]: Would you like this? 04:51.170 --> 04:53.391 [SPEAKER_05]: Would you like, okay, let me, let me do this, okay? 04:53.411 --> 04:54.351 [SPEAKER_05]: This is totally free. 04:54.371 --> 04:56.772 [SPEAKER_05]: This was given to me years ago. 04:56.792 --> 04:57.712 [SPEAKER_05]: All right, so first, 04:58.252 --> 05:03.919 [SPEAKER_05]: Let me let me talk to dudes specifically dudes that are heading in to married some day. 05:04.119 --> 05:05.200 [SPEAKER_05]: This is what I want to do, okay? 05:05.721 --> 05:11.367 [SPEAKER_05]: So dudes you know this heading in a married some day when you get to her wedding day 05:12.831 --> 05:15.893 [SPEAKER_05]: She's been planning this day her whole life. 05:17.054 --> 05:20.737 [SPEAKER_05]: She got her first little wedding magazine when she was fourteen years old. 05:21.117 --> 05:23.899 [SPEAKER_05]: She put the blanket around her, acted like it was a wedding dress. 05:24.179 --> 05:29.043 [SPEAKER_05]: She did the towel over the head, it was the veil, all the things she's been planning this day her whole life. 05:29.944 --> 05:30.884 [SPEAKER_05]: So here's what she needs to do. 05:30.964 --> 05:35.167 [SPEAKER_05]: You just need to stand where she tells you to stand, where is she tells you to wear and do what she tells you to do. 05:35.207 --> 05:36.909 [SPEAKER_05]: You're gonna make her the happiest one of the world, okay? 05:37.329 --> 05:38.029 [SPEAKER_05]: Now, applause. 05:38.089 --> 05:39.150 [SPEAKER_05]: Now, that's applause. 05:40.091 --> 05:41.192 [SPEAKER_05]: Let's see if you applaud this. 05:42.359 --> 05:51.661 [SPEAKER_05]: Ladies, when you get to his wedding night, he's been planning this night his whole life. 05:52.681 --> 05:58.382 [SPEAKER_05]: So what you need to do is stand where he tells you to stand, where will he tell you to wear and do what he tells you to do? 05:58.682 --> 06:00.923 [SPEAKER_05]: You're gonna make him the happiest man in the world. 06:00.943 --> 06:08.364 [SPEAKER_05]: Okay, that feels like masculine laughter, or clapping is what that was. 06:09.363 --> 06:21.287 [SPEAKER_00]: I think the first time I saw this clip was through Sheila Greg Wars, Twitter, and she, of course, wrote the Great Sex Rescue, and has done a lot of studies serving Christian women about their experiences, being taught about sex within the church. 06:21.767 --> 06:36.572 [SPEAKER_00]: And there was also a great article that analyzed this kind of sermon clip by Rick Pidcock, who writes for Baptist News often, and he says in part that in stark contrast to the childish detail of the woman's concern, he offers no detail about the sex plans of men. 06:37.192 --> 06:42.433 [SPEAKER_00]: Of course, much of that may be due to evangelical theologies of sex that tells teenage boys that they are never to masturbate. 06:43.033 --> 06:47.994 [SPEAKER_00]: Even thinking about sex is taking on the risk of getting turned on, masturbating and spending an eternity in hell. 06:48.555 --> 06:53.816 [SPEAKER_00]: Thus, evangelical men are developed to be sexually starved, utterly dependent, disembodied and helpless. 06:54.236 --> 07:03.118 [SPEAKER_00]: Howardton is creating a scenario here of an evangelical teenage boy who is planning out the sex for their wedding night, a decade ahead of time, while attempting not to get turned on by it. 07:03.658 --> 07:10.441 [SPEAKER_00]: Thus by the time the evangelical teenage boy grows up and gets married, Howardton refers to the wedding night as, quote, his wedding night. 07:10.901 --> 07:18.505 [SPEAKER_00]: Women on the other hand are assumed to have no sexual desire in a required to submit to the entitlements of helpless men whom they crown as kings that get their body. 07:18.985 --> 07:23.927 [SPEAKER_00]: Not only is that a perfect example of obligation sex, it's also promoting the dynamics of rape. 07:24.447 --> 07:28.231 [SPEAKER_00]: It's no wonder why sexual abuse is rampant in these conservative churches. 07:28.451 --> 07:30.553 [SPEAKER_00]: That was a really fantastic piece there. 07:30.913 --> 07:32.735 [SPEAKER_00]: But it doesn't just stop with the wedding night. 07:32.795 --> 07:41.763 [SPEAKER_00]: Someone else shared another teaching around sex that is particularly harmful and looks at women as merely a solution to a need that men have. 07:42.323 --> 07:52.286 [SPEAKER_00]: This quote from a commenter said that they were taught that when a man's wife just gave birth, it is expected that the husband's needs are still being met with either oral sex or a hand job. 07:52.786 --> 07:57.008 [SPEAKER_00]: Never mind the wife's needs to sleep or to get help with things concerning the baby. 07:57.828 --> 08:02.351 [SPEAKER_00]: Consider this quote from a Christian author that kind of echoes exactly what this commenter said. 08:02.711 --> 08:13.579 [SPEAKER_00]: And I want to include some of these clips and quotes, not just because it divides up what I'm talking about, but also I think a lot of times people in the comments also go, you know, oh, that's not one person's experience. 