WEBVTT 00:00.031 --> 00:03.259 [SPEAKER_02]: Hello, everyone out there in podcast land. 00:03.279 --> 00:05.184 [SPEAKER_02]: This is Westy from the Rug Band Payment. 00:05.384 --> 00:07.449 [SPEAKER_02]: Hey, this is Spiral Stairs from Payment. 00:07.470 --> 00:09.655 [SPEAKER_02]: And the Payments movie. 00:10.136 --> 00:12.081 [SPEAKER_02]: The story behind the song. 00:12.121 --> 00:15.369 [SPEAKER_02]: And that's where we're getting into the little bit of kennel day. 00:15.590 --> 00:17.314 [SPEAKER_02]: Rook, rook, rook. 00:28.600 --> 00:33.348 [SPEAKER_00]: I have a very special bonus surprise episode for you today. 00:33.368 --> 00:36.533 [SPEAKER_00]: I have the guys from the great band pavement. 00:36.593 --> 00:38.476 [SPEAKER_00]: I've Scott Canberg and Steve West. 00:39.197 --> 00:40.620 [SPEAKER_00]: Gentlemen, how are you guys doing? 00:41.181 --> 00:41.802 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm doing good. 00:42.022 --> 00:42.383 [SPEAKER_00]: Great. 00:43.444 --> 00:44.085 [SPEAKER_00]: Excellent. 00:44.907 --> 00:47.792 [SPEAKER_00]: Where are you both calling in from today? 00:48.673 --> 00:52.860 [SPEAKER_01]: I am calling from Melbert, outside of Melbert, Australia, in the future. 00:53.241 --> 00:53.441 [SPEAKER_01]: Wow. 00:53.862 --> 00:54.743 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, you're ahead of us. 00:54.993 --> 00:59.097 [SPEAKER_02]: And I'm from Virginia in the wild country of Virginia. 01:00.123 --> 01:03.849 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, all parts of the world, that's what we have here, and I'm on the West Coast. 01:03.909 --> 01:06.012 [SPEAKER_00]: So we got it all going on here. 01:06.052 --> 01:07.875 [SPEAKER_00]: Thanks guys for joining us on this one. 01:08.075 --> 01:08.816 [SPEAKER_00]: This will be fun. 01:09.157 --> 01:16.949 [SPEAKER_00]: We're gonna be talking about one of your great songs from the 30th anniversary album, Lawee Zawi, Kendall District. 01:16.969 --> 01:28.206 [SPEAKER_00]: We'll also talk about the movie, which is, I don't even know how you describe the movie, but it's a great movie called pavements that you can see streaming on movie right now. 01:28.186 --> 01:37.835 [SPEAKER_00]: Um, we'll get into it a little bit because it's a documentary, but it's not it's a sad tire and spoof, but it's it's a little bit of all of the above. 01:37.875 --> 01:43.821 [SPEAKER_00]: So I'm very curious to see how that all happened to, but first, you know, let's let's talk and dig right into it. 01:43.841 --> 01:53.070 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's get into your 30 30 of anniversary and before we even get into the song, Kennel District and curious how you guys chose that song. 01:53.310 --> 01:57.214 [SPEAKER_00]: Tell us a little bit about just the background of how you guys all 01:57.346 --> 01:58.247 [SPEAKER_00]: formed your band. 01:58.528 --> 02:04.175 [SPEAKER_00]: One of the most influential indie bands and, you know, back in the day, I certainly would there listening to your music. 02:04.576 --> 02:04.976 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. 02:05.016 --> 02:16.952 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, thank you so much for that, you know, without people like you listening, it would have been, we would have just been another has been, uh, you know, rock band in the history of rock bands. 02:17.073 --> 02:22.560 [SPEAKER_01]: But, uh, yeah, I mean, we, you know, we started in 89 and Westy came along. 02:22.658 --> 02:27.943 [SPEAKER_01]: In 93, I'll take you number for the, 02:28.227 --> 02:34.136 [SPEAKER_01]: the late Daryon and has been a rock for, you know, since then. 02:34.436 --> 02:54.707 [SPEAKER_01]: West and Malcolmists made up most of Crooked Rain in New York and we were, that's kind of where the story of Kendall District kind of starts because we recorded a, we tried to record a version of it around the Crooked Rain 02:55.328 --> 03:15.987 [SPEAKER_01]: version of that on the crickering sort not sort of sentables but whatever the name of the crickering for issue thing is there's a version of an early version of cano district on there basically made it up in in New York while we were recording crickering 03:16.372 --> 03:27.686 [SPEAKER_01]: And then, um, we ended up revisiting it again in, uh, when we went to Memphis to, um, to record it easily studios to record. 03:27.806 --> 03:28.367 [SPEAKER_01]: Wow, he's now it. 03:29.549 --> 03:31.391 [SPEAKER_01]: So that's kind of a short history. 03:31.451 --> 03:37.539 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, there's, there's a lot of deep meanings to it and stuff, but you want to know more about it. 03:37.599 --> 03:40.202 [SPEAKER_01]: I could tell you more about that. 03:40.840 --> 03:41.901 [SPEAKER_01]: It's a good story. 03:42.182 --> 03:43.363 [SPEAKER_00]: That's why we're here, guys. 03:43.663 --> 03:44.745 [SPEAKER_00]: Story behind the song. 03:44.785 --> 03:45.906 [SPEAKER_00]: True. 03:46.006 --> 03:48.028 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, right, that's what it is, right? 03:48.489 --> 03:51.853 [SPEAKER_01]: Like a lot of my songs, I was very shy to record a song. 03:51.873 --> 03:55.958 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, Steve had such so many songs in the well. 03:56.058 --> 03:57.179 [SPEAKER_01]: And then they were so great. 