[SPEAKER_02]: If you want to grow the reach, revenue, and impact of your learning business, you're in the right place.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm Celisa Steele.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm Jeff Cobb, and this is the leading learning podcast.
[SPEAKER_00]: Lorting businesses are constantly asked to do a lot.
[SPEAKER_00]: Support the mission, satisfy learners, and drive sustainable revenue.
[SPEAKER_00]: This episode offers a real world look at how one organization is doing all that.
[SPEAKER_02]: This episode, number 466 features my conversation with LED Clots.
[SPEAKER_02]: Senior Vice President of Membership Education and Programs for APIC.
[SPEAKER_02]: The Association for Professionals in Infection Control and Epidemiology.
[SPEAKER_00]: Letty shares how APIC developed and launched three new certification prep courses in less than a year.
[SPEAKER_00]: What they'd learned about listening to learners and how they balance mission and margin in pricing and portfolio decisions.
[SPEAKER_02]: We also talk about APIC's shift to more flexible learning formats, including virtual instructor lead programs, micro learning and micro credentials, and how APIC is using data and collaboration to focus on topics learners most need.
[SPEAKER_00]: The conversation offers useful perspective for anyone managing an education portfolio that has to deliver both impact and income.
[SPEAKER_00]: Here's the conversation with Ledi Klutz.
[SPEAKER_02]: So tell us a little bit about APIC, kind of what it does in general and then also I would love given that we're the leading learning podcast to get kind of a high level look at what's in your learning portfolio, what you offer by way of education and learning.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, apic is the leading professional association for infection and barrenchiness or IPs as we like to call them.
[SPEAKER_01]: And our mission is to advance the science and practice of infection prevention and control ultimately to protect patients, health care workers and communities.
[SPEAKER_01]: you name it, but they are the unsung heroes of keeping everyone safe and free from induction.
[SPEAKER_01]: So that is who we are and what we do.
[SPEAKER_01]: As far as education, as you can imagine with an association, obviously education is so so important and one of the critical things that we do.
[SPEAKER_01]: Education helps our members develop professionally and personally, it also helps them stay on top of all of the things that they need to be aware of when they are keeping patient safe.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, it is definitely a cornerstone of what we do in what we offer, offer a suite of different trainings, short, longer, online, instructor-led, asynchronous, synchronous, you name it because we really want to meet our member where they are in their professional development and their education journey.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, that's just a very high level overview of what we offer.
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, great.
[SPEAKER_02]: And one of the reasons I wanted to talk to you is that I've had the chance to hear you speak a few times over the last year or so about some of what you have going on around certification and some certification prep work.
[SPEAKER_02]: So for the sake of our listeners and for my own sake to get to hear it again, would you kind of just give us that sketch of kind of what APIC has done and gotten out there into the market in an impressively short period of time, I think.
[SPEAKER_01]: sure and thank you because it was we look back and we're like we can't believe we actually pulled that off.
[SPEAKER_01]: So really this worked again in earnest in 2022 and it feels like that should be so much longer ago than it actually is and we really saw the need to update and upgrade quite frankly our
[SPEAKER_01]: At that particular point, it was almost divine intervention in this perfect storm of different things happening at the same time, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: Our certification body, if you will, Civic, they were getting ready to launch a new certification.
[SPEAKER_01]: And we knew that the first question our members would ask is how do I prepare to take the certification, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: And so that is what really spent things up and got the ball rolling when we looked at, okay?
[SPEAKER_01]: We don't have the bandwidth or the expertise, quite honestly, to create a cert prep course for this new certification.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then it became a, okay, our members have been asking for certain aspects as part of cert prep from flashcards to pre test to post test.
[SPEAKER_01]: And we just took a step back and said, this is an opportunity for us to upgrade the experience.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so we reached out to the homes corporation.
[SPEAKER_01]: I had worked with them in a previous life on SIRP Prep.
[SPEAKER_01]: And we put together a timeline and a plan to bring all of this different ocean.
[SPEAKER_01]: So we actually created three separate
[SPEAKER_01]: cert prep courses in less than a year, which I do not recommend for anybody, but it is something that we certainly are very proud of.
[SPEAKER_01]: The feedback has been fantastic.
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, we, you know, as IP is in particular and in healthcare, this whole concept of continuous improvement has certainly brought forward with our educational experience to, especially with cert prep.
[SPEAKER_01]: So continuing to listen to what our members want, to what they're looking for.
[SPEAKER_01]: We actually are just launched on up-dated version of our cert prep courses.