08:13.599 --> 08:20.083 [SPEAKER_00]: This isn't popular theology or maybe one random person told in this where they assume this, but it's not somebody that's actually taught. 08:20.504 --> 08:25.087 [SPEAKER_00]: And I have plenty of examples for all of these comments that that reinforce what they were saying. 08:25.687 --> 08:29.528 [SPEAKER_00]: So, here's a quote from Ed Wheat, who wrote the book intended for pleasure. 08:30.069 --> 08:39.412 [SPEAKER_00]: He said, when you are not having intercourse frequently, as you were prior to pregnancy, you should offer manual stimulation to him, particularly during the period of abstention. 08:39.652 --> 08:44.074 [SPEAKER_00]: Again, the woman just exists to fulfill the needs of the man. 08:44.154 --> 08:53.397 [SPEAKER_00]: But there's no look at what the woman might need within the period of, you know, being postpartum within the period of, you know, going through an illness or things like that. 08:54.197 --> 08:56.539 [SPEAKER_00]: And then there's one more quote here relating to this. 08:56.859 --> 09:00.621 [SPEAKER_00]: The commenter said that they were taught that only men look at porn women aren't interested in that. 09:01.021 --> 09:07.745 [SPEAKER_00]: Another version of this kind of thinking is that men are visual women are emotional, which just isn't true. 09:07.925 --> 09:17.450 [SPEAKER_00]: Like this whole concept that you see in all the clips and this quote so far is like, oh, this is something that, you know, guys want, it's not something girls think about. 09:17.550 --> 09:22.593 [SPEAKER_00]: And I think there's a plethora of examples of ways that women are interested in sex. 09:22.653 --> 09:26.615 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, culturally, there is many things you could point to as evidence of that. 09:26.735 --> 09:33.339 [SPEAKER_00]: And we listen to the accounts of women, like, which is missing within the church context often. 09:34.319 --> 09:36.700 [SPEAKER_00]: Sex is not something that is just a guy's activity. 09:36.900 --> 09:39.962 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, this is something that women are interested in. 09:40.102 --> 09:45.165 [SPEAKER_00]: And I think it's telling that a lot of pastors are sharing experiences where their wife isn't interested in that. 09:45.205 --> 09:47.026 [SPEAKER_00]: But anyway, that's beside its point. 09:47.246 --> 09:48.547 [SPEAKER_00]: So there's a couple there. 09:48.807 --> 09:54.312 [SPEAKER_00]: I think on the back side of this kind of leads into my second part of this video, which is how women bear blame. 09:54.352 --> 09:59.817 [SPEAKER_00]: This was another theme within the comments of, you know, people who were writing in about this topic. 10:00.538 --> 10:04.802 [SPEAKER_00]: One commenter said, they were taught that men are the stronger sex mentally and physically. 10:05.282 --> 10:05.583 [SPEAKER_00]: However, 10:06.163 --> 10:10.424 [SPEAKER_00]: Don't show your shoulders and legs because this will break them and cause them to sin. 10:10.444 --> 10:17.366 [SPEAKER_00]: This is, again, a really funny one where, you know, men are so alpha and superior and, you know, just beastly. 10:18.146 --> 10:21.367 [SPEAKER_00]: But if they see a shoulder, man, that could really, really mess them up. 10:21.407 --> 10:28.189 [SPEAKER_00]: Here's a really great clip here that kind of illustrates this point here and the way that the struggle of men is described. 10:28.349 --> 10:29.209 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's take a look. 10:29.609 --> 10:30.870 [SPEAKER_06]: That's why it's so important. 10:31.070 --> 10:34.951 [SPEAKER_06]: That's why women most of all get more upset over standards than men do. 10:35.955 --> 10:36.895 [SPEAKER_06]: You say, why is that? 10:37.175 --> 10:39.456 [SPEAKER_06]: You can't tell me how I need a dress. 10:40.737 --> 10:43.458 [SPEAKER_06]: You can't tell me what I can't wear, what I can't wear. 10:43.518 --> 10:44.618 [SPEAKER_06]: Well, let me tell you something. 10:45.058 --> 10:47.019 [SPEAKER_06]: God cares about how you dress. 10:47.779 --> 10:52.901 [SPEAKER_06]: I don't get one royal flip, what you think, your husband thinks, what your kids thinks, what your mama thinks. 10:53.221 --> 10:54.362 [SPEAKER_06]: I care what God said. 10:54.622 --> 10:56.502 [SPEAKER_06]: Here's some news last for you. 10:56.803 --> 10:57.643 [SPEAKER_06]: Us men struggle. 10:59.664 --> 11:03.886 [SPEAKER_06]: I got about four eight men's, all the rest of them, all the rest of them in here aligned, or don't want to admit it. 11:04.347 --> 11:10.670 [SPEAKER_06]: So here's the thing, all of them in are appealed to the sensual side of a woman. 