03:57.239 --> 04:00.063 [SPEAKER_01]: And we just tried to get through them all. 04:00.103 --> 04:04.288 [SPEAKER_01]: And then there was moments at the end of each record where I was like, I've got this song. 04:04.348 --> 04:08.012 [SPEAKER_01]: And so Carol District was kind of one of those and West. 04:08.684 --> 04:17.614 [SPEAKER_01]: kind of comes in with a really great signature, his signature drum beats. 04:17.965 --> 04:39.501 [SPEAKER_01]: It's scary for that for that song because it's kind of the same and same for courts and then you've got this kind of, you know, I guess it's like a pixie's kind of an ironic kind of thing, or it's just a verse course verse the lyrics were kind of about my girlfriend at the time who then became my wife and now is my ex wife. 04:39.818 --> 04:47.373 [SPEAKER_01]: And also about this woman that I met in New York around the time of Crooked Rain, who was married to a like an Americana rock star. 04:47.394 --> 04:52.925 [SPEAKER_01]: I won't tell, I won't say his name, but he was divorcing him because he would beat the shit out of her. 04:53.205 --> 04:57.895 [SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, it's a pretty dark, you know, it's a poppy song, but it's got some dark. 04:57.875 --> 04:59.177 [SPEAKER_01]: dark undertones to it. 04:59.378 --> 05:00.199 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, that's interesting. 05:00.219 --> 05:17.588 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, the way you were describing it and and the kind of the dark genesis of it, because just look at the lyric sheet and it's, you know, over and over again, the why didn't I ask, why didn't I ask, yeah, I don't, I mean, that's, you know, life's big questions, you know. 05:17.568 --> 05:23.540 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, there's a lot of those moments in life where you say to yourself, why didn't I ask? 05:23.560 --> 05:24.883 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh yeah, no question about it. 05:25.203 --> 05:32.718 [SPEAKER_00]: I had several of those today, so Scott, do you remember when you first had the idea of that song? 05:33.099 --> 05:37.568 [SPEAKER_00]: And whether it was a lyric first, whether it was a melody first, take us back to that. 05:37.548 --> 05:42.536 [SPEAKER_01]: I think we were just kind of playing around and came up with that little keyboard melody. 05:42.857 --> 05:50.910 [SPEAKER_01]: Luckily, we remembered it for the, for the Woiseau record because I would have, uh, I don't, I don't, do you remember last two of it? 05:51.251 --> 05:52.473 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, what did we do? 05:52.513 --> 05:54.556 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, how did we revisit the song? 05:54.616 --> 05:55.257 [SPEAKER_01]: I can't remember. 05:55.518 --> 05:56.179 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't remember. 05:56.259 --> 06:01.227 [SPEAKER_02]: I just remember you playing the, the basic, uh, baseline thing and, and playing to that. 06:01.443 --> 06:08.676 [SPEAKER_02]: But I wondered what you played that keyboard part on and what instrument it was that you played, because that really makes the song. 06:09.036 --> 06:15.668 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I think it was, I think originally we were, we just played whatever was there, like a move or something. 06:15.949 --> 06:24.784 [SPEAKER_01]: And then I think when we went to easily, we, they had some cool synthesizer or something we played. 06:24.764 --> 06:39.145 [SPEAKER_01]: And then now, you know, when we play live, Steve plays on guitar and and Rebecca plays the That part too, so that sounds really really big and it's nice and full 06:39.884 --> 06:40.805 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I don't know. 06:40.865 --> 06:49.676 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it's just kind of, I didn't really have at that time, you know, like I said, it was, you know, it was hard to compete with old, the old Malcolm. 06:49.696 --> 07:04.255 [SPEAKER_01]: I tried to keep my songs as simple and fast as possible, so we could at least record them and, you know, if I had to do it over, like I might like remix it or re-sing it, if I, you know, like I remember a matter or saying once. 07:04.893 --> 07:06.395 [SPEAKER_01]: for that song date with IKEA. 07:06.435 --> 07:09.438 [SPEAKER_01]: They were like, can you go and re-record the vocals? 07:11.020 --> 07:14.404 [SPEAKER_01]: We want to put it out as a single, and I'm like, I don't think so. 07:14.424 --> 07:17.007 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, tough guy. 07:17.047 --> 07:24.036 [SPEAKER_00]: The fact that the label watted you to record your vocals again, and that's not your style, right? 07:24.196 --> 07:25.497 [SPEAKER_00]: It's not pavement style. 07:26.038 --> 07:27.019 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, 07:26.999 --> 07:32.988 [SPEAKER_01]: They were right in the end, you know, it could be sung a lot better, but yeah, that wasn't our star. 07:33.088 --> 07:41.020 [SPEAKER_01]: Our star was just basically what we did, we put out and we tried to make the best of it and moved on. 07:41.141 --> 07:48.552 [SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, I think people like that, you know, from us and, you know, it could always be better, but, 07:49.882 --> 07:51.083 [SPEAKER_01]: That's the hindsight, right? 