[SPEAKER_01]: So they have been exceeding our expectations, and our learners have been very, very happy with the materials that we're providing to them.
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, you're talking about the how the feedback's been great, how what you're hearing is really positive.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so one of the things I would love to get you to talk about a little bit is about how a fit goes about listening to member needs, to learn or needs, what methods or processes you might use to make sure that you're hearing, what they say they need.
[SPEAKER_02]: And then, to what extent you might perhaps augment, what they're saying they need with what you know, they might need that they might not even know that they need yet.
[SPEAKER_01]: as a great question.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think we solicit feedback from a variety of different places.
[SPEAKER_01]: So we have all of our syrup prep take place in our learning system.
[SPEAKER_01]: And part of that, when someone finishes going through the syrup prep course, there's a survey that we take that we provide to them that asks questions about what they liked, what they did in suggestions for improvement.
[SPEAKER_01]: Sometimes we get suggestions that are unsolicited.
[SPEAKER_01]: When we do instructor lead, we also do a survey at the end of that.
[SPEAKER_01]: So, variety of different ways where we want to hear from them, did this help prepare you?
[SPEAKER_01]: What are some things you would like to see as part of these courses?
[SPEAKER_01]: And then, I think to your point, it's balancing what they say they need with what we actually know.
[SPEAKER_01]: We can provide to them.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think a perfect example of that is in the previous version
[SPEAKER_01]: The upgraded platform, it was no audio right you just went through you read and that was some of the feedback we got it's like we would like to be able to listen we would like to be able to go in our car and put this on audio and study as we're driving to whatever place or have that as an option and so we did just that.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think that that's a good example of listening to where our members and customers are and what they're looking for and so that was extremely helpful flashcards it sounds so simple man people love flashcards they love a good flashcard because it's a good again checks and balances to make sure that they're learning the content so those I think are two examples of we knew that this is something they had been asking for for years and it validated.
[SPEAKER_01]: What we thought because that's the other thing is that you don't want to assume that you know what your members and your customers need and so being able to ask the questions in a variety of different ways helps validate what you think they need at the same time so again you're meeting them more they're at.
[SPEAKER_02]: The reliance on post-course surveys or post-learning experience surveys that feels pretty common, a lot of organizations do that.
[SPEAKER_02]: How do you go about hearing from folks that might not fill those out?
[SPEAKER_02]: Or perhaps it's required and so you're getting more feedback there, but just again kind of that balance of, are you hearing from the really vocal minority or how do you sort of feel like, oh, no, we're actually hearing from our membership what they need?
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, it's nice as an order to get a certificate of completion.
[SPEAKER_01]: You have to take the survey.
[SPEAKER_01]: And you have to provide feedback.
[SPEAKER_01]: So that's sort of a little carrot that we dangle.
[SPEAKER_01]: But it also, I think, part of it, too, is helping them understand that we actually take their feedback seriously.
[SPEAKER_01]: And we do something with it.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not just you filling out a survey for the sake of filling out a survey, but we really want to make sure that we are providing information and content that they find useful, that they find valuable.
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's worth the investment that they're making because it is an investment.
[SPEAKER_02]: So one of the things that I know about associations and association learning businesses is that often, what they offer in terms of education or learning kind of can end up having to sort of walk a balance being between being out there because it supports the mission of the organization.
[SPEAKER_02]: And also potentially being this revenue driver for the association to help feed some of the other expense areas of what has to happen.
[SPEAKER_02]: So I would just be curious to think about our task you about how apex where thinks about that or how you let you think about that in terms of kind of balancing mission versus margin in terms of what you offer as education.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I think that's a great question.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think it's something that probably all associations struggle with.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, at the end of the day, you know, no mission, no money, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: But obviously our mission is our priority.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't think there's anyone who couldn't get behind, you know, a safer world world without infection and really driving the science and practice of IPCE.
[SPEAKER_01]: So it's definitely a mission that everyone rallies behind.
[SPEAKER_01]: So which I think is a great thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, that you do have to balance that, right, and you do need to look at making sure that you are bringing in enough revenue to cover the expenses that you're providing because again, no money to mission right, and it's an it is absolutely a delicate balance and it's something that we struggle with something that I have certainly learned throughout this process and this journey is that.
[SPEAKER_01]: understanding and communicating the value proposition to the people who are purchasing your education materials is so, so important and you don't want to undervalue the education that you're providing to your members.