11:11.411 --> 11:13.972 [SPEAKER_06]: If you don't, you line or you gay, that's what one preacher said. 11:15.593 --> 11:17.214 [SPEAKER_06]: God appeals to the senses. 11:17.274 --> 11:21.757 [SPEAKER_06]: So honey, when that dress gets above that knee, you start exposing that thigh. 11:22.937 --> 11:26.960 [SPEAKER_06]: Hey, let me tell you something, the men start looking, and it's amazing. 11:28.442 --> 11:30.163 [SPEAKER_00]: And I just, I didn't mention it here. 11:30.204 --> 11:31.765 [SPEAKER_00]: This is Evangelist Jonathan Smith. 11:31.785 --> 11:32.866 [SPEAKER_00]: I want to make sure I name these guys. 11:32.906 --> 11:38.230 [SPEAKER_00]: You can look into them later and look at some of their other resources to see that I'm not like just cherry picking certain things. 11:38.310 --> 11:41.253 [SPEAKER_00]: But, yeah, this is Jonathan Smith here in Evangelist. 11:41.293 --> 11:42.394 [SPEAKER_06]: They're just perverts. 11:42.974 --> 11:45.076 [SPEAKER_06]: If you got a pull down on it, it ain't long enough. 11:45.556 --> 11:46.657 [SPEAKER_06]: It's not common sense. 11:47.078 --> 11:49.580 [SPEAKER_06]: If you got to keep pulling up, then it ain't tall enough. 11:50.240 --> 11:51.241 [SPEAKER_06]: It's not common sense. 11:51.501 --> 11:54.624 [SPEAKER_06]: I tell people all the time, you and my brother all got in about this one time. 11:54.684 --> 11:58.207 [SPEAKER_06]: And he said, well, he said, you shouldn't be preaching about what women should be wearing. 11:58.247 --> 11:59.989 [SPEAKER_06]: You should be preaching about how men are thinking. 12:00.569 --> 12:02.711 [SPEAKER_06]: Well, if I could change the way I think, I do it. 12:03.952 --> 12:08.016 [SPEAKER_06]: But the problem is it's a natural thing for a man to be attracted to a woman. 12:08.256 --> 12:08.936 [SPEAKER_06]: Let's flip that. 12:09.377 --> 12:12.560 [SPEAKER_06]: It's a natural thing for a woman to be appealed to the man. 12:14.015 --> 12:15.336 [SPEAKER_06]: Now, I don't know, I'm a man. 12:15.396 --> 12:21.300 [SPEAKER_06]: I don't understand this, but women are apparently are not as entertained with the looks of a man. 12:21.400 --> 12:21.741 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know. 12:21.781 --> 12:23.862 [SPEAKER_00]: Have you seen the way that women look at Pedro Pascal? 12:25.163 --> 12:26.564 [SPEAKER_00]: I think that might not be accurate, sir. 12:26.864 --> 12:28.025 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know why I'm looking at you. 12:28.486 --> 12:29.506 [SPEAKER_06]: You're bold like I am. 12:29.546 --> 12:30.167 [SPEAKER_06]: Let me come on. 12:31.107 --> 12:33.509 [SPEAKER_06]: So I don't know what it is about women. 12:33.549 --> 12:34.350 [SPEAKER_06]: Say, what is this? 12:35.090 --> 12:38.533 [SPEAKER_06]: Say, men are appealed by the central side by what they see. 12:40.814 --> 12:41.235 [SPEAKER_06]: Women. 12:42.962 --> 12:46.538 [SPEAKER_06]: or appealed by what how a man talks to them. 12:47.043 --> 12:53.265 [SPEAKER_00]: I love how guys tell themselves like, well, I don't know what it is, but my wife just is an interested in appearances. 12:53.285 --> 12:56.626 [SPEAKER_00]: That's like, hmm, interesting. 12:56.986 --> 13:03.768 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so women bear the blame there for how they're dressing and what they cause them to think. 13:04.348 --> 13:14.771 [SPEAKER_00]: And again, I think you can always point to, and these conversations like this is, there's no way you can dress that is going to alter the way that a predatory man is thinking. 13:15.238 --> 13:17.679 [SPEAKER_00]: And I want to separate this too because I think there's two pieces to this. 13:17.940 --> 13:24.783 [SPEAKER_00]: One, it is natural to view people and have sexual feelings. 13:25.784 --> 13:27.625 [SPEAKER_00]: That's wired inside of us. 13:28.105 --> 13:33.889 [SPEAKER_00]: And I think a lot of times sexual attraction gets linked up with like lust and predatory behavior. 13:34.389 --> 13:36.330 [SPEAKER_00]: And it's like all uttered in the same breath. 13:37.571 --> 13:41.533 [SPEAKER_00]: It's completely natural to see someone and be attracted to them. 13:42.033 --> 13:43.314 [SPEAKER_00]: There's nothing wrong with that. 13:44.094 --> 13:48.278 [SPEAKER_00]: It's nothing wrong with looking at someone and feeling a sexual attraction to them. 13:49.699 --> 14:02.268 [SPEAKER_00]: There is an issue with seeing someone feeling a sexual attraction to them in an urge to take them, whether they want it or not. 14:02.328 --> 14:11.214 [SPEAKER_00]: I think when you're looking at sexual attraction, fine, pursuing sexual dominance over somebody and then attributing it to them, wearing something that invited that, 14:11.995 --> 14:14.157 [SPEAKER_00]: That is so incredibly wrong and harmful. 