07:51.183 --> 07:51.484 [SPEAKER_01]: You know. 07:51.524 --> 07:57.130 [SPEAKER_01]: The original version of Canal District is like on the one that's on the crooked rain. 07:57.650 --> 08:03.156 [SPEAKER_01]: Reissue is hard to listen to the way I sang because I really, I'm really out of tune. 08:03.196 --> 08:13.007 [SPEAKER_01]: So I must have just been a quick take and luckily we never put that out on an actual record. 08:15.009 --> 08:15.990 [SPEAKER_01]: Have you heard of West? 08:16.240 --> 08:20.028 [SPEAKER_02]: No, I didn't even know we did it, so yeah, no, I've never heard it. 08:21.271 --> 08:36.763 [SPEAKER_00]: It sounds like your process, it wasn't really a process, you know, when you're talking about songwriting and doing all that sort of thing, is it more like you guys, your pick-up your instruments and just start kind of playing around and then something strikes you. 08:36.743 --> 08:55.900 [SPEAKER_01]: West was living in New York with with with Malcolm us, and they were they were kind of running through songs, but then when we got to the studio, we all kind of were there for Wally's alley, and that was that was there was a strange one because it was. 08:56.723 --> 08:59.829 [SPEAKER_01]: Those guys had recorded a bunch of tracks in New York. 09:00.209 --> 09:01.011 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know where was that? 09:01.051 --> 09:03.876 [SPEAKER_01]: That you guys was it at the old, the car was? 09:04.197 --> 09:04.938 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. 09:05.259 --> 09:06.802 [SPEAKER_01]: And so we had those songs. 09:07.823 --> 09:19.525 [SPEAKER_01]: And I think we re-recorded a few of them, but then we ended up recording, you know, half of the record is like, kind of the band actually recording them there at, at in Memphis. 09:19.505 --> 09:20.306 [SPEAKER_01]: as a band. 09:20.627 --> 09:27.998 [SPEAKER_01]: And so it was kind of a strange way to, I guess, in those days, it was kind of a strange way to do a record. 09:28.759 --> 09:30.101 [SPEAKER_01]: But we pulled it off, you know? 09:31.323 --> 09:36.951 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not going to tell you who you guys are, obviously. 09:36.971 --> 09:42.039 [SPEAKER_00]: But from somebody who appreciates your music, it's very much authentic to who you guys are. 09:42.320 --> 09:45.124 [SPEAKER_00]: At least that's what it seems like, you know, very organic. 09:45.184 --> 09:46.947 [SPEAKER_00]: It's not like overly rehearsed. 09:47.087 --> 09:47.267 [SPEAKER_00]: It's 09:47.247 --> 10:01.543 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, we really, we really, that that record was, was cool because we had Davis McCain and Doug Eastley were the engineers and, you know, they kind of made sure everything I think was sounding great. 10:01.904 --> 10:10.033 [SPEAKER_01]: And then of course, Bryce Gawgan kind of, he had the, he had the task of putting it all together and to make sense at all. 10:10.053 --> 10:11.455 [SPEAKER_01]: And yeah, and I don't know. 10:11.515 --> 10:14.398 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, we just kind of got lucky that the songs were good. 10:14.859 --> 10:17.001 [SPEAKER_01]: And yeah, I mean, we just kind of, 10:16.981 --> 10:27.801 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, Peyton was always kind of like we just kind of threw stuff against the wall and see what stuck and we still worked really hard to make sure that it all kind of sounded good. 10:27.832 --> 10:34.824 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, when you went into the studio, did you already know which songs would be on on why we saw he has an example? 10:34.904 --> 10:44.760 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, was there a process to any of that where you guys had a, I don't know, an agreement of a certain number of songs or anything like that or was, how would you describe it? 10:44.940 --> 10:50.229 [SPEAKER_02]: We have been touring a lot for Crooked Rain and we knew some of the why we saw that we have played live. 10:50.750 --> 10:54.396 [SPEAKER_02]: So definitely when we went in there and 10:54.376 --> 10:56.058 [SPEAKER_02]: played recorded those songs. 10:56.098 --> 10:58.462 [SPEAKER_02]: We kind of knew that we all knew how to play. 10:58.562 --> 10:59.844 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm to a degree. 11:00.765 --> 11:02.527 [SPEAKER_02]: And then you're like, okay, that's great. 11:02.688 --> 11:07.655 [SPEAKER_02]: But we've got to like another 40 minutes or whatever if you're making a big long album like I was out. 11:07.675 --> 11:09.918 [SPEAKER_02]: Like, what would just keep recording? 11:10.459 --> 11:16.988 [SPEAKER_02]: So yes, we did because we knew how to play at least six of those songs from live. 11:17.028 --> 11:18.350 [SPEAKER_02]: And we all did that together. 