[SPEAKER_01]: And that was a really, I think, an aha moment for me because you can always discount, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: You can always discount, you can't increase pricing.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so I think it's having a different
[SPEAKER_01]: as an association, as an organization and looking holistically across the portfolio that you offer about the value proposition that you're getting to your members is such a critical part of that conversation when you're looking at how do we drive revenue and how do we have those conversations internally?
[SPEAKER_01]: But again,
[SPEAKER_01]: Educating your members on the value that they get and all of the different features and doing some competitive pricing too.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that's a really important part of the process because again, you don't want to devalue what you're providing to them, but you don't also want to be like the push.
[SPEAKER_01]: of the education space, especially in this association, where there is so much price sensitivity, especially these days, and healthcare, where everything's being cut right and left, that we really want to be mindful of that, but it's a balance, and it is a dance between the two, to be perfectly honest.
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, I appreciate what you're saying next.
[SPEAKER_02]: I think that sometimes what can be missed is the idea that price is often perceived, often not consciously, but perceived as an indicator of value, right?
[SPEAKER_02]: So if something's priced too low, it's sometimes ironically, then the lower it can be like, well, it's not actually, can't be that good if it's that.
[SPEAKER_02]: Does APIC keep some things in its portfolio that might be only breaking even because it really does support mission and then you might have others that still of course support mission, but are bringing in more sort of, you know, do you have any kind of way you try to actively balance sort of what the make up of the portfolio looks like in terms of the revenue that's being brought in.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I think it is a balance and you have to look at those different.
[SPEAKER_01]: You have to look holistically right you can't just price one thing in a vacuum and really it is looking across the organization across the portfolio.
[SPEAKER_01]: across the suite of products that you're offering.
[SPEAKER_01]: And we offer a variety of different educational opportunities outside surprep, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: We have our online learning courses.
[SPEAKER_01]: We have webinars that are all a member of benefit right now.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so I think it is really looking and being mindful about what is the strategy behind, what you want to price and what that, what the overall objective is, because you may have some things that, yeah, are to your point, strictly revenue producing.
[SPEAKER_01]: Then you have others that you say, you know what?
[SPEAKER_01]: This is the right thing to do.
[SPEAKER_01]: So we're going to price it accordingly so that we can get more, maybe more people at a less price versus fewer people at a higher price.
[SPEAKER_01]: And having those conversations and being mindful of what that looks like when you're putting new products and services and education material forward.
[SPEAKER_02]: How often do you revisit pricing?
[SPEAKER_02]: Is that something that sort of baked into a regularly
[SPEAKER_01]: It is now.
[SPEAKER_01]: We started that.
[SPEAKER_01]: I started it last year actually and took the time to put together an entire smart cheat with all of our offerings.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so now we do, we review all of our pricing as part of our budgeting.
[SPEAKER_01]: And we have a conversation so that also the right handouts with the left hand is doing and being very mindful of when do we increase, when do we don't?
[SPEAKER_01]: I think you know, a perfect example is some of our signature products pricing hadn't been raised in 10 years.
[SPEAKER_01]: But the breadth of what we had offered had grown significantly.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so making sure that we are having those conversations and reviewing stuff yearly, now it doesn't make sense to increase every year.
[SPEAKER_01]: It just doesn't.
[SPEAKER_01]: When you have updated content that you're rolling out or new content, yes, that's when you look at that.
[SPEAKER_01]: And you look again, holistically across the suite that you're offering and making sure it makes sense with so that like products look like products, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: So if you have,
[SPEAKER_01]: For example, an online course, it's two hours.
[SPEAKER_01]: You don't want to price it the same thing as someone that is eight hours, because that just doesn't make sense.
[SPEAKER_01]: So we have much more structure and an actual strategy and a pricing philosophy so that we are reviewing it every single year, every single product and having those conversations, again, as part of our budgeting process.
[SPEAKER_02]: And it's part of looking at pricing.
[SPEAKER_02]: Are you also looking not just at the price tag, but at the costs that go into making these products?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, absolutely.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think you also have to look at when are because we're healthcare, we have to review our content every three years and updated accordingly, which is part of our when we provide continuing education credit for example.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so you have to build that factor into the budget right and you really have to be mindful of what does that look like in as we all solve past couple of years you never know I feel like change is happening so much quicker now and so sometimes those updates maybe don't fit that three or life cycle because there are costs associated with it and you do want to make sure that you're covering them as part of those conversations when you look at.
[SPEAKER_01]: updating or revising doesn't make sense, but that is all part of the pricing conversation is what goes into making sure that we are keeping our content fresh.