14:14.637 --> 14:18.721 [SPEAKER_00]: And again, all you have to do is look at countries where people are covered from head to toe. 14:19.241 --> 14:24.686 [SPEAKER_00]: There are literally Middle Eastern countries where women are sexually assaulted. 14:24.786 --> 14:34.795 [SPEAKER_00]: I remember being in Jordan and seeing a big mural of, you know, like an anti abuse mural and it should a woman beaten and bruised and it was talking about violence against women and sexual abuse. 14:35.975 --> 14:42.678 [SPEAKER_00]: And, you know, even in the image, she's depicted from head to toe completely covered. 14:43.679 --> 14:58.525 [SPEAKER_00]: And so if it was how the woman dressed that brought upon sexual assault, which we know is not the case, like, then wearing something that covers you from head to toe, except for like this much of your face, would deter all of these men, but that's clearly clearly not the case. 14:58.545 --> 15:03.508 [SPEAKER_00]: That's the thing I think about all the times, like there are so many people who are incredibly modest 15:04.408 --> 15:06.129 [SPEAKER_00]: that still are sexually solved by men. 15:06.189 --> 15:14.231 [SPEAKER_00]: I think there's actually, there's a really powerful image from a museum of what people were wearing when they were assaulted. 15:14.251 --> 15:17.933 [SPEAKER_00]: So you can see this at the SBA project.org. 15:17.973 --> 15:20.094 [SPEAKER_00]: That's SBA project.org. 15:20.534 --> 15:26.776 [SPEAKER_00]: It says, when survivors of sexual violence disclose their stories, they're often asked, what were you wearing as if they're closing choice to terms or consent. 15:27.316 --> 15:39.705 [SPEAKER_00]: The what were you wearing exhibit an international survivor art installation fights back against rapists by displaying recreations of the clothing survivors were wearing when they were assaulted, showing that someone's clothing does not equate to their consent. 15:40.345 --> 15:42.287 [SPEAKER_00]: Here's some of the examples here on the site. 15:42.967 --> 15:46.169 [SPEAKER_00]: A long sleeve black blouse, gray dress pants, and loafers. 15:47.250 --> 15:50.731 [SPEAKER_00]: a zeor cutie with baggy dark-race white pants and a jacket. 15:51.371 --> 15:53.332 [SPEAKER_00]: A pair of a deetest shorts with a blue shirt. 15:54.172 --> 15:57.413 [SPEAKER_00]: A school uniform, a light blue shirt and navy blue pants. 15:58.313 --> 16:00.814 [SPEAKER_00]: A random t-shirt and a hello kitty pajama pants. 16:01.334 --> 16:02.515 [SPEAKER_00]: I was wearing my school uniform. 16:02.775 --> 16:06.936 [SPEAKER_00]: It was a simple navy blue shirt and some khaki shorts with a pair of light-up sketches. 16:07.196 --> 16:09.037 [SPEAKER_00]: That was an eight-year-old girl at home. 16:09.637 --> 16:10.177 [SPEAKER_00]: And so again, 16:11.766 --> 16:18.327 [SPEAKER_00]: what you wear, does not excuse the behavior of other people, or the assault of other people. 16:18.347 --> 16:20.448 [SPEAKER_00]: But I want that to be crystal clear. 16:21.048 --> 16:30.709 [SPEAKER_00]: Another example here of a pastor preaching about this comes from evangelist Gary Hawkins, talking about the way that women portray themselves within churches. 16:30.729 --> 16:31.610 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's go ahead and take a look. 16:31.690 --> 16:36.350 [SPEAKER_11]: Oh, I've been here so I won't say this, and if it makes you mad, and we all right, but here's what I'm seeing in a lot of our churches. 16:36.610 --> 16:37.931 [SPEAKER_11]: We got KFC churches. 16:39.391 --> 16:39.691 [SPEAKER_11]: You ready? 16:40.871 --> 16:41.771 [SPEAKER_11]: out as late as in breast. 16:42.692 --> 16:43.232 [SPEAKER_11]: In our churches. 16:43.392 --> 16:44.492 [SPEAKER_11]: That's the way to come dressed. 16:45.572 --> 16:48.353 [SPEAKER_11]: You wouldn't believe the places I go and see things like that. 16:50.654 --> 16:51.114 [SPEAKER_11]: You know what? 16:51.234 --> 16:52.074 [SPEAKER_11]: I won't tell you right now. 16:52.434 --> 16:54.395 [SPEAKER_11]: If you're going to dress like that, do it at your house. 16:54.455 --> 16:55.075 [SPEAKER_11]: Not at church. 16:55.415 --> 16:55.555 [SPEAKER_08]: Amen. 16:55.595 --> 16:55.795 [SPEAKER_08]: Amen. 16:55.835 --> 16:59.196 [SPEAKER_11]: I don't need to see it. 16:59.216 --> 17:00.016 [SPEAKER_11]: I don't want you to see it. 17:00.036 --> 17:01.056 [SPEAKER_11]: I don't want you to see it. 17:01.077 --> 17:03.597 [SPEAKER_11]: I don't want you to see it. 17:03.777 --> 17:04.597 [SPEAKER_11]: I don't want you to see it. 17:04.657 --> 17:05.818 [SPEAKER_11]: I don't want you to see it. 17:05.898 --> 17:06.558 [SPEAKER_11]: I don't want you to see it. 17:08.073 --> 17:11.675 [SPEAKER_11]: Why would a man let his wife dress like that? 17:13.577 --> 17:16.018 [SPEAKER_11]: Why would you want other men to look at your wife? 17:17.259 --> 17:22.302 [SPEAKER_11]: I mean, happy they're down to a big slate on a beach, honey. 