11:18.470 --> 11:20.653 [SPEAKER_02]: And then Scott had his song that 11:20.836 --> 11:30.629 [SPEAKER_02]: I just found out we had done earlier, Kindle Day and maybe Steven had a one or two other things that he might have played for me at some point, but I didn't really know. 11:31.810 --> 11:37.357 [SPEAKER_02]: So you just kind of throw it, put it all together and see what happens and that was a wowies. 11:37.618 --> 11:38.078 [SPEAKER_02]: Zoey. 11:38.519 --> 11:39.961 [SPEAKER_00]: It would you throw it all together like that. 11:40.001 --> 11:41.062 [SPEAKER_00]: You guys are in the studio. 11:41.122 --> 11:47.130 [SPEAKER_00]: Do you remember what kind of what the sessions were like there was, was that an easy process for that particular album? 11:47.380 --> 12:08.815 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, we would go through it pretty quick, you know, run two or three times through the song and then move on and you know you try to get through your four songs done a day and then go back when you realize you you've listened to and your brain You've heard it all night long and you're like I can play that better again, and so then you take another take or something so 12:09.520 --> 12:12.505 [SPEAKER_02]: That was a kind of our loose way of handling it. 12:12.705 --> 12:18.955 [SPEAKER_02]: And if there was something that we knew could be better, we'd go back specifically and try to make it better. 12:19.516 --> 12:20.497 [SPEAKER_02]: One way or the other. 12:20.637 --> 12:24.624 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, but it was, it was, you know, like most of our recording sessions. 12:24.704 --> 12:27.027 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, even Territory, I like to a certain degree. 12:27.208 --> 12:29.832 [SPEAKER_01]: It was kind of a, we're just like a gang of friends. 12:29.952 --> 12:37.063 [SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, we liked, we went out and we ate really amazing food because, you know, Mark Ibo, it was like a, 12:37.043 --> 12:44.170 [SPEAKER_01]: would tell us where to go and we went to the, I don't know, Memphis was like what, it was the grifters town, right? 12:44.270 --> 12:48.213 [SPEAKER_01]: So we were all with the grifters and I think GBV came at the plate of show. 12:48.233 --> 13:04.789 [SPEAKER_01]: Hey, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, play, 13:04.769 --> 13:06.972 [SPEAKER_01]: It's, you know, it's kind of cool that we're all still around. 13:07.032 --> 13:14.821 [SPEAKER_01]: And we still, we still kind of get to experience that and in our new, uh, our new shows. 13:15.261 --> 13:15.522 [SPEAKER_02]: Right. 13:16.142 --> 13:29.258 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, I think it's important when you're recording a record to have an atmosphere that you're in where everyone in the band is kind of 13:29.812 --> 13:43.078 [SPEAKER_02]: you know, enjoying the city or the studio, whether it's a real tight, like net super studio or more relaxed studio with tons of instruments and everything cords are all over the place. 13:43.345 --> 13:46.731 [SPEAKER_02]: And I think in the gamut of pavement, we did all of those different studios. 13:47.633 --> 13:56.789 [SPEAKER_02]: Superlose superlose superlose engineers to really tight as working dudes, making everything sound great. 13:57.330 --> 13:59.333 [SPEAKER_02]: And you can hear it in every album. 13:59.554 --> 14:01.337 [SPEAKER_00]: You can hear the different personalities. 14:01.317 --> 14:03.279 [SPEAKER_02]: Sure, and the atmospheres. 14:04.040 --> 14:09.665 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, each of our records are different that way, you know, and it's pretty interesting. 14:09.885 --> 14:22.697 [SPEAKER_00]: So, when you look back at it that way and you, you know, you're talking about like, some guys are really loose in somewhere really uptight and super strict, which looking back, do you think was better for you? 14:22.717 --> 14:26.901 [SPEAKER_00]: Or which do you think brought out what you really wanted to bring out? 14:27.242 --> 14:27.662 [SPEAKER_00]: Mm-hmm. 14:27.642 --> 14:46.360 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, I think they all, they all brought it out really in different ways, you know, like yeah, that of Not of it was really negative, you know, it was really there was all positive because the songs They were all the songs all, you know, got made and and 14:46.576 --> 14:48.000 [SPEAKER_01]: and put on record. 14:48.662 --> 14:55.820 [SPEAKER_00]: And 30 years later, yeah, we're talking about, which is pretty cool. 14:55.881 --> 15:01.716 [SPEAKER_00]: It's got to be cool to look back, you know, 30 years from that, that album, and that was album number three. 15:01.696 --> 15:13.756 [SPEAKER_00]: And this is just rolling in from, you know, you had Elm's number one and two, you had the song, one of your most well-known songs cut your hair, you're coming into the studio with these songs. 15:14.157 --> 15:22.892 [SPEAKER_00]: When you have two under your belt and you've achieved the success that you guys had, is there a different feeling going into the studio for album number three? 