[SPEAKER_08]: Hey everybody, welcome back to the Grey Malkin Lane podcast where queer friends and allies gather to review and discuss the original X-Men comics and continuity order.
[SPEAKER_08]: We're going to be putting this episode out in December, wrapping up the year on Grey Malkin Lane with some wonderful script reads.
[SPEAKER_08]: It's been a wild journey taking the Avengers with Beast joining the team and Moon Dragon across some various adventures this year.
[SPEAKER_08]: This issue marks a significant shift in the title under Steve Engelhart where we get to go into time-travel craziness with huge casts of characters that are all over the place.
[SPEAKER_08]: It's going to be really fun and we have some really delicious characters that will be a huge surprise joining today and moving into next time.
[SPEAKER_08]: I am so thrilled to be joined by some of my very favorite people returning for this group and some pinch hitters because some of our regulars could make it.
[SPEAKER_08]: Today we're going to jump into the world of Avengers number 141 which came out in November 1975.
[SPEAKER_08]: The writer's Steve Engelhardt.
[SPEAKER_08]: George Perez is on pencils.
[SPEAKER_08]: Beautiful pencils, by the way.
[SPEAKER_08]: A Vince Colletta on Inc. Janice Cohen on Letters.
[SPEAKER_08]: Tomorse a Cascie on Colors and Marv Wolfman is the editor.
[SPEAKER_08]: I'm Chad Anderson.
[SPEAKER_08]: I'll be playing your narrator today.
[SPEAKER_07]: I'm Chandler Russell and I will be your beast.
[SPEAKER_01]: Uh, I'm Allison Parent and I'll be Wasp, Patsy Walker, and Lady Luck.
[SPEAKER_06]: I'm Jack Nichols, and I'll be your Thor.
[SPEAKER_11]: I'm Apparent.
[SPEAKER_11]: I will be Iron Man, The Vision, and Hyperion.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm Ruth Ann Press, and I will be your Scarlet Witch, your Moon Dragon, and your Golden Archer.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm Kevin Canirae, and I will be Immortious, Hugh Jones, and Wizard.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm Scott Frey, and I will be Buzz Baxter, Dr.
[SPEAKER_00]: Spectrum, and the Royal Hot Kid.
[SPEAKER_09]: Goodness Scott, go excited.
[SPEAKER_09]: I'm Daniel Gilford, and I'll be playing Yellowjacket and The Hedgeman.
[SPEAKER_08]: The cover is by Gilkane and John Ramita, the Avengers lineup on one side, Vision, Iron Man, Captain America, Scarlet Witch Beast.
[SPEAKER_08]: On the other, it's the Squadron Sinister, Lady Lark.
[SPEAKER_08]: Wizard, Dr.
[SPEAKER_08]: Spectrum, Hyperion, Golden Archer.
[SPEAKER_08]: It's Team Versus Team, enough said.
[SPEAKER_08]: And for those of you that hurt us open the month with X-Men number 100, where we saw the Team Versus Team lineup, this is a direct parody of that cover we see it so often in comics after that.
[SPEAKER_08]: And there came a day, a day unlike any other when Earth's mighty superheroes and heroines found themselves united against a common threat.
[SPEAKER_08]: On that day, the Avengers were born.
[SPEAKER_08]: To fight the foes, no single superhero could withstand.
[SPEAKER_08]: Through the years, their roster has prospered, changing many times, but their glory has never been denied.
[SPEAKER_08]: He'd decal then for now!
[SPEAKER_08]: The Avengers assemble, Stanley presents the mighty Avengers in the Phantom Empire.
[SPEAKER_08]: Previously at Avengers, Beast used science to help save the life of Yellowjacket, who sized changing powers had gone out of control.
[SPEAKER_08]: Vision got to save the day as he and the Scarlet Witch came back from their honeymoon.
[SPEAKER_08]: Thor remains the chairman of the team, Iron Man and Moon Dragon, are off on a quest to find Hawkeye, who they've discovered has been using Dr. Doom's time machine and is missing in the past.
[SPEAKER_08]: The Happy Go Lucky Beast goes bounding down the street in blue briefs, unaware of the green-clad men with guns forming behind him.
[SPEAKER_07]: Man, it's wonderful that both yellow jacket and the wasp are on the mend.
[SPEAKER_07]: This bouncing baby beast bow with the big bows had a happy ending after all.
[SPEAKER_07]: But I guess things will be quieting down now.
[SPEAKER_08]: Well, if this nightstriker, we're just any unwavery tourist, the most bizarre mugging would be history soon.
[SPEAKER_08]: However, this was the beast.
[SPEAKER_07]: I thought I'd hoi to put it at.
[SPEAKER_07]: I did, I did.
[SPEAKER_07]: I did hoi to put it at.
[SPEAKER_07]: But he looks more like a mice with an atomic brick.
[SPEAKER_08]: The men open fire on the beast, blowing up a car as the mutant narrowly evades, bounds back and even kicks the men into face before jumping off a light post, knocking two of the men's heads together with his feet, and then getting hit in midair with another explosion.
[SPEAKER_08]: This is going to be an extremely bizarre mugging.
[SPEAKER_10]: What you did, fastest tail on the double.
[SPEAKER_07]: Don't make me laugh, Moldoon.
[SPEAKER_07]: I'm looking to be an Avenger soon, so you better look out.
[SPEAKER_07]: I'm as limber as your average limberger and twice as tricky.
[SPEAKER_07]: Whatever your game may be, you, ah, no.
[SPEAKER_07]: Why are you standing?
[SPEAKER_07]: That last, like a thousand cold needles, can't hold up hell.
[SPEAKER_08]: But in comes a hero and red-white and blue, his feet and hands both tucked behind his shield as he slams into the villains.
[SPEAKER_09]: Only if, and after you kill me, Mr.
[SPEAKER_09]: Ooh, Captain America, soldier.
[SPEAKER_07]: Thanks, Cap.
[SPEAKER_07]: That was all my manic metabolism needed to recover itself.
[SPEAKER_07]: You know, mind if I give you a hand, though, do you?
[SPEAKER_07]: Listen, be my guest.
[SPEAKER_07]: I don't think there is liberal as you, Beast.
[SPEAKER_07]: Can't you ever stay out of politics, man?
[SPEAKER_08]: But it's a great read of Captain Beck, by the way.
[SPEAKER_08]: Although Beast mentioning his manic metabolism I feel like is clear indication that he has bipolar disorder I just want to throw that out there really fast fighting at each other's backs.
[SPEAKER_08]: The two heroes throw a series of punches sending the green clad villains fleeing Hey, no joke cap.
[SPEAKER_07]: You're showing up right then got me out of a tight spot Dare I assume it was only coincidence there is very little coincidence in this line of work as you well know
[SPEAKER_09]: No, I've been tailing the crew's sergeant to see several months back, uh, friend of mine, all the Nomad saved huge zones, president of the Rockson oil company from Warlord Crane and the Serpent Squad.
[SPEAKER_08]: Keynide readers will know that Nomad was actually Captain America himself when he gave up the identity after the whole Watergate scandal that we talked about on the show a while back.
[SPEAKER_08]: and that rocks on oil guy, his name is Hugh Jones, which is a play on words, because it sounds like huge bones.
[SPEAKER_08]: It's the billionaire oil barren, but onward we go, we get some flashbacks to Captain America's numbers 181, 185, 186.
[SPEAKER_09]: At the time, that seemed like all there was to it, but later when the Falcon and I were tearing up Washington searching for the red skull, Jones just drove up and told us where to find him as repayment he said.
[SPEAKER_09]: He refused to tell me how he knew.
[SPEAKER_09]: While at all he said was that he had his sources.
[SPEAKER_09]: I had to go on my mind then, so I put Jones on the bat burner.
[SPEAKER_09]: But later, at the skulls hide a strange troops burst in and massacre to his men.
[SPEAKER_09]: Once I gave it some thought, I did some snooping around the rocks on building and tagged our friends as probable trooper.
[SPEAKER_09]: Tonight, I watched him pick up some of his pals and go out on the prowl.
[SPEAKER_07]: For me, but why?
[SPEAKER_07]: This is the first time you and I've met face to face in years.
[SPEAKER_07]: Heck, we're not even going to be contemporary Avengers.
[SPEAKER_08]: Did you say Avengers?
[SPEAKER_08]: Back over to Avengers Mansion, the mysterious woman in a pink coat is still waiting on the steps.
[SPEAKER_08]: And yes, she should still fancy walker.
[SPEAKER_08]: Avengers!
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, I'm still waiting for them, or at least for their new recruit the beast and I'll keep riding till doomsday if I have to.
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, perhaps it won't take quite that long, Miss.
[SPEAKER_02]: I just tuned in this evening's news and have learned that they are Mercy General Hospital.
[SPEAKER_01]: Hospital, the beast not hard, is he?
[SPEAKER_02]: I believe it's a yellow jacket and the wasp, Miss.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, that's good.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, that's bad for the Pam's book.
[SPEAKER_01]: Good for me.
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, I don't know what I mean.
[SPEAKER_01]: Goodbye, and it's miss.
[SPEAKER_01]: Not miss.
[SPEAKER_08]: I love her so much.
[SPEAKER_08]: Oh, strange young woman.
[SPEAKER_08]: So she is so she is.
[SPEAKER_08]: And this month we'll even find out who she is.
[SPEAKER_08]: But first let's get where she's go.
[SPEAKER_08]: I can see the stars of this show, the mighty Avengers.
[SPEAKER_08]: At the hospital, Jenna Van Dyne and Hank Pym are in matching hospital beds, each holding a dozen roses.
[SPEAKER_08]: Pink flowers bloom in the corners as the doctor and nurse check their patients' vitals, thores, scarlet witch in the vision are there, and Captain America and the beast will soon join them.
[SPEAKER_01]: I haven't had this many flowers since our wedding, Hank.
[SPEAKER_09]: Well, you said you wanted some, and besides, I have to lie here and meant to.
[SPEAKER_09]: But if I ever find the guy who sent that extra bit of aid to me, I'll be out of this bed so fast.
[SPEAKER_03]: I ordered them for myself, actually, as a true witch, I've come to like having flowers around.