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, one of the things that associations don't do well and I can pick on associations and say work at one is we don't do well with sun setting material.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so part of this process too, not just looking at pricing, but looking at sales, looking at does this make sense to continue?
[SPEAKER_01]: Because you know, Sacred Cells, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: And everyone's stuff is so important to them.
[SPEAKER_01]: But making sure that you are making those decisions that are smart for the association and sunsetting material that are just the juices and worth the squeeze anymore.
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, you talked a little bit about change and health.
[SPEAKER_02]: Seems like that's just the pace of changes increasing.
[SPEAKER_02]: And so to tell us a little bit about how APIC is continuing to evolve, it's approached to revenue generation, to member value, when you kind of look out the next couple of years, given all these broader shifts that are happening AI, changes in continuing education, but what have you, all those things that are going on?
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, I think you know, it's it's we seem to be in the this shift of reduced attention span, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: I guess that's not really recent.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, that's been for around for a long time, but in a lot of ways, what I find really fascinating and a one of the few positives to come out of COVID was the thirst for virtual for its structure, let it in a virtual environment.
[SPEAKER_01]: We have
[SPEAKER_01]: so much engagement virtually, where before we didn't really do anything that was virtual, everything was in person.
[SPEAKER_01]: And after COVID, we do a smattering of in-person, but most of it is all online and all virtual.
[SPEAKER_01]: Because again, a lot of times with our audience, with our members, with IPs, they don't have the luxury to be able to leave their facility for three to four days.
[SPEAKER_01]: and this allows them to be able to stay at home to not travel, it reduces costs, so virtual has been a huge game changer for us.
[SPEAKER_01]: We have gotten into micro credentials.
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, when you look at these small bite size flexible ways of learning, that's something that we launched earlier this year in June.
[SPEAKER_01]: We launched our first micro
[SPEAKER_01]: or take as a year to review the content and take the exam at the end.
[SPEAKER_01]: But that's an example of how we are doing more smaller bite-size learning opportunities.
[SPEAKER_01]: We have our micro credentials.
[SPEAKER_01]: We also have micro learning.
[SPEAKER_01]: So we're talking about 10 to 15 minute snippets.
[SPEAKER_01]: On there, as you can imagine, very, very specific topics.
[SPEAKER_01]: You have to be specific when you have that short amount of time.
[SPEAKER_01]: meeting our members where they are and a lot of times they just want they it's a just in time and a lot of ways to right you know that you want to learn something about this particular topic well I can now go here and find that particular topic that I can spend 15 minutes on a refresher versus sitting through a three day course just to learn a part.
[SPEAKER_01]: of the content that you want to see.
[SPEAKER_01]: But I think, again, it's meeting people where they are.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so being able to offer all of the different types of learning, again, we like to say choose your own adventure.
[SPEAKER_01]: When it comes to your preferred method of learning, your preferred method of engaging with content, it gives the learner a lot of flexibility to, again, meet them where they are.
[SPEAKER_02]: Is the micro learning, is that something that they can earn credit towards maintaining, okay?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_01]: So they, it's a couple of different things.
[SPEAKER_01]: So for example, we, the one that we launched in June is on surveillance.
[SPEAKER_01]: So eight hour course, at the end of the course, you take an assessment and then when you pass it, you get a digital batch.
[SPEAKER_01]: That digital batch is something that they can then put on LinkedIn.
[SPEAKER_01]: They can put on their signature and outlook, whatever it is.
[SPEAKER_01]: So that is an example.
[SPEAKER_01]: You can also, if you take those micro credentials, that also can earn you what we call infection prevention units, IPUs, for our certification that is offered through civic.
[SPEAKER_01]: So there, you can use it in a variety of different ways.
[SPEAKER_01]: You can also get continuing education credit from nursing standpoint.
[SPEAKER_01]: So there's a lot of different options for the learner again, depending on what they need, resurfication or continuing education credits for.
[SPEAKER_02]: when you think about what's coming, what challenges or opportunities are you seeing for a pick kind of what's on your mind?
[SPEAKER_02]: What are you tracking?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I think it this political landscape we're in right now is just it's challenging.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's hard and it's really hard for our members.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's health care in particular.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think has been really impacted by this and said that,
[SPEAKER_01]: is absolutely on the forefront.
[SPEAKER_01]: And again, it comes down to meeting our members where they are and making sure that we're providing educational content for them.
[SPEAKER_01]: Some of the things that we've been talking about in kind of brainstorming is how do we sort of unbundle some of our topics?