15:23.152 --> 15:27.940 [SPEAKER_00]: Like is there a different goal you had for it compared to the other ones? 15:28.038 --> 15:28.899 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think so. 15:28.980 --> 15:52.999 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, yeah, I mean, we, you know, originally on that record, I wanted to kind of keep it, just a, you know, a 12 song record or something or a 10 song record, keep it kind of 15:54.312 --> 16:07.174 [SPEAKER_01]: Because it's, you know, it's a sprawling 18 song record with what I like to call, I like to say it's I used to like to say it was a record and it's B sides all in one. 16:07.274 --> 16:12.704 [SPEAKER_01]: So the reissue be or as they say in the movie, the reissue before the reissue. 16:15.509 --> 16:17.552 [SPEAKER_01]: Going into it. 16:17.971 --> 16:40.992 [SPEAKER_01]: That was my mindset, you know, because I kind of would do a lot of editing and a lot of, you know, the order of the records, the song order and Steve wanted this one to be kind of just all over the place and it's kind of cool that it was, you know, and in retrospect because we went back to the normal way of doing it for the last two records. 16:40.972 --> 16:41.513 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know. 16:41.653 --> 16:44.717 [SPEAKER_01]: I think we just, I don't know what we were doing at that time. 16:44.797 --> 16:50.284 [SPEAKER_01]: I think we were just touring a lot, and just trying to kind of figure it all out. 16:50.364 --> 16:52.166 [SPEAKER_01]: We didn't, we didn't really have any pressure. 16:52.406 --> 16:56.872 [SPEAKER_01]: Except for we did take that record to, uh, was it Atlantic? 16:56.932 --> 16:59.836 [SPEAKER_01]: I think Danny Goldberg was the, was the president. 16:59.876 --> 17:00.557 [SPEAKER_01]: We had a meeting. 17:01.818 --> 17:09.628 [SPEAKER_01]: We had a meeting with him and he kind of, he kind of looked at us and said, like, 17:09.608 --> 17:20.057 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, he said, you know, like really like this isn't this isn't going to win any he awards or I don't know what he said, but he just kind of laughed. 17:20.290 --> 17:30.424 [SPEAKER_01]: he kind of laughed and drew our cause away was there and he was kind of sticking up for us and jarga is one of the main guys that mattered to work. 17:30.444 --> 17:34.910 [SPEAKER_01]: We kind of knew that that was a dagger. 17:35.190 --> 17:40.858 [SPEAKER_01]: It wasn't going to be as big as Cricket Rain and TV wasn't going to fall. 17:41.238 --> 17:42.780 [SPEAKER_02]: The first nail in the coffin. 17:44.483 --> 17:50.010 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and then we and then we played all the blows. 17:50.665 --> 17:51.787 [SPEAKER_01]: all of the loser. 17:52.168 --> 17:59.401 [SPEAKER_01]: It wasn't really like a big, you know, the songs weren't like big crowd pleasers at that time. 17:59.441 --> 18:14.108 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, maybe our fans who were out way up in the in the in the cheap seats liked them, but the the the whole fans and the Cypress Hill fans weren't really in, you know, 18:14.763 --> 18:19.957 [SPEAKER_00]: Do you want to mention Lala Palusa, you know, that whole experience that you guys had? 18:20.157 --> 18:20.719 [SPEAKER_01]: It was great. 18:20.859 --> 18:29.201 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it was, it started off a little rough, you know, like I don't think we were really prepared for that kind of environment. 18:29.221 --> 18:30.865 [SPEAKER_01]: We'd never really played. 18:30.845 --> 18:32.388 [SPEAKER_01]: that those kind of shows before. 18:32.448 --> 18:50.621 [SPEAKER_01]: So it was a little, it took a little bit of time to find our feet there, but all of the other bands were great and really supportive and it was a super fun time except for getting mud thrown at us. 18:50.861 --> 18:53.005 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, a little aggro. 18:54.166 --> 18:59.479 [SPEAKER_01]: But you know what, you know, I don't know, it was, that's what happened in the 90s, right? 19:00.041 --> 19:01.043 [SPEAKER_01]: You threw mud at people. 19:01.404 --> 19:05.093 [SPEAKER_00]: That's got to be a wild experience when your odd stage and that happens. 19:05.193 --> 19:11.128 [SPEAKER_01]: But yeah, I guess, I mean, I'm surprised I'm surprised it didn't happen more. 19:11.378 --> 19:18.707 [SPEAKER_00]: But you're young guys, too, like, you know, so this is all going on and you're playing your music and so it's part of the overall experience. 19:18.807 --> 19:21.831 [SPEAKER_00]: Easy for me to say, yeah, I mean, you knew it was going to happen. 19:21.891 --> 19:23.954 [SPEAKER_01]: They were, you know, they were watering down. 19:23.994 --> 19:25.676 [SPEAKER_01]: They were like had big hoses out there. 19:25.756 --> 19:31.023 [SPEAKER_01]: They were watering down the crowd and it was just like, oh, oh, oh, take it out on these people. 19:31.103 --> 19:40.795 [SPEAKER_02]: In front of us, we don't know who the hell is this band, they suck, yeah. 19:41.281 --> 19:48.250 [SPEAKER_02]: which we, you know, we're very fortunate because out of that, we've gotten a lot of mileage out of that, that's seeing you know, but he really got hurt. 19:48.871 --> 19:50.192 [SPEAKER_02]: So that's a good thing. 19:50.453 --> 19:51.594 [SPEAKER_02]: They made a movie about it. 19:51.775 --> 19:54.017 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, we got it filmed for sure. 19:54.057 --> 20:00.145 [SPEAKER_00]: It's part of the lore, which is just one of so many different anecdotes about you guys that makes it really interesting. 