[SPEAKER_11]: say, have it she acquired on her honeymoon island hank.
[SPEAKER_11]: I knew she couldn't come back to New York without you.
[SPEAKER_09]: Sorry to interrupt, but the Beast and I are in what pursuit of a private army.
[SPEAKER_09]: This is Avengers business.
[SPEAKER_09]: Can we talk?
[SPEAKER_09]: Sorry to cut this so short people, but from what I hear, you need to rest anyway.
[SPEAKER_09]: Okay, Kat, have fun.
[SPEAKER_09]: Let's stop back again.
[SPEAKER_09]: We haven't had a chat in months.
[SPEAKER_08]: And Hank Pym is still clutching his roses.
[SPEAKER_08]: I'm just saying this is a set of seaside.
[SPEAKER_08]: We're not going to see Hank and Janet for a little while as they convalesce, but we haven't loved having them on the show.
[SPEAKER_08]: Now we move forward.
[SPEAKER_06]: Good then.
[SPEAKER_06]: There are alpins.
[SPEAKER_06]: We leave you now.
[SPEAKER_06]: Avengers business.
[SPEAKER_06]: Half the sauce.
[SPEAKER_06]: Bangle Avenger returned to us at last.
[SPEAKER_09]: Hey, care you too, and hey, it's those robes, huh?
[SPEAKER_09]: May the power within you grow.
[SPEAKER_01]: That good people, Hank.
[SPEAKER_01]: Whatever knocks we've taken, I'm glad we help found the Avengers.
[SPEAKER_09]: I'm still on the side of the bout that, honey.
[SPEAKER_09]: Just here, take these goofy flowers.
[SPEAKER_01]: You're the one who's goofy, lusting after test tubes instead of red blooded adventure.
[SPEAKER_08]: It's red blooded, all right.
[SPEAKER_08]: And hey, Patsy's in there.
[SPEAKER_01]: Hello, aren't the Avengers here?
[SPEAKER_01]: No, I'm sorry, Miss.
[SPEAKER_01]: You just missed them.
[SPEAKER_01]: They're headed for their mansion.
[SPEAKER_01]: Wait, don't I know who you?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, thanks, goodbye!
[SPEAKER_08]: Meanwhile, on the streets to come, Thor is referencing a particularly problematic Falcon story happening in Captain America 186 that involves Jive talking in Pimps and Sam Wilson's secret identity is snap Wilson out, go looking up, we're going to move on.
[SPEAKER_06]: There's some tie-in between Rocks and Oil and the Brand Corporation, so tonight's action proved it.
[SPEAKER_06]: This is the case that Falcon should stare clear of since it hit so close to a core of his new personality and since Avengers were already involved, I thought it was time to join forces again.
[SPEAKER_06]: Just good that thou dits, Captain, get hold of what now transpires to save the crowd.
[SPEAKER_07]: Look, it's a quinget!
[SPEAKER_07]: And that means Iron Man and Moon Dragon are back.
[SPEAKER_07]: With or without the missing Hawkeye, let's hope we don't have a double crisis on our hands.
[SPEAKER_08]: They quicken their pace toward the headquarters as Thor fills in cap on the background of the Bowman's strange absence.
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, good evening sir.
[SPEAKER_02]: There was a young lady.
[SPEAKER_06]: Enough JavaScript later.
[SPEAKER_11]: Howdy people, it looks like we've timed our rifle about right.
[SPEAKER_11]: Well, high love birds.
[SPEAKER_11]: I didn't expect to see you back so soon.
[SPEAKER_11]: That was a short honeymoon.
[SPEAKER_03]: We know, Iron Man.
[SPEAKER_06]: Yeah, but you're between Avenger, Hawkeye, then his lost.
[SPEAKER_03]: Worst than that, Thunder God, if our suspicions are correct, your friend has been trapped in time, to lure the rest of us to our doom.
[SPEAKER_11]: It doesn't take much of a genius to figure out who did it either.
[SPEAKER_11]: We've been had by Kang the Conqueror.
[SPEAKER_11]: Again, this is getting monotonous.
[SPEAKER_11]: Didn't any of you suspect it might happen?
[SPEAKER_06]: Who could expect the man to be obsessed?
[SPEAKER_03]: For that reason, Thor, we alone should seek a king.
[SPEAKER_03]: As gods, you and I are easily the best suited to the task.
[SPEAKER_06]: That's fine with me, Thor.
[SPEAKER_06]: I've walked into an ongoing situation.
[SPEAKER_06]: You'll have to split the team anyway, and what I most need is numbers.
[SPEAKER_06]: If...
[SPEAKER_01]: So there you are.
[SPEAKER_01]: Nobody's gonna keep me away from you this time.
[SPEAKER_01]: You're mine at last, Beast!
[SPEAKER_08]: Patsy Walker storms in past Jarvis, her coat opened to reveal a cute yellow dress with buttons on top and vertical stripes on the bottom.
[SPEAKER_08]: Oh my heavenly days!
[SPEAKER_08]: Patsy Baxter!
[SPEAKER_08]: You knew it was the former star of Patsy Walker comics and amazing adventures all along, didn't you, Drew Believer?
[SPEAKER_01]: It's Patsy Walker again these days, fellow, not that you'd bother to keep track of me.
[SPEAKER_07]: Uh, look, Pat.
[SPEAKER_07]: I'm in the middle of some important business here.
[SPEAKER_07]: Ah, the heck with it.
[SPEAKER_07]: New caught me fair and square.
[SPEAKER_07]: Come on in the next room.
[SPEAKER_07]: We can talk there in private.
[SPEAKER_03]: This may take time, Thor.
[SPEAKER_03]: Are we agreed to go?
[SPEAKER_07]: Hi.
[SPEAKER_07]: Farewell, Captain America.
[SPEAKER_07]: That's a love to you, Thunder God.
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, Beast.
[SPEAKER_01]: Talk turkey.
[SPEAKER_08]: I have to assume Moon Dragon is attracted to Patsy Walker and just rushing out of their space disposal.
[SPEAKER_08]: The voices outside the cramped room fade is Thor and Moon Dragon make their exit, but the voices inside crescendo in controversy for 10 long minutes.
[SPEAKER_07]: Then, at last, Pat has an announcement to make.
[SPEAKER_07]: Go ahead, Pat.
[SPEAKER_07]: Don't be shy.
[SPEAKER_01]: Just see you watch me.
[SPEAKER_01]: Listen, everybody, the beast is really Hank McCoy.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, Miss, we know that already.
[SPEAKER_01]: You do?
[SPEAKER_07]: They do.
[SPEAKER_07]: I told him who cares.
[SPEAKER_07]: I don't have a secret ID anymore, so you don't have anything to hold over my head anymore.
[SPEAKER_07]: Still in a moment of weakness, I did make you a promise.
[SPEAKER_07]: And if it's all right with you, Cap, I'd like to have her come as an observer of this action tonight.
[SPEAKER_07]: Let's go, everybody.
[SPEAKER_07]: Just a minute, beast.
[SPEAKER_07]: As I understand it, you haven't been officially designated an Avenger.
[SPEAKER_07]: No, but I hope you'll play along with me.
[SPEAKER_07]: I want to show her what superheroing involves for reasons of my own, but even observation might be dangerous.
[SPEAKER_07]: Maybe, but despite her school girl charm, Pat Walker's got grit.
[SPEAKER_07]: Anyway, didn't you want to take a kid named Rick Jones around with you besides?
[SPEAKER_07]: I'll watch out for her.
[SPEAKER_08]: as true.
[SPEAKER_08]: And so the Avengers began simultaneous operations, both of which are destined to shake them to their very souls.
[SPEAKER_06]: I did agree to go with the priestess because I have warned vengeance upon this villain from the void.
[SPEAKER_06]: But I must insist that thou dust mentioned my god had no more.
[SPEAKER_03]: You dislike being called a god before men, A.
[SPEAKER_03]: You are so, so egalitarian.
[SPEAKER_08]: With barely a furrowed brow, the mysterious Titanus fires a brainbolt across countless centuries, despite himself Thor stands astounded as such unguessed power, and the ease with which it was wielded, psychic circles swirl around Moon Dragon, and with the sound effects,
[SPEAKER_08]: Snap, a man in an enormous purple hat and purple cape manifests in a vision before them.
[SPEAKER_08]: It's a man for recognises.
[SPEAKER_03]: Who calls him artists?
[SPEAKER_03]: One who learns your brain patterns when we last met a master of time, two who seek carrying the conqueror.
[SPEAKER_03]: You wish for me to transport you through time?
[SPEAKER_03]: You have aided the Avengers before, and we would avoid mechanical time machines.
[SPEAKER_02]: Follow my image from your era to the present of forever.
[SPEAKER_08]: Thor has gotta be thinking how did I end up out space time with these two homos?
[SPEAKER_08]: Suddenly, Thor and Moon Dragon are enveloped by an energy and reappear in the floating cosmos.
[SPEAKER_08]: Immortus in a short green dress and green boots floats in front of them on a crystalline platform.
[SPEAKER_08]: And then, they are pulled through reality into a cosmos of yellow and blue complex striations.
[SPEAKER_08]: Immortus rockets ahead in a beam of yellow light pulling the two Avengers behind him.
[SPEAKER_08]: And just ahead, hang the conqueror in a purple face mask, green jumpsuit that is cinched honey, and striped purple boots up to the hip.
[SPEAKER_02]: And then once more to the forever out now.
[SPEAKER_03]: I sense Hawkeye, in that direction, lead us inward toward the beginning of mortise.
[SPEAKER_06]: My mind's rough.
[SPEAKER_06]: None of us truly knew the extent of her skill.
[SPEAKER_03]: Father, father, wait!
[SPEAKER_10]: Who lit?
[SPEAKER_10]: You have fallen into the trap of Kang the Conqueror.
[SPEAKER_03]: Are you certain, Kang?
[SPEAKER_03]: No one has trapped until he has helped us.
[SPEAKER_08]: And that will find us far from that.
[SPEAKER_08]: Thor throws his hammer, but it bounces off the force shield of Kang.
[SPEAKER_12]: Yet even my demioner cannot harm me while I wear my personal force field godling.
[SPEAKER_02]: Kang!