17:22.542 --> 17:24.824 [SPEAKER_11]: I mean, but you know something every man never looking at. 17:24.844 --> 17:28.746 [SPEAKER_11]: You want to man take this shirt off because he's Marshall. 17:28.827 --> 17:30.568 [SPEAKER_11]: I'm not going to the GM to be a Marshall man. 17:30.808 --> 17:33.149 [SPEAKER_11]: I'm going to GM to get a little bit fit and stay healthy. 17:33.630 --> 17:35.511 [SPEAKER_00]: And so I think this man 17:37.298 --> 17:50.542 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't believe personally until I see evidence otherwise this man has never seen the inside of a gym in his life when you're winded screaming about what women are wearing in church like I don't think you're hitting the treadmill at the planet fitness 17:54.353 --> 17:55.914 [SPEAKER_00]: So that's one example there. 17:56.174 --> 18:01.576 [SPEAKER_00]: Someone else said, women are both the problem and solution to all male problems. 18:02.017 --> 18:04.178 [SPEAKER_00]: I'll pull from a female speaker here. 18:04.218 --> 18:20.325 [SPEAKER_00]: This is Tammy Gauder, the wife of Bruce Gauder from Faith Baptist Church in Wildemar, California, who was featured in a not so positive light in the documentary series Let Us Pray, which is available on HBO Max, and shows how he was involved in several cover-ups of sexual abuse. 18:20.666 --> 18:22.887 [SPEAKER_00]: This is his wife talking about the 18:23.927 --> 18:25.448 [SPEAKER_00]: story of Bashiba and David. 18:26.589 --> 18:31.493 [SPEAKER_00]: And if you're not familiar with the story, the story of David and Bashiba is that David is the king at this time. 18:31.833 --> 18:41.921 [SPEAKER_00]: He is looking out his window of his palace and he sees a woman bathing on a roof named Bashiba and bathing on your roof during that time period was pretty normal. 18:41.981 --> 18:43.763 [SPEAKER_00]: That was like something culturally that happened. 18:44.383 --> 18:45.943 [SPEAKER_00]: David was the one who looked at her. 18:46.504 --> 18:48.484 [SPEAKER_00]: He arranged for her to be brought to him. 18:49.024 --> 18:56.606 [SPEAKER_00]: He essentially rapes her because he's a king who is having sex with a woman who has no real power in the situation at all. 18:57.126 --> 19:02.507 [SPEAKER_00]: And then he sends his woman's husband off to the front lines of war to die so he can have her to himself. 19:03.248 --> 19:07.569 [SPEAKER_00]: And Tammy twists his story to make it where Basheba is the problem. 19:07.589 --> 19:09.709 [SPEAKER_04]: Let's see what a difference. 19:10.769 --> 19:12.590 [SPEAKER_04]: It would have made in David's life. 19:13.773 --> 19:18.716 [SPEAKER_04]: if one lady had been more careful about her modesty. 19:24.039 --> 19:26.060 [SPEAKER_04]: What a completely changed everything, wouldn't it? 19:27.781 --> 19:31.243 [SPEAKER_04]: What if she bet what it closed the blinds to her window? 19:32.647 --> 19:34.449 [SPEAKER_04]: What a difference. 19:34.729 --> 19:38.252 [SPEAKER_04]: Maybe it would have, you know, I don't know exactly where she was. 19:38.352 --> 19:42.516 [SPEAKER_04]: I don't know she was in a room with him, you know how, night you can see in a window real well. 19:43.217 --> 19:52.045 [SPEAKER_04]: Or she was on a rooftop, I don't really sure, but maybe it would have blocked the breeze and being careful about her modesty would have cost her some comfort. 19:54.348 --> 19:58.570 [SPEAKER_00]: And again, maybe if you can see in somebody's window, you shouldn't look. 19:59.731 --> 20:14.138 [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe if you see a woman bathing, and you can see her in a private moment, it's on you as the dude, not to look at her, not to be a peeping Tom, and not to have her brought to you so you can do whatever you want to her. 20:14.418 --> 20:15.979 [SPEAKER_04]: I don't know what her motivation was. 20:16.619 --> 20:21.201 [SPEAKER_04]: Maybe she was the romantic type, and maybe she wanted to bathe under the stars. 20:21.961 --> 20:23.062 [SPEAKER_04]: No, it's not like a lady doesn't it? 20:24.070 --> 20:27.372 [SPEAKER_04]: and being careful about her modesty would have curbed her style. 20:28.992 --> 20:36.756 [SPEAKER_04]: Or maybe the tub or basin was filled with water before she thought about the modesty and to move it would have been so inconvenient. 20:39.017 --> 20:45.820 [SPEAKER_04]: Why does Shiba would have taken time to think about whether or not anyone could possibly see her while she bathes herself? 