20:00.165 --> 20:01.467 [SPEAKER_00]: Like that's 20:01.447 --> 20:03.773 [SPEAKER_00]: authentic to who you are. 20:03.813 --> 20:11.010 [SPEAKER_00]: We're going to take like a very quick break and then I want to get into the, I don't know if you call it a documentary, but I'll let you guys describe it. 20:11.030 --> 20:19.911 [SPEAKER_00]: We'll get into the movie a little bit, and then I want to get a little bit more into just what you guys are up to today, but we'll be right back with Steven Scott from the Great Band Payment. 20:22.068 --> 20:23.370 [SPEAKER_00]: All right, we are back. 20:24.111 --> 20:26.234 [SPEAKER_00]: So I like to see it. 20:27.175 --> 20:30.840 [SPEAKER_00]: Scott, for those of you who are not watching, Scott's picking up his guitar. 20:31.120 --> 20:31.781 [SPEAKER_00]: Go ahead, Scott. 20:31.861 --> 20:32.422 [SPEAKER_00]: No, please. 20:34.845 --> 20:34.906 [SPEAKER_01]: Hi. 20:34.926 --> 20:34.986 [SPEAKER_01]: Hi. 20:35.006 --> 20:36.688 [SPEAKER_01]: Trying to learn television solos. 20:36.708 --> 20:37.129 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, good. 20:39.852 --> 20:39.993 [SPEAKER_01]: Mm-hmm. 20:40.013 --> 20:41.274 [SPEAKER_01]: Or actually, I got a word. 20:41.695 --> 20:46.301 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm rehearsing for our big Mexico City show coming up next week. 20:46.321 --> 20:47.202 [SPEAKER_01]: Have you been practicing? 20:47.443 --> 20:47.743 [SPEAKER_01]: West? 20:48.384 --> 20:50.607 [SPEAKER_02]: No, I've been slacking off, man. 20:52.088 --> 21:01.679 [SPEAKER_00]: At this point in your lives, do you know each other so well that there's no need to practice or you just let you go on stage and it's like riding a bike? 21:01.999 --> 21:06.384 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, parts of it are, but we still need to practice. 21:06.404 --> 21:11.770 [SPEAKER_01]: Or I do and you know, I'm sure West West is probably the guy that's practiced the most of any of us. 21:11.830 --> 21:20.239 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm sure the reunion shows have been absolutely amazing because he's 21:20.219 --> 21:31.623 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I feel like I've rehearsed, but then when you get together with everybody and you start playing the song, it's like, oh no, you know, yeah, but then you play the more shows you play the more comfortable you get. 21:31.683 --> 21:40.742 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, if you can't it's it is like riding a bike, but but it's like, you know, you need the you need the training wheels for a little bit of time. 21:40.722 --> 21:42.946 [SPEAKER_01]: before you, uh, really feel comfortable. 21:43.066 --> 21:46.311 [SPEAKER_01]: But, uh, but next week's Mexico City is our, it's our first show there. 21:46.471 --> 21:57.128 [SPEAKER_01]: And so we're playing, you know, pretty much, we've Bob sent us the set list and it's kind of, you know, the songs were more comfortable with than any of them. 21:57.669 --> 21:58.530 [SPEAKER_01]: I, I'm not sure. 21:58.570 --> 21:59.612 [SPEAKER_01]: It's kind of district on there. 21:59.872 --> 22:00.453 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it is. 22:00.473 --> 22:01.876 [SPEAKER_02]: It's like a third of a song. 22:01.896 --> 22:02.376 [SPEAKER_01]: Four songs. 22:02.497 --> 22:04.620 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't really need to practice that one, but 22:04.718 --> 22:08.142 [SPEAKER_01]: And maybe you've worked it on getting in tune with a sing. 22:08.402 --> 22:09.563 [SPEAKER_01]: Ooh, all right. 22:09.603 --> 22:09.823 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. 22:10.184 --> 22:10.624 [SPEAKER_01]: That's mine. 22:10.704 --> 22:11.585 [SPEAKER_01]: That's my problem. 22:11.605 --> 22:15.409 [SPEAKER_00]: So how is it after all these years getting back on stage together? 22:15.469 --> 22:20.334 [SPEAKER_00]: Is it something is it fun to be playing live together again? 22:20.374 --> 22:23.257 [SPEAKER_00]: How would you describe it just for yourselves? 22:23.577 --> 22:24.819 [SPEAKER_01]: Personally for me, it's great. 22:24.839 --> 22:25.620 [SPEAKER_01]: It's I love it. 22:26.160 --> 22:28.723 [SPEAKER_01]: It's because, you know, the songs are great. 22:29.303 --> 22:31.345 [SPEAKER_01]: And the fans are great. 22:31.526 --> 22:33.848 [SPEAKER_01]: And my band members are 22:33.828 --> 22:45.930 [SPEAKER_01]: great you know it's just like it's it's really it's it's it's a fun experience yeah i think it's kind of like a circus where you know there's parts where the clowns come out. 22:46.484 --> 23:09.319 [SPEAKER_02]: and then the lions are out there at other times and the elephants come out and the guy in the middle talking do comes out and it's very unpredictable but predictable at the same time but you really don't know how there's could always be you know a moment where you skip up and that's when it gets interesting 23:09.974 --> 23:12.098 [SPEAKER_02]: It's fun, it's all, it's just fun, it's great. 