[SPEAKER_02]: He's your madness!
[SPEAKER_08]: Have I much proven you cannot prevail?
[SPEAKER_08]: These two counterparts face each other in giant size Avengers, recently during the celestial Madonna saga.
[SPEAKER_08]: And for those of you who are not well versed in the world of Kang the Conqueror, this is the same guy from two different time periods.
[SPEAKER_08]: Roma tuts another gay version of these characters.
[SPEAKER_08]: We'll talk about it more another time.
[SPEAKER_08]: Anyway, they haven't got a lot going on.
[SPEAKER_08]: Don't worry about it.
[SPEAKER_11]: The minute I cease to try and mortise is the minute I fulfill your prophecy of my coming weakness.
[SPEAKER_10]: You will never see that time.
[SPEAKER_10]: You and the Avengers kept the Celestial Madonna from my hands.
[SPEAKER_10]: If it takes forever, I shall destroy you for it.
[SPEAKER_06]: Neville and Tisdau who was suffered destruction.
[SPEAKER_06]: You all are going to absorb that evil, right?
[SPEAKER_06]: Bring it into concentration and hurt it back upon me.
[SPEAKER_06]: And Thor does just that with a sazam.
[SPEAKER_03]: Net rocked him Thor.
[SPEAKER_03]: You do have an exceptional mastery of your beloved combat.
[SPEAKER_03]: But look, he's falling back into the haze from which he came.
[SPEAKER_06]: Falling or fleeing, in either case, to avail him enough, his time will be the end of Kang, so swear store.
[SPEAKER_06]: Am I correct in mortise?
[SPEAKER_02]: Aye, do not make predictions, godling!
[SPEAKER_02]: Aye, but follow a road, I have already traveled!
[SPEAKER_08]: And though the gods now known to time, and though the gods now known to time, the Avengers would consider this at the same moment elsewhere in eternity.
[SPEAKER_08]: The remaining Avengers are sneaking back into the old familiar brand corporation once again.
[SPEAKER_10]: This is as far as we can go with hope being seen.
[SPEAKER_09]: The Beast and I are right, Shell Head.
[SPEAKER_09]: There's at least a part of an army in there.
[SPEAKER_09]: Five superheroes should be able to take them, but it's still going to be a fight.
[SPEAKER_11]: Listen, Cap.
[SPEAKER_11]: Stark Industries has dealt with brand and we got bitten badly.
[SPEAKER_11]: I've always thought they played the game too fast and loose.
[SPEAKER_11]: That and your smiling face are what kept me here when I could have gone after Haka and Kang.
[SPEAKER_11]: I'm with you all the way.
[SPEAKER_07]: Oh my, this is great!
[SPEAKER_08]: You are not going beyond this gate lady.
[SPEAKER_08]: One to two starts to whisper but then stops and thinks ahead of her shortened honeymoon and the vision swift return of them to the Avengers life.
[SPEAKER_08]: A glow with love as she is, she's still fine, she doesn't really like it.
[SPEAKER_08]: But none of the Avengers realize they're being watched on a screen inside by two men.
[SPEAKER_08]: Head of security buzz backster, the recently divorced husband of Patsy Walker,
[SPEAKER_08]: And Hugh Jones, the slimy president of Rockson Oil.
[SPEAKER_08]: He's smoking a full cigar.
[SPEAKER_02]: Mm-hmm, sitting ducks.
[SPEAKER_02]: The beast, then, let's think our security is still at its 1970 free level, A.C.A.M.O.
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, that's a affirmative Mr. Jones.
[SPEAKER_02]: Hey, couldn't know what rock sawman brand could do when they put, hey, Colonel.
[SPEAKER_02]: Isn't that your wife with them?
[SPEAKER_00]: Good lord it is.
[SPEAKER_00]: But whatever hair brain scheme that Torps got cooking this time, it won't, well, who Colonel buzz backster.
[SPEAKER_00]: Anyway, she's my ex-wife.
[SPEAKER_08]: Okay, now dry your eyes.
[SPEAKER_08]: You wouldn't want to miss any of the upcoming action as Beast jumps over a fence, but as he does that vision phases through the wall and simply opens the gate for the others.
[SPEAKER_08]: I'm getting good at this.
[SPEAKER_07]: My breakin' at the brand bit is close to perfect.
[SPEAKER_07]: Though I have to admit it'll never match his.
[SPEAKER_07]: Of all the Avengers I've met, he's the hardest to figure out.
[SPEAKER_07]: I mean, he really could be a vision.
[SPEAKER_07]: He's so spooky and after my years as an X man, I know spooky.
[SPEAKER_07]: Hmm, speaking of spooky.
[SPEAKER_07]: I wonder where the guards are.
[SPEAKER_07]: Why don't you just know it?
[SPEAKER_08]: A portal opens and five garishly clad villains pass through.
[SPEAKER_08]: Looking as though they represent a whole league of justice, pun intended.
[SPEAKER_08]: Lady Lark is in a form fitting feathered one piece bathing suit in brown with a black belt at her waist, black heels, brown gloves, a domino mask,
[SPEAKER_08]: Pearl earrings and her short feathered hair to complete her look.
[SPEAKER_08]: The wizard is in a skin-tight yellow with blue bodice, boost boots, gloves, and a mask on.
[SPEAKER_08]: Yellow goggles on his eyes, a lightning bolt on his forehead, only his nose, mouth, and chin exposed.
[SPEAKER_08]: Dr.
[SPEAKER_08]: Spectrum, however, is covered head to toe in red, yellow, and blue the primary colors.
[SPEAKER_08]: A black starburst on his forehead, his hands glowing with energy.
[SPEAKER_08]: The golden archer,
[SPEAKER_08]: is in head to toe, Robin Hood, yellow, yellow hat to yellow boots, yellow bow and yellow arrows, yellow feather in his yellow cap.
[SPEAKER_08]: And then there's Hyperion, a nuclear symbol on his chest, all rippling muscles and frightening super strength, but suit skin type red with yellow metallic briefs and a golden cape fit on the front of the right shoulder and on the back of his left.
[SPEAKER_08]: They met the Avengers first and last way back in Avengers 85 and 86 as the squadron's sinister.
[SPEAKER_02]: Halt and Truders, Halt and face the fury of the squadron's supreme.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's supreme, not sinister Avengers, just you know who creamed you.
[SPEAKER_09]: God, the creamed in these issues.
[SPEAKER_09]: That doesn't make any sense.
[SPEAKER_09]: The Squadron Sinister was a creation of the Grandmaster.
[SPEAKER_09]: Those men were evil, but the Squadron Supreme, they looked similar.
[SPEAKER_09]: We're actually heroes from a parallel dimension.
[SPEAKER_09]: And you, you look like the golden archer who was only a disguise of Hawkeyes.
[SPEAKER_08]: Cap's right, see Avengers 69th or 71, and Captain America 179, anyway, his shield blocks the explosive arrow fire at him, but his shield cannot block the truly horrid British accent that you're about to hear from the golden archer.
[SPEAKER_03]: That's what I chose the name, got not on my word, I was on my world, I was called Hawkeye, but here I had to avoid confusion.
[SPEAKER_03]: It was a good joke to take his name in costume, what?
[SPEAKER_08]: That's excellent.
[SPEAKER_08]: Nearby, Iron Man is shooting repulsors at the wizard, but the wizard runs yellow streaks around the gold and red Avenger.
[SPEAKER_08]: GA always overreacts.
[SPEAKER_02]: It's a trademark.
[SPEAKER_02]: All you Avengers will be just memory soon anyway.
[SPEAKER_11]: The wizard lives up to his name.
[SPEAKER_11]: Without quick silver around, I forgot and what speed can mean.
[SPEAKER_11]: Have to sharpen up or I'll leave myself wide open now.
[SPEAKER_08]: Iron Man is knocked from the air as the wizard whizzes hard right into his stomach.
[SPEAKER_02]: In case you're still in the Dark Iron Jaws, I'll put it words in one syllable.
[SPEAKER_08]: We've sold out nearby the beast narrowly evades a punch from Hyperion and then kicks the man right in the face.
[SPEAKER_07]: I thought I smelled something rotten in the state of rocks on.
[SPEAKER_12]: You shant insult the squadron supreme, creature so swears, Hyperion!
[SPEAKER_08]: That's all.
[SPEAKER_08]: Hi.
[SPEAKER_08]: Dr.
[SPEAKER_08]: Spectrum fires a red battering ram at the vision who simply faces to let the attack pass through him.
[SPEAKER_00]: You expected it's only find an army here.
[SPEAKER_00]: What a laugh.
[SPEAKER_00]: Roxanna's whatever it needs always at the ready.
[SPEAKER_11]: I am beginning to realize the truth of your statements, Dr.
[SPEAKER_11]: Spectrum, but you will need more that a power prison to stop one who can will himself to virtual nothingness.
[SPEAKER_08]: Which leaves the three ladies in our tale?
[SPEAKER_03]: And a true witch is more than enough for you, Lady Lark.
[SPEAKER_03]: You remember me then?
[SPEAKER_03]: No.
[SPEAKER_03]: I remember a better woman.
[SPEAKER_08]: One touch of her outstretched hands and the living earth beneath the lady's sandals explodes.
[SPEAKER_08]: So at that point does Pat Baxter.
[SPEAKER_08]: Lady Lark is thrown back at his caught up in it as well.
[SPEAKER_03]: You were told to stay back, Pat.
[SPEAKER_03]: I want some of this action witch.
[SPEAKER_08]: And thus are the tides of battle turned for before Wanda can follow up her first text, Lady Lark emits a single shilling sound, a sound to distort all thought and all matter.
[SPEAKER_08]: Two down, as the Scarlet Witch and Patsy collapse in a sound induced vertigo.
[SPEAKER_08]: If the Scarlet Witch could see her husband now, she'd know how much he loves her, but she's as unconscious as he is.
[SPEAKER_08]: For while the vision is distracted, Dr.
[SPEAKER_08]: Spectrum's power prism blasts the synthesolating crimson colors.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's three down.
[SPEAKER_02]: How fair is the wizard?
[SPEAKER_02]: Almost done, Doc.
[SPEAKER_02]: Ironman's armor slows him down, and even with his footsteps, he can't fight a man who's super fast body.