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, one of the things that APEC is doing is working on this year is actually having what we're
[SPEAKER_01]: And so really focusing on specific topics to help us focus on a telling our members and this is all based on data that they've told us right they we know.
[SPEAKER_01]: that they want information on these specific content areas.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so that is helping us focus our time in our energy into making sure we're providing the information and the education that they told us that they want.
[SPEAKER_01]: But it's also looking at what do you already have?
[SPEAKER_01]: Nothing, you never have to always create something from scratch, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: And taking a step back and saying, what do we have that we can repurpose?
[SPEAKER_01]: Where are the gaps, what do we need to do, how do we collaborate across the enterprise across the organization to make sure that we're putting together these again different educational opportunities, maybe there's a webcast, maybe there's a micro learning, maybe there's a micro credential and it doesn't necessarily have to be all of the things.
[SPEAKER_01]: for the same content area.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so it's really I am super excited and really proud that we've taken that step, but something that we've talked a long time about and I think it is absolutely going to come back and dividends to us that were really.
[SPEAKER_01]: honing in on specific areas where we know our members have said, this is where we need help, this is where we need more information on.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm a big fan of working smarter, not harder.
[SPEAKER_01]: And that I think is a really good example of what we're doing to ensure that that happens.
[SPEAKER_02]: We'll talk about working smarter, not harder.
[SPEAKER_02]: I know that you said you have about 15,000 members.
[SPEAKER_02]: How big is the apex staff?
[UNKNOWN]: How?
[SPEAKER_01]: We are a small bit mighty or about 50 employees.
[SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, so there's a lot of collaboration.
[SPEAKER_01]: As I'm sure, you know, you kind of gather from that conversation, we're chatting about from a content strategy standpoint, it's all hands on deck right.
[SPEAKER_01]: And honestly, it takes a village, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: It doesn't fall on one people's, on one people's, one person's shoulders to bring this forward.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think kind of going back to one of your previous questions about our membership.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, we're spending a lot of time talking about the member value proposition.
[SPEAKER_01]: We're gonna be doing a membership campaign, talking about the benefits of being a member all of the things.
[SPEAKER_01]: that we offer to our IP is because I do think that's also a critical part of this too is helping people understand the value and that they're proud to be part of an association that is bringing forward all of this information to help them be better and do better.
[SPEAKER_02]: You've talked about positive feedback.
[SPEAKER_02]: We've talked to them about revenue.
[SPEAKER_02]: Both of those are potentially indicators of how you're doing with your learning products and education products.
[SPEAKER_02]: But I'm also thinking about just this idea of impact.
[SPEAKER_02]: And when a learner comes in and engages in one of these micro learnings or does a micro credential or what have you does the cert prep?
[SPEAKER_02]: There's just that idea of impact.
[SPEAKER_02]: Are they actually learning?
[SPEAKER_02]: And you even said what back in your, about the mission statement, right?
[SPEAKER_02]: It's about changing practice or it's about improving practice and all of that.
[SPEAKER_02]: So talk a little bit about how you think about the impact of what you offer in terms of learning, like what are you tracking or what would you hope to track that maybe you can't currently track?
[SPEAKER_01]: So that's another really good question.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think, you know, one of the things we're tracking is, obviously, especially with certification.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think there's probably, there's a huge opportunity there when you're tracking, okay, those who go through the cert prep course who obtain their certification and then how do you tie it back into metrics that impact infection prevention?
[SPEAKER_01]: How do you tie it back into reduced HAIs, which are hospital required infection?
[SPEAKER_01]: We actually have a research center
[SPEAKER_01]: And they have been doing so much research in that regard.
[SPEAKER_01]: They launched a staffing calculator, which basically says you put in data-specific to your facility it then basically spits back a report that says, here's the recommended number of IPs you should have on staff.
[SPEAKER_01]: And the data that they're pulling back from that to show that there's a direct correlation between the number IPs you have on staff in the reduction in the number of infections.
[SPEAKER_01]: can't really, that's golden right there.
[SPEAKER_01]: And there's been so much work in collaborating with our research center with these, you like to say, you know, we'd like a good acronym in health care, our EIR, our expert informed resources really is again making sure that we are all tying it back to how we can help them be better and do better.
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, you also get the testimonials and the
[SPEAKER_01]: that people talk about how it help them do acts or do why.
[SPEAKER_01]: Sharing their stories in, we have two publications that we offer.