23:12.539 --> 23:21.476 [SPEAKER_00]: There's a lot to talk about, but I want to, I do want to ask you about the movie because I've watched the movie, my daughter watched it with me, she's hard core music person. 23:22.178 --> 23:28.771 [SPEAKER_00]: And it's, it's, it's just, how would you describe what the movie is? 23:28.791 --> 23:31.476 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know. 23:31.945 --> 23:35.169 [SPEAKER_00]: For those of you who haven't seen it, we're listening and watching this. 23:35.470 --> 23:45.844 [SPEAKER_00]: You got to go check it out because there are a lot of movies that are biopics and documentaries about musicians and artists and this is like nothing that I've ever seen before. 23:45.924 --> 23:50.730 [SPEAKER_00]: It's fascinating but so I'll let you guys describe how you would describe this film. 23:50.710 --> 24:13.613 [SPEAKER_02]: Well, I would describe it as a little bit of a wowies alley where it's got a little bit of everything going on, and there's a lot of depth to it where you can watch it, which I have, fortunately or unfortunately many times, and each time I see something different that Alex Ross Perry and Robert Green put into the movie with through their editing. 24:13.947 --> 24:15.589 [SPEAKER_02]: and the audio as well. 24:15.730 --> 24:30.572 [SPEAKER_02]: So it's kind of epic in that way, it's just it's fresh, it's not too Hollywood and it's not too to rudimentary or anything but it's not too over the top. 24:31.430 --> 24:54.045 [SPEAKER_01]: It's just got a little bit of everything, and for me, what I really got out of it besides all of the crazy storylines and stuff that Alex, I mean, Alex asked us, you know, we emailed, or we talked to him on the phone back in like 2019, I think, and he was asking us, you know, about our experiences with Payburn and stuff. 24:54.025 --> 25:01.554 [SPEAKER_01]: And that was kind of, that was kind of it, you know, like he, he went on and made this made this movie. 25:01.694 --> 25:06.900 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, luckily we got, you know, we had some shows to kind of integrate into it. 25:07.501 --> 25:18.013 [SPEAKER_01]: But from for me, like, it just kind of, it made the songs, take on a whole new life and, and how great how great the songs were. 25:18.734 --> 25:21.838 [SPEAKER_01]: And, and still are, you know, they make this 25:22.004 --> 25:26.682 [SPEAKER_01]: musical, you know, that it's supposed to be fake, but it's, you know, is it really fake, you know? 25:26.722 --> 25:27.224 [SPEAKER_01]: It's real. 25:27.806 --> 25:30.135 [SPEAKER_03]: It was real for three days, for two or three days. 25:30.155 --> 25:30.678 [SPEAKER_03]: Yes. 25:30.698 --> 25:31.862 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, there he is. 25:43.891 --> 25:52.737 [SPEAKER_02]: It's staring and it did it when we get to get our Grammy, you know, it gets boring if you just do the thing where the band gets together and why they got together and then why the band broke up. 25:53.223 --> 26:14.556 [SPEAKER_02]: and you know that that is a storyline that a most documentaries have but when it's kind of hidden in between you can read into a lot of that stuff if you watch it enough and know the read about the band but being hidden is more interesting to me and it's on another level besides that regular documentary type thing. 26:15.042 --> 26:30.483 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, it's another, it's another, it's another play, it's another play, it's very, it's, I'm not just saying this because I'm talking to you guys, like it's brilliantly pavement and I'm wearing this shirt because I truly watch so many movies. 26:30.764 --> 26:33.287 [SPEAKER_00]: I've seen a lot of music films. 26:33.267 --> 26:35.471 [SPEAKER_00]: It's pretty remarkable what you guys did here. 26:35.711 --> 26:39.157 [SPEAKER_00]: So first of all, like your stories are just awesome on their own. 26:39.457 --> 26:46.469 [SPEAKER_00]: But the fact that there was a Broadway musical or an opera, a Broadway musical that actually was put together and all the love and attention that was put into that. 26:46.589 --> 26:47.791 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't want to spoil the film. 26:48.232 --> 26:51.217 [SPEAKER_00]: But, and then there's an art museum like you said. 26:51.237 --> 26:53.982 [SPEAKER_00]: And it's all happening at the same time. 26:54.062 --> 26:56.085 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, they worked hard on it. 26:56.065 --> 27:00.571 [SPEAKER_01]: they worked hard and and they did an amazing job. 27:00.791 --> 27:19.575 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean it's I've probably seen it more than West to seen it but every time I do see it I see something new in it and and get something get a chuckle out of it and at the end of the day it's like you know we're we were a pretty good band we still are. 27:20.737 --> 27:27.285 [SPEAKER_00]: I love to hear that and cue applause on that one, but everybody you can see that you should go see that movie. 27:27.305 --> 27:27.966 [SPEAKER_00]: It's on movie. 27:28.006 --> 27:31.110 [SPEAKER_00]: I think it's exclusively streaming on movie, so you should check that out. 27:31.130 --> 27:35.775 [SPEAKER_00]: And if you don't know movie, it's M U B I, it's, you know, people who love movies go to movie. 