[SPEAKER_02]: Let's have him literally walk on air!
[SPEAKER_08]: And thus with the final flourish, the wizard finishes his whiz by twirling his forearms at super speed, creating blasts of energy that propel with wizard into the sky while flushing Iron Man down to the ground.
[SPEAKER_08]: And I know I'm purple in my prose here, but I'm not joking when I say that the sound effect that is used while Iron Man hits the ground is dump, I'm not joking guys, so we just sound a wizard dump, everyone.
[SPEAKER_08]: Meanwhile, Hyperion grips beast by the feet and slams him into the wall.
[SPEAKER_12]: Then it's time I showed my true worth and a bit of my unearthly speed.
[SPEAKER_08]: I've down, ready for more of the Golden Archer's accent?
[SPEAKER_08]: Y'all the last one, American, face up to it, lad.
[SPEAKER_08]: You've bitten off more than you can do.
[SPEAKER_08]: As if to echo the Bowman's words, Lady Lark sings once more and ends the recital for the evening.
[SPEAKER_08]: Captain America's perception of self melts away as the Sonic's hit him and he's down and don't worry.
[SPEAKER_02]: Our two straight white guys are still watching on the camera inside as the Squadron Supreme gathers up the defeated Avengers and Pat Baxter as well.
[SPEAKER_00]: Neither do I, Mr. Jones, though ever since she had some connection, a pact of something with the beast.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, once the squad and supreme delivers their prisoners to the escape proof cell, Dr.
[SPEAKER_00]: Spectrum and brand corporation technology cooked up, I'm sure we'll get any answers we want.
[SPEAKER_00]: Then we'll begin our final march to victory, and no one will be able to stop us.
[SPEAKER_08]: And the truth or falsity of the Colonel's words will be shown in the coming months.
[SPEAKER_08]: Marvelite, as will the results of the journey through time.
[SPEAKER_08]: For at the same moment, and centuries before, Thor and Moon Dragon have exited the striated world of light and landed in the desert of the wild wild west.
[SPEAKER_02]: Here is the year and place to which can flood my friends.
[SPEAKER_06]: To my ancient eyes that appears to be the American far west in the year 1871.
[SPEAKER_00]: It is, rather, 1873, demons.
[SPEAKER_00]: The last year you shall ever know.
[SPEAKER_00]: On my gross, this dot is not king.
[SPEAKER_03]: It is incredible.
[SPEAKER_08]: Who or what is so incredible, we'd be only too happy to tell you right now, but we're out of space.
[SPEAKER_08]: And you have to see this to believe it.
[SPEAKER_08]: Don't miss Avengers 142 when the gods go west.
[SPEAKER_08]: Okay, I'll spoil it for you really quickly.
[SPEAKER_08]: It's the raw-eyed kid, the gayest cowboy of all.
[SPEAKER_08]: And no, I'm not kidding.
[SPEAKER_08]: We are jumping all over the place.
[SPEAKER_08]: And that's Avengers 141 friends.
[SPEAKER_08]: We're hearing a significant tone shift in the book moving forward.
[SPEAKER_08]: And we have a lot to unpack as the story transitions from one to the next.
[SPEAKER_08]: uh let's open we're gonna be saying goodbye to yellow jacket in the wasp for a period of time let's hear from a Daniel and uh Allison on the journey of Hank and Jan in their hospital beds with all of their flowers they mostly just complained and made a mess of things yeah they're kind of messy Jan really wanted Hank to rejoin the Avengers if you recall she kind of pushed him in that direction she ended up blown up by the towed he lost his shit battle the whirlwind and almost died in the street they need a rest
[SPEAKER_08]: They need a second they need a vacation if I have a find out who sent me these flowers.
[SPEAKER_08]: I'll let them know We also have Captain America returning to the team He's gonna take some prominence in the book now, which threatens Thor's leadership a little bit But this group is all over the place.
[SPEAKER_08]: Let me hear from Daniel and then Derek what was it like to play cap and Thor here?
[SPEAKER_09]: I think it's fun to have Captain America back in the book and taking on more prominent role.
[SPEAKER_09]: I think, as much as we talk about like comics, they have politics inherently baked into them in Captain America, so that's such a centrally art of this story.
[SPEAKER_09]: It's a point where they call it out on the page in this issue.
[SPEAKER_09]: I think like having him in a story allows this interesting perspective on every sort of step that they take as a team.
[SPEAKER_06]: Thor was kind of nervous about like having to play like health-of-health-a-mail with Cap.
[SPEAKER_06]: Now, he's back.
[SPEAKER_06]: This issue is specifically door being alone with Mundra and again because he wasn't he was two issues ago and then Iron Man got her last time.
[SPEAKER_06]: This one was a little less um, sexually charged so it was good to see him kind of on like even even feel.
[SPEAKER_03]: Because Patsy Walker showed up.
[SPEAKER_08]: What you didn't know you needed was Thor and Moon Dragon in the Old West.
[SPEAKER_08]: It's a really fun journey.
[SPEAKER_08]: We also get Hawkeye's gay adventure with two gun kids.
[SPEAKER_08]: They're for sure hooking up in this old saloon tab.
[SPEAKER_08]: Scott, I know you have pretty strong feelings on the Raw Hyde kid.
[SPEAKER_08]: Well, I was elected to bring him here.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, thanks.
[SPEAKER_00]: Thanks for having me do that.
[SPEAKER_00]: I love the Raw Hyde kid.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's one of my favorite Marvel characters.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's ridiculous and is a really stuff because it's just like, who is the sociopathic twin?
[SPEAKER_00]: just terrorizing the old west.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I love that.
[SPEAKER_00]: I love that for him.
[SPEAKER_00]: I love that for me.
[SPEAKER_08]: Rod kid is a blind spot for me in many ways.
[SPEAKER_08]: I've read that like modern gay series and I've read him in the Avengers, but it's it's it's a fun place for him.
[SPEAKER_08]: I'm looking forward to learning more about this character.
[SPEAKER_08]: We have a lot of old west stuff.
[SPEAKER_08]: Kang the conquerors.
[SPEAKER_08]: Plot here is to go back in time.
[SPEAKER_08]: and conquer the old west so that the future will be conquered.
[SPEAKER_08]: And it's a crazy, wonky thing.
[SPEAKER_08]: Now the Avengers has always been kind of the book at Marvel more than any other that has to take into account all of the continuity happening everywhere else.
[SPEAKER_08]: We have all of these like editors know it's here's what's happening over in caps book and Thor's book and Iron Man's book and to remember amazing adventures, but also remember the squadron's sinister and also
[SPEAKER_08]: like there's a lot happening and we're pulling in now the raw-hide kid and these old Avengers foes all along the way.
[SPEAKER_08]: We're dumping deep into the sandbox and George Perez is having the time of his life of these pencils.
[SPEAKER_08]: Do we have any comments on the art in this book?
[SPEAKER_08]: It's beautiful.
[SPEAKER_02]: I will say this, nobody knows how to do a team book like George Perez.
[SPEAKER_02]: He knows how to draw multiple characters, make them look unique and give them such superhero anatomy in the best possible way.
[SPEAKER_02]: Like he's a master at it.
[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, no, I don't know if he led to the design of Squadron Supreme, they have like a very special place in my heart.
[SPEAKER_07]: I think with this one, what really kind of interested me, which just kind of the everyone's really kind of all in primary colors for the most part, but there's still kind of like foils of each other in a lot of ways, even though we're clearly just asleep versus Avengers.
[SPEAKER_07]: I just appreciate that kind of continuity and parallels, I guess, with the colors.
[SPEAKER_08]: Rounding up the main team, let me hear from the voice actors for each.
[SPEAKER_08]: Let's talk about Iron Man, Moon Dragon, and Beasts Journey here, as the book starts to transition.
[SPEAKER_08]: What was elected play these characters?
[SPEAKER_07]: I mean, Beasts got caught, right?
[SPEAKER_07]: I mean, he didn't really, he wasn't in a lie because everyone knew, but, you know, Patsey had been gutting for him for the last few issues.
[SPEAKER_07]: So in a way, it was sort of anti-climactic.
[SPEAKER_07]: but it was very tongue and cheek and funny and I think Allison does a fantastic like early 20s, 30s like first time women are wearing pants and kind of just like leaning into this woman's suffrage kind of like early New York accent.
[SPEAKER_07]: I live for it.
[SPEAKER_11]: It's very funny for Ironman to go from very like trying to hook up with Moon Dragon to all of a sudden embroiled in the Patti Walker beast of it all.
[SPEAKER_11]: I think that's very funny.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's just intimidating to try to be Moon Dragon in lieu of Sarah's Century, so I would just like to thank her for her epic performance, which allowed me to have something to fall back on, and I just hope I did her, you know, right.
[SPEAKER_08]: Moon Dragon gets like some real powerhouse moments as she jumps through time here, which is really fun, a Thor Thor thinking, the god thinking, oh, she's more powerful than we realized.
[SPEAKER_08]: Now we have a bald woman in the old west, and we get to see her, like, play dress up, next issue, which is really fun.
[SPEAKER_08]: So be prepared for that, Jodie.
[SPEAKER_08]: Now I have done the trial of Moon Dragon and Hellcat on my show during 2025.
[SPEAKER_08]: But for those of you that have listened, these characters have a lot of rich history together, and separately.
[SPEAKER_08]: Patsy Walker was one of kind of Marvel's early kind of sweetheart character.
[SPEAKER_08]: She was like the teen girl character in a lot of 40s magazine.
[SPEAKER_08]: She has hundreds of appearances before they bring her back in the silver age of books here.
[SPEAKER_08]: So Buzz Baxter was kind of the Ken to her Barbie in the old books.
[SPEAKER_08]: He was the All-American kid, but now he's a veteran.
[SPEAKER_08]: He was super unkind to her in amazing adventures.
[SPEAKER_08]: Now they are X spouses.
[SPEAKER_08]: And he's soon to become the really awful super villain Mad Dog, which we'll be talking more about them.
[SPEAKER_08]: Let me hear from Allison and then Scott on the relationship between Patsy and Buzz here and Patsy's journey as a character.