20:47.035 --> 20:48.255 [SPEAKER_00]: So that's a clip there. 20:48.455 --> 20:52.196 [SPEAKER_00]: And again, I'll do one more clip here, and then I'll move on to the next section. 20:52.336 --> 20:53.516 [SPEAKER_00]: This one's from Bobby Leonard. 20:54.016 --> 20:57.077 [SPEAKER_00]: Echoes the exact same thing, but puts it in a modern context. 20:57.697 --> 21:09.139 [SPEAKER_00]: In this clip, be essentially spends time talking about like women being dressed in modestly, in pigeon forge, and how many of them are wearing shorts and not skirts, and then he drops this line here. 21:09.159 --> 21:12.539 [SPEAKER_03]: And you know, I should say this. 21:14.120 --> 21:15.680 [SPEAKER_03]: I have a say this a long time, you ready? 21:16.850 --> 21:22.134 [SPEAKER_03]: I said, if you trash like it and you get raped, and I'm on the jury, he's gonna go free. 21:23.916 --> 21:24.916 [SPEAKER_03]: Now then you'll like to do you. 21:26.137 --> 21:26.698 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm right though. 21:28.279 --> 21:29.460 [SPEAKER_03]: I can't hit you like I'm right. 21:30.461 --> 21:31.902 [SPEAKER_03]: Cause you know, a man's a man. 21:33.641 --> 21:59.878 [SPEAKER_00]: which is just an insane thing to say and it is worth noting that this got a lot of attention when it came out a lot of people were calling it out rightfully so and ended up getting some news attention and so the apology came out in this form which is the most Baptist way to apologize changing the church sign Bobby Leonard put out this sign in front of the church said I'm sorry for any hurt I was wrong 22:00.858 --> 22:22.236 [SPEAKER_00]: Which is like a crazy summation of saying if you're wearing shorts and pigeon forging you get raped I'm gonna let the guy go Is anyway, but yeah, I was I was a apology there if you haven't seen it Anyway, I'm gonna move on to the third section here the next super comments here regard male authority and a one person's comment said that they were taught that men have authority over women and 22:22.496 --> 22:31.459 [SPEAKER_00]: not only wives, but also daughters who are morally obligated to obey whatever they are told to do by their father until let authority is transferred to their husband at marriage. 22:32.520 --> 22:42.363 [SPEAKER_00]: Here's an example from Pastor Joe Kamalari, where he makes one a woman who went to go to college and instead tells them they should stay home and so let's check it out. 22:42.623 --> 22:43.143 [SPEAKER_10]: Telling ya! 22:44.024 --> 22:49.426 [SPEAKER_10]: Keep in the hole is a high calling of God in Christ Jesus don't hang your head for one minute. 22:51.758 --> 22:53.900 [SPEAKER_10]: You go be a CEO and God bless you if you do. 22:53.960 --> 22:57.242 [SPEAKER_10]: I hope you're triple-ties, but they'll live without you tomorrow. 22:57.302 --> 22:57.923 [SPEAKER_10]: Don't doubt it. 22:59.284 --> 23:05.068 [SPEAKER_10]: This church will live without me as a pastor tomorrow, but I'm telling you, you weren't, we're making soldiers for Jesus Christ. 23:05.108 --> 23:07.650 [SPEAKER_10]: And mom, the fact is you have the greatest impact. 23:08.711 --> 23:10.012 [SPEAKER_10]: So God says I'll start with her. 23:11.513 --> 23:15.436 [SPEAKER_10]: She's more naturally Christ-like. 23:16.697 --> 23:19.840 [SPEAKER_10]: It's not a punishment, but you're gonna have to trust him. 23:26.147 --> 23:26.948 [SPEAKER_10]: Do it, God's way. 23:28.010 --> 23:31.315 [SPEAKER_10]: Keep looking at the picture, because everything else you look at, I go into your crazy. 23:32.596 --> 23:34.279 [SPEAKER_10]: Our girls, I know I got eight girls, I know. 23:34.920 --> 23:36.222 [SPEAKER_10]: You know, it comes graduation time. 23:37.163 --> 23:39.526 [SPEAKER_10]: And I got to fill out Pistabar Koski's little thing there. 23:42.681 --> 23:47.285 [SPEAKER_09]: What are you gonna do with your life, you know, all the anti, you know, the unsafe dance? 23:47.325 --> 23:48.366 [SPEAKER_09]: What are you gonna do with your life? 23:48.386 --> 23:49.487 [SPEAKER_09]: Well, I'm gonna go to the bathroom. 23:49.707 --> 23:51.168 [SPEAKER_09]: I'm staying home and so on. 23:59.015 --> 24:00.597 [SPEAKER_10]: I'm gonna serve my father. 24:02.278 --> 24:04.260 [SPEAKER_10]: I wanna get married and have children. 24:08.699 --> 24:11.642 [SPEAKER_10]: If you know what the regressants are pushing for, and don't doubt it. 24:12.122 --> 24:18.568 [SPEAKER_10]: A genderless, raceless, cultureless, borderless, sexless, religious, bunch of knots. 24:18.628 --> 24:20.550 [SPEAKER_10]: And that's what you have to have for the antichrist to take over. 24:21.851 --> 24:24.434 [SPEAKER_10]: I've seen a boy last night with a fingernail polish on. 24:24.834 --> 24:29.859 [SPEAKER_00]: And then he just goes on to this rant, which I'll just leave in for the sake of giving context. 