[SPEAKER_01]: Aject, which is our scientific magazine and prevention strategists, so we always encourage members to submit their stories.
[SPEAKER_01]: Submit what they did to demonstrate the value of the practice of infection prevention and how it's impacted patients outcomes, what they've done so that others can learn.
[SPEAKER_01]: from their own experience.
[SPEAKER_01]: So I think it is holistically bringing in all of those different stories to show people how what they learn and how what they put into practice actually has an impact.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's great.
[SPEAKER_02]: Sounds like you're doing really good work there to be able to make that clear connection between, you know, here's what we're helping you learn.
[SPEAKER_02]: Here's what the IPs provide and this is what it means in terms of reduced infection.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's great.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's awesome.
[SPEAKER_02]: So it's leading learning podcasts.
[SPEAKER_02]: We always love to ask folks who come on a little bit about their own approach to lifelong learning.
[SPEAKER_02]: So do you have resources or practices or habits that help you kind of stay up to date and on top of your game?
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, I think I'm huge proponent of lifelong learning, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: You never know everything.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think having that mindset and that perspective of you can always do better and learn more is important to just
[SPEAKER_01]: being a better human and a better employee, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: I really do.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, whether it's learning about leadership, or whether it's learning about infection prevention, like how you can better serve your members.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that that being that sponge and constantly or reading the articles that are submitted for our publications, reading the research agenda and the stuff that comes out of our research center and staying informed just makes you a
[SPEAKER_01]: better and inform consumer and information too.
[SPEAKER_01]: And so my huge proponent, I read our magazine all the time.
[SPEAKER_01]: I, you know, making sure that I'm listening to what our members are telling us.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm too can imagine there's never a dull moment with what's coming out of the White House right now.
[SPEAKER_01]: So being on top of the current issues, I think is so important, but making sure that you are approaching it and hearing all different sides, it's really easy to fall into, especially in the political environment we are right now to listening to one side and not really
[SPEAKER_01]: understanding what everyone is saying about different things, and so I think that's a really important, especially in the healthcare space, to have that lens of, okay, today I'm going to listen to this particular news.
[SPEAKER_01]: Tomorrow I'm going to listen to this one.
[SPEAKER_01]: I want to kind of hear all that's going on, and our members are trying.
[SPEAKER_01]: They will, they will share their opinions with us, which I actually think is a great thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: But again, I'm a huge, huge, huge, huge proponent
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that's just it's also the nature of health care right performance improvement continuous learning continuous improvement and having that perspective I think you have to carry it forward when it comes to learning and continuing to develop as a leader yeah sounds like you're doing though the walking the walk right if you're going to talk to your members of a continuous improvement you need to embody yourself that's great.
[SPEAKER_02]: We've covered a fair amount of ground.
[SPEAKER_02]: So if you wanted to make sure that listeners took away one or two or three points out of what we've talked about today, is there, what would you point them to?
[SPEAKER_02]: What would you want to reinforce?
[SPEAKER_01]: I guess I would say that don't undervalue what you provide your members.
[SPEAKER_01]: Making sure that you are reviewing pricing holistically across your organization on a regular basis.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that's so, so important.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then I would say probably the third thing is listen to what your members and your customers are telling you and then meet them where they are.
[SPEAKER_00]: We're not done quite yet.
[SPEAKER_00]: Stick around for our recap.
[SPEAKER_02]: You'll find show notes in a transcript at leadinglearning.com slash episode four six six along with links to apix website and letties linked in profile.
[SPEAKER_02]: And letty is happy to chat and share from her experience as she is a big proponent of sharing to help others learn.
[SPEAKER_00]: If you got value from this episode, please share it with a colleague or leave a rating and review.
[SPEAKER_00]: Those actions help others find the leading learning podcast and support the work we're doing.
[SPEAKER_02]: Thinking about all that leddy shared, I was really interested here that Apex Research Center has data showing the direct correlation between the number of infection preventionists on staff and a reduction in the number of infections in that setting.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's the kind of real world outcome and impact that learning businesses need to be able to show.
[SPEAKER_00]: Another thing that's very well aligned with our thinking is her ammunition to not undervalue what you offer.
[SPEAKER_00]: We're big proponents of value-based pricing and understanding that price is often unconsciously correlated with value.
[SPEAKER_00]: So low price, low value, higher price, higher value.
[SPEAKER_02]: And even though our podcast is free, rest assured that what we offer is high value stuff.
[SPEAKER_02]: Thanks again for listening and see you next time on the leading learning podcast.