[SPEAKER_08]: It's hilarious to me when they call her Pat Baxter on the page.
[SPEAKER_08]: It's such a weird thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's a loser.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think Patsy's really, really fun.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I didn't know about her ex husband until I read this one.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's sort of a, she doesn't have good luck with husbands because he's, you know, she pivots from him to Damon Halsstrom, which, you know, is a tonal change, but the little son of Satan is kind of a better husband than backster, so, oh, good for Damon, question mark.
[SPEAKER_08]: They're both terrible.
[SPEAKER_08]: And before this comes out, everyone will have heard the trial of Damon and Satana on my show as well.
[SPEAKER_08]: We'll be exploring those characters, which is a sort of fun.
[SPEAKER_08]: We have the character huge owns of Rockson Oil, which is clearly a parallel of the real world,
[SPEAKER_08]: Uh, there's a lot of that brand corporation is a parallel of the real world rant corporation.
[SPEAKER_08]: Let's hear from Kevin on what it was like to play a huge owns.
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, it was huge.
[SPEAKER_02]: Um, I do think whoever backed out of this recording tonight so I could join this because this was a blast.
[SPEAKER_02]: I love how angry he was that he kept seeing Patsy in this cameras.
[SPEAKER_02]: That was my favorite part of that entire thing was he's like, and you're X-Wife, what is she doing here?
[SPEAKER_02]: So angry about her showing up and I just love, I don't know, there's something ridiculous about that about like I was kind of having Snape and Mr. Burns energy I was trying to give where I was like playing with my hands and fingers while he was being extra evil.
[SPEAKER_08]: Both of these stories, the old west one and the one heating up at the brand corporation turn huge huge owns we're going to discover is under the influence of the serpent crown which is channeling an elder god who wants to conquer the entire planet so there's a lot of stuff
[SPEAKER_08]: and they have brought in the squadron supreme slash squadron sinister as as the ancillary characters from another dimension.
[SPEAKER_08]: Now for those of you that know these characters from Mark Greenwald's epic 12-ishy run in the 80s, it's super famous the squadron's squadron supreme.
[SPEAKER_08]: This is the book that he like had his ashes mixed into the ink after he died in the reprints.
[SPEAKER_08]: I talk to his wife Cagronwald on the show about that.
[SPEAKER_08]: What's the squadron supreme?
[SPEAKER_00]: It just, like, broad overview of 50 years of Marvel history.
[SPEAKER_00]: And the idea, as it turns out.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean, they're essentially a pastiche and parody of the Justice League.
[SPEAKER_00]: They appear originally in the 60s as one often tagin' us to the Avengers, as a squadron sinister, and then they come back,
[SPEAKER_00]: sort of in this, and then, you know, through, as you mentioned, Mark Greenwald's maxi series, you know, subsequent appearances, they're a little confusing because there's multiple squadrons supreme from different parallel Earths, so it's not always clear which squadrons supreme you're dealing with, but yeah, they're all sort of stand-ins for Justice League characters, like
[SPEAKER_00]: Nighthawk who was not in this is Batman.
[SPEAKER_00]: Dr.
[SPEAKER_00]: Spectrum is competent Hal Jordan.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, Lady Larkis Black Canary.
[SPEAKER_02]: We have Wizards Flash.
[SPEAKER_02]: And then they change and they get additional members as the Justice League, a DC would get other members, then they would do their knockoff versions later and other ones as that's why the team would change.
[SPEAKER_02]: And I think sometimes you'd see different squadrons of prems because they'd be playing off the idea of like,
[SPEAKER_02]: the evil Justice League are three, you know, like so they were playing off of all the stories.
[SPEAKER_02]: Kind of as a trope to sort of mock D.C. at the beginning, some of it was a little bit of like, like how worse your characters are than ours, but then I think people started to grow to love them and start to like give them a little bit more of a backstory and something more to them.
[SPEAKER_02]: But I think the original intent was when we can't play with their characters, but let's show how much better we are.
[SPEAKER_02]: And there's something really nice about George Perez drawing this and then
[SPEAKER_08]: No, Nighthawk, Nighthawk said additional character they introduced that's the parody of that man who's like the playboy billionaire But he's been brought into the defenders as a main team member along with Hellcat or Patsy Walker later on That's a character.
[SPEAKER_08]: We'll have a lot to say about later Hyperion as the parallel of Superman Scott, let me have you finish your thought and then we'll talk about the individual characters like
[SPEAKER_00]: I was going to say Marvel goes and D.C. then later does their parody of the Avengers called Lord of the Extremists and like this becomes just ongoing thing.
[SPEAKER_00]: So like Lord havoc in the extremists show up and it's like, oh, it's Dr. Doom and et cetera, et cetera.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's fun.
[SPEAKER_08]: OK, let's talk about each of these parody characters really quickly.
[SPEAKER_08]: We've got Hyperion, which is maybe the most used from the squadron supreme, of course.
[SPEAKER_08]: This is a design.
[SPEAKER_08]: I know both Taylor and Derek have their eyes on.
[SPEAKER_08]: Like, ooh, can I cosplay this?
[SPEAKER_08]: I can see it in your eyes.
[SPEAKER_07]: It's a classic look.
[SPEAKER_07]: Enjoy Hyperion's costume just because I feel like it's a little obnoxious, and it's a little on the nose, just with the kind of the mallet or the Adam symbol and whatnot.
[SPEAKER_07]: I was Dr.
[SPEAKER_07]: Spectrum is kind of the one that has a place in my heart for sure, but I think Hyperion is interesting because I think, you know, there's always been this question within DC Comics.
[SPEAKER_07]: And it's been explored several times, you know, if what if Superman, this all-powerful space God, like, turns evil, like this, you know, this guy that no one can beat.
[SPEAKER_07]: And so Hyperion sort of did that first in my mind that he kind of fell into this morally gray area.
[SPEAKER_07]: And so it was kind of a precursor of what's to come.
[SPEAKER_06]: I love a good catch of a mustard color scheme.
[SPEAKER_08]: Thank you very much.
[SPEAKER_08]: Then we've got the incredible lady Lark, which is a really delicious kind of giving bird woman like she are energy almost she's a fun character with like a sonic screen and I know there's a ton of black canary huge fans out there in the world.
[SPEAKER_08]: Let me hear Ruth Ann and Allison comment on lady Lark's look.
[SPEAKER_03]: I just said, I think it's a serve who doesn't want to brown swimsuit, right?
[SPEAKER_03]: With me that a feather is definitely talking about a cosplay.
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm working on that now.
[SPEAKER_08]: We get this delicious moment where like Patsy just grabs Lady Lark's hair, but she screams and they're like, oh no, vertigo, it's it's really fun.
[SPEAKER_08]: Now, we also have the old World War II hero, the wizard, Robert Frank, who's later in this kind of same Ron of books, told to be the parent of Wanda and Pietro.
[SPEAKER_08]: Like, there's a whole story where they think that that he and Miss America are their parents.
[SPEAKER_08]: So it's a parody of the flash, but we've got the wizard deliciously voiced by Kevin here.
[SPEAKER_08]: Now, in 1940s, like, oh, I'm going to take off in a whiz, right?
[SPEAKER_08]: Like, that would have been a thing.
[SPEAKER_08]: But it's just come to mean peace since then and his yellow color scheme is really uncomfortable for the reason.
[SPEAKER_08]: Kevin talked about the wizards look.
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, there's also a musical, called Fulcettos, where one of the main characters name is also Wizard, and it just always sounds wrong every time you hear it.
[SPEAKER_02]: I love a good-fast character.
[SPEAKER_02]: They're all kind of sort of the same bit every time, but I do like that, and it's kind of nod to Flash, which I was trying to give them a little more of kid-flash energy versus regular Flash, but I love somebody who knows how to make a little tornadoes with their hands.
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't know why.
[SPEAKER_02]: From everything from characters from like he-man to like all the comic books, you could spin your arms around fast.
[SPEAKER_02]: I love that shit.
[SPEAKER_08]: We've got Dr.
[SPEAKER_08]: Spectrum who's the Green Lantern parody.
[SPEAKER_08]: He has this kind of primary color ski.
[SPEAKER_09]: He's got like this red blue and yellow, but they're, they kind of meet in a triad in the center of his chest, and he's got the star on his full mask face.
[SPEAKER_09]: It's, it's actually kind of intimidating and scary almost.
[SPEAKER_09]: So definitely there's this contrast between this like more menacing look with the outfit and the primary colors that are typifying you know a hero color scheme.
[SPEAKER_08]: Now one time Hawkeye was like I should have a costume changed so I have a disguise and he dresses like this golden archer and now we have this guy from the other universe that's like.
[SPEAKER_08]: Hey, I want the golden option.
[SPEAKER_08]: I address like, Hulk, I thought it would be a good time.
[SPEAKER_08]: Like, it's ridiculous.
[SPEAKER_08]: Let me hear from a, well, Matt, do you want to describe the golden archers look for us?
[SPEAKER_08]: And then Ruth and I know you jumped in.
[SPEAKER_08]: Last night, I'm at X.
[SPEAKER_11]: He, he very much is the, the green arrow, but he is all yellow and all yellow is a tough look.
[SPEAKER_03]: I, it's also a tough accent.
[SPEAKER_03]: That was a lot of fun.
[SPEAKER_03]: Thank you.
[SPEAKER_03]: I, any time you need me to do that again, I would gladly, gladly do that again, don't know.
[SPEAKER_08]: I love, I have this group of like willing delicious voice actors that so fun to just play with all of you.
[SPEAKER_08]: Okay, now we have to toss in the last bit of crazy and this is Avengers Deep lore.
[SPEAKER_08]: Avengers number eight is where we first meet Kang the Conqueror who's so, so, so queer-coated.
[SPEAKER_08]: He's giving like Wikim Phoenix from like Gladiator, like that evil, like, oh, I'm the board emperor and he's like in his
[SPEAKER_08]: purple, purple, gay, gay, gay costume floating around in a chair like he's lounging with like a cigarette.
[SPEAKER_08]: He's he's so delicious this character.
[SPEAKER_08]: They quickly make him so complicated.
[SPEAKER_08]: We jump into the time travel, tiny whiny of it all, and we meet Immortus.