24:29.939 --> 24:33.923 [SPEAKER_00]: But, oh man, he's... And he looked like all boy. 24:34.894 --> 24:37.756 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, I'm just, I'm like, oh, I want to break his fingers. 24:38.696 --> 24:44.540 [SPEAKER_00]: That's such a crazy response to seeing any, like, just to say this to another time for a little people. 24:44.560 --> 24:46.001 [SPEAKER_00]: The second one is bizarre. 24:46.021 --> 24:48.903 [SPEAKER_10]: Hey, man, that's it. 24:49.243 --> 24:52.004 [SPEAKER_10]: Long as I'm at it, you boys that are a little, and I like fashion. 24:52.044 --> 24:53.145 [SPEAKER_10]: I don't like slabs. 24:53.205 --> 24:56.047 [SPEAKER_10]: Everyone in church and out at that spiritual, we're slabs. 24:56.887 --> 25:02.471 [SPEAKER_10]: We're slabs because we just proven that God accepts us the way we are slabs. 25:05.045 --> 25:06.709 [SPEAKER_10]: But you that are on the fashionable side. 25:06.729 --> 25:11.420 [SPEAKER_10]: Let's don't go too far and make it a feminine fashionable. 25:12.887 --> 25:14.148 [SPEAKER_00]: Anyway, that's a clip from that. 25:14.248 --> 25:15.488 [SPEAKER_00]: Someone else dropped to comment. 25:17.930 --> 25:19.350 [SPEAKER_00]: Actually, it was a continuation last comment. 25:19.370 --> 25:21.071 [SPEAKER_00]: So they said the men have authority over women. 25:21.131 --> 25:24.253 [SPEAKER_00]: And then they said they must always obey the father, has been no matter what. 25:24.673 --> 25:26.994 [SPEAKER_00]: Because men have the authority to determine what God says. 25:27.354 --> 25:31.136 [SPEAKER_00]: And the woman can never assert that authority to declare that God says something different. 25:31.676 --> 25:36.959 [SPEAKER_00]: One of the past I've talked about a lot on the show is Pastor Jack Treber from North Valley Baptist Church. 25:37.639 --> 25:42.882 [SPEAKER_00]: and Santa Clara California, and I've covered a lot of scandal out of his church. 25:43.562 --> 25:51.326 [SPEAKER_00]: And he says with no restraint whatsoever that women find their purpose in submission. 25:51.806 --> 25:52.527 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's hear him here. 25:52.767 --> 25:57.389 [SPEAKER_02]: Well, Elizabeth Elliott, her husband was on that plane and was killed. 25:59.931 --> 26:02.812 [SPEAKER_02]: Elizabeth Elliott wrote a powerful statement. 26:05.293 --> 26:06.434 [SPEAKER_02]: I want to read it to you tonight. 26:09.378 --> 26:10.999 [SPEAKER_02]: Elizabeth Elliott wrote these words. 26:12.840 --> 26:16.863 [SPEAKER_02]: Supreme authority, don't miss this please. 26:17.784 --> 26:29.952 [SPEAKER_02]: Supreme authority in both church and home has been divinely vested in the mail as the representative of Christ. 26:31.534 --> 26:32.894 [SPEAKER_02]: Let me read that statement again. 26:33.015 --> 26:34.115 [SPEAKER_02]: I'll continue after that. 26:34.876 --> 26:37.478 [SPEAKER_02]: Supreme authority in the church and home 26:38.288 --> 26:44.891 [SPEAKER_02]: has been divinely vested in the mail as the representative Christ, who is the head of the church. 26:47.813 --> 26:51.314 [SPEAKER_02]: It is in willing submission. 26:53.675 --> 26:54.316 [SPEAKER_02]: Hear me please. 26:55.036 --> 27:07.282 [SPEAKER_02]: It is in willing submission rather than grudging capulation that a woman in the church, whether married or single and the wife in the home, 27:08.418 --> 27:10.879 [SPEAKER_02]: find their fulfillment. 27:12.719 --> 27:18.421 [SPEAKER_02]: It is an willing submission that we find our fulfillment. 27:22.141 --> 27:24.382 [SPEAKER_02]: Here's a submissive wife. 27:26.122 --> 27:28.143 [SPEAKER_02]: She loves God, she submits to God. 27:30.263 --> 27:31.664 [SPEAKER_02]: She walks humbly before God. 27:31.704 --> 27:32.884 [SPEAKER_02]: She confesses her sin. 27:33.284 --> 27:37.126 [SPEAKER_02]: She'll bend her knee at an old-fashioned altar from time to time. 27:37.526 --> 27:41.187 [SPEAKER_02]: She'll get happy during a song and begin to weep in a church service. 27:43.188 --> 27:45.249 [SPEAKER_02]: She's a godly submissive woman to God. 27:46.750 --> 27:48.971 [SPEAKER_02]: And she submits her husband in the Lord. 27:49.651 --> 27:50.931 [SPEAKER_02]: And her children watch that. 27:52.272 --> 27:53.292 [SPEAKER_02]: I want to tell you something. 27:54.293 --> 27:57.194 [SPEAKER_02]: You have a great potential of raising some godly children. 27:58.383 --> 28:03.328 [SPEAKER_00]: So there's Jack, here's one final clip here, and then I will get through the last pieces here. 28:03.868 --> 28:08.753 [SPEAKER_00]: This is just in the continuation of conversation on male authority. 