27:35.835 --> 27:36.236 [SPEAKER_00]: It's cool. 27:36.757 --> 27:50.153 [SPEAKER_00]: So tell me about before we end guys, I want to hear just, you're obviously touring, you're doing your reunion tour, which is very cool. 27:50.133 --> 27:51.839 [SPEAKER_01]: So that'll be really fun. 27:52.221 --> 27:57.862 [SPEAKER_01]: And we're actually talking about next year doing some doing some fun shows as well. 27:58.083 --> 28:00.733 [SPEAKER_01]: Do you have any new music that's going to be coming out? 28:00.933 --> 28:04.258 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, we don't have anything new. 28:04.319 --> 28:14.996 [SPEAKER_01]: We just have the soundtrack for the movie, which we recorded a bunch of really great live tracks from the previous years tour. 28:15.196 --> 28:18.782 [SPEAKER_01]: And we've got like a new greatest hits package. 28:18.822 --> 28:27.717 [SPEAKER_01]: So it just came out because our label really wanted to capitalize on the harness your hopes, Chris. 28:27.697 --> 28:34.987 [SPEAKER_01]: So we have this, we have this like Tik Tok thing going on where all these kids love that song. 28:35.128 --> 28:40.936 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know if you've noticed it was at the Texas shows, but we've got a whole new demographic of fans. 28:41.356 --> 28:44.160 [SPEAKER_02]: I didn't notice I couldn't see 18 to 24 year olds. 28:44.501 --> 28:45.102 [SPEAKER_00]: That's great. 28:45.122 --> 28:46.684 [SPEAKER_00]: The power of Tik Tok. 28:46.664 --> 28:47.265 [SPEAKER_00]: It's amazing. 28:47.405 --> 28:49.509 [SPEAKER_00]: And great music, you know, you put that together. 28:49.549 --> 28:50.872 [SPEAKER_00]: That's that's very cool. 28:51.152 --> 28:56.623 [SPEAKER_01]: But, um, other than that, I mean, I'm the pavement stuff just keeps chugging along. 28:56.643 --> 29:01.071 [SPEAKER_01]: Hopefully one day we'll do a box set or Western I have solo things we do. 29:01.512 --> 29:07.063 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm just I'm just finishing up a new solo record in LA next week and west. 29:07.684 --> 29:08.385 [SPEAKER_01]: What are you doing? 29:08.365 --> 29:12.373 [SPEAKER_02]: Um, I work with two different bands of Darlington Pear. 29:12.753 --> 29:14.376 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't write the songs in that song. 29:14.457 --> 29:24.636 [SPEAKER_02]: I just play that band I played drums and I work with them and we record it and practice every week and play shows and unmastered masters. 29:25.004 --> 29:33.315 [SPEAKER_02]: that I do write to songs with the other guys and I'm finishing up our album and we're going to press it as vinyl. 29:33.335 --> 29:33.976 [SPEAKER_02]: All right. 29:34.157 --> 29:35.078 [SPEAKER_00]: Congratulations. 29:35.518 --> 29:35.679 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. 29:35.799 --> 29:38.783 [SPEAKER_02]: We're keeping the creative here one way or the other. 29:38.943 --> 29:45.232 [SPEAKER_00]: And then for both of you guys who are you listening to who is really hitting you right now with music? 29:45.292 --> 29:46.073 [SPEAKER_00]: It can be anybody. 29:46.113 --> 29:46.994 [SPEAKER_00]: It can be new music. 29:47.054 --> 29:47.415 [SPEAKER_00]: It can be. 29:47.575 --> 29:51.180 [SPEAKER_02]: Lofem is a 29:51.785 --> 30:16.965 [SPEAKER_02]: French band we saw them in Austin and they played the night before we played and my wife and I have been fans of them for about 10 years now and we got to see them play and I went up to say you guys were great and they thought I was kind of creepy but that was okay because they were fabulous I really like the kind of stereo lavish and 30:16.945 --> 30:20.310 [SPEAKER_02]: with with a little more humor and a little more flam. 30:20.390 --> 30:21.872 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know, but they're really great. 30:21.892 --> 30:22.833 [SPEAKER_02]: And I really enjoyed them. 30:22.953 --> 30:23.434 [SPEAKER_01]: Very cool. 30:24.155 --> 30:29.161 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, I like this, uh, this Australian band, uh, Royal Headache a lot. 30:29.562 --> 30:31.945 [SPEAKER_01]: I listen to them every day while I go jogging. 30:32.826 --> 30:36.051 [SPEAKER_01]: And there's a new band from Austin that is really cool. 30:36.091 --> 30:38.614 [SPEAKER_01]: Call the point that opened up for us. 30:39.435 --> 30:46.665 [SPEAKER_01]: In the point, the point, 30:46.645 --> 30:49.929 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I like them really good very cool guys. 30:49.969 --> 31:03.346 [SPEAKER_00]: Listen, I really appreciate you both joining me on the story behind the song and I really urge her ready to check out, you know the special compilation you have on the soundtrack for the film the new film pavements which you could see. 31:03.366 --> 31:12.417 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm movie which is really cool and just like seeing you live and Hopefully seeing you come across into the states also touring the states next year 31:12.397 --> 31:18.962 [SPEAKER_00]: But 30 years later, after Wawizawi, here we are, and it's fun to hear the stories. 31:19.284 --> 31:20.127 [SPEAKER_00]: So thanks for joining. 31:20.428 --> 31:21.512 [SPEAKER_00]: Thank you.