[SPEAKER_08]: He's like far future self who has some crazy comic book lore himself.
[SPEAKER_08]: We've also met the Scarlet Centurion.
[SPEAKER_08]: We've also met Iron Lad.
[SPEAKER_08]: And we're recently in Avengers Academy.
[SPEAKER_08]: We've got the queer-coded version of this character that's
[SPEAKER_08]: kid amortists by Anthony Olvera, if you've been following any of that.
[SPEAKER_08]: So we have Kang balanced by Immortists.
[SPEAKER_08]: One of them is meant to be evil and one is good and they're fighting each other with the Avengers in the middle.
[SPEAKER_08]: Kevin, your Immortist voice is my favorite thing I've ever fucking heard on the show.
[SPEAKER_02]: I didn't know what to do.
[SPEAKER_02]: I was gonna make it like a little like low-key.
[SPEAKER_02]: I was like not every villain can be so Mwaha, but every line he has ends in an exclamation point.
[SPEAKER_02]: Everyone when I saw that I was like, well, he can't just like talk normally He's there's something wrong with this person
[SPEAKER_02]: I think when you've lived that many centuries, you're just screened.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think he's deaf.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think he's like an old lady who just can't hear, but also can we please discuss the panel where Kang is wearing the highest hip boots that anyone has ever seen in their life.
[SPEAKER_02]: And it looks like Dormamu's face, it's that kind of purple, but with the lines in it.
[SPEAKER_02]: And it is just gorgeous and why is somebody not wearing that right now.
[SPEAKER_08]: But also in mortises, tiny, tiny green skirts.
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh my god, they're outfits.
[SPEAKER_02]: They're all perfect.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think I might do a series of cosplays of just every version of Kang because they're all kind of love it so much.
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, the great thing about Kang is he first appears as Rama Tutt who's just wearing a skirt.
[SPEAKER_00]: Then he goes the full Kang and then once he's elderly he goes back to the skirt and I like I like the cyclical kind of
[SPEAKER_02]: He learned that that's like more useful and practical wearing a little skirt.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's comfortable.
[SPEAKER_08]: I may lean into it, y'all.
[SPEAKER_08]: I've set on the show a few times.
[SPEAKER_08]: Like tracking Kang the Conquer is like my handbook writer's nightmare.
[SPEAKER_08]: He is insane, but it would be really fun to go back and read these old tiny, whiny stories.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think they could counsel of Kang's and require each person to find one of the Kang's and they have to follow it.
[SPEAKER_08]: If you listen to my show if you ask me my least favorite thing at Marvel is the council of cross time fucking kings.
[SPEAKER_08]: I hate it
[SPEAKER_08]: Maybe, maybe I don't know.
[SPEAKER_08]: I may take a journey next year.
[SPEAKER_08]: We'll see.
[SPEAKER_08]: We have a candidate of Morris on the show unexpectedly, so I don't know.
[SPEAKER_08]: We'll see what we'll do.
[SPEAKER_08]: Okay, as we're wrapping up, do we have any kind of final thoughts or shout out?
[SPEAKER_08]: So this is a character heavy journey.
[SPEAKER_08]: And we're going to jump into the story full fledged in the new year where we just go get lost in beasts journey with the Avengers along the way.
[SPEAKER_08]: It's a very fun time.
[SPEAKER_08]: And I'm having such a joyful time putting this together.
[SPEAKER_08]: Thank you all for your support.
[SPEAKER_06]: Shoutouts to everybody like on this call that really leaned into the accent work.
[SPEAKER_06]: It was pretty incredible.
[SPEAKER_06]: Just kind of saying back and listen to me.
[SPEAKER_06]: Do you want to follow me on social media?
[SPEAKER_06]: I'm a Derek J. Nichols on Instagram and then on TikTok.
[SPEAKER_06]: Planets here, Derek, is where I post my captain planet recaps.
[SPEAKER_06]: So I've been going through season one so you can check it out there.
[SPEAKER_08]: Taylor, your alliteration isn't these today was amazing.
[SPEAKER_07]: Beast bows and bouncing bows, I can't quite repeat it.
[SPEAKER_07]: I think it's just shout out to everyone of course, but also Kevin, you have such a range like in your voices and you're acting and I love it because like if I didn't know it was you, I probably would be like guessing.
[SPEAKER_07]: It looks like it's at the same voice actor.
[SPEAKER_07]: Like there's a consistency to it, but there's also a variety to it.
[SPEAKER_07]: And I just I really love just witnessing that.
[SPEAKER_07]: Oh, and if you want to follow me online at Taylor Underscore, the bookstaboy on Instagram, I should use Blue Sky more, but I haven't gotten there yet.
[SPEAKER_08]: My favorite character journeys in this episode was Patsy Walker, who is just delicious, pushing past everyone, taking no names, and jumping right into the thick of a superhero battle with pulling hair.
[SPEAKER_08]: She's so great.
[SPEAKER_01]: I want to shout out Kevin, because that was just delicious.
[SPEAKER_01]: Here, every thing that you did.
[SPEAKER_01]: You can find me at Alison Parent on Blue Sky, and you can also turn into our podcast and skip the mode of verse.
[SPEAKER_01]: This month, we're doing the Nadia Nice List, which really great books and then characters behaving badly, like killing horses.
[SPEAKER_11]: And I'm a parent.
[SPEAKER_11]: You can follow me at Matt Parent on Blue Sky.
[SPEAKER_11]: I'm also a skip the mode of verse.
[SPEAKER_11]: Obviously, I want to shout out Taylor, you're so grounding in these books that your beast is just so good.
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, I'm going to shout out Chad because you keep putting all of this together and you keep putting me in a room with all of these amazing people.
[SPEAKER_03]: So thank you for that.
[SPEAKER_03]: What what great fun and all the rest of you make me better at doing this.
[SPEAKER_03]: So it is a pleasure to be with you all.
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't have anything personal to shout out.
[SPEAKER_03]: So I'm going to say if everyone has been really frustrated with sort of the sad arc of vision and star that which is honeymoon in this issue.
[SPEAKER_03]: Go read Steve Orlando's The Vision in the Scarlet Witch.
[SPEAKER_03]: You'll get to issue five.
[SPEAKER_03]: Everything will be redeemed.
[SPEAKER_03]: It will be great.
[SPEAKER_03]: Enjoy it.
[SPEAKER_03]: It's fantastic.
[SPEAKER_03]: You can find me on Instagram at at head of Dapler.
[SPEAKER_09]: My name is Dr. Daniel Gilford.
[SPEAKER_09]: I'm a climate scientist and I love to talk about climate and comics.
[SPEAKER_09]: Reach out to me if that's something that's interesting to you.
[SPEAKER_09]: I'm at comic extracts on Instagram and I'm just so grateful for the opportunity to spend time with all of you.
[SPEAKER_09]: It's just a wonderful way to spend a new link together.
[SPEAKER_00]: No, I also want to shout out Chad.
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you for having me join your Avengers reading and getting to voice my favorite member of the Squadron Supreme, Dr.
[SPEAKER_00]: Spectrum, and the Royal Hot Kid.
[SPEAKER_00]: You can find me on Instagram, Blue Sky, et cetera, it's just got free as of podcast, Clone Conspiracy, where I try to explain the Clone saga and then Riley.
[SPEAKER_00]: So if you like depressing men from the 90s, you're guy.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm Kevin Canary, and I am honored and blessed every time I receive a text from Chad saying he might have a role to do for me and one of these things.
[SPEAKER_02]: It is the true joy in my life right now, and I love it, and I don't have my own podcast, but I love to glam off of Chad and all of his work, and just show up and do things here.
[SPEAKER_02]: So you might hear me on some other script readings as well, because this is a delight.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'll be in the new year at WonderCon and a few other conventions during the year so if you see me there please especially if you're one of these people on these beautiful script readings please say hi I'd love you all and I see you in little tiny boxes, but I have very strong feelings about all of you Thank you.
[SPEAKER_08]: Thank you, my friends Lastly, I'm Chad Anderson.
[SPEAKER_08]: I keep my on social media private because I got kiddos you can follow the show a grandma can underscore late
[SPEAKER_08]: It's going to wild journey for me, professionally and personally this year on the show.
[SPEAKER_08]: Lots of conversations about fascism as I'm trying to figure out how to be the father of a gay kid and a therapist and a civilian in America these days.
[SPEAKER_08]: It's been kind of a heavy, heavy journey, but we're closing the year out with a lot of silliness over on the Patreon in December.
[SPEAKER_08]: We have five eyeball themed episodes.
[SPEAKER_08]: But watch for it, and we're gonna jump into Nightcrawler as the themed character as we open the year in 2021.
[SPEAKER_08]: So it remains at a tremendous joy.
[SPEAKER_08]: I love producing this show.
[SPEAKER_08]: I love doing the research and I love this community more than anything.
[SPEAKER_08]: So thank you everybody for your ongoing support.
[SPEAKER_08]: Uh, super grateful for all of you.
[SPEAKER_08]: All right, everybody.
[SPEAKER_08]: Thanks for listening.
[SPEAKER_08]: We will see you back here next time on Great Malkin Lane and uh, Happy Holidays!
[SPEAKER_08]: and now stay tuned for some thoughts on fascism as a special guest and I talked about a red skull story and it's modern applications.
[SPEAKER_08]: Hitler's table talk, or the, uh, I got to practice my pronunciation here.
[SPEAKER_08]: Tishka prashka, no, uh, Tishka spraka, Tishka spraka.
[SPEAKER_08]: Hitler's table talk where Tishka spraka is a collection of informal conversations, Adolf Hitler held with his inner circle.
[SPEAKER_08]: Primarily between 1941 and 1944, at his military headquarters in East Prussia, most famously called the Wolfs Lair.
[SPEAKER_08]: Think of a little bit like the Nixon tapes for those of you that may be familiar from American history.
[SPEAKER_08]: Unlike speeches or propaganda writings, these talks were private candid discussions over meals, or casual gatherings, intended to reflect that there's personal views on politics, ideology, war, and culture.
[SPEAKER_08]: Participants included high-raking Nazi officials, AIDS and select visitors, and the conversations raised ranged from military strategy and racial theory to art philosophy and Hitler's vision of Germany and the world.