28:09.034 --> 28:13.318 [SPEAKER_00]: This one's from Pastor Eric Pittman, who outright says, I own my wife. 28:13.598 --> 28:13.918 [SPEAKER_00]: Here we go. 28:13.978 --> 28:15.900 [SPEAKER_08]: Everybody, let's get some of that music over here. 28:16.300 --> 28:17.601 [SPEAKER_08]: Why don't you go ahead and start dancing? 28:17.722 --> 28:18.542 [SPEAKER_08]: Oh, you're feeling a little hot? 28:18.562 --> 28:20.244 [SPEAKER_08]: Go ahead and take some of them garments off. 28:20.404 --> 28:20.964 [SPEAKER_08]: It's hot out. 28:20.984 --> 28:21.805 [SPEAKER_08]: We're dancing out here. 28:22.225 --> 28:23.586 [SPEAKER_08]: You're dancing with your friend's wife. 28:24.067 --> 28:24.727 [SPEAKER_08]: That's all right. 28:24.767 --> 28:26.009 [SPEAKER_08]: You know, God is love. 28:26.049 --> 28:27.129 [SPEAKER_08]: He loves everybody. 28:27.170 --> 28:28.170 [SPEAKER_08]: Let's just share. 28:28.511 --> 28:34.336 [SPEAKER_08]: Let's not be primitive and have these crazy feelings of jealousy and ownership. 28:35.937 --> 28:37.498 [SPEAKER_08]: Have you all heard these speeches of the world? 28:39.260 --> 28:40.441 [SPEAKER_08]: Sick and it's wrong. 28:42.177 --> 28:43.078 [SPEAKER_08]: I own my wife. 28:43.138 --> 28:44.119 [SPEAKER_08]: I put my name on her. 28:44.199 --> 28:45.520 [SPEAKER_08]: Everybody say you're in right there. 28:45.860 --> 28:49.482 [SPEAKER_08]: I know some of you ladies don't like that because you've been watching the liberal news people, but it's a good thing. 28:51.344 --> 28:53.025 [SPEAKER_08]: Brother Ken, do I get a name in right there? 28:53.866 --> 28:54.586 [SPEAKER_08]: Praise God. 28:55.847 --> 28:58.109 [SPEAKER_08]: Y'all better say you man, you're not helping me much at all. 28:59.630 --> 29:02.652 [SPEAKER_08]: How many of you possessive of your wife don't want another man dancing with her? 29:02.692 --> 29:03.233 [SPEAKER_08]: Say you man. 29:04.033 --> 29:06.015 [SPEAKER_08]: How many of you ladies don't want another man dancing with you? 29:07.086 --> 29:09.107 [SPEAKER_08]: Ladies, you've done lost all your browning points right now. 29:09.447 --> 29:13.488 [SPEAKER_08]: You weren't going to get a brand new something, brother, but now it's all gone, everybody's segment on that one. 29:13.828 --> 29:26.433 [SPEAKER_00]: The last section here is a serious one, and I'll share a clip that I've shared many, many times from Pastor John Piper, but I've heard this echoed many, many times from many pastors and many denominations. 29:27.434 --> 29:32.418 [SPEAKER_00]: And it is this idea that you stay and pray if you're in an abusive relationship. 29:32.538 --> 29:39.765 [SPEAKER_00]: This commenter said the pastor said from the lectern that if a wife and children are being abused in the home, they still have to stay and pray. 29:40.366 --> 29:44.890 [SPEAKER_00]: If the abuser kills the wife and her children, it's sad, but staying was still the right thing. 29:45.411 --> 29:48.674 [SPEAKER_00]: Because even if they were murdered, they'll be in heaven, so they'll end up happier. 29:49.314 --> 29:54.640 [SPEAKER_00]: And they still had kept this Christian home together, so they would not have the sin of divorce on their soul's record. 29:54.700 --> 29:57.703 [SPEAKER_00]: This is just an evil theology and evil belief system. 29:58.404 --> 30:06.293 [SPEAKER_00]: John Piper echoed this when he said a woman should be willing to endure being smashed for a night or two if her husband is abusing her. 30:06.940 --> 30:22.116 [SPEAKER_01]: If it's not requiring her to sin, but simply hurting her, then I think she endures verbal abuse for a season and she endures perhaps being smacked one night and then she seeks help from the church. 30:22.136 --> 30:28.523 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, every time I deal with somebody in this, I find the ultimate solution under God in the church. 30:29.123 --> 30:35.805 [SPEAKER_00]: This is a belief that is not only dangerous, but can be fatal in relationships where people stay too long. 30:36.306 --> 30:40.887 [SPEAKER_00]: Again, this is just a cherry on top of some of the comments that have shared in this episode. 30:41.247 --> 30:51.071 [SPEAKER_00]: But I'm curious to hear from you if you haven't dropped a comment on the original post and you're watching this video, what are some toxic lies that you were taught about masculinity within the church or the context of the Christian life? 30:51.311 --> 30:54.972 [SPEAKER_00]: Drop a comment, let me know, and I may react to them on a future video. 30:55.533 --> 31:03.309 [SPEAKER_00]: And if there's any sermon clips or any books in particular that you found particularly harmful, I'd love to see links to those as well, and check them out. 31:03.669 --> 31:04.932 [SPEAKER_00]: But that's all for today's episode. 31:04.952 --> 31:10.483 [SPEAKER_00]: Thanks so much for listening, and I will catch you on a future episode here on the Pre-Choice Podcast.