[SPEAKER_08]: It feels like a segment Trump might put out on Fox News, if you will.
[SPEAKER_08]: The recording of these conversations begin with Heinrich Heim, a personal aid and officer who meticulously took notes on Hitler's remarks, often including the date, location, and attendees.
[SPEAKER_08]: Heim's transcriptions aimed to capture Hitler's informal reasoning, not to produce necessarily a public document.
[SPEAKER_08]: But he sometimes recorded Hitler's statements verbatim, sometimes paraphrased for clarity.
[SPEAKER_08]: Later Henry Picker, working under Martin Borman, compiled and edited the notes, creating a more organized manuscript for internal use within the Nazi leadership.
[SPEAKER_08]: Berman purportedly intended these records to serve as a reference for Hitler's ideological positions, preserving his worldview for posterity.
[SPEAKER_08]: After World War II, the manuscripts were seized by Allied forces and recognized as valuable historical documents.
[SPEAKER_08]: The first German editions were published in the 1950s and later the 60s based on the combined high-end picker transcriptions.
[SPEAKER_08]: In English, the text appeared in 1953 as Hitler's tabletop.
[SPEAKER_08]: 1941 through 1944 translated by RH Stevens and became a key source for historian studying Hitler's private mindset.
[SPEAKER_08]: That book is still available out there.
[SPEAKER_08]: Scholars have debated the accuracy and editorial influence of these editions, noting that some nuances may have been lost or altered, but the text is broadly accepted as a primary source for understanding Hitler's informal thoughts and
[SPEAKER_08]: The significance of table talk lies in its ability to reveal the gap between Hitler's public rhetoric and private ideology, whereas speeches in propaganda often aimed to manipulate or reassure audiences.
[SPEAKER_08]: Table talk captures his unfiltered views, including his plans for Eastern Europe, racial policies, reflections on art and culture, and apocalyptic visions for Germany.
[SPEAKER_08]: Historians use these records to trace the evolution of his world view over time, understand the rationale behind Nazi policies, and study the psychological and ideological foundations of Hitler's leadership during World War II.
[SPEAKER_08]: It remains an indispensable resource for understanding not just the man, but the interlogic of the regime he led.
[SPEAKER_08]: Also not a pleasant read.
[SPEAKER_08]: No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no
[SPEAKER_08]: recommend this year very curious.
[SPEAKER_08]: Now we're going to jump over to the world of Marvel in the early 2000s.
[SPEAKER_08]: First to a silly book called Marvel Universe number one, with a flashback to World War II.
[SPEAKER_08]: The war is nearing its end and barren struckers forces are losing in England.
[SPEAKER_08]: The red skull dressed all in black, visit struckers labs noting that he's been preparing suspended animation technology in case the war is ending.
[SPEAKER_08]: I would like some samples of your gasses and delixes for my own study, he says.
[SPEAKER_08]: Still, I wonder about the necessity of all this one would almost think that you doubt the longevity of the Reich, A, in Captain America's Sentinel of Liberty Number 1, it's 2001, and Captain America and Shield are defending Independence Hall from the terrorist group, millennium dawn.
[SPEAKER_08]: We flashback a few years to when Captain America and Sharon Carter, or Agent 13, were just
[SPEAKER_08]: 9 kills another agent with the dust of death leaving his face looking like a withered skull and then establishes a link with the red skull and top aids to teleport in and take over the helicaria that cap disrupted this disrupts the signal and sharing kills the agent.
[SPEAKER_08]: Now we're going to get to the red skull taking over a shield helicaria in the next few episodes of my show so this was a fun pre-amble for that upcoming story because he was on this helicaria for a really long time including in a bunch of X-Men comics where he controls the head of
[SPEAKER_08]: Now, for today, I am thrilled to be joined by one of my very favorite people, the Tremendously Talent and Tristan Pongron.
[SPEAKER_08]: Just in welcome back to Graham Hawking Lane, are you a red skull fan, my friend?
[SPEAKER_05]: Well, that is an interesting question.
[SPEAKER_05]: I'm afraid I am not.
[SPEAKER_05]: One of my favorite things, at least about the way that the red skull is written, though, is just how despicable everybody else in the Marvel universe finds them, including all of the other villains.
[SPEAKER_05]: My first introduction to the Red Skull was reading about his crossover with the DC Comics universe and the way that the Joker of all people just completely flips out when he finds out that the Red Skull's costume is not just a costume and that he's actually a full-fledged Nazi.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yes, he was, I will say, a good villain to have, just somebody who is completely hateful
[SPEAKER_08]: You know, I've talked about many topics on the show at this point.
[SPEAKER_08]: You've been on probably a dozen times or so, right?
[SPEAKER_08]: We've done character episodes, we've done trials, we've done regular stuff.
[SPEAKER_08]: We've talked about Magneto's origins.
[SPEAKER_08]: Let's hear relationship with kind of Captain America comics.
[SPEAKER_08]: I know we've talked a lot of kind of X-Men and Tangential stuff, but are you or are you someone who's ever followed the capbooks?
[SPEAKER_05]: I had not followed the cap books directly, but I've written some cap adjacent characters written for Domino Outlaw Diamondback.
[SPEAKER_08]: So cap's girlfriend.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_05]: Who at one point in the 80s dated Captain America?
[SPEAKER_08]: I recently called Diamondback.
[SPEAKER_08]: I say this very lovingly because I really like the character, but I think she's an enormous flop.
[SPEAKER_05]: That's it.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_05]: She might agree with you.
[SPEAKER_05]: She definitely agree.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_08]: Now Captain America books.
[SPEAKER_08]: We have all kinds, right?
[SPEAKER_08]: We get to jump back into World War II stuff, which is one of the issues that I had you read.
[SPEAKER_08]: The other we just get as patriotic as possible.
[SPEAKER_08]: Let's let's defend Independence Hall from a terrorist group and the red skulls the backdrop of both.
[SPEAKER_08]: What was it like for you first to jump into this world of Marvel Universe number one?
[SPEAKER_05]: It was great to get this to get kind of like a modern perspective on Marvel's history digging right going right back to the to the origins of the company and general back when it was one of those books that like Korean wall loves he wants to tie up all the loose threads and like put them in one story let's put all the red cons in one place.
[SPEAKER_05]: one of my favorite things about comics.
[SPEAKER_05]: I know this is not everybody's favorite thing, but it is my favorite thing is the way that they do mind these old stories and continuity, different perspectives on them, different characters to bring back, and ways to teach us new things about these characters, who have otherwise become very familiar.
[SPEAKER_08]: In this Marvel Universe book, we get to see the Red Skull interacting with Strucker.
[SPEAKER_08]: It's like a little buddy comedy,
[SPEAKER_05]: Well, they seem a little bit chained by continuity in this point, and that the Red Skull can't know too much about what Von Strucker is up to with Hydra.
[SPEAKER_05]: They do showcase their relationship and just show us how uneasy Nazi war criminals are with each other and get a sense for their rivalries and the sense of danger lurking under every interaction.
[SPEAKER_05]: Because the Skull and Von Strucker are not friendly at all at this point.
[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, there's, there's, there's eventually these old invaders characters.
[SPEAKER_08]: It's become fun for me to kind of categorize, I don't know, fun, fun, right word.
[SPEAKER_08]: But it struckers the military man where Arnhem Zola is the geneticist and skull is the one that's behind the propaganda, right?
[SPEAKER_08]: Like the, the war machine, uh, concentration camp efforts with Hitler being, of course, the, the parallel to the mall.
[SPEAKER_08]: In early Captain America, after the heroes were born stuff, if you guys recall, all the books were canceled in the late 90s, Rob Laefeld did Captain America volume two, which is,
[SPEAKER_08]: who just historically bad or it's bad.
[SPEAKER_08]: Redskills in that, but it's a different version and I just didn't want to re-read it for this show.
[SPEAKER_08]: But Mark Wade is now writing Captain America at Marvel during this era and it caps quite popular.
[SPEAKER_08]: Like popular enough where he gets a second book, which I think is one of the few times in history.
[SPEAKER_08]: We've seen that.
[SPEAKER_08]: So this Captain America sent in a Liberty book was an ongoing, the first issue here from 2001 gives us that like shield agent independent's haul story.
[SPEAKER_05]: This isn't Redscold related, but interesting to see the characters acknowledge how their relationship with shield changes over time.
[SPEAKER_05]: Early on in the story, Sharon is apparently loyal shield agent, but this is story of nested flashbacks in the outer story.
[SPEAKER_05]: Sharon has had a more troubled history with with shield is aware of a number of what she calls dirty ops and has says that she hated what it did when Nick Fury was in charge.
[SPEAKER_08]: Much like the pentagon, she'll just kind of has its hands and everything.
[SPEAKER_08]: Every third shield story you read is about some corruption.
[SPEAKER_08]: Here's this evil agent who's killing people for the red school right in the middle of it all.
[SPEAKER_08]: And there's always the character in the moral universe that's exhausting sometimes.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yes, Agent Nine was charmingly villainous in this one.
[SPEAKER_05]: It's very over the top even more so than the red skull who doesn't even appear in really in person in this story as much as a shadowy figure directing the treacherous
[SPEAKER_08]: shield agent agent nine from behind the scenes and cap would never kill of course, but Sharon Carter's there to end things for this agent.
[SPEAKER_08]: She is not afraid to fire the shot, which Steve Rogers does not always love that goddess he love that woman.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yes, it's it's it's all very heterosexual.
[SPEAKER_08]: There's a lot of modern applications and hearing me kind of open with this story about the Hitler dialogues that's not a lot of history that people know very well obviously.
[SPEAKER_08]: Did you have thoughts on kind of looking back at history and its connotations in this story the way we keep history the way we preserve the truth of things I think is the theme I'm on here.
[SPEAKER_05]: Well, one thing, especially wary of with his with the way that marvel and, you know, popular history in general treats the Nazis is that they can treat them as much being much more competent and swath and cultured than they actually were, which most often was power hungry, megalomaniacs, hateful idiots running over female Hitler famously harm to his own war effort by overriding the advice of professional military men frequently.
[SPEAKER_05]: That is something that, in our current era, is a little more difficult to do with modern, modern megalomaniacs and charges, because they post all of their thoughts on social media all the time.
[SPEAKER_08]: Which brings us to my next question, the 2025 comparison, right?
[SPEAKER_08]: The idea of these very self-important men wanting to leave behind a record of their accomplishments and your blessed this reporter to sit down and get to witness the real me while I fake news
[SPEAKER_08]: They're very clear parallels to modern reality.
[SPEAKER_08]: How you do it in 2025?
[SPEAKER_08]: It's a it's a crazy time right now.
[SPEAKER_05]: Oh man.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, it's really interesting to be talking about Captain America, comics in particular on this day.
[SPEAKER_05]: I'm not sure when this podcast will be coming out, but on the day of recording is when part of the the White House's west wing is just being
[SPEAKER_05]: born out be like got it right now right this instant by construction equipment in order to construct Donald Trump's big new royalist bald.
[SPEAKER_08]: And we're 48 hours after the recent, you know, millions of Americans joining together in no king no king's rallies.
[SPEAKER_08]: We do and I included in our own cities, you know.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_05]: My shoulders are still sore from holding up those signs, and not too long after the Donald Trump posted an EI video on his head social media about dumping shit on millions of Americans from a fighter jet.
[SPEAKER_08]: When I was at the rally the other day, I was really spending time noticing, first of all, there's a lot of absurdity right now.
[SPEAKER_08]: Everybody's dressed in like frog costumes and just like carrying crazy signs and blocks a lot of unicorns for I was.
[SPEAKER_08]: I love the energy of like we're just gonna gather together and be together, you know?
[SPEAKER_08]: But I had to dissociate a little.
[SPEAKER_08]: I'm looking around and I'm like, okay, I'm from one spot in this crazy crowd.
[SPEAKER_08]: How many times can I see Hitler's face right now?
[SPEAKER_08]: And I counted 14 from one vantage point, there were 14 signs that had Hitler faces on them.
[SPEAKER_08]: And then I thought, how many times can I read the word pedophile right now?
[SPEAKER_08]: And it was over 20 from one spot.
[SPEAKER_08]: And then I start listening to the conversations around me.
[SPEAKER_08]: Like, oh, there's a drone overhead.
[SPEAKER_08]: How do you better cover your face?
[SPEAKER_08]: You don't want ice-looking for you.
[SPEAKER_08]: Or, hey, Mom, are you sure we should have brought your wheelchair over here?
[SPEAKER_08]: Because if there's a gun brought out, how are we going to get you back to the sidewalk and the crowd?
[SPEAKER_08]: And I'm like, this is not normal.
[SPEAKER_08]: This is not normal, do you know?
[SPEAKER_08]: Like this in this space, while we're all dressed like unicorns.
[SPEAKER_08]: This is craziness, but also how wonderful, right?
[SPEAKER_05]: These are not very subtle times.
[SPEAKER_05]: One thing that I used to, you know, kind of roll my eye out and comics is just how over the top evil.
[SPEAKER_05]: A lot of the villains were 10 or 20 years ago, the fiction that I preferred reading had nuanced villains, people who thought that they were doing the right thing who had
[SPEAKER_05]: complex reasons for doing the the evils that they did.
[SPEAKER_05]: And I've been realizing that no actually comic books with over the top villains people gloting about all of the deaths they're they're going to cause that was actually a more accurate view of reality and the reality that refined ourselves.
[SPEAKER_05]: And these are the
[SPEAKER_05]: These are not subtle times and these are not subtle people.
[SPEAKER_05]: Honestly, the kinds of science fiction or stories in general that most accurately describe the places that we're in right now are the ones that are that over the top that think that subtly is for cowards.
[SPEAKER_05]: Because that is an honest, that is an honest and accurate depiction of where we are right now.
[SPEAKER_05]: That is frankly honest and accurate depiction of the Nazis in World War II.
[SPEAKER_05]: Fick a fiction with nuanced villains did not prepare me.
[SPEAKER_05]: I think did not prepare a lot of us to be living when and where we are.
[SPEAKER_08]: You might, my show has always been kind of a reflection of where I'm at, but there's been shift this year.
[SPEAKER_08]: It's a different world.
[SPEAKER_08]: I'm redefining kind of everything.
[SPEAKER_08]: What does it mean to be a dad in this world?
[SPEAKER_08]: What does it mean to be a therapist in this world?
[SPEAKER_08]: And the show host, you know, I'm creating a lot of joy and I'm creating community, which is something I've always craved in the show provides so much of.
[SPEAKER_08]: But November, and this will come out probably in early December if I'm calculating right.
[SPEAKER_08]: In November on my show, the topic is fascism in pop culture.
[SPEAKER_08]: Like that's the theme we're exploring in the academic panel, et cetera, so there's some significant conversations.
[SPEAKER_08]: And I do think there's knowledge in history to be found.
[SPEAKER_08]: I think there's a lot of strength in learning where we've come from and what isn't is not normal and what we need to do to take care of ourselves, right?
[SPEAKER_08]: I think that's crucial.
[SPEAKER_08]: How are you doing my friend in this crazy world?
[SPEAKER_08]: Friend to friend and whatever you don't want to share online is okay.
[SPEAKER_08]: But just check on on you.
[SPEAKER_08]: you.
[SPEAKER_05]: Well, I have been buoyed up by the protests, by the sense of community, by the number of people who are stepping up and fighting where large institutions are failing us.
[SPEAKER_05]: One of the things that is keeping me together is that I do ultimately believe that we will get out of this, so that we can get out of this.
[SPEAKER_05]: It is a, it is a real struggle trying to try to cope with just the monsters and see on the daily and the news, though, and the way that it would that, you know, that it's crept into into our personal lives.
[SPEAKER_05]: I've had to cut off contact with people because people who I once thought were decent considered people who are endorsing all of this and I've wonder and left wondering if.
[SPEAKER_05]: They've always been like that, or if they've changed, I've doubted all of my conception, all of my, everything I thought about a lot of people before all of this happened.
[SPEAKER_08]: The last question to love your way.
[SPEAKER_08]: I'm a big fan of your writing, as you know, it's how I first found you and how we first became acquainted.
[SPEAKER_08]: You have the chance to write elixir from the perspective of here's a kid that used to be a reaver, like kind of a shitty kid, who's now trying to fit in.
[SPEAKER_08]: You've also written the character brain drain who was a Nazi character who got reprogrammed to be different, right?
[SPEAKER_08]: What are your thoughts on kind of redemptive arcs when we take these alternative perspectives?
[SPEAKER_05]: Well, Alexa is, um, is necessarily susceptible to, uh, to a lot of, to,
[SPEAKER_05]: You know, a lot of things that people are that, you know, young, dumb people who are easily swept up by, you know, like we were talking about a sense of community, but a sense of community, um, with a pair of social influencers on social media and the manosphere who don't really people who don't really think deeply about about what they're doing before they get swept up by by hate and being able to easily just easily dismiss billions and billions of people based on based on factors of their identity.
[SPEAKER_05]: And Elixir is a character who is forced to confront, to confront that deeply when he found out that he is a mutant that he's one of the minorities that was being discriminated against and was shown over and over and over how wrong he was.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, brain grains history as a Nazi is something I didn't really want to touch at all when I when I had the the joy of writing for him in in my scroll girl book, I went off of Ryan North's incredible characterization of him in the scroll girl comics, where he is this existentially depressed philosopher.
[SPEAKER_05]: If I did have to delve into his history though, I'd say that his redemption was brought about just by an incredible amount of suffering that he endured because of his beliefs and because of being forcefully confronted with people.
[SPEAKER_08]: I wish that was the case.
[SPEAKER_08]: Schoolgirl just reprogrammed his computer read to be good.
[SPEAKER_08]: She released him from his old program.
[SPEAKER_05]: No, no, no.
[SPEAKER_05]: Didn't reprogram him.
[SPEAKER_05]: She found out that there was something wrong with his suit that was preventing him from growing.
[SPEAKER_08]: Yes, yeah, yeah, it's an excellent story.
[SPEAKER_08]: If you're following Ryan's been writing Squirrel Girl in Brain Drain again, and the current one world under Doom series that he's writing for.
[SPEAKER_04]: Oh, my gosh.
[SPEAKER_08]: She's the last little part of the story.
[SPEAKER_08]: Tristan, my life is better for knowing rich academic, queer, wonderful people who are smart and intelligent.
[SPEAKER_08]: I'm so glad we're friends and I can't wait to hang out anytime and every time.
[SPEAKER_08]: I thank you for taking this journey with me.
[SPEAKER_08]: I know these conversations are a little bit like, but also it's wonderful to connect with the people I respect.
[SPEAKER_08]: So thank you.
[SPEAKER_08]: I appreciate your time and perspective always.
[SPEAKER_05]: Thank you very much for having me.
[SPEAKER_05]: You're very much appreciate any time I get to spend.
[SPEAKER_08]: Well, let's plan something again soon.
[SPEAKER_08]: Oh, I'll reach out.
[SPEAKER_08]: All right, everybody.
[SPEAKER_08]: Thanks for listening.
[SPEAKER_08]: Take care of yourselves.
[SPEAKER_08]: Creating joys and active.
[SPEAKER_08]: finance make sure you're taking care of yourselves in this crazy world and who known what has happened between recording and release.
[SPEAKER_08]: So I'll we'll keep checking on you as we go.
[SPEAKER_08]: Thanks, Tristan.
[SPEAKER_08]: Thanks fans.
[SPEAKER_08]: We'll be back here next week on Graeme often made.
[SPEAKER_08]: Thank you for listening to Grimalk and Lane.
[SPEAKER_08]: We hope you are enjoying this podcast.
[SPEAKER_08]: Grimalk and Lane is produced and recorded in Salt Lake City, Utah with music and editing done by my husband, Michael Bell, and promo art done by the incredible Seth Martell.
[SPEAKER_08]: Look for us on Patreon, where we are releasing weekly episodes about obscure characters and facts.
[SPEAKER_08]: It's a great way to participate with the podcast for only just a couple of dollars a month and it helps support what we are doing here.
[SPEAKER_08]: Also, the best way you could help
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[SPEAKER_08]: We'll see you back your